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Shuttle SS51 Reviewed
hilldaddy writes "AnandTech has a review up of the new Shuttle SS51 XPC. Looks like they finally added an AGP slot. Read the review." We've done several previous stories on the Shuttle mini-PC systems.
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I bought a shuttle bare bones system a while back for LAN gaming. I really like the system, it's quiet and about as large as my toaster, but I ended up replacing the C3 with something faster.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
Well to serial are good but what about dongle support
One of the best things about this is the way the CPU is cooled.. I'd wish you could get something like this for your average mini tower.
considering a very resembling STS-51 less successful one.
Anyone else find it not the greatest looking thing around? I guess it doesn't matter if you shove it under a desk, but I"m not sure it's something I'd want on top of my desk or sitting out in the open. The SS50 at least looked decent, but they added too much flashy stuff to it, and it looks silly.
What?
Many mac people claim that they have the best computers because of their size and portablity. Perhaps Windows (or hopefully linux) will be able to show people that we to can make really weird looking small computers too. And this one even has a serial port as apposed to the mac.
"Excellent" - Monty Burns
This is how you know you're a geek the power goes out and you are unemployed and unemployable. Yes I know I can't spell
"Upgrading CPUs and graphics cards shouldn't be a problem but when it comes to motherboards, you're pretty much stuck with what you've got." Surely the reviewer realizes that motherboards have a socket type that only run a certain type of CPU. Obviously this isn't always an issue but depending on when a motherboard is made and where in the development cycle the chip maker is in and what processor one buys... The same could be said about the old AGP 2x to 4x conversion.
-- Scientist: You aren't going to leave me here, are you? Boagh! Thump...
Rack mounts, but costs aside...Wouldn't you rather have a 4 space ATA rack case with a 1u computer, a 1u UPS, 1u keyboard/LCD and a 1u 24port switch all within a nice carryable package that it doesn't hurt throw in the back of the car?
These are really cool though for their small footprint, but personally I have been carrying around a Supermicro S-760 case for a few years now fully loaded, and its pretty heavy, but I really don't mind- it's strong enough to hold up one end of the table, or to be able to sit my UPS on top. These could be cool for LAN parties, but the exact reason I bought such a large case was for massive expandablity- multiple scsi drives, cdr, dvd, multiprocessor, etc...
It really could be cool for Lans though, but that LianLi alumnium case also fixes weight problem too.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
I was interested to see that Shuttle has a new case out with an AGP slot, but it's still one-off from what I'd like, because it doesn't take AMD chips, which I prefer.
Does anyone know of a similar case for Durons / Athlons? I hope this is Shuttle's next move, because these cases are quite nice looking.
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
In times past (oh, you know, 2 years ago.), it seemed eveyone I knew wanted a full sized tower. At the least, a mid tower was preferred.
Now, however, it seems things are hopefully turning around. It is quite encouraging to think that in the near future I can finally get rid of all of the crap that clutters my desk due to the computer. Pair this with a flat-panel monitor and you now have noticeably more room above and below your desk.
Now, I just need to find a way to consolidate all of my power and accessory cables. Those are probably the largest hassle when cleaning for me.
in case you manage to /. Anand's servers.
Hexus - http://www.hexus.co.uk/review.php?review=395
- HeXa
Anyone in touch with people building system component by component realizes a great majority of these are AMD based, since they get to see the processor price difference and know the price/performance problems with P4 vs. Athlon. I personally have been eagerly awaiting a version with AGP for AMD, and then I might buy in... I want to have an All-in-Wonder in one of these babies to integrate into my entertainment system...
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
This looks very close to the exact type of computer I need considering I move every 4 months and I don't have much room to pack all the time.
Does anyone know a good place to buy this in Canada?
Looks great with the aluminum casing. Was pretty cheap too at $300 for the case, proc, mb, power supply and RAM. Yes, no hdd, fd, or cdrom. This is going to be a diskless system, and I'd have to say that the SV24 fits the bill quite nicely. I'll put up a page when the project is finished.
IWARS.
People, in general, disappoint me. Politicians even more so.
.... fogot the other two reviews...
g p1.htm
http://www.viahardware.com/ss51xpc_1.shtm
http://www.ocworkbench.com/2002/shuttle/ss51/ss51
- HeXa
Better pics.
A friend of mine is looking into upgrading his machine or simply getting a new one.
I was thinking of reccommending the SS51 to him... Until I saw that it was a P4 machine.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Did anyone notice that the three audio ports can be remapped between input and output at the user's discretion? Want surround output, set them all to output. Want to record something? Switch a port to input. VERY nice - But is the audio quality up to snuff?
