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Yahoo Will Use Google Instead Of Inktomi
Yoje writes: "Someone's probably already submitted this, but it looks like sometime
in the
next 30 days Yahoo! will switch from inktomi to Google for
search requests. More attention for Google is always good. :)" I'm not sure Google strictly needs attention, but capsteve and others pointed out Google's own press release which says Google has now indexed over a billion pages. (Note: around half of these are not fully indexed.)
My understanding of the Google model is that they sell you a customised view on their database, rather than selling you a software package. Although if Yahoo pay them enough, perhaps they'll change that.
Yahoo: FreeBSD web servers, and now, search technology supplied by Linux. (Google being a vast farm of Linux boxes)
1. You don't have to bribe them to get in, but to get anywhere before the thousandth returned url or so, you have to pay some $$$.
Are you talking about Yahoo or Google? I've never used Yahoo, but I doubt you have to pay to get into Google. For one thing, I didn't, and searches on my real name return me. Searching for ntop and gtml's home pages got me them in the top three. In fact, I've probably only had to move to any kind of refined search a handful of times with Google. Whereas Altavista, my old search engine of choice, required more thinking to get results.
And now it's covered in ads. Who'd a thunk they could make cable seem so slow?
That's all right then. As long as you're not defaming my favourite search engine 8).
(Well, given that Yahoo is offering a service that professes to return useful information, among other things, it really isn't that OK at all. But it doesn't appear to bug the people who use Yahoo.
Here, use this. Screw Google. >;)
I belive they managed to cram 4 (maybe just 2) machines into each 1u shelf that way. It looked warped due to the way the cardboard insulator was sticking up and out.
They have a bazillion 1u shiny red machines now in a monster cage. Impressive to look down isles of them.
Computer cases just take up space
Danny.
I have written over 900 book reviews
AV is bloated but their technology is first rate.
While I've been a Google fan since way back, I have to say that AV's frills-free raging is my engine of choice these days.
--
"I do not speak for my employers, though they are controlled from my Teddy's huge pulsating brain."
I agree, 45 TB seems like a very small amount of data, given the size and scope of the WWW. Even if you just take into account porn sites (of which I have no personal experience with :), the amount of websites is truely staggering, and many claim to have gigabytes and gigabytes of porno (I definately don't find this hard to believe). So for total data, 45 TB seems very small indeed.
Perhaps it is some metric of original content or something, I have no idea. You can also count sites like IBM who sell downloadable software of their website... would this count too? Or those my.mp3.com or whatever websites. Or internet radio (accessible from the web, right?).
When you start looking at it this way, though, it seems to me that it becomes harder and harder to define what "the web" in fact is, since what we classically think of as the WWW is more and more integrated with other protocols all the time.
But, I'm probably way off base anyways, so I'll just go sit in a corner.
-Ryan
--
What bothers me more is Yahoo's inherent conflict of interest. Originally, Yahoo was useful because it was an index compiled by real humans, in (more or less) useful categories. But as Yahoo's business side has grown to encompass free email, shopping, map servers, just about everything, Yahoo always gets to list its own service first, set off from any of the others. Can we really expect that they will be as rigorous about listing their competitors? Or give a "cool" rating to a service that strongly competes with their own?
Yahoo may be an occasionally useful conglomeration of services now, but its original utility as an unbiased and hand-compiled index is almost entirely gone.
"I believe that the cult of the particular brings only death - for it bases order on likeness." St.-Exupery
I read my email from an IMAP server. Maybe the search engines I'm most likely to use are archie or veronica?
Scuttlemonkey is a troll
If you liked Altavista' search, but you don't like wading through all their portal crap, try http://www.raging.com/, which
has the Altavista search without any extra fluff.
-Joe
Geez, guy, where'd you learn English? "Scruntous" is, of course, an adjective expressing the concept of "that which is scrunty".
Now please don't tell me you don't know what "scrunty" means...
Google also uses dmoz for its directory listing.
No, this is different. You know how when you search for something obscure (or mispelled) and you get a bunch of google/altavista/lycos-style links instead of the categorized stuff? That'll be provided by Google, not the categorized search results. The human-made index will still be there.
I rarely use minus in queries, because I'm afraid that they might filter out useful pages. Consider a page that contains a lot of useful information about OpenSSH, but also the sentence "This isn't rpmfind" (I know this is a bad example), or even an informative link to rpmfind. That page would be rejected.
Well, if you search for chunder pictures then my page is 4th
....30th (I got bored there) are all my pages description on various Yahoo or Open Directory listings.
