I don't want to be redundant, obviously (outside of gamers) the MS OS is driving the industry for bigger faster hardware. This is sad because they really can't *won't* figure out how to really make an OS that people can USE!
Frankly, if you take a person who knows very little about computers and plop any OS in front of them they get scared and will not really know what to do. Mr. Gate's "easier to use, faster internet access" marketing ploy to sell his OS's (which drive the hardware industry) would be meaningless if everyone really knew 2 things. One is that just browing the web will work fine with a 200 - 400 MHZ machine with 64+ MB if ram. The second is that no matter how many features, knobs and gizmo's that Gates packs into his bloated OS the same functionality is really available in older versions of the OS. Plus, a novice will still not be able to use the XP os out of the box very effectively (see below for explanation.)
My bet is that MS is very aware of these dangers and builds some abstraction into their design to purposefully make the OS harder for new users. Note that Win XP has no desktop icons or easy HUD type bar (like KDE, GNOME, Aqua etc.) on the default install. The start menu (possibly the most familiar "PC icon" i the world) is completely different and much harder to navigate IMO. They make these OS's seem better with gadgets but the core functionality is still not in line with the common users needs. MS will then be able to launch a new OS every few years that is "easier to use." To use an analogy, would anyone be interested in a car that doesn't drive very well (hard to steer, accelerates erratically, just "cuts out" while driving.) then keep buing a new car every 2 - 3 years that has only slightly better conditions (or fixes some problems while adding more!)
The company I worked at purchased a bundle of 130 PC's about 14 months ago (I didn't work there then). They were fully propritary (yeck), major brand name, and "Legacy Free" (Everything integrated and all USB, no serial, ps2, parallel, or PCI slots.) The moron who bought them didn't buy an extended warranty either (smart eh? Buy a bunch of PC's you can't possibly service and do not buy any warranty with them. Needless to say that guy is long gone.) Luckily I argued one out of the company before and bought an extended warranty before the orignal expired.
Anyhow, almost 60% (probably more, the PC's are spread all over the country) have had Fujitsu drive failures. These are all domestic (U.S.) Pc's with Fujitsu 10 GB drives. I am so glad that this is a real problem - I feel like sending this link to the pain in the ass support guys that have made my life hell everytime a PC dies and needs a hard drive replaced.
I agree with you, didn't want to come off as stand-offish!! I was just relaying an experience with them I had. I wouldn't think that many of reasonable mind would feel differently than you or I on the computerized translation of medical-jargon-bad-doctors handwriting issue.
Just as an FYI - About 5 years ago I was a hardened PC tech at a major metropolitan hospital. We deployed a fleet of the Fujitsu tablets you mentioned complete with PCMCIA with RF networking (not sure what the RF standard was at that time) and access points. They replaced the bedside "Clipboards" and interfaced directly with the Hospitals mainframe.
My recollection was that the docs used them for about a day then lost interest, reverting back to the clipboards - IMO their handwriting may be hard to read but I would rather have it translated by a floor nurse who knows what the hell is going on than some buggy hacked together software!!
This is kind of a long question, hope you don't mind
Many food shows tend to focus on fancy ingredients bought at stores that only exist in downtown NYC made with special tools that normally an average person would not own.
With your training at the New England Culinary institute, I know you must understand and have cooked "gourmet" cuisine. Yet on your show, you shop at Kroger's, use hardware store items instead of specialized cooking instruments and focus on the types of food we eat everyday (Pot Roast, Steak, Potatoes, Mac and Cheese.) Is there a secret that we non-gourmet types should be let in on? Should we catapult the notion that fancy meals with French names and odd ingredients is what you need to have an exquisite meal? Or are you a secret gourmet type sneaking into uber-hip Manhattan restaurants that only server beet foam with caviar and ramps?
BTW - your recipes are great, I don't know if you have heard this before but you are the new guard of America soul cooking.
Over the years I have moved from systems administrator positions to being an IT director at varying companies ranging from health care to heavy manufacturing. While the health care company (a major meto area hospital) I worked at had some policies (change every 60, minimum length etc.) people would still choose passwords such as "password1" and then increment the number ever 60 days or whatever. The manufacturing firms I have worked for had abismal policies for passwords (setting the default password to the same as the username and never forcing a change after that.)