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Not much of a review if they're going to wait for a replacement mobo to see if stability gets better.
MA
This is gonna be my main box at home and primary LAN party box. My old box is gonna be relegated to the role of an Apache server. I'll put up a review of how well the SS51 runs my favorite distro when I get the thing in.
Now if this had AMD support I'd buy one in a flash. This plus a flat screen display would solve a lot of the space headaches I have ATM. (Full Tower case, 21" Monitor, scanner, printer, speakers etc).
Anyone know why there is no AMD support? Heat problems? Problems getting the chipsets onto such a small form factor?
Like so many sites, the folks who did the web pages for Shuttle Computer Group seem to think that nothing can be done without Javascript - you cannot even view their site with JS turned off. I do wish these so-called web designers would realize that some of us either cannot run JS, or choose not to.
I went to the Shuttle site trying to see if they had non-P4 systems - I'd rather get a 1800MHz processor that runs like 2200MHz than a 2200MHz processor that runs like 1800MHz. Also, I'd like to know how compatible this system is with Linux.
Lastly, while it has 2 optical SPDIF ports, I'd like to have a unit with a co-ax port. Why? My stereo has one optical and one co-ax input, and the optical is being used by my DirectTivo - I'd like to use the co-ax for my MP3 player.
Of course, what I'd really like is a simple USB -> SPDIF converter - no other I/O, just USB in and SPDIF co-ax out.
www.eFax.com are spammers
they put a headphone jack, usb ports, and firewire up front, but the KEYBOARD AND MOUSE PORTS ARE STILL IN BACK. Are designers just dense? Many people actually use ps/2 mice and keyboards. If you're going to put ports up front, why not these too?
Anyone know any places to buy these things online. I have seen tons of reviews, but I can never find a reseller.
It's not the size of your stack that matters, it's how you push and pop
Jon Acheson
All opinions expressed herein are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled.
Rather, I have a bunch of SV24's, not 50's as I wrote before. We have about 10 or so of these and they're great little office boxen. Only had to RMA one bad power supply. Rest are hummin' (literally) along.
A friend and I have been tossing around the idea of a backpacked minirig system for some time now, making use of small scrap cases from HP or something and the smallest form factor parts we could find. We wanted to build the entire thing into a backpack, so we just unzip a pocket, pull out a power cord and cat-5, and plug them in to go. This would be for both LAN parties and just doing work on the fly, and much less expensive than a laptop; more upgradeable too.
/.ers tried/accomplished anything like this? Also, for those of you who've used them, whats your personal opnions on Shuttles other models? I'm especially interested in the cooling issues, as building a computer into a backpack creates even more :)
The Shuttle setups seem almost ideal to this, as they've already solved some of the cooling problems we were finding with our minirigs. I'm just waiting to see what a Shuttle w/nForce2 looks like, and maybe some AMD support instead of Intel.
I noticed recently a new rollup keyboard on thinkgeek as well, which would be suited, so long as it works well; small factor mice are readily available for laptops, so those arent an issue.
Have any other
http://thechubbyferret.net - Ferret pictures and informative links.
Shuttle SS51 Reviewed
My first thought was: isn't it a little bit late?
Didn't they review this thing to death after shuttle 51 blew up 108 seconds after liftoff in 1986? Wasn't the shuttle fleet grounded for two years?
Those who would give up liberty in exchange for security and DRM should switch to Microsoft Palladium!
I was going to buy a couple of these, but it seem that to install Linux on these little wonders is a real headache. There are no Linux driver for the onbaord SIS graphics set.
nothing to see here
Fastest P4 I can get to work in it plus a R9700 (unless I wait for the NV30), coupled with two high speed hard drives (one in HD bay and other in FD bay) with a RAID controller in the PCI slot and of course a DVD-R/RW drive.
Cooling won't be a problem with a few case mods but my only concern is whether the powersupply can handle all the components.....
- HeXa
(note - I'm not affiliated with Shuttle in any way, shape, or form)
Although this is a good P4 machine, I'm an AMD fan, so this machine really doesn't interest me too much.
The one I'm waiting for is the Nforce2 Shuttle that will be released soon. It's for AMD, it's Onboard Video and Audio is very good so you wont need to replace it as soon unlike other onboard components, where it's almost necessary, and it's upgradeable just like the SS51 is.
The Nforce2 Shuttle wil be a good LAN gaming machine out of the box, whereas the SS51 needs a Video and Possibly an audio card right off the bat
In Soviet Russia, Trojan exploits YOU!
