Slashdot Mirror
The Continuing Rise Of Amiga
Mike Bouma writes: "Already well over 15,000 developers have bought the Amiga SDK 1.0 and soon there will be an update available (3D, Sound, GUI and performance improvements). It will be downloadable freely for 1.0 buyers and a Windows equivalent will be available.
There is an enormous amount of activity going on within the Amiga community, for example only yesterday
Hyperion Software acquired the rights for a Europa Universalis port. While Hyperion Software already had an incredible lineup of games licenses for the Amiga (Majesty, Soldier of Fortune, Sin, Heretic II, Shogo: Mobile Armor Division, Freespace: The Great War, Worms: Armageddon), Linux (Majesty, Sin, Shogo) and Mac (Shogo, Soldier of Fortune). Read this interesting interview with Thomas Frieden to know more about them. They are also working together with Titan Software to port various titles like Alien Nations as Titan has the Amiga and Mac porting rights.(Also their Exodus: the Last War *finally a Napalm beater?* and Evils Doom are great new games)
Meanwhile many other companies are investing a lot of effort to support alternative OSes and especially the Next Generation Amiga Digital Environment. Some examples are Epic Interactive and PaganGames (Earth 2140, Scavengers, Magick, Simon The Sorcerer 2, Dafel: Bloodline, etc., for both Amiga/Mac and Foundations series), Crystal Interactive (Gilbert Goodmate, Bubble Heroes, Dark Millennia, Dweebs, Gorky17), Digital Dreams Entertainment (Hell Squad, Wasted Dreams series, Diablo's Land), Blittersoft (Wipeout 2097 for Amiga/Mac, Payback, Homeland, etc.) and many many other small and unannounced companies developing for the new Amiga. Some interesting Amiga SDK information and some open sourced games and utilities for the Amiga SDK can be downloaded here."
Don't look now, but if you read part of your user number upside down it reads 666.
I'd be careful about that.
My central point is that as someone who primarily uses Linux, even *I* would consider buying an Amiga if they manufactured cheap PowerPC boxes that Linux could be reinstalled on to.
So which part of my statement indicates I did not read the article. I just don't buy the hype.
If you read my post before firing off your lame "he didn't read the article" whinge, you'd realize I was opining more on the state of Amiga and fruitless advocacy, than the "news of the day" this submission links to.
Any system that FUNCTIONS is viable for a particular user, but if AMiga had 100 times the market share... they still wouldn't beat Apple or Linux. I'm sure Amiga will benefit from open-source software that gets ported to their OS, but even then there's only so many port maintainers, and I don't envision lots of closed source software getting ported.
Amiga could have targeted systems to Linux users,
most of whom have fond memories of the AMiga of old.
wow, amazing someone is still developing for an old system. DYK that their are people still developing for the apple//gs too? it has AIM and a web browser and all kinds of other cool stuff. But here's what I don't understand. The best amiga you can possibly by doesn't have anywhere near the power to run a game like shogo MAD or SOF. Exactly which amiga computer are we talking about here. Is amiga still in business and making machines? If they are let me at one!
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
Besides, Even I, in 1988 didn't know what the hell an Amiga was. It took a video tape of the effects work from Aegis VideoScape and the other cool programs to show me that a little PC could do the work of much more expensive, dedicated video equipment. Not even the Mac at that time could compete. Back then, a local guy was trying to make Crystal Topaz do better 3D animation than a Video Toaster. The Topaz software alone cost more than the Toaster, and couldn't do as good a job as Lightwave (1990)
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
An OS that is largely dead can no longer roast your files, frustrate you with non-existent support or let you down in any way.
What's next, people claiming that the TRS-80 was better than a PS-2?
all this support for amiga, but beos users can't get any? ^^;;
--
Peace,
Lord Omlette
ICQ# 77863057
[o]_O
Make an Open Source CLONE!!!
My other account has a 3-digit UID.
>If that's your main problem, get longer display and keyboard cables, and stick that machine in another room.
:)
That's simply not an option in an apartment, and when I get a house I'd lose a whole room to "storage". I've already tried putting the system in the closet, but it gets too warm.:-/
I appreaciate PowerPC for other things than minimal heat. Just like some people view Linux as "free" because the software doesn't lock you into an OS vendor, I appreciate the potential for linux not locking us into *an architecture*. I am simply floored by people who don't click on this POTENTIAL... we'll never get anything revolutionary from Intel so why wear their handcuffs? I like cheap x86 parts (smp!) too, but Intel's lost there edge. The next revolutionary CPU designer will have nothing to offer if Linux apps are still chained to IA-32...
I ran PPC Linux when I had a Mac, and liked it. Sure, I'll miss out on Quake and Unreal, but Loki's porting PPC games.
One wouldn't need to compile everything if they run a Linux distro that supports apt-get. I totally love Debian now, after trying everything else first because of rumors of a difficult install (not so bad)
WTF??? Did you ever own an Amiga in the '80's?? The main reason I bought an Amiga 1000, then an Amiga 500 while I was in college was because they were CHEAP! Even as a Mac fan and Windows user (sorry, I couldn't bring myself to say "Windows fan") today I can admit that PC's and Mac's were outrageously overpriced and underpowered back then compared to Amigas. Their primary attraction among their fans back then was the big bang-for-the-buck that you got when you bought an Amiga.
Face it, you need to learn to close your mouth when you don't know what you're talking about!
Assign NatPor: CD0:Images/Sex/Illegal/StarWars
Then just use NatPor: to get where you know you wanna go.
Assign NPAndGrits: NatPor:Grits
And you get the idea. :-)
Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
... where my .jedrc is.
Hi, im pretty sure that the OS is opensourse now(cept for the kernal :(). The OS runs hosted on a number of platforms and the list of OS that can host it are increaseing. Windows and Windows CE very soon if not atm.
Also it runs by its self. That is it doesnt have to be hosted by another OS.
And really, if your sick of people talking about the amiga why do you read their comments/articles ?
Another thing how can a computer die? Maybe people stop programing for it. But that never happened. Maybe you all just tuned out!
Giving IE users a taste of their own medicine since 2005 - http://pods.-is-a-geek.net/
"We have dug up Mussolinis corpse, cultivated germ cells with DNA from the corpse and spliced it with DNA from Hitler and Stalin to build the greatest dictator the Earth has ever seen...
;) Okay, okay I guess I'll stop mocking the believer's for now... Being a long time Apple supporter I know what those skeptical looks are like... I guess only time will tell if you're following the shoe or the gourd.
=tkk
Bill Gates - Creationist?!?
