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David Brin on "Attack of the Clones"
dpt writes "Science fiction author and scientist David Brin caused quite a stir at the time with his article on The Phantom Menace, and now here are his thoughts on Episode II. Not being as harsh, it hasn't received much attention, but it's an interesting read anyway."
... with the new star wars films is nostalgia. We look back on the original three films with rose-tinted glasses, when really the dialogue sucked, the plots were generic, and acting not up to scratch. :-)
The only new crime of the new trilogy is the over-reliance on CGI.
PS this isnt a troll I actually love Star Wars
<fnord>OBEY</fnord>
I mean, shouldnt a critique of the movie be out, say, within a month or two of the movie being released??
From Time magazine, as quoted in the Brin piece:
Cheers
-b
Um, yeah.
Considering that Mr. Brin has written some of the best science fiction out there (I particulary enjoyed Earth), I'd say he *can* do, and does very well.
Just my opinion. I could be wrong.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
Those who can't do, bitch.
You know what? David Brin can do; he's pretty clearly in the top 100 science fiction writers of this century. Maybe if you could write like him, you would instead of bitching about his writing.
-A. Coward Ph.D
I found the article fragmented and poorly written. His "plot holes" were so thin I was reminded of movie-mistakes.com, where a "plot hole" is a piece of paper moving between someone's left and right hand over the course of 10 minutes.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
A girlfriend of mine had a cat that would sit and watch you all day long, not moving, not reacting to anything. If you got close enough, it would try to claw your eyes out. If you escaped and could still use your eyes, you would see the cat sitting there looking at you calm and cool. That cat was evil.
Giving into anger is more about making a person evil than it is about displaying emotion. Any master is calm, cool and collected. Luke was a student, not a master. They wanted him to be an evil student, and the quick path to that is anger.
Overall, I don't think that article was any more accurate or insightful than the movie it chose to criticize. It, too, was somewhat obvious and full of factual errors. (Lucas did not direct all five movies, for example.) I'm glad he found it entertaining, though.
The biggest irony is this -- I could scribble a 3 paragraph outline that would save Lucas. It would explain every awful inconsistency/paradox in his universe.
To me, something about Brin's vehemence moves him from "critique for criticism's sake" into "personal beef with Lucas"-land. Or more likely he envies Lucas' success compared to what he considers more legitimate and well-written sci-fi (his own work?).
I think what would have really put Episode 2 over the top would have been if Count Dookoo was fighting the Dark Side. If he had seen the Sith's rise and the Jedi's incompetence, he should have moved to build an army and defeat the Sith before it took over the Senate, or at least gather enought power to form a decent resistence. Then everything mostly could have worked in the plot. Why kill Obi-wan? Because obi-wan knew where they were. Why fight the Jedi? The Jedi were being used as pawns of the Sith and had to be stopped before they caused too much damage.
Of course this is just one CS majors ramblings, but I would have liked to see that.
There is nothing wrong with being gay. It's getting caught where the trouble lies.
Indeed, the very last paragraph's suggestion on how to actually make star wars make sense would be exceptionally cool.
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Yes! Lucas needed to whittle the Jedi down in a tragic and colorful way. But couldn't he have shown them suffering calamity despite behaving cleverly and well? Doesn't he have peers to workshop this stuff against?
Good question but I suspect that Lucas honestly believes that he has no peers. It's unfortunate because the scripts that came out of his colaboration with Kasdan were pretty good, IMHO. Yes, I know Lucas co-wrote AOTC with someone from Indiana Jones Chronicles but I argue that this guy was just a yes-man for Lucas. Lucas really needs to team up with a good, known writer to come up with an interesting story for Episode 3. Maybe he'll come to his senses and realize that he needs some help in the script department for his final Star Wars film. We can only hope.
GMD
watch this
So what? Brin is most definitely not in the "can't do" category. He's a fantastic author who's won a stack of awards for his Science Fiction writing. I'll admit that the one movie made from one of his books was awful, but the blame for that lies clearly on Kevin Costner's shoulders, not Brin's.
There's no point in questioning authority if you aren't going to listen to the answers.
The problems and holes in TPM could have been fixed with some quick editing and a couple of reshot scenes. It wouldn't have approached the first Star Wars, but then again very little does.
AotC was so utterly, unredeemably bad that it is unfixable. Sheesh - once glance between Harrison Ford and Carrie Fisher in ESB carried more romantic tension than 30 minutes of moping between what's his name and Natalie. "Let's go to the mall Anni". As my 8 y.o. said "Yuck". How perceptive is the mind of a child.
sPh
Biggest damn plot hole in the history of all plot holes:
C3PO: Hi, I'm a droid.
Owen: Hey, didn't I meet you before?
C3PO: No, I don't think so.
Owen: Yeah, you're C3PO. Build by Anakin Skywalker, right? You're the one who told everybody how itchy you were so you could get Padme to oil you up.
C3PO: I have no idea what you're talking about.
Owen: My dad married his mom! We worked together for about 10 years or so. Remember the whole sandpeople incident, where they came and kidnapped her for no reason? Or how we've been raising her grandson - your creator's son - for 18 years now? By the way - why didn't he ever come back and look in the local phone directory under "Skywalker" - he might have found out his son was right here.
C3PO: (Waves his hand before Owen.) We are not the droids you remember.
Owen: (Dazed.) You are not the droids I remember.
C3PO: (Waves hand again.) You want to purchase us. And give me an oil bath.
Owen: Bath.
Call me strange, but I think there was just a little plot hole there. Maybe a small one.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
Absolutely true. If you look at the prequels critically, as films and not as special-effects demonstrations, you see glaring holes in logic, motivation, purpose, etc. Brin ties all the problems up in three paragraphs. Absolutely astounding.
Nor did I spend two years at Evil Graduate School for an MA, two years at Evil Writer's Workshop for an MFA, and six years at Evil Graduate School for a Ph.D., but I don't go around signing my posts as:
Kelso Lundeen, M.A.,M.F.A.,Ph.D.
There's just something off-putting (and tacky) about tacking your credentials on stuff like this. I think it's an attempt by Brin to make sure folks know 'whereof he speaks', but it's annoying.
Strut your shit in your work, not in the byline for chrissake.
Yes, everyone knows there's no sound in space. Yes, Kubrick did it right. No, Kubrick didn't have 10 minute long space fighting sequences.
Mute your TV during the space combat scenes in Star Trek, Star Wars, etc. and see how it is. Just stop whining about it and let the rest of us enjoy the cool sound effects.
