Slashdot Mirror
The Future of Game Dev (Except in St. Louis)
ksquire writes "Ben Sawyer, of Digitalmill, has published an interesting article at Avault.com about
the past, present, and future of game development.
Sawyer argues that the game industry is going more and more toward 3rd party development tools and '4th party' publishing -- meaning that game developers are essentially tool developers for game enthusiasts to create mods (also using tools like Alienbrain or Discreet's
GMAX).
I'm really curious as to whether the Slashdot community thinks we'll see a future era of standardized game tools and developers courting modders, or if we'll continue to see more specialized game engines. Maybe a greater PC / Console split?"
Meanwhile, over in St. Louis, the Free Expression Policy Project has filed an
amici curiae brief
by 33 media scholars saying that "Most studies and experiments on video games containing violent content have not found adverse effects."
They're trying to stop the county from banning violent games --
Wired has the story.
ksquire points out that "Sawyer also wrote an article, Serious Games: Improving Public Policy through Game-Based
Learning and Simulation, which was
discussed on slashdot."
netphilter and TCPALaw get credit for the Wired link. Previous Slashdot stories on violent gaming include this one and this one.
TCPALaw's full comment was (minus a dangling modifier): "Wired has a nice story on the St. Louis ban on violent video games. If the ban sticks (it was upheld by Judge Limbaugh against a constitutional challenge... Rush Limbaugh's uncle ... the same judge who struck down the federal ban on junk faxes as an abridgment of free speech - go figure) it could be extended to MP games available to play over the Internet."
I've seen a HUGE decline of arcades here because of this ruling, many of them have closed. The local mall near me used to have an arcade...until they put in a police substation across the hall. I hate it here because of stupid stuff like this.
Studies show that, studies showing that video games cause violence in children, are what actually causes violence in children.
--
If you moderate this, then your children will be next.
Look at Half-Life. I can still, after how long now, fire up Half-Life and join a decent game.
;)
Hell, I can still find Quake 2 servers around, and there's still a few Quake 1 holdouts.
Gamers love mods. For the developer, it gives them a chance to experience how games are made first-hand and also gives them an arena to show off their skills to existing gaming houses.
For players? Depending on the mod community, it's like buying one game and getting ten in return. And everyone likes to save money, eh?
Uhhh
HallmarkOrnaments.Com
Having just started a game development project our major goals include cross-platform compatibility (ala SDL / OpenGL), modularity, and open formats.
How popular would Doom and Quake be without these things? Part of the fun of these games is the possiblity of expansion and innovation by peers. For example Capture the Flag was a user mod that was incorporated into later versions of the Quake series.
I hold a patent on sigs...
What would be cool to standardize would be the 3D modeling language and behavior scripting representations. After that it is a matter of compiling the world models and behaviorisms into the games custom binary representation.
We aren't that far from this now. There are a number of *common* engines. Various generations of Quake and Unreal seem to be used in all sorts of games. If both of these could compile levels and models designed in a standard 3D editor, others would surely follow.
I've seen alot of companies hiring people based off of their proven abilities in the mod field.
Likewise, I've seen people use their contacts in the mod community to get better jobs.
With some of the newer games coming out with good tool support (Unreal 2k3 has dedicated programs included, for example) for people to make their own content (be it maps, models, sounds, what have you), I fully expect game companies to actively search out mod teams.
Obvious case in point:
Think about what Valve would be doing right now if it wasn't for a very small number of mods.. (Counter-Strike, Day of Defeat, Action Half-life, etc... Especially Counter-Strike)
Building a good game engine vastly expands the reach of a game. For example, Zillions of Games, which is now a number of years old, is still considered the standard engine to use for all abstract strategy games. http://www.zillions-of-games.com/
NeverWinter Nights is demonstrating how RPGs can be expanded by a good game engine, with a good user construction interface.
I have seen a trend in closing arcades in many areas of the country. To my knowledge none of these areas have any such laws regarding the games.
The reason for the decline of arcades in your area may have something to do with your laws but, I think that the answer lies elsewhere.