Minor correction: 7.1x MHz 68000 in the A1000
The "directory-name as a command is equivalent to cd directory-name" thing was my invention. I got tired of typing 'cd' all the time, and I was writing a unix C-shell clone (plus a lit) for the Amiga (with process control, much more rich syntax, etc, etc, etc). I then got hired by Commodore, and shelved the shell - but I put a few things like the don't-have-to-type-cd into the main shell (actually, I convinced Andy Finkel to add them; I was in charge of AmigaDOS). I also added all the hooks for user shells to replace the default shell.
I wish tcsh on Unix had the ability to obviate the need for 'cd '.
(As someone mentioned, you could also add defines for directories, both for use as commands, and for access to files associated with a program. For example, I had src: assigned to Work:Development/src, and to CD there would just type "src:". Yes, of course this can be done with alias in tcsh, but alias doesn't help with things like "src:AmigaDos", or "copy src:foo/*.c wherever". Also, yes, if you are willing to create a bunch of top-level softlinks it will mostly work the same way in Unix - but people rarely are willing to do so.
All anyone talks about is it's potential comeback
Amiga is dead, and until they release something more substantial than what they have been (like something cool maybe?) they will remain there. Linux would not be where it is if it
wasn't free
didn't have free developemnt tools ($100 is crazy, even apple has _some_ free stuff (not much but some))
It just seems that 1 or 2 times a year they release something that has potential to be cool, but then really isn't. If there is enough demand for the OS. Release it! I looked on amiga's website and could only find information specific to the "classic" amiga and the new SDK. If this is supposed to be some sort of portable application tool it's not specific enough.
It says it's minimum requirements are red hat linux? hmmmmm So what OS does this actually run on? It lists that the os can run on (embedded) windows, linux, and QNX and can run on powerpc hardware...but with what os there? certainly not mac os.
If they really want to "make a comeback" as they have talking about for years (even before they were fully dead) then open source the os! port it to x86! port it to whatever you want! but come on do something people!
/* oops I accidentally made a comment, sorry */
A 'CP/M Developers Kit' is just the grey-cover 8-1/2 x 11 manual. Almost nobody had them, and I suspect mine would sell for good money on E-Bay to the right collector.
Everybody just made copies of each other's CP/M binaries. Were you around then?
Right ...
Linux is an alternative, this, even if you don't like the way PCs are built. I like to enjoy the latest evolutions in hardware and therefore, amiga won't be the solution for me.
Announcements were made at the last linux conference with new motherboards for linux systems running on x86. There's developement on the way but it might take some time (but faster than the amiga revival anyway ...).
Quick add to divx, it is now being ported to linux without any f***** windows libraries.
Sleep tight Gothic :)
That's what the Amiga was FOR. The Video Toaster and all those neat applications that made Amiga famous? Those came later.. by several years.
As with many things from the early days of personal computers, the history is muddy and filled with opinon, but if you poke around for a bit, you can pick up one common thread: They were striving to build the next hot gaming platform.
One example of this would be a history found here.
There's dozens more out there.. I reccomend looking them up and getting a lot of opinions before making your own. But playing games exclusively wouldn't be an insult to the Amiga. :) It'd be using it for exactly what it was meant to do.
I've had almost one of every kind of boxen in my collection at one time or another.
The Amiga (it was a 3000) tops the list of computers I was glad to get rid of.
I could never see why people liked them that much. Braindamaged CLI syntax, atari 800 class video.
Yeah, the Toaster was a crufty hack and some of the Psygnosis games were OK but for the most part, ick.
--
tranquility for the mac...coming soon.
Efficiency???
ROTFLMAO!!!
Let's see...A Java virtual machine that runs on top of Tao's Elate OS that runs on top of Linux. Sounds sooooo efficient to me.
Don't forget, how many operating systems multitask beautifully in 256k RAM that the A1000 had? It's rather sad they screwed up. Amiga could have quite easily dominated the industry :(
I must admit though, the Amiga SDK does sound like it will be as 'revolutionary' as the hardware was in 85... but let's just wait and see hey
Do your best, hope for the best, suspect the worst.
They have a "wopping" fast 25mhz processor (optional 50 mhz). And a 1 GIG scsi Harddrive. That really makes me want one. NOT.
...how many people have actually read the actual articles and base their replies on actual information, not just to "Amiga? That was a nice piece of gaming hardware in 80's and died in early 90's." - level of knowledge.
Somehow most of the replies to the original give me the mental image of a quite small percentage. Whether negative or positive, the feedback should be in my opinion based on relatively up-to-date information. Bashing or blind zealous worship without facts are rather useless when only a few minutes worth of work would be needed to get relatively up-to-date. If someone doesn't bother doing that, she or he probably shouldn't bother to participate in discussion either.
Everyone who makes generalizations should be shot.
Have you tried Google?
Will I retire or break 10K?
Firstly Europe's not a country, it's a continent and Secondly in this part of Europe (England) 15,000 means Fifteen Thousand and 15.000 means Fifteen (to three decimal places). I guess it's different in continental Europe?
--
01 13 19
TVDJC TDSLR AZNGT NWQSH KPN
They're too much a bunch of candy-assed roadkill queefs to give us AmigaPPC or OS 4. Instead, they make up shit about "we don't need hardware any more, there's so much of it already" and expect that to stand up as an excuse for the con job they are pulling on us. Digital enviroment? Give me a break. The truth of the matter is that the amiga is dead. I hate to say it. Honestly I do, if any platform ever deserved to die, it wasn't the Amiga (Wintel or maybe vax?).
So, after being raped by third party comapnies for the last half of a decade (060 accelerator for only US$1000 anyone?), the new owners must have it in their heads that supporting amiga means some kind of rape. And they give us the biggest rape of all. Bigger than Gateway's patent rape, if that is even possible. They stole the "Amiga" name, slapped it on some idiotic technology package, and hope that this scheme gives them some kind of respect that they didn't have before.
If I only thought that a guy like me could succeed at some sort of homebrew/open source hardware project, I'd try it. Maybe dirt cheap PPC accelerators (avnet has 603e's for $44 per unit), or even a cloned motherboard. But even if I managed to, to what effect? Jumping the hurdles of 68k emulation still leaves us with a seriously outdated OS, and no one is gonna change that. Even OS X has more in common with System9 than DE has with AmigaOS. Is software like this something that is realistically clonable, especially considering how little effort might be mustered for it?
Like the father who is begging/crying to the doctors to just please save his child, just save him, I can't believe Amiga has to be dead. Quit posting these goddamn morbid stories so I can grieve in peace.
