Mozilla is a good, stable browser with lot's of plugins available. It you have a fast computer it's probably a better choice than Phoenix.
Phoenix doesn't build whatever I've tried. So I use Mozilla. Mostly.
I've stopped using Mozilla mail client, once Evolution evolved finally to what it is now - Outlook killer for Linux users.
I am not interesting in plugins, but, very rarely, when there is no way arount to get to the site rather than through stupid flash - I use Opera. On the same platform with the same plugin binaries Opera works. Mozilla doesn't. I mean Mozilla doesn't work with plugins out of the box - the best is it shows the flash (somehow, in ery bad quality), but any mouse click on it sends Mozilla to the crash.
Basically, the only way to call Mozilla 1.x stable is when you don't use it for anything else besides HTML browsing. Everything else (mail, calendar, custom built XUL forms) will crash Mozilla sooner or later. With HTML it's oppositely different - it shows more than 20 tabs in 3-5 windows for weeks on my testing Linux box without crashing. And if it's getting slower - I just restart (close-open-load) some of tabs. Opera is far bellow such stability level. With HTML.
Everything above is true for Linux.
On Windows, I use Mozilla with plugins without such problems - it's stable. And when I name plugins, I mean Flash and Java. So, the problem with plugins is the problem with Linux binary plugin code, not with Mozilla. Perhaps, both Macromedia and Sun have no interest in Linux platform, but have very strong interest to keep their source code closed.
P.S. But why Opera (by the way, also distributed in binary code) works with same binary plugins better than Mozilla?
CORBA is not reaally overhead - it works fine in GNOME. But CORBA is obsolete. The main problem is that CORBA was not designed for asyncronous messaging from the first place. And that is bad in a real world with real firewall admins.
I think SOAP is much better than CORBA to bring a network transparency to GUI. SOAP is more flexible and more language independent (People who tried CJava comm over CORBA will understand).
Unfortunately, SOAP has problems too:
SOAP will give more overhead if you'll try to use it to deliver individual pixels and mouse events. Although, it's a solvable and configurable tradeoff between latency and overall performance.
Today SOAP is controlled mostly by Microsoft. I doubt that company will contribute anything to any good open source project. Although, Microsoft itself has some chance if they'll try something like GUI.NET
I wonder if Mono will be capable to sustitute X in future.
Strangely, she seems most interesting in CLI apps.
Kids are interesting in everything unusual. GUI is too simple, very usual, and very limited. In CLI they think (and they are often right!) they can find some way of doing of something or some information that they cannot find in GUI. Besides CLI is like a magic way, or some adventure game, or some sort of exploration.
That's my impression of watching kids playing with CLI.
Cool. This brings to mind the Linux watch IBM made some time ago. Does anyone know what's become of that? Is it still in development or was it just a showpiece?
The project scope has been temporary moved to Beowulf cluster of such watches - required for military special force teams.
all alternative you've listed suffer from a lack of application. That's because they planned to move from X through revolution.
I read (cannot find a link) another day that Gnome eventually will migrate from X to direct frame rendering. And I think that Gnome will manage to save most of existing Gnome applications as they are written with GTK, not X11 code. That's the way of evolution.
If they would hire another person, then it is non-zero chance that new one will spend considerable amount of time to learn specific installation and infrastructure information. Depends on the scale it can be 5 month (I know, that would be very extreme case) before the new guy will do adequate fixes and changes. So, that the base for negotiating.
If you had a problem to find a job all that time - take a payment for all 5 months you've been laid off. At least begin your negotiation from that point.
At least this anonounce speaks for itself: IBM "supports" open source by changing it to its proprietary software and thus IBM is killing open source software by destroying open source community.
Sounds familiar? For me to: it reminds me Bill Gates' "gifts" in India.
Technically, no way IBM can prove that DB/2 is better than PostgreSQL. But IBM even doesn't try to do it. No need. A sponsor can dictate its own choice of technology.
All right then. No more comments about dead BSD, candy Macosx, sloppy Windows, non-readable Perl, dragon corps and (whatever) USA and Americans.
Of course,./ admins must change some rules as well: no negative moderations anymore. How exciting!
I wonder what will happen to IRC channels? Filtering THAT? Been there done that. And that [actually, reasons of that] was the reason I fled from Soviet Union.
Then how would you explain that on my powerbook G3 I see lots of things faster when I boot Gentoo Linux comparing to Mac OS X?
The list of thing includes:
rendering of the same HTML by Mozilla;
rendering of the same XML by Cocoon;
performing the same query in PostgreSQL database;
byte-code compilation of the same package of scripts by Python;
byte-code compilation of the same code by Elisp;
LaTeX document rendering;
GCC compilation of the same code;
execution of various Apache CGI scripts;
running of OpenOffice;
running X11;
The list could be even longer, but many software (interpereters, APIs, servers) I need for my work is not compiled under Macosx at all or not in the version I need.
