Slashdot Mirror
OpenDJ UNIX-based P2P Streamer
hardcorejon writes "I found the Streamer software interesting, particularly because I've also written a remarkably similar piece of software, called OPENdj. Because Streamer requires
Windows, I thought my fellow Slashdot readers would be interested in
OPENdj, which is an open source
Java/Linux-based distributed streamer. Development on OPENdj began over a year ago, with version 1.0.0 appearing this past May. It has some slick features, including
automatic archiving, archive search, stream meta-tagging, listener
counts and chat rooms. Download it, bang on it, send me patches :)"
Dear developer: :)
OpenDJ doesn't crash!
Is this a bug or a feature?
Will you be putting the crash thingee back in so as to make it comparable to its closed source Windows counterpart?
--- Grow a pair, liberals... stop letting the Republicans bully you!
I've gone from being completely indifferent about internet radio to being a huge fan of it in the span of about a year. I have not listened to broadcast music in a couple years now. Just about everything I listened to for a long time came out of my friends and I's CD pools. We'd make compilation albums for each other or just snag songs we particularly enjoyed from albums in each others collections. Broadcast radio has always been shit but recently it has been so bad I simply can't stand to listen to it. I began to go to dozens of concerts from LA to San Diego. Last year I think I tallied 35 concerts in about 9 months. Was I going to see bigass arena shows being hyped by radio stations? Only in a very small handful of cases like the Yahoo Outloud Weezer tour, when I went to the LA and SD shows. Most shows I was going to were indie rock shows and small local shows. Anyhow, I was going to these shows SPECIFICALLY because the bands weren't being played on the radio.
Now it is facing some stiff opposition in the form the RIAA and their demonic minions. I don't want to see internet radio go down because it is the only inexpensive way I've got left to get introduced to some good music. Sharing with my bearded linux hippie friends is nice but there isn't enough variety to really find off the wall shit I end up really digging. P2P radio seems like an obvious solution because of the P2P buzzword culture surging as of late. The model however runs into serious problems. The RIAA doesn't have to go after a single individual or group of individuals to take out P2P radio like they were able to with various sharing programs. All they have to do is make some deals with cable and DSL providers. Lets say there was a popular P2P radio in my town, all it would take is a deal or lawsuit against Charter and he would be toasted. We'd all end up with our bandwidth curtailed more than it already is and P2P radio would end up specifically forbidden in the AUP.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
Hello slashdot folk.
I'm really interested in getting as much feedback on OPENdj as I can. Towards that end, if you have any questions, comments, concerns that you'd like to direct towards me, please let me know.
Thanks,
- jonathan.
This is kind of funny as you just spent the last few hours pimping the program all over the 'streamer' story. Anyway, I have a question. How is this program distributed, I think I looked over the docs carefully, it seems like more of an automatic co-op timeshare software.
Thanks,
-Jon
this is my sig.
seems like an 'almost' good idea gettin this on the front page of /.
wonder if the service'll get un-intentionally slashdotted?
I think we already got this "story" in the comments seven stories down.
Yeah yeah, I know I know... troll/flamebait. *sigh* Whatever.
You need to add copy protection and close the source of your software. Show some respect for the DMCA you criminal.
question: how will you avoid getting killed by the fees on internet radio broadcasting? Don't you have to keep a log of exactly who is listening, what is broadcast, etc etc?
There's no need to actually invent new P2P-stream-distribution techniques: a better approach would be to merge live, refreshing station playlists with existing P2P file-sharing networks, like Gnutella, ED2K, FastTrack, etc.
You can think of this as as "Judo Radio" because it uses a tiny, smart control channel to throw around a giant amount of content that lives and travels on outside networks.
I wrote more about it here:
It's not quite the same as typical P2P-webcasting proposals because it leverages open, ownerless content-distribution networks that are already in place, and in fact the "stations" can be agnostic about how the data arrives to audiences. They just say, "get and listen to this next", ad infinitum.Whether the "stations" need any licenses whatsoever to the tracks they "recommend" seems a debatable point to me: the stations themselves make no copies of copyrighted material at all, instead leaving that completely up to the audience to do on their own.
This approach thus has the same resiliency (or weakness) of the underlying P2P file-sharing networks themselves.
The DJ Agreement for OPENdj specifically places all responsibility for copyright/licensing/royalties/CARP issues on the DJ. Sucks that it has to be that way, but it's the only way I can afford to operate OPENdj without getting into big trouble.