However the curious thing is that the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th, 15th, 16th, 17th, 18th, 19th, 20th
It looks like I have the market cornered!
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
Although I doubt they'd be selling their directory services (I don't even think this would be legal - as I'm sure the ODP data is copyrighted by AOL/Netscape - hence their ability to license it) a lot of their data has to come from the open directory project (ok, well, 1% of it needs to come from it). I would assume they would of spidered the ODP in it's entirity as a good basis for the rest of their search data. If they did this Yahoo is in a way getting to use the data.
I really think this is a violation persay - just as a search engine could have spidered www.dmoz.org and built that into their search results along with all the other sites. But it just strikes me as being peculier.
back under your bridge Fawkin Troll! Besides, you have my email address if you really want to discuss it.
Fawking Trolls!
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." - Jed Babbin
Google
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I have had similar experiences whenever I've shown people google, which usually comes magically closer to "the right answer" sooner than any other engine I've used ...
people are amazed because they are used to total suckiness to have something that is way way less sucky.
Tim
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
On another note, I scored 4th place out of 60 for a web search competition using only Google.
You of course know that google now has an index too? Tho I suspect it is machine classification in action.
>is nothing more than another capitalist
>institution, feeding off of others for it's
>sustinence.
100 free frags to the first slashdotter to point out the sheer absurdity of that statement.
Hint for bucktoothed vermin...
Who owns hotmail?
john
Resistance is NOT futile!!!
Haiku:
I am not a drone.
Remove the collective if
Imagine all the people...
They've used other engines before with no detrimental effects, altavista, inktomi..
As far as I can tell the only thing this will do is give Google some more income without having anything to do with advertisements.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
Presumably if a new site offers something that the previous sites didn't, people will link to it. Everything about the internet is fickle, and Google is not going to fundamentally change that.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
Clearly he means "Scrumptious". Mmmmm...
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
Be that as it may, Google is selling yahoo a service, rather than advertising space.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
Yes, I ring in at the top... long live the fart machine.
Does that B scare you?
I'm sorry, I couldn't resist :P
-bugg
Indexing things by hand is a good idea, but yahoo can't do it well enough by hiring people. You need the power of open source.
Raging search vs Google. Common, which gives more relevent hits? Screw AltaVista and their "clean" interface with a new name pretending to be a new engine. (-;<
Insert wit here.
I always felt that the best way to demonstrate how Google weeds out the chaff is the "pseudo-porn-term test". If you can type in "beaver" as the search term, and get all clean results for the top 10 entries, you know the engine is doing the job. Works for other words, too...
Not the AC, but i'll bite.
Second, just because I don't show off my HotMail address here does not mean I don't have one. My HotMail address is pretty much just for IM and recieving spam.
I think the original poster was refering to people who only use hotmail or people who use it as there primary email vs. people who use non-web based email as their primary email.
Thirdly, I don't like being insulted. If you said this right to my face, tomorrow would see you visiting your dentist to get false teeth.
And the day after that you'd be in court paying for those teeth, court fees, and whatever else the lawyers could squeeze out of you.
And finally, the subject is an example of sarcasm. However, I doubt that you'd understand that. I say this because it seems you haven't really evolved from the tree apes.
You were the one talking about inflicting physical violence... not very civilized.
^Z
I vote for the latter. I've never considered Rome a great civilization for just those reasons. The "greatness" of a civilization is its intellectual, moral, cultural and material developement. Any civilization that allows the kind of carnage that went on in a ancient Rome, at the very least, lacks in moral and intellectual developement.
Finally, back to the point, a definition (from dictionary.com):
Civilized: Showing evidence of moral and intellectual advancement; humane, ethical, and reasonable.
Nowhere did i refer to civilization. Violence, at least in my opinion, is not civilized, albeit occasionally necessary.
^Z
---
Chaosnetwork: [men will be men]
OliverWillis.Com
An Operative with an Agenda
To catch spam, I think I'd rather have email addresses at fuckyou.co.uk or yourmom.com
--
yup, and his name is They.
You know, as in, "That's what They say."
Any sufficiently advanced civilization is indistinguishable from Gods.
Also Mac and BSD and US Govt and University searches are available.
I've always wondered why they never put links to these on the main page. I know they pride themselves on they slimness of their pages, but there's no need to be sparse.
Any sufficiently advanced civilization is indistinguishable from Gods.
Your stuff is toast unless you met them at the Playboy Mansion.
The message on the other side of this sig is false.
