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Mozilla.org Launches Mozilla 1.3
theBrownfury writes "Mozilla 1.3 is out and about. New to this version are features like image auto sizing, bayesian junk-mail filtering, dynamic profile switching, about:config for a pretty view into all of Mozilla's "secret" settings, an initial version of Midas for rich text editing, and a lot of other fixes for performance, standards compliance and site compatability. Also with 1.3 Mozilla is now applying machine learning to improve the autocomplete feature. Mozilla 1.3 is now the official stable release from mozilla.org. Users of all previous versions should upgrade to 1.3 for the latest in features and stability. More info at the 1.3 release page and discussions at mozillaZine.org."
what, no mp3 player?
Thats fine is you want the bloat. (although the kitchen sink is pretty funny) But when is the phoenix browser project going to release .6?
Choose wisely you must...
Yeah! Got the Linux and Windows versions before the Slashdotting! In your face, Taco!
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
I just heard this sad bit of news on talk radio; Slashdot browser star Phoenix was found dead in its Seattle home this morning. There weren't any details. Even if you didn't agree with its minimalist style, there's no doubting its contributions to browser culture. Truly an open source icon.
Autocomplete: the only browser feature that can turn Disney.com into DonkeyHumpingMaidens.com.
"Also with 1.3 Mozilla is now applying machine learning to improve the autocomplete feature."
Sounds good. Eventually I can just tell it "porn" and it will go grab all sorts of crazy shit for me to do naughty things to. Of course, I hope it doesn't work like the Tivo's related feature or I'll end up with 30 translations of goatse.cx and a giant pic of Janet Reno in a bikini.
Shawn
Because you gotta bitch
If you haven't been using the 1.3 preview releases, and so haven't been running the spam filters yet, remember they take a while to get going. Look at http://www.paulgraham.com/spam.html , the results are for around 8000 sorted messages. Just keep correcting it and you'll be fine.
I'm scared of numbers that can't be written as a fraction. It's an irrational fear.
Mozilla is contacted by slashdot.
Thursday March 13, @04:30PM
Mozilla is slashdotted.
Thursday March 13, @04:50PM
Mozilla takes FIRE BREATHING REVENGE OF DOOM! LAUNCHES NUCLEAR MISSLES AT "THE THREAT"
Thursday March 13, @05:01PM
Mozilla successfully slashdots slashdot with nuclear missles.
...you can now use a version of Galeon later than 1.2.7 without worrying about a dodgy beta copy of Mozilla. In the past if I'd wanted 1.2.8 I'd have to download and use the possibly unstable Mozilla 1.3 beta.
Get Mozilla 1.3 here and here.
Note to M1-ers: a curt but otherwise insightful message is not "Flamebait" or "Troll".
I just barely got done downloading Netscape 4! stupid 1200 baud modem!
...when you're downloading in the middle of a slashdotting, and it's *still* going at max speed. Sigh.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
Everything you need to know, step by step, can be found here.... I've been building AA/TrueType support into Mozilla for a while now, and I have no idea why it's not enabled by default, or why others don't config their builds to do the same. Mozilla looks like absolute shit without smooth fonts.
Additionally, you can find a webcam movie of me eating a donut by clicking the link below.
Bowie J. Poag
Finally mozilla supports unicode in the titlebar properly and also the address bar! Not the most important feature but it certaintly made things ugly to look at when you look at sites in different character sets. (This is reffering to Windows rels. btw)
Al Qaeda has ninjas!
Make Moz1.3 look just like IE... with the IE skin.
Force-upgrade people without them noticing.
At least it doesn't have an operating system built into it like IE.
134340: I am not a number. I am a free planet!
Autocomplete doesn't use machine learning in 1.3. It was an experimental, disabled-by-default, feature in 1.3beta for data-collection.
Aren't we supposed to be nerds here? Doesn't that mean we should all be capable of installing a fucking browser properly?