I may have to pull the archive facility, but there is nothing illegal about the OPENdj technology in and of itself. People could use this to stream their original music, or just do talk radio, neither of which infringes on anyone else's rights.
- jonathan.
I mean, he never posted offtopic or anything. It's not like some people haven't been posting the same stuff for years now. If the guy wants to promote or raise awareness about an open source project that's relevent to the current discussion, I say why not. Just as long he doesn't go overboard and start spamming or something.
W
-------------------
This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Well, who really cares?
hapo
You wont get any development support if you keep using java. Port to C.
Java apps are not easy to install usually for any OS because they require a Virtual Machine, why not just use C and develop cross platform? Please tell me why you picked java?
Thats the only problem i have with your app. I understand java allows easier cross platform development but you could have done the same thing with C, it wouldnt be as quick and easy but you'd have better support and better code in the long run.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Theres not a single good java app for peer to peer, name one.
Err...Limewire??
So, are you volunteering to write it in C or C++ ? You're complaining soo much, so put your time where your mouth is Mr. Hanzo.
This is one example of why Open Source programming ideas are bad. When the developer comes out, other's bitch at him without anything to contribute. That's why authors get burnt out.
Why Java?
Because server side networking code is REALLY easy in Java. Writing multithreaded code is REALLY easy in Java.
That said, OPENdj is really built on top of open wire-level protocols. The current client and server are in Java. I'm working on a C client right now. If someone wants to reimplement the server in C, go for it!
- jonathan.
So, if you've written a piece of software, all you have to do to get an article about it on Slashdot is wait until an article about a similar program is published. Then, you bomb the thread with links to your project, wait a while, submit a story about your project, and Bob's your uncle. Easy. *Crawls back under a rock, waiting for the next article even remotely touching file managers*. ;^)
main(O){10<putchar(4^--O?77-(15&5128 >>4*O):10)&&main(2+O);}
You wont get any development support if you keep using java. Port to C.
That's kinda funny; I keep telling people that I'd love to help them out with their projects, if they'd port to Java.
Java apps are not easy to install usually for any OS because they require a Virtual Machine, why not just use C and develop cross platform? Please tell me why you picked java?
I develop java, because that is the language I know; I don't post in chineese because I don't speak chineese. Sure - you can develop cross platform, and I'm sure it's easy as pie, which is probably why everyone who develops in C develops cross platform.
The problem in your proposal is, that you need to support a huge number of platforms - with java you only need one; granted, the platform needs to support Java, but that's not my problem. Also I doubt you can reuse much code between Sparc+Solaris and x86+Linux.
I understand java allows easier cross platform development but you could have done the same thing with C, it wouldnt be as quick and easy but you'd have better support and better code in the long run.
Why would it have better support? And why on earth would it result in better code? I am yet to see any buffer overflows in Java, and they are probably the most common bug in software; even good developers fall for those.
Now - why don't you port it to C, and all the platforms that support java? Even if OpenDJ is not open source, I'm quite sure the author would allow you to do so. Or are you only in this for the right to bicker?
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
Yeah, "pimping" would be one word for it. Too much coffee, no sleep, and getting a little too excited is what happened. I'm sorry if it came across as spam-ish, that's the last impression I want to give.
But anyway, you're right, I thnk of OPENdj as not really P2P but more like "public access" Internet radio. A soapbox that anyone can stand on and shout!
- jonathan.
Does "HanzoSan" mean "I burnt my tungue on a cup of java once, and now I'm pissed off at Java" in some obscure language?
...
I haven't reached the bottom of the 26 comments so far, and you have posted your hatred of java three times so far
Did you flunk your java course or something?
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
Yes, to operate your own OPENdj station requires some knowledge of server-side stuff.
The intent is to make the life of the would-be broadcaster as easy as possible. There are a lot of non-technical people out there who would love to broadcast and know lots about music but not much about computers.
As a secondary goal, it should be easy to install your own OPENdj station. As you note, currently this is not the case.
Also bear in mind that OPENdj has a lot of features Streamer does not - automatic archiving, configurable rerun scheduler, listener counts, real-time chat with your listeners, etc.
- jonathan.
more from a comment by the same author :)
7 94 975
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=35116&cid=3
Does the name Pavlov ring a bell?
And.... another point being.... that people dont realize a lot of music doesnt fall under the RIAA's grasp....