Still, I like Google. Clean and simple, and the caching bit is kind of neat. And I can't argue with something that rate s my site #1 under the one query it deserves, 'oscar fish'! Thank you very much Yahoo! for not updating their description of it, which is now over two years old (after three requests).
--------
Oscarfish.com: tropical fish with attitude. Way t
http:// www.altavista.com/cgi-bin/query?pg=aq&what=web&enc =iso88591&text=yes
1. You definitely don't have to bribe Yahoo to get in. My site, Rings-Online.com got in the first time in only two weeks. The trick is that your site needs to be good. They typically pass over crap sites.
2. Google crushes AltaVista like a grape. AltaVista almost never returns relevant results no matter how much you tweak your search.
If you haven't tried Google yet, you really are doing yourself a disservice, it is so good, I actually started using search engines again.
Brian Woodring
Rings-Online.com
The link on the Inktomi page is broken. Try corporate.yahoo.com.
--
Turn on, log in, burn out...
Well. I can't think of a single reason for me to go on living.
Being number two and number three is a spectacular achievement, but your work here won't really be over until you get to number one!
Wouldn't Yahoo users be more likely to use Yahoo mail than Hotmail?
hehe, it's because google is based on linking to pages and you should see rpmfind's linking, like 5 links to one rpm, so they prolly SHOULD be on the top of the list, if you really dont want rpmfind then do -rpmfind (for example if you want to search for openssh do-
openssh -rpmfind
)
.. that's what i do, it's kinda a pain in the ass if you want to find the official page and get rpmfind on the top....
=]
Yahoo, is still going to use Inktomi for Corporate Yahoo! Check out the press release.
I view this as great news. I use both Yahoo (email) and Google (surfing) on my wireless SprintPCS phone. Maybe the marriage will lead to better things. Does anyone know of a wireless portal I can check my POP mail? thx
-jc
Hi - I'm sorry I can't gush over google.com because it does not respect quoted strings, making it far less useful for searching for exact phrases. For example, if I search for "I love you" on google, google takes out the "I" and just searches for "love you" This is a simple example, but it illustrates my point. altavista does not do this! TWR
Also check out this site about the open human edited directory project. It claims the Hotbot, Lycos, etc are using it.
--- no sig
--- no sig
Now, it might of course take a bit of brains to make your search specific enough so that not every second page on the net fulfillst it, but if you can't do that, then no search engine will ever be useful for you.
The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer.
--Henry Kissinger
Agree. DMOZ is a direct competitor to Yahoo. It is not strictly open (theres a /. cliche for ya), but it still has a lot of potential. I wouldnt like to see it frozen out of this, one of it's really big partnerships.
...
I cant believe this is the only person who has brought this up (at least in the title)
-
one of my former professor at UCSB helped start google, and I was going to work at Inktomi. After having seen both from a very scruntous level, I believe that Yahoo is probably doing the right thing! Key difference: the engines relevancy. Inktomi's engine is probably a better distributed system, however, in my opinion google better understands language and interface.
kicking some CAD is a good thing
Inktomi is the search engine that Yahoo uses to go through it's database.
Nuff said... and that isn't flamebait, so mod it back to 1.
Quoting Google's About Page, google is applying for a patent on it's search technique:
Doesn't anyone care about freedom any more?Yeah, I hope google.com will still work. It probably will, I don't see why it wouldn't. Yahoo's just using their search engine, not buying them.
You know, Google does return results by relevancy as well. So if a new site comes up with great relevancy, it will still show up in the top of the list. However, it will not come up if there are already several other sites with good relevancy and good popularity. But why should it? Wouldn't you prefer the more popular site? In my experience, I have not had any problems getting new sites showing up on Google with relevant searches.
aren't we supposed to be boycotting google since they are trying to patent their software? or has google somehow escaped the wrath of the gplheads? have we deemed their technology patent-worthy?
ok then your [sic] infringing on my copyright! Could you as [sic] me next time before STEALING my comments for your own?
Warfare has changed, that is all. America bombed Hiroshima. That's pretty damn violent. And there is still citizen vs citizen violence...just look at the murder and domestic rates. just because your average beaver isn't chasing each other with a sword at every bad word doesn't mean shit....they are suing, it's the new hip style warfare and hurts you alot more than any punch will. And oh, I love you little kiddies who say shit like "Come say it to my face and Ill knock your teeth out" or whatever. It's pretty damn hilarious...easy to say here, on the internet...hundreds of miles from those you 'threaten'. Those who are weak in their own confidence lash out like that...maybe you know you are ignorant and didn't make much sense? I say this to you: You can raise your fist to strike at me, but it takes mere milliseconds for me to draw, raise and shoot.