Well, if Sturgeon's Law holds, then probably more like fifteen hundred are worth a flip. It is, however, possible that Sturgeon was being highly optimistic.
I'm not very familiar with the Amiga, or its rebirth, but from the list you given in the post, it looks like the Amiga has been demoted to a video game system, is the plan for Amiga to compete with consoles, or is the Amiga also going to be an actual PC platform with a broad range of applications?
We do this because this is the curse of the Amiga.
Click on that stupid Amiga Icon, and read through the stories, and see exactly HOW MUCH vapor has been spewed on this topic, and HOW MANY of their plans have never materialized.
...then you might start to understand why we take all our Amiga stories with a decent-sized glacier of salt.
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Wow! A whole 15.000 developers have downloaded it! Maybe if they're lucky, 5 more will get it, and they'll have a nice round 20.000 developers... :P
Well, obviously the assumption being made here was that the people who click on the 'read more' link would be the people who do care.
Actually, I think that's meant to be 15,000 (Fifteen Thousand) developers. And what THAT actually means is that 15,000 copies of the Amiga SDK have been sold, essentially making anybody who bought on somehow magically an "Amiga Developer".
I know people who bought one, and they don't know how to code. So that number is inflated. But, rest assured, there are more than "Fifteen" Amiga developers.
(Probably just not many more than that worth a flip, but.....)
-=-
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
I think this article will go down as "the most front page header space wasted in Slashdot history". A joke, but still...
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
The company who committed this piece of software says that they are also porting 2 pokemon games to the new Amiga Digital Environment.
My x86 boxes are so hot, and noisy, that I'm tempted to wear headphone
If that's your main problem, get longer display and keyboard cables, and stick that machine in another room. No need to change mb architectures (buying a new mb, recompiling all your software, and some of it is only available for intel linux).
(this coming from a guy who really likes his PowerPC mac)
- Isaac =)
People have been saying that for 5 years, and it's not dead yet. Amiga: the cockroach of operating systems... (hey, I had one too, and stuck to it longer than most people).
The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer.
--Henry Kissinger
So, I think this is a great idea, and a high quality implementation, but the licensing stuff looks stinky. Too bad. Maybe they will open source it in a year or so?
.- -.. .. --- -....- .- -.- - .. ...- .. - .-.- - ...-.-
Sigh! There are no licensing fees involved. The new revised license agreement is onl ine for all to read.
You only pay Amiga Inc. if you want your software to be "Certified by Amiga" and get marketing support from Amiga Inc.
.-.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
What does the SDK for the future AmigaDE have to do with obsolete technology (well OK, so the DE and software for it will run on obsolete technology like e.g. x86-processors)? And do you still think 150,000 people would have downloaded an Apple ][ emulator for sentimental reasons if they had to pay 100USD per copy? .- -.. .. --- -....- .- -.- - .. ...- .. - .-.- - ...-.-
.-.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
15,000 developers @ $99 ! That's already far exceeded my expectations for Amiga, which admittedly weren't very high in the first place.
---------
There will be no more reports in Italian media on the actions of Alleanza Nazionale in the parliament (because Alessandra Mussolini's grandfather Benito is STILL dead).
.- -.. .. --- -....- .- -.- - .. ...- .. - .-.- - ...-.-
Idiot. The article isn't about the "classic" Amiga (A1000-A4000T) or its OS (1.x-3.x). It's about the forthcoming Amiga OS (or DE as Amiga Inc. want to call it). You can't flog an unborn horse.
.-.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
okay, i know you meant windows when you meant "PC". but it's a pet peeve of mine. ever since the mac vs windows wars, the word "PC" has gotten a bad rap. this is sorta like the whole "hacker" and "cracker" thing.
bah. start over
I do this too -and with good reason. There are NO lossless animation/pixel-by-pixel editing tools available anywhere else that I hae found that are on a par with the Amiga's various image processing suites, such as PPaint and Animation Studio.
The modern ones are all either veery powerful, but with hideous, clunky user interfaces (gimp, photoshop), or with superficially similar easy UIs to Amiga packages, but ridiculuously feature free.
If I'm drawing original, bitmapped web graphics, I use an emulated copy of Amiga software - although, now that phoitogenics is out for linux, that can finally begin to change.
Choice of masters is not freedom.
Yes, the Amiga was a VERY similar m68k UNIX-like OO GUI architecture to NeXTSTEP, in fact - but at 1/10th the cost.
It was technically excellent, but management screwed it up.
Choice of masters is not freedom.
I wonder if they'll fix the huge oversight bug in Wipeout 2097 this time around. On the PC version, there are no speed limiters, so if you have a decent system, it runs 20x as fast as it should.
I mailed Psygnosis (original makers) and they said that it was bound to happen as computers got faster. I guess they can program great console games, but forgot how to do PCs. (Funny, my copy of Lemmings ver.1 for the PC (or Tandy,) runs just fine on my P3 450.)
the most people think to much of the past people that think other os's suxx because windows i the best than they don't know what is easy to use and the new amiga wil use new hardware not the old hardware and if people think that other platforms can't make it (linux beos amigaos macos) they shoul read the news better many people want use other things than windows!!!!!!
While the Amiga name will be used to promote the product, it's nothing like the purchase of the Commodore name; there's actually a new product behind it this time (as impossible as that sounds, given the last few years in Amiga's history!)
More factual info can be found on amiga.com
AC comments get piped to
More power to 'em. We need more platforms, not fewer.
Heck, If I had a billion bucks to throw around,
I'd bring the Apple II line back. Sans Apple, of course.
Reverse engineer the ROMs and OSes.
I'd like to see a modern system, w/ a built in language interpreter and machine-language monitor.
It sure does look like my copy of the Amiga Hardware Reference Manual will be obsolete with this new stuff. Ack, I spent a fortune on that book back when I was 14 =)
Otherwise, Your Amiga is Alive. Or not.
.
For those who know, this isn't funny.
-
Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
Actually, it had 256K RAM and 256K WOM (write once memory - which Kickstart wrote to and became protected afterwards). And um.. the applications on Amiga were all very tiny, requiring very little overhead. Of course, there isn't a terrible lot you can do in 256K but you could quite easily run say 100 different programs (like clocks, text editors, small animations, and more) if you wanted to. The system might slow a bit after 30-40 of them but what do you expect from 7.14MHz
Even taking it further... the A500/2000 with 512K or 1MB or 2Mb... theres a hell of a lot you can do in that on an Amiga. Nothing compares to the responsiveness and abilities the little beast could do back then even compared to now (with those that have more memory and processing power)
How would Linux perform in 2Mb RAM? What could you run on it? QNX is probably the only thing that is comparable in this way
Do your best, hope for the best, suspect the worst.
