Slashdot Mirror

When I hear "Took our Jerbs" I'm reminded of Bob.

Bob was 5 years away from retirement when I started in 2005.

Bob refused to learn AutoCAD. He "didn't trust it". Any task that required drawing would take Bob 5-10x as long as anyone else.

We put an intern in charge of shadowing Bob.

When Bob retired his job was taken over by a few python scripts (He didn't trust Excel's Sort either) and the other stuff was absorbed by fresh graduates that worked much cheaper than Bob.

Bob insisted he was 'highly skilled' because he had a Masters Degree. He thought he was in high demand and could take off to any company when in reality it was just too much work to fire him and he did his job 'ok' enough to make it to retirement. If Bob was in his 30s or 40s we would have dropped him for a fresh college graduate that had modern skills. Bob would have probably sat on Slashdot complaining about being "highly skilled" but not being able to find a job.

For all those "highly skilled programmers" looking for jobs, here are a few within 25 miles of Farmington Hills, MI.

- Simulink (99 of them are $100k+). (Simulink is a 'dirty' graphical programming language that Slashdot likes to mock.)
- RTOS
- dSpace
- OSEK

They even have sponsored job listings like this one.. (I doubt they'd pay to sponsor it if they're just using it as an excuse to hire a H1B). Full time. Very good Embedded C knowledge required. Also need to have relevant modern skills like knowledge of CAN, LIN, and FlexRay.

Those results can be replicated in multiple parts of the country. Look for locations near any Aerospace, Heavy Machinery or Automotive companies.

When I hear "Took our Jerbs" I'm reminded of Bob.

Bob was 5 years away from retirement when I started in 2005.

Bob refused to learn AutoCAD. He "didn't trust it". Any task that required drawing would take Bob 5-10x as long as anyone else.

We put an intern in charge of shadowing Bob.

When Bob retired his job was taken over by a few python scripts (He didn't trust Excel's Sort either) and the other stuff was absorbed by fresh graduates that worked much cheaper than Bob.

Bob insisted he was 'highly skilled' because he had a Masters Degree. He thought he was in high demand and could take off to any company when in reality it was just too much work to fire him and he did his job 'ok' enough to make it to retirement. If Bob was in his 30s or 40s we would have dropped him for a fresh college graduate that had modern skills. Bob would have probably sat on Slashdot complaining about being "highly skilled" but not being able to find a job.

For all those "highly skilled programmers" looking for jobs, here are a few within 25 miles of Farmington Hills, MI.

- Simulink (99 of them are $100k+). (Simulink is a 'dirty' graphical programming language that Slashdot likes to mock.)
- RTOS
- dSpace
- OSEK

They even have sponsored job listings like this one.. (I doubt they'd pay to sponsor it if they're just using it as an excuse to hire a H1B). Full time. Very good Embedded C knowledge required. Also need to have relevant modern skills like knowledge of CAN, LIN, and FlexRay.

Those results can be replicated in multiple parts of the country. Look for locations near any Aerospace, Heavy Machinery or Automotive companies.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

for silicon valley employers.

Then it sounds like you're insisting on a geographical area to find a job and blaming the job market on the lack of jobs. People that want to be crab boat deckhands don't go to Arizona.

I tossed a few key words & technologies into Indeed and had 0 problems finding available positions around Farmington Hills, MI. (The only geographic area I decided to search).

• Embedded - 1400 jobs. 285@$100k+
• Simulink 611 jobs. 106@$100k+
• RTOS 81 jobs. 51@$105k+
• dSpace 136 jobs.
• CANape 136 jobs.

All of those have direct need for C skills and in addition (based on where I've worked with those skills) need people that can do everything you listed. All of these companies have a shortage of engineers that can do what you listed and are looking for them (and willing to pay them). There were 21 jobs RTOS within 25 miles of Farmington Hills starting $110k

And that is one job skill set within one geographic area (That isn't Silicon valley). I can repeat those job searches across the country.

I'm over 50 and that's a major 'problem'

I work with 50+ engineers all the time. Some of them 'recently' hired. It has nothing to do with age.

that's not the issue and it never was.