Hmm. This is good because google has a much better search than yahoo, consistantly finding the good sites at the top. It's bad for the smaller sites (like mine..search TI-89 Games at yahoo) though because of how search engines work. Google goes more by the number of links and my site was recently established. I think that this method can work but they should also use how words occur, because instead of people stocking their pages with keywords, they now pay commercial services to link sites to them. One commercial service that I saw an ad for linked 4000 sites to people for $250, effectively buying them a high place on a search engine like google. Search engines should try to use methods that both prevent people from stocking up on keywords but that prevent people from buying top places even when their site could be worse.
"I have not failed. I've simply found 10,000 ways that won't work." --Thomas Edison
The size of image data look completely wrong. Image data makes up for about 75% of the content of most pages (see for example Akamai's data). Assuming some duplication of images, the amount of image data should be around 1-1 with text (a 100K text file is huge, a 100K photograph is average size).
Another great one is the BSD-specific search engine: http://www.google.com/bsd. I wonder if there are any other special engines like those on google? I can't seem to find a list on the site anywhere. Oh well, KISS.
You are more than the sum of what you consume.
Desire is not an occupation.
I know what you mean. Boolean Algebra was not my cup of tea, BUT if you can get the language down, it is really accurate. Still, somehow, porno sites always seem to seep through the logic. You have to like total chaos to like "FAST"
"Oblivion is just a click away." -Aazz
If you really want something to get fuzzy about, check out alltheweb.com. As Saddam would say, it's the mother of all search engins. If you really want TOO much information, this is the place to go.
"Oblivion is just a click away." -Aazz
TRY MSN SEARCH!!! You might like it.
"Oblivion is just a click away." -Aazz
The bottom line, some of the volunteers for the open directory know what they're doing in terms of hierarchically organizing data, but many don't.
This is why you will not find pervasive organizational practices and structures throughtout the open directory, and this is why ulimately most of it is a mess of broken links on untended pages.
To succeed with an organizational scheme you need rules that are applied universally (for example, each category should/shouldn't make reference to geographical data, based on X,Y, etc.).
The open directory model is akin to asking visitors to the library of congress to design its subject hierarchy.
And HotMail (read: Microsoft) is not just "another capitalist institution feeding off of others for its sustinence"
OR
Have I just been Trolled?
Tom
Reality does not happen until you analyze the dots. -Don DeLillo (Underworld)
Seriously, though ZIP stands for Zoning Improvement Plan, kind of a misleading term for US Snail.
Marxism is the opiate of dumbasses
it's not funny: yahoo is NOT a search engine: it's a directory, organized by humans.
A search engine crawls and store web pages. This may be one of the smartes moves from yahoo. Let's hope we can still access the lean google.com
Sorry, I thought that they were included with you trolls. Please accept my humble apology. Maybe there should be like a troll faq or something, so that people will be able to tell trolls apart from the real trash. Esp. since some troll posts are completely hilarious.
Chris 'coldacid' Charabaruk Meldstar Entertainment
So Yahoo! has an index. It's of dubious quality, and it seems that you have to bribe them to get into the index.
I'll stick to AltaVista, TYVM.
Chris 'coldacid' Charabaruk Meldstar Entertainment
Okay, for starters, I know it's a generization. I just want to point out that generalizations are false (hrm... by that rule, that's false itself).
Second, just because I don't show off my HotMail address here does not mean I don't have one. My HotMail address is pretty much just for IM and recieving spam.
Thirdly, I don't like being insulted. If you said this right to my face, tomorrow would see you visiting your dentist to get false teeth.
And finally, the subject is an example of sarcasm. However, I doubt that you'd understand that. I say this because it seems you haven't really evolved from the tree apes.
Chris 'coldacid' Charabaruk Meldstar Entertainment
I really don't give half a rat's ass. It's just that zip code sounds so wierd. It's like you are sending mail to an encrypted archive or something. BTW, wth did the term 'zip' as used in 'zip code' come from?
Chris 'coldacid' Charabaruk Meldstar Entertainment
I use HotMail, yet I almost never use Yahoo. Yahoo is nothing more than another capitalist institution, feeding off of others for it's sustinence.
I will not pay money so that my site is at the top of a search of Yahoo. I have something that the people of Yahoo don't - morals.
Chris 'coldacid' Charabaruk Meldstar Entertainment
Altavista have launched a decidedly Googlish style interface at http://www.raging.com Its a nice way to lose all the portal crud
What are the chances? Negligible
Well, google is my favorite search engine, and I am glad to see it do well. However, yahoo used to be the one I used when google didn't give me what I needed.