Too bad this generates as much interest as, say, NoMad Linux or the re-porting of the FreeBSD ports to Linux (hell, what do we need it for when we have Debian? =P)
That, and the licensing issues benind Amiga...I hope they get straightened out, though my primary interest in Amiga is in hardware. Odd to see Amiga tech go platform-independent.
Stating on Slashdot that I like cheese since 1997.
Where the hell is PETA when you really need them?
---
---
Slashdot: News For Zealots. Stuff That's Hypocritical.
Oddly enough, brazil, so did I. I used my Amiga 500 from 1988 until 1998. I even went online with it for the very first time--at a whole 1200 baud!
I'm not a geek, I'm just a clever script.
Is the Amiga only going to be a game machine? That's what it sounds like. And the comment about BeOS is very true. There seems to be a lot of action happening for an OS that isn't yet real when there could be work being done on what that is. And BeOS is very real and well worth every developers attention.
---
--
If I actually could spell I'd have spelled it right in the first place.
Naw, I'm serious! A C64 palmtop with a card for secondary storage, maybe a USB port for communications. The biggest ticket item on it would be the screen, the rest could be stuck on one chip, and think of all the software that exists for it already. And it was such a ball to code on...
engineering overview
This sounds like a java that actually works. 3 month porting time, everything compiles to virtual machine code, and is translated native on the fly, depending on architecture.
Too bad about the licensing/fee issues that others have posted. The SDK itself should be free, and freely downloaded, if they are going to do that. Or $100 and free from royalties. But not both.
So, I think this is a great idea, and a high quality implementation, but the licensing stuff looks stinky. Too bad. Maybe they will open source it in a year or so?
Treatment, not tyranny. End the drug war and free our American POWs.
See my user info for links.
I would be happy just to see a new version of Mindwalker, one that is as true to the original as possible. That was a really cool game! There are times when I miss my old A1000.
Probably about 10x that number have downloaded Apple ][ emulators. That doesn't mean the Apple ][ is coming back, it just means that people are sentemental about obsolete technology!
--- Speaking only for myself,
Gee, that's all we need! Another pedo phi le programming language for PERVERTS only good for writing applications like this!
--- Speaking only for myself,
It's my understanding that the LithTech engine, first used in Shogo, should be very easy to port to Linux, Amiga, and other alternative OSes.
Monolith Software was in collaboration with Microsoft very early on in development. MS did all they could to support development of LithTech as the Quake-killer, the DirectX engine that would finally topple id's OpenGL-driven dominance. But, alas, Monolith and MS had a falling out, and monolith decided that they weren't going to take any more of Microsoft's crap.
They started making most of the core Lithtech code OS and API independant. In fact, the original intent was to simultaneously release Shogo for the Windows PC and the Nintendo 64. They never finished the N64 version, but a pleasant side affect of it's incomplete development is that we have a modular, portable 3D engine that will take very little modification to run on Linux with GL. Or Amiga with whatever 3D API they're using (I assume GL as well).
It's always nice to have engine competition. Now if we can just convince Carmack to open-source Q3...
Anonymous Luddite: "What do you think of the dehumanizing effects of the Internet?"
Andy Grove: "Not Much."
If the SDK was only that, an add on to the OS that allowed developement, yes, $100 would be silly. However, the SDK also contains the complete OS, etc. They are not shooting for "open source" but for something different. Frankly, the direction they are going is simply amazing.
It changed my life...
Need I say more? That game took all I had seen of computers before, wrapped it up in a large tortilla and shoved it down my throat. I was simply astonished. It made me choose Amiga before Atari, gave me some really memorable nights of cool gaming, brought me through the demo scene, taught me computer architecture, assembly language programming and a lot of basic computer skills in general. Heck... Made me wear sunscreen...
Would love to see a revival of this fabulous machine! For sure!
I wholeheartedly agree...
I can remember many hours of fun playing the original Lemmings, and other great Psygnosis games like Blood Money and Awesome.
there was also no shortage of way cool demos for the amiga showing off it's prowess... one of the original ones was a bouncing red and white checkered ball, I don't remember if it was rendered or if it was a video, but anyway, the ball is still their logo to this day.
-------------------- the list is long. dirac angestung gesept
Why is almost everyone here bringing up the long-gone-and-deadness of the old Amiga machines, and then in the same breath writing the SDK off as DOA?
:-)
This SDK has nothing to do with the old Amiga machines. They kept the name, but that and maybe a certain degree of technical unconventionality are about all this has in common with what Amiga used to be.
This is a cross-platform, hosted application environment. It has a virtual-processor architecture, such that the same binary will work for all platforms (through dynamic recompilation). Everything is based around the Taos kernel, which is (supposedly) the only thing that actually has to be ported to a new architecture for the entire system to support it.
So what this really is is something like Java on steroids, or GNUstep sans native binaries. I love that the core system is quite compact (apparently the Taos kernel is 12kB!), and that it is highly geared toward efficient parallel processing. That the whole thing is called Amiga is a bit odd, but looking into this, one explanation becomes clear: What Amiga boxen were to the hardware peers of its day, this seems to be to the software of today. This really does look like advanced stuff. Read more about it.
I am disappointed, however, that the system is proprietary. Don't wanna go there. But then, hey, these guys are way ahead of the curve. And who knows, maybe the AROS folks will begin their own implemetation of the new API once they finish with the old one
iSKUNK!
I still find it fascinating that interest still exists for the Amiga. Back in them old days its popularity was due its hardware capabilities. It's good to see than the OS shone through (more than I thought) as well.
-- Hob - Java Spectrum Emulator
It can run unhosted. Yes it's an OS.
Seems like the main asset the Amiga guys have
is the old OS roms, and the ability to make
a legal emulator that can still run all the old
software. I don't see the point without 68xxx
emulation, though when I browsed the site,
I didn't see anything about this.
http://junglevision.com -- Shamus for Gameboy
If they really DID sell 15,000 copies of the SDK (I'm skeptical, but anything is possible...) then apparently there are quite a lot of people (not just serious developers) who are willing to pay $100 for the SDK.
Maybe charging $100 for it wasn't such a bad idea after all.