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
If you read the ML autocomplete page, the main "feature" in 1.3 is logging what entry people tend to pick from the autocomplete list; this will be fed into development of the ML autocomplete. They have a super-alpha version of the engine in there, sure, but really what you should be doing with 1.3 is feeding them the info. Don't expect intelligent autocompletion.
Unfortunately they still haven't added NTLM support. If you're in a total Microsoft shop with a MS proxy, if the admin has it totally secured, nothing other than IE can be used. Having this feature in Mozilla will help reestablish it as a corporate browser....and help some of us who can only use IE.
Oh and the bug is 3 years old. I know some work is being done on the Windows Mozilla, but damn. Three years?
m.kelley
life is like a freeway, if you don't look you could miss it.
This is the quickest I ever installed software... hot off the press.
I LOVE mozilla... too bad more users don't have this expirience.
Just installed it on OS X. Installation was literally "dragon-drop" (ba dum bum).
What is music when you despise all sound?
1.2.1 finally fixed www.msnbc.com. However, www.nvidia.com was still not "right". Now even that site works. woot!
I know judging a browser by it's ability to handle the twisted "html" these sites use is a bad thing to do. However, it's nice to see Mozilla take on the challenge and succeed anyhow.
Maw! Fire up the karma burner!
Only problem is that I can't find a single web page which demonstrates Midas in-action, what gives?!
The RPMs for RedHat 8 have the Xft support enabled. (They're not released yet, but they probably will be soon.)
It's not enabled by default because it requires libraries (Xft2, fontconfig) that many users don't have. At some point someone might modify the code so that it tests for the presence of the library and loads all the required function pointers manually, but that's a bit of work. What's available now is good enough for distributors and good enough for people who know to get the RH8 RPMs.
No IE favorites import. :( It's broken again. Back to Bugzilla....
Skip Franklin
It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. -- despair.com
Go ahead and demonstrate for me how you can generate an arbitrary file with the same MD5 checksum as the Mozilla tarball.
Still waiting.
No?
Well I can't square what you say with what I see. The production release of 1.3 is snappy. At least as fast as 1.2.1.
Maw! Fire up the karma burner!
Just curious -- how long does it usually take before they create the RPM's for each release? They don't seem to be available for 1.3 yet.
Trolls lurk everywhere. Mod them down.
Nice OS, all it needs now is an internet browser. [SlashCompo: Fastest Post to Get a Troll Mod]
Am I the only one here that is happy Mozilla 1.3 is out? After reading the posts here it sounds like /. would bitch if they were hung with a new rope.
/.ers also complain about)
What is wrong with Mozilla? "Bloat" what exactly is "bloat" memory footprint? HDD footprint? Load Time? Compaired to IE I find it to be very compeditive, plus you are not helping lord gates and mount redmond take over the net/world. You are providing them with a serious challenge which is better for everyone.
Sorry, I just work up and I'm a little cranky. I don't meean to bitch at the parent post specificly just people that are complaining about nit picky stuff while overlooking all the time/energy spent giving them a free speech/beer answer to IE and redmond (something
F3 or Ctrl-G
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
> Mozilla takes FIRE BREATHING REVENGE OF DOOM! LAUNCHES NUCLEAR MISSLES AT "THE THREAT"
MOZILLA was a browser, he was a dragon-browser, he was just a dragon, but he was still MOZILLA! Burninating the BLINK tags! Burninating the DOM! Burninating all the Frontpage users in their non-compliant HTML! (NON-COMPLIANT HTMLLLL!!!!!) AND THE BEAST SHALL COME FORTH SURROUNDED BY A ROILING CLOUD OF VENGEANCE... uh, I mean IN THE NIIIIIIGHT!
- The Book of Consummate Vs, 12:10
Hasn't about:config been there for a while?
The pace at which they're going now is absolutely incredible. It took them forever to reach 1.0, and I admint I was somewhat skeptical about the project. But once they got to 1.0, they started going fast and furious.
I will politely wait for the slashdotting to end before getting this release, but I can't wait! Go Moz!