Google Lists the results based on how many times that page was linked by another page. Sometimes that is good -- you see the most popular page based on those names. Sometimes this is bad. Yahoo used to have the results indexed by a human. Sometimes this is good, sometimes this is bad. Depending on what I am looking for I find yahoo would give me better results and sometimes google did.
Now will google and yahoo give the exact same results? Or will they use Google's index but still be sorted differently? If yahoo will equal google (I seem to remember back in 94 or 95 when I used yahoo mostly as a search engine now yahoo is an everything page and it get's it's search engine from someone else) maybe I will have to find something to replace yahoo.
Google has always been the most reliable search engine (in my experience, that is, and by "reliable" I mean most accurate results for what I asked for) and it's too bad that a bunch of people just use the crap MSN search built into MSIE. Maybe Google getting some advertising on a large portal site will help people get away from this once they find out that typing in 'Britney' into a search box won't get them 1.0 x 10^30 links to the same porn site. Ah well.
But when Google came out, I had to add them to my Favorites. Their search engine is just plain better.
I've been waiting a long time for Yahoo to wake up and realize Inktomi sucked (as it did for most portal sites). Now Yahoo will have my eyeballs fully -- and I'm very happy about it.
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
Google being my primary search (and the beauty that it is)... here's another for those looking for a backup:
.......should the need arise.
FAST Search
Whatever you come across in life.. as long as there's no money in it,... it'll probably be alright.
Maybe this link explains a lot http://searchenginewatch.com/reports/alliances.htm l
My favourite search engine now is Google, but why all the fuzz? OK, they are running Linux on a bunch of boxes, is that the reason why /.ers liek it so much? I think it is just marginally better than the alternatives.
One of the reasons they are better than the alternatives is that the pages are so clean. I recently answered a survey on the Google site where I hope I got that point through. It was lots of questions of the portal type things on the form, I hope they are not going in that direction. I think they are not.
But, if Google opened their source, I mean, with all the geeks allready liking Google, they would certainly get a lot of good people, and their page rank technology won't last forever. Besides, a link doesn't have any implied meaning, and of course people do mostly make links to good pages, but that need not necessarily be a good thing to use. I have links to pages I have slaughtered...
Employee of Inrupt, Project Release Manager and Community Manager for Solid
Well maybe because some people don't want to have to write down http://www.freewebsites.com/hir6/section8/padfs3/~ sdflwefg.html
Thanks for the support talonyx. I would bet that easily 98% of the US population didn't know what Inktomi was.
Flamebait? Are you guys nuts?
dubya dubya dubya dot network hyphen ...
listener: wait, which one is the hyphen again?
you: you know, that straight dash thingie, i.e., a centered horizontal line
listener: oh yah, that one
you: geek dot com
listener: wait a minute, can you start again?
you: ok [...]
listener: oh, hey, why do you have a hyphen between network and geek?
you: OH FUCK IT. just go to google and type network geek.
I think Michael needs to change his formula. The scale seems a bit off.
He also mentions that there are about 45 TB of data on the web. In comparison, the Gnutella network contains about 1 TB of data, according to the statistics on my computer.
Granted, Gnutella is not the web, and there are many (large) files on it that are not found on the web. However, it is a relatively small network (compared to the Web), and I have a hard time believing it contains as much as 1/50th the data!
Also, since the Web grows exponentially, he could get way off very quickly, even though by my estimates it only grows a little faster than half a percent a day. It may even end up being faster than exponentially (ie. x^x).
But be careful, because you will be attacked by a bunch of monkeys when you try to climb the stairs.
When you find them, you will see Jimmy Hoffa coding viruses!!
And when you finally open the car door, a bunch of fast food bags will come flying out at you!
WTF? This sounds a lot like an Easter Egg.
I was blown away by AltaVista when I discovered it in late 1995. Then the signal-to-noise ratio became problematic over the years. One year ago I was blown away by Google. There's hope! This new algorithm of weighting based on the extent to which other sites link to a page seems to work!
Then I realized that it works for our site (a nonprofit site offering public-sector information) only because we've been on the Net for over five years, and by now we've built up a fair number of links to us on other sites.
But I worry about someone coming online for the first time. They won't get listed in Google simply on the basis of their newness. They could offer a REAL cure for cancer, and no one would find them if they used Google.
So while Google has restored my faith in bots, I still feel that some attention ought to be paid to obscure public-sector information by the Google folks, apart from their automated rankings. Maybe a special wetware screening process for nonprofit sites.
I've seen too many sites with good public-sector information on them, and counters on the bottom that actually work, and then I make the computation and discover that they are getting only two or three hits per day. I think the Internet ought to be a bit easier than that for nonprofits with useful information.
For those amongst you that read Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy: search'engine: An important part of the Improbability Drive. The search'engine produces the random numbers that one needs to travel through spacetime. You travel based on the probability that what you seek for is found. I'd rather see yahoo adopt a bistro-technology model for their searchengine. The totals on the receipts in Italian Bistro's are far more random than any Giga-Google search-result i know! Or wasn't yahoo looking for a pseudo-random number generator?
Inktomi Selected by Yahoo! as Premier Enterprise Search Solution Provider for Corporate Yahoo! Service .. This is what you'll find at Inktomi's web page at http://www.inktomi.com/new/press/yes.html . How the h*** could this be true if Yahoo! selected Google?
- cfelde
you missed one.
those who use AOL tend to primarily use askjeeves or, heaven forbid, AOL search.
It's well known that Yahoo runs on FreeBSD. Now its search engine will run on Linux. Tell that to people who ask "is it good enough?"
I noticed this about 3 years ago, when all my searches from different search engines just kept pulling up the same pages over and over. As for Yahoo! using other services... that kinda makes sense, since Yahoo! has evolved (or degraded, if you prefer) from a pure search engine to an Internet portal. It's a great portal, and home page... the searches? Ehhh... Well, I, for one, am happy to see Yahoo dump Inktomi... Yahoo! was already famous for having dead links by then, and ever since they switched to Inktomi, their "web page match" has been somewhat useless in finding relative matches. Hopefully this will add to their users' search experience. I really like the whole idea of cached pages, too. At least you get to see some of the page without having to rely on remote servers being dead. =p
Is Google really better than Inktomi? Or are a bunch of folks just praising Google because it is linux based and Inktomi is not?
Right now Inktomi serves up more queries per day for just Yahoo than Google serves up in a day for all customers. And they still have the horsepower to serve several other big sites, like AOL.
Let's let it run for a while, but like several analysts have said - don't be surprised if Yahoo goes back to Inktomi because Google breaks under the load.
And if you think this move was based purely on technology, dream on. Google and Yahoo happen to both have the same guy on their board of directors. Don't be surprised if Yahoo even just buys Google at some point. I just hope that Google can take it.
Just as Inktomi sells their search engine and directory (ie, yahoo-esque) engine services seperately, i'm sure google does exactly the same.
No problem there, then.
...j
Danny - http://www.google.com/search?q=danny
I have written over 900 book reviews
From waht I understood, Google has sets of more trustworthy pages and less trustworthy ones.
A trustworthy page is one linked to by many trustworthy pages or a page that the Google designers found interesting.
Thus to get high relevancy, spamlinkers would have to be linked from trustworthy pages. Of course, if a page links to spam, then it is not so trustworthy.
I hope Google has a way to continously reevaluate the value of pages.
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Men with no respect for life must never be allowed to control the ultimate instruments of death.
GW Bu
There are lists of the other specialized searches here.
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Yahoo needs google because it isn't a search engine. It's an index, maintained by human editors. They sell it as "the best of both worlds". You get human-filtered stuff in yahoo, but if you want something so recent that it hasn't made it through the editorial pipeline, or something so utterly obscure as to not warrant its own category, you can use google.
In hotbot's case "powered by Lycos" basically means "owned by Lycos".
The only thing that bothers me is: what's to keep them from catering to specific commercial interests?
I think the people at Google understand very clearly that while their money comes from the advertisers, they only have advertisers because of their users. They don't want to piss off their users, and they understand that the key to keeping users is to provide the best results, with no BS.
In fact, they put pretty big restrictions on their advertisers. Ever notice how the ads are really small text-only ads, that are related to your query? If an advertiser doesn't like the restrictions, it's easy to get another advertiser. It's hard to replace a million pissed off users.
Actually, Lycos has dropped their original search technology, and moved to using the Fast engine (read the press release.)
"Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgement." Job 32:9
I must say. I really enjoy using google. I really really do. No advertising. pure search.
Hmm. So now yahoo isn't even a 'search' engine anymore.... they are just an index.
Hmm. Today Inktomi announced they will provide search services for Corporate Yahoo [I'd put a link there, but my nslookup seems to not be finding it].
It's agreements like this that keep Google from having to place ads on their search page. Hopefully they didn't sign an agreement not to compete with Yahoo!