Yes. It's people that insist on looking in a very small geographic area that has a flood of people wanting to live there. Driving the job market out from under people also wanting to live there. You think your grandfather got to turn down jobs from the CCC because "eh, I really don't want to get bussed into a different city during the depression. Can't you just let me work here?"

Seriously, I'm having a hard time not finding any jobs on Indeed. $100-$130k. Experience in GUI/applications development in C#, C++, and VB6. Experience working with TCP/IP and automotive protocols (CAN, J1850, etc.) Some knowledge of embedded systems. Any experience in CAN diagnostics is a plus.

This leads us to one of a few conclusions:

• Your insistence to live Earhquake Zone is stronger than your want to get a job.
• You really aren't as skilled as you say you are.

It sounds like you don't have relevant skill sets anymore. H1Bs are backfilling the gap that should have been a computer oriented skilled trade.

I laugh when Slashdotters mock "drag and drop" programming while at the same time there are plenty of jobs available doing just that.

What abut owner-operated truckers? There lot of those.

Ageism doesn't exist? Bullshit

A search for "TVA senior manager for the probabilistic risk assessment in the Nuclear Power Group from April 2010 to September 2014" returned Ching Guey. Inceed lists his work experience as "Senior Manager Nuclear Power Group - Chattanooga, TN April 2010 to September 2014 TVA" so that's almost an exact match, especially given his name. Matching the list of wikipedia to the info off NRC.gov, there is only Exelon Generation Co. LLC, or FirstEnergy Nuclear Operating Co. Exelon owns 4 out of the 5. Then, there is the actual PDF of the indictment.

You are correct. Not only that, the learning objective with drag and drop might be colloquially called "coding" but in reality it might be to teach the logic of problem solving and the logic of coding using graphics

I use Simulink for a living. This is exactly what it it is, the buzz word is "Model Based Control". It doesn't mean I spend any less time trying to figure out the logic of how things work. Our whiteboards at work are covered with sketched block diagrams on how we need to implement a strategy.

Almost every company I know of has moved on past C for their engineers and just has them design and implement algorithms in Simulink. It's why the are a lot of positions open for Simulink across the country.

It writes better C faster than I ever could. Including C that meets ISO® 26262, IEC 61508, EN 50128, and related functional safety standards such as IEC 62304 and it's cutting development time in half

I got an Arduino Robot the other day and I spent more time messing around with C than I ever have with Simulink. I can make a control system to run a 16 cylinder engine in a half an hour. Drag and drop an engine speed sensor, drag and drop injector block. Toss in some PID control and it's done. Right now I would kill for a Python equivalent of Simulink but nothing comes close, I'm about ready to just make an Arduino mako template so I can teach python to write my C for me.

Not that people that need to know C disappeared, they're just the ones writing our 'device drivers' for Simulink. When I drag and drop a "Digital I/O" block into the model I trust that they made it so it works. (And sometimes it doesn't, but that's all code). It validates the datatypes. Does fixed pointing in a straight forward manner. I know most people think autogenerated code is big and scary but I trust it better than I trust some guy that took a few C courses in college.

Additionally it's much easier to let engineers do stuff how engineers do them and programmers how programmers do things and not make the engineers learn programming or the programmers learn engineering. (Not that we don't exist, but we write the device drivers)

It's why a lot of dev boards also have Simulink libraries. It's not that I don't know C or assembly it's that I'm tired of dicking with it and just want to make a controller. I can take the same Simulink model and compile it for multiple vendors and even different devices for that vendor.

I can swap dev boards without changing any of my model logic in a few seconds. Even compile it for FPGAs and PLCs.

Further reading:

1. http://papers.sae.org/2013-01-...
2. https://www.mathworks.com/tagt...
3. http://www.mathworks.com/compa...

[Meta: Speaking of taking a lot longer to write. This post took an extra 5 or so minutes because I had to format all of the HTML. Please switch to Markdown or Restructured text. There's a reason we use it in industry, it is faster.]

I agree. Salary.com has some breakdowns by degree by job title
http://swz.salary.com/salarywi...
http://swz.salary.com/salarywi...

