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to pull it off: pcs w/o operating systems installed.

Don't laugh - they have some excellent deals:

How about a 1GHz Microsoft-free PC for $399!

Or 1.4GHz of Athlon blasting goodness for $499!

Wallyworld computers dot com

Powerful PCs
Without Windows These PCs are perfect if you've already purchased a full version of Windows that has not been previously installed or if you have an alternative operating system, such as Linux.

Sure, OS/2 still exists [ibm.com], but who's going to pay $284 for an OS when Windows comes pre-bundled with every computer you buy?

Remember the OS-less computer? The reason it is so darn cheap is because they don't have to include the OS TAX.

As long as the applications that people want to run (office, quicken, etc.) REQUIRE windows to be installed

They want to run office, but do they need to run Microsoft Office® brand office as opposed to OpenOffice.org brand office? They want to run personal finance, but do they need to run Quicken® brand personal finance as opposed to GnuCash brand personal finance?

The choice is not adding another operating system to my computer. The choice is choosing NOT to buy a second operating system.

Well, LindowsOS ($100) is less than one-third the price of Windows XP Professional retail ($300), which is important to those building PCs for their friends and family either from parts or from a $400 naked PC from Wal*Mart.

Cars are not a good analogy.

People install operating systems all the time. This very minute, Wal-Mart will sell you any of 9 models of PC without an OS. Replacement hard drives come blank and, "re-install Windows" is probably the most commonly spoken phrase in tech support today.

Here is an example of 2 computers that appear to be the same except for the OS. Neither include monitor.
Without OS $599 With OS $698

Here is an example of 2 computers that appear to be the same except for the OS. Neither include monitor.
Without OS $599 With OS $698

I saw a short TechTV segment about Walmart selling PC's without any operating system at all. I took a look at the website and found some half-decent systems at half-decent prices. Hopefully this link will work for you.

>2. Most people could never know where / how to by a PC without windows.

Just go to Walmart.

I think that "most people" will be able to find their way there. Since it did just pass GE to become the world's largest company. But maybe you're right.

Apparently the /. editors don't consider this newsworthy. I've submitted it several times to get it rejected, I suppose if ESR had submitted it they would've posted it.

Walmart.com is selling PCs without Windows. In a Cnet article (sorry, don't have the link) Walmart announced this because the cost of Windows is offsetting the cost of cheap hardware and Windows is making the computer too expensive.

Apparently the /. editors don't consider this newsworthy. I've submitted it several times to get it rejected, I suppose if ESR had submitted it they would've posted it.

Walmart.com is selling PCs without Windows. In a Cnet article (sorry, don't have the link) Walmart announced this because the cost of Windows is offsetting the cost of cheap hardware and Windows is making the computer too expensive.

Walmart is selling computers without windows.

Equally odd (IMHO), Wal-Mart will also sell you the latest release from the band that all music snobs love to pretend to love!

--xxk

If you go to NetCraft's What's that site running?, and enter www.walmart.com, you get back the following.....

The site www.walmart.com is running Microsoft-IIS/5.0 (WindowsNT) on Linux.

Could it mean the web server is IIS, but the IP stack of some frond end router or getaway is Linux?

Wal-Mart is selling PCs without OS's

I submitted this as an article to ./ 2 weeks ago. Rejected. This is a major example of how Wal-Mart could hurt MS.

That would be BJFH. Bastard Janitor From Hell. The janitors here couldn't admin a Fisher Price laptop much less a real system.

I used to have a friend who worked, uh, temped for AOL. I still have part of this email he sent to me

"On the 25 minute walk that I make to work I usually think about work on the way there, thereby doing what I always promised I would never do as long as I was a "temp" - think about work outside of being at work. Only a God can spend 8 hours 5 days a week someplace and not wonder what their place in it was. As a "temp" at the end of the century your place was/is even more displaced than your fellow postmodern brethren. The turd of the Virtual Elite, on a global level a "temp" exists on a plane with structurally readjusted peoples and prisoners. On the local level a "temp" is nearly a non presence, disposable, cloneable, or on its best day not qualified enough to be solidified."

I think he touches on several good points. Economist Richard Rosecrance wrote a book a few years ago called "The Rise of the Virtual State"(yes walmart sells it). In it he basically said that nations will divide into two parts, ala Descartes, the head, or mind, and the body. The mind will perform the information and idea tasks, the US, Europe, Japan, and the body will handle the labor, China, Mexico, Africa.

It is especially interesting when that mind/body split is enforced here in the US of A. Plenty of people say, well if they would just get more of an education then they would be alright. In a sense that is correct, but overall it is a push to drive us in the US toward strictly virtual or mind based production and send all the body work elsewhere. As an economic solution, it may work for us in the US for the short time that we are alive, but also you have to wonder about the political aspects that help set these divisions into play, ie dictatorships in Africa, the decline of organized labor in the US and the massive push in the tech sector to outsource as much of the workload as possible.