What is key in this discussion, in all places I have worked is that the executvies who have the access to the most sensitive info and demand data security are the ones who never want to remember a password or have them change. If they don't want to participate, why burn out your Network Admins enforcing password policies as well as all of the support headaches they bring from locked accounts, forgotten passwords, screwed up password changes etc?
Really, my opinion from 7 years of 'real world' experience running 1000 - 5000 node networks plus large multi user systems (Unix Terminal environment to AS400 to Mainframe) is that passwords really only secure you (somewhat) from internal employees accessing information they are not supposed to. It is probably impossible to really say with any certainty (would you bet your salary on it?) that a system that has 1000+ logins and is accesible from the outside world is ever really "safe."
So, I must concur with some of the other posters and give a big "No Duh" on this one. IMHO It would be a waste of money and time to chase password policy enforcement for 10,000 users versus providing a total lockdown from outside acccess to your important systems and controlling that access with long passwords, 128+bit encryption etc. Of course there are exceptions for your financial institutions and other high sensitive government areas, but I have a feeling that they too are more lax on password policies then we would expect.
First of all - please read the Modern Hippocratic oath to get a feel of the sheer gravity that the oath actually represents. Then imagine the programmers oath
"Wherever I can, I will code many hidden easter eggs without the project managers consent or knowledge to provide the end users something to do. Also, I shall endeaver to ingest large quantities of mountain dew."
I mean, I can think of a few professions above programmers I want to take an oath (How about the short order cook that spit in your food last week huh?)
Second of all - How can you even compare the concept of upholding the ability to save and improve physically the life of an indivdual without corruption to a programmer? How is coding spam similar to endangering a life for unethical pursuits?
Third of all - WHO CARES? Oaths are meaningless in a captalistic society such as ours. Want proof? Lets take a quick tour down career avenue and look at the professions that take oaths - Lawyers (hmm, they seem to be a respectable bunch), Elected Officials (don't get me started), Judiciaries (Not too bad in his arena) and Public Safety officals (Rodney King, Malice Green, etc. etc.) Not to open a can of worms but the ORIGINAL Hippocratic Oath actually had a section condeming a doctor to perform an abortion so theoretically doctors that perform abortion break their oaths (I agree to the modern version expressed above and my political viewpoints on abortion are hopefully not reflected!)
To compare the importance of upholding the importance of ethics in the medical profession to a coder writing spam, spyware or other such "annoyances" is ABSURD.
"It seems oxymoronic to bother with plot lines in a movie like this."
It seems oxymoronic to bother writing a review for a movie like this. I mean, come on "Jon Katz writes a movie review of Scorpion King" I don't have to read the review and I know exactly what you are going ot say. Why not review a real movie with some literary content like "Panic Room" or "Attack of the Clones" or even "Blade II"
Is this really a black mark for the Xbox? I have never had a pleasant customer service experience with any consumer electronics barring Computers. I have come to expect a poor level of service if I ever have to call support for a DVD player or a TV.
Besides, Microsoft will realize the current support contractor sucks, and pay out some cash for a better one. From the article it dosen't sound all that bad anyway.
This is anecdotal eveidence of certain individual's problems - not a big deal.
Re:Has everyone forgotten the Dec 25 Birthday?
on
Christmas is Coming
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· Score: 1
Kristi Myst - December 25th is the day we celebrate Kristi Myst - I loved her in "Buffy the Vampire Layer"
December 25th was the day when the prevailing Pagan Roman religion (something to do with sun worship I think) had their highest feast / orgy day. It was decided to place Dec 25 as Christmas to easily nudge people to accept Christianity. So if you look at it from this point of view - materialisim is a long way from orgies. Maybe Christmas isn't so bad after all?
All kidding aside.. I don't get your argument either
"Stop spending, start sharing. Christmas shouldn't be about gifts and money, it should be about family and helping each other and being nice to each other."
I think people I know and love buying me things is being nice - and likwise I feel I am being nice when I buy gifts. No doubt people give gifts under false pretenses, and most likely everyone has accepted a gift that they knew was given to them for a purpose (be it business, avoiding real contact, forgiveness, envy, blah)
The hushed overtone is "Spend money it is good for the economy" and the dissenters will yell "Don't spend for you are materialistic" - if the situation was one of great prosperity, the same dissenters would probably proclaim "Spend your money on others - What do you need it for"
Coke has competition that makes it clear that Coke is not a soft drink, Coke just has a more effective marketing campaign. Maybe Coke is one syllable and Pepsi is too much for a lazy person to mutter.