My father (who also has a doctorate) would quote the first Austin Powers movie on this:
"I didn't go through four years of evil medical school to be called Mr. Evil."
Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.
And please explain, why just five minute after Obi-Wan convinces Annikin that he must abandon Padme to "do his duty", does Yoda abandon his duty to the Republic in order to save two useless Jedi?
sPh
Next movie will surely have a Chicano low rider caricature help Obi-Wan
make his escape with the twins.
Anyone know if Cheech and Chong are free?
He's, basically, an artist (maybe not a good one, but an artist nonetheless). He likes to make movies and he likes to control every aspect of his movies (he was originally into editing, but switched to directing because he wanted more control).
He's made a whole lot of money, but what does he do with it? Does he have huge mansions or fleets of yachts? No. His lifestyle is quite simple for how much money he has. Lucas uses his money to build the coolest special effects shop, sound studio, and movie sound system companies. He uses it to further his movie work. In the A&E Biography about Lucas, a friend recalled how Lucas was still living like a starving idependent film maker, even after Star Wars. His friends had to remind him that he could afford better.
His movies may not be great, but I don't think for one minute that he's making them because he's greedy.
His crazy plot for Ep III sounds interesting ...
.... Darth & Obi-Wan setting this whole thing up to bring balance to the force ... how crazy would this be! Lucas would forever be known as a movie genius!
... we still don't know where he learned the ways of the Dark Side ... maybe it was Yoda that taught him ... That would REALLY mess things up!
...Yoda trained Dooku, who has obviously played a part in Anakin's turning to the dark side by showing him how powerful it is. Yoda trained Qui-Gon ... who trained Obi-Wan, who trains Vader. And if Yoda trained Sidious!!! WOW! At that point, maybe the universe should have been focused on pointing a death star at the little green bastard! ... or maybe Yoda was so smart that he knew this would rid the Universe of the Jedi and prevent the Jedi from taking over (for the long haul) ....
It would definately make Lucas look like a genius, but like the good doctor, I don't believe that Lucas would be smart enough (or would let his ego deflate enough) to use this terrific plot that has been presented infront of him.
Consider the possibilities: Yoda and the Emperor working together the whole time
This would also answer the question of how the Emperor became so powerful with the force
Think about it
That story line definately has possibilities!
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And we all remember how rivetting 2001 was (Monolith, snore, Monolith on Moon, snore, Monolith in Jupiter orbit, snore, etc...)
Hey, Star Wars is a space soap opera (sorta like Flash Gordon or Buck Rogers). 2001 is hard-core science fiction. Two distinct genres.
Please don't place a burden on something that doesn't deserve it.
Political correctness is the newest form of slavery.
I thought this article was an interesting read, and he made some really good points. The fact that I neither love or hate star wars makes this it a little easier to look at this objectively.
The one thing that I couldn't agree with was when he said getting angry can turn you evil is a down right lie. He then brings up an obligatory Hitler reference. A better example would be if, say a military group attacked you, and you decided to completely annihliate everyone who is from their country. You fighting the group is not evil, but you going overboard and killing everyone is! Of course you would have had no reason to fight them at all, but you were mad at what they did to you.
Hope that makes sense!
I read David Brin's article and noticed that he keeps mentioning how the whole series can be "redeemed" should Lucas decide to do "something special" to the plot. Of course, Brin never enlightens us to his fix-all plot twist.
Well, I think I might be on to what he's talking about. How cool would it be if Anakin's drop into the Dark Side was manipulated and guided by Yoda (and maybe some other elite Jedi) with the expectation that he'd eventually bring balance to the force in VI: ROTJ? Yoda ( or perhaps a council even higher than the ovenmit?) allows certain attrocities to go unchecked because he has a higher prophecy to fulfill. When I think about the possibilities, this could really put a brilliant and completely new spin upon the Star Wars universe. If done correctly, it really could be the next Empire Strikes Back in terms of having a plot that is more than predictable pubescent garbage (don't get me wrong, I love Star Wars).
But at any rate, those are my thoughts, and I'll admit that I don't read the forums and gossip websites at all. Does anyone else have any ideas as to what this "something special" which David Brin is referring to might be?
Except for the countless times people on this board have mentioned that in the Star Wars universe, droid routinely have there memories wiped out. Shit man, it's like the most posted message on this site.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
[i]True, it helped that my expectations were low. Still, I found myself quite enjoying the first half of the film!
While I agreed with his overall response I completely disagree with most of his points. I didn't like the first half, except maybe the first scene where Obi-Wan jumps out the window. It was the second half that was enjoyable. While the plot held itself together better in the first half of this the dialog was painful.
I've found that I really dislike this guy, and the way he presents thing. But I often agree with his opinions. At least on movies.
Science may someday discover what faith has always known.
There are many who will take offense at Brin's comments. But as a fan of Sci Fi it is Brin's duty to question Lucas and call him on his mistakes.
If more people step up and speak the truth about how much of a "let down" both of the "new" Star Wars films have been, maybe George will spend a little more time writing the third and less time worrying about the CGI.
We wasted a 'movie night' on TPM so we passed on AotC. If the reviews (professional and peer) were outstanding we would have seen it, but they were all 'it's better, but not great.'
When I heard that it was going to be out on IMAX, I considered going to it but as my wife said "Why, so we can see a so-so movie on a bigger screen?"
How is Palpatine supposed to explain the clone army? "I propose to create a grand Army of the Republic... oh look, I already have one, isn't that handy?" As they said in the movie, it takes years to develop, breed and train a clone army, so coming up with one at the drop of a hat should raise of few eyebrows.
Exactly.
:)
Reading this guy's article, I was amazed at how seriously he took SWII. Taking entire paragraphs to point out plot inconsistencies, complaining about the simplistic notion of Jedi thoughts on anger, Anakin's mother, etc., etc. makes me wonder if he doesn't realize that for George Lucas, this whole Star Wars thing is pure escapism - a giddy, whimsical throwback to B-grade kiddie serial flicks from another time. Of course there's no Spielbergian display of 'inner conflict of the human hero' - that's how the genre works. The Lone Ranger would have been out of place in Saving Private Ryan but he'd be in familiar company in a Star Wars flick. Even special moments of angst (Luke looking at setting twin suns, Han contemplating a return to attack the original Death Star) are stock B-movie cheesy moments. It's What Makes Star Wars Fun.