The interesting thing is that this provides incentives not to link to other sites, and to spread your content between several machines.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Does this mean that they will create customizable personal web-search ehgines called "Mininktomies"? Sorry bad pun
Romanes eunt domus? People called Romanes, they go the 'ouse? It says Romans go home. No it doesn't. What's Latin fo
Eeeeeeeeeeexcellent... (in Monty Burns tone)
;)
While debugging an Apache build with a coworker I used Google to look for a certain bug. And, as expected the first few hits contained what we needed. Later said coworker referred to this as the "Google trick" I showed her. (??) Don't know what part of it was a trick. It's just a search engine like the rest. Just happens to be very good
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
hotbot is also owned by lycos, so it's pretty reasonable that they share technology.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
Actually the answer to how Goggle makes money is more interesting than ads.
It's good old business2business relationships.
They are currently in the process of stealing Inktomi's business - the people who supply the data for the searches on most of the major portals.
Firstly they won Netscape's portal, and now they have Yahoo.
Google have turned from plucky underdog to the rulers of the scene in a matter of a year.
Unfortunatly, Google still returns several of my archived /. posts with the linked .sig before the actual page on CDROM RAID. Thankfully my sig changed, so there won't be too many more interfering entries, but still!
.sig: Now legally binding!
Like that
"And how can this be? For he is the
I actually really like Google's caching features. Quite a few times, I've found a page that will tell me exactly what I want, only to find that it no longer exists, access denied, etc. If google has it cached, then no problems for me. I can't really see people using the caching feature at any other time.
the display the user sees will still be a Yahoo-formatted page, with Google search results but Yahoo-managed banner ads, hyperlinks, and other decorations. I'm more interested in what Yahoo does to link the banner ads with the search terms or search results, though perhaps Google also gets to sell that information to advertisers or information aggregators, even though they're not providing the banner ad themselves.
Remember when the Internet term "IP" meant "Internet Protocol" instead of "Intellectual Property"?
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Yeah, my problem is, I only have so much web bar-space.... I like the fact that this doesn't take up any room....
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DO NOT DISTURB THE SE
I notice a pattern of people and search engines. Those that use hotmail as their e-mail use yahoo as their search engine. Those who use POP3 use altavista or google. I had a public speaking teacher that wanted us to visit a website. She was too dumb to give us the address, so she said, "Go to a search engine and type in blah blah blah....." I couldn't find it using AV or google. But when I typed it into Yahoo, it was in the first page.
The point of this is that some people are too dumb to write down URL's. They depend on search engines to find a site again. If they site changes, people might become confused.
new sites will never become popular, since they aren't linked to by the highly-rated ones.
We already have a dose of that with the Bow Tie theory of the web.
I wonder what effect Google/Yahoo will have on Spamdexing "industry" ? Rather than stuffing <meta> tags, will the lexicographic whores turn to setting up "stooge pages" with loads of links to their favoured targets.
A large auto-generated farm of stooges could carry a lot of "relevant" text on a particular subject, and links to the target pages. It's almost impossible for Google to detect wordlist drivel from real sites (that's nigh-on a Turing Test). As storage space is cheap, and bandwidth needed would be minimal, the spamdexers could afford a large collection of these.
I think google's slip into commercialism is inevitable, but by the time that happens there might be another slick clean engine to use. =)
They aren't replacing Yahoo with Google searches as some people think, they're probably replacing the 'search engine' portion of yahoo (once powered by AltaVista, in fact) that comes up if you explicitly ask for it or automatically if the regular yahoo search yeilds no hits.
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Oh my god, Bear is driving! How can this be?
ADVENTURERS! - ANTIHERO FOR HIRE - CARDMASTER CONFLICT
Note: http://www.google.com/search?q=Felipe+Hoffa+car+ke ys
is the URL above...
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
Re: [SQL] locked my keys in the car
accursed database!
In today's "go! go! go!" Internet boom, we seldom take time to appreciate what we have done so far.
1 billon. 1 thousand million. 1x10^9. That's the population of China. That's 1/6 the population of the world. If you presume the web was really born on January 1, 1990 (I don't know the exact date, but this is close enough), 261,096 pages were put up per day on average. Impressive.
According to this Inktomi has "more than 80 customers". Their current market cap is "Fifteen Biiiillion Dollars" [Dr. Evil]
80 customers and a market cap that ends in a B. This new economy scares me!
