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Europeans in Western China, 1200 B.C.
beijing_coder writes: "Caucasian-looking mummies have been discovered in the deserts in Western China since late 1800s. Now DNA tests showed they "belonged to the same genetic lineage as most modern-day Swedes, Finns, Tuscans...". I'd like to add that although the mummies were found in what's Western China today, in recorded history (after the mummies' time) that region were inhabited mostly by nomadic people, not Chinese."
Also, if these have been turning up since the 1800s, is there a major archaeological relevance to that area? What was there at the time, anyone know?
You thought that this sig was what you think that I thought you wanted me to think. I think.
AFAIK, the Finns and Swedes are not at all related. They just happen to have turned out neighbors. Linguistically, at least, the Finn's language is not at all related to any other European language. The exact orgins of the Finn's was, at least as I can remember, unknown.
On the subject of the Finnish...our favorite Finn is actually of the Swedish ethnicity, and just happened to be living in Finland.
Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
Yes, there are (Indo-) Europeans in Western China right now. They're called Uighurs and they've been there forever so far as I know.
"Reactionaries must be deprived of the right to voice their opinions; only the people have that right." - Mao
More simply put, is your poster at all sure about the direction of the migration?
The 12th century European mummies have their own Linux community.
"Reactionaries must be deprived of the right to voice their opinions; only the people have that right." - Mao
I guess the DNA study is a recent development. P revious researchers think they may have been related to the Celts. The Weegas (God knows how many English spelling variations ther are) probably have some ancestry from these peoples. Some of them have blue eyes, which can be seen in other shows about Western China. They do share some cultural characteristics with the mummies. Over time the caucasoid gene pool was replaced by the mongoloid gene pool.
Check out PBS 1998 Nova's Mysterious Mummies of China and for 1999 the Discovery Channel's Riddle of the Desert Mummies
Why oh why is it that all the cool stuff about the history of mankind... er ah humanity is in countries that aren't friendly to America? China, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, etc.
If you think the international politics are bad. Just check out our very own domestic Graves Act. It allowed aboriginal Americans to claim the 9,000 year old bones of the Kennewick Man as their direct ancestor. Nova also covered this issue with Mystery of the First Americans. His genes show that he's most closely related to the Ainu.
The peopling of the Earth is a contentious issue and probably will be until all our genes are thoroughly mixed and we become a uniform gray with no outward sexual differentiation.
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
He suspected that the Chinese had encountered Westerners from Europe long before the emperor Wudi dreamed up his military alliance. Several early Chinese books, for example, described tall men with green eyes and red hair that resembled the fur of rhesus monkeys.
Maybe they were monkey men.
Promote proofreading. Don't mod up sloppy posts.
I believe that Europeans have created a global settlements many times before and each time there has been a fall. Ancient remains of Europeans have been found on every continent long before "modern" Europeans were supposed to have been there. Kenewick man in America, the Anu in Japan, remains in ancient China and Seti's mummy seems to be red head. Ultimately what does it mean? It could mean periodic cometary impacts, catastrophic changes in climate, super volcano's, shifts in the earths magnetic field, liberal socialist philosophy, who knows. :-)
It may ultimately mean that stone will last longer than civilization.
Homo Sap began leaving Africa while the last Ice Age was in progress and North Africa through Arabia was verdant grasslands.
The first to leave spread east through India on to China.
The glaciers retreated and later leavers of Africa could find new land to the north and follow the glacial retreat into Europe and Siberia. Genetic studies show something like 13 men and 6 women fostered all of Europe. Maybe they didn't like speaking Arabic ;)
15,000 years after that, Egyptians built the first pyramid.
We know so little about this subject to date that speculative revisions can be made almost yearly such is the rate of discovery.
as far as i know finnish is distantly related to estonian and hungarian. i believe that estonians, finns and hungarians are originaly from same area in asia, later they migrated into europe as slavic and germanic tribes did before them.
-- http://electronicintifada.net --
Where's the story in the first place?
How old are these mummies anyway? 1000 years? 2000?
does this mean that I have the right to go and yell 'All your base are belong to us' to the Chinese now?
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
i believe that east turkestan was independent state for some time before china occupied it in 50-ies. i read recently somewhere that they are still fighting for their independence from china
-- http://electronicintifada.net --
The post says something about Finns,Swedes,and Tuscans. Are Tuscans Norwegian(related to Scandanavia then) or... ? I don't think I've ever heard that word before.
