The target that you should be aiming for regarding these patent agreements is not Xandros, or Novell, or even Microsoft. It should be the borked Software Patent laws that you've got in the US. Fix those, and you'll have no need of any patent agreemetns, or any patent clauses in the GPLv3.
So, where are the details of the letters you're all sending to your Senators / Congress-people? (You ARE sending them aren't you???) Where is the campaign to change the law? If you lot spent half the time trying to amend legislation that you do bitching about Xandros/Novell, then you might actually achieve something.
(I can't do anything, as where I'm from we don't have software patents. Software clauses in the GPLv3, or patent agreements between Xandros / Novell and Microsoft mean nothing to me, as they are irrelevant. However, seeing various parts of the Linux community slag into each other because of the uncertainty caused by a borked patent system pisses me off royally - FIX YOUR PATENT SYSTEM!!!)
I get the impression that GPL v3 was drafted in response to things like Tivo-isation. But that is the problem with Freedom.
"Free as in Free Speech, not Free Beer", as the mantra goes. Unfortunately, if there is Free Speech, then there will be someone saying something you don't like.
My view is that in any arena of Freedom, there will be those who abuse that freedom, but, in order to preserve that freedom, this abuse will need to be tolerated. This goes for Free Speech, and (may I suggest) also for "Free" software licenses.
Tivo-isation, patent agreements, and the like, might be distasteful, but may need to be tolerated for the sake of a greater "Freedom". Trying to legislate against such things paradoxically may produce less freedom than there was before.
I don't like Mono or the rest of Miguel's M$ fan-boyism. I don't want M$ crap in my life and haven't had it there for years.
Bully for you! You manage to lead a pure and Justified existence, unsullied by any contamination of anything from Microsoft.
Unfortunately, if you hadn't noted from your Edenic paradise of FLOSS perfection, a large of PCs (whether work or home, Server or Desktop) run Windows.
This begs a question - how to encourage people and companies to migrate from Windows to GNU/Linux? This just doesn't mean providing desktop environments (Gnome/KDE) but also a way to migrate applications (a big concern for business).
Java is not a problem, but the Microsoft languages (C#.NET and VB.NET) are.
I know what! What is required is someone to help provide an environment where these applications can run in (say) Linux and not just Windows! That way, the path to paradise is not blocked for all those people and companies using stuff developed with Microsoft technologies. Is there such a person? Is there such a Project? Why, goodness me, there is; Mono, with Miguel as main developer.
Of course, you may not want Gnu/Linux to become mainstream. If so, may I humbly disagree.
(Oh, and a query, How will you avoid all the stuff that the Suse folk put into the kernel? They're still at it as well, by the way, looking at the latest change logs. Maybe you should use Hurd instead. I've heard it's very pure and unsullied!)
Sesostris III
(PS, I currently dual boot with Ubuntu, having always used KDE before, and I must admit I like it. As mentioned by someone else, there is Kubuntu if you prefer KDE. Xubuntu if you prefer neither!)
Possibly wait a bit before emailing your MEP. The issue is currently out of their hands (and with the Council/Commission).
Should the Directive be passed by the Council, and sent back to the EP, or, if the process started again from scratch, then that is the time to email your MEP!
While with the Council/Commission, the best people to email are probably your national politicians.
Because... they're parents? Apparently it's the sort of things parents do, looking after their kids!
Actually, in the UK, in some situations a parent can be held accountable for the actions of their children. Surprisingly, a few parents have gone to prison due to the persistent truanting of their offspring.
Indeed! I'm sure it will soon occur to soemone that if the phone can report back to the parents that the teenager is speeding, then it can also report back to the police.
The police will then realise that this is not just useful in catching teenagers who speed, but can be used to catch anyone who speeds! And so on...
When I used to ride a bike, Volvo drivers (amongst bikers) has the worst reputation! The theory for this was that because they were so safe, they felt able to take risks with impugnity!
Actually, this might be the same with Firefox. I am much more likely to (ahem) surf to a dubious site with firefox than I am with IE!
OK, and a Non-US citizen (British), I really must object to this. To categorise all US citizens this wasy is just as obnoxious as (say) categorising all muslims as terrorists! Neither are true.
As to some specific points above:
Nearly half of the US voters who voted voted against the incombent president. It was a closely fought election, and not all US citizens can be blaimed for who gets elected.
There are many in the US who object to SUVs. Even in the UK, I get to realise that SUVs are controversial over there in the US. Indeed, the anti-SUV movement is probably more developed over there than over here!
