QuickTime On Your Cell Phone

blamanj writes "Apple and DoCoMo are confirming that a new version of QuickTime is on the way supporting MPEG-4 images over 3G cellular service." Now if only these would make sense in the U.S. ...

Comments

Naughty Taco XXX

[Anonymous Coward]

Fucking shits
MOD ME UP

Cmdr. Taco gathered me as though I was a child and placed me on his lap. "Shhh," Cmdr. Taco whispered in my ear. His warm breath caused my skin to gooseflesh while Cmdr. Taco slowly rocked me. When my tears were finished, Cmdr. Taco asked, "All better, little one?" I nodded feeling emotionally spent. His lips nuzzled the hollow where his breath had teased. Lightly nipping and licking Cmdr. Taco whispered, "Shall we continue?" Without waiting for me to answer, Cmdr. Taco stood me up holding my forearms when I stumbled shakily. "Take off all of your clothes," Cmdr. Taco slowly inspected me from my swollen lips to torn blouse to thigh highs peeking from under my skirt. "You may leave the stockings on. They remind me of the whore that hid inside you before I made you my own--my sweet, little whore, all mine. So alone out here, with no one to worry about you being gone." Cmdr. Taco nodded his approval when I had the last of my clothes off. I blushed as his eyes touched over every curve and valley of my exposed body. I moved to cover myself, but Cmdr. Taco stopped me. "No! It is mine to look at, mine to use." His fingers ran lightly over my skin. Brushing the underside of my breasts first, then Cmdr. Taco cupped both in his hands. The pads of his thumbs circled my nipples until they hardened even more. A smile curved his lips, finally his right hand lowered and cupped my sex. His middle finger slid easily within my silken folds. "I think someone is enjoying our little game." His finger probed deeper. "Tell me how much you like it."

My tongue felt thick and useless. I could barely breath--thinking was beyond question. I rocked my hips up and back straddling his hand wantonly. I felt my juices seeping running down between his fingers and onto my quivering legs. I opened my mouth and tried to speak but no sound would come forth. My jaw moved woodenly. I nodded my head from side to side trying to explain.

"You dare to disobey me?" Cmdr. Taco asked in disbelief. Cmdr. Taco piled my clothes in my hands.

I was afraid that Cmdr. Taco would send me away for disappointing him. I pleaded with him with my eyes. I finally worked until, "Please" came out.

"Please, what whore?" Cmdr. Taco asked.

"Please, don't make me go." I whispered looking down unable to meet his eyes.

He looked startled for a moment and then laughed. "Let you go? Letting you leave here was the last thing on my mind. I wonder if you would beg to stay knowing what I plan on doing with you--to you?" His voice turned harsh. "Throw your clothes in the fire." I started to question then did as Cmdr. Taco asked. I watched as my clothes kindled and disappeared into ashes. "Do you realize what you have done?" Cmdr. Taco asked. I shook my head no. "The only way you can leave now is as you are." Cmdr. Taco looked up and down my naked body. "I think the town would be shocked to see you walk through town in the buff. Don't you agree? Our perfect little girl naked and wandering the streets, maybe I'll make you do that later. What would they think? Would they see you then as I do? A needy whore begging to be taken--to be possessed fully and completely. Reach down and tell me what you feel." Cmdr. Taco commanded.

I reached down quickly to obey. I needed to fill the need throbbing between my thighs. My palm slid through my sticky tight curls as my fingers brushed my clit than slid into my wetness. Riding the sensations, I watched his face. This man I didn't know, yet the man who knew everything about me.

"What do you feel?" Cmdr. Taco prompted me as though I was a child.

My hips moved of their own volition as I crammed my fingers in and out of my wetness. "I feel wet." I answered.

"What feels wet, my sweet?" Cmdr. Taco questioned.

"My pussy." I answered.

"All of it," Cmdr. Taco said watching my fingers disappear then reappear.

"My pussy feels so wet." I moaned.

"Why is your pussy so wet?" Cmdr. Taco asked pulling me towards him and pulling my fingers from my cunt.

I struggled for an answer. "I'm wet, because I like this."

He brought my fingers to his mouth and slowly sucked them one by one into his mouth thoroughly cleaning each one. His mouth opened and sucked the puddle of wetness in my palm. Cmdr. Taco reached up and pulled me towards him by my nipples. "Here now I taste like you. Taste yourself." My tongue met his, and Cmdr. Taco moved my fingers between our mouths. Our tongues traced my fingers and met in their seams licking each other. The changing textures, the smell of my pussy between us caused me to gush more. Cmdr. Taco moved my feet apart with his foot. Somehow seeing his shoes still on and taking in his fully clothed body made me feel even more naked. Cmdr. Taco ran his hands along the inside of my thighs, and I shivered my pleasure at his touch. I wanted him inside. I wanted him to touch my core. I needed to explode to release the pleasure Cmdr. Taco was building within me. His hands quickly became coated with my stickiness. Cmdr. Taco moved his hands over me, but never where I craved it most. "What makes you this wet?" Cmdr. Taco asked again.

"You do." I answered.

"Do you think flattery will get me to touch your clit, little one?" Cmdr. Taco chuckled.

"Please," I begged.

"Mmmmm, I do have a soft spot for begging, and you begged so prettily earlier." Cmdr. Taco pondered as if considering my request. My hips pressed forward seeking his touch. I had never been this wet before. I was steadily dripping now. My nipples ached; my pussy literally throbbed with need. "You, young lady are making a mess on my carpet."

"I'm sorry," I stammered.

"I think you shall have to be punished for making such a mess with that slutty little pussy of yours. What do you think?" Cmdr. Taco questioned.

"I'm sorry." I repeated. "I can't help it. I need it so much."

"Why do you think it is that you need it so much?" Cmdr. Taco pressed on.

"Because, I like it... because, I'm a dirty slut. I like the way you make me feel. Please touch me there." I begged.

"You are a bad girl. First making a mess on my good carpet, and then begging for me to touch you in such naughty places. You must be taught a lesson I'm afraid. Bend over my lap." Cmdr. Taco commanded.

I quickly hurried hoping Cmdr. Taco would make the throbbing need end. My breasts lay in front of his knee and my legs hung suspended in the air not quite touching the ground. His knees spread, and I felt helpless. His hand reached between my thighs and cupped my sex. I moaned my intense pleasure. "What do you want?" Cmdr. Taco asked.

"Please, please touch me." I implored.

"Touch you where? Cmdr. Taco asked.

"Touch my pussy, please." I begged biting my lip to keep from steadily begging and pleading for the touch I needed so badly.

"Good girl, you are learning. Tell me exactly what you want."

"I want your fingers inside me. I want you to rub my clit."

His hand rubbed over my dripping pussy then moved back to my ass smearing my juices over me. His hand dipped back down and coated once more. Cmdr. Taco rubbed my juices back and forth until my wetness covered me thoroughly. His finger finally sought my clit, and I all but screamed my joy. Cmdr. Taco laughed aloud at my eagerness. Cmdr. Taco circled my now distended clit then rubbed it roughly. His other hand rubbed soft circles on my backside, and then without warning smacked down sharply. I jerked crying out at the unexpected pain. His fingers circled my clit once more. His fingers plucked and twisted my clit as though it was a nipple. Then his wet hand came down once more. Cmdr. Taco slapped my bottom relentlessly. My flesh stung and burned. The wetness made the slaps ring out in the room. I whimpered torn between the peaking pleasure between my legs and the sting of my backside. I felt the walls of my pussy begin to tighten. "That's it my little slut," Cmdr. Taco urged on. "I know you would come like this." His fingers plunged in and out of my pussy as his other hand rained down on reddened behind. "Does it hurt, little one?"

"Yes," I whimpered.

"Do you want me to stop, little one?"

"No." I shook my head.

"Do you know what that means?" Cmdr. Taco asked never slowing his two hands--one sliding in and out, the other slapping up and down faster and faster.

Tears built in my eyes. "I like to be hurt." The blows became harder still my body moved up and back, my breasts swaying and slapping against his leg as Cmdr. Taco rammed roughly in and out of my body.

"Who's slut are you?" Cmdr. Taco asked.

"I'm your slut." I answered.

"What kind of slut are you?" Cmdr. Taco pushed on continuing his twin assault.

"I'm your little pain slut," I cried out as I came gushing even more.

"That's it baby, come hard for me," Cmdr. Taco coaxed running his fingers slowly now in and out coaxing me to come even more. As I lay quivering over his legs, Cmdr. Taco rubbed my bottom praising me. My pussy clenched and released convulsively. "You are so beautiful. You respond so fully." Cmdr. Taco lifted and turned me on his lap facing him. Cmdr. Taco slid his cock into me and held it there filling me. I felt so complete. I tightened around him stroking him without moving. Cmdr. Taco cupped my bottom in his hands and rocked me up and back running his cock in and out of me. Cmdr. Taco would completely fill me, and then withdraw leaving me feeling empty then filling me once more. We rocked slowly together. His mouth covered my neck then my jaw biting lightly. We kissed slowly the contrast from the earlier pell mell rush making it seem even more languid. Minutes stretched by, contended I laid my head on his chest as Cmdr. Taco unhurriedly fucked me. I felt myself building once more, and Cmdr. Taco felt it too. Cmdr. Taco pulled me tighter bouncing me up and down on his cock. Cmdr. Taco turned me and pushed my shoulders to the floor following me to the rug. His hand road the small of my back as my elbows rested on the carpet, and my ass turned up into the air. Cmdr. Taco hesitated a moment looking at my upturned ass before plunging into my pussy. "I'll save your ass for later." Cmdr. Taco promised. The thought of having his cock, any cock in my virgin ass sent me over the edge, and I came. Cmdr. Taco never slowed his pace, but continued to pound relentlessly into my gaping pussy. As I struggled to breath, Cmdr. Taco fucked me without restraint. His cock slammed into me; his balls slapped out a rhythm. Cmdr. Taco no longer spoke, but moaned and groaned his enjoyment. My elbows slipped beneath me, and my face lay pressed onto the rug. My nipples drug up and back on the carpet. The teasing pleasure quickly became pain as my sensitive nipples rubbed faster back and forth. My nipples burnt and stung. My elbows were rug burnt halfway to my forearm. When Cmdr. Taco came, I felt the hot wet splash of his come inside me, and it set off another wave of pleasure. Cmdr. Taco drew out and rubbed the sticky remains of his come on my asshole. "Later." Cmdr. Taco promised watching the gobs of come run along the crack of my ass. I lay gasping on the rug feeling thoroughly used. Cmdr. Taco ran his finger along the crack of my ass. "You are just so tempting, little one. Your mouth was so eager; your pussy was so wet, so hot, and now that sweet little ass of your is calling to me. Do you want to be my three hole girl?"

He sat on the floor and leaned back on the sofa. "Come here, little one." Cmdr. Taco beckoned. I turned and crawled towards him. "Take off my shoes." Cmdr. Taco ordered. I turned my ass towards him once more and untied his shoes and pulled them from his feet. His socks followed. I felt his hand on my ass and tensed as his finger slid down my crack and circled my asshole. I clenched without meaning to, and Cmdr. Taco sighed. Cmdr. Taco lifted and slid his pants and underwear down and off. Cmdr. Taco pulled me back towards his lap by the hair. I lay curled between his legs, my head resting on his thigh while Cmdr. Taco slowly stroked my hair. My face was inches from his cock, and I watched fascinated as his cock twitched and more come slowly trickled down the bulbous darkened head. My tongue involuntarily jutted across my lips as I thought of tasting his come. My action didn't go unmissed. "I'd hate to disappoint a lady." Cmdr. Taco said sneering on the word lady. Cmdr. Taco grabbed a handful of my hair. I watched as another glob dropped from his head and fell into the dark matted hair at the base of his penis. His rough jerk reminded me to pay attention to him, and I quickly moved where Cmdr. Taco directed. Cmdr. Taco violently towed my head upward. Staring directly into my eyes, Cmdr. Taco threatened, "Keep that cat tongue in your mouth, or I will teach you what real pain is about." I nodded my compliance. "Say it!" Cmdr. Taco ground out impatiently.

"I'll...I'll keep my little cat tongue in my mouth." I promised.

"Yes, you will." Cmdr. Taco nodded. Instead of the licking and lapping up of used come that I craved, Cmdr. Taco held my head firmly between his hands and rubbed my face in the gooey remains of our release. The quickly cooling come coated my entire face. Cmdr. Taco dragged first one cheek then the other through the puddle of sperm. Then face first, up and down his spent cock. I felt it begin to harden beneath me. The temptation to open my mouth--to taste was so great that I clenched me jaw against it. More than the threatened pain, I didn't want to displease Cmdr. Taco. I wanted to please him more than I wanted to gratify my longing for come. I felt his seed spread through my eyebrows and eyelashes and begin to stiffen as it dried. The smell of his arousal was overwhelming, and I felt the familiar tightening in my body begin. When Cmdr. Taco was finally finished, Cmdr. Taco lifted me up into his arms. Cmdr. Taco smiled his satisfaction. "You look pretty covered in my come. I'll always remember you this way."

good stuff

[oo7tushar]

It's nice to see the world moving forward and advancing on these technologies. We need to move forward and continue to make new things that could be used in the future but still have some commercial viability now.
It would be nice to go all out and build everything in the future but there may not be a market now and we all remember the great crash of 99-00.

But, if I get access to one of those phones then I definetly will because places are starting to wire up that offer the media that you want..._now_.

Re:good stuff

[purrpurrpussy]

Dude....

The problem is that this is technology for the sake of technology rather than any actual practical use. Yes live video feeds are useful but not to many people. Emergency services, surgeons... probly. Me! NO! I have NO use for this AT ALL and neither do 99% of the population.

IMNSHO The current 2G (2.5G) phone system and the handsets in use have NOT been fully exploited. There are NUMEROUS things that could have been done with that technology and ESPECIALLY the connectivity.

To see how a device can REALLY be exploited look at the GameBoy - 10 years and still new stuff is turning up. Technology for the sake of technology is pointless without software to back it up and I do not see that happening.

Re:good stuff

[Anonymous Coward]

You think that the great crash of 99-00 will be as bad as the 02-03 one?

Re:good stuff

[Ponty]

Don't underestimate the "Asian girls who like to see Hello Kitty everywhere they look" market. Those people NEED this technology ASAP.

Re:good stuff

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, but when the GameBoy first came out somebody probably said the same thing you did. Technology needs to start somewhere. People in 10 years will marvel that someone could use a phone without video.

Frist Pots?

[Anonymous Coward]

Eat my dangling dust, you dangling dust eaters.

Good



bye



lameness



filter

IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

cell phones make sense

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

IN SOVIET RUSSIA, cell phones make sense of YOU.

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

*whispers* in soviet russia, soviet russia does you

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

*screams* IN SOVIET RUSSIA, SovieT RussiA DoeS YOU!!!

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

*lollyfoots* in Soviet Russia, Soviet Russia does you.

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

*gravies* In Soviet Russia, Soviet Russia does you.

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

Click here for the rest of the thread.

Re:IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

*distended* In Soviet Russia, line waits on Russian people.

Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[DrunkenPenguin]

Nokia's Communicator cellphone has included RealPlayer for at least 1.5 years.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Boss, Pointy Haired]

How did RealPlayer install itself on a Nokia without the [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE \ SOFTWARE \ Microsoft \ Windows \ Current Version \ Run ] to install about 3 billion entries in that start every time your turn on your computer, consume resources and pop-up random messages??

The day RealPlayer respects my computer will be the day I respect RealPlayer.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

It comes pre-installed :) Another cool thing about the Communicator is that it also comes with www-browser. OS inside is Symbian and it's open for everyone. WWW-browser Opera has been ported to it.

I wonder when will someone port Linux to it ;)

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

Troll allert!!!

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[dimator]

Amen, brother. You got to click through about a hundred dialogs just to disable the damn StartCenter or whatever the fuck their stupid resource-hogging tray icon shit is called.

And they do things like "Are you sure you don't NOT want to NOT DISable StartCenter?" to confuse the pants off you, so that you accidentally click yes instead of no. Disgusting, really.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[alfaiomega]

I wonder when will someone port Linux to it ;)

I would rather count on NetBSD. What CPU architecture does this phone use?

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[simong_oz]

couldn't agree more on this. I hate that bloody app. I hate the way it seems to take over every file extension known to man even though that damn startcenter thing is disabled. It has decided that it is the default player for any audio CD's even though I specifically told it not to do that. Then it leaves the 10+MB worth of setup files in it's damn directory (even after uninstalling it!) just in case I uninstall it and ever want to use it again. And how the hell do you switch that stupid message center thing off?

Unfortunately I don't know anything else that plays realmedia and rm seems to be pretty common on the web.

If this streaming is going to become common on mobiles, then please, for the love of everything decent, DON'T USE REALMEDIA.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

Here are some facts: "The Nokia Communicator 9210 is designed to be an integrated communications tool, functioning as a cell phone and providing features like fax, email, Internet, WAP, word processing, spreadsheet, presentations, calendar and contacts. The phone measures 158 x 56 x 27 (mm), and weighs 244 g. Dual band: EGSM 900/1800, with a 32-bit ARM9-based RISC CPU and 16MB. Symbian OS. Data speed up to 43.2 kbps.

Memory might become a problem here, although from what I heard, the new models have 40MB of memory. I am no expert here, but I think that should be sufficient.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Alan Partridge]

comparing Real Player to QuickTime is like comparing a dodgem to a BMW M5.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

Easily. For example RealPlayer for Linux doesn't need a registry :)

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

For example RealPlayer for Linux doesn't need a registry :)

I think that's a brilliant point. A lot of people on this thread seem to hate Real Player, but they are obviously using Windows version. I have used both Linux and Windows version of the Real Player and the Windows version really is bloated with all kind of crap and it does some nasty things. Linux version is completely trouble free. No annoying ads or messing with file extensions..

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

is like comparing a dodgem to a BMW M5

Yeah, but which one is which one?? ;)

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[DrunkenPenguin]

Ahoy all Linux and *BSD developers! INTERESTING technical question! Is it possible to port Linux/*BSD to this device? It would be interesting to know. The CPU is 32-bit ARM9-based RISC CPU. That would make it the first cellphone to run a Unix like OS. Boy, would it be cool to have Unix like OS running on this!

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[ParnBR]

It's like they are punishing us for using Windows. Haven't we had enough already?! OTOH, at least Micro$oft doesn't hold a monopoly for harassing Windows users.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[I didn't]

/Me look at DoCoMo's new phone:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/021 210/161/2u9fd.html

/Me look at my 9210

Comparing the Japanese phones with the Communicator is like comparing apple (pardon pun :) and orange.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

Comparing the Japanese phones with the Communicator is like comparing apple (pardon pun :) and orange.

Who is comparing anything here? You just did! Not us.

We are talking about movie players on cellphones - we are not comparing anything.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[MoneyT]

That's cause they probably figure the linux users went through enough crap just to get the system running.

Seriously though, it's probably has something to do that in terms of developing and advancing, the windows version is top on their list. Like everything linux, just wait a few years and it will be up to par with everything else, popups, bloats and all.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[mbbac]

Real Player actually isn't that bad on Mac OS X. I've had it installed for a while now and have noticed any bad things. I refuse to ever install it again on a Windows machine because of all of the evil vile instrusive things it does.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

I accidently stumbled upon this while browsing real networks site: Real Enterprise Desktop its basicly the same player without all the crud (advertisment, nags, etc) and it plays all the stuff normally. I think its ment for corporate environments where those advertisment enabled players wouldn't get installed by the it-section. And IIRC, it asked if I want it to start in the background on startup when I was installing it (thu I don't see a switch in the preferences..) Gained a little of my respect. Works for me.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

Like someone mentioned earlier on this thread - Linux version of Real Player is completely trouble free. No ads, no popups, no messing with file extensions...

Unfortunately I don't know anything else that plays realmedia and rm seems to be pretty common on the web.

Well, I do. MPlayer can play any modern mediaformat you can possibly find on this planet. It is also the most fastest and feature rich player there is.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[KAMiKAZOW]

Visit the Helix Community and download the Helix DNA Binaries.
This pack comes with an application called HelixPlay. This player is crappy and not very user friendly, but it's small (~2MB compressed; ~5MB expanded) and has no spy ware. It's enough to view RealVideos, if you have to.

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[Anonymous Coward]

It better be enough, I can just imagine the phone starting to swap over GPRS... Ouch! Pain!

Re:Nokia's Communicator has RealPlayer

[ender81b]

/me Hugs his real player 8.

Seriously I agree with you on this one, Real One is the bane of my existence. But luckily enough you can still find real player 8 still around.

oh yeah

[oo7tushar]

I also wanted to add that video will be on the heels shortly as they're probably just going to use the same core as they do right now (which supports mpeg4).
Course, bandwidth problems come into play but imagine the possibilities...can you see me now?

Re:oh yeah

[zwoelfk]

Course, bandwidth problems come into play but imagine the possibilities...can you see me now?

3G phones currently support video playback and transfer. For example, he new J-Phone even has video capture. So the interesting bit is not that it has video, but that it's in Quicktime format.

From the article: Microsoft and Real incorporate Digital Rights Management (DRM) technology in their file format, giving companies an added feeling of security when publishing their content. This, Jones thinks, could be a disadvantage for Apple.

Two things: 1. Have you ever tried to pull data off a cell phone? Especially streaming data? Security through obscurity may not be a great method, but it sure is a pain in the ass. 2. Those people who have issues with DRM should take note. If Apple continues their No-DRM policy, these phones could become the Fair-Use-Geek's first choice.

From the article: Analysts see the adoption of QuickTime by DoCoMo as a way for Apple to broaden its customer base and to have customers associate the QuickTime brand when they buy content.

I don't see this as a very good thing. Video playback should be seemless to the user. I don't want or care about codec branding. What this probably really means is that there will be an annoying Quicktime splash screen every time I open up a video (in order to have me "associate the Quicktime brand") blah.

[...] but imagine the possibilities...can you see me now?

I don't have to imagine. When I get on the train and see twenty people in my car using camera phones, it creeps me out. It'll be worse when video is used everywhere. Who knows how many people are taking pictures of you, anywhere.

Re:oh yeah

[Alan Partridge]

QuickTime is NOT A CODEC, it's an architecture that supports HUNDREDS of graphics, sound and movie codecs - along with sundry other formats like FLASH 4, text layers, sprites etc etc etc. That's why MPEG-4 was based on it - it's fucking beautiful! So, if you 'phone had QT, you might be able to take a series of pictures, compile them into an image sequence and send them to a friend as an MPEG4 movie stream; or maybe compose a ring tone as MIDI and send it somewhere; or open a TGA or TIFF file, or a wav, mp3 or aiff file etc etc etc

Re:oh yeah

[Anonymous Coward]

uh?

mpeg4 based on qt?
i thought qt used silly licensed mpeg4..

yeah.. qt is just format to enclose other shit.. (like avi...).

compile pictures and then send them to friend as mpeg4 stream? what point would there be in that?

who needs another properiaty format to enclose files in? why not send that midi ring tone directly, without hassling with enclosing it in qt..

Re:oh yeah

[zwoelfk]

Geez, raw nerve there?

Okay, allow me to rephrase: "I don't care under what umbrella which codecs are supported." The point is the same. It doesn't matter to the user what you call it, they just want the features. Granted, all the things Quicktime can do are wonderful, but do we really needed it to be branded? Especially if it interferes with the user enjoying all those features?

The biggest problem right now with these devices is the amount of memory available to the user. There's been a big improvement this year, but if you want to start working with big 'ol formats (like TGA) and editing little videos on the fly, we're gonna need more. And better UIs too. I can barely use the calculator on my phone, I can't imagine trying to edit anything.

That said, if I could get something equivalent to Yahoo's Launch on my cell, I'd be stoked. (Before anyone mentions it, yes I know I can get streaming audio now, but I want the video too)

Re:oh yeah

[Pathwalker]

"The QuickTime file format has been used as the basis of the MPEG-4 standard, developed by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO)."

You can read it for yourself here in the docs on the structure of the QuickTime file format.

You seem to be completely missing the point of QuickTime, and why it is not just a simple wrapper format like AVI. Read up on the different atom formats in QuickTime, and you should be able to find what you have missed.

Re:oh yeah

[seamelt]

QuickTime was never ever intended for authoring actually all you can really do with quicktime pro that pertains to authoring is exporting movies in different formats, QuickTime is however my personal preference in media video media players because it is full featured and doesn't bow DRM.

oh and if i any of you
*scurries back to apple techsupport hell*
-ever deal with someone who cant figure out how to use a mac? now that is scary

Re:oh yeah

[Alan Partridge]

you can do EDITING in QuickTime Player - move, cut, paste, add, delete. Multiple video, audio, Flash, text, Sprite and meta data tracks are all addable and subtractable. You can turn movies into image sequences and vice versa, scale, shear, change volume and sample rate etc etc etc

Re:oh yeah

[RAMMS EIN]

``QuickTime is NOT A CODEC, it's an architecture that supports HUNDREDS of graphics, sound and movie codecs''
So QuickTime is a proprietary Ogg equivalent?

FYFI

[Anonymous Coward]

Boullion! First you fail it in your face, boy!

Wait...

[Anonymous Coward]

Watching movies + cell phones = My fist though a wall.

That's all really nice

[FlukeMeister]

... but without an actual 3G network in place in the entire western world, it seems like a fairly pointless technology.

Besides, who really wants people sending video-spam to their phones?

Re:That's all really nice

[evilned]

Well, the CDMA2000 1XRTT service that Sprint and Verison are currently selling are as close to 3g as you will find anywhere on the planet right now.

but

[Anonymous Coward]

can it work on my Nokia 3285 that doesnt support pictures, or AIM? only text messaging, voice mail, and calls.

What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

The only reason they keep trying to add such technology to phones is so they can continue to rip you off with their charges. Do you really want to pay air-time rates to watch tiny tiny tiny movies?

Here in the UK the mobile phone companies need their clients to spend an average of £50 per month ($70-$80) just to allow them to recover from the enormous debts of the 3G licences they lumbered themselves with.

My bill is much less than that a month, and I really don't intend to use any gimicky technology they offer me to tempt me to pay them stupid amounts of cash.

Re:What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

I just wish SMS was cheaper. 10p is a total rip-off given that it much take up the same amount of air time as a 2 second phone call, if that.

Re:What's the point?

[Boss, Pointy Haired]

I think i've heard that one of the reasons for SMS pricing is the network capacity to actually handle the volume of messages - not air time, i'm talking about the processing and delivery at and between message centers

Any cheaper and they wouldn't be able to cope. I've not done the maths but it sounds plausable.

Re:What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

They're adding it so they can sell you pron, and thereby prevent you from contributing your genes to the pool.

Re:What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, makes sense. Maybe if they had a secondary, 1p each service but where they may take up to an hour to arrive? Or maybe they could punt them off to a internet based delivery mechanism, and let it handle the strain?

Re:What's the point?

[Christopher Doopov]

The only reason they keep trying to add such technology to phones is so they can continue to rip you off with their charges.

No, you are being mistaken. Those charges are important indeed, however they are not the key issue. Of course, as you have already stated, movies on the cell phone are useless. Even if there was no charges at all, there is no reason to have such feature other than to "show off," while with those charges the situation looks like this: it is the most expensive and the least convenient method for watching movies in the history of cinematography.

So why do they add such a useless functionality to they cell phones? Of course the most obvious reason would be to sell uselessly powerful hardware, but that is still not the most important issue.

The real answer, and I say it as someone who has spoken with employees of one of the key software companies in the market, is to lock people with proprietary codecs and/or file formats. Because when everyone has only Real Video and Quick Time on her cell phone few years from now in the future, she will be much less likely to record her grandchildren family movies in Ogg Theora/Vorbis format, if she won't be able to watch them on her cell phone.

You may say that it is not important in which format someone stores movies of one's children or cat, but it is very important to make sure it will not be convenient for people to use free and open formats. After all, this is what average people want, not freedom, not liberty, not even safety, but convenience. And when it is inconvenient to use open formats, and convenient to use only proprietary formats, they will try to make fees for making movies, or maybe even for every distributed copy.

And here are the big money. Grandma will say "Oh, this is nothing 50 cents for every person I will send this movie to," but the recording industry with its legacy business model will be safe, as no one will be able to compete with them as an independent movie or music maker, without paying them money. And this is, people, how the monopolies are built and maintained.

Please consider this issues. Because so far, the most popular attitude is this: "Those, who can give up essential liberty... Ooooh! A new shiny cell phone with proprietary file formats! This is so cool! Where do I sign up?!" This is sad, but that way, nothing will ever change. And this is what I sadly observe, even here on Slashdot.

Re:What's the point?

[bsartist]

The real answer ... is to lock people with proprietary codecs and/or file formats.

Your "answer" ignores one important fact - that neither the MPEG4 codec, nor the MPEG4 file format are proprietary.

Re:What's the point?

[Amadodd]

The reason they charge exorbitant prices for services is because they have to, and can. The business models of these companies do not allow them to give value to their customers, only to their shareholders (ideally value should be provided to both parties). In the UK the extra charge for making call to a different network is mostly at least 400% more than the cost of a same network call - why? - To make more money, and don't even ask about international calls. The cost of international SMS is ~3 times more than a local one - why? - To make more money. Sure the tech is there to play videos and the like on your mobile, but you will pay for this big time. The current income per user is ~£22/month and their business model for 3G require £50/m per user? How will they get there? Prepare to see some more disproportionate pricing for all the new features. I don't think we will ever see a network that says data is data, and we will charge you the same whether it is voice, text or pictures. And, oh yes, we will charge you only 20% extra for the convenience over fixed line communications.

Re:What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

Quicktime is fully capable of incorporating Theora and Vorbis in to its codec wrapper framework.

Wether or not the OSS codecs will offer anything more than 'OpenSource Boners' to 'L00nixWeenies' over the MPEG4/AAF pre-bundles is an entirely different matter.......

Re:What's the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

"The cost of international SMS is ~3 times more than a local one - why?"

Well T-mobile charge me 20p instead of 10p for an SMS to other parts of Europe.

"I don't think we will ever see a network that says data is data, and we will charge you the same whether it is voice, text or pictures"

Well, i'm looking forward to t-mobile allowing me to use the GPRS features of my phone on their network - the others do. This apparantly charges you per byte rather than per second. I`m getting a landline soon, after having just a mobile, so they'll be getting even less money from me.

Re:What's the point?

[Christopher Doopov]

Your "answer" ignores one important fact - that neither the MPEG4 codec, nor the MPEG4 file format are proprietary.

Actually, I was talking more about the Real Video formats (these is the only area I have any real informations about). As for Quick Time, I have not been following their development since the problems I had with their formats and codecs (e.g. Sorenson). But if that Quick Time format/codecs this story is about is truely free and open (by which I mean that it is patent-free, the full specification is available to anyone without NDAs and anyone can make its free software implementation), then I had to be mistaken about Quick Time and I will have to reeducate myself. Thank you for pointing it out, I am glad that they have chosen the free (as in freedom) way of designing multimedia codecs and file formats. I was also almost sure that the MPEG4 was not free format (i.e. not as free as Ogg formats), I had to be wrong, please excuse my ignorance then.

Re:What's the point?

[cappadocius]

Your "answer" ignores one important fact - that neither the MPEG4 codec, nor the MPEG4 file format are proprietary.

IIRC, Apple went through a long strugle with the MPEG people about liscensing fees. Doesn't that make it a proprietary format? I know it is a "standards-based" format, but it was my understanding that the two were not mutually exclusive.

Not a troll, just an honest question.

iPhone

[HaveBlue34]

Can you say iPhone?

does this mean i can watch the twin towers divx rip on my toilet?

Re:iPhone

[tamen]

Nope. But you might be able to do it on your phone ;)

Re:iPhone

[byolinux]

They recently registered iPhone as a trademark in the UK too.

Re:iPhone

[Zane Edwards]

This (iphone.org) is a moot point that has been in the rumor mills for some time. I don't see Apple using a dot org for a marketing domain. Nowe if there was a iphone.COM, that would be a different story.

Re:iPhone

[Knife_Edge]

I think this distinction is irrelevant. It may seem odd that Apple has registered a .org and not a .com, but that may be because their attorneys believe that owning one of these domains is enough to establish a legal precedent of some sort, which may be all that they wanted. IANAL and this does not constitute legal advice.

Re:iPhone

[commodoresloat]

But, stay tuned to apple; the iToilet is coming soon!

IN SOVIET RUSSIA

[Anonymous Coward]

You didn't get first post!

OWNED!!!

iPhone

[iomud]

Should be interesting to note that apple also owns this domain.

Za Moosey?

[Anonymous Coward]

Where is Za Moosey?

AYB

[KarateBob]

All your base are belong to Apple Quicktime

Pr0n

[KecCu]

I guess this will give a whole new dimension to phone sex ...

Re:Pr0n

[tigress]

...and I thought sending an SMS to the boss by mistake was bad. =)

Standards?

[Anonymous Coward]

I just hope I won't see a future where the first question when buying a phone is "Does it run Windows".

Does this mean...

[tigress]

Will I be able to watch my (legally obtained, of course) DivX movies on my Nokia soon? =)

Re:Does this mean...

[Anonymous Coward]

There are no legally obtained DivX movies. The entire codec is probably infringing on some patent.

Re:Does this mean...

[Anonymous Coward]

Quicktime doesn't support DivX.

Re:Does this mean...

[Anonymous Coward]

you can access divx movies with the FFMPEG quicktime component.

Re:Does this mean...

[Catullus]

You can already play MP4 movies on the Nokia 7650.

Lame BeoWulf refrence

[KarateBob]

Imagine a BeoWulf cluster of 16 3G cell phones!

Imagine Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets QuickTime trailer on 16 cell phones in your bedroom.

Nice :)

Re:Lame BeoWulf refrence

[Anonymous Coward]

you mean reference?

New from doubleclick.net

[fatgav]

We at doubleprick.net are pleased to announce our new and exciting range of pop-up video ads for the new generation of mobile phones. Increase your hit rates with a multmedia extravaganza that your customers will look forward to receiving. The best bit is that your customers will pay the download costs for you. They will love you for it!! Enquire today!!!!!!

I just don't get it

[John_Renne]

Sure it sounds pretty neat. I can watch video full color on my cellphone but did anybody ever ask for these kinds of features. Why do they think I own a big screen TV? This whole hype mobile operators want you to follow is just an extra argument to get the money out of your pocket into theirs.

On the other hand it would be the ultimate gadget :-)

Re:I just don't get it

[purrpurrpussy]

What choice do the operators have! They seem to be loosing money hand over fist (or rather have MASSIVE debts). The only successes they've had so far are voice communications and text messaging (which they COMPLETELY overlooked until it had already happened).

They have to recoup money somehow. I suspect they'll end up giving this crap away for free! They've tried charging for voice messaging etc and nobody pays.

I do however THOROUGHLY agree. I do NOT know who is going to be watching "movies" on their mobiles. If grandma wants to watch the kids kids grow up then she'd rather have a video or DVD she can watch at any old time (and over and over again). Are the phone companies going to store your video for you? I guess they must somehow.

1" screen and a crumby piezo speaker... oh yes please.. there are enough butthead idiots out there with 120db ring tones and smalltalk to match. I don't want to hear anymore crap on the train please.

I think this "hype" is to get people to buy new phones... which they often see mto sell at a loss.... go figure....

arse...

Re:I just don't get it

[lucabrasi999]

I completely agree. I recently bought a new phone for my Sprint service (after the old phone decided it didn't want to work anymore). The 19-year old at Radio Shack showed me his Sprint phone, with the color screen and talked about how cool it was. Although it was cool, I could not figure out why I would need a color screen, when the phone would spend about 90% of it's time closed and the other 10% of it's time pressed against my ear.

Quicktime on a phone kind of reminds me of the new BMW 7-Series. Has anyone else seen the inside of this car? It has a new computer screen that controls every aspect of the car (audio, temperature, etc.) with a touch-sensitive, menu-driven screen. It's a neat idea, except for the fact that only an insane driver would mess with touch-screen menus at 70 miles per hour. This basic problem makes a $70,000 car about as useful as Quicktime on a phone.

Quicktime.

[Anonymous Coward]

I realise that I've got a personal vendetta against them, but I'm not letting anything from either Quicktime or Real media anywhere near any of my devices.

(Moral : If you want me to even consider running your software, don't have processes which run all the time... Don't change my existing file associations without asking me and don't put an icon in my taskbar.... Any others... Oh yes... If you're Maria Cantwell from RealMedia, then never ever mail me again... You can take your spam and stick it.... )

I should have stuck with my old analog phone... At least that didn't have an LCD for people to advertise at me with.

Re:Quicktime.

[Anonymous Coward]

don't have processes which run all the time... Don't change my existing file associations without asking me and don't put an icon in my taskbar...

So I guess you don't run Internet Explorer or WMP either, right?

Re:Quicktime.

[SvnLyrBrto]

I'm running top right now (and not running Quicktime), and I don't see anything I can identify as a Quicktime process.

Quicktime has never, in my memory, hijacked a file type or creator without my permission. Of course, it came pre-installed on my computer, so I dunno what would have happened had I installed it fresh. But I can easily, for example, tell mp3's to associate themselves with Audion or iTunes, and Quicktime won't hijack them; either on opening the file, or on launching Quicktime.

And any icons (except for those in the Applications folder itself) are easily removed.

Open your eyes, and stop spreading FUD.

(And hell... when you come right down to it, the most recent version of RealOne is remarkably well-behaved. I admit, I was reluctant as hell to install it, given my past experiences. But they do seem to have listened to the input (complaints) of the users. Still not a company I would give money to, given their past behavior. But they seem to suck significantly less.)

cya,
john

DoCoMo does NOT serve the "western world"...

[interactive_civilian]

So...it is pointless because you folks over in the states can't use it? Gimme a break...

In the country where this is being marketed, there is already an "actual 3G network" in place, so this isn't pointless technology. I am currently a DoCoMo customer who happens to be in the market for a new phone, and I must say, I am quite excited about this. It will be nice to have the media that my phone uses play nicely with my iBook, unlike the format that J-Phone uses, which if sent to a computer, can only be viewed on a PC.

And this technology is not entirely useless in the US. My family happens to live there, and with this, I will be able to send them quicktime movies from my phone...sure, it is a novelty, but it sounds good to me. :D

Just my 2 yen.

Business Men Twiddling their fingers evilly...

[dagg]

1. Sell phones by saying that Grandma can see the kids grow up.
2. Send movie trailers to their phones!
3. ???
4. Profit!

Video on a Phone...

[MosesJones]

Makes MMS look positively naff, why send a single picture when you can send a video stream ?

BUT if you think about the bandwidth requirements of streaming then it becomes hard for the mobile infrastructure to support.

20 million phones, say only 1% active at a time means 200,000 phones active, each streaming at 256 kilobits means 6400000 kilo bytes of bandwidth required. In other words that is 6.4 GigaBYTES of bandwith required by the mobile network.

Video is a nice idea, and for low usage it works okay within a network, but either the quality has to be crap, or the network investment has to be huge to support video-phone technology over IP. There are better compression elements out there that could work at 64 kilobits, but that is still over a Gigabyte per second network.

AND that is just for a country with only 20 million mobiles.

Re:Video on a Phone...

[pwagland]

BUT if you think about the bandwidth requirements of streaming then it becomes hard for the mobile infrastructure to support.

20 million phones, say only 1% active at a time means 200,000 phones active, each streaming at 256 kilobits means 6400000 kilo bytes of bandwidth required. In other words that is 6.4 GigaBYTES of bandwith required by the mobile network.

Yes, but if we assume that this 1% usage rate is true, then that means that each person would be viewing (on average) 1 minute of video, every 100 minutes, or 15 minutes of video per day!

Further, lets assume that this is true, and that the 256kbs thing is also true, that is 480 Kilobytes in traffic per person per day. Looking at current plans that is around 50Euro cents per person per day (at the cheapest rates), or in other words we are talking a 10 million Euro revenue stream per day.

If this was possible, then you can be sure that the phone companies would ensure that the bandwidth was there!

Re:Video on a Phone...

[tigress]

Multicast

Re:Video on a Phone...

[EvilNTUser]

"20 million phones, say only 1% active at a time means 200,000 phones active, each streaming at 256 kilobits means 6400000 kilo bytes of bandwidth required. In other words that is 6.4 GigaBYTES of bandwith required by the mobile network."

Only if you route all traffic through one point, which would of course be terribly silly...

Re:Video on a Phone...

[luisdom]

And you are counting 256kbps for a tiny screen, when, for example the biggest bandwidth codec in gnomemeeting (for video) is 64kbps. For 320x200.
Doesn't seem unreasonable, for me.

Re:Video on a Phone...

[Anonymous Coward]

Multicast wouldn't be very useful for this application since you'll probably be wanting on-demand stream data... Weather forecast, headlines, etc. I guess you could have a CNN-style looping headline broadcast though.

Codec

[Anonymous Coward]

Knowing Apple, it'll be in Sorensen so you have to be running a WinCE phone to see anything anyways

Re:Codec

[geniusj]

I don't think they use sorenson for MP4, only for MOV.

Re:Codec

[Anonymous Coward]

wtf? mpeg 4 IS the codec... QT6 .mov files can contain MPEG4 not sorenson.

bob

Bang!

[Anonymous Coward]

1. Select movie to download.
2. Billed $9.99.
3. Downloading...
4. Downloading...
5. Downloading...
6. "I'm sorry, Quicktime has performed and illegal operation and will be closed. Please report this fault to Apple inc. Thank you."

Re:Bang!

[Mononoke]

6. "I'm sorry, Quicktime has performed and illegal operation and will be closed. Please report this fault to Apple inc. Thank you."

6. "I'm sorry. Microsoft has found this to be the perfect opportunity to make you think that Quicktime has a problem, when it really doesn't. Please help us blame Apple for all our problems. Thank you."

Cell Phone Pornography!

[fortinbras47]

Once again the porn industry is a technological pioneer.

RPN is good

[Anonymous Coward]

Try RPN...

Goto www.hpcalc.org, and download the hp49 simulator. Set it to RPN mode and have a play. Give it 5 minutes and you will want to buy an RPN calculator.

PS: Owning a TI drops your IQ by 5 points. Buting a HP raises it by the same amount.

How come ...

[Anonymous Coward]

... no-one has posted already the obligatory "In Soviet Russia cells phones watch you" -thingy?

Re:How come ...

[Anonymous Coward]

Because they know the golden rule:

Posting an "In Soviet Russia.." comment? You better believe that's a paddling !!

Re:How come ...

[Anonymous Coward]

In Soviet Russia, the obligatory "In Soviet Russia cells phones watch you" -thingies post YOU!

US and 3G

[JimBobJoe]

Now if only these would make sense in the U.S...

The Economist had a great article a few months ago about 3G around the world. Asia does lead the US in 3G, and both places are way far ahead of Europe. Essentially, Europe's insistence on one standard, which worked nicely for 2G, screwed the pooch raw with 3G, that, and the fact that Asia and the US didn't license out 3G, so European cell carriers had to take on debt for billions for 3G whereas no one else did.

There's no doubt in my mind that Asia will continue leading in 3G...for the simple reason that while 3G is developing here in the US, it's been pretty hard to sell Americans on anything other than just talking on the phone. There is some cultural difference that makes Asians all giddy about spiffy 3G features, so it doesn't surprise me to see the newest and greatest 3G tech. over there.

Re:US and 3G

[spewn-]

The article in the Economist is(in my eyes) misleading and holds false information..'why?' you ask..well since I own a 3G Phone myself, and have done for almost a year now..I can safely say, that yes..Asia is pretty much leading the field..but if there was a second place prize..it would be given to my local telecoms company.

This is their little page about the 3G network on the Island I live on. Owning a 3G, and using it day in day out, I can make a fair assessment that the technology is limited at the moment, it's still all a bit of a novelty..the handsets hold little or pointless functionality, and it only comes into its own when u plug the little thing into a USB port on a laptop/desktop. At that point, u get a broadband connection on a mobile device..I'm sure as time goes on, and technology evolves..so too will the handsets, but the main issue for 3G at the moment is that no manufacturer wants to produce 3G phones. This is due to the fact that even on a global scale..3G is relatively unheard of, and it all comes down to the old supply-and-demand..there is no point in making what people don't really want.

The US attitude is probably right at this moment, because 3G is nothing more than a toy..until it begins to get some fundamental uses rather than just to 'look cool' then its gauranteed to be successful..but at the moment..the 3G Flag flies with Asia :)

Re:US and 3G

[cfelde]

If I remember correctly, Isle of Man is the test bed for 3G in Europe.. Tried using it outside your island?

Re:US and 3G

[Anonymous Coward]

It is most deffinatly not Europe holding 3G back, it's the US. The dream of 3G is to be able to go anywhere in the world with one handset and get on a netwrok. All is well and good if you live in Europe or Asia, which are much in sync with 3G (Japan are just ahead with the network infrastructure), but in the US there are about 3 standards.

Here is some RF spectrum, do what you want with it.

Re:US and 3G

[jasenj1]

I was in Hong Kong recently. There are an AWFUL lot of people riding the subways with their headphones/earphones on/in, a cell phone in hand, and an MP3 player clipped to their jacket. (I didn't see many folks with a PDA too, but there were some.) Imagine any significant percentage of those folks using their cell phones to watch and listen to little TV shows to be entertained during the 5-10 minute subway ride from A to B. (Sports highlights, news, music videos, stand up comedians, short cartoons, etc.) This provides not only a useful service to the consumer - fill boring time - but provides a revenue stream to providers.

I'll go one step further, imagine advertiser suppported video on demand via cell phone - so the consumer doesn't have to pay connect/data charges. Cell phones become mini-TVs supported by the same paradigm as current broadcast TV.

IMHO, 3G, video and audio streaming via cell phones will really only take off in populations with large numbers of mass transit commuters, i.e. NOT the U.S. The cell phone becomes not only a comm link, but a personal entertainment center. In the U.S. our cars are our PETCs, in Hong Kong the cell phone is.

Re:US and 3G

[Besty]

Infact that article is slightly out of date, the first commercial implementation of 3G launches very early in 2003. Handset pictures & prices can be found at the following website: www.three.co.uk Tariffs range from £59.99-£99.99, handsets from £399. The sexy clamshell nokia model has bluetooth,2cameras & Java support. We may be behind the US at the moment but i would expect that situation to reverse rapidly in 2003.

Re:US and 3G

[IamTheRealMike]

Essentially, Europe's insistence on one standard, which worked nicely for 2G, screwed the pooch raw with 3G, that, and the fact that Asia and the US didn't license out 3G, so European cell carriers had to take on debt for billions for 3G whereas no one else did.

Actually the European carriers screwed themselves. The airspace was sold off in auction, and they bid each other up to stupid amounts. Having signed the deals during the height of the dotcom bubble, they're now stuck with it. Kind of a shame, but equally they did sign a contract with the government - I don't think they should be let off because they were stupid.

Re:US and 3G

[spewn-]

nope, unfortunately i havent be able to leave..but it wouldnt work, as there is no 3G infastructure outside this island (as far as i know)..like you said, its just a test bed and im a guinea pig :)

Hmmmmmmm

[IamTheRealMike]

Are there really more users who own 3G phones AND want to watch movies on them AND who will pay the horrendous bandwidth charges required than there are desktop Linux users who want to watch movie trailors? I don't think so.

Re:Hmmmmmmm

[martindp]

True .... And how great would it be, that every time you pickup your phone you'll have to click later to that stupid upgrade question?

Re:Hmmmmmmm

[matthew.thompson]

There may well be soon. Remember that the number of people who own mobile phones is numbered in billions.

If the trailers are free of charge or minimal charge kids, in the UK at least, will use the service and then video phone to their mates to arrange to see the film etc. etc. etc.

The issue here is for future market share available - not current market share. The estimates for increases in Linux desktop share are, I would imagine, far lower than the number of people expected to move to 3G mobile system in the next 3 years.

By getting Quicktime onto phones Apple provide a way to sell their encoders and lever Microsoft's format off of the mobile platform.

Re:Hmmmmmmm

[IamTheRealMike]

The estimates for increases in Linux desktop share are, I would imagine, far lower than the number of people expected to move to 3G mobile system in the next 3 years.

Well, that's what the telcos would have us believe, but from what I've gathered most 3rd party analysts aren't so confident. So far, 3G providers (in europe anyway) are horrifically loaded with debt and are desperately trying to find customers who are willing to pay huge amounts for what are essentially gimmicks.

There are loads of adverts here telling us about all the funky things you'll be able to do with 3G phones - maybe, oneday. Everybody takes the piss out of them. 3G is by no means a certain bet.

Compared to Linux which has a huge amount of interest, and a lot of people saying "Well, I would use it but there's still 1 problem left......" I think it's pretty likely that Linux will grow faster than 3G in the next few years, simply because it has a lot more people interested in it.

Don't get me wrong, 3G will happen, but not after some abortive starts and it'll take a lot longer than we think.

15 minutes a day

[MosesJones]

My mobile usage is well over 15 minutes a day, normally around 1 hour a day.

I totally agree that if people use this then the revenues are high, but if it is low quality at the start then it will die (ala WAP, its now good but people don't care very much) and the revenues won't exist.

The problem increases when you consider that much of this is going to be cross-network interconnects so the efficent routing to average the bandwidth will be harder. I don't disagree that if they saw this money they would put the network there, but the issue is that the quality of network has to be very high before this becomes viable.

MMS is being pushed because its got low QoS issues, as long as the message gets there its okay. Streamed video is a different issue as it requires a greater QoS than the standard voice call (you can still hear the voice on a poor connection, but a poor connection == no video) which will be difficult to provide at a reasonable cost.

But without a doubt the mobile operators are going to have to get the biggest fattest pipes onto the internet, and have their own dedicated backbones to route traffic effectively. This is the internet on demand like no-one has seen it before.

Strangelly enough...

[perdelucena]

... I don't have such problem with RealOne running on my RedHat 8.0 workstation.

Trailers free, downloading isn't

[barzok]

Airtime costs.

Re:Trailers free, downloading isn't

[Anonymous Coward]

Airtime costs.

And if the amount people in Europe spend on crap SMS services is anything to go by, people are willing to pay.

Re:Trailers free, downloading isn't

[kruczkowski]

I think the US is the only place where the stupid "airtime" exisits. In Europe, you DON'T pay for recived calls, toll free calls are free. Cell phones are just like anyother phone. I really wish the big players will wake up and adopt a similay pay plan.

BSD or Linux on Nokia's Communicator

[capmilk]

No, it would *not* be cool, since you wouldn't be able to make a single phone call anymore. And at least to that is what a phone should be all about...

Re:BSD or Linux on Nokia's Communicator

[egreB]

I don't think you get the geek factor of this.. It would've been WAY cool to have Unix on this thing! I'd consider buying one if they ported NetBSD to it.

Who cares about phoning people? Another six months, and somebody'll hack a phone-program that will only phone out between 5 and 6 in the morning, and you'll have write the config scripts yourself. But hey! It's cool!

Great quote:

[MoneyT]

Microsoft and Real incorporate Digital Rights Management (DRM) technology in their file format, giving companies an added feeling of security when publishing their content. This, Jones thinks, could be a disadvantage for Apple.

"The big hurdle that QuickTime has to clear is that it isn't a nicely bundled solution of video creation management and security," said Jones. "They don't have some of the content management and DRM capabilities that Real and Microsoft have."

Everyone else calls that a plus. No DRM, no security, less crap to deal with.

On another note, someone was asking whether there was truly a greater demand for this than a Linux port of QT. Perhaps there is, but also, this could be a way to pave the road for video phones.

Re:Great quote:

[Anonymous Coward]

Mark my words. Apple will never release a QT port to Linux. Never. Ever. Noting the "lack of quicktime" is one of the primary things they can do to sway people from using Linux for desktops rather than their proprietary and significantly more expensive Windows XP clone, Mac OS X.

Re:Great quote:

[Anonymous Coward]

Not a very compelling argument either. "lack of quicktime"

Europe is not part of the western world?

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow, I didn't know that!!
You could argue that you meant that 3G networks are not still in use in most, if not all, European countries. But I doubt it is a ponitless technology because until a few months we won't have it(!).

P.S. As the other aswer says, since when something is a pointless technology because you can't use it??

where's the real innovation?

[Anonymous Coward]

I like advanced technologies being put into common use appliances, but I'd like more being able to play with these devices, program them, hack them where possible and customize them.
Current cellphones are plain and simple pieces of crap. Here are just some examples of some real innovation I'd like to see in newer phones.

Why one does have to keep 5 remotes, or buy an uber expensive learning one, when any cellphone could include $ 0.5 circuitry and some lines of code might be added to make it able to learn and keep in memory IR signals?
How about including also a RF module that will open my garage door with the codes I already stored in its memory?

Why do trekkers/workers have to use walkie talkies when cellphones may be configured to allow 1v1 and switched 1vMany short range communication without any need for a repeater?

Why does one have to fight against the expensive cable/docking station when one mini USB port in a cellphone would both give standard physical I/O capabilities and enough power to recharge the batteries simply by connecting it to a PC?

Ok, and as a techie I'd like to program my cellphone in C and its devices in asm.

Make a cool device and I'll buy it, but if you try to charge me for a "service" I already do for free on my computer just because the cellphone it's smaller, you're losing your time.

Re:where's the real innovation?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sounds like you're describing an iPhone

Re:where's the real innovation?

[Catullus]

Let's discuss your points one by one...

I agree with your comments about turning your phone into a remote. But in future, hopefully more and more devices will be controllable via Bluetooth, which a large number of phones do support.

Handset manufacturers don't make phones which could act as walkie-talkies because it would be a loss of revenue for the network operators.

Some phones do have USB docking stations.

Some phones can be programmed in C++.

bloatware

[Anonymous Coward]

I've always found quicktime on the pc to be huge and heavy, and I refuse to install it for that reason (and because they install extra services which don't go away even when you uninstall it)

I hope they've trimmed it down abit for the handheld market...

Semi OT: popups in an audio-stream

[spacefight]

As I tried the day before WMA streaming, I could enter URLs (via the spacialaudio plugin for Winamp) into the stream and whoooom, Windows Media Player opened Internet Explorer and went to the sent URL. Isn't this one of the first possibilities to push the webpage to the user (well besides other nasty popups)?

IMHO this is a huge security gap (imagine a bunch (well let's say 10000) of WMA listeners while you send them all the same URL, nice DDoS he?) and should not be possible. Blame the WMA format?

wow, a 8 Mb player AND a bloated movie on my phone

[avi33]

So the player would be pre-installed, but how is it that the fattest content of all is the right candidate for phone optimization?

tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[g4dget]

QuickTime isn't MPEG4 and QuickTime streams are intrinsically not fully open because they are a container for proprietary video streams. Apple also keeps confusing the issues with their claims that MPEG4 is somehow based on QuickTime; there is some historical relationship, but they are different.

For truly open formats, you have to stick either exclusively to the stuff that is standardized by a standards body, or you have to go with a fully free and open codebase. 90% open doesn't count. Open stream format with the possibility of proprietary codecs doesn't count.

Apple's efforts with QuickTime are really no different from those of Real or Microsoft: they want to dominate multimedia with a format that they control. Their confusing statements about openness and relationships with MPEG4 are simply attempts to muddy the waters and confuse the issues. The best thing consumers can do is to say "no" to all of them--because otherwise consumers are going to pay the price in the long run. There are plenty of alternatives--we don't need Apple, Microsoft, or Real for multimedia.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[zaren]

There are plenty of alternatives--we don't need Apple, Microsoft, or Real for multimedia.

And that would leave us to view our multimedia content with...?

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[g4dget]

MPEG, MPEG2, MPEG4, MJPEG, the h.XXX standards, Ogg, and a few others. Those formats are open, documented, and have open viewers and servers available.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[BlueGecko]

Apple also keeps confusing the issues with their claims that MPEG4 is somehow based on QuickTime; there is some historical relationship, but they are different.

Last time I checked, they both share exactly the same container format. The difference is simply the default encoders they choose to use--and seeing as QuickTime can use the MPEG4 codecs, even that difference can be eliminated.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple also keeps confusing the issues with their claims that MPEG4 is somehow based on QuickTime; there is some historical relationship, but they are different.

Tell me about it! And it's not just Apple confusing things: even those bastards at MPEG are trying to muddy our otherwise-clean waters:

The design [of the MPEG-4 file format] is based on the QuickTime® format from Apple Computer Inc.

I'm sick of this goddamned FUD!

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[2nd Post!]

Such as Apple's Quicktime?

It can support MPEG4, MJPEG, and h.XXX out of the box, and has Ogg and MPEG2 components (for both encoding and decoding) and can decode MPEG1 without any special effort.

What, exactly, is your problem? Quicktime, I believe, *is* documented. The only thorn is the Sorensen codec... which is just a codec, and not a container and not a platform.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[Anonymous Coward]

And if ANYONE is guilty of "muddying the waters" it's Microsoft and the "MPEG-4" they released over two years ago which isn't actually MPEG-4

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[Anonymous Coward]

MPEG is correct. The MPEG4 file format as defined by ISO is based on the QuickTime file format.

If you know differently, please enlighten us.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[g4dget]

And your point is? A small part of the MPEG4 standard is based on an Apple stream format. That doesn't make MPEG4 the same as QuickTime. Most of the MPEG4 standard is about completely different things from a stream standard, things that just aren't in QuickTime at all. And I still can't play general QuickTime streams with a non-proprietary decoder.

What it comes down to is that either Apple is lying when they are saying that some cell phone will incorporate "QuickTime", because what it actually includes is MPEG4, or the cell phone actually includes QuickTime and the content cannot be generated with an MPEG4 encoder.

Re:tired of proprietary formats, muddied waters

[g4dget]

Apple's QuickTime is a container format for multimedia streams; it is NOT a digital video format by itself. If I tell you that something is a QuickTime stream, you will have no idea whether you'll be able to decode it. In fact, you will have no idea whether it's even video.

If these cell phones use "QuickTime", including the ability to use new codecs, then they are effectively using a proprietary format. If they use what QuickTime usually refers to, the QuickTime stream format with Sorenson, then they definitely are using a proprietary format.

If the cell phones use MPEG4, then it's misleading for Apple to claim that they use "QuickTime", which would imply that Apple has some sort of special power over the format; if all they actually use is MPEG4, then Apple is just one of many companies that can provide software or hardware for it.

So, you are right that the QuickTime stream format is open and document; QuickTime just isn't a open streaming video format by itself because it doesn't define how the video is actually encoded.

you didn't finish it.....

[kajoob]

you forgot the obligitory slashdot...

7. ???
8. Profit!

If only this would make sense in the U.S....

[Anonymous Coward]

That's thing there -- it doesn't make a lot of sense in the US. Remember, in other countries people tend to use mass transit way more than we do. Japan is an excellent example. Americans, however, commute alone via car.

So... when are we going to use a service like that to justify the massive 3g infrastructure investment? Especially when we have broadband at the office and a decent dialup at home?

Quicktime

[Anonymous Coward]

Who wants a phone with pop-ups and nag screens? I just uninstalled Quicktime yesterday when I realized it now has something that runs automatically when I boot. Uninstall was faster than tracking down and disabling that "feature".

Re:Quicktime

[Dawang]

You mean

QuickTime > Player Preferences > (uncheck) Show Hot Picks movie automatically

was too difficult for you?

Re:Quicktime

[bill_mcgonigle]

No you didn't. That's why you posted as Anonymous Coward. What you really did is go look at some more Quicktime trailers and you couldn't figure out how to disable hotpicks, so you thought you'd vent here.

Re:oh yeah?

[Anonymous Coward]

Once you know what quicktime is, you can understand why M$ wanted to kill it, and why Jobs resisted.

OT

Tell me guys, where would the porn industry be without QuickTime? QuickTime + Final Cut Pro = crusty shorts.

Quicktime on Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

It is rather a shame that Apple hasn't released an official port of quicktime for linux, but the latest mplayer plays all the sorensen movies and the wmv movies. I think mplayer plays every format out there...the new LOTR trailer looks so sweet in linux...the mplayer version of qt seems to run smoother than the windows version....gotta love linux....phones should use mplayer.....lol...

http://www.mplayerhq.hu

Helix binaries

[logic7]

I'm wondering where the client binary files on that site are located?? I don't want to download the source code or register for that.

Re:Helix binaries

[goat_attack]

You gotta register if you want to download the binaries too. :P Once you're registered click on download the source, and on the left side hit binary EULA under the select license section.

Feh.

A name for this

[squiggleslash]

I think this is a remarkable innovation. Just think - a person will be able to receive video and audio signals transmitted over radio waves within a few miles of a suitable transmitter.

We could call this equipment a name that reflects its nature - perhaps "tele", from the Latin for "far", and "vision", reflecting the visual nature of the content transmitted. Visiontele. It has a nice ring to it.

Re:A name for this

[ArpAkolAs]

"tele" Latin for "far"? Where did you learn latin dude? "Tele" is ancient Greek for "far".

Re:A name for this

[Ilgaz]

grammar nazis even check latin? omg, phear.

It was a JOKE man ,-)

Re:A name for this

[squiggleslash]

I shall refrain from making the standard "It's all greek to me" joke.

Ooops!

Yep, I knew the roots of "television" were a Latin/Greek combination, but I thought, for some reason, it was Tele that was the Latin bit as Vision (video) is more, I don't know, modern sounding and standalone, and tele- gets prepended to almost everything.

I shall slink back now...

AT&T GPRS vs QT6

[scotty1024]

AT&T thinks they have this capability today in the US with their GSM based GPRS service. But as I see it AT&T has two challenges with customers using something like a QT6 player on a Tungsten via Bluetooth to watch movies. 1. Their GPRS network has still never delivered even 57,600 bits per second to me. 2. At $0.01 per 1024 bytes a two hour movie delivered via their network would cost me around $500 if they were capable of delivering 57600bps!

Re:AT&T GPRS vs QT6

[dorky]

True, true. Downloading meaningful video streams to a cell phone with GSM or even GPRS is not going to be feasible any time soon because of bandwidth restrictions. (Although we have chalkers here, and that WiFi SD card...)

But convergence is here already, even if it's not realtime convergence. C'mon over to my house, and I'll show you how I do it on my TMobile PocketPC phone.

1) Record films/shows to PC with WinTV and SnapStream. (Alternately, download saved shows from TiVo with WinTV and WinDVR.)

2) Use SnapStream's Pocket PC converter or Windows Media Encoder to munge down the size of the file.

3a) Enable SnapStream server. Leave house.

4a) Dial into ISP from PocketPC Phone, connect to SnapStream server, and stream video files (takes a long-ass time).

OR

3b) Save shrunken .WMV files to phone's SD expansion card.

4b) Leave house.

5) Watch whatever the hell you want wherever the hell you want to in Media Player. Yesterday, rather than leafing through germ-laden back issues of Good Housekeeping as I whiled away an hour in the doctor's waiting room, I watched "The Sopranos", while at the same time waiting on hold with the veteranarian's office.

Oh, and then at the vet's office, I read an eBook.

You mean Windows Media Player

[Frobozz0]

Uhhh... I think you mean Windows Media Player, not Quicktime. LOL.

Guess whhhhhaaaat?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're an idiot

Argh.

[xmutex]

Look, I want to make phone calls with my cell phone. I want to sometimes receive them.

This is all. I don't want my cell phone to take pictures, play games, play QuickTime movies, launch surface to air missles, sing to me on lonely nights, do the jig, reminisce about the halcyon days of yore, and so on.

All this whizz bang cell phone "technology" is obnoxious and a textboox example of feature creep.

STOP THE MADNESS!

Re:Argh.

[Anonymous Coward]

What's the matter, can't drive, talk, and watch the latest LOTR trailer at the same time?

Re:Argh.

[superdan2k]

I dunno...the abitily to launch surface-to-air missiles with a cellphone would be pretty groovy. (Obligatory USA PATRIOT Disclaimer: I am NOT advocating or planning any terrorist activities.)

Actually, I'm of the opinion that extra features in a cellphone generally suck. I just cancelled my web access ($5/month) on my SprintPOS (er, PCS) phone because I never use it.

Right now I want exactly TWO things from my cellphone: decent coverage area, and Bluetooth capabilities to I can use my iBook to surf from wherever and keep all my phone #s straight between my Palm, iBook, and cellphone (because I have so many floating around, I never remember them all).

Re:Argh.

[sco08y]

(Obligatory USA PATRIOT Disclaimer: I am NOT advocating or planning any terrorist activities.)

Obviously if you *were* planning terrorist activities you'd use precisely this disclaimer. I'd better forward this to No Such Agency.

Re:Argh.

[schuss42]

hear that - all i really want is for the phone to *work* most of the time, and some way to keep the address book current with all the other address books floating around (palm, powerbook, webmail, post-its on my desk). i use text messaging a lot, that's pretty neato. the rest of it, forget it.

is anyone really going to carry around a digital camera attachment for their phone so they can send pictures/video to their *one* other friend who can see them? don't think so. i want my phone *smaller* and with *less* loose parts to break off or lose.

my phone's like my wallet - goes everywhere with me. gets dropped. scratched. beat up. tossed in the backseat. sat on. <sarcasm>i know, let's put some sensitive video hardware and a *glass lens* in there! yeah!</sarcasm> :p

c'mere, sprint! i'll give ya some PieCeS of this Vision!

Ogg?

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe with the QT Ogg component, we can listen to ogg files on the cell phone!

Re:US and 3G - LMAO

[dapprman]

The US screw themselves over 2G phones and suddenly people think they're world leaders.

Japan is far ahead of anyone on the 3G game, and the technology is, at least, bieng tested in teh UK and Europe.

Oh and it's not the supposed licensing that's cost the Euro companies so much, it's the fact the governments auctioned off the licences, starting at ridiculously high prices.

Get QuickTime Pro now?

[nightsweat]

I'd hate to have to click through that "Upgrade Now" nonsense every time I wanted to see a little vid on my phone.

What else is remaining?

[bayankaran]

Now cellphones are PDAs, movieplayers, radios, MP3 players and what not.

What about adding a scanner, keyboard, mouse etc.

After two years of cellphone usage, I cancelled the account. Now I use it as an alarm clock and phone number book.

Why does DRM matter?

[MacGoldstein]

The way they say Apple's quicktime 6 doesn't include DRM security measures makes it sound like a bad thing. Why is it that today the masses won't accept a technology without adding some ridiculous "anti-pirating" measure onto it? I think anyone should be able to play any movie regardless of who they are or where they got it.

Re:Why does DRM matter?

[Basehart]

I agree - if someone builds a multiplex and starts showing pirated movies to paying patrons I think that's screwed up, but someone watching a bit of Twin Towers while having a shit is NOT an issue

why ofcourse!

[amanpatelhotmail.com]

Now if only these would make sense in the U.S

Porn... To Go

linux users

[edmo]

can now see "download QuickTime plug-in" on their cell phones

Makes MMS look positively naff

[Catullus]

Actually, MMS is a fairly flexible standard and there's no reason why you can't send video clips over it. For, probably, a lot less money.

thats great but..

[Anonymous Coward]

Will a quicktime pro add interupt you in the middle of a conversation

united states patent #6,134,243

[retiarius]

referenced from www.mpegla.com, this is
a nexus essential to both quicktime and .mp4.

now if only "container" compatibility
quirks were overcome, so that things like
supposedly legal .mp4 bitstreams from the
codecs of 3ivx/divx could interoperate with
bare quicktime without explicit installation.

DRM

[ryochiji]

> Microsoft and Real incorporate Digital Rights Management (DRM) technology in their file format [...] This, Jones thinks, could be a disadvantage for Apple.

It appears the assumption here is that not having DRM is a good thing. It may be a good thing for corporations, but it's NOT a good thing for consumers. I think consumers need to be more active in supporting non-DRM solutions so that corporations don't automatically assume DRM=good.

Yes, they are proprietary. Licensing $$$

[xiphmont]

You'll need to license over a hundred actively defended patents to play in the MP4 kiddie pool.

The standard is well and publicly specced, and this is indeed a much better thing than it being secret. But you're required to pay money even for the right to build your own from scratch.

Monty

Incredibly misleading headline.

[robla]

The headline should be "3GPP support to your cell phone", and it's not all that surprising, but it's very good news for everyone (including RealNetworks, where I'm from). We've been doing a lot of work in the 3GPP, and it's great to see that work paying dividends. If you really want to find out what this stuff is about, look at the spec (and yes, I hate the fact that these are Word docs in zipfiles as much as anyone).

Much of the confusion around this subject comes from a lack of understanding of the difference between .mov, .mp4, and .3gp. DoCoMo's announcement was good news for 3GPP, and given the support throughout the Helix platform for 3GPP formats, codecs, and protocols, we view it as great news for the Helix Community.

As another poster pointed out, only a piece of 3GPP is based on Quicktime is the container file format itself (the bit that says "here's a 3000 byte chunk of data with this 32bit codec identifier"). Another piece (the protocol) is based on work RealNetworks pioneered (RTSP). Moreover, the Helix DNA Client supports the 3GPP specification today.

RealNetworks added MPEG-4 and 3GPP support 10 months ago with the RealSystem Mobile Server (see press release),
and MPEG-4 support will be included in the Helix DNA Server when it is released in the near future.

As for the speculation about Apple releasing 3GPP encoding support, we would welcome them to the party. In early November we announced that a version of our Producer product for creating 3GPP content will ship in Q1 of 03. (see press release) Moreover, we offer our encoding framework as open source (and naturally open APIs) so that you can add support for whatever format you want to. We've given you a head start by implementing Ogg Vorbis support.

Again, the new phones sound great. Lots of new devices for Helix encoders and servers to work with.

Re:Video on a Phone... it's stamp-sized, tho

[nikster]

current phones have something like 128x160 pixel screens... so you can be very cheap-ass with the data rate.
seems like you could do a lot less than 256k...

hey.. all of a sudden, stamp-sized video starts to make sense.. ;)

Twin towers?

[teasea]

Did they make that into a movie or something?? Damn exploitational swine.