Firingsquad also has a review up.
http://firingsquad.gamers.com/
For some time now, I've been very interested in the Shuttle line of PCs, and if they'd just come out with an AMD version of the SS51, I'd most likely buy it (I know, it should happen as it has with the others, so I'll wait).
My problem is I'd like to use it as an HTPC component. Right now though, it's just going to be just for (legal) emulation purposes. Every time I've gotten to the point of almost buying one, I've stopped because there's no parallel port, and I need one to plug my SNES pad into.
The AGP port is a definite plus this time around, but there's still no parallel port. However, there's still the PCI slot, so what I'm wondering is has anyone used one of the PCI parallel port cards (and gotten it to work under Linux), and how well did it work?
"My days are less enjoyable because of people." ~ Johnny the Homicidal Maniac
Over the years, my computer has replaced more and more of my media systems.
Why not replace an expensive AC3 decoder with onboard decoding and some external cheap amps? (I'm not saying get a noname amp - I'm saying get a good name amp that is a decade or so old. Sound quality's the same, the only difference is all sorts of doodads you don't need.) Or one of the recent sets of PC speakers designed for use with surround-capable soundcards?
But as I asked earlier, I wonder what the quality of the onboard audio is. The onboard audio on my Epox EP-8KHA (VIA chipset onboard) is just plain unacceptable for ANY use - HORRENDOUS feedback/squealing.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Anyone know a UK source, or someone willing to import?
Cheers,
Ian
Anyone here ever heard of PC104(or better still PC104 Plus)? Its a small low power, minimal factor fully modular, fully upgradeable PC solution. Used in industry. But so far the devices onforming are a little too expensive and a little too low spec.
Have a look at http://www.pc104.org/ or even try http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=PC104 .
Were there to be sufficient demand, maybe more domestic manufacturers could put boards together with this capability with better specs and more reasonable prices.
I was originally looking at this as a solution for an extremely high-power robot board.
OrionRobots.co.uk - Robots From sol
Yea, that's true, you can get small 4 space racks, that are mainly intended for music, that aren't too deep. Sometimes only 12-18 inches deep, which is really cool
Tibbon
tibbon.com
At the very end of the article, it says that next they are producing an nForce2 based mini-system. It indicates that this will include an AGP slot as it mentions the home theatre possibilities of pairing it with an ATI 8500DV.
They announced the nForce2 based board they'll have out in a few months. AMD all the way there, with an integrated GeForce4MX
Unfortunately, I found the review a little lacking. It was informative with what was provided and what these things did, in the reasonable benchmark comparisons, but then in the last words mentioned problems with stability without actually mentioning what the problems actually were. Is this usual for their reviews or did I miss something?
This now concludes our broadcast day.
As an aside, wouldn't low pressure air absorb less heat? Wouldn't it be better to direct the airflow in, thus having the pressure be higher at the heat sink?
Then, of course, you'd be blowing hot air around the inside of the computer case. Still... anyone have some actual knowledge to drop on this subject?
-jim
There are no trolls. There are no trees out here.
It looks like they've lost the onboard S-video output. That was a cool feature for anyone who wanted to turn one of these boxes into a PVR or something similar.
Sure, you can get AGP cards with S-video, but if you're not doing for hardcore gaming, it looks like that's one more thing to have to buy now.
Mapping the audio outputs is nice though.
Also, it looks (from the photos on their site) like the case is getting slightly bigger in the newer models. Soon we'll have a (gasp) mini-tower again!
--
"There has grown in the minds of certain groups in this country the idea that just because a man or corporation has made a profit out of the public for a number of years, the government and the courts are charged with guaranteeing such profit in the future, even in the face of changing circumstances and contrary to public interest. This strange doctrine is supported by neither statue or common law. Neither corporations or individuals have the right to come into court and ask that the clock of history be stopped, or turned back."
- Robert Heinlein, Life Line, 1939
Tuus crepidae innexilis sunt.
bye, bye viahardware.com
Hope they're not running on an SS51!
I bought a Shuttle SS50 this month (gee, if I'd waited, I could have gotten an AGP slot...). Nice system, runs a bit hot, I wonder if the SS51 heat pipe can be retrofitted.
However, I would like to put a PCI graphics accelerator in it for LAN gaming. Question is, what's a good midrange PCI 3D card for this purpose? GeForce cards are out of the picture 'cause the reviewers point out that this chipset is too data-transfer-intensive to work well over a PCI bus. Suggestions, anyone? JPriest, what card did you use, and how much did it improve things? (Seems to me the internal on-board video's faster data path might reduce its slowness relative to a PCI plugin card, but I might be wrong...)