Don't get me wrong - the guy's allowed to take Star Wars seriously. But this whole 'disgruntled fan-boy' criticism just seems like a waste of time, kind of like posting about it on Slashdot.
Hey, wait a minute...
But what does my opinion matter, I just vote here. It's not like I have any money or anything.
Well, that works for half the equation. Maybe Owen is a droid too.
Chalk it up to movies 2001:A Space Odyssey.
We'd been conditioned to see space as an antiseptic place, full of glaring bright light, shiny technology, and alien experiences. The original thing about the first SW movie was the way it visually reimagined space to be grungy, bange-up, and lived-in, full of low life characters who were perfectly comprehensible even if they spoke some weird electronic lanuge and looked like a pile of congealed excrement. Star Wars opened up outer space to the great unwashed.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
...obviously start with Startide Rising, a much better book set in the same universe (The Uplift Saga, which has six volumes). The Uplift War is just as good, even though I suspect it was conceived as a giant pun. It may also appeal to your Libertarian instincts.
Then you're faced with a choice. If you just can't get enough Uplift, the last three books of the saga are really one story or trilogy and introduce many new and interesting ideas. But the climax is not as satisfying as Startide or Uplift War.
If you liked the eco-libertarian side of The Uplift War and (especially) Startide Rising, Earth develops these ideas much more fully, but it may not be entirely non-unsettling to a true believer in the Libertarian Cause.
If you liked the puns in The Uplift War, Kiln People delivers puns at a rate which has to be seen to be believed. This book also does a lot better job of transferring the mystery genre to sci-fi than Sundiver. And he even explains why his gumshoe maintains a running dialog in his head.
If you like Asimov's Foundation, then Foundation's Triumph will be of interest. Otherwise ignore it.
Perhaps his most interesting book was written with Gregory Benford -- Heart of the Comet, biological sci-fi set in deep space.
Eternal vigilance only works if you look in every direction.
The man worked hard to get his doctorate, and you bitch about him showing his accomplishments on his sleeve? Bugger off, mate.
That's "Dr. Mate" to you, A.C.!
GMD, Ph.D.
watch this
Okay, I give. Where are those three paragraphs?
PHEM - party like it's 1997-2003!
I've read 1/2 of Earth and 1/2 of The Postman, and found the writing horrible. I get annoyed with Harry Turtledove's writing at times (it gets repetitive), but at least the plot keeps things going.
Right, but, Lucas seems to want folks to feel there _is_ a message in his films, claiming to be inspired by the work of Campbell (who definitely claimed that even 'escapist' cultural myths reveal the underlying philosophy of a culture).
So Brin is critiqeing from the view that Lucas does want to be taken seriously.
I happen to agree that Lucas just wants to make a bunch of money and play with some cool new digital toys & that he is using Campbellian patterns in his stories because they are recepies for popularity, not because he actually wants or expects his stories to teach or shape the culture.
But a central theme to Campbell's work was that popular myths _do_ shape and teach...
My problem is that with so much money riding on the success of these movies, that its hard for me to take the guilty pleasure of enjoying such a scene when one could plausibly construe the scene as an easy-to-make marketing ploy.
.. as if somebody out there knows what kind of cultural crack I'm unable to resist, and is making some phat cash of peddling me 'the goods' ...
:(
Between all the crossovers, cameos, in jokes, and plot ploys in hollywood entertainment these days, its increasingly difficult for me to enjoy my guilty pleasures. When I know whoever owned the rights to the characters/franchise/brands involved is making a crudload of money off of pandering to my guilty desires instead of challenging them or surprising them with novel ideas, I just want to turn the TV off. As a fan of various shows, characters, etc, sometimes I feel downright exploited
Well, back to Yoda. Really, I much prefered the mystery. We all knew Yoda could kick some Imperial ass, so did we *really* have to see it? I much preferred the mystery, but now I am ruined.
"Old man yells at systemd"
Bottom of the page.
I don't care if he's jealous. His addendum RAWKS!
God, it's so good, I wish I'd thought of it!
note to self: read more of his books!
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
And yet, R2 recognized Obi Wan...
Do you realize that in nowadays' political atmosphere, the Rebels would be seen as terrorists and the evil Empire would look more like ... well.
um, marquand directed it, but lucas still wrote it...giving the controlling nature of lucas, i'd be willing to bet that the "shoot the reactor and then run" part or rotj was lucas', not marquand...marquand just directed the story that lucas gave him...
"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true." - Homer Simpson
It could be that Owen considered droids beneth notice - the classic "They all look alike to me". As such, the only reason he would consider C-3P0 special were the memories that were erased. Upon meeting the wiped 3P0, nothing would be present to trigger any familiarity.
www.eFax.com are spammers
Brin makes some interesting points in these anti-Lucas screeds of his, but the strongest feeling I get from them is one of bitter resentment. I think Brin has a particular idea of what constitutes "real" SF, and Lucas's success with his paltry "pseudo-SF" is grating. That, I can understand, but it does Brin no good to come up with spurious logic and silly accusations to try and denigrate Lucas... to what purpose, I can't tell.
For example, Brin is fond of pointing out how unhealthy it is to repress your emotions -- something he claims the Jedi faith is based on. The problem is that the Jedi have no problems with the existence of negative emotions -- merely with acting on them. Controlling yourself to the point where you don't even have any negative emotions is nigh-impossible; but recognizing when you are having those emotions, and waiting until you are calm before you act, is where the wisdom lies.
Brin also makes the odd assumption that just because Lucas shows a character doing something in a movie, means that Lucas thinks that real people should act that way in real life. His quote from Orwell is almost apropos, except that a movie is different enough from a gas chamber that the comparison is silly. I'm not saying Brin has to like Lucas's beliefs or philosophy, but to claim that there's some crime being perpetrated against humanity because of the entirely fictional things that happen in a movie, is just dumb. Criticizing a movie for bad writing, bad direction, and bad acting is certainly fine, but why does Brin see such a threat against real adult morality from these films?
"Destroy science and religion. Science would re-emerge exactly the same; but not religion." - Penn Jillette, paraphrased
How many protocal droids have we seen in th3e movies so far that look exactly like Threepio. Quite a few. In fact, usually the only difference is that their coverings are a slightly different shade.
Also, keep in mind that Threepio's coverings have been completely replaced by the time he and Owen meet again. He is a completely different color.
Why should Owen necessarily recognize him?
There they were, sitting in the van with all those dials, and the cat was dead. -V. Marchetti, CIA
He was friendly, he didn't recognize him.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
I've read most of his books. Not because I find his books especially well written, but because I'm a Sci-Fi junkie. His characters tend to feel like cardboard propups. Not that I'm defending Lucas' crap either.