As long as game engines provide a flexible enough API for building specialized modules for specific games, I think it will fly. The goal should be to make the engines modular enough, so that developers will be able to enhance specific aspects of the underlying engine without a major rewrite.
These two articles had nothing to do with each other, save for the fact that they both can be filed under the 'games' topic.
They should have been posted as separate stories. By trying to nail the two together as a single story, you're not doing anything except fragmenting the discussion.
What Microsoft wants to deny:
Many gamers have programming skills. I think this is great model for game developers to shoot to perfect. Why not simply create a game engine, with a 'default' game that comes with the game engine install to demo the game engines' features. Seems to me that ID did this without knowing with Quake 1 (anyone still love team fortress.) Look at Half-life, UT or most other FPS for examples.
This perspective only holds in the PC game enthusiast market. The PC market is only a fraction of the total videogaming market and the enthusiasts are only a fraction of that.
The really big market for games is not on PC but on consoles, where customization is pretty much unheard-of. If you think that the industry is getting large enough that 3rd parties can create a market selling tools or libs or whatever, then that's absolutely correct and has been so for over a decade. If you think the market is going to 'decentralize', think again.
Is the saved keystoke worth sounding like a manager?
I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
I'm not sure how it works in the US but movies here have ratings on them. If you want to rent a movie or see a movie that is rated R you have to show ID that you are over 18 or accompanied by an adult and so on for PG 13 and AA14 and so forth, and there are parental guides on content. Why not simply apply those ratings to video games, since movies and games are from a content standpoint comming together the existing rating system would apply. A parent who lets their 17 year old buy a R rated movie or game is less inclined to care about it's content than a 8 year old kid, but then the person legally responsible for the child is aware of what their child is doing (insofar as they chose to be).
Banning video games of any sort will be as effective as banning pornography or alcohol. Except al capone will be some guy with a webserver on a former british AA base in the middle of the atlantic.
Check out the list of scholars who are particpating in the brief. Only a handful are psychologists, and that is the faculty which is perhaps best suited to investigating whether there is any connection between observation of violent behaviour and violent behaviour. A brief read of the bio's of the scholars further indicates that most of these people are stepping well beyond their area of expertise.
I would have thought that a brief to the court would carry more weight if the people lending their name to it had standing in the academic community in that area of research...
*** Where are we going? And what's with this handbasket?
i believe that once we have video cards that can all render scenes fsaa4x with *actual photo-realistic detail*, kind of like the NV30 but better... THEN we'll get standardized development environments & tools. THEN the crux of game development will be character development, art direction, and plot-related. The engine and graphics will be the easiest part. Developers will be able to focus on the game, and will not have to worry about framerates or physics engines, or light mapping techniques anymore.... it'll all be about developing a better story.... and OHHH THE FUN WE'LL HAVE THEN!
geeks are cats who dig a certain kind of cool
This is just like Dungeon and Dragons, they said it contributed to murders, suicide, and increased violence.
Funny how an increase in violent videos managed to contribute to decreased violent crimes throughout the 90's. Oh, that does not count that was the improved economy, with a weak economy there is increase in crime. So what they need to do is outlaw the economy taking a downturn, because THAT will prevent violence...
Did personal camcorders eliminate hollywood? Did affordable video equipment and home computing force ILM to close?
From the wired article: One studio recently signed a deal to make Doom a motion picture. /. story about this by now, or did I just miss it?
At first I presumed they meant the failed attempt several years ago, but then I found this article on Yahoo dated last Wednesday. I figured we would've seen a
The decline of arcades is not because of "the man" keeping the violent game-playing kids out of trouble in the malls, it's because arcade games just aren't the profitable business they were 15 years ago. (Arcades are SO 1980's!) I remember when I was a kid, arcades were a big deal because I never had a console. Even the friends who did have Ataris and Nintendos liked the arcades because they had higher quality games. So, it was worth a special trip to the mall to play "Altered Beast" or "Mortal Kombat".
