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you mean like this? http://archives.fedoraproject.org/pub/archive/fedora/linux/core/

If you MUST use Windows:

http://www.openoffice.org/
http://www.gimp.org/downloads/
http://www.inkscape.org/download/?lang=en

If you're partial to macs you have the same options:

http://www.openoffice.org/
http://www.gimp.org/downloads/
http://www.inkscape.org/download/?lang=en

If you're fed up with Microsoft and don't have a Mac (or if you have a Mac but are tiring of OS X):

http://www.opensuse.org/en/
http://www.kubuntu.org/
http://www.xandros.com/
http://www.centos.org/
http://fedoraproject.org/

No need to wonder, Fedora 9 had it already back in may: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/9/FeatureList

I don't know about fedora, but ubuntu installer has a free software only option at the opening screen. Functionality of high-level stuff may not be there (java, 3d-video, flash) but it's not inseperable.

With Fedora, freedom, is the only option - excepting the binary blobs that are talked about in the above article, that are shipped with the kernel. Fedora doesn't ship or maintain repositories for non-free software. Adobe Flash isn't there, patent encumbered audio and video codecs aren't there. Take a look: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems

All the documentation in a free system distribution must be released under an appropriate free license. Additionally, it must take care not to recommend nonfree software. [...] What would be unacceptable is for the documentation to give people instructions for installing a nonfree program on the system, or mention conveniences they might gain by doing so.

That's just ludicrous. Frankly, it's just a (very) small step away from requiring that you don't (or can't) run any non-free app on your "free" OS. That single clause has just blown any notion of a "free" (in any sense of trying to protect the end-user's freedoms, which is the FSF's major ideological foundation) distribution. I don't know who the manic that wrote that section is, but it's going to cause immeasurable harm to the Free Software movement.

If we go by that clause, NONE of the distros are free. You'd have to cut out a huge chunk of the Ubuntu distro, remove the entire non-free Debian archive, and I'm not even sure how to get it out of Fedora.

What do you mean get it out of Fedora? Fedora has no non-free software (binary firmware blobs that are distributed with the kernel excepted) to begin with. Moreover Fedora has no 'non-free' repositories. (There are third party repositories for Fedora - but they are not managed or hosted by the Fedora Project.) To boot Fedora has for years (perhaps since inception) taken the stance of not talking about non-free software in it's documentation. See: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems

Hello,

You may want to read this: Fedora 10 Virtualization.

And from another article

"The kernel-xen package has been obsoleted by the integration of paravirtualization operations in the upstream kernel. The kernel package in Fedora 10 supports booting as a guest domU, but will not function as a dom0 until such support is provided upstream. The most recent Fedora release with dom0 support is Fedora 8."

So it's unlikely that Fedora is abandoning Xen... There are upstream problems to be fixed before dom0 support is integrated in Fedora again.

Hello,

You may want to read this: Fedora 10 Virtualization.

And from another article

"The kernel-xen package has been obsoleted by the integration of paravirtualization operations in the upstream kernel. The kernel package in Fedora 10 supports booting as a guest domU, but will not function as a dom0 until such support is provided upstream. The most recent Fedora release with dom0 support is Fedora 8."

So it's unlikely that Fedora is abandoning Xen... There are upstream problems to be fixed before dom0 support is integrated in Fedora again.

Plugins, namely. One of the coolest ones is Presto. But like I said, what use is it if I can't even run it on my server without adding more ram?

Xen virtualization is still strong, fedora just isn't porting the kernel patches upstream anymore. I believe Novell has a 2.6.27 kernel with xen patches. I would think it to be possible to pull down the kernel source from Fedora, build the config, then pull in suse kernel source, run make oldconfig, and compile your own kernel for fedora using the suse sources. I've never tried it and fully understand that this is an unacceptable option for most fedora users.