Why oh why can't Hollywood make decent Sci-Fi movies? Most of the sci-fi movies that get made are absolute torture to watch. I suspect it has to do with the fact that most decent movies today are made with relative shoestring budgets. Crap lie Star Wars and Star Trek and even Minority Report.
Another may be that the Directors involved in the production are too powerful and have too much control over everything. Does anyone believe Lucas was told the Romance scene was completely horrid? I can't beleive the actors managed to spout that tripe without barfing or laughing in Lucas' face.
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon, Marshal of France - speaking truth to power
No, he simply had that gawd-awful 10-minute long starfield journey THROUGH the monolith.
"Population 1,656"
I enjoyed David's The River of Time, which is a short story collection.
I think droids are a commodity in the SW universe, much like toasters are today. Mass produced, identical, and when you come down to it: mere tools.
Why would Owen remember it?
Murphy was an optimist.
What Lucas is good at is production-value overload. In Episode I, there's a new major set every 90 seconds. That's really what keeps people from being bothered by the bad dialogue and inept action.
Yes, it makes money, but so does Pokemon.
In a recent Time Magazine article, George Lucas explains the depressingly foreordained saga of Anakin Skywalker's slide into evil-demigodhood by saying: "He turns into Vader because he gets attached to things. He can't let go of his mother; he can't let go of his girlfriend. He can't let go of things. It makes you greedy. And when you're greedy, you are on the path to the dark side, because you fear you're going to lose things, that you're not going to have the power you need."
So in essence, Lucas has modelled the Vader character after himself. The series has so much potential, everyone can see that. But Lucas is content to drag it down to the lowest level, simply because he is greedy.
I also really like the author's suggestion for Episode Three, which is a major plot twist. I have thought about it, and I think it could work very well. I'd have to review the previous movies to see if it works all the way through the trilogy, but I think it would. He proposes that Obi Wan and Darth Vader are actually teaming up against Yoda and the Emperor.
I think it would be a cool twist to reveal that the Empire is really the good guys, and the Rebels are the bad guys. There was a whole article on this somewhere, and I thought it was a pretty unique and intriguing analysis of the saga.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
"Doesn't he have peers to workshop this stuff against?" Ouch! That hurt all the way over here, and it wasn't even _pointed at me_! George - all work and no peer review makes a director - weird.
this
1. Owen had VERY little interaction with the droids in AotC. :)
:)
2. The droids are all named by their model number. In a universe, it's clear that there are likely millions of each model droid. There'd be no reason to think that a C3PO is the C3PO he dealt with about 20 years prior.
3. Droid memory erasures, as mentioned by many people.
4. If you watch the original film, Owen goes out of his way not to select C3PO or R2D2. It's Luke who's so damn adamant about getting C3PO, and they only get R2 because the other unit burnt out before it moved 50 feet... My thought is that he had some sort of subliminal memory of droids like these ones, and thus didn't like them. If memory serves, he actually bitches about them to Luke in Episode IV. He's also very pushy about Luke taking them up to Anchorhead to have their memories erased. Interesting.
Though I do like your comment about Padme and the oil bath.
.... um, i lost you after "0110100001101001".
Jesus, just enjoy it. Quit over analyzing it.
Um. Well there are two schools of thought when it comes to a form of art:
1. Those who enjoy it for its own sake.
2. Those who enjoy it for intellectual reasons.
Take anything: music, film, fine art. Whatever and you will find these two camps (the second being smaller than the first).
Now your post title is "It's just a movie" so I assume you are in the first camp. Basically the rule of thumb is if you liked the movie or not. Binary. Runs. or Hangs. And that's fine.
The second group are those who take an active interest in looking deeper into a form of art. The political reasons. The creator's own personal relations to it. Larger social meaning and how it fits into the larger genre. Here analyisis brings deeper understanding of the film and thus more pleasure than just sitting back and watching it.
A good parallel is David Sirlin's editiorials on Street Fighter II. His gist? Either you enjoy video games just to play them, or you enjoy them by winning (and winning takes analysis of the deeper mechanics of the game).
In all things either it is just a meaningless pastime or a deep and profound experience. Passive enjoyment or active involvement. Understand that there are people who enjoy the same things you do but for different reasons.
What is music when you despise all sound?
This is not to say that Star Wars has been a goldmine of originality, of course.
TWW
"Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
There has to be more to Yoda than meets the eye. First he (apparentlly) has no clue as to what is going on around him in the most recent films. Second -- Their is a questionable amount of mystery as to why he went into hiding during the last 3 star wars movies. I think Brin has a good theory that Lucas could use to tie up the MANY loose ends in this story. I just can't help but think that Yoda's mysterious actions and apparent ignorance is the biggest outstanding mystery of all.
(+1 Funny) only if I laugh out loud.
The only people I ask to address me as Doctor are those who introduce themselves as Dr. whomever. Everybody else just calls me by my first name. I've always felt that as long as I have confidence in my knowledge and abilities, I don't need to push the handle.
1984 was supposed to be a warning, not an instruction manual.
Oh, wait this is /. of course not.
Brin makes an outlandish suggestion. What if Vader and Obi won were working together against both the jedi and the empire? It would explain all the inconsistencies in the 5 movies so far!
Go read the article, it's right at the bottom. Awesome idea.
Liberty.
Seriously. He did a great job summing up every single Disney movie ever made:
The hero begins reluctant, yet signs and portents foretell his pre-ordained greatness. He receives dire warnings and sage wisdom from a mentor, acquires quirky-but-faithful companions, faces a series of steepening crises, explores the pit of his own fears and emerges triumphant to bring some boon/talisman/victory home to his admiring tribe/people/nation.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
heheh,
:)
:("
seeing Yoda fight was like losing one's virginity - couldn't wait for it to happen, but it was almost anti-climactic after the fact.
But who wants to stay a virgin? I'd rather have an experience than anticipate it - that's just me
"I much preferred the mystery, but now I am ruined.
Lucas popped your cherry. I guess he should have been more gentle. Seeing Yoda fight like kermit on crack was a little rough. I feel your pain.
Robots are everywhere, and they eat old people's medicine for fuel.
This is typically the stance I take when someone starts to critique Star Wars as well. I do, however, enjoy hearing intelligent critiques and laughing about the shortcomings with friends.
This is not one of those times.
This man's article falls short in several areas. First and foremost, he's plain wrong on some of his assumptions.