I understand that Photoshop runs on Macosx faster than on Linux b/c there is no Photoshop for Linux. That's why I compared performace on equal examples.
I've spent 6 months trying to love Macosx without any success. Probably I demand too much from that grandma-oriented OS.
Macosx is based on some part of freebsd, mostly some drivers and some utils.
Deep inside macosx is microkernel based. Freebsd is not.
Therefore, noway macosx can be same fast as freebsd, assuming they will run on the same hardware, which situation is not possible or at least any such benchmarks are not published. Or are they?
I know this is not an OS problem, it's a bloaty Mozilla problem
That's bloaty mozilla works way slower on both Mac OS X and Windows for me comparing to both Linux/x86 and Linux/PPC.
I think the problem is in swapping: both Windows NT and Mac OS X have very bad (slow) implementation of swapping. For example, it is not a bad idea that Linux uses a separate swap partiion.
Besides swapping, don't forget the speed of Ext3 (in some journalling modes) comparing to both NTFS and HPFS.
Re:Correction to Answer
on
Is Mac OS X Slow?
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
Macs are based on Objective-C - that's REALLY slow.
Correction: It is Mac OS X that is based on Objective-C. Linux/PPC systems are (all kernel, all Xfree86 and most of server applications) written on C.
And Gentoo/PPC on G3 powerbooks (without AltiVec) makes a way better (faster) optimization results than Mac OS X.
So no Macs aren't slow
Especially when Linux/PPC (namely Gentoo) is the OS installed on that Mac:)
Your advise is pointless. I've spent about 6 months with mac OS X at my home Mac and finalyy I've noticed that I swith to it in dual mode less and less, working more and more time in Linux/PPC (YDL that time).
I agree, first impresion was "Wow! nice candy!". But then I've found Mac OS X is too (comparing Linux, not to Windows!) limiting my capabilities of doing what I used to do in OS: development of server-side applications.
As for Open Office - it works good enough. I read all documents I get from my collegues and I can send them my editions back. Usually it works. All situations, when something looks not very nice b/c of some minor incompatibilities with MS Office, are compared to same situations of incompatibilities between different MS Office versions. We found that chances of such incompatibilities are almost the same.
By the way, I worked with mac version of MS Office - same problems, although usually it is well compatible. Same as Open Office.
Do you mean Apple computers with Linux installed? Oh, then good.
But something is bothering me to think that you may mean some other, proprietary, non-cross-patform, memory-leakful vendor-specific, operating system created by the company who wants to be another monopolist. Am I right?
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Something reminds me the bad word "pornography"...
Wait, how about software from startup companies? That would be certainly a case of child abuse!
So, what you suggest is wrong.
What makes Phoenix different than Galeon in terms of features?
what is the list of new features for Mozilla 1.3 and 1.4?
It exists for while already and it's called Yellow Dog Linux, check their store for pre-installed Macs and pre-installed harddrives.
Phoenix doesn't build whatever I've tried. So I use Mozilla. Mostly.
I've stopped using Mozilla mail client, once Evolution evolved finally to what it is now - Outlook killer for Linux users.
I am not interesting in plugins, but, very rarely, when there is no way arount to get to the site rather than through stupid flash - I use Opera. On the same platform with the same plugin binaries Opera works. Mozilla doesn't. I mean Mozilla doesn't work with plugins out of the box - the best is it shows the flash (somehow, in ery bad quality), but any mouse click on it sends Mozilla to the crash.
Basically, the only way to call Mozilla 1.x stable is when you don't use it for anything else besides HTML browsing. Everything else (mail, calendar, custom built XUL forms) will crash Mozilla sooner or later. With HTML it's oppositely different - it shows more than 20 tabs in 3-5 windows for weeks on my testing Linux box without crashing. And if it's getting slower - I just restart (close-open-load) some of tabs. Opera is far bellow such stability level. With HTML.
Everything above is true for Linux. On Windows, I use Mozilla with plugins without such problems - it's stable. And when I name plugins, I mean Flash and Java. So, the problem with plugins is the problem with Linux binary plugin code, not with Mozilla. Perhaps, both Macromedia and Sun have no interest in Linux platform, but have very strong interest to keep their source code closed.
P.S. But why Opera (by the way, also distributed in binary code) works with same binary plugins better than Mozilla?
I think SOAP is much better than CORBA to bring a network transparency to GUI. SOAP is more flexible and more language independent (People who tried CJava comm over CORBA will understand).
Unfortunately, SOAP has problems too:
- SOAP will give more overhead if you'll try to use it to deliver individual pixels and mouse events. Although, it's a solvable and configurable tradeoff between latency and overall performance.