Vietnam. Some of the strongest anti-Vietnam war protests were... in the US!
Americans have no values? What about; Freedom of Speech? Stallman and the GPL? The ACLU? Linux? (Linus Torvalds now lives and workds in the US). Democracy? (If Bush had lost the vote, he would have been out!).
Abu Gharib/Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay have, and do, anger a lot of US citizens. At least one US soldier has been court marshalled and imprisoned for Abu Ghraib, and the US supreme Court has ruled against the US Administration on some os the Administration's tactics as Guantanamo Bay. (Legal representation, I believe, although not sure).
I could go on. All I will say is don't judge a whole nation on the actions of a few. And that goes for all nations, not just the US. I would no more hold the US people as a whole to account for what their current president does, that I would blame all of Russia for what Stalin did!
Its worse than that. IBM may support Linux, but Linus is not IBM. This allows Intel, HP, Novell and others to also support Linux.
Solaris, even if Open Source, is still Sun. Would Intel, HP and Novell, let alone IBM, be willing to support a platform that is still linked heavily with Sun, rather than one that is truly "free"?
I think there is a confusion here about what is "Free" (as in beer) about F/OSS. Also a confusion about what most developers actually develop.
To take the first point first. I think (in a way) you inadvertently hit on the F/OSS business model. Companies like Red Hat, SuSE, Mandrake, IBM, Novel make money, not through the software, but through servicing and support. In the same way, Companies who buy proprietary productes (Windows, Office, etc) also probably spend more on support than on the software. There are probably more MCSEs around that Office Developers!
This leads to the second point. Relatively few developers produce "core" packages like Windows, Office, Visual Studio, Oracle (proprietary), or Lunux, GNU, Gnome/KDE, Apache (F/OSS). Most produce bespoke systems Using these products. I am one. Whether these are open source or proprietary is irrelevant - they are only applicable for your organisation. I cannot think (for instance) of a F/OSS banking system, ticket booking system, hospital patient record system, and so on. Yet there are far more of these than "infrastructure" systems like Office, and their development employes more people.
The question is why these bespoke systems aren't being created/replaced, as that is where most employment within IT is.
Hmmm. I'm sure there may be some Microsoft/Sun/Apple developers in Australia, in the same way that there may be some Microsoft/Sun Apple developers in New Zealand, the UK, France, Germany, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Brazil, etc, etc, etc. However, I suspect that most Microsoft/Sun/Apple developers are in the US.
Now, remind me again which country is really pushing for such "Fair Trade Agreements"!
Actually, there will still be people paid to develop it.
A distinction must be made between "infrastructure" software (packages such as word processors, IDEs and firewalls), and "bespoke applications" (such as, say, government social security applications). The former lends itself readily to open source development, the latter probably not (as there is only one user, with one set of requirements).
I would imagine that most (paid) software developers actually work on bespoke applications, rather than packages. I can't see this changing, even if the base packages used are FOSS.
The exceptions to this, of course, are those developers working for companies like Microsoft. Microsoft only produces (infrastructure) packages - the very things threatened by FOSS!
Re:So, naturalists observe, a flea...
on
A Worm's Worm
·
· Score: 1
I thought the ditty was:
Big fleas have little fleas upon their backs to bite them, and little fleas have lesser fleas, and so ad infinitum.
We whinge on one hand that Microsoft don't innovate. And when Microsoft innovate and try something new, we whinge! Perhapse we'll whinge whatever Microsoft do. Hindsight is a marvellous thing, and makes is oh so easy to judge.
The whole point about making progress is that it doesn't go smoothly. The same can be said within the FLOSS world, as well as in the proprietary software world. It is the attempt that is important, and the recognition that things could be better.
The fact that Microsoft do seem to be reverting back again with the.NET framework (stand-alone applications with separate config files) should be someting to appreciate, not criticise. Think of it not so much as a circle, as a spiral.
Actually, you can still use shared libraries in the.NET framework, they've just got to be digitally "signed", not so much to prove they're safe, but as an indication of who they came from! There is also a "global" machine-level config file!
(And no, I'm not a Microsoft shill - I'm typing this on Mizilla running SuSE 9!)
Interestingly, with the.NET framework, Microsoft seem to be going back to separate configuration files for each application (XML based).
Even more interestingly, one can create stand-alone.NET applications that will take all their dependent dlls etc with them. All you need to install is xcopy! This will permit different versions of the application to be held and run.
Of course, there are still global dlls with the.NET framework, but even then, different versions can be referenced.