Arcade games now are played more for the novelty than the experience. With the exception of maybe multiplayer racing games with cockpits, racing wheels, and gas pedals, games on todays home consoles are much higher quality, don't require rolls and rolls of quarters, and don't require a trip to the mall or the local pizza joint. The only reason I have to play a coin-op today is because there just happens to be one in the place I'm grabbing a burger, not because I'm going out of my way to play them. And if I see Galaxian sitting next to the latest version of Virtua Fighter, chances are I'm playing Galaxian, because I want a fun, simple game I don't have to pump 20 quarters in to master.
Again, I don't think the majority of readers here are worried about what this means for arcades. It's just an unfortunate nail in the coffin. What people *should* be worried about is how far the advocates of banning violent games will take this - internet cafes, online content, what is sold in the local Best Buy?
-the walrus
It's never black and white with anything. Do video games cause all kids to commit violent acts? No. Do some video games cause some kids to commit violent acts? Probably.
Children that watch other kids do things mimic them but the way to overcome that is to ensure that there is a good moral foundation ( which comes from parents )
Have we seen a spike in violence in children since video games became more prevalent? Yes. But why is the question. You'll note that this is the same time that most families had to start having two working parents ( to supplement income ) and so there isn't somebody to monitor tv, games and other media. Nobody there to comment on this being done in the game. Nobody to say "we don't do that in real life".
Studies and statistics are often misleading and misused. A prime example that we learned in a Psych 101 is that of Churches and Crime rate. Did you know that in areas with more churches there is a higher crime rate? Considering that astounding revelation we should ban churches since they obviously lead to crime.
The issue is that there isn't a direct relation, but rather a common factor between the two. Where are there more churches? In higher populated areas. Where is there more crime? In higher populated areas. The problem for higher crime is increased population, not churches.
However, those in congress and those doing this study use common link evidence and say it is a direct relationship as if anything is so black and white
The future of gaming is what every NES/atari/old school gamer has dreamed of. They always complain that games today are just copies of what is popular (how many quake/fps copycats can you name?).
Well, modding is changing all of that. When a game comes out, modders push the limits of the engines to do anything they want... the clincher is... they do it for free.
Now, for game designers to still make money, they have to come out with new and unique ideas. Doing your standard FPS ain't gonna do it anymore. Even single-player FPS with great plots are being done with mods. The games of tomorrow will have to be bigger and better than mod writers (or have a bigger and better engine), which means the days of the FPS copy-cat will soon be over.
Also, to note, some publishers are encouraging the modding community to step forward into the gaming industry. Just look at Garage Games. They are selling their Torque Engine (the engine behind tribes 2) for $100 for a non-commercial license (and if you make a commercial product with it, no problem, as long as garage games is your publisher).
Let the mod revolution continue!
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
You cannot ever hope to complete even ONE level of any modern game on a single coin. (Okay, 50 cents.) The games are designed to make sure you get killed off quickly and must pump more quarters into the machine just to continue. I know this may seems like a great idea to get more income, but in the end it just frustrates the game player. And yeah, home consoles are right up there in graphics and sound with the "full blown" arcade machines, so why bother going to the arcade?
In 1972, he invited Long Island mother Ronnie Lamb to bring her message to his show and launch her campaign to ban video games.
WTF was the violent video game in 1972? Death pong?
Did her Little Tommy kill somebody with a ping pong paddle? This is just silly.
Murphy was an optimist.
I think the underlying assumption is still sound, especially when most consoles now have HD's and network connections.
Even before those were availiable some games let you at least edit levels and save them on memory cards.
With network support, we might well see console makers host a mod site that would let console owners post new levels or perahps even TC's (like UT mods when the current UT client is put on the PS2 or XBox).
The exciting thing about console makers hosting mod sites is the possibility they could pay for licences in some universes (like Star Wars, or The Simpsons, or Land of The Lost [how much would that licence be? $9.99??]) and then hold contests to have people create legal mods using licenced content. At least that's what they would do if they had a shred of sense.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
"....meaning that game developers are essentially tool developers for game enthusiasts to create mods...."
well the thing that this may lead to is that it will just shift the model out one layer - in that all the really good mod developers out there might actually start game houses. Granted this would take a while - but you can even see now that some quake mod developers are starting small "companies" (term used very roughly) and creating products. Whether they are actually selling them - or just making them is another issue.