-=-
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
I didn't get into the Amiga until 1988. The machine had already been out a few years, and I still didn't know what it was. (I still had an Atari 800 and computers weren't "cool" yet)
The Amiga 1000 literally, blew me away. The macs I saw in the seven years of being a heavy Amiga user never impressed me. I saw, probably, a higher lever of elegance, but it wasn't as fast. (A Quadra700 running Photoshop was not nearly as fast as TV-Paint with the same processor on a Retina card in an Amiga 3000). I always saw the design magazines with pages and pages of Mac produced design. Every once in awhile you would see something made on an Amiga. I later learned about the difference that a consistent interface to applications would make. Photoshop is probably the best paint program (software) I've ever used.
I have such a soft spot for the Amiga though... I still have a ton of Amiga hardware. Most of it is in 24 bit video hardware. But I also have learned to harness the power of the Mac's PowerPC chip. Probably not a day goes by that I wonder what Commmodore could have done had it been a "real" computer company, and not a "company that made widgets". (I believe that's a quote from a former Commodore employee like Dale Luck so someone)
Sigh... I'm pretty close to buying an Amiga developer kit. Perhaps I'll get past "hello world" in my "C" book.
Scott Thomas
a broadcast designer in Southwest Florida
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
After reading a few of the marktoid blurbs on the new amiga envoirment, it sounds like amiga is reinventing the java wheel. I mean where have we seen 'write once, run anywhere' before? Also the idea of a singal compatiable abi across several different envoirments/chip archetecures seems again just like java. The final thing is how its being pushed, as an envoirment that scales from cell phones to super computer, java marketing spin again. What Amiga hasnt talked about is how they are going to fix the short comings of java. Well not licenseing the abi will fix one, like it or not if sun controlled all jvm's then we know the code would work on all systems. The next major pitfall of java is performance. Even with the best jvm compairing speed performance and stress testing isnt in the same leage as C or C++ compiled to a native binary. Now on super computer you might have cycles to waste on a emulation envoirment, but how many extra cycles do you think your cell phone will have. THere is one other amiga option which is you compile a seperate binary for each supported platform, then the binary loader picks its correct code. This sounds insane, but your makeing the trade off of size complexity for speed complexity, as big drives and ram prices fall, this trade off might be worth it to sustain run time performance. Really I would like to see amiga take off. Actually I would like to see several OS's develop and used by the general public, M$ is slow, fat and stupid ( which is no way to go through life) and I think some of these other os developers are a bit more hungry and willing to put in the effort to develop the best possible envoirment. Before I can get behind Amiga (again), I want to see a clear plan of the future, I want to know how they plan to solve real world problems, before the marketoids get behind a project the engineers have to sign off on it first. Amiga needs to stop putting out market buzz and start talking about cold hard facts, problems and solutions so us engineers can hold them up and say "Look these guys have something, and you marketoid morons should take a look"
Talk about throwing a bucket of ice water on people hot to do something really interesting with the SDK! That and the fact that the Elate OS stuff is heavily patent-encumbered (I wonder if the guy who developed/patented the VM ever heard of UCSD p-code) leave a bad taste in my mouth.
Oh well, it is interesting to look at until the next SDK from someone completely different is released with a more developer-friendly attitude (and license!). Fortunately, it didn't cost too much, so I don't feel cheated. I'll get my $80 out of it at some point.
Note- yes, I realize that there is a license on their web site that does not contain the royalty requirements. However, that license is not properly written to supercede the one on the disk. First, it does not reference any particular product (the "product listed above" is not listed at all). Second, the original license says that the royalty requirements may change and those changes are to be found at http://www.amigadev.net/royalties, which does not exist. Thus, I don't see, legally, how the royalty requirement has been dispensed with (properly). It doesn't matter if they claim that they won't sue for royalties; as long as the legal loophole exists, developers are at risk.
I wonder how many of the other 14,999 developers are feeling the same way. Further, I also am curious how many of them don't realize that they are at risk of being sued for said royalties, if "Amiga" decides to be nasty about it.
-SS "Teach the ignorant, care for the dumb, and punish the stupid."
"divx on linux using a win dll : what the hell of genius is that ?"
Divx is a hack of a Microsoft codec. As the Divx people don't really know how it all works themselves and couldn't write it from scratch if their lives depended upon it, every Divx codec on every platform requires the original Microsoft files to do all the real work. (Well, unless there's another one I don't know about.) That Microsoft hasn't shut down all of Divx by now is a mystery to me.
--
The old Amiga program TVPaint by NewTek has been ported to Windows a few years ago. It has a nice DeluxePaint-like look and feel, but also powerful features such as support for pressure-sensitive tablets, alpha-blended layers, animations etc. Newtek later changed the name of the program to Aura.
"We mustn't be caught by surprise by our own advancing technology" -- Aldous Huxley
P-code was cool. It was an instruction set that was compiled straight from Pascal code. I remember the Apple II had a special Pascal OS complete with interpreter and its own disk format. One of the interesting things was that the instructions 00-7F were all "throw value onto stack" because the system was very stack based. it basically let you embed ascii strings in the code. You could recognize a Pascal OS program because it would fill the screen with inverse '@'s as it was booting. I must be old, because I actually remember that...
The new Amiga is not really a hardware platform although a third-party company will be producing a hardware machine using standard components. It is instead very similar to Microsoft's .NET plans. Code is compiled to a virtual processor. The VP code is compiled at run-time. Amiga also support asymmetrical multiprocessing and can support parallel processing. It has a Sun-certified Java that benches as the fastest in the industry. Although it will run as an entire OS, on desktop systems, it will merely be hosted, at least initially. It is currently hosted on Linux with Windows hosting coming out this month. It supports 12 different processors. The new Amiga focuses on reusable code. For instance, generating a program to fly through a fractal landscape takes about a hundred lines using their current libraries. They are focusing now on Matrox G400 support as a demo of what gaming can be on the Amiga. Doom was ported in 15 minutes, Quake in about 2 hours. Executable speed of these games was very comparable to the original.
.NET may be worthwhile for many but not all apps. Let's not kick something new until we've seen more.
One of the greatest weaknesses in the package is that it's debugger is not nearly as good as M$ and it doesn't have incremental compile/link. But Linux folk have some acquaintance with that already.
I'd also like to point out that this approach could work very well with code-morphing processors like the Transmeta. Some concepts are similar. Imagine a Transmeta processor or even a version of AMD's RISC engine running native mode.