- Today SOAP is controlled mostly by Microsoft. I doubt that company will contribute anything to any good open source project. Although, Microsoft itself has some chance if they'll try something like GUI.NET
I wonder if Mono will be capable to sustitute X in future.Kids are interesting in everything unusual. GUI is too simple, very usual, and very limited. In CLI they think (and they are often right!) they can find some way of doing of something or some information that they cannot find in GUI. Besides CLI is like a magic way, or some adventure game, or some sort of exploration.
That's my impression of watching kids playing with CLI.
The project scope has been temporary moved to Beowulf cluster of such watches - required for military special force teams.
I read (cannot find a link) another day that Gnome eventually will migrate from X to direct frame rendering. And I think that Gnome will manage to save most of existing Gnome applications as they are written with GTK, not X11 code. That's the way of evolution.
TWM comes with Xfee86/cygwin by default while FVWM, IceWM and AfterStep are also available.
If they would hire another person, then it is non-zero chance that new one will spend considerable amount of time to learn specific installation and infrastructure information. Depends on the scale it can be 5 month (I know, that would be very extreme case) before the new guy will do adequate fixes and changes. So, that the base for negotiating.
If you had a problem to find a job all that time - take a payment for all 5 months you've been laid off. At least begin your negotiation from that point.
Sounds familiar? For me to: it reminds me Bill Gates' "gifts" in India.
Technically, no way IBM can prove that DB/2 is better than PostgreSQL. But IBM even doesn't try to do it. No need. A sponsor can dictate its own choice of technology.
It doesn't matter on which hardware platfomr Linux will have success. Mac/PPC? Even better!
The question is: can Linux/PPC take an advantage of Apple's hardware?
The rest of your life you will discover that you are not what you thought.
Of course, ./ admins must change some rules as well: no negative moderations anymore. How exciting!
I wonder what will happen to IRC channels? Filtering THAT? Been there done that. And that [actually, reasons of that] was the reason I fled from Soviet Union.
The list of thing includes:
- rendering of the same HTML by Mozilla;
- rendering of the same XML by Cocoon;
- performing the same query in PostgreSQL database;
- byte-code compilation of the same package of scripts by Python;
- byte-code compilation of the same code by Elisp;
- LaTeX document rendering;
- GCC compilation of the same code;
- execution of various Apache CGI scripts;
- running of OpenOffice;
- running X11;
The list could be even longer, but many software (interpereters, APIs, servers) I need for my work is not compiled under Macosx at all or not in the version I need.I understand that Photoshop runs on Macosx faster than on Linux b/c there is no Photoshop for Linux. That's why I compared performace on equal examples.
I've spent 6 months trying to love Macosx without any success. Probably I demand too much from that grandma-oriented OS.
Deep inside macosx is microkernel based. Freebsd is not.
Therefore, noway macosx can be same fast as freebsd, assuming they will run on the same hardware, which situation is not possible or at least any such benchmarks are not published. Or are they?
That's bloaty mozilla works way slower on both Mac OS X and Windows for me comparing to both Linux/x86 and Linux/PPC.
I think the problem is in swapping: both Windows NT and Mac OS X have very bad (slow) implementation of swapping. For example, it is not a bad idea that Linux uses a separate swap partiion.
Besides swapping, don't forget the speed of Ext3 (in some journalling modes) comparing to both NTFS and HPFS.
Correction: It is Mac OS X that is based on Objective-C. Linux/PPC systems are (all kernel, all Xfree86 and most of server applications) written on C.
And Gentoo/PPC on G3 powerbooks (without AltiVec) makes a way better (faster) optimization results than Mac OS X.
So no Macs aren't slow
Especially when Linux/PPC (namely Gentoo) is the OS installed on that Mac :)
Yes, Gentoo, as well as most (I count 14) of other popular Linux distros, has its PPC port.
I agree, first impresion was "Wow! nice candy!". But then I've found Mac OS X is too (comparing Linux, not to Windows!) limiting my capabilities of doing what I used to do in OS: development of server-side applications.
As for Open Office - it works good enough. I read all documents I get from my collegues and I can send them my editions back. Usually it works. All situations, when something looks not very nice b/c of some minor incompatibilities with MS Office, are compared to same situations of incompatibilities between different MS Office versions. We found that chances of such incompatibilities are almost the same.
By the way, I worked with mac version of MS Office - same problems, although usually it is well compatible. Same as Open Office.
Do you mean Apple computers with Linux installed? Oh, then good.
But something is bothering me to think that you may mean some other, proprietary, non-cross-patform, memory-leakful vendor-specific, operating system created by the company who wants to be another monopolist. Am I right?
Have you tried Gentoo on latest Apple powerbooks?