In any event - the rift might end up being so that the two types of really prevelant games are 1) MMORPGs and 2) Engine provided with a decent yet small Campaing ala NWN. with the tools and intentions for user end mods.
While I do not think that this model would apply to sports games - the RPG genre is definitely a perfect arena for this type of development model.
What we really need in gaming is some revelutionary ideas in the area of interface and gameplay (not to mention the need for new genres entirely - not an easy task.)
Modifier? I don't even know her!
(Rimshot)
I say cut out the middle man and just buy the engine yourself: http://www.conitec.net/a4info.htm
I mean why make a Mod that you don't legally own when you could just buy one of the many "off the shelf" engines and own the final product?
Studies have shown that most people making up studies that say killing in games leads to killing in real life were actually made up by the same person you killed in the same camping spot on dust2 in Counter-Strike until they got so frustrated, they left the game, and are now trying to make it professionally in the flamer industry. This is our payback for enjoying AWPing people.
SecondPageMedia - Wha
...meaning that game developers are essentially tool developers for game enthusiasts to create mods (also using tools like Alienbrain or Discreet's GMAX)
This is pretty flawed thinking. Because by that same logic, there should be little market for softare because clearly we can all just go get MS Visual Studio, or Perl, or PHP, or any number of other programming languages. Who needs application developers! Just give the masses programming languages.
Just because you give someone a tool doesn't mean they can create greatness. GMAX is definitely a "dumbed down" version of a more sophisticated package, but in no way has it streamlined the users (artists) creativity or imagination, not to mention sense of aesthetics, balance, and proportion.
Arcade games also have the problem that their goal tends to be to get the player to drop in as much cash as possible in the shortest time possible.
You don't often see a PC/Console racing game that doesn't let you finish a race if you don't hit all the checkpoints in a predetermined time. (With the exception of, say, Burnout and a few others.)
Console developers have a lot more freedom with what they can write, because they can assume there are no line-ups to deal with.
If a chair is thrown in a forest, and there are no witnesses, did Ballmer still do it?
A game engine that allows a user modification later is just gravy. We've pretty much have seen this as a marketing tool to get our game off the shelves and into the hands of gamers. The great success of the Quake and Unreal engines prove this. At first, just to play the Counter-Strike mod, you had to purchase Half-Life.
Currently, only independent developers are using these third-party engines. The main reason is that they lack the resources ($$$, time and people) to create their own engine. These groups quickly find that their engine lacks the power or doesn't handle game functions as they would like. The best games will have the game design create the engine and not the other way around.
Let's face it. To have a AAA title, you need to have your own proprietary engine. Those that use a high-end Quake or Unreal engine will often have to strip out and insert new code to make it work. (Wasn't Half-Life 85% new code?)
I only expect to see more proprietary engines being created (as it always has been) and the ability to create user modifications as a marketing tool to increase sales.
As long as the game makers limit the ability of the modders to be compensated for their work, then game engines will continue to be made.
Today, in many ways, you can "mod" a games using net built tools based on distributed games and have little chance of getting paid for your work (if you're lucky, you might get picked up by the original game producer). But, most modern games limit the ability of modders to actually sell their new levels, etc. (e.g. Neverwinter Nights)
The other way to "mod" the game is to actually license the engine from the creator, pay them a fee and/or royalty and be able to then distribute your work based on the engine.
Licensing the engine tends to give you a bit more flexibility in the final game, as you may be able to modify the actual source of the engine, whereas with typical mods you can not.
It would be an interesting development when you can get a "reasonably priced" license from, say, Blizzard to build new mission sets for WC3 and then be able to sell them. Here, you don't license the actual engine, but rather simply use the tools that the internal level designers used to create single play campaigns for resale.
This way, for example, WC3 becomes not simply a game, but also an authoring tool. The issue here, of course, is that if you're licensing the world building component, then later there may be difficulties regarding expanding and enchancing the games through patches and what not. If Blizzard decides to tweak a spell or capability in the core game, that tweak may throw a 3rd party scenario out of balance enough to ruin the scenario for players.
These could all be dealt with, of course, but it would require some extra maintenance and forethought and communication by Blizzard. Now, since there are no licensees of the world building piece, they can change whatever they want and all of the hobbyist fan made changes can be damned.
Mods are a great way to extend the longevity of a game (Total Annihilation anyone?), and keep it popular, but with the engines becoming more sophisticated, it would be nice to have channel for professional 3rd party content as well as amateur content.
I like it when people with little game experience start predicting the future of games. The article rehashes some of the popular predictions and adds one or two new ones, probably to legitimize whatever business model they're trying to use. If Mr. Sawyer wishes to continue speculate about the future of games he may want to spend some time in the industry before doing so.
"This evolutionary process is not finished. Increased compartmentalization and object orientated advances will enable re-usable components, character behaviors, game logic and audiovisual content. Over time, some forms of fundamental standardization for various types of content may allow users and developers to interchange content from one product with that from another."
Standardization? Sheya. We don't even have a standard animation format from product to product *from the same company*. Engine programmers are constantly attempting to gain speed and compression of assests and each rev of the engine will affect how assests processed. Even if you could standardize a 3D model format and an animation format you still need some way to hook it up to the game. The day performance is no longer an issue is the day you'll see standardization.
"Key trends in development, including online worlds, continuous development and after-market products from fourth-party developers require new distribution systems."
Oh yes, pay-to-play. That'll go over big with gamers. You dont own the disc anymore and you can't play if you're connection is down. Gamers rent the software, even if it's a one-player game. The Xbox os ready to do this (who woulda thunk it), but the PS2 and Gamecube can't unless you force players to buy more stuff.
"Continuous Development" - old hat.
wasn't the bit on the legal action involving violent games already posted on /. last week?
Today's gamers are tomorrow's game developers, and I think this is something that wasn't as true ten years ago.
With the recent increased popularity in both video games and software development, making mod-able games isn't so much a new innovation, but really just a logical step forward. Game developers can safely assume that at least a couple hundred of their players will be talented programmers, and from those a collection will be willing to work on things like mods. The benefits of this possibility are fairly obvious (look at other posts), and really the only cost is the need to organize your code into an SDK, which is probably benefits your codebase considerably if you are thinking about this from the start.
Someone else mentioned this, but not only will you possible generate new games that will add to the value of your game, but the programmers who worked on these project are probably just the type you want working in your company, allowing you to basically hand-pick a few new programmers for your company from the vast pool of modders working on your game. I'm almost certain that Valve Software (Half-Life) hired a few guys from some mods, and I think they even keep the Counter-Strike developers on payroll just so they will continue their work.
All this of course applies to artists and such as well.
Your signatures belong to me.
I think that while we'll continue to see proprietary technology like UnrealEd, DromEd, Radiant, etc. in the game development world, there will also be a push towards engine technology that is directly compatible with the tools that are already on the market.
;) In the end, these kids are growing up to become more than just members of the community, and will be purchasing licenses for these packages for work.
Making it easier for people with Lightwave, Maya, Max, Nendo, Mirai, et al, to contribute directly to game content without jumping over any hurdles is a win-win situation for both the gaming community and the companies that make these products.
There's always the argument that teenagers can't afford Max or Lightwave, but somehow they still manage to create whole sites of tutorials based on such software
It only makes sense for companies, in both a business and ease-of-use sense, to move away from the proprietary, and towards more open design standards that profit everyone.
Before developers can push the future of gaming development, and allow "4th party" users to create mods, we'll have to invent some pronouns with which to refer to these 4th parties! I mean, we already have 1st, 2nd, and 3rd person pronouns -- I, you, and he/she/it respectively. What will the 4th person pronouns be like? Are these at all related to the modifications to tenses required by time travel as expanded on by Douglas Adams?
The following sentence is true. The preceding sentence was false.
When was the last time you made a console game? Why is it then that as a console ages, the games that come out push the limit of the console to new heights? Customization on a console port is key to really making the game hum. As developers become more intimate with the hardware, they come up with new hacks and tricks to get that extra chuck of processing power or memory bank switching to achieve new effects.
Please note that St. Louis City and St. Louis County are completely seperate entities (and have been for well over 100 years). There is much animosity between the two and the hillbilly ignorance of the county should not be considered as a reflection on the city, which is much more sophisticated (this is only said partially tongue in cheek, you don't have to get far outside the city limits to be in Mississippi Burning land).
this is getting old and so are you
blog
Those who would blame video games for violent behavior do not understand the cause of violence. Fear fuels hatred, and hatred fuels violence. Without the hatred, violence cannot flourish. If anything, video games reduce the level of stress an individual is experiencing, making it less likely that an individual will become violent.
What this is really about is blame shifting. White middle class America can't even grasp the concept that they might somehow be responsible for the angst level of minorities and the underpriveledged. It is much easier for suburban America to have a politician pass a law against "violent" video games than it is for them to take a hard look at their own lifestyles. This way, they feel as if they are "doing something" while absolving themselves of any responsibility for the condition of their communities.
The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.
Ah.
... Wizard of Wor.
The days of 'Aladdin's Castle' at one end of the mall, five dollars, and 25 tokens.
And each game was one token! (This was around 1983, give or take. The days of Defender and Pac Man and Donkey Kong.)
And my personal favorite
Of course, playing Wizard of War or Tron or Bump and Jump or Mappy or Spy Hunter on MAME is nowhere near the same experience at those early years in the arcade...
'Customization' refers to userland customization. OF COURSE the console devs tweak out ports of games for that system. Anyone who would propose otherwise has never put down a line of code in his or her life. But console devs don't publish API's so that users can do mods or total conversions like the article is proposing is the inevitable future for all gaming.
Some of the best games of recent memory for me were designed with technologies that are not particularly platform-specific. Id Software showed this during Quake III Arena beta development. Their initial public beta offering was available only for Mac OS systems in the first few days (specifically targeting a system at the time that came with a powerful video card).
That small example expresses a point when developing games. It's not all one world, and many people no longer accept that a particular game is available only for one device (PC, console, whatever). All of these platforms have already converged in technologies and aren't particularly different except for the game accessory hooks (Windows: DirectX, Mac OS 9: InputSprockets) that make porting a pain in the patootie. Some companies that port the most popular PC games to other platforms or develop their games with concurrent release are great at it, but something's amiss now. The lack of ports for Linux games is shameful, given that one of the most popular UNIX-class operating systems show that these games work in this area (Mac OS X). I know it's not a "just recompile" thing, but it shouldn't be that hard, right?
I'm not a programmer, but I've read the general qualms that make game development so richly rewarding and a pox on your soul. In a utopian game development world, I'd stick with these standards:
- USB devices with common, open source drivers that work anywhere (everything handles USB now). Screw proprietary or legacy connectors.
- OpenGL, OpenGL, OpenGL: Everything works with it--just keep refining it
- Clone John Carmack, Westlake Interactive, Blizzard, Aspyr, and any other company/person who thinks the game first, and the platform second
Are programmers so limited in skill that they can't develop without DirectX? Or are there plenty of politics that derail the idea of "code once, frags for all"?
Vos teneo officium eram periculosus ut vos recipero is.
The Big Problem(TM) is that people are confusing the symptons with the causes.
Angry and violent people are often drawn to violent forms of expression, including violent games, movies and music. Some are trying to find a release valve for their feelings, others are trying to legitamize their feelings, and others are just acting out their feelings.
They are trying to treat the fever and not tje infection that caused the fever.
Boobies never hurt anyone. - Sherry Glaser.
I do not think that video games cause violence. I think, and there is evedice supporting this, that violent people who play video games to quench that violent thirst become more violent that is where most people get confused.
Sex is what happens when people think no one else will ever find out
with the word 'induce.' There are those who also confuse 'induce' with 'incite.' I believe there are those that use such confusion willfully to further their own agendas as well.
The distinction is, in strictly legal terms, extremely important.
Executing a violent video game *causes* certain electronic phenomenon to occur in the machine.
Violent behaviour among minors is *caused* by the minor in question acting violently.
KFG
On a related note, my research has shown that even years of daily pornography viewing does not result in abberant sexual behavior. I mean with others.
--- What?