Indeed.com resume section tells a different story for new york city and silicon valley if you look at the filters on the left.
http://www.indeed.com/resumes/...
http://www.indeed.com/resumes/...
He based the statistic from a self-reported stackoverflow survey. The survey itself says 38% of the people self-identified as professional programmers, 46% as other, and 16% as unknown. So it looks like most non-professionals on the survey don't have a degree.

I agree. Salary.com has some breakdowns by degree by job title
http://swz.salary.com/salarywi...
http://swz.salary.com/salarywi...

Indeed.com resume section tells a different story for new york city and silicon valley if you look at the filters on the left.
http://www.indeed.com/resumes/...
http://www.indeed.com/resumes/...
He based the statistic from a self-reported stackoverflow survey. The survey itself says 38% of the people self-identified as professional programmers, 46% as other, and 16% as unknown. So it looks like most non-professionals on the survey don't have a degree.

Vocational schools need to amp up the sales pitch. Machinists of the Tools and Die variety make 40$ and 50$ an hour, and that ain't bad.

In the massive factories that cover most of Canada?

The Tool and die machinist jobs I was able to find had 3 of them at $80K+ a year ($40/hour = $83,200/year), and all require more than 5 years experience, two of them in supervisory roles.

http://ca.indeed.com/jobs?q=Ca...

Manufacturing happens in China. Nice try on the selling of vocational ed, though...

Silicon Valley prior to the dot com bust in 2001. Even today restaurant wages are 42% higher than the national average.

http://www.indeed.com/salary/q-Restaurant-l-Silicon-Valley,-CA.html

This is true, but consider that 122K is on average. This means for every person in school out there contributing for free, we have others making 244K per year. If it were 10% free development, then the average for the others is 136K. The average salary for a software engineer in the USA is 94K, so something is fishy.

Says who?

http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=U...

Ah, *that* famous slide deck. Here's a ground report on how it works in practise.

http://www.indeed.com/cmp/Netf...
--
High pay, high stress, no job security
Sr. Manager (Current Employee), Los Gatos, CA – July 28, 2015
Pros: High salaryCons: Culture is cut-throat, not collaborative
They live their Culture Deck and people are disposable. The smallest mistake could cost you your job, particularly if the overly-powerful HR business partners take issue with it. There are some good people there, but by and large the complete lack of job security (they don't hesitate to fire people) creates a CYA culture whereby senior management (directors and above) line their organizations with potential "fall guys" that they can lay the blame on (and fire) in the event that anything goes wrong. At least they pay good severance (4-9 months of salary, depending on level).

Pay is high, but other benefits are pretty weak. Healthcare is particularly expensive if you have a family.

If you like dress codes, you'll love Booz, Allen, Hamilton. Freshly pressed suits, at all times. If you're lucky, you might be allowed to take your jacket off after hours.

http://www.indeed.com/forum/cm...

Stick with program managing, Justin. Actually, given you were responsible for Silverlight, find some other career entirely.

If you check Perl, Java, PHP or C++ on Indeed.com, you will see exactly the same trends.

If you perform his same terrible analysis of the TIOBE index, PHP, C++, VB.NET, Objective-C are all going to collapse. Apparently Java has been "heading for collapse" since 2004.

People who can't do statistics shouldn't report on them.

The problem does not appear to be that C# is becoming less popular (than other languages), it's appears that custom application development as a whole is becoming less popular than it was a few years ago.

This may be due to the economy, outsourcing, mobile platforms or whatever. You can't suddenly pull reasons out of your ass like this being due to "Microsoft’s ever revolving door of new technologies", despite how pissed off you are at them for shit-canning your pet project.

When doing stats on whether something is less popular, it's helpful to ask "less popular than what". Sure, it may be less popular than it used to be, but so are the competing languages. This does not indicate that the C# ecosystem is going to collapse.

Stick with program managing, Justin. Actually, given you were responsible for Silverlight, find some other career entirely.

If you check Perl, Java, PHP or C++ on Indeed.com, you will see exactly the same trends.