More or less, for every person making 80k and saying, just get more productive schooling, there are 10 college graduates wondering if they will ever get their teeth cleaned again. It's our economic policy.

Will we see a similar situation to the DVD players that did not conform to the DVD spec (you know, the ones that would play any region DVDs and did not force you to watch the goddamn FBI warning for the 256,000th time)? Remember how quickly most national resellers stopped carring those brands? How hard it was to find one once the Word was Out?

This little retailer you might've heard about had a huge stack of Apex DVD players in a store I visited going into Christmas. AFAIK the current models are hackable to some degree (it might take a while after they first come out, but it usually happens sooner or later).

I'm sorry, but there is a science which studies this kind of thing, and it is called economics. You are contradicting centuries of accummulated scientific knowledge of economics. You are treading lightly where giants have exercised utmost care.

The consumer loses because competition based on cost requires the elimination of additional value in the supply chain. Quality, customer service, guarantees, product returns, post-sales service, what-have-you: it all is eliminated when the lowest price guarantee becomes the requirement for survival.

If the consumer can't correctly judge the value of different choices in the market, and goes for the "cheapest" (but seriously devalued) product, then he wholly deserves it when he gets fucked. Market economies don't just make demands of producers and laborers; they also make demands of consumers.

$39.99 Remington Paraffin Wax Hand Spa (so her fingers don't look like she writes code all day :)

$50.00 DreamTime Microwavable Foot Cozys (one of the ways to a woman's heart is through her feet - again, I bet guys would like these too even though they'd probably never actually buy them for themselves)

$20 gift certificate to Bath & Body Works (sometimes a gift certificate is better than guessing what her favorite scent is)

$49.99 Star Wars Rogue Leader: Rogue Squadron II

$40 1 lb. of Godiva chocolates(if you're gonna do chocolate, do it right...Godiva really does taste better :)

You can go to your local Walmart and buy a disposable camera for five bucks, take 27 pictures, and then get your photos posted on Walmart's site for download or forwarding to family and friends. Sure, it's not a true "digital camera", but it's probably good enough for the masses looking to email photos cheaply. Somehow I think a service like this would have more applications than a disposable/reusable digital camera with terrible image quality.

You can go to your local Walmart and buy a disposable camera for five bucks, take 27 pictures, and then get your photos posted on Walmart's site for download or forwarding to family and friends. Sure, it's not a true "digital camera", but it's probably good enough for the masses looking to email photos cheaply. Somehow I think a service like this would have more applications than a disposable/reusable digital camera with terrible image quality.

Nice try, troll. According to my source, the crimson tide was actually ISBN 0817310517.

Gamecube = 199
This DVD player = 99
Total = 298
PS2, still costs more

Try $900 here

$3000...

That's only a little under 5 times more expensive than this 35" normal TV.

Let's see: 3 times the resolution, 5 times the price. 3/5 of the benefit isn't going to make me rush out and buy one anytime soon.

In light of this, perhaps the following names could be "confusingly similar" to well-known tradmarks:

Wal*Fart compared to Wal*Mart
Sysco compared to Cisco
IBN compared to IBM
Wintel compared to Intel
Microslop compared to Microsoft

Oh, and any router with the word "gateway" in its hostname must be changed!

Granted, *most* of the sites mentioned are backed by big businesses with even bigger legal budgets so they can get away with it, but still....

(P.S.--It seems to me that "well-known" and "confusingly similar" are mutually exclusive)

Sure, we can't go to any computer store and buy them yet, or at least I can't, but it is getting better. I seen Mandrake at Wal-Mart. Not to mention a decent selection of distros at larger computer stores, slackware even. So in my opinion it is just a matter of time before we see all the great games for Linux, and in stores. I just want Need For Speed!

another mirror here

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I'm not sure about WalMart, but there is a interesting story about Meijer:
(WalMart + IGA (in midwest) = Meijer)
Someone bought a 22 cal. in Meijer and went out into the parking lot an committed suicide. The family members sued Meijer for selling a firearm to someone so 'distressed'. I'm not sure how the case ended, but as a result of this case, Meijer now only carries Blackpowder guns and Air (pellet & BB) guns. This is very unfortunate!

Perhaps the MP3 community (I was Napster banned for 1 remix of a Metallica song) should look to the firearms industry for knowledge. The firearms industry has been fighting stupid lawsuits for years.

Like MP3 companies, the firearms companies are being sued so that they accept the responsiblity of individuals who do stupid things with their products. I don't think trading MP3's is stupid, but I agree that an individual should be held responsible when using a product in an illegal manner.

If one conclusion can be made by looking at the firearm industry is that the MP3 companies are going to endure years of litigation until the recording industry can find someone else to blame or another way to make money.

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