...and watch your crime rate grow. More silly laws--> more "crime" + oppression-->fewer residents + more resentment-->...well, you know. I do admit, though, you might get more bucks for law enforcement. And just because there's a logical fallacy called "slippery slope" doesn't mean you can't have a slope which is slippery.
Shure Jon Doe is a good person, but could he have been better, if not subjected to X,Y,Z.
Get a free ipod.
I wouldn't worry too much about a PG-13 rating. If Aliens were to be re-released today in theaters, there would be very little keeping it from receiving a PG-13 as well (maybe cut out a bit of the course language, but even that has become normal as of late).
I think the best source of game innovation is from players, and that doesn't stop with the modders. Look at all of the MMORPGs out there. Those players aren't creating mods, but by playing characters far better than any AI, they add to the level of game play for everyone. And they not only don't get paid, they pay the game company to play! "You mean you pay to play an elf, so someone else playing the game encounters a more realistic elf during their game?"
The modders are almost yesterday's news compared to the people who pay to improve the game by playing it. Now that's a business model. You get a better "AI equivalent" than anyone could write, and they pay you for the privilege.
Brought to you by the Council for Better Living Through Dead Languages!
The funny thing about the NES/atari/old school gamer crowd is that even back then there were a lot of clones. How many different clones of Pong were made? Of Breakout? How many side-scrolling platformers were made based on the popularity of Super Mario Bros.? You don't remember the clones, except maybe one or two that were exceptionally good, or one or two that were exceptionally bad. When you look back in ten years, you'll remember Quake, Half-Life (a Quake clone, but an exceptionally good one), and Daikatana (another Quake clone, but this time exceptionally bad). You'll forget all about the other clones, like SiN, because they were forgettable. Then, you'll pine for the "good old days", never remembering that there was just as much tripe then as there is now.
People have selective memories. The past is always better, because you remember it as being better. That doesn't mean it really was better, just that you have some idealized conception of it being better.
"The Internet changes everything"
7 008 ). Specifically, content is going to be increasingly user-centric and user-generated, especially as driven by in-game online connectivity (see the recent Will Wright interview about Sims Online, read about the bit where users will interact with other player's in-game scenarios via the automatic networked feedback).
The technology used in games will always improve, just as our machines get faster and software gets better. This is a fact.
What needs more forward compatability (scalability and adaptivity) is game content. (see my previous post: The future of game content http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=36256&cid=390
One of the things burns me most about the 'classic' game development models is that the fixed-platform approach to content invites the reinventing of engines from scratch every few years. This is a vicious cycle: old fixed content doesn't scale to new technology, so the technology is replaced, requiring new from-scratch fixed-platform content. Lather, rinse, repeat.
This is one of the fundamental reasons why we end up buying the same games over and over: we're paying for the recreation of content and technology since the system is constantly reinventing the wheel.
When the content in games becomes inherently scalable and platform/technology-independant (adaptive), the internet will make an even bigger difference in being able to cross-pollinate development of rich user-driven game environments.
As I'm fond of point out: The next John Carmack won't be a game engine guy, he'll be a game CONTENT engine guy.
Contrary to the author's claims, modern gamers and programmers are not as sophisticated as they once were. I have yet to play a good FPS that has the depth that Infocom's Wishbringer had. I have yet to meet a game developer in today's industry that knows what lex and yacc is.
I've loved the games all my life, but now that I'm a developer, I can't help but feel mournful for what the state of the industry and where it will never arrive.
"People with opinions just go around bothering one another." -The Buddha
Ok then, St. Louis treated you horribly.
St. Louis was didn't nurture you. St. Louis is home to some people who disagree with you.
Read the first few paragraphs of the Riverfront Times' "Best Of" issue and answer them honestly, will you? Best of St. Louis 2002
I left St. Louis years ago, but I don't complain about the city making me unhappy. Cities don't make people unhappy.
People are unhappy.
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A big part of the cost of producing a game is the content production. Game companies throw many man-years of artist's time to get the content just right, putting in the cobwebs, covering z-fighting, and hiding the geometrical seams.
Two things are going to solve the content creation problem for many games in the future: (1) procedural generation of textures and geometry, and (2) user created content.