The link takes me to a story about a ban on pesticides in canada and the history of lawns in the US.
What gives?
Can anyone give me the correct link to this story? And no this isnt redundant no one pointed it out as of yet.
I do however think that this story has more to do with geeks then anyone pertaning to mummys...
Does anyone know the other chemical used in conjection with 2,4d for agent orange?
In my area they use these pesticides and after that article I think I am going to talk to the mayor of my city about getting them banned.
Anyone else think its a good idea to ban this crap?
The Lottery:
"Not my manner of thinking but the manner of thinking of others has been the source of my unhappiness." - M
"Think about french speaking Canadians. They aren't really French but just as Canadian as english speaking Canadians."
Say that is a French Canadian, and they're likely to punch you.
Recently, Secretary of the Interior Bruce Babbit cheerily agreed to let five American Indian tribes have the remains of the Kennewick Man, so they can bury these remains in a proper Indian ritual. The problem is that the Kennewick Man was probably a white guy and not an Indian. His skull isn't an Indian skull at all, but is the kind of skull that white people have. Why's that a problem? Because he was hanging around in America 9,000 years ago; long before any evil white people were supposed to have been here. The remains were found near the Columbia River in Washington state, and apparently there weren't even any Indians around there until about 3,000 years ago. The Kennewick Man is one of those inconvenient things that pop up every so often that cuts the legs out from various PC dogmatic truths. Suddenly, the Indians who have been claiming a moral high ground because "they were here first," have a rival. And, the rival may have been a white guy! "Oh, no, please don't let him have been a white guy," seems to have been the cry from the white haters in our nation. "Hurry and bury him, so the Indians can retain their moral high ground." So, although scientists want to do more testing on the remains to prove the Kennewick Man's genetic origin, the white haters won't allow it. An interesting thing about the Kennewick Man is that the reconstruction of his head, done from his skull, bears a striking resemblance to the actor Patrick Stewart who plays Capt. Piccard of the Starship Enterprise. In fact, the resemblance is so close that one is hard pressed to tell one from the other. Perhaps we need to look at Stewart's family tree to see if any of his ancestors disappeared from Europe while on a boat trip about 9,000 years ago, and maybe the remains should be given to Stewart to bury in Europe in a proper pre-Christian European ritual... http://www.newnation.org/NNN-kennewick-man.html
The link in the story seems to be a link to a pesticide discussion?
Has anyone got a relevant URL?
Your link is broken. Now points to another story.
Besides, where have you geeks been. There have been major stories about these mummies for the past 4-5 years, at least.
Finally, these mummies are most likely Indo-Europeans; they don't have any relation to Finns or Tuscans (assuming current theories that Tuscan was not an Indo-European language). Studies of the written language of these people, Tocharian, suggest their language was Western, rather than Eastern (ie, not Indo-Iranian) and thus more closely related to the Germanic and Celtic languages.
Their plaid wool garments are suggestive of Celtic patterns.
The "pointy" hats worn by some of these mummies is not unlike the old witches hat or wizards hat of European folk lore, and was also similar to hats worn by certain Saka or Scythian tribes that once lived in Iran.
Finally, it has long been known that ancient Chinese texts speak of interacting with whites, and that the horse tribes of central asia were "aryan" - Indo-European speaking whites. These aryan horse tribes were once common on the borders of China until pushed back by Turkic and Mongolian horse tribes, slowly over a period of a thousand years, starting perhaps with the Huns and ending with the Mongols.
It's amazing that most people do not know this, but such are the wages of modern liberal education, political correctness, and the like.
Caucasians are from the Caucasus Mountains in Russia. That region is the origin of white people. In northern Iran there are people who are whiter than anyone you commonly see in Europe or the U.S.
Since they come from southern Asia, it is not surprising that Caucasians can be found in many places in Asia.
Map of the Caucasus
Bush's education improvements were
Working link to mummy article
The article is here.
Or search for mummy on the site.
You can find the article in the archive: the new link
That PBS already has done a couple of documentaries
on this.
It is hard enough to "classify" modern people
based on bone structure, genetic markers,
physical features (if you have flesh).
Bones from ten thousand years ago are even harder.
K-man doesn't realy fit into any modern categories
acoording many researchers (see PBS special).
This has already been exposed as bollocks. Do some research before you uncritically post crap like this!