If you perform his same terrible analysis of the TIOBE index, PHP, C++, VB.NET, Objective-C are all going to collapse. Apparently Java has been "heading for collapse" since 2004.

People who can't do statistics shouldn't report on them.

The problem does not appear to be that C# is becoming less popular (than other languages), it's appears that custom application development as a whole is becoming less popular than it was a few years ago.

This may be due to the economy, outsourcing, mobile platforms or whatever. You can't suddenly pull reasons out of your ass like this being due to "Microsoft’s ever revolving door of new technologies", despite how pissed off you are at them for shit-canning your pet project.

When doing stats on whether something is less popular, it's helpful to ask "less popular than what". Sure, it may be less popular than it used to be, but so are the competing languages. This does not indicate that the C# ecosystem is going to collapse.

Stick with program managing, Justin. Actually, given you were responsible for Silverlight, find some other career entirely.

If you check Perl, Java, PHP or C++ on Indeed.com, you will see exactly the same trends.

If you perform his same terrible analysis of the TIOBE index, PHP, C++, VB.NET, Objective-C are all going to collapse. Apparently Java has been "heading for collapse" since 2004.

People who can't do statistics shouldn't report on them.

The problem does not appear to be that C# is becoming less popular (than other languages), it's appears that custom application development as a whole is becoming less popular than it was a few years ago.

This may be due to the economy, outsourcing, mobile platforms or whatever. You can't suddenly pull reasons out of your ass like this being due to "Microsoft’s ever revolving door of new technologies", despite how pissed off you are at them for shit-canning your pet project.

When doing stats on whether something is less popular, it's helpful to ask "less popular than what". Sure, it may be less popular than it used to be, but so are the competing languages. This does not indicate that the C# ecosystem is going to collapse.

Stick with program managing, Justin. Actually, given you were responsible for Silverlight, find some other career entirely.

If you check Perl, Java, PHP or C++ on Indeed.com, you will see exactly the same trends.

If you perform his same terrible analysis of the TIOBE index, PHP, C++, VB.NET, Objective-C are all going to collapse. Apparently Java has been "heading for collapse" since 2004.

People who can't do statistics shouldn't report on them.

The problem does not appear to be that C# is becoming less popular (than other languages), it's appears that custom application development as a whole is becoming less popular than it was a few years ago.

This may be due to the economy, outsourcing, mobile platforms or whatever. You can't suddenly pull reasons out of your ass like this being due to "Microsoft’s ever revolving door of new technologies", despite how pissed off you are at them for shit-canning your pet project.

When doing stats on whether something is less popular, it's helpful to ask "less popular than what". Sure, it may be less popular than it used to be, but so are the competing languages. This does not indicate that the C# ecosystem is going to collapse.

Java is one of the most popular languages that employers hire for

Well, here's a report that disagrees with your statement. Looks like .NET is winning by nearly 2 points.

The cost of living is 28% higher in California:
http://livingwage.mit.edu/stat...
http://livingwage.mit.edu/stat...

The average dollar salary of a programmer is 10% higher:
http://www.indeed.com/salary/q...
http://www.indeed.com/salary/q...

Texas programmers therefore have average effective salaries 18% than in California. I AM having good luck.

The cost of living is 28% higher in California:
http://livingwage.mit.edu/stat...
http://livingwage.mit.edu/stat...

The average dollar salary of a programmer is 10% higher:
http://www.indeed.com/salary/q...
http://www.indeed.com/salary/q...

Texas programmers therefore have average effective salaries 18% than in California. I AM having good luck.

http://www.indeed.com/

Within .Net there is a move away from ASP.Net towards new frameworks such as MVC.Net. You get a different picture with a slightly different link http://www.indeed.com/jobtrend...

Here's the trend right here: http://www.indeed.com/jobtrend...

I dunno, there are plenty of masturbation jobs on Inceed!

Remember the miracle on the Hudson? It was the flight attendants who made sure everyone was safe and made sure they evacuated in an orderly fashion. They were the last ones off the plane. THAT is why they are there and I for one am glad to see them.

Does the math work? How many lives per year would flight attendants have to save to justify the price?

There's just short of 10m flights per year in the US, and a US life is worth about $7m for prime-aged workers. If a flight costs an average of 10 flight attendant hours (I'm guessing that's low), that means we spend 100m flight attendant hours per year.

Starting pay for flight attendants is $16/hr. So that's 1.6 billion dollars per year, plus overhead, that we pay for flight attendants.

If safety is 50% of their job, and overhead is 50% of base pay, that means we're spending $1.2b per year on flight attendants for safety purposes.

At $7m per life, that means they have to provide safety benefits equal to saving 170 lives per year. In the US, we currently lose about 15.3 lives per year to air travel fatalities.

Just ballpark figures, but it feels like we're overpaying.

Well a quick stat on indeed.com suggests that I am right in mentioning scala over what you suggest:
http://www.indeed.com/jobtrend...

Take a look at Akka. It mostly fits your description for the "language" you want. Scala is pretty extendable, so the libraries often end up looking more like language extensions than libraries.

Scala allows both mutable and immutable objects, but it favours immutable.
In Akka you have mutable state within your actors and pass immutable messages.

The 2nd SOMALGET country was first leaked by defense contractor resume. Hinted at, in any case. Defense Contractors put all the illegal shit they do in their resumes to get more jobs doing those things.

Christopher Soghoian's tweet on the subject.

Erica A's resume

Erica A spent December 2012 to October 2013 in Afghanistan, is an expert in "Somalget Retro GUI" and is available for hire immediately.

As many as possible. I've said for years the real money lies in being a welder, plumber, or an electrician.

But have you tried backing it up with any facts? People keep repeating it, but the statistics keep insisting otherwise. You can point to an anecdote about a welder who made $150K in a year. The trouble is showing that large numbers of young people could all become welders who make $150K per year. On average, welders make $32,000 per year. And that's among welders who actually hold a job as a welder.

Only on a nerd site would you find such jealously... As welder, of anything, and everything. I didint get paid no f'in 160,000 annually. Welding encompasses numerous things, it isn't he shit you see on TV with some guy/gal welding steel with a MIG or TIG welder. And unlike what they teach you in shop class or any tech school, you have to be able to weld numerous alloys and those alloys in some cases are mismatched.

So you and the goons that voted your comment up should become educated, before you think little thoughts of someone on TV welding steel on steel, and figure that's what it must be to be a welder.

mig, tig, stick, acetylene, and even soldering..

programmers make 500K a year, and don't work OT
Oh, not all programmers, but no welder I know make over 100k, much less 150k.

http://www.indeed.com/salary/W...
http://www1.salary.com/Welder-...

You are making 150k a year as a welder, you are working 60+ hours a week.

As many as possible. I've said for years the real money lies in being a welder, plumber, or an electrician.

But have you tried backing it up with any facts? People keep repeating it, but the statistics keep insisting otherwise. You can point to an anecdote about a welder who made $150K in a year. The trouble is showing that large numbers of young people could all become welders who make $150K per year. On average, welders make $32,000 per year. And that's among welders who actually hold a job as a welder.

> My mom made just over $65k/year in Chesnee, SC over a decade ago

Uh, not as a teacher.

http://www.indeed.com/salary/q...

(tenured professors are paid substantially more than software engineers in the US)

Indeed?. That is so not true. Okay, those numbers are not great, but they are actually quite similar. The difference being that software engineers make that shortly after graduation, and tenure... well, first you'll need a PhD. Then some years as a postdoc. Then tenure takes what, 7 years or so? And during all this time the salary is quite low considering the work being required.

A professionally trained, well-paid human teacher eh?

If this is true, then how come our schools are so awful?

We the people have been throwing more and more money at schoolteachers, and requiring ever-increasing levels of training and education to maintain their license to teach, yet the educational achievments of our students have been flatlined for 40 years, and have even fallen dramatically in some districts.

this is a MYTH.

this is nothing but a red herring argument foisted by fiscal conservatives to continue to destroy the public school system and to concentrate resources in elite public schools. for a nation whose economic engine relies on advanced knowledge and high literacy, we should be treasuring our teachers. teaching should be one of the highest-paid professions, and people should be beating down the doors to try to become a teacher.

instead, people have bought the line that teachers are "overpaid" and don't bother to realize that teachers earn incredibly low salaries for the education and professional level of their work. that is insane.

at the very least, please stop repeating the blatant lie that teachers are overpaid. there could be nothing farther from the truth.

You need to be on LinkedIn with connections and endorsements and Indeed for your resume. LinkedIn especially has become a MUST for connecting to prospective employers and showing off your previous work and skill sets. I don't give out my Facebook or Twitter to employers and I make them hard to connect with my business self simply because of my off beat personal interests and art. (see sig line) - HEX

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

http://jobsearch.monster.com/search/Software-Engineer_5

1) Look at most other fields, jobs are still scarce, but not for software engineers
2) Look at the job postings and read the tech that is used, it's basically a list of open source projects
3) You want a specific example? Wordpress. http://www.indeed.com/q-Wordpress-jobs.html where they list (at the time of this writing) 7810 jobs. That's *one* open source package. How about mysql? http://www.indeed.com/q-MySQL-jobs.html 17549. Cassandra? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=Cassandra&l= 1752. Apache? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=apache&l= 10873. Rails (*shudder*) http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=rails&l= 12734. Python? http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=python&l= 19653

Every business needs IT, every business has a website, nearly every business depends on open source for it's operation. The evidence of this requires trivial research to find it as I show above.

Having the utter lack of creativity to determine ways to make money as a software engineer outside of just selling it boggles the mind. I might suggest if that's the only way you can think of to get value out of engineering skills, perhaps you should consider a marketing career instead.

"My previous company had a lot of H1-B employees. And we had a really difficult time hiring people that weren't, because there just aren't any that are worth anything. Trust me, I've done dozens of interviews where the people are just pathetic. "

I won't work for company that hires lots of H-1B's. It's just bad karma, knowing the employer cheated the system and a large number of US citizen's will be underemployed as a result.

For the most part, companies like Micro$oft have dysfunctional business models, expecting all their tech employees to move to their defacto company town is throw back to the early 1900's. They suck up all the local talent, abuse them, and then complain to congress when nobody but 3rd world indentured servants will relocate and work for them.

The H-1B program has allowed the abusive employers to continue on like nothing is wrong. The moment a US corp makes the top-100 in the H-1B visa rankings, I avoid recommending, purchasing, or installing any of their products. The logic is simple, abusive employers produce inferior, low quality products.

It sure looks easy to be some kind of developer or programmer. We sit on our butts all day, staring at monitors, clicking with our mouses...how hard can it be?

I mean, I can drag some wire round the frame of a room and put some caps on to fasten up a switch or outlet, but that doesn't make me an electrician by any means. Even if the lights turn off and on without sparking and burning down the building, there's a lot more to the job than knowing to turn off the power before touching the wires.

Likewise, there's a lot that happens between the chair and keyboard that often gets overlooked. I know many out there will disagree with me (and I get paid well to clean up after some of them), but writing software can be hard work. Sure, slapping a few loops and conditions together is pretty easy, but there's a lot of finesse in making sure it actually does the right things in a reliable and robust fashion. There's also the downside to the job including digesting incomplete requirements, meeting unrealistic expectations, and suffering through unexpected panic from your customers, whether internal or cash-paying.

Taking a little hobby development and desire doesn't do justice to you, your potential future employers, or those of us who've schooled, trained, and worked our craft for years to make it look easy. I like that you've noted that you're looking for an entry level position, but make sure that you're looking at it for the right reasons and not just because you like the appeal of sitting in a cubicle all day drinking Jolt soda.

I also noticed you mentioned a "lower paying" job; I'm sure after years doing your craft you've worked up some ranks, but indeed.com points out that software pays better. With this comes the competition. As others have said, be prepared to compete with young, energetic people who haven't got experience, but who also don't have mortgages...

Of course, I'm not saying don't do it. I say the more the merrier; there's lots of software yet to be written. Just respect the craft and the effort it takes to do a good job.