Game companies have discovered that if they provide tools, rudimentary and broken tools will do but even just the specs so users can create their own (often better) tools, some users WILL create content for the game. Sure, only a few users will be motivated to do it, but a few per thousand can easily surpass the content creation power of 20 artists. Especially if the game company provides sample content, users can generate content of comparable or better quality.
Expect to see much more of this in the future. What's cool, is that for some people creating content is as compelling, or more, than playing the game itself, and some of these people would otherwise never have been attracted tot he game. In other words, as some games start to blur the lines between content-creation and the game itself, they will attract new (traditionally non-gamer) players to join.
Online, multi-player gaming will probably provide the mass entertainment that interractive TV was supposed to.
I didn't even know this was going on!! Has it been on the local news? I'm going contact the local news stations about it.
While the creation of tools and level editors makes it possible for fans to make new levels, making a REAL GAME requires 15 to 40 people working 8+ hours a day, 5+ days a week, for 1 to 2 years!!!!!! Even if you have NO programmers.
All the 3d models, textures, effects, cutscenes, animations, sound effects, scripting, etc all take massive ammounts of time for the majority of games. Sure you can whip out another level for Quake by reusing someone else's graphics. That's fine, it's fun, you get some more game play but that's not what sells. What sells, with few exceptions, are the games that took major resources to make. The fans or 4th party, generally do not have the required time to put in.
You only have to look on the net. There are over 300+ 3D engine/game engines out there. There are very few complete total conversions of any games including all cutscenes and dialog etc. The reason is a game engine can be made in a couple of months by one or two people. The content for the game can't.
That's why even though you can get cheap 3D software and video cameras there is no fan made Star Wars, Star Trek, Lord of the Rings, etc (that are any good) because they require too much work and therefore too much time and money for people not doing it for a living to do.
St. Louis may not have the $1 million median home prices of the Bay Area, but when it comes to education it is on par with Palo Alto and considerably better than most of the other communities on the Peninsula. And Creve Coeur is hardly a special case, as other suburbs like Clayton and University City also compare well to the richer but not smarter mini-cities of the Bay.
Despite its muggy summer weather I hope to someday move back to the St. Louis, and when I go I know I will not be leaving behind civilization, but only San Francisco's cultural mediocrity and empty poses of sophistication.
What better match could exist than opensource tools, game engines, etc and mod programmers? The geeks that are really good at programming can release their code without having to fake their way through producing some half assed artwork and the mod makers can have full access to code, tools, everything. Feedback can go directly from the mod guys to the programmers and new code can be cranked out as needed just to suit their needs. It might take a while before the two sides find the right combo to bring them together but then it'll be a match made in heaven.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
Middleware companies (I work for one) - produce solutions for game programmers in areas that are traditionally "hard". Few game developers nowadays produce their own graphics engine (opengl, directx, renderware are used). Physics middleware is establishing itself (havok and mathengine), and there is a feeling that AI middleware will be big when it comes.
Game developers think "why should I put 6 months programming into something that probably won't look as good as what the dedicated guys can do?" Game players nowadays don't want "just" good graphics or AI or sound or physics, they want a completely immersive experience, and this is often impossible for a single team of developers to produce in any realistic time-frame
Johns: Well, how does it look now? Riddick: Looks clear.
had "Custer's Revenge" and "Texas Chainsaw Massacre" which were contraversial at the time.
No, I think he was commenting on "correlation" vs "causation". Unless this retarded comment filtering system has once again removed the reply to the reply to the original post that your post is commenting on. (that sound wrong to you?...hmmm)
Anyway, bottom line. Crazy is crazy, and a kid with no parents will pick up his morality from his environment. Without someone to filter and interpret that environment, thus providing a basis against which future decisions can be made, senators will try to win popularity points by forever and again raising issues that fan the bright fires fed by the ignorance of the masses...
Everyone on slashdot has a journal.
A well-used door needs no oil on its hinges.
A swift-flowing steam does not grow stagnant.
Neither sound nor thoughts can travel through a vacuum.
Software rots if not used.
These are great mysteries.
-- Geoffrey James, "The Tao of Programming"
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