"My strength is as the strength of ten men, for I am wired to the eyeballs on espresso."
A case that looks like it belongs in an entertainment center. Preferably with standard ports in the back and extra port connections for firewire & USB 2 behind flip covers on the front.
Case should be able to accept most any motherboard and give me vertical slots in the back.
Minimum of 2 5.25" bays up front. No 3.5" needed.
Should be able to accept large PSU's.
Try to engineer the case to be as quiet as possible.
No stupid bright LED's on the front. If I'm going to use it to play games or watch movies & play MP3's I don't want the lights to distract me when I turn off the overheads.
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." Col. Jeff Cooper
I think their idea is to get away from larger connectors and become more slim line. If you can afford to get a beefy SFF box then I think you can afford a USB printer.
The difference in density of the cooling air due to the pressure rise or drop across the fan is utterly negligible in terms of heat capacity per unit volume, and may well be swamped by the results of heating of the air by the CPU heatsink (in those cases where the air path goes that way; the SS51 doesn't do that.)
The pressure across the fan is way less than 0.1 PSI, compared to 14 PSI ambient pressure at sea level, so a crude analysis would say the effect is way less than 0.5%, most likely hundreds of times less.
If you pass the air across the CPU first and then through the power supply as in the SS50, you likely get hotter PS temperatures 'cause the temp difference is lower, reducing the amount of heat transfer until the PS heats up more.)
"My strength is as the strength of ten men, for I am wired to the eyeballs on espresso."
I mean, Printer port? Gimmie a break. They should have just gone ahead and lost the PS/2's for the mouse AND the Serial ports while they were at it. For that matter I'd like to see one of these without the plate for a floppy and with a cover for the CDROM bay that kept the front panel looking nice. Kind of like the CDROM drive door on the PowerMac. That would have been really nice.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
If you're willing to go with water cooling or something like the CALM System's evaporative cooling, you can get even quieter than that. Or you can do what I did and run cables under the floor so you can put the thing in a closet and shut the door.
Yahoo's Silent-PC list and AVS Forum have lots of good info on building PCs a lot quieter than the new Shuttle.
But not as tiny!
"The 200W power supply delivers 10A on the +12V and 20A on the +5V rails."
10A * 12V + 20A * 5V = 220W
Can someone explain?
All of my coworkers are excited about the SS51, I have a feeling it's going to be a huge seller... perhaps even one of the best selling pieces of PC kit this year. I wouldn't be too surprised if, over the next six months or so, we start seeing this little wonder popping up all over the place... offices, retail point-of-sale, on sitcom sets, etc.
In a related note, I'm curious about the "optional parallel port"... is it nothing more than a USB adapter? I would love a real parallel port as I perfer parallel for printers.
IMHO, better'n the SS51. A brushed aluminum cube looks spiffier to me than the same with a clear plastic faceplate tacked on.
"My strength is as the strength of ten men, for I am wired to the eyeballs on espresso."
I run Win98 SE on mine (amazingly, I was still able to buy a copy), Win2K is a bit more resource-hungry IIRC, and XP is *not* to come into my house or it'll get shot on sight. If this weren't a LAN-party box, I'd have it dual-booting Mandrake. HL/CS, Operation Flashpoint (great game, BTW) and StarCraft are the major uses for it, and it seems to do all right in terms of frame rate, though testing is still in progress...
73 de N1XNX
"My strength is as the strength of ten men, for I am wired to the eyeballs on espresso."
Why is this a troll? I am legitimately interested in this device's operations under Linux. As such this is a legitimate question. Although I didn't post this question I am considering getting one in my Linux-only shop and since I don't have any windows software in my house this is a significant concern.
Partnership for an idiot free America!
Thanks for your input. If it's comparable to any SB, then it's pretty good for an onboard sound chipset. Not that I'm saying SB is better than most - Even super-cheapie Yamaha chipset cards are "acceptable", i.e. I can't tell the difference for gaming/home multimedia use.
My definition of "bad" is the onboard audio on VIA KT266 chipsets, such as my Epox EP-8KHA. It SUCKS. It has this obscenely loud high-pitched squealing that gives you a splitting headache on 1-2 minutes flat. Needless to say, I'm now VERY wary of onboard audio solutions.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
When an author who works for a company describes the features of a product from that company it's called an advertisement not a review.
Yes, still think the product is damn cool.
Look at the photo of the backside in the review. See the removable plate just above the main system fan that looks like it'd accomodate a DB-25 connector quite nicely?
And if you look closely at the picture of the motherboard (or look at the specs on shuttle's website) you'll find that SURPRISE! the header for the parallel port is still on the board.
If it's that important to you to have a parallel port then, by all means, spend the $5 to buy an add-on parallel port with a cable long enough to reach. The case is only 5 inches tall, and the cutout is directly above the header.
I mean, really, if you're going to pay ~$300 for the case and motherboard combo, plus the cost of everything you're planning on putting on the board or in the drive bays, what's an extra $5??
Sheesh.
I fail to see the reason Macs are gay. Now granted the "Flower Power" model was less masculine than one would want but overall I find my Quicksilver to be pretty much inconsequential to my sexual preferences.
Could be you are meaning that the Mac itself is gay. I have seen no proof of this to date. Not once in the year I have owned the Mac have I come into my computer room to find my Quicksilver mounting my Beige G3 in sweaty, hairy arousal.
On the other hand my wife has a Toshiba laptop that came with XP on it and I'm pretty sure it smokes ass when no one is around.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Wait another couple months. The SN40 is coming. It's based on the nForce2 chipset, but otherwise expect similar specs to the SS51.
- nVidia press release
- VIAHardware nForce2 article
- Small Form Factor forum (search for SN40)
- or Google it yourself
SN40 is probably the machine that will get me to switch my home computer from PPC to x86."With an AGP slot, this is the perfect small LAN box, and the onboard video looks to be shaping up well too."
Also, FWIW, I've read that a shuttlegroup employee said that the SS40g was their last SFF box without AGP.
next
Here is another review by Thresh's Firingsquad.
The case is big enough to put in 2 bays.
I have not owned a floppy drive or floppy in years. But I do have several DVD/CDRW/DVD+RW drives.
Please, all that I really need is a VCR sized case with two 5.25 bays.
Hardware keys are available in USB flavors too.
Jon Acheson
All opinions expressed herein are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled.
all the comments of the crew before and during launch:
x pl oration.and.Development.of.Space/Human.Space.Fligh t/Shuttle/Shuttle.Missions/Flight.025.STS-51-L/STS -51-L.Transcript.and.History
http://spacelink.nasa.gov/NASA.Projects/Human.E
last comments:
T+1:10............CDR Roger, go at throttle up.
(NASA: SSME at 104 percent.
T+1:13............PLT Uhoh.
T+1:13.......................LOSS OF ALL DATA.
I've looked at small form factor PC's like this before and while it might be great that they added an AGP slot for those that use these machines for LAN parties or as their primary desktop, I'd actually like something similar, sans all the bells and whistles. Basically, I'm looking for something that has two PCI slots so I can install a quad-port ethernet card and a wireless card and run OpenBSD on it and use it as a firewall. Methinks the console is going to look that same, whether the bus is 4X AGP or even a serial console for that matter :)
So all I really need is mouse/keyboard + ethernet + serial + 2 PCI slots. I could actually get away with only the serial port and 2 PCI slots, using that as a console and using the quad-port card for network connections but I like to have a physically separate network jack that sort of matches the logical layout of the network so I'd like onboard ethernet.
Does anyone have any recommendations for a PC like this? A Pentium running at a decent speed would work fine for a firewall - the problem is no one was making small form factor PCs like this when the Pentium was around. Maybe I need to look at embedded solutions as well - it just pains me to have a big clunky Dell Optiplex as my firewall when I could get away with a quarter of the shelf space but it also pains me to have to buy a machine with an AGP slot, when all I want is 80x24 text graphics...
Simlple - Each port has 2 channels (Stereo)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Shuttle's XPC for AMD
Q: What do you think about American Culture?
A: I think it's a good idea.
(adapted from Gandhi)
What's up next from Shuttle? An nForce2 based XPC; if paired up with a All-in-Wonder Radeon 8500DV (or maybe even the R300 version) we'd have one killer Home Theater PC on our hands with that one...
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." Col. Jeff Cooper
They make one that uses AMD Athlon processors and has two PCI slots. There's a review at Tom's Hardware./ 020710/inde x.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/02q3
I want a Shuttle SS51. It's exactly what I need for my "living room" PC. (I like the P4 > AMD for it's better heat handling)
But unlike many Slashdot readers I have no clue what parts to get to flesh out a barebones system.
If I ordered the SS51, what do I do next?
Are there some good FAQs for building your own system?
- For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat
If putting a case in an entertainment center, tailer is ok, but deeper than 15" r so is too much.
You should have a look at http://www.shuttleonline.com, ths ss51 is their first mini case with AGP, the previous all have 2 PCI -- just what you asked for, and cheap (you can even get a PIII case).
Hope this helps.