Not to say that Microsoft is the be-all and end-all of computing (I'm typing this in Mozilla running under SuSE 9), but credit where credit is due. Even Microsoft can learn and make improvements.
Agreed. I've never claimed my own govermnent and country is perfect. There are things in the UK (and in Europe) that I don't like either. These things I try and influence by writing letters to my MP and, ultimately, at the ballot box. The people who put cameras up are (in theory) ultimately responsible to us, the citizens.
However, with regards the topic of this story, there is one fundamental difference. Whereas the cameras in London (and other cities - I'm in Merseyside) will photograph everyone, including both UK citizens and non-UK citizens, the fingerprinting and mug-shots proposed on entry to the US are for non-US citizens only.
Well, I agree. It is totally wrong to lump all US citzizens together and blame them all for some of the partisan actions of a partisan US Administration, or the actions of a few large corporations.
But then again, may I suggest that it is equally wrong to lump all non-US citizens together and brand them as potential terrorists, hell bent on destroying the US way of life.
I'm from the UK. Although I haven't been to the US tmyself, I do know a large number who have, or who intend to go some time in the near future. Why? Not because they want to destroy the US way of life, but because they LIKE the US!
To be honest, I LIKE the US! I wouldn't mind visiting the place myself (for some reason the image of hiring a Harley and biking through Arizona comes to mind! No idea if this is recommended, practical or even possible). However, I will NOT be doing anything of the sort if my fingerprints and mug-shot is going to be taken on entry and exit. I wouldn't want my own government doing that to me, let alone a foreign one.
Slashdot Mirror
The target that you should be aiming for regarding these patent agreements is not Xandros, or Novell, or even Microsoft. It should be the borked Software Patent laws that you've got in the US. Fix those, and you'll have no need of any patent agreemetns, or any patent clauses in the GPLv3.
/Novell, then you might actually achieve something.
So, where are the details of the letters you're all sending to your Senators / Congress-people? (You ARE sending them aren't you???) Where is the campaign to change the law? If you lot spent half the time trying to amend legislation that you do bitching about Xandros
(I can't do anything, as where I'm from we don't have software patents. Software clauses in the GPLv3, or patent agreements between Xandros / Novell and Microsoft mean nothing to me, as they are irrelevant. However, seeing various parts of the Linux community slag into each other because of the uncertainty caused by a borked patent system pisses me off royally - FIX YOUR PATENT SYSTEM!!!)
Sesostris III
I get the impression that GPL v3 was drafted in response to things like Tivo-isation. But that is the problem with Freedom.
"Free as in Free Speech, not Free Beer", as the mantra goes. Unfortunately, if there is Free Speech, then there will be someone saying something you don't like.
My view is that in any arena of Freedom, there will be those who abuse that freedom, but, in order to preserve that freedom, this abuse will need to be tolerated. This goes for Free Speech, and (may I suggest) also for "Free" software licenses.
Tivo-isation, patent agreements, and the like, might be distasteful, but may need to be tolerated for the sake of a greater "Freedom". Trying to legislate against such things paradoxically may produce less freedom than there was before.
Sesostris III
Bully for you! You manage to lead a pure and Justified existence, unsullied by any contamination of anything from Microsoft.
Unfortunately, if you hadn't noted from your Edenic paradise of FLOSS perfection, a large of PCs (whether work or home, Server or Desktop) run Windows.
This begs a question - how to encourage people and companies to migrate from Windows to GNU/Linux? This just doesn't mean providing desktop environments (Gnome/KDE) but also a way to migrate applications (a big concern for business).
Java is not a problem, but the Microsoft languages (C#.NET and VB.NET) are.
I know what! What is required is someone to help provide an environment where these applications can run in (say) Linux and not just Windows! That way, the path to paradise is not blocked for all those people and companies using stuff developed with Microsoft technologies. Is there such a person? Is there such a Project? Why, goodness me, there is; Mono, with Miguel as main developer.
Of course, you may not want Gnu/Linux to become mainstream. If so, may I humbly disagree.
(Oh, and a query, How will you avoid all the stuff that the Suse folk put into the kernel? They're still at it as well, by the way, looking at the latest change logs. Maybe you should use Hurd instead. I've heard it's very pure and unsullied!)
Sesostris III
(PS, I currently dual boot with Ubuntu, having always used KDE before, and I must admit I like it. As mentioned by someone else, there is Kubuntu if you prefer KDE. Xubuntu if you prefer neither!)