Maybe some of you should read the specs before you fire off comments about antique hardware. A Linux form of
while it maybe true that the Prowler is in high demand because of it nostaglic *look*, it is a completely modern car, which *is* compatable all unleaded gasoline and is easly serviced by a massive infrastructure. Amiga will only succed if it can leaverage the huge installed base of pc's out there. otherwise it will be just a cool toy, like the BeBox. :-)
-----
please don't feed the monkey
Settlers runs perfectly on a 1MB 7MHz amiga 500, although some of the sounds are disabled because the large maps take up a great deal of RAM.
You really think I meant Lightwave *itself* is gone? That's just plain dumb of you. Of course I meant in regards to Amiga OS.
:_)
Newtek no longer actively supports their new products on AMiga. Is that clear ENOUGH for you? Deal with it.
I was at NAB the last few years. Newtek has the best booth doughnuts.
That's true from the point of view of non-Amiga users, who have been following the press releases in the news over the last few years. But to people who have been using Amigas, the brand name still connotes a lot of very positive things (along with a lot of the bitterness that you just described too, though).
I think the reason they kept the name is that
- The still existing Amiga users have been looking for a new platform that is as good as the Amiga. There are varying opinions, of course, but many of them had still not found anything satisfactory up through 1999.
- This new project wants developers. This is one of the most important things for a new platform.
Just put one and one together. By keeping the old trademark, they attracted a number of former Amiga people. I don't have any numbers to back up the following wild speculation, but: I bet there are a shitload more people using the Amiga SDK than ever used Tao up through last year.---
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
An interesting thing is, UCSD Pascal was slow on the Apple II, but that was long and long ago. It would probably be quite fast now. OTOH, it was a vanilla Pascal (nearly), and didn't have many of the features that are now assumed, e.g., objects, freedom from pointers, etc. And it was limited in the amount of memory it could address (64KB as I recall). And it worked with 16 bit integers. etc.
There is probably a large range of problems that it would be a very good solution for. But it probably isn't worth redesigning into a modern system. By the time you got done, you'ld have an interpreted Delphi, which would be as slow as Java.
Still, I keep thinking that one should be able to fork off multiple independant processes, each running their own p-code machine, and communication by ? files ? environment variables ? I think that if such a system were put together, and code were designed to run on it, that it might be as good as any current system. But the program design would need to be quite different. A few changes to the p-code system would be needed (for synchros, OS calls, etc.). The amount of work involved is probably too great to justify the effort, but it is a way that things could have gone, if CPUs had gotten cheap faster than RAM did. And it would be more naturally parallizable.
Caution: Now approaching the (technological) singularity.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Fransico Franco is STILL dead!
More news as the story develops!
Sheesh people.... let it go... the dead horse you're flogging is begging for mercy.....
=tkk
Bill Gates - Creationist?!?
>>And yes, I could ignore Amiga news, but it's just so much fun to rile you guys up!
:) Every once in awhile we need a jolt to remind ourselves what got us here.
Well, no harm done I suppose.
Actually, what I saw in the Amiga, wasn't so much the GUI. It was the elegance of how it all fit together. I felt comfortable digging into the thing. The Mac has a similar elegance, but it seems a bit distant. I still prefer that than troubleshooting Windows 96/98 based machines. I can do it, it's just a high level of frustration.
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
Maybe you should visit my homepage.
> Amiga: the cockroach of operating systems...
:-) 30 year old technology that just won't die :-)
:)
Nah, that would be *nix.
(Not that there is anything significantly better, but BeOS sure comes darn close
--
For all you moderators on crack, I even put EMOTICONS on the end, so don't take it seriously.
Trashcan lid banged in Dale Luck's garage. Where's my Halloween candy?
"It's overkill, of course. But you can never have too much overkill." - Anonymous Slashdot Coward
A JVM isn't an operating system, but an operating system running native on a picoJava is.
Windows is an operating system, but I wouldn't consider WINE to be an OS.
Jay Miner, the "Father of the Amiga" designed the Amiga's three custom co-processor chips. (Agnes, Denise and Paula)... He also designed the custom chips in the Atari 800.
One is 1978-79 vintage... the other is 1984-85.
I actually met Mr. Miner at an AmiExpo. He was a very nice (and brilliant) man who until the time of his death in 1994, ran a BBS and actually answered his mail.
To compare the Amiga to the Atari 800 in some way is a complement
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
The last time I checked the definition of an operating system, it interfaced between the hardware and the software on the machine. Unless AmigaOS somehow usurps the underlying OS (by needing to be run as root, or whatever, in which case why not make it an independant OS?), can we really call it an operating system?
And yes, I am one of those guys that's pedantic about terms :) Hacker = cracker, web = internet, Red Hat version = Linux version etc are all mistakes that came into being because people weren't quite strict enough...
I hear complaints about cost, noone seems to care that the longevity of some of these systems can make Amigas effectively cheaper!
Also, noone seems to recognize how absolutely wonderful these keyboards are! As is having SCSI as the main harddrive interface (shame the harddrives don't cost less though).
Oh, and does anyone else find the PC IRQ problem to be ridiculous? As an Amigan I enjoy having all cards on one IRQ and a pretty nice AutoConfig(TM) setup. Speaking of cool trademarks, Intuition is a cool name for a GUI system!
Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
Sometimes I feel life I've been through more Amiga revivals than Macintosh miracle recoveries :-)
I used to be an Amiga Games Developer until the $$$ on the Sega Megadrive lured me away.
So now I'm just a "Hardware Prostitute" (whatever platform runs the fastest and pays the most money/egoboo to it's developers is where you'll see me.)
That is to say, I'm currently writing graphics apps on BeOS with a 14-month old 600 MHz Intel PIII -- I won't jump in with yet another OS company just because they use the name "Amiga" - But I'll come running back if they have a hardware/software combo thats nicer than what I've got now.
-ShunScene
(ring 0900-SYKIC-4-YOU for my EMail address.)
It was a simple 2-d image being stamped around the screen to make it bounce (bouncy sound included) around a blue area with a grid that came towards the screen on the bottom. The rotation was merely a palette color shift, which did the job well...
Another Amiga logo was the "Amiga checkmark" which was a stylized check that phased color from the top, to the bottom, and half-way back up to the end. I looks pretty nice as a 3-D rendered object I know. :-)
Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
http://www.blitzbasic.com/
http://www.blitzbasic.com/
Graphics3D 640, 480
FYI, The Java virtual machine, running on Elate, running on Linux, is STILL 2-7 times as fast as EVERY other Java virtual machine in existence, and that's a fact.
If you don't beleive me, research it for yourself.