10 We'll want that land back now.
9 no, we don't
8 yes, we do
7 etc
6 [you
5 fill
4 in
3 these]
2
1 All your ancestors are belong to us.
--
Liberty uber alles.
All kinds of neat things, photos, etc, and you can probably order the video too.
The original story linked above looks like the human interest story of the archeologist and the political interests in China made it relevant as a story, as far as the newspaper editors were concerned.
I can see the Chinese government trying to deal with politically inconvenient truths.
Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
When a fly lands on the ceiling, does it do a half roll or a half loop?
.oO0Oo.
Last I read they caught the ceiling with their front legs and were then pivoted onto their other four feet.
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Finnish and Estonian are similar enough that people can understand each other just fine. However, about 200 words have a slightly divergeant meaning, which sometimes leads to funny misunderstandings. The level of similarity between the two languages is about the same as between, say, Spanish and Portuguese. In between Finnish and Estonian, there is Karelian, which is still spoken in Eastern Finland and, to a lesser extent, in Northern Russia's Karelian republic.
Hungarian and other languages of central Russia, such as Mordavian and Komi, are distant cousins of those Baltic languages. In each case, about 200 words have retained the same pronounciation and meaning e.g. body parts, harvesting equipment, hunting parlance, etc. but that's all the affiliation that remains with the Baltic branch.
Genetically, Finns and Karelians are related to Germanic and Russian branches. However, Samer (i.e. Lapland natives) have a genetic heritage that ressembles that of central Russia, near the Perm area, and the language is associated with Finnish (not that many Finns can understand Lappish, however!).
Software is not supposed to be about how to work around a useability issue. - Ken Barber
There were a number of lerge migrant populations in western china at the time. Over the next 2000 years, they migrated west across the countries of Russia, and eventually sacked Rome. At that time they were collectively called the Hunns. According to most accounts, they had a vary materialistic culture, but also a vary open one, accepting of anyone willing to travel with them. This was the primary reason their population grew so large and their armies were vast enough when approaching Rome.
--
--Got Lists? | Top 95 Star Wars Line
Many (most?) U.S. High schools require two years of a foreign language. (High school is roughly 14-18 here, grades 9-12. I think our grades are off by one from most European counts.).
Frequently junior high schools (grades 7-8, but that varies; there are 6-8 and 7-9, and they're sometimes called "middle schools") have spanish and maybe french or german. Two years there tends to replace one year of high school.
Our colleges frequently have a language requirement as well, with college years equating (roughly) two high school years. Four years of high school language will meet most college requirements. Often individual departments (e.g., math) will have a written language test if foreign language research is still relevant (so at my undergraduate, if I had finished the math major instead of taking a pair of minors (philosophy), I would have had to shown that I could translate a page from a german or russian (or french?) math text or article into english (with use of a dictionary). In physics or economics, everything importantis either written in English in the first place, or immediately trnaslated, so there is no similari requirement).
Our requirements are closer in purpose to your third language in sixth grade than the english in third. You're not learnning english to learn about british or american culture or literature, but because it's the universal language. We already happen to speak it; if another language had that role, I assume that we'd be trained in it early on.
Then to get things really wierd, there's an english group pushing to have british rather than american english taught as a foreign language, which completely misses the point--american english isn't the norm because it's spoken in the U.S., but because it's the dialect spoken by everyone else.
hawk
It's easy to forget that the western tip of China is about halfway between Athens and Beijing.
Oh John!
Oh Marcia!
Oh John!!
Oh Marcia!!
Oh shit....
Muslim community leaders warn of backlash from tomorrow morning's terrorist attack.
There's nothing new in any of this, Indo-Europeans known as Tocharians have long been known to have contact with the Chinese. Some Chinese words such as the Chinese word for dog, were originally Tocharien sourced.
Its well known that Indo-Europeans originated from the Southern Russian Steppe/Central Asian regions. Tadjik, Pamir, Dari & Pashto are all Indo-European languages of Central Asia.
Other past Indo-European languages of that region include Sacian, Bactrian, Sogdian, Kwaresmian & of course Scythian. The Scythians ranged right across the steppe, from the Black Sea (where they traded & fought with the Greeks) all the way to Mongolia (where they traded & fought against the ancient Chinese).