Thanks for this.
Having read the article, it becomes clear that the answer to "Would she make a worse president than Bush or Cheney?" is no.
(I can't help noticing that she looks rather like a cross between Hillary Clinton and Laura Bush. Is there a reason for this?)
I'm not from the US, so I know little about this Nancy Pelosi.
Would she make a worse president that Bush or Cheney?
Just curious.
Indeed. I started to install the update, saw this, and promptly cancelled out.
There is no way pre-release software should be issued as a high priority update.
Sesostris III
I assume you meant OpenDocument Text (.odt) rather than OpenOffice.org 1.0 Text Document (.sxw)?
Sesostris III
Possibly wait a bit before emailing your MEP. The issue is currently out of their hands (and with the Council/Commission).
Should the Directive be passed by the Council, and sent back to the EP, or, if the process started again from scratch, then that is the time to email your MEP!
While with the Council/Commission, the best people to email are probably your national politicians.
Sesostris III
Because ... they're parents? Apparently it's the sort of things parents do, looking after their kids!
Actually, in the UK, in some situations a parent can be held accountable for the actions of their children. Surprisingly, a few parents have gone to prison due to the persistent truanting of their offspring.
Sesostris III
Er, Scotland's first step!
Sesostris III
Reviewed in the Guardian. See:
, 13270,1394031,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/online/insideit/story/0
The abKey site is:
http://www.abkey.biz/
No idea if it is any good. Looks better than the New Standard Keyboard though!
Sesostris III
Indeed! I'm sure it will soon occur to soemone that if the phone can report back to the parents that the teenager is speeding, then it can also report back to the police.
The police will then realise that this is not just useful in catching teenagers who speed, but can be used to catch anyone who speeds! And so on...
Sesostris III
When I used to ride a bike, Volvo drivers (amongst bikers) has the worst reputation! The theory for this was that because they were so safe, they felt able to take risks with impugnity!
Actually, this might be the same with Firefox. I am much more likely to (ahem) surf to a dubious site with firefox than I am with IE!
Sesostris III
As to some specific points above:
- Nearly half of the US voters who voted voted against the incombent president. It was a closely fought election, and not all US citizens can be blaimed for who gets elected.
- There are many in the US who object to SUVs. Even in the UK, I get to realise that SUVs are controversial over there in the US. Indeed, the anti-SUV movement is probably more developed over there than over here!
- Vietnam. Some of the strongest anti-Vietnam war protests were
... in the US!
- Americans have no values? What about; Freedom of Speech? Stallman and the GPL? The ACLU? Linux? (Linus Torvalds now lives and workds in the US). Democracy? (If Bush had lost the vote, he would have been out!).
- Abu Gharib/Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay have, and do, anger a lot of US citizens. At least one US soldier has been court marshalled and imprisoned for Abu Ghraib, and the US supreme Court has ruled against the US Administration on some os the Administration's tactics as Guantanamo Bay. (Legal representation, I believe, although not sure).
I could go on. All I will say is don't judge a whole nation on the actions of a few. And that goes for all nations, not just the US. I would no more hold the US people as a whole to account for what their current president does, that I would blame all of Russia for what Stalin did!Have a nice day!
Sesostris III
Ho hum! If you look at the IP-Wars.net article (linked to in the main /. article), you will see that Al Petrofsky mentions his site at scofacts.org.
/. article), you will see (on the first line) it links to a PDF at ... scofacts.org!
... because, in reality, we are all on the same side!
If you look at the Groklaw.net article (linked to in the main
Al Petrofsky might be considered a troll on Groklaw, but this doesn't stop Groklaw from using his material.
And this doesn't matter. Why
Hope this helps
Sesostris III
Its worse than that. IBM may support Linux, but Linus is not IBM. This allows Intel, HP, Novell and others to also support Linux.
Solaris, even if Open Source, is still Sun. Would Intel, HP and Novell, let alone IBM, be willing to support a platform that is still linked heavily with Sun, rather than one that is truly "free"?
I doubt it.
I think there is a confusion here about what is "Free" (as in beer) about F/OSS. Also a confusion about what most developers actually develop.
To take the first point first. I think (in a way) you inadvertently hit on the F/OSS business model. Companies like Red Hat, SuSE, Mandrake, IBM, Novel make money, not through the software, but through servicing and support. In the same way, Companies who buy proprietary productes (Windows, Office, etc) also probably spend more on support than on the software. There are probably more MCSEs around that Office Developers!
This leads to the second point. Relatively few developers produce "core" packages like Windows, Office, Visual Studio, Oracle (proprietary), or Lunux, GNU, Gnome/KDE, Apache (F/OSS). Most produce bespoke systems Using these products. I am one. Whether these are open source or proprietary is irrelevant - they are only applicable for your organisation. I cannot think (for instance) of a F/OSS banking system, ticket booking system, hospital patient record system, and so on. Yet there are far more of these than "infrastructure" systems like Office, and their development employes more people.
The question is why these bespoke systems aren't being created/replaced, as that is where most employment within IT is.
Hmmm. I'm sure there may be some Microsoft/Sun/Apple developers in Australia, in the same way that there may be some Microsoft/Sun Apple developers in New Zealand, the UK, France, Germany, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Brazil, etc, etc, etc. However, I suspect that most Microsoft/Sun/Apple developers are in the US.
Now, remind me again which country is really pushing for such "Fair Trade Agreements"!
Actually, there will still be people paid to develop it.
A distinction must be made between "infrastructure" software (packages such as word processors, IDEs and firewalls), and "bespoke applications" (such as, say, government social security applications). The former lends itself readily to open source development, the latter probably not (as there is only one user, with one set of requirements).
I would imagine that most (paid) software developers actually work on bespoke applications, rather than packages. I can't see this changing, even if the base packages used are FOSS.
The exceptions to this, of course, are those developers working for companies like Microsoft. Microsoft only produces (infrastructure) packages - the very things threatened by FOSS!
I thought the ditty was:
Big fleas have little fleas upon their backs to bite them,
and little fleas have lesser fleas, and so ad infinitum.
Oh please,
.NET framework (stand-alone applications with separate config files) should be someting to appreciate, not criticise. Think of it not so much as a circle, as a spiral.
.NET framework, they've just got to be digitally "signed", not so much to prove they're safe, but as an indication of who they came from! There is also a "global" machine-level config file!
We whinge on one hand that Microsoft don't innovate. And when Microsoft innovate and try something new, we whinge! Perhapse we'll whinge whatever Microsoft do. Hindsight is a marvellous thing, and makes is oh so easy to judge.
The whole point about making progress is that it doesn't go smoothly. The same can be said within the FLOSS world, as well as in the proprietary software world. It is the attempt that is important, and the recognition that things could be better.
The fact that Microsoft do seem to be reverting back again with the
Actually, you can still use shared libraries in the
(And no, I'm not a Microsoft shill - I'm typing this on Mizilla running SuSE 9!)
Interestingly, with the .NET framework, Microsoft seem to be going back to separate configuration files for each application (XML based).
.NET applications that will take all their dependent dlls etc with them. All you need to install is xcopy! This will permit different versions of the application to be held and run.
.NET framework, but even then, different versions can be referenced.
Even more interestingly, one can create stand-alone
Of course, there are still global dlls with the
Not to say that Microsoft is the be-all and end-all of computing (I'm typing this in Mozilla running under SuSE 9), but credit where credit is due. Even Microsoft can learn and make improvements.
Agreed. I've never claimed my own govermnent and country is perfect. There are things in the UK (and in Europe) that I don't like either. These things I try and influence by writing letters to my MP and, ultimately, at the ballot box. The people who put cameras up are (in theory) ultimately responsible to us, the citizens.
However, with regards the topic of this story, there is one fundamental difference. Whereas the cameras in London (and other cities - I'm in Merseyside) will photograph everyone, including both UK citizens and non-UK citizens, the fingerprinting and mug-shots proposed on entry to the US are for non-US citizens only.
Well, I agree. It is totally wrong to lump all US citzizens together and blame them all for some of the partisan actions of a partisan US Administration, or the actions of a few large corporations.
But then again, may I suggest that it is equally wrong to lump all non-US citizens together and brand them as potential terrorists, hell bent on destroying the US way of life.
I'm from the UK. Although I haven't been to the US tmyself, I do know a large number who have, or who intend to go some time in the near future. Why? Not because they want to destroy the US way of life, but because they LIKE the US!
To be honest, I LIKE the US! I wouldn't mind visiting the place myself (for some reason the image of hiring a Harley and biking through Arizona comes to mind! No idea if this is recommended, practical or even possible). However, I will NOT be doing anything of the sort if my fingerprints and mug-shot is going to be taken on entry and exit. I wouldn't want my own government doing that to me, let alone a foreign one.
Er, no. It is 100% tax on $699 surely?
... $699!
I make that