Follow the adventures of the new wandering jews
I just check my weblog stats and non IE browsers accounted for 12% of hits so far today (out of 1.1million). About two months ago it was only 7%. Mozilla itself is at about 6.2%. Let's hope this trend continues.
An excellent example of what open source can accomplish, and I really mean that. Kudos and all that.
Automatic image resizing is off by default in Mozilla (although on by default in Phoenix), and can be toggled by clicking on the image.
I have to say I don't like it much either. For Phoenix users, it can be turned off by adding user_pref("browser.enable_automatic_image_resizing ", false); to user.js in the profile directory, or by manipulating the browser.enable_automatic_image_resizing preference in about:config .
I'm sure the Mozilla gods have blessed us with a config option to disable this "feature."
Actually, you have a preference to _enable_ the feature. It's off by default. Also, once enabled (by going to Edit->Preferences...->Appearance and checking the box titled "Enable automatic image resizing") a simple click on the image will restore it to its original size.
This really is a friendly implementation. I much prefer it to the feature implemented by the other guys.
--Asa
You are aware that mozilla is hosted in AOL's datacenter, arn't you? Good luck slashdotting it.
From domainwhitepages.com:
OrgName: Netscape Communications Corp.
OrgID: NSCP
Address: 501 E. Middlefield
City: Mountain View
StateProv: CA
PostalCode: 94043
Country: US
NetRange: 207.200.64.0 - 207.200.127.255
CIDR: 207.200.64.0/18
NetName: NETSCAPE-CIDR
NetHandle: NET-207-200-64-0-1
Parent: NET-207-0-0-0-0
NetType: Direct Allocation
NameServer: NS.NETSCAPE.COM
NameServer: NS2.NETSCAPE.COM
Comment: ADDRESSES WITHIN THIS BLOCK ARE NON-PORTABLE
RegDate: 1996-09-06
Updated: 2001-03-28
TechHandle: AOL-NOC-ARIN
TechName: America Online, Inc.
TechPhone: +1-703-265-4670
TechEmail: domains@aol.net
I think AOL can hold up aginst a slashdotting...
Which is especially true since you can download the Mozilla source yourself, set your compile options, and not have to build most of these extra features in at all. I mean, even the cited Phoenix browser relies on a functional build of Mozilla to compile, right?
I do not have a signature
The nightly builds support AA but it isn't enabled by default. I'm using this in my user.js:
pref("font.FreeType2.enable", true);
pref("font.FreeType2.autohinted", false);
pref("font.FreeType2.unhinted", false);
pref("font.antialias.min", 0);
Looks good to me!
Check out the Progress and Future of Mozilla-the-application-suite for information on what's coming up in the next few months.
It'll work when bug 104174 is fixed.
Guvf vf abg n EBG zrffntr
If this feature has indeed been added to mozilla (and MS could learn this as well), please add an option to turn it off!
An online Starcraft RPG? Only at
Online Starcraft RPG? At
Dietary fiber is like asynchronous IO-- Non-blocking!
Strangly enough, thats not way I would Build Mozilla. Usualy I use these to get what I want, this includes all sorts of goodys, that are not just font specific. Also I shy away for the "-march=i686" but I do use O2.
ac_add_options --enable-crypto
ac_add_options --enable-ldap-experimental
ac_add_options --enable-optimize=-O2
ac_add_options --enable-reorder
ac_add_options --enable-cpp-rtti
ac_add_options --enable-cpp-exceptions
ac_add_options --enable-default-toolkit=gtk2
ac_add_options --disable-toolkit-gtk
ac_add_options --enable-xft
ac_add_options --enable-freetype2
ac_add_options --enable-oji
ac_add_options --disable-debug
ac_add_options --disable-short-wchar
ac_add_options --with-system-zlib
ac_add_options --with-system-jpeg
ac_add_options --with-system-png
ac_add_options --with-system-mng
ac_add_options --disable-tests
"think of it as evolution in action"
The way I think completion should work is to match the shortest matching non-unique segment. /info.