I am a techno DJ.... I spin trance in clubs, and hardhouse for parties and clubs sometimes... and the majority of my music is released either A) underground or B) with the full knowledge of the label that it is being pressed for public use and is generally encouraged to do so.
Go into any record store (vinyl catering to DJs, not CD store..) and you will find bins of LPs with white sleeves and white labels... penned on some track name or genre or play speed (33/45)..
The RIAA has *NO* say about how this music is played as its not under their domain!
So, to make my point, I think its perfectly fair and common to spin tracks in such a manner without even dealing with the beforementioned copyright/licensing/royalties/CARP shit..... Thats basically implied upon purchase of the record.
Is not life a hundred times too short for us to bore ourselves? -Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche
Offer a download button which downloads all the file in one tar or zip, have some instructions on how to install it on your website.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Limewire sucks compared to alot of the other Gnutella clients, its a decent client but nothing about it makes it better.
The best thing I can say about limewire is it works.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Try running jEdit on a 533MHZ PII System :)
Lets just say 20 sec to load a notepad clone is sad, and it has to redraw all widgets when you multitask. (which can take another 10-20sec)
Picked up Crimoson Editor, written in C++, has many more features, and runs like a charm.
Perhaps if someone came out with a Java Compiler that turns Java code to machine code I'd like it better.
Until then, you have fun with your Java proggies, I stick with my C/C++ programs.
Congratulations on your development of a page-widener that works in Mozilla. It's not even obvious that you're the one doing it. Adding it to a reasonably on-topic post was a nice touch.
I do sidestep the CARP issue by requiring the DJ to take care of all that. If the DJ wants to broadcast original material, or do a talk show, then there are no copyright restrictions on that. If they want to broadcast copyrighted material, it's their responsibility to pay any associated fees.
The broadcasting software that DJs use tells them how many listeners they have, so if they need to use that to calculate what they owe, the can use it.
On the bandwidth side, a 24 or 32Kbps upstream signal is about all a 56k modem can do. I've tested it with PacBell dialup anyway, and it works OK.
Which brings me to another thought: I hope the RIAA realizes that these low-quality streams are not really worth prosecuting. They are listenable, but certainly won't infringe on album sales - the difference in quality is just too huge. Now if I were streaming at 128k, then you might have a different story.
- jonathan.
Say you download an MP3 from a P2P network. Isn't that streaming too? Or is streaming defined only as content delivered at its real-time rate and/or content that the user cannot directly control (i.e., requests are allowed, but not directly manipulating the stream-er to deliver a specific song)
One wonders whether non-realtime "streaming" (read: downloading) can also be made illegal by RIAA/CARP
I don't believe that DMCA mandates copy controls. It punishes things that circumvent existing controls but does not require new ones. He might be clear under DMCA.
It's less clear what would happen under CBDTPA (or, as I like to call it, PHHHFT
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach
First file sharing, now radio! How about someone does this for Instant Messaging next. This would seem even more important then the first two.
Please give me some comments on this. Is it even possible ?
For user authentication, how about SSH Certificates or PGP keys ?
fwiw, Andromeda has been well received on Freshmeat. -Scott
Here's what I do: Bitty Browser & Andromeda
Please can we get a header translation so that those of us can build upon your framework.
And also Windows... The client should have Windows support.
Thanks.
Tournament Management Online &
Java has always had an important problem: it's ugly and doesn't (visually) interates with anything. Most java app are slow (or maybe the code? i'm am talking about Limewire, Phex, etc.) but i can live with that. But a client is supposed to look nice?
Why didn't SUN though about providing native widgets? For the server side you don't need them, but if they wanted to hit Microsoft in the heart, they should have though of many a java app look as nice as any other app in windows (or linux, say gtk or qt).
I guess they'll never understand the desktop market. If it doesn't look nice, it's perceived as BAD.
I'm not only talking for myself, but for what I hear from people trying java stuff.
unfinished: (adj.)
I'm looking for mention of UNIX in this article, and all I'm seeing is a Linux derivate. What gives?
// -- http://www.BRAD-X.com/ --
Or java is just slow....
but then again, processors are getting faster so soon java will feel like assembler...
-- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
That was one of the major goals of Java - write once, run anywhere.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
--Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
It might have been once, but it isn't any longer.
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
Are you blind or what?
White/green letters on black backgrounds have been around on computer displays since the teletype started going out of style.
The problem is either your web browser or your eyes or both.