Windows has a ton of market share - the point is that to the common person, they would just think Windows is that thing on the comuter that makes it work. You make a good point, and my argument is definitely in the theoretical range - the word Windows would need to replace "Operating Systems" in our vernacular for my argument to amke any sort of sense - I was hoping a so called IAAL would comment on it.
Ok - isn't it legally possible that "Windows" could become a defacto name for an operating system (as a legal argument?)
Think about "Lineoleum" the vinyl floor covering. Lineoleum use to be a brand name for one specifc companies vinyl floor covering. Over time, lineoleum became so synonomus with vinyl floor covering (much because the company that manufactured lineoleum was pretty much the main producer of vinyl floor coverings) that the Lineoleum trademark was declared public domain. Now a bunch of companies make vinyl floor covering and call it 'lineoleum'
Kersoene, Asprin and Heroin are other examples of trademarked names released into the public domain - note that it is not because they expired but because the trademark name became so synonymous with the product it would be impossible to compete with one who holds that trademark. I have seen (from a marketing management course) Xerox internal documents stressing company employees to "Never refer to making copies as 'Xeroxing'" as Xerox is afraid to lose their trademark as well. Kleenex, Band Aids and Q-Tips all have the same issues, look at a pack of Band Aids - They are "Band Aids brand Adhesive Bandages" Does Microsoft market it's product as Microsoft Windows Brand Operating System?
The point I am making (or trying) is not that "Windows" as a name should mean all operating systems, but that the common person, would hear "Windows" and think of a computer operating system. Linux has Windows, Mac has Windows - why can't they just be called "Windows" as in - "hey are you running Linux Windows?" "No I am running Mac Windows but I want o upgrade to a new open source type of windows"
I talked to Comcast today - they say that a DHCP server is out in michigan (hy my area.) It seems that they are lying about what is going on. Only DNS servers are down (I am using my works DNS server heh heh) Unless they use DHCP to address the DNS servers (that would be dumb - but I wouldn't put it past them) It looks like that @Home is trying to pull the plug in the most logical way to get everyone up and running without having to readdress everyone.
It would bet that people who still have a connection are in a partially migrated network so a DNS server that is owned by their local ISP / cable company is acting as a secondary.
I understand your point - BUT: For large corporations, there is a bigger picture. Most managers should KNOW that Linux can provide the same if not better availability than Unix, and light years more than MS - Like I said on my original post it is not a technical issue. The heart of the matter is that CIO's feel that Linux is still hard to support, and that implementing Linux means you are putting something in your enterprise hat will be unsupportable in the long run. This is why Dell supporting Linux is a big deal.
1. Red Hat Server is not Free - you can buy it from Red Hat if you want yourself for about $179. If you really are going to complain about $150 (small potatoes) you can buy the Servers with no OS and get Red Hat GPL and load it yourself.
2. Not getting stickers, manuals, or a box? Are you kidding? If I kept all the boxes, stickers, Manuals I got, I would have a sea of cardboard in my cube. I would prefer just getting the OS CD maybe documentation on the CD too (I never read it anyway) and no paperwork whatsoever.
3. All Dell is a major player in the small server market. You can't compare IBM and HP's monster boxes to Dell's. Plus both HP and IBM have a cadre of Computer Scientists and consultants to draw upon. Dell makes no pretenses about what they will and will not supply.
4. I have called DEll support / Service too. It sucks - no questions about that. I guarentee you that if your company was larger and had a dell rep - you would have AWSOME service. My rep bends over backwards and makes all sorts of things possible.
All and All, I think your experience is isolated and shouldn't be held against Dell.
Getting Dell to maintain installation of Linux is kinda a big deal. I scope out servers from Dell often for my job, and I know as well as any other sys admin that when a box comes with any OS pre-loaded the first thing to do is wipe it out, resetup your RAID set and reinstall.
The importance is not that they load the OS, it's that they are treating Linux the same as Microsoft. PHB's like to feel secure, and knowing that Dell, a major player in the OEM server / PC market, is offering Linux as a platform they stand behind just like Netware and NT/2000 - makes them feel secure. It all comes down to big management catch words like "Enterprise" "Scalable" and maybe even a little "TCO."