Let's not even go into micro-illogicalities, like having CP30 work for 'Uncle Owen' for ten years... then later they won't recognize each other at all.
I mention this because it's hinted again and again that Anakin will "unite" the schism in the force. But this has been poorly foreshadowed at any level. Have we even a hint what this MEANS?
Has he forgotten there's another movie coming, one which takes place between AOTC and ANH? Perhaps Lucas is leading us on because, oh, I don't know...he wants us to eagerly anticipate and try to predict what really DOES happen? I, for one, would be horribly disappointed if GL tried to hammer some of these things home with a sledge hammer, it would take away from my imagination.
Minor nitpick... did anyone notice the repeated use of the phrase 'fire on the Federation starship!' and 'don't let the Federation starship get away!'
What are these guys -- Klingons?
Trade Federation. I'm not going to dictionary.com to lookup the word's definition, but I'd guess there are plenty of reasons to use it, and I guarantee it was around before Star Trek.
Yoda -- the green-asbestos oven mitt
Again and again, we see Anakin being punished for being, er, human.
A dig at Star Trek? What do you want, a monopoly? Hey, people have enjoyed 100 times as many hours of that universe as they have yours, George. Live with it.
Despite every flaw, there IS a way that Lucas could weave all the threads together and pull a miracle of cinematic legerdemain, causing it all to make magnificent sense.
I'd wager my house that he won't do it.
I have serious problems with people giving THIS TYPE of criticism of George Lucas. He has, quite arguably, the most succesful saga ever seen on the screen. Millions upon millions of people flock to see his movies, more often than not 3-4 times in the theatres alone. Typically, finding someone who hasn't seen Star Wars is met with "What?! How's that possible?!". If it's a guy being asked, I'd outright disbelieve them. My point is, unless you can come up with a reason contradicting why the better part of the world has seen Star Wars and thoroughly enjoys it, I don't think criticism of GL really stands.
--trb
Maybe their memory data is stored differently than their personality data...MAN THIS CONVERSATION JUST GOT LAME.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
Okay, I'm tired of seeing this thing linked to, so I will post my rather extensive rebuttal. Even if the author was joking, which I don't think he was.
I'm not going to deal with his ignorance of the Expanded Universe, I don't like his reasons but I'll let it be. I'll refute him with the movies.
The notion that the Emperor was a benign dictator like Pinochet--I don't know where to start. I'm sure Chile would be most impressed to learn that Pinochet was "benign." Thousands killed for political reasons is not "benign."
Now, he has a point that Alderaan was probably armed. Most planets are. That's not illegal. Destruction of those weapons would have been a legitimate military exercise. Now, I ask you this: is it legitimate to slaughter civilians to destroy those targets? Especially if you're doing it to blackmail a resistance leader? Who happens to be a member of your own governing body? That would be akin to Bush nuking New York because Hillary Clinton would blow him. I mean, really. Who's the author trying to kid?
He speaks of the system of regional governors, owing their fealty to the Emperor, and what a nice system was and how the Emperor's death would shatter it all. First of all, it's not much of a system if it takes one man (in a galaxy of quadrillions or more) to hold it all together. That they would squabble speaks poorly of Palpatine's judgement.
Yes it's true that the Empire is a meritocracy. Do what we say or we kill you. Do it right while doing what we say or we kill you. Never does he question the ethics of such a policy.
How are Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru traitors? They bought two droids secondhand from junk dealers. The droids weren't stolen, so all you can get them on is harboring fugitives. Except, those droids were abandoning ship. Hell, C-3PO didn't even know what R2-D2 had. If you want to get technical, R2-D2 should be gotten for possessing stolen goods, 3P0 for aiding a felon...There were no grounds for executing them, especially since without the droids there was no proof. I didn't see the Jawas give Owen a receipt.
As for his bashing of the Jedi, I will suggest to him "hubris," and ask him if the Jedi ever killed innocent people at random. Moreover, the Jedi are elevated by biology, and the cultivation of resultant abilites. A meritocracy, of sorts. Isn't that what he thought was so great about the Empire?
As for the Republic putting down the rebellion...they were simply a regime fighting a violent group committed to their overthrow...like the Empire.
His article is amusing, but I see people taking it seriously, thus I must point out these inconsistencies and logical fallacies. The Empire benign? Please...
~Chazzf
No statement is true, not even this one.
And what about those who enjoy analyzing it?
Let us know when you win a Nebula or Hugo, OK?
R2 was being *sent* explicitly to Obi-wan Kenobi, on Tatooine. Remember that little message that R2 had to deliver? From a daughter of Vader, to the trainer of Vader, using a droid of Vader, on Vader's home planet, which just happens to have Vader's son on it as well. Of course, I know the Lucas fans will say there is some lame way (are human memories routinely erased in the Star Wars universe?) that *Vader* doesn't notice this, but still can remember enough about Obi-Wan and his past to say that Kenobi's "failure will be complete."
Anyhow, to get back to the parent post: it's rather hard to deliver a personal message without being able to recognize the recipient.
Same thing that Hitler did, several of the Roman emperors, and so on.
In the first movie, he gets the largely ceremonial post of Supreme Chancellor; he officates the Senate, which basically means he gets to 'recognize' who is speaking. Also, he likely gets to form 'subcommittees' for things that the Senate has decided to 'investigate' such as the problems on Naboo. Otherwise, probably lots of kissing babies and opening bridges.
Also, and far more insidiously, he plants the idea that the Senate is too big and bloated to actually do anything in a timely fashion.
In II, he engineers a war crisis. Then, he gets himself granted 'emergency powers.' The analog here is Republican Rome; an Emperor would appoint a Dictator (Speaker) who would wield absolute power during times of war, then hand control back to the civilian gov't when the crisis was past.
Now that he has those powers, he can keep them until HE decides that the 'crisis' has passed. But it won't have. He'll next put into place the command struture of the Empire; Moffs rule systems, Grand Moffs rule sectors, and report back to him. The Senate, at this point, is rubber stamping things. Then, as we hear at the start of IV, he dissolves them, and the Republic becomes the Empire.
Also, expect him to do something to turn the Galaxy at large against the Jedi; he'll probably point out how they were completely incapable of stopping the Kamino insurrection, for example. Then, he'll have them hunted down and killed behind the scenes.