Check this page
http://www.wlc.com/oxus/eyawtkat.htm
Read more about it in the June '94 issue of Discover magazine. There are many pages of content covering these discoveries. It was shortly after the development of the 'bit' that goes into horses mouths, enabling them to pull carts over thousands of miles. This technology spurred the Aryan invasions all over the world, including Turkey where they became known as the Hitites--the first known to have invented steel. And northern India, where they eventually intermarried. The northerners are still known as "Aryans" in the south, as the upper classes are sometimes referred to as "Aryans" in the noth, if I am not mistaken. Over two hundred such mummies were fund in a few sites by '94 (I think from '91 or '92?). Since there were accidental, it indicates that perhaps 100,000 may have actually there. The Aryan Empire was very similar to the Viking Empire. In fact, I think the Vikings were their direct ancestors. --Matthew
known since thousand years or more. the area is very close to iran and india. population explosions in the steppes take place periodically. a long time ago some people migrated for hereabouts to europe, mixed with the european aborigines (who were probably negroid seeing the cave paintings and grimaldi skeletons) and formed the ancestors of europeans (including vikings) and those of today. so they resemble some europeans of today.
Actually most of his data are from an article in the New York Times magazine from about 4 months ago. Pro-business yes, but hardly right wing or racist.
I think what he was arguing, however red-neckedly it may have come off is valid. The point was that "Native Americans" weren't really native - they migrated here too. Granted they were here prior to 1492, but so was Erik the Red (692 ad if I recall).
As for "continuity," since a caucasoid WAS here 9,000 BC, they either mingled with other migrants and effectively vanished, or were slaughtered by the "Native Americans." Don't forget that many of the Native American tribes were not hippie peace lovers. They engaged in genocide, slavery and other crimes, just as the Europeans who settled in the latter half of the last millenium.
A common attack on that argument is that "we" (meaning I can only assume liberal guilt soaked/immortal americans who've been there and done that) killed far more and drove them off thier land. Guess what? We were just more effective. Rifles do that, 100 to 1 odds in favour of the settlers do that, and history of large scale war (see Rome) developed logistics lets one do that.
As for me? I'd like Bill Mahr from Politically Incorrect to be President, or better yet, as the Supreme Court.
The important thing, above all else, is that red necked racists (whom the poster is not necessarily) and rich white liberal guilt stricken folk can both argue about it without suing each other. Hopefully it will last a few more years before thats not the case in the US.
funny word play:
aryan(arja)-> orja, a finnish word meaning "slave"
slavic -> slaavi = slave
Maybe we all think ourselves superior and the name of the opposing people is linked to slavery...
Of course, this could mean nothing(99% propable)
Another one: Sami, the finnish original people, give the land a name, which could come from the word "suomaa"(swampland), not very different the modern "suomi"(Finland)... after all, we have lots of swamps... hehheh...
--- Hajotkaa siihen, kapitalistit!
Race is a fiction. Knowing that someone is "caucasian looking" or whatever tells you very little about history. If you want to really get a historical understanding of large-scale movements and dominations and where breakthrough technologies came from and how they spread, you should look to linguistics (For instance, it's especially clear in Africa, where linguistic communities still overlap geographically sometimes more than they do technologically). But whoops, sorry, that's just a bunch of "soft" inferences, not a "hard" science like genetics.
Preferential Voting: easy as 1-2-3
A lot of history will need to be rewritten as stories like this and similar ones enter the mainstream. Right now evidence that doesn't confirm the status quo is mostly ignored.
Works by people like Michael Cremo prove that the human race goes back millions of years. One thing that is shown is that there was a civilization before ours and before our history and it is mostly gone now. Tools are found in million year old geological areas.
- James - [IMAGE]
millions of years? Nope, more like 300000 years, and the latest 75000 years without significant genetic differences... cromagnon and neanderthal guys died out. Actually, Cro-Magnon could have been a better species(bigger brain IIRC)... dunno why it disappeared. Neanderthals, on the other hand, were almost like us, but had some bone differences, but their imagination, especially artistic imagination, was much weaker. They had tools and "jewelry", but what I know of, it was all copied from rival tribes of Homo Sapiens. Also, they were a bit bigger and thus, child birth was more difficult... uhhuh, now I'm giving fourth hand "IIRC" info, but this is what I "know"...
--- Hajotkaa siihen, kapitalistit!
Caste system is what the Portuguese (sp?) thought Indian population was practicing.
South Asia had had systems to distinguish people. One was a system of Varna, which means color (so they say, but I haven't seen any usage of this word to mean color, btw). The system of Varna seems to have been around since the youngest part of the Rgveda was composed. However, it is less than certain that how strongly the system was observed (such as the movability in the system, which is quite difficult in so-called Caste system).