For those complaning about Altavista's and other's portals, there's a nice little solution. If you use IE 5 and windows, that is. I'm sure there's something similiar for other browsers/OSes. The quick search accessory from ms. You get it as part of the Web Accesories Pack. It lets you type "ly search for this" in the address bar which searches lycos for "search" "for" "this". Or type "av thiscompany -host:thiscompany.com" to do a custom Altavista search. You can even "teach" it to use engines it doesn't have built in, like google. I love it.
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DO NOT DISTURB THE SE
Whaddya mean? I sure didn't have any trouble.
Those who do not know the past are doomed to reimplement it, poorly.
I love Google (now GigaGoogle (try saying that five times fast)), but I really wish it had better syntax. It supports ANDs, AND NOTs, and phrases, and that's it. No ORs or XORs, and certainly no NEARs or searching by date. I used to use AltaVista before they turned into a portal, but now I can't stand it. So I use Google because it's fast and gives relevant results, but most importantly because it doesn't tell me what the Dodgers score was, or which town in Texas was the host of the most recent gun-nut massacre. I still wish it was a little less primitive, though.
Switch the . and the @ to email me.
What I'm wondering is how this will impact Yahoo's use of the open directory. Currently Google uses the open directory in their search results, and you can visit it at directory.google.com, and now Yahoo's using Google's search results? How many of these search results are going to be coming from The Open Directory, or at least spidered due to the work of the volunteers at the ODP? In some warped way Yahoo may have the largest index again.
So either Google really is catching up, or Michael needs to change his formula.
I'd say the most important factor in Google.com's growth is the fact that if you enter "Farting Sounds" as your search term, you get my web page as both the second AND third results.
Over a billion pages... and two of the top three "farting sounds" pages are mine.
Well. I can't think of a single reason for me to go on living.
Phallic Symbols in LOTR
Perhaps this is just slightly OT, but one of the things I really like about Google is their Linux-specific search engine!
:)
They always seem to turn up Linux stuff anyway - sometimes I wonder if rpmfind.net alone accounts for 75% of their 1 billion pages.
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While I love google, and use it for all my searches, a little voice in the back of my head tells me to be worried. Google rates sites based on how many other sites link to them (and how many other sites link to those sites). So, let's say I decide to create a page about the very tasty fish Red Snapper. I'll probably include a section of links to other Red Snapper pages, which I will find using Google. As more and more people create pages with links they found on Google, the set of pages that were popular when Google started get higher and higher ratings, until there is just an incestuous web of interlinking, highly-rated sites.
If everyone uses Google-like search engines, new sites will never become popular, since they aren't linked to by the highly-rated ones. The result will be a fairly static set of pages returned by search results, with an impossible barrier for new sites.
Maybe google can do something to give the new sites a chance (Give extra points to pages created in the last month, or something).
On the other hand, it was becoming clear to me that some of the newer search engines, especially Google, were beginning to do a hideously good job of indexing things in a most-un-Yahooly way. Well, not completely un-Yahooly; Google is fast and simple, too. And people really like that, even if they miss that hierarchical, home-made feel.
Now, I understand that the current agreement is for Yahoo to provide Google results for searches it doesn't do anything useful with, but I would be a bit surprised if they didn't adopt the technology more widely to crunch through the Web, which can really no longer be lovingly indexed by hand. And I predict that people will learn to like it, which is something I would not have predicted a year ago.
But the end result will probably be the same: Yahoo will still make lots of money, while very few other outfits will. And the reason will probably be the same: Yahoo provides what people really want.
Babar
it seems funny to me that all of these supposed 'search engines' are all using other 'search engines' to do the work for them
used to be you had yahoo, hotbot, altavista, lycos, etc. -- now yahoo is going to be 'powered by' google, and hotbot is 'powered by' lycos, and altavista still returns pictures of santa claus when you do a search on "caffeine free diet coke"
you know - i'll bet if you look into this far enough it probably all links back to one guy who stays up all night answering queries.
guy: "jesus another search for 'caffeine free diet coke' - wtf...let's see how he reacts when i return links to pictures of santa claus!"
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
Google still can't find my car keys.
Fh
So far, it seems that Google hasn't fallen into a commercialist trap - they've generally kept everything clean and unbiased, and they turn up darn good results. (Heck, I got a Google t-shirt for Father's Day, and I'll proudly wear it.)
The only thing that bothers me is: what's to keep them from catering to specific commercial interests? How long is it before it becomes YASE (Yet Another Search Engine) that favors some commercial hits above any others? I sure hope there are some people up top at Google who push fairness. Of course, when those people go away, what's left to do that work? Have they forced themselves into a process that will do it for them?
Be nice to your friends. If it weren't for them, you'd be a complete stranger.