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This is an extremely interesting twist in the plot, but I don't think it has any chance of happening. Not because of Lucas's ego or anything like that though. I think it won't happen because Yoda is such a beloved character. It would be like if in the new Indiana Jones movie we find that Indy has joined the Nazis, or something like that (well maybe not THAT bad, but you know). Lots of people would be really pissed.
If a slightly different version of this plot existed, where Yoda doesn't actually have evil intentions and isn't really working with the the Sith, then maybe there's a chance. Like Vader and Obi-wan decided Yoda needed to be curbed but not because he was evil. I dunno.
Just my thoughts.
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. -- Carl Sagan
There are much better, truer, more uplifting stories about Good vs. Evil out there. George's vision makes me want to join the Empire, seek out the Dark Side, and thus avoid being an incompetent, lying little scrotum hiding out in a swamp.
Your rallying cry of "the theme is valid, so the story is good!" only carries so far. After that, the heart and mind revolt, and I look for better stories.
Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.
Sheesh, lighten up. I don't need to put a tag in there, do I? At least the moderator got it...
Neither is a doctorate in Space Physics the same as a doctorate in Polical Science, or a doctorate in chiropractic medicine.
All the same, having a doctorate in any field implies a strong degree mastery within that field. And, people may have different reasons for using their titles either in formal writing or in dealings with others.
In formal writing, formal speaking, and in "expert's" work (including anything from engineering to medicine), it's a way to preemptively answer the question of, 'who are you that your claims count for anything'. Answer: I am an acknowledged master of my field of knowledge, and I have worked hard to attain this level of knowledge, I have the papers from an accredited institution to prove it.
In the military, and in certain halls of academia, it's a way of establishing pecking order. 'Who are you that I should do what you say?' Answer: I'm your professor, or your commander, Mister, so mind your manners.
And, some folks just prefer to be called 'Dr.' the way some folks prefer a nickname or their middle name over their full name. Or the way some women prefer 'Ms.' over 'Mrs.' or 'Miss'. I know of at least one Dr. who has a feminist aversion to gender-specific titles, and I respect that. My father just prefers Dr. to his former military title.
In other words, however he wants to sign his name, it's his biz.
Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.
It's a matter of context. The 70's were full of "anti-hero" movies - Bonnie and Clyde, Dirty Harry, etc - that people were longing for simple Good vs Evil plots and action. Darth Vader was unambiguously bad, Luke Skywalker was unambiguously good. Star Wars was a breath of fresh air in a very dark decade for movies.
Of course Star Wars was derivative - that's a big part of why it worked. We didn't have to contemplate the brooding anti-hero's motivations. The robots were from Kurosawa, the final Death Star battle was from Dambusters and other WWII movies, and the overall structure from old movie serials like Flash Gordon. This was familiar ground writ large.
Raiders of the Lost Ark succeeded for much the same reasons.
It is not a "terrific plot", and it's not terribly original, either (I've been hearing similar theories since Episode 1 was released). As Brin himself points out, it can't work for one simple reason: Darth Vader killed far too many people.
I mean, maybe he could have been forced to kill a couple of people just to convince the emperor he really was on the dark side. A tough moral choice but in the end he decided the sacrifice of a few was necessary to save the majority, sort of thing. But when the undercover agent kills more people than the godfather, then there's no way you can make him turn out to be a good guy after all.
No, I think Episodes 2 and 1 really did more damage than Episode 3 can possibly fix. And what's worse, if you see them in the new order, the original movies (which are excellent) will now seem to be full of contradictions. Lucas might as well have made a completely separate story (same universe, perhaps, but not directly connected to the original movies).
After I saw Episode 1, a friend of mine asked me "so, how did you find the plot?" and I said "I didn't".
The only way to fix things is if, in Episode 3, J.R. wakes up and all this turns out to have been a dream.
RMN
~~~
It's OK for fans of a genre/author to comment, but not other people who also work in the same field?
I can understand the "conflict of interest" argument re: making a living out of making things/making a living out of critiqueing the made things", but you appear to be basing this on the idea of "bad taste".
I think this is the sort of thing that should happend much more often - it's also the sort of thing that gets little publicity, as it's not in the distributor's (movies, TV, books, etc.) financial interest for the audience to feel conflicted about buying into X.
Critics tends to be "3rd-parties" to provide a comfortable layer preventing the audience from feeling conflicted about what they are interested in seeing.
Here's exactly the sort of thing that studios hate: "I like Director A + Director B; A trashed B's last movie - am I allowed to like them both anymore??!!" Very junior high.
Adults can be more sophisticated about their patronage choices... but XXX made how many hundred million?
Just a few:
- Angle the deflector shields.
These beg the question, "Where do they come up with this stuff?"--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
I can remember sitting in the theater watching AotC and leaning over to whisper to my friend that this could have been a SciFi channel special.
I was annoyed I paid money to see it and glad my wife wouldn't see it until it was 2nd or worse in the box office for 2 weeks in a row. I think AotC was a perfect made for TV popcorn show....
that is it.
"Only one thing, is impossible for god: to find any sense in any copyright law on the planet." Mark Twain
It's OK for fans of a genre/author to comment, but not other people who also work in the same field?
That's right.
Imagine this:
Michael Jackson: Bon Jovi Sucks!
In this case, we'd all think MJ was an idiot for criticizing another musician.
Now, imagine this:
Michael Jackson Fan: Bon Jovi Sucks!
No big deal. A fan can declare that they like or hate something freely.
If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
But after hearing all the reviews about how awful the film was, I've never been able to bring myself to watch it.
I thought Practice Effect was a good read as well, but again it was a long time ago I read it.
"I found the article fragmented and poorly written."
Hmm, maybe that's cause the article was _fragmented_ (it was clearly a hodge podge of Brin's thoughts on the subject) and also written with _little attention to detail_ (poor doesn't really apply here). The guy clearly has better things to do than spend lots of time correcting spelling mistakes on random thoughts on some B movie he took his kids to see.
Leia got the droid off the ship with the message for Obi-Wan, she just really lucked out she did it above his home planet.
Ok, that's a stretch, but still.
Finally, math books without any of that base 6 crap in them.
Do you think a viewer in the theater will sit and think through such explanations as they watch the poor dialogue on the screen? Or would a viewer rather just see a good emotional performance that conveys to them all of those explanations in the first place? It's called acting.
For someone who is "all of a sudden getting this rush of feelings" and another someone who "has never loved before either since her life has been spent in the political spotlight," you'd think their performances would better reflect those emotions. Instead, I had to come to Slashdot for trb001 to describe it out to me because the dialogue and acting was so poor.