I've been following the fedora-xen mailing list and they would still like to put xen back in, but not until it's in the upstream kernel. As stated at the F9 release, they feel it is counterproductive to maintain 2 different kernels, which I can't disagree with them on. The latest news I heard is that they were hoping the 3.4 release of xen to have pv_ops dom0 in the kernel. Wether or not that it's Linus' kernel, they haven't really stated. If fedora is waiting for pv_ops dom0 to make it into Linus' kernel, then I would have to agree that xen will slowly dissapear and KVM will be the way to go. I see that as an uphill battle for the xen team since kvm is already in the kernel.
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs/Beats/Virtualization for more information on f10 virtualization.

I have a laptop I bought in April, 4GB RAM, and Vista (preinstalled) has always just been obscenely slow when doing anything like logging in, switching users, etc. Absolutely ridiculous.

No, you bought 1 GB RAM but paid for 4. Windows can only use 3 GB and Windows Vista wastes more than 2 GB by itself. That leaves you with 1 GB. Why not use all 4 GB RAM or get turbo speed by swapping DEs.

The dev team did away with rhgb (replaced by plymouth) and used readahead to achieve faster (30 seconds was the target) boot times (details here). Plymouth relies on kernel modesetting support to get its graphical goodness, which unfortunately is only supported well on ATI chips.

This dom0 was rather important for me. I am still running FC8 for that reason. I guess xen virtualization is slowly disappearing. Kvm I presume will be the way to go eventually...

Take the .src.rpm for firefox from Fedora and issue an rpm --rebuild on it. You can't redistribute the result of that command without entering into a trademark license agreement with Moz Corp.

Take your .spec, remove the line that says "ac_add_options --enable-official-branding", and go ahead and distribute with no agreement. (It'll be called Bon Echo or Gran Paradiso or Shiretoko or Minefield or whatever, though.)

Iceweasel (the Debian one) was a special case - they completely ignored the existing rebranding bit and hacked everything together, then complained. (I think they un-hacked their stuff these days, though.)

(For the Fedora case, http://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc//rpms/firefox/devel/firefox.spec?view=markup - see the %define official_branding 1 bit up top.)

1. No fecking media support! I get XMMS inform me on first attempt at playing an MP3 that it won't because of licensing conflict. Wtf? Codecs for avi's and DVDs were a simular story; all had to be downloaded via yum (bloody excellent tool!). Seriously; not good, but fixed in the end.

See this page to understand why these things are not included by default. Essentially you are either complaining that you aren't getting something for free that requires royalties (or you don't agree with the current laws making the use of these technologies without paying royalties illegal). =) This is why many people try to use and promote the use of non-restricted formats.

2. Why the hell do I have to install a new kernel? Why? I've never had to on Windows - why is Linux different? Is it so buggy? I installed with a factory version something ending 054. Now I have something ending 122 I believe. I did it ok, but that's not the point I'm making; were there really 68 cock-ups so great in the kernel build from release-time until that now they had to re-release 68 times? I'm guessing probablly not, but still.

All software has bugs. =) I don't think you're ever *forced* to upgrade your Linux kernel, but it's generally a good idea to keep up with minor updates to reduce security vulnerabilities and such. Are you sure you've never upgraded your Windows kernel? You've never ran Windows updates? I think you just don't know that you have. You're effectively complaining that Linux is more transparent about what it's doing. That's a good thing!

3. Point 2 also breaks my nvidia drivers. I don't want to re-compile new drivers everytime there's a new 'patch'. For the love of god, why?!

I'm not sure I understand this one... nvidia's drivers are closed, so you can't actually compile new drivers each time. If nvidia doesn't support the kernel you want to upgrade to, you are at their mercy, and I don't use nvidia cards for this reason, but I thought that nvidia generally kept up with the latest stable kernel versions. I assume you just had to add an external yum repository (like Livna)? Does Fedora not take care of upgrading the nvidia driver for you automatically then?

4. X-Windows. What a mess. Why do I have to tell it my x & y refresh rates for my monitor? Windows just 'knows'. Many more things here I feel that X-Windows should just 'know' - the number of buttons on my USB mouse for-instance. If Windows can do it, there's no reason why Linux can't. Also, X-Windows 'feels' slower than Windows. I'm sure there's good reasons for this, but I don't care; Windows is snappier.

I agree with you that X is still behind in a lot of ways. There's a reason why Apple didn't use it when developing OS X. It's development had stagnated for a while, but it's been picking up steam again, so we'll see...

5. Lack of decent file-browser. The best I've come across is Nautilus in a mode that resembles Windows Explorer. It'll do for now, but as far as I'm aware, offers no context-sensitive menus for applications (like the Winamp "Play in Winamp" right-click menu on folders.

Yes won't argue with you there either, I think there's still a lot of room for improvement on the desktop side of things for Linux.

Some distros do have unique features. For instance Fedora 9 had kernel-mode setting if you had an Intel video card. At the time, it was only one of a few, if not the only installers to offer full disk encryption in the installer, etc. Ubuntu offers Wubi.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/9/FeatureList

That is the kind of stuff I'm talking about. When reviewing distros, write about what makes that distro unique.

Just what kind of argument is it? You've installed RPMs from unknown source on production server and complain that the RPMs are broken... Quite silly really.

If you still wan't to check out Zabbix and you use RHEL I recommend EPEL RPMs packaged by Fedora Community. They work fine for me:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL

But there is no automatic database creation script since no sane admin need such thing.

Instalation is as simple as:

1. Install RPMs via YUM or by hand.
2. Create database user and database with proper privileges (RTFM on how to do that).
3. Load initial database schema from supplied SQL file.
4. Configure zabbixd and zabbix_web (PHP frontend) - you need to supply database creditentials and that is bassically it.
5. Start the demons and you are done. From now you can point and click most of basic stuff.

Combine these efforts with IBM's recommended use of Make for startup dependencies, and Fedora's One Second X project and we should have some marked improvements in boot time.

Firefox 3.0 has a feature that blocks sites that are on Mozilla's phishing blacklist. They would like users to accept a service agreement before using this feature, and they would like the feature to be on by default, which means having the user accept the agreement the first time the program runs.

I can understand their desire for the service agreement. Trademark and copyright law apply implicitly - other people have no rights to distribute the software or use the trademarks unless granted by a license (or fair-use), so there is no need to ask someone to agree to them. Service agreements are different - they are honest-to-goodness contracts and not licenses of any sort, so it really is best to get an explicit agreement. And the whole "by simply using this service you agree to the terms posted somewhere on our website" is hard to uphold in court if the user doesn't even know he is using the service.

At the minimum they need to have some sort of nag-screen displayed when activating this feature letting people know that it is getting data from an external server, and to deny liability for inaccuracies etc. Preferably (from the point of view of lawyers), this would require a click-through agreeing to the terms. But if they do this at all it should be done in a way that is clear that they are not agreeing to a license to use the software. Something like:

Firefox has a new phishing protection feature to protect you from fraudulent websites designed to obtain your private information (like passwords and credit card numbers) by disguising themselves to look like legitimate websites (like banks or online shops).

This feature relies on an online service provided by Mozilla Corp. By using phishing protection, you are accepting the terms of the Mozilla Website Service Agreement.

[I accept the service agreement - Enable phishing protection]
[Do not enable at this time]

There are 3rd party services now included in FF which have additional terms not covered by copyright/trademark law.

I agree.

The only reason that this is being discussed at all is because FireFox has such a strong brand and people don't want to loose it.
But that doesn't mean we should accept this. If the major Linux distributions accept this from Mozilla, everyone else will want to have their own special EULAs displayed and the user experience will become degraded to the point where we have 10 or 20 different apps all popping up their own custom EULAs each with slightly different terms and conditions.

What happens if Mozilla add a couple of extra lines in the next release that makes the EULA just that little bit more restrictive. Do we go through the same hand wringing all over again "well ... we have accepted the first one, and it is only one tiny extra clause ..." ?

The only way to deal with this problem is to stop it before it starts. If Mozilla want to add an EULA, then FireFox gets removed from the default install.
It can still be available in the 'extras', where the user can explicitly accept the EULA when they install it.

Or, Mozilla work with Canonical, RedHat etc. to work out a way of adding the appropriate legal clauses to the system install screens. I have no objection to Mozilla wanting to protect their trademarks but they need to do it in a way that does not degrage the user experience. This kind of thing should be displayed when the software package is installed, not when it is run. If that means it gets dropped from the default install and has to be explicitly selected and installed later, then so be it.

On first boot, Fedora presents a simple to read page that says the license details are here : http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Legal/Licenses/LicenseAgreement9 I'm sure Ubuntu has something similar. Sensible thing would be to add the bits Mozilla need to say to these so they are seen by the person who installs it, not the person who uses it.

TFA says:

However, as of September 8, the crisis continues, with Fedora users still unable to get security updates or bug-fixes.

Not true. Go here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Enabling_new_signing_key, follow the instructions and voila... updates available.

http://www.debian.org/
http://www.fedoraproject.org/
http://www.ubuntu.com/
http://www.opensuse.org/
http://www.slackware.org/
http://www.gentoo.org/
http://www.freebsd.org/
http://www.openbsd.org/

Here's a conversation I found from a fedora discussion:

Non linear ogg editor/ screencast helper

Status: Proposed

Summary of idea: Still we are missing a good non linear editor for ogg videos. This can be a simple GUI based application to do non linear editing of ogg. Like cutting, mixing the videos. Adding still frames to the video etc. Though this is not a project to be finished within 2-3 months, but we should be able to have a basic application running to do simple edits. May be having feature of upload videos to fedoratv or integrate itself with recordmydesktop to get screencasts directly. I am looking for more ideas on this.

Contacts: KushalDas kushaldas AT fedoraproject {NOSPAM} DOT org

Notes: Recommended choice of language is Python or C

ValentTurkovic: I have 2 suggestions; First is to try and resurrect Diva Project who started as GSC project in 2006. Second is to work with Pitivi Project because it is on a good path and has ogg editing functionality and easy enough interface. To get an overview of this Diva Project rise and fall please read these two posts. UPDATE: There are two projects that look promissing: saya-videoeditor [2] and myvideoeditor [3]

So between these and Cinelerra's successor, Lumiera, I'm sure 4 years will be more than enough to have an actually usable professional Video Editor for Linux.

And I think that these 4 years will give Krita and GIMP the time they need to become full-featured and more user-friendly, respectively.

(And don't get me started on WINE, these guys are advancing fast!)

This page includes a list of FLOSS automated theorem provers. Fedora 10 adds several of these tools, so you'll be able to easily install and try out some of them.

News feeds:

IE Blog - for keeping track of what MS is up to on the browser front
http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/atom.xml

Standards Blog - not as many posts now days, was very important during the height of the ooxml/odf war
http://www.consortiuminfo.org/standardsblog/backend/geeklog.rss

I keep OSNews for completeness, but it is pretty useless - software news
http://osnews.com/files/recent.xml

Anandtech - hardware news and reviews
http://www.anandtech.com/rss/articlefeed.aspx

Ars Technica - tech news and commentary
http://arstechnica.com/index.rssx

Phoronix - linux graphics news and info
http://www.phoronix.com/rss.php

Linux Weekly News
http://lwn.net/headlines/rss

KDE announcements
http://www.kde.org/dotkdeorg.rdf

Open Source Software Planets:

http://planet.debian.org/rss20.xml

http://planet.fedoraproject.org/atom.xml

http://planet.ubuntu.com/rss20.xml

http://planet.gnome.org/atom.xml

http://planetkde.org/rss20.xml

http://planet.freedesktop.org/rss20.xml

http://planet.mozilla.org/atom.xml

http://planet.jabber.org/atom.xml

mostly software releases and XEP updates
http://planet.jabber.org/news/atom.xml

http://maemo.org/news/planet-maemo/atom.xml

environment feeds:

Good Pacific Northwest environmental news
http://www.sightline.org/daily_score/rss

Best environmental news and discussion on the web
http://www.worldchanging.com/index.xml

I keep Treehugger for completeness, but I mark 90% of their posts as read without looking at them.
Really too "light green/consumer green" for me
http://www.treehugger.com/index.xml

other feeds:

Dive into Mark - not what once was, but good enough to keep around
http://diveintomark.org/feed/

Loooong posts on software
http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/atom.xml

Bruce Scheier knows Alice and Bob's shared secret
http://www.schneier.com/blog/index.rdf

The intersection of Science (especially Evolution), Liberalism, Atheism, and Squid
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/index.xml

"Your comment has too few characters per line" - what a load of bull. Taco, I know this and the timer are supposed to cut down on spam, but I think they annoy legitimate posters more than they reduce spam. You should really reconsider these "features".

SuSE is a proponent of AppArmor, whereas Red Hat is big into SELinux. If you're big into security, this is a major difference.

http://www.novell.com/linux/security/apparmor/selinux_comparison.html
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SELinux

Normally, I'd agree with you. On this occasion, I did download it because I *will* be using it, and I wanted to add my vote to the statistics. The way I saw it, this wasn't just about a new version of a web browser, the event was a public vote of confidence in FireFox and OpenSource in general.

I won't be installing it from the zip, because it is included automatically in Fedora 9. At the moment my desktop is running Fedora 8, but I plan to update all my machines to Fedora 9 in the next month or so. Installing it from the Fedora package I should (hopefully) get the most recent security updates as well.

http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

You can update to them now:
rpm -Uvh http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

You can update to them now:
rpm -Uvh http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

You can update to them now:
rpm -Uvh http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

You can update to them now:
rpm -Uvh http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/firefox/3.0/1.fc9/i386/firefox-3.0-1.fc9.i386.rpm http://koji.fedoraproject.org/packages/xulrunner/1.9/1.fc9/i386/xulrunner-1.9-1.fc9.i386.rpm

> I am pleased that there are alternatives at last, be it Apple or a future Linux that will be more innovative and user friendly by the time my current hardware dies.

Why wait that long? Download a Linux distro today and setup a dual boot system. Spend some time just looking around, figuring out what you need to make the migration. Take your time, and do a smooth transition.

Here's some free links for you:
http://fedoraproject.org/en/get-fedora
http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/download

This abandoning the desktop talk really annoys me. Desktop is just a buzzword all the while redhat maintains and writes half of gnome and desktop software, where you think network manager came from or pulse audio, the suspend features in gdm, UI, who funds and built freedesktop.org? Just cause they dont have a sticker that says "desktop linux" doesn't mean they abandoned it. look up redhats contributions http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/RedHatContributions sometime.

It's quite simple really they dont want fresh OSS software to be associated with the red hat brand. Fedora will have bugs and be considered "unstable" to many who are looking for no noticeable bugs in thier OS. If fedora was called redhat desktop people would be going around saying i tried to install "red hat" and the instal failed.. they wont differentiate redhat desktop from redhat server in mindshare, it will redhat will lose its brand as a stable serious company. This way I get my fast moving OS and i know what it is, yet newbies wont start branding redhat as a P.O.S cause it didn't install on their emachine.

That's what I don't understand about the name change... unless RedHat intentionally wanted to re-brand Fedora as inferior. They couldn't block 'freeloaders' so make the *free* version seem inferior and suddenly 'poor' people would rather pirate RHEL, download centos or go to another distro.

Give people more credit, especially those trying Linux for the first time.

Redhat Consumer Desktop (don't like consumer, but how about 'Redhat Fedora Desktop' ?)
Redhat Server
Redhat Enterprise Server (LTS)

What's wrong with that? people don't stop buying desktops because they can afford racks. They buy desktops because they cater towards a consumers needs such as graphics rather than power/wattage p/ inch. OS's are the same... You want to download the enterprise server and likely half the functions you want/need will be disabled by default (and vice versa). You want fancy effects, media players and consumer featured stuff you buy the desktop...

Consumers = Server is inferior
Enterprise = Desktop/workstation is inferior

No offence to fedora users (although admittedly I haven't used any rpm based distro in eons) but from my own perspective it would appear RH outsourced the 'consumer' market because they weren't getting any return and in doing so alienated by choice their own brand.

Look at this site:
http://fedoraproject.org/

and then look right down at the very bottom of the page, just squint your eyes:

"
Copyright © 2008 Red Hat, Inc. and others. All Rights Reserved. Please send any comments or corrections to the websites team.

The Fedora Project is maintained and driven by the community and sponsored by Red Hat. This is a community maintained site. Red Hat is not responsible for content.
"

JIMHO, and this is jimho, RedHat appears to have actively DILUTED their own desktop OS on purpose rather than avoid brand confusion.

I'm sure this has been a discussion beaten into the ground, but you did ask for me to elaborate. I have no disrespect for Fedora or its abilities as an OS but I dont believe RH could distance themselves any further without risking an 'unofficial' out of their control distro of Linux

http://fedoraproject.org/ http://www.opensuse.org/

Is there something I'm missing completely here, or are the comments above complete non-sequiturs?

Just because the internet existed when you were born does not mean that free music and movies are a birthright.

While I don't argue that bittorrent is being used for distributed pirated works, there are legal uses for it. For the most part bittorrent is used for large files because it is more efficient. Because of this, Linux distributions are distributed via bittorrent. If you don't believe me, get a copy of Redhat Fedora. World of Warcraft players get their updates from Blizzard using Blizzard's customized version of bittorrent. Some musicians like Trent Reznor have released digital masters via bittorrent of their own work. At the moment, none of these ISPs will recognize these legal uses.

Recently, I've noticed the filtering. It wasn't network latency. I could surf for hours and download gigabytes of files directly from a site. If I started bittorrent, my ISP connection would drop in 10 minutes. I would have to restart my router. Every time my I had to update WoW, I had to kiss my internet connection goodbye while it loaded.

I'd tend to agree. On my machine is both Fedora 8 and Debian Etch. Debian's "stable" code is maddeningly stable sometimes. For instance, Fedora keeps up along with the Pidgin version, whereas Debian Etch currently maintains a Gaim version (I forget which exact version).

However, Fedora has a lot of focus on upstream work that distros, who focus on stability, can benefit from. Not saying either is better, but there's a place for each of them. So... you do tend see some less mature software in Fedora but that's expected. I'm not sure how the other distros operate but Debian and Fedora seem to be on the opposite sides with what is released.

you can do a minimum net install, then install whatever you want (if that is what you are looking for)

http://docs.fedoraproject.org/install-guide/f9/en_US/ch-other-install-methods.html#sn-alt-install-method

I thought the name Sulphur was kind of... lame, so I decided to see what the name was about. The truth is, it was the least bad of all the names voted upon.
 
The logic behind it is thus:
Some more suggestions

  "sulphur"
  "mayonaisse"

(like werewolves they react badly with silver)
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2007-December/msg01194.html
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/Names
The other options were:
vote_count , name
                62 , Sulphur
                54 , Bathysphere
                43 , Chupacabra
                39 , Mayonnaise
                32 , Dragicorn
                29 , Woodwose
                23 , Tourette
                13 , Asperger
                13 , Barmanou
                10 , Chingachgook
                  6 , Kingsport Town
                  5 , Marfan

https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-announce-list/2008-January/msg00012.html

I"m planning on putting FC9 on a machine, FC9 has Pulse Audio http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Overview, I'm not certain about it on a 64bit machine. I've gotten Adobe Flash to work on my Arch Linux machine using Nspluginwrapper. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Install_Flash_on_Arch64 The Arch Linux Wiki says there might be trouble with Pulse Audio and Flash. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PulseAudio Anybody try Adobe Flash+Nspluginwrapper+x86_64+PulseAudio? How'd it go?

"I'm a sysadmin and use KDE all day long, with Konsole as my terminal. I tried the preview release of Fedora 9 and found
that the new Konsole - has less features!"

They must be going for the Gnome look...

All kidding aside, I'm very surprised they went with KDE4. I've been playing around with it on Gentoo for several months now, and I could understand making it an option, but to not provide KDE3 out of the box at all (http://docs.fedoraproject.org/release-notes/f9/en_US/sn-Desktop.html#sn-KDE) is shocking. I thought even the KDE folks were recommending waiting until 4.1. Oh well, Fedora always likes the latest and greatest.

PackageKit is actually a just a tool which sits on top of yum and does not replace it. It does replace pup and pirut though.

See PackageKit site of the release notes.

We have quality control also. Also, this language pack trojan was caught early on...

Not only does it not exist, but if you run out of disk space, you run out of disk space.

Here's a stupid question for the slashdot populace: Why are all operating systems so bad at handling the process of deleting files?

It seems like it would be bog simple (disclaimer: I am not much of a programmer... salt at the ready) to remap unlinking of a file to relinking it to a trash directory, something like $HOME/.Trash (there's per-volume trashes too, but I always forget where those live. Probably on the volume) :P Then, and this is the important part: 1, when free space is requested, files in the trash are not shown in the quota and 2, when a file operation requires disk space, instead of failing it, we unlink some files for real based on some sort of reasonable algorithm.

Why, why, WHY does no one do this? It makes no sense. It would save everyone from ever having to empty the trash. When files have metadata, or based on metadata which can be generated from files programatically, files can be assigned scores and deleted in order of rank... or on whatever basis the user likes, you can select files to delete and return their inode numbers with a shell script for all I care. Just fall back to some reasonable heuristic if the user space tool fails.

Anyway, if you want to move files to the trash yourself, it seems like a simple shell script would do the job. You could also use find -exec (read the manpage for find.) to do all kinds of fun selective "deletions". There must be some way to instruct nautilus to trash a file with dbus, which would surely be the best way to go about it... but I have no idea what that would be. While looking around I found libtrash (this is about using it actually, not a direct link) which does some of what I want; I also found Gvfs which provides unified trash; it looks like Nautilus (GNOME's file manager) has trash functions in a private library, I don't know if that's built shared but it might not be too hard to use the same functions to trash files.

In order to delete all your potential trash files you have to do the following (GNOME):

1. sudo rm -rf $HOME/.Trash/*
2. sudo rm -rf $HOME/.local/share/Trash/*
3. for each mounted filesystem, do the following:
   if [ -d "${filesystem}/.Trash-${USER}" ]; then sudo rm -rf "${filesystem}/.Trash-${USER}" ; fi

To put trash into the trash properly... that's much more complicated, because files with the same names are removed. I think you can make nautilus empty the trash via dbus but I don't know about anything else, I don't think so.

It seems like you could get this functionality at the command line and in the GUI by installing libtrash, and wrapping a script around the 'rm' command that would set LD_PRELOAD to load libtrash. But I haven't tried it.

Fedora in particular has a very bloated set of bash scripts used to load its services. Upstarts more sophisticated notion of services and how to trigger them is a good step toward streamlining many of those services.

Summary: Each of the distributions had their strengths and weaknesses when it came to hardware, but beyond that were essentially competing on common ground.

That said, Fedora 8 was tested, and the beta for Fedora 9 is currently in full-swing and will be released in 8 days, so the comparison is slightly weighted (as all Linux desktop distribution comparisons tend to be) to the most recent release: Ubuntu in this case.