3 /20282 09&mode=nested&tid=95&tid=185&tid=154"
If I type "www.moz" and I've been to "www.mozilla.com" (and various subdirectories) and "www.mozone.com" (and various subdirectories), it should show just those two matches, without the subdirectories. I should then be able to hit tab to choose one or the other, and then continue to type. Say I choose www.mozilla.com and type
Now, if the only pages matching this is "/info/win32/editor.html" "info/win32/browser.html" "/info/linux/browser.html" then I should get to choose between "/info/linux/" and "/info/win32/".
This way I can type "sl" and see all the individual sites starting with sl, before looking through thousands of lines like
"http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/03/1
Also, if there are no matches, the window shouldn't come up at all. It's a pain to have to click repeatedly to get out of the URL entry if the url you are entering doesn't match anything. (at least on the Linux version)
If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
These preferences (font.FreeType2.*, etc.) trigger different antialiased font code -- code that uses FreeType directly rather than going through Xft2 and fontconfig. This requires that the user configure TrueType fonts separately for Mozilla.
There's been a bit of debate about which approach is better. I'm strongly in the "don't reinvent the wheel" camp, and thus I prefer Xft to the direct use of FreeType.
If you want the old one, get it from bug 93093.
And save it as "mozilla.bmp" in your Mozilla folder.
Guvf vf abg n EBG zrffntr
That the idea to use it as a platform to develope portable applications (using ECMAScript + XUL) is catching on slower than some people would expect. This is a pity, because ungodly amounts of effort goes in making this possible, and still people see it just as a web browser (a large one).
Other than that, Mozilla-the-web-browser is fine, Mozilla-the-messaging suite is at least good enough, and Mozilla-the-javascript-debugger shows lots of promises.
I don't include Mozilla-the-IDE (Komodo) in the list, since it deviates too much from the usual distribution (even if it is Gecko Inside(TM)).
Now waiting for Mozilla-the-organizer (thru Calendar, planned for 1.4 ~ 1.5). Perhaps a Mozilla-the-file-manager would be something worth implementing (but Meow seems definitively dead).
"Tools | Mark Selected Messages as *Not* Junk"
There have been a bunch of posts to the newsgroup and this has been the problem.
Unless you tell the filter what is spam *AND NOT* spam then it only has half of the information it needs to make a decision. It's a bimodal decision tree that is used to determine whether a message is spam or not. ie;
for each word {
the probability it is spam is x
and the probability it is ham is y
}
A calculation (Bayes) of those probabilities intersecting usually places the probability that any given message is spam either close to 1 (spam) or 0 (ham). What happens if you don't train ham is the probability of all messages will be around .5 and that is not enough to say anything definitively and defaults to delivery.
Who are you? The new #2 Who is #1? You are #617565. I am not a number, I am a free man! Muhahaha.
Do you have any idea how much porn I didn't keep because autosize made it too small??? Not Mozilla too, geez...
If you're running OS X on that PowerBook, then no, this won't affect you. The bug affects OS 9 and lower.
They usually appear a while after the actual release.
Look on ftp.mozilla.org for the previous Mozilla releases, they have md5 checksums.
Guvf vf abg n EBG zrffntr
It's important to those of us that have to use multiple browsers for one reason or another. There are lots of cases where a site is only viewable in IE (or vice versa, although that's much less common). This is especially bad if your company develops Int(er|ra)net applications, as mine does.
.URL file formats haven't changed recently - certainly they're simple enough. But somehow this feature keeps breaking. It's a reason for me not to use Mozilla, and if Mozilla is ever going to become a general user phenomenon, it needs to be working flawlessly. Joe user won't switch unless we make it extremely easy for him to do so.
The "who cares" mentality seems to exist at the Mozilla developer level as well, since this bug keeps popping up again and again. I'm almost positive that
The obvious next comment is "get the source, fix it yourself, submit a patch". If I get the time, maybe I will, despite my less-than-stellar C++ skills.
Skip Franklin
It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black. -- despair.com
It seems like this autocomplete thing is more about ranking... I wonder if they'll fix what I consider to be the bigest problem with autocomplete - Mozilla will pick one site from which to return URLs.
Example: If I start typing in 'http://s' for example, it will gladly show me a list of 20 URLs from slashdot.org, but not a single one for stickdeath. Why doesn't it do like (Windows) Explorer-style autocomplete - when I type in the above, provide me with domains from which to choose. When and if I pick Slashdot, then it should provide links from slashdot only, but why on earth does it assume that by typing a few letters, that it should automatically complete 10 documents from the same website, but none from any others?
--Dan
For a better web browser that does support mp3 playing, go here.
You know where you are? You're in the $PATH, baby. You're gonna get executed!
Mozilla just keeps getting better and better... With all the features it has, it's well on it's way to becoming the super user's uber browser. I had to tweak one of the "secret features" a few weeks ago. (Port 1080 is denied unless you explicitly tell the browser that it's OK to access) The info I found, referred me to the about:config screen. When I saw it I was very impressed at how much potential there is for using this browser in so many different ways. The only thing they need on Linux now is the "Quick Start" or whatever they call it launcher program. That way you will only have to wait a fraction of a second for Mozilla to appear. I think this could be implemented by having another Mozilla componenet that you can run at X login. It doesn't actually display any output, it just loads the base elements of Mozilla needed to launch any Mozilla app. That would be EXTREMELY cool...
-- For my comments on the new difficulties in first posting and the "broken-ness" of metamoderation, go here:
http://slashdot.org/~Trolling4Dollars/journal/2699 5
Un-news
if your like me and you don't use the download manager but have dialogs enabled, you will eventually find that downloads will continually take longer and longer to start. Eventually I ended up with a 10 second lag between clicking save, and the application actually saving. Turns out Mozilla logs all downloads in the download manager anyway and NEVER purges the list. You can improve performance by deleting the file 'downloads.rdf' in your profile directory (this of course nukes your download history).
Just in case anyone else has been having a problem with huge delays in downloads starting.
Seriously IE sucks. Even die hard Windows users I know switch to Mozilla or Opera. I do use the best tool for the job which is why I use Mozilla. Maybe if Microsoft opensourced IE it'd improve and not suck so much. Pitiful considering how few platforms they even support and the headstart they had.
:)
The same with Linux. I use Linux because it's better than Windows (for my needs at least). I do have major complaints about Gnome 2 though. It seems like they've slipped a lot. They actually are making XP look good in some ways.
The one really kickass program Microsoft makes.. M$ Flight Sim. Flight Sim is cool. Haven't seen it in a while though. They still selling it? I have yet to see an opensource program that was anywhere as cool as Flight Sim.
Also keep in mind that having access to the source is one feature that defines how useful that program is as a tool. Would you buy a car if it were impossible to open the hood? Of course not because to keep the car useful as a tool you need the ability to fix things that break. Maybe you wouldn't be the one to fix it but you could pay somebody to. Unless you have really deep pockets just try to get Microsoft to fix a bug just for you.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
I know I can see the ALT tags by doing properties on the images, but I'd rather be able to simply see them on mouse over.
"To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit." -Stephen Hawking
Yes, I know I can save some folders and do other weird stuff to make sure this doesn't happen, but by god, think of the newbies. (Ok, so the last part was a bit over the top, but still...)
Oh, and with the new spam-filtering-rules Mozilla has now become my fav mailclient. Combined with IMAP it just rocks.
Thank You to all developers. Perhaps I should go file that bug now. The annoying one.
You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. -- Harlan Ellison
Naw. I think Mozilla is great if you have anything even remotely new for a computer. I still think they should put more effort into making it run better on crappy hardware but it runs well on most gear.
Mozilla uses less memory than IE and doesn't leak memory like Netscape 4.x so that is good. If you don't want all the extras you can easily compile Mozilla without them for less memory and hdd use.
Mozilla is very stable and full of useful features. Not crap like a talking paperclip but things that are actually useful. It looks a lot nicer than any other browser I've seen to. Some other browsers allow themes but they are pretty limited and still pretty ugly. Mozilla also has a lot better CSS support than other browsers which results in nice looking standard compliant web pages.
The fact that it's opensource is a great feature. It allows for unlimited customization and bug fixes. The fact that it gives IE some real competition is good for both IE and non-IE users. Having a choice is one of those features we all should appreciate.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
Unfortunately Mozilla still has a horrible usability flaw that the developers refuse to address. It caches DNS lookups forever, and does not honor the TTL on the record - there is no way to turn this off. This means that any site that uses changing DNS records with a short TTL for failover or load balancing will be broken for Mozilla users. IE works fine. This issue makes Mozilla look really pathetic in a corporate environment.
Search bugzilla for "dns cache".
Am I the only person who noticed that they cravenly removed the Mozilla mascot from the splash screen?
This will sound stupid to the Slashdot Crowd, but many of the people that I've switched to Mozilla really, really liked the mascott. I've even had several of the women comment that they used Mozilla because they thought the logo was cute; the guys though it looked cool (these people are not technical types).
Why they would switch to the current bland and antiseptic splash screen is beyond me. I mean, I'm not going to switch browsers or anything, but they do risk alienating at least a fraction of their "joe six-pack" user base. Plus it's just dumb from a marketing standpoint.
Bring back the fire-breathing lizard!!!!
If you agree with me, vote for the bug I submitted to Bugzilla.
Help save the critically endangered Blue Iguana
Since my computer started getting infected with all kinds of ActiveX exploits, I've switched to browsing the internet only with Mozilla. (I use IE for work stuff that requires ActiveX) Popup management alone would have been a good reason to switch. However, I haven't noticed it being any slower than IE lately. I _HAVE_ noticed that Windows tries to swap Mozilla out of memory the first chance it gets. It's almost uncanny. I'll have a bunch of applications running, and Mozilla is always the first one to get swapped out when I'm working on something else. Obviously, this rarely happens with IE (presumably because 9/10 of it is loaded when you boot Windows). Anybody have any idea why it seems to be so much worse with Mozilla? (Running Windows 2000).
GreyPoopon
--
Why is it I can write insightful comments but can't come up with a clever signature?
It's only a minor annoyance, but Mozilla doesn't yet snap to the default button in Windows if that setting is configured in Control Panel (when set, the mouse cursor should automatically move to the default button in dialog boxes). You might think it wouldn't be such a tough fix, but it's apparently ellusive :-/.
If you like, you can vote for the bug (you'll need a free Bugzilla account to vote). You'll probably need to copy-n-paste the URL, as Bugzilla doesn't accept referers from Slashdot.
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
That would be the "other" line, right? browsers used on google in January
--
I have no sig. I am lame.
"Why the heck can't it handle my skins a little more gracefully? Is having Orbit work between 1.2.1 and 1.3 too much to ask?"
No kidding, they should just include/maintain Orbit with the default install - everyone I know that uses Mozilla uses Orbit as their theme of choice.
-If
Run a pencil-and-paper RPG campaign with your far-off friends: Gametable!
I love the spam filter... I even used 1.3a and 1.3b get the bayesian filter feature. Now that 1.3 is out I'll be installing that ASAP and hope that it fixes a few minor bugs I've noticed.
You don't have to have a large section of the market to be competition. Remember how fast IE destroyed Netscape? You just have to have a product good enough to keep the heat on. If IE stops progressing Mozilla will catch up and surpass them and eventually eat their lunch. Unlike Netscape Mozilla isn't going to be easy to kill. It's been designed from the ground up to be maintainable and flexible. It's independent of a commercial company. You can't buy it ot put it out of business.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
So if you want to help a poor Mac (and Linux, for my servers) user who can't afford to upgrade to Jaguar, go to this website and make a donation! (or buy something).
Shameless, I know. Shame is too expensive for my budget.
Convert RSS to HTML - integrate webfeeds into your website
... one is the quick launch "feature'O'bug".
this problem is much deeper than it appears to be. It's directly connected to the memory leaks issues. whether bad mozilla code or bad C libs implementations are guily for these is still debated on bugzilla. I guess there is no hope to see this baby fixed until a mjor new version emerges (2.0?).
in my opinion this is the biggest problem this cool browser has and it's getting pretty old.
... second is the ATI drivers doodoo.
i don't know just how big this one is but the fact that a browser admits to have problems with all of the latest ATI drivers is totally unacceptable.
i would propose them to extend this problem over nvidia cards so that we all go for matrox.
I would have liked to use Mozilla for my e-mail, as Netscape Messenger 4.7x finally has enough unfixed time/date induced problems so as to be unusable.
I have an inbox (no messages left on server) with about 90 e-mail and 10 MB of attachments. My folders in total have around 30 MB of e-mail. This is on Windows 2000, 800 MHz cpu, 7200 RPM 60 GB disk, HDD FULLY defragmented two days ago, folders compressed not less than a few days ago..
"Compressing" the folders takes 1.5 minutes, despite the fact that I swear I did it only a few days ago. Deleting an e-mail with a 2 MB attachment runs the CPU and HDD for 15 seconds. Same goes for "saving" the attachment to disk.
Oddly enough, even though those operations sound and feel heavy, HDD rattling like heck and system all slow like molasses, the HDD is only reading and writing at 0.5 MB/s, and the CPU is no higher than 10-40 pct.
Now *that's* an unscalable architecture.
Worst of all, while you're saving an attachment to disk your pointer is not locked to an hourglass, and you're free to close the e-mail and delete it from your inbox (which you will do the first time you don't notice the "M" icon still spinning in the e-mail). You get no warning, but I guess because that happens "while" it was trying to extract the attachment, the attachment save gets silently cut off, and you end up with a corrupted partial file on disk (bad zip, etc etc).
That's ONE HELL OF A USABILITY BUG.
After only 1 month, I'm dumping Mozilla Mail as fast as I can.
Anybody else notice that 1.3 can't handle some of the .jpg's on their site? I installed 1.3 today and I'd say about a 5th of my images(all created by photoshop) were no longer viewable.
.jpg "optimized" does but I guess I won't be using the option anymore. Weird.
I exported them with a bunch of different options and it appears that unchecking the "optimized" checkbox and saving them again fixes the problem. To be honest, I'm not sure what making a
am i the only person who does not like AA?
Maybe I'm just spoiled, but rather than fetching the giant re-installer, is there some way that mozilla can upgrade itself? For all the complaining that web developers do about people out there still running Mosaic v0.9b, it amazes me this isn't a primary feature.
-Zipwow
I don't know which is more depressing, that 2/3 didn't care enough to vote, or that 1/2 of those that did are crazy.
The DNS cache is supposed to be flushable by going offline, then online again. Currently, it's broken, however. Eventually, it will be fixed. http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=192798
Am I the only one who prefers non anti-aliased fonts? I think that anti-aliased fonts look like shit, especially on small point sizes. I like text to look crisp, not blended together. During an eye-exam, the doctor made a comment to me along those lines. So maybe I am alone on this...
That the idea to use it as a platform to develope portable applications (using ECMAScript + XUL) is catching on slower than some people would expect.
I think there are two basic architecture issues that turn a lot of people off. The first is Javascript (ECMAscript). The only place this language has a foothold is in HTML. If the real goal is to have people write general applications, nobody uses javascript and so this meets a non-demand.
The second is the failure to separate concerns into layers very well. Presentation code in XML is heavily intermixed with behavior code written in javascript. A better model here is the one used by JSP custom tags. The behavior is encapsilated and isolated to another layer. XUL on the other hand really encourages you to intermix the two.
must be getting jealous just about now... ;p
The war with islam is a war on the beast
The war on terror is a war for peace
Who's the UI guru that decided reordering the tab context menu (ie, when you right click on a tab, or in the tab bar) so that 'close tab' is where 'new tab' used to be, and vice versa?
I've been using 1.3 for all of five minutes, and I've twice already closed tabs I wanted to keep open!
What's next, the new emacs remapping c-x c-s to 'quit without save'?
Does anyone know how to change the order of the right click tab menu for
the windows version? Before it had "new tab" on the top, now "close tab" is
the top one.
You get to the menu by right-clicking anywhere on the tabs bar.
I really hate Dan Patrick.
How awesome that instead of trying to decrease the memory footprint, increase stability or actually improve usability, the mozdev team focusing on ripping off EVEN MORE useless features from IE. My favorite is the removal of items from the right click menu's in the context sensitive way of doing things. Never mind going back is the second most used function, let's get it off that menu. When I brought this up, I was told I could edit the code to put it back, wow, talk about usuability, just rewrite the code! Good job mozdev, you keep showing the world that in the face of adversity you can keep making something worse and still take credit for it, believing all the while, and convincing not a few that you've done somthing great.
Can someone tell me the best way to upgrade between the versions?
:)
I've been usin' and lovin' Moz for a long time now, but I'm always worried about going from one version to the next....can I just "cheat" and install overtop? Should I uninstall the old Moz first for the best stability? I tend to be anal in this area because I like my installs to be 'clean,' yet at the same time I'm lazy and want to do as little work as possible.
What is the most I can "get away" with?
We have XBL to let us seperate concerns. Check it out.
We looked into XUL as a solution to our content management system about 12 or 18 months ago, I don't remember, and my concept of time is seriously warped from the dor-com days.
At the time, they CLAIMED that you could do all this cool stuff with XUL, but the documentation (including the 1 ONE official book on XUL, sucked). They all focused on building the GUI inside of the Mozilla browser.
We were working with a potential partner that has a browser based application, whose bain of existance is IE's print feature (they log printing with their print button, but an IE print would trash that). The idea of a "stripped down" browser that would start at their screen would rock. Additionally, using XUL widgets would let them eliminate the frames and other garbage, making their app easier. They liked the idea of using a XUL toolbar instead of a frame with buttons.
Unfortunately, weeks of research through their docs went nowhere, and we worked on a Java solution, and the deal went south over time. Now we have our own Java based solution, and don't want to migrate to XUL.
The XUL + ECMAScript stuff should have been pushed earlier with proper documentation. Instead they pushed it to grab some marketshare when they weren't ready.
I love Camino/Chimera, and the other Gecko browsers (use Phoenix when on a Windows machine), but they missed a lot of time with not getting XUL as an early solution. They should have put out (early) some shells that you could start from then add your other functionality.
Sure, other projects have picked it up since then, but with the XUL + ECMAScript solution being the red-headed stepchild for a while, they lost some steam.
It'll happen, but every year that they wasted will take 2 years to recover, as growth has slowed down and projects chose other tech.
That said, I love Mozilla now, but I think that the shifting of priorities cost them mindshare that will be painful to recover.
Alex
Fortunately, you can return the functionality by putting the following line in your prefs.js file:
Where did you get the 95% figure? It's hard for me to find any sites that don't work in Mozilla, and I go to plenty of sites that use JavaScript and DHTML. When I do find a site that doesn't work in Mozilla, it's nearly always very poorly designed and it's just an accident that it happens to work in any browser.
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
That sounds like a challenge! Everyone, hit AOL quick! We can do it! GO GO GO!
Sorry, couldn't resist ;)
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
I completely agree about the contention that Mozilla is swapped out a soon as possible. Leave it for a few minutes, and you click on it and a swap storm ensues, despite the fact that a hundred megs of memory is free.
It wouldn't be hard to do, given that they give the option to register as the default browser, and browser apps may require other unknown OS resources that MS could use to ID foreign browsers.
Hey, I'm just your average shit and piss factory.
I agree, the 95% figure is way off, but he has a point. And most of the sites you are talking about (or at least the ones I've seen that resemble what you are talking about) are just old. It's not due to poor design, though. It's because they were made in an "era