The fight for Linux is not a fight of technical profecciency, that is already achieved, it is a fight of making managers at 35,000 feet feel comfotable with it. (IMO)
I don't think censorship is inherently communist. To prove my point here is a NY Times story (registration required) about how Saudi Arabia has been using filtering software to create a country wide "veil." The current contract is expiring and the Saudi government is bidding building the new internet veil out to US firms.
I can see your argument that this is immoral etc. On one hand - government censorship goes against everything America stands for and this is bad. However, on the other hand, Saudi Arabia (or China) ISN'T America, and whenever different cultures are judged against each other - war seems to be the result. Can we just worry about ourselves and let other countries do what they will (provided they return the favor)? Let China's people have their own democratic revolution if they want, or not. We all have to live together, don't we?
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I can smell those unix guys a mile away - Mt. Dew and Taco Bell...
Frankly, if you take a person who knows very little about computers and plop any OS in front of them they get scared and will not really know what to do. Mr. Gate's "easier to use, faster internet access" marketing ploy to sell his OS's (which drive the hardware industry) would be meaningless if everyone really knew 2 things. One is that just browing the web will work fine with a 200 - 400 MHZ machine with 64+ MB if ram. The second is that no matter how many features, knobs and gizmo's that Gates packs into his bloated OS the same functionality is really available in older versions of the OS. Plus, a novice will still not be able to use the XP os out of the box very effectively (see below for explanation.)
My bet is that MS is very aware of these dangers and builds some abstraction into their design to purposefully make the OS harder for new users. Note that Win XP has no desktop icons or easy HUD type bar (like KDE, GNOME, Aqua etc.) on the default install. The start menu (possibly the most familiar "PC icon" i the world) is completely different and much harder to navigate IMO. They make these OS's seem better with gadgets but the core functionality is still not in line with the common users needs. MS will then be able to launch a new OS every few years that is "easier to use." To use an analogy, would anyone be interested in a car that doesn't drive very well (hard to steer, accelerates erratically, just "cuts out" while driving.) then keep buing a new car every 2 - 3 years that has only slightly better conditions (or fixes some problems while adding more!)
Anyhow, almost 60% (probably more, the PC's are spread all over the country) have had Fujitsu drive failures. These are all domestic (U.S.) Pc's with Fujitsu 10 GB drives. I am so glad that this is a real problem - I feel like sending this link to the pain in the ass support guys that have made my life hell everytime a PC dies and needs a hard drive replaced.
I agree with you, didn't want to come off as stand-offish!! I was just relaying an experience with them I had. I wouldn't think that many of reasonable mind would feel differently than you or I on the computerized translation of medical-jargon-bad-doctors handwriting issue.
My recollection was that the docs used them for about a day then lost interest, reverting back to the clipboards - IMO their handwriting may be hard to read but I would rather have it translated by a floor nurse who knows what the hell is going on than some buggy hacked together software!!
Oh - I though it read 150 years of Eccentric pants Which could be a celebration coming up if you look here.
Many food shows tend to focus on fancy ingredients bought at stores that only exist in downtown NYC made with special tools that normally an average person would not own.
With your training at the New England Culinary institute, I know you must understand and have cooked "gourmet" cuisine. Yet on your show, you shop at Kroger's, use hardware store items instead of specialized cooking instruments and focus on the types of food we eat everyday (Pot Roast, Steak, Potatoes, Mac and Cheese.) Is there a secret that we non-gourmet types should be let in on? Should we catapult the notion that fancy meals with French names and odd ingredients is what you need to have an exquisite meal? Or are you a secret gourmet type sneaking into uber-hip Manhattan restaurants that only server beet foam with caviar and ramps?
BTW - your recipes are great, I don't know if you have heard this before but you are the new guard of America soul cooking.
Over the years I have moved from systems administrator positions to being an IT director at varying companies ranging from health care to heavy manufacturing. While the health care company (a major meto area hospital) I worked at had some policies (change every 60, minimum length etc.) people would still choose passwords such as "password1" and then increment the number ever 60 days or whatever. The manufacturing firms I have worked for had abismal policies for passwords (setting the default password to the same as the username and never forcing a change after that.)
What is key in this discussion, in all places I have worked is that the executvies who have the access to the most sensitive info and demand data security are the ones who never want to remember a password or have them change. If they don't want to participate, why burn out your Network Admins enforcing password policies as well as all of the support headaches they bring from locked accounts, forgotten passwords, screwed up password changes etc?
Really, my opinion from 7 years of 'real world' experience running 1000 - 5000 node networks plus large multi user systems (Unix Terminal environment to AS400 to Mainframe) is that passwords really only secure you (somewhat) from internal employees accessing information they are not supposed to. It is probably impossible to really say with any certainty (would you bet your salary on it?) that a system that has 1000+ logins and is accesible from the outside world is ever really "safe."
So, I must concur with some of the other posters and give a big "No Duh" on this one. IMHO It would be a waste of money and time to chase password policy enforcement for 10,000 users versus providing a total lockdown from outside acccess to your important systems and controlling that access with long passwords, 128+bit encryption etc. Of course there are exceptions for your financial institutions and other high sensitive government areas, but I have a feeling that they too are more lax on password policies then we would expect.
First of all - please read the Modern Hippocratic oath to get a feel of the sheer gravity that the oath actually represents. Then imagine the programmers oath
"Wherever I can, I will code many hidden easter eggs without the project managers consent or knowledge to provide the end users something to do. Also, I shall endeaver to ingest large quantities of mountain dew."
I mean, I can think of a few professions above programmers I want to take an oath (How about the short order cook that spit in your food last week huh?)
Second of all - How can you even compare the concept of upholding the ability to save and improve physically the life of an indivdual without corruption to a programmer? How is coding spam similar to endangering a life for unethical pursuits?
Third of all - WHO CARES? Oaths are meaningless in a captalistic society such as ours. Want proof? Lets take a quick tour down career avenue and look at the professions that take oaths - Lawyers (hmm, they seem to be a respectable bunch), Elected Officials (don't get me started), Judiciaries (Not too bad in his arena) and Public Safety officals (Rodney King, Malice Green, etc. etc.) Not to open a can of worms but the ORIGINAL Hippocratic Oath actually had a section condeming a doctor to perform an abortion so theoretically doctors that perform abortion break their oaths (I agree to the modern version expressed above and my political viewpoints on abortion are hopefully not reflected!)
To compare the importance of upholding the importance of ethics in the medical profession to a coder writing spam, spyware or other such "annoyances" is ABSURD.
I myself use VNC extensively for my network. Combined with SSH2 it makes a decent little VPN (plus it works in a browser window!)
OT, has anyone here gotten VNC to run in the Windows CE / PocketPC OS? I like the idea of controlling servers from my wireless PDA at home.
That depends on what you definition of "is" is.
It seems oxymoronic to bother writing a review for a movie like this. I mean, come on "Jon Katz writes a movie review of Scorpion King" I don't have to read the review and I know exactly what you are going ot say. Why not review a real movie with some literary content like "Panic Room" or "Attack of the Clones" or even "Blade II"
..oh wait, never mind
Besides, Microsoft will realize the current support contractor sucks, and pay out some cash for a better one. From the article it dosen't sound all that bad anyway.
This is anecdotal eveidence of certain individual's problems - not a big deal.
Kristi Myst - December 25th is the day we celebrate Kristi Myst - I loved her in "Buffy the Vampire Layer"
All kidding aside.. I don't get your argument either
"Stop spending, start sharing. Christmas shouldn't be about gifts and money, it should be about family and helping each other and being nice to each other."
I think people I know and love buying me things is being nice - and likwise I feel I am being nice when I buy gifts. No doubt people give gifts under false pretenses, and most likely everyone has accepted a gift that they knew was given to them for a purpose (be it business, avoiding real contact, forgiveness, envy, blah)
The hushed overtone is "Spend money it is good for the economy" and the dissenters will yell "Don't spend for you are materialistic" - if the situation was one of great prosperity, the same dissenters would probably proclaim "Spend your money on others - What do you need it for"
Merc - A German Pharmaceutical company (still around today) It was trademarked sometime before WW2
Lineoleum is no longer a registered trade name. Check out the query on "linoleum" from the US Trademark Electronic Search System
Coke has competition that makes it clear that Coke is not a soft drink, Coke just has a more effective marketing campaign. Maybe Coke is one syllable and Pepsi is too much for a lazy person to mutter.
Windows has a ton of market share - the point is that to the common person, they would just think Windows is that thing on the comuter that makes it work. You make a good point, and my argument is definitely in the theoretical range - the word Windows would need to replace "Operating Systems" in our vernacular for my argument to amke any sort of sense - I was hoping a so called IAAL would comment on it.
Think about "Lineoleum" the vinyl floor covering. Lineoleum use to be a brand name for one specifc companies vinyl floor covering. Over time, lineoleum became so synonomus with vinyl floor covering (much because the company that manufactured lineoleum was pretty much the main producer of vinyl floor coverings) that the Lineoleum trademark was declared public domain. Now a bunch of companies make vinyl floor covering and call it 'lineoleum'
Kersoene, Asprin and Heroin are other examples of trademarked names released into the public domain - note that it is not because they expired but because the trademark name became so synonymous with the product it would be impossible to compete with one who holds that trademark. I have seen (from a marketing management course) Xerox internal documents stressing company employees to "Never refer to making copies as 'Xeroxing'" as Xerox is afraid to lose their trademark as well. Kleenex, Band Aids and Q-Tips all have the same issues, look at a pack of Band Aids - They are "Band Aids brand Adhesive Bandages" Does Microsoft market it's product as Microsoft Windows Brand Operating System?
The point I am making (or trying) is not that "Windows" as a name should mean all operating systems, but that the common person, would hear "Windows" and think of a computer operating system. Linux has Windows, Mac has Windows - why can't they just be called "Windows" as in - "hey are you running Linux Windows?" "No I am running Mac Windows but I want o upgrade to a new open source type of windows"
I talked to Comcast today - they say that a DHCP server is out in michigan (hy my area.) It seems that they are lying about what is going on. Only DNS servers are down (I am using my works DNS server heh heh) Unless they use DHCP to address the DNS servers (that would be dumb - but I wouldn't put it past them) It looks like that @Home is trying to pull the plug in the most logical way to get everyone up and running without having to readdress everyone.
It would bet that people who still have a connection are in a partially migrated network so a DNS server that is owned by their local ISP / cable company is acting as a secondary.
mod this up - this guy speaks truth.
I understand your point - BUT: For large corporations, there is a bigger picture. Most managers should KNOW that Linux can provide the same if not better availability than Unix, and light years more than MS - Like I said on my original post it is not a technical issue. The heart of the matter is that CIO's feel that Linux is still hard to support, and that implementing Linux means you are putting something in your enterprise hat will be unsupportable in the long run. This is why Dell supporting Linux is a big deal.
1. Red Hat Server is not Free - you can buy it from Red Hat if you want yourself for about $179. If you really are going to complain about $150 (small potatoes) you can buy the Servers with no OS and get Red Hat GPL and load it yourself.
2. Not getting stickers, manuals, or a box? Are you kidding? If I kept all the boxes, stickers, Manuals I got, I would have a sea of cardboard in my cube. I would prefer just getting the OS CD maybe documentation on the CD too (I never read it anyway) and no paperwork whatsoever.
3. All Dell is a major player in the small server market. You can't compare IBM and HP's monster boxes to Dell's. Plus both HP and IBM have a cadre of Computer Scientists and consultants to draw upon. Dell makes no pretenses about what they will and will not supply.
4. I have called DEll support / Service too. It sucks - no questions about that. I guarentee you that if your company was larger and had a dell rep - you would have AWSOME service. My rep bends over backwards and makes all sorts of things possible.
All and All, I think your experience is isolated and shouldn't be held against Dell.
The importance is not that they load the OS, it's that they are treating Linux the same as Microsoft. PHB's like to feel secure, and knowing that Dell, a major player in the OEM server / PC market, is offering Linux as a platform they stand behind just like Netware and NT/2000 - makes them feel secure. It all comes down to big management catch words like "Enterprise" "Scalable" and maybe even a little "TCO."
The fight for Linux is not a fight of technical profecciency, that is already achieved, it is a fight of making managers at 35,000 feet feel comfotable with it. (IMO)
I can see your argument that this is immoral etc. On one hand - government censorship goes against everything America stands for and this is bad. However, on the other hand, Saudi Arabia (or China) ISN'T America, and whenever different cultures are judged against each other - war seems to be the result. Can we just worry about ourselves and let other countries do what they will (provided they return the favor)? Let China's people have their own democratic revolution if they want, or not. We all have to live together, don't we?