On the other hand, there is another Sanskrit word that may be considered to refer to the caste system---jati, which means birth. That system basically seems to have referred to ancestry, clan, family, hereditary occupation, etc. In practicie, this perhaps closer to the caste system.
However, the difficulty in talking about the caste system is that South Asia is vast! and with a long history. The practices is apparently different from region to region, time to time.
Horses do just fine, and the article commented on the authors expectation that they were related to the movements of the mummy's people. Euro-American invaders to Central and Western North America (:-) used horses and wagons to cross the place fairly rapidly, though later followers brought railroads. Herding cultures in the area drove cattle hundreds of miles, perhaps up to a thousand, just for market reasons, hauling them from grasslands to urban areas where they could be put on railroads. Railroads did simplify transportation of larger numbers of people, and simplified extermination of the buffalo that supported competing hunter-gatherer popoulations, which simplified expansion of the railroads and invasion of less-mobile crop-based populations, who resolved their differences with racially similar herder populations in much lower-intensity conflicts.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Korean is commonly classed as an 'altaic' language, related to turkish and finnish, as well as other languages in northern asia.
--
Life's a bitch but somebody's gotta do it.
Lots of Eurasian nations have common traces with what we consider "typical" European characteristics. And barely they are based in a later mix. In fact I found references of old ancient mongol tribes having blonde hair and blue eyes. Besides, Chingiz Khan was red-bearded.
On what concerns Aryans. As far as I could get from several sources, including the Rig-Veda, we europeans are their enemies. There is a very high probability that the large majority of us are descendants of those that were cursed several times in old texts.
I studied a little bit of mongol and some funny things about us and the Siberians.And this gave me the idea that we europeans didn go to China. We came from China. In hordes. And these hordes do not include indo-europeans per se. It includes a whole group of eurasians: indo-europeans, turkics and finno-hugurians. The history of Europe is an history of a people, for which the mongols are still linguistically very close, which broke away some 9000 years ago. Since then, they have been roaming the west for several times. The origin of this nation is somewhere between Manchuria/Mongolia, and ending in the Altai-Sayan moutainous ridges.
They had nothing to do except wander around the world littering, hunting, grunting, farting. They formed groups and occasionally ran into each other. If they didn't war, they traded women or whatever. That's it. They didn't dwell on the racial politics or nationalism we have today!
They didn't care who was going to be thought of as the superior race by idiots in the future like us! They didn't care if all their wanderings confused scientists today! Cavemen had more important things to think about!!
The article is basically about Victor Maier. Since I knew Victor Maier (I got my doctorate from his deparment, not in Cinology, but in Indology), I guess I have a little personal feeling.
First of all, as other posters have pointed out, the European looking mummies have long been known. Especially one mummy of blond, blue-eyed young woman discovered by Stein had attracted people's attention. (The article mentions the Beuaty of Loulan). There was a popular novel written about her in Japan. I think they made a movie out of the novel.
The point of the article is not as quite simple as Europeans in China. But it seems to relate to the Aryan homeland. (The article talks about this toward the end.)
Since the discovery of Sanskrit (from the Westerners point of view), the disciplines of comparative linguistics, historical linguistics were formed. They theorized that languages of Europe and India (South Asia) had common origin.
I am sure that every linguist you meet will say that linguistic families and races/ethnicity do not have anything to do with each other. But many people confuse, and I do not think scholars of the 19th century and the early 20th centuries were as cautious as today. As such, the search of aryan homeland has been heavily debated, and having been attracting interests.
One of very early theory was that Indo-European speaking people came from North Europe that includes Germany. I guess everyone knows the implication of this in the history of the 20th century, so I will not touch this.
As notionalists and revisionists in all countries are in rage these days, it is not surprizing that the theory that Indo-European speaking people came from India is becoming popular in India.
But I think currently popular theory among linguists is that they came from somewhere around Black Sea. The problem has been that there has been not much archaelogical evidence that suggests a large settlement or a civilization in that area. For this reason, I have been paying attention to the outcome of this expedition.
Anyhow, Victor Maier wants to suggest again that Indo-European came from currently German speaking region. I am sure that his intention is purely academic, but it does have a huge politidcal implication.
For one thing, I have trouble understanding the whole situation. Humans with European features (physically) have been living in Europe for.. much more than 10,000 years? And the beginnning of the spread of Indo-European languages is postulated somewhere like 7,000BC, IIRC. So, the use of the word ``European'' in the article is not only vague, but quite misleading, especially it talks about ``the homeland'' later in the article. Finding peoples who lived in Central Asia, and share ancestors, does not make them Europeans. As I am not familiar with the date when Europe was Indo-Europeanized, the date 2,800BC of the earliest mummies could also mean that they conquered Europe. Were the residents of Europe Europeans if they did not speak any of Indo-European languages? Or, they and Europeans might have shared common cultures, and the Tocharians who spoke an Indo-European language might have been the decendents of those mummy people, there is no guarantee that they also spoke Indo-European language. Are they still Euroepans?
I would certainly avoid entering the mine field which is Aryan homeland problem. But I am not an Indo-European speaking person.
I also a little trouble about the use of the word China in the article. Although the area (vast) has been part of People's Republic of China, I would call that area Central Asia. As it may be noticed, the inhabitants of the area do not very much look like what you think of the Chinese. The area had traditionally been considered outside China. The use of the word China in the article seems to carry some unneccesary connotation to the discussion. (The article does talk about independent movement in the area.)
Tuscan Raiders in China. Watch out for the bantha poodoo ;)
ASFIK, the Finns are the same group as Komi, which populate Russia's Urals (dated officially 700 years back to have a city). They came to the Urals from the Polar Ocian, presumably, from Siberia. If from Siberia, then they are one of the most acient nations in the world. The Komi are blond, with blue eyes.
damn, forgot to log inn (=
The Flood was recorded in the Sumerian epic of Gilgamesh as well as other myths. Now colleagues of Dr. Mair's are discovering evidence of an ancient civilization in western China that had its own unique writing.
Seastead this.
Oops, less than 100 years. Certainly not "thousands". So much for that theory.
Having power equivalent to and BEING atomic (and thus radioactive and causing possible genetic mutation) are two vastly different things.
It never fails to surprise me how many otherwise intelligent people can't manage even the slightest grasp of history or physics.
it's interesting how understated the exhibit is. no velvet ropes, no pretty paneling on the walls. in fact, very little differentiates the exhibit from the rest of the museum. the mummies /are/ very well preserved. the plaques don't discuss the very interesting red dots that appear on some of them, but, then, it's a miracle the plaques are in english at all. if you happen to be in xinjiang with nothing to do, it's worth a visit
http://www.sil.org/ethnologue/families/Uralic.html
If you know the Russian Geography well, you'll see that some of the majority of the Uralic languages are around Finland/Estonia/Karelia.
At the same time, MAri/Mordvinic/Permic languages are located around Volga river and Ural mountains in Russia (these mountains are considered to be a border between Europe and Asia).
Yet at the same time the easternmost tribes of this language group live on Yenisey (about 7 hours of jet flight East from Moscow). Some of them (Khanty & Mansi, small tribes with less than 50K in the ethnic group) are the closest relatives of Hungarians.
And Samoyedic group lives even farther North.
Also of interest will be the site www.hyperborea.ru (they have English version).
Tigers respect lions, elephants and hippos. Maggots respect no one. (C) S. Dovlatov
No pre-Christian European ritual here; Kennewick man WAS the Captain Picard that was killed by the Borg during one of the Starfleet missions when travelling to the past that has not been filmed yet.
;-)
He should be buried using the Starfleet ritual (a casket flown to the deep space).
Can you imagine finding a 9000-yr old Klingon skeleton?
Tigers respect lions, elephants and hippos. Maggots respect no one. (C) S. Dovlatov
Finnish language is not an Altaic one; it's Uralic.
8 25 6&cid=258
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=01/05/19/04
BTW, in that site Korean is classified as an isolated language.
Tigers respect lions, elephants and hippos. Maggots respect no one. (C) S. Dovlatov
yeah don't mix it. My mother tonge is spanish, and does not make me spanish. 100% zapotec blood I have. I went for my university in finland to the tampere university, and the swedish speaking fins think they finnish not swedish. They just happend to be born in a place where they speak finnish. And then in the north of finland there is some people who speak lappish. You guys forgot to argue about . In lapland they speak this weird indo european language.
America is not the name of a country. If you're gonna insult someone from america refer the country. Like united statian usa or canadian. good way to call them is yankee. ooh yeah you can call them american pigs. most of them United statians think the name of their country is america. Wich is not America is a continent.