From what you describe, I should have been seeing incredible passionate romance in the AOTC I saw. But I didn't.
Actually, it's amusing that you bring that up. The US of A has been in a legal 'state of emergency' since the late 1930s, as I recall; I'll have to go find the reference.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
The article or the movie?
If you can come up with a good reason why Anakin ignored his mother for ten years and why Amidala, Obi Wan, or anyone else who was friends with Anakin with enough money for a Speeder couldn't have easily bought her freedom other than plot necessity, then I'll believe you might have a point.
The enemies of Democracy are
No, he is saying if you assume some of the good guys are really bad guys and vice versa, their meaningless, plot-convenient actions would suddenly have true motivations.
He's saying assume that the Emperor AND Yoda are the bad guys, and that Obi Wan AND Vader are the good guys.
The enemies of Democracy are
Yes, he certainly is and certainly was played as Maori in the film. I'm reminded of the uproar in jewish circles about the "shylock character" of the junk dealer in TFM. He's not supposed to be jewish - he's supposed to be italian. Not only is he supposed to be italian, he is obviously a deliberate parody of Dino Delaurentis...
-- your Web browser is Ronald Reagan
brin thinks that the mention of "Federation starships" is a dig at Trek. I thinkn he's grasping at straws.
The ships belonged to the Trade Federation. I'm guessing it's called Trade Federation because Alliance was already taken and other synonyms like Union or Guild might have caused different "issues".
my blog: good times, man, good times
Exactly. I thought the whole reason Luke was on back-woods Tatooine ("If there's a bright center to the Universe you're on the planet that it's farthest from,") was so Vader couldn't find him. I was sorely disappointed to see that Anakin had been born and raised on Tatooine too, and that he and Luke's mother return for frequent visits. Everyone in the Republic seems to know about the place. Can't George come up with any more planets?
A Ph.D. is not something that is waved about publically in polite society, even in academia. I should say especially in academia. It's pretty much assumed that all faculty members have one, so the important title is the one that indicates their position. Consequently, "Dr." suggests that they have no other title worth mentioning, and the really high-strung academic types will regard it as a positive insult.
In normal society, only MDs and holders of similar degrees such as DDS or DO -- that is, those who actually treat ailing people -- are addressed socially as "Dr." Everyone else, including boastful Ph.D.s, are "Mr." or "Ms". Just ask Miss Manners. That Brin insists on trumpeting his degree does him no credit.
And the brethren went away edified.
I was just saying that most of the people I know don't view Yoda as a very good character and would be happy to see this plot twist put into play.
But I do believe your are correct, it just wouldn't fly with most of the fans.
Brin- science fiction writer, where writers:
Lucas- science fiction (though he won't admit it) movie / TV director, where directors:
But I doubt Lucas will ever hear Brin: Lucas seems to have surrounded himself with yesmen, who rarely pass on negative articles. (Plus, for him to listen would be evidence that his work and inspiration came in part from SF and the space opera of his youth.)
I agree with the folks who tell you to stick with the Uplift books. I would say that really, everything of his I've read has been pretty good. One in particular I urge you not to overlook is Heart of the Comet. A collaboration with Gregory Benford, it starts off as a fairly mundane "expedition finds life on Haley's Comet" story, but then really gets interesting.
"The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
"She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts, kid."
"Curse my metal body, I wasn't fast enough!"
"Look at the size of that thing!"
"Sorry about the mess..."
"You came in that thing? You're braver than I thought."
"Aren't you a little short for a storm trooper?"
"You've got something jammed in here real good."
"Put that thing away before you get us all killed!"
"Luke, at that speed do you think you'll be able to pull out in time?"
"Get in there you big furry oaf, I don't care *what* you smell!"
Top Ten Sexually Tilted Lines in "The Empire Strikes Back"
"And I thought they smelled bad...on the outside!"
"Possible he came in through the south entrance."
"I must've hit it pretty close to the mark to get her all riled up like that, huh kid?"
"Hurry up, golden-rod..."
"That's okay, I'd like to keep it on manual control for a while."
"But now we must eat. Come, good food, come..."
"Control, control! You must learn control!"
"There's an awful lot of moisture in here."
"Size matters not. Judge me by my size, do you?"
"I thought that hairy beast would be the end of me!"
Top Ten Sexually Tilted Lines in "Return of the Jedi"
"Rise, my friend."
"Open the back door!"
"Hey, point that thing somewhere else!"
"It's just a dead animal..."
"Not bad for a little fur ball."
"How can they be jamming us if they don't know we're coming?"
"Come here, I won't hurt you. You want something to eat?"
"Keep on that one, I'll take these two"
"I want you to take her. I mean it, take her!"
"I don't think the Empire had wookies in mind when they designed her, Chewie."
...myself, I can testify to the complete accuracy of your statements.
It took one bad relationship for me to realise that lust really was a world apart from love, and 5 more "interesting" relationships to get anywhere close to having understanding and control over my feelings.
Yes, AotC had tacky romantic dialog... Yes, we all cringed... No, it was not crappy romance, or bad writing; it was 100% accurate material from someone who remembers being 19 and "In Love."
Geeze, I remember telling a girl I was interested in that running around flashing Loscon in a pair of speedos just wouldn't be the same without her. How many of you have said equally wierd things..? : )
(Out of curiosity, I wonder how many people here will suddenly respond... "Oh, so *you're* the one who..!"
Sheesh, does noone here appreciates the value of rivalry and competition? ;)
Musicians, authors, artists, etc. are all on some level entertainers - there's a long long long historical record of rivalries between poets, painters, musicians, etc. Check out what Byron wrote about his contemporaries- or better yet, what the wrote about him!
More recently, the Oasis/Blur rivalry between Blur + Oasis was an _obsessive_ topic in the UK music scene for _years_.
This sort of rivalry can be genuinely productive, by making both sides work harder to top the other. "Competition" is a concept you might read up on...
Certainly, if MJ said "Bon Jovi sucks" we'd go "Dumbass". Then again, MJ and Bon Jovi travel in _very_ different musical circles - their music isn't expected to influence each other, let along compete in the marketplace. Perhaps if he had something relevant to say then it would be worth listening. The fact that he most likely doesn't says more about the division between genres in the current music market than it does about his right to comment on the work of other musicians.
Brin, on the other hand, is an acclaimed SF author, and Star Wars is an SF phenomenon (movies, books, etc.). This is his ballpark! This is is area of expertise! He's not only expected, but practically _required_ to have an opinion on Star Wars! Does he have to publish his opinion, no...