Where is all these new amiga machines? They are selling a dev workstation, which is an amd k6. I owned an amiga 500, my first pc, and I loved it dearly, I was never able to afford a hard drive at the time because it cost 500 bucks for a 20 meg drive. But with my 24bps modem a floppy and a list of npd sites... What the amiga could've been if it didn't just die overnite. World wouldda been a different place. To think of it, its still in a cardboard box laying around somewhere ridden with the saddam virii.
Sorry folks, but I've been using QNX every day for the last three years so your "efficiency" bullshit just doesn't fly with me. It still annoys me that Amiga dumped QNX in favor of kowtowing to the Linux crowd.
FYI, Tao's JVM also runs in QNX which runs on multiple CPU's. And as for developers:
Amiga: 15,000
QNX: 300,000
What is so important about the Amiga? Really - someone explain to me the need to keep the Amiga alive.
You can get an Intel based peecee for $600 that will blow it's doors off and run orders of magnitude more software & apps. What a waste of development time.
Even casual involvement excludes total freedom by it's inherent nature. John Valby
Wow, you must have them all listed in that news "blurb". Can we have the Reader's Digest version next time, please?
If you aren't...Wy then make any comments about it..??
Sure, everything they shipped was cheap as in quality but not cheap as in price tag.
The cheaply made Amiga's were competitively priced, but the higher end models (A2000, A3000) weren't built too shabbily. The C64 made people expect low priced machine with lots of versatility, and the quality of everyone's low-end machines reflected that. Even today, cheap PC's abound, and are built to not last.
"It's overkill, of course. But you can never have too much overkill." - Anonymous Slashdot Coward
My friend's amiga 1000 had games that made my moth drop open. With most people stuck in CGA and EGA world, the graphics on the machine would blow ones mind. Add to that a windowing environment that beat everything up to about Win95 and OS7. Multitasking! On a PC! An OS for which the GUI and CLI made sense together.
Back then, PC operating systems were a joke compared to the amiga. If amiga had business apps back then, the choice would have been clear.
A comeback seems absurd today, but I remember that in grade school the amiga was a miracle. Who knows?
Yeah, I read that page before I posted the comment.
I guess I may be dense so, if you don't mind, please direct me to the section of the online license agreement you linked to where it identifies the license as APPLICABLE to the SDK I purchased.
If it doesn't explicitly refer to the particular product it applies to, then the original license CAN hold up in court.
In the meantime, I have been advised to take the matter up with Amiga directly and have them clarify the issue, since nothing I have seen here or on their web site adequately addresses the issue.
Thus, my comment still stands.
-SS "Teach the ignorant, care for the dumb, and punish the stupid."
Geez, upon first glance I see "Foundation Series" -- and what am I supposed to think?? Of course I think of the great SF novels by Asimov. Wow.. How could such a grand universe be represented in a computer game... what would gameplay be like.. what characters would there be.. what would the story be.. endless questions. My mind starts to run crazy with ideas. I get excited, click on the link, and what do I find??? A game that has nothing to do at all with the Foundation books. It's a strategy game that has nothing to do with it at all. Disappointment rushes over me..
Oh well. Maybe some uber game designer saw it and had the same thoughts as I did, and they'll create a game.
One can only hope. But don't get my hopes up next time, you evil bastards!!! You are evil! Pure evil!
Fear my low SlashID! (bidding starts at $500)
Do not anger the worm.
I feel they would be best advised to play down the Amiga name and invent a new one. Something that hasn't left a ten year trail of shit behind it.
thats a big post. like, so big i'm not even going to bother reading it. i'm just going to assume that that the 15 guys who are developing amiga stuff are making a LOT of noise.
*Bought* the SDK? Jeez, even MS gives away its headers, libraries and extensive API docs...
Like the BeOS group, apparently these Amigans are still under the impression that people will pay for a non-Microsoft OS + dev tools. Hah!
Dan
I emailed Amiga developer support a few days ago to ask how in the world they were charging $100 for the SDK. I was answered that they need serious developer.. and that serious developer won't be scared to spend $100 knowing it's worthy. I was told that if they released the SDK for free it could have attracted a million peopole but not serious developers. Nice smack in the face of the old Amiga community. What's wrong in having a million people playing around with an SDK ? Also.. do they think those 15,000 serious developer were going to lose interest in the SDK because it's free ?
Well sorry if I'm not a developer serious enough to give 100 bucks away just to play around with something and find out if it's useful or not.
Amiga doesn't exist anymore.. it's a name of an hardware and software that used revolutionary.. if another revolution has to happen it wont be because of a name.
He hasn't read the article and he doesn't know a shit about the *new* Amiga...
He is talking about the *old* Amiga which is a completly different thing. The only thing they have in common is the name and the spirit.
My other account has a 3-digit UID.
A lot of things are easier than bringing the Amiga back. Either you didn't grow up using one or you didn't like it to begin with. That's fine. The Amiga isn't everyone's cup of tea. What it did have, back in it's heyday, was an incredible amount of power and flexibility. From it's lowly CLI, I learned the basics of a command line interface. It's windowing interface gave me the basics to run the Mac and Windows systems I use today. I am not a classic "hacker"... but I do score points when I have to work on the video still-store system we have that runs on a i486. I had to figure out a hack the previous IT guy did to make it hook up to our network. I feel that if I didn't have the Amiga experience 12 years ago, I wouldn't feel comfortable to hack things if I had only a Mac or Windows GUI background.
The platform tought me more than I can ever give back to it!!!!
copy flame.txt >NULL:
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
They're trying to dig up Mussolini and promising he's going to run for office again - REAL SOON NOW!-tm
Idiot. [...] You can't flog an unborn horse.
No, but you can make fun of the nth product announcement from a company (how many different savior companies has Amiga had now???) that has yet to produce any actual product.
Diakatana has a better deilvery record than Amiga at this point.
The amiga files! My favorite is:
Amiga is Back? Contributed by CmdrTaco on Friday January 30, @09:05AM
from the guru-meditation-error dept.
This link was sent to us by alert reader David Hill. Amiga Inc has announced that they will be making 68k and PPC Amiga's. There will also be clones and licensing of the AmigaOS
The Amiga search list is a continuing series of "ressurection", "Next incarnation" and "new rebirth" stories.
All I'm saying is, "Donkey's live a long time."
=tkk
Bill Gates - Creationist?!?
While this may seem like an original phenomenon, I draw your attention to the aging baby boomers and the success they have created for the Prowler. Nostalgia is nothing new. Computers, however, are, relatively. As the first wave of us who grew up programming games and such and measuring application sizes in KBs age, we happily return to our earlier and more fond experiences with computers that were fun and just plain Worked. Amiga is an example of technological nostalgia to come about more often in the near future.
Regards
It's the feminine form for Amigo.
Amigo means 'cat with pointed ears.'
It hurts the "root for the underdog" part of me, but Amiga has no momentum, and the best thing you can do with one is install Linux on it.
Well, OK, I'm overstating things a bit -- it's a viable platform for people who won't budge off it. However I don't see any NEW people moving onto it, Lightwave is gone, and most of the specialized, creative applications have since moved onto NT.
What I *really* wish Amiga had done was manufacture PowerPC-based boxes that could easily be refitted with Linux. Nothing against Apple, but I just want CHEAP POWERPC motherboards. My x86 boxes are so hot, and noisy, that I'm tempted to wear headphones in this room, and I hate headphones. I think Amiga could have made a much better run in the Linux workstation market than say SGI...
On the offchance that this gets moderated up, I'd like to THANK MOTOROLA for the lack of off the shelf PowerPC motherboards. Motorola pushes embedded Linux on [gasp!] Intel processors, their server line is Intel-based, and and you can't buy off the shelf PowerPC motherboards.
What corporate vision. They seem about as efficent as General Motors.
*sigh* Maybe my raise will allow me to get one of those G4 Cubes without wincing. They would make sweet Linux boxes.
Just a bit of history, for all the people that didn't grow up on the apple (computer):
The Apple ][, ][+,
The Apple ][ (orginal),
Woz says:
The only way to get the mini-assembler on the Apple ][+,
The enhanced
i.e.
You can see the source for the mini-assembler here.
An interesting read of the Apple (computer) history can be read here.
Hmm, yesterday there was an article about someone working on games that boot off the CDROM, and today news about the Amiga. What a coincidence...
He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. -Friedrich Nietzsche
And you'll all pay...yes, each and every one of you will PAY!
--Giving to trolls for the benefit of us all
Today's vices may be tomorrow's virtues.
>> Sorry, there are losers in any industry, and Amiga is gone. It's your problem if you can't let go of the past. The rest of us have work to do.<<
Well, you are probably right. In 1996 I finally broke down and bought a Mac clone. In the two years after Commodore's collapse, I was using a PowerMac 8100/80 at work. I had to move on to keep going in my chosen field of design. Yes, Commodore really Fsked up the Amiga, but I still keep a little hope that someone will bring it back. There are a lot of concepts that are still lost on the Windows, Mac and Linux communities that were the forefront of the Amiga. BeOS seems to be the closest. I just haven't had the time to download BeOs 5 to check it out.
Is the campaign to bring the Amiga back really keeping you from what's important to you? If not, just let it go and let those that feel that it is important, work to bring it back to it's former glory. You know, it is possible that you can just ignore the Amiga news and go on with your life... can't you?
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
Wow ! 15000 England Units is the same that 150000 USA Units. Sure it's beacuse of the inflation in USA.
Or perhaps "." in England means ",0" in USA ?
--- End Ironic ---
In many countries the "." and "," are interchanged to express numbers and currency. Also the time formats and hour format are different.
MOD THE CHILD UP!
beowolf a dead amiga?
to bad sony is pounding them silly for games
and so is apple.
so is microshaft.
AMIGA = EFFICIENCY
:)
Simple as that. I have an Amiga and a PC. The PC has twice the processing power, the Amiga is twice as fast.
When I use a PC I sit and get annoyed at how slow Windoze is, how bloated and buggy.
When the new Amiga finally comes to use standard PC hardware and gets the same processing power as the PC has now, you won't see it for dust.
It's gonna FLY !
Nobody cares about Matt's 'articles' on the Drudge Report. The only thing on his page with any credibility are links to other sites. Get real.
You're embarassing us, guy.
You are right in that Amiga Inc. has handled this badly. For starters, the new agreement is not at the URL the SDK docs say it should be at. And there are no dates on the agreements.
.- -.. .. --- -....- .- -.- - .. ...- .. - .-.- - ...-.-
<IANAL>The new agreement only refers to "the software product", but that should apply to the SDK, since that's the only software product Amiga Inc. delivers so far. When there are two agreements and it's unclear which one supercedes the other (though I think it's obvious that the one on the website is always the newer) I think you can take your pick as to which one you'd like to follow.</IANAL>
If you write them, please tell them to put the new agreement up at the URL printed in the docs.
Anyways, the licence agreement delivered with the SDK is obsolete and invalid and people should stop moaning about non-existing licensing fees. It just unnecessarily upsets slashdotters and other similarly ignorant FUD-susceptible hordes.
.-.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
They're trying to dig up Mussolini and promising he's going to run for office again - REAL SOON NOW!-tm
:)
.- -.. .. --- -....- .- -.- - .. ...- .. - .-.- - ...-.-
Once again, that would imply a re-launch of an old productline. This is has nothing to do with a rotten corpse, it's more like: "We have dug up Mussolinis corpse, cultivated germ cells with DNA from the corpse and spliced it with DNA from Hitler and Stalin to build the greatest dictator the Earth has ever seen, complete with an added 5 kg of gold ornaments to a new version of the black Italian uniforms you've kept in such a fond memory!".
No, but you can make fun of the nth product announcement from a company (how many different savior companies has Amiga had now???) that has yet to produce any actual product.
The SDK is an actual product. Furthermore, it was released just 9 (8?) months after McEwen's/Moss' buyout of Amiga Inc. from Gate$-way. The only product that has been announced from this company is the SDK (which you can buy now), they have also mentioned that they will produce a computer with the code name "Amiga One" but have NOT announced any details simply because they don't want to follow the tradition of earlier companies which we all have mocked. Things are happening now. For the first time since before Jay Miner et al sold Amiga to Commodore, the name Amiga seems to be in the hands of people who care for the technology.
Amiga is Back? Contributed by CmdrTaco on Friday January 30, @09:05AM
Jan. 30, 1998! Back then Gate$-way sat on the Amiga patents. As we all know by now, the efforts of the people Gateway assigned/hired for the Amiga project went down the drain when Gate$-way pulled the plug on everything and hoped this would finally kill any hopes for a new Amiga. It didn't .
.-.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
I can't help but notice that Mario 64 is on the list of games being ported... seems very unusual to me since Miyamoto has gone on record saying he doesn't want to port to other platforms. Yet the very promise of being able to play these games on any platform would seem to totally contradict that.
Also, would this mean that Nintendo is going to be using the Amiga platform? a common complain by developers of the n64 was that is was very hard to develop for... is this the answer?