But guess what? By publishing his opinion he can provide entertainment and insight to others, and add to conversation of ideas in his chosen field of practice.
In this case it is hopeless that Lucas will actually listen to another human being, but that in no way deprives Brin of his right to call "foul!" on something he sees as polluting the marketplace he works within.
Whooops, guess I let myself get trolled. Alas...
David Brin's well-reasoned and critical approach comes the Western tradition of analytic philosophy. Now can I ask you for exactly where your critique comes from?
Comparative philosophy, here we come.
Read carefully. Brin is saying that this fact was never communicated in the film. And he does provide a good reason for ignoring everything written about the Star Wars universe.
Episode II: Attack of the Clones plays on American paranoia about Mexican immigration with its army of lookalikes marching in lockstep by the tens of thousands. The fact that the soldiers are bred on the planet Kamino --- which sounds like the Spanish word 'camino' --- is a dead giveaway to the bias and bounty hunter Jango Fett even looks Latino
Brin quotes what the Latino community is complaining about, then goes on to say that *normally* he'd consider this PC hysteria, but maybe, just maybe, there's something to it.
I completely lost him at this point. I'm sorry, but 'Kamino' for all we know could have been taken from the old El Caminos. Maybe Lucas was a car buff. And you damn well better believe if he never hired Latino actors for his movies, the shit would hit the fan. Considering that Boba Fett is widely considered by fans to be one of the 'coolest' Star Wars characters, I don't quite see how this is a bad thing for Latinos.
You might as well say that Lucas has a thing against car buffs with dark hair - your argument would hold about as much water.
And God forbid he ever use characters with any accents again (the other common 'racism' complaint of late with Star Wars). Know what? By making a character sound/look/act different, that's is PRECISELY what makes them alien. That's not racism, that's human nature. Trek has been doing this for decades now (hordes and hordes of alien races who look *similar* to us, but maybe with a different skin color), and I don't see any mass outcry against it. You have to make aliens different somehow, or else they wouldn't be.. alien. Accented English is a very effective medium for this - human beings of the same species speak in different accents, why wouldn't different species? Of course, the odds of them speaking the same language at all are pretty slim, but you have to draw the line somewhere unless you want the next Star Wars (now with no racial stereotypes!) to look like a foreign film filled with subtitles.
Methinks Mr. Brin, much as I love most of his writing, wants very badly to jump on the bash Lucas bandwagon. All he's done is re-hash the same tired criticisms of Lucas and Star Wars, wrapped in bigger words and more obscure concepts.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
What, blowing up Alderan isn't evil enough for you?
Whoever stated that signature sizes should be limited to one hundred and twenty characters can just go ahead and kiss my
I wasn't trolling, the moderators are just idiots.
All your points are well taken, but I disagree with you that criticism of others is necessary for competition. Maybe *you* should brush up on it, and you might get rid of the misconception.
People who are in the public eye don't improve their image by being catty. The only way to rise above cattyness is to be really really good at what you do and ignore everything that you might consider lesser than you. That's part of a formula for a good public image.
If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
the ships are fugly. give me flying space junk ANYday! go Explorers!
-l
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While I appreciate your high-mindedness, I would be terribly upset to live in a world where people didn't hold strong opinions, and express them with equal vigor.
Certainly, David Brin may lose some audience members who are offended by the release of his unfettered opinion into the terrifying wilds of the public mind - however, I much prefer this approach to the the ice-cream smooth "personas" taken on by the majority of public figures.
Could Brin's tone have cleaned up his tone a bit? Sure, but he was clearly aiming for casual, non-academic tone - he wished to engage with other SF fans on a personal level, while applying his professional expertise. By taking on a casual tone, he would avoid the pedantic sensibility that he railed against in his essay. So what that he talked some shit - if you were offended, I'm sure you're not the audience he was trying to persuade.
As for me, I find his willingness to call it as he sees it refreshing, esp. when the other choice is to pretend that he and all other professional SF authors/writes/directors/etc. (incl. Lucas) are members of a secret elite who may never be seen to comment on each other in public outside of making simple reassuring and supportive grunts.
So many "public figures" are afraid to have opinions - there's a real difference between acting civility and avoiding conversation entirely. In a choice between narcissistic self-involvement and engagement with the outside world, I find the public figures who are willing to engage in an actual conversation with the public to be far more compelling than, oh, for example... George Lucas. (sorry, that was low. but fun and appropriate.)
OTOH, I will allow that it is certainly possible to take this approach to far as well - for an example of this, check out Harlan Ellison. However, IMHO Brin has _plenty_ of karma left to burn before he goes from "opinionated" to "crank".
No, that was an example of above average acting in a film that fills a similar role. Comparing the acting to, say, One Flew Over the Cookoos Nest or Shawshank wouldn't exactly be a fair comparison. Apples to oranges and all that.
Science may someday discover what faith has always known.
I personally found the comment funny because I thought the same thing while watching the Episode II. Particularly interesting was the fact that the Republic's ships were called "spaceships" while Federation ships were called specifically "starships." In Star Trek, it's the starship Enterprise.
Er, I don't think that "Fantasia" follows that plot at all.
Have you ever seen Fantasia? It fits, albeit in a fucked-up drug-haze way.
But then, it's a fucked-up drug-haze movie.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
"' The analog here is Republican Rome; an Emperor would appoint a Dictator (Speaker) who would wield absolute power during times of war, then hand control back to the civilian gov't when the crisis was past."
Well, the first problem with this description is that when Rome was a Republic, there was no Emperor. That, in fact, is why it was called a Republic.
I hope yr implying that he orally ingested said 30 lbs of feces.
otherwise it wouldn't be right.
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
Depends on which point of history; you'd have Imperial Rome, Republican Rome, Imperial Rome with a Senate doing useful things, Imperial Rome NOT using a Senate to do useful things....
But, aye, I should have said 'The Senate would appoint a dictator....
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
Dark Star did the grunge low-life in space bit three years before Star Wars.
I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
The reason for this is not to be a troll. I say this becuase I was brought up an Easterner, and I know too many people who claim deep understanding, when the point of it is not *understanding*. Thus my criticism.
David Brin's literary decontruction of George Lucas is perfectly right. His method of borrowing the tropes of Eastern mysticism lacks true understanding of the mind of a oriental philosophers. And it shows, in his ridiculous plotline.
Not to mention that Lucas has the noisiest light in the universe as well as the most sound conductive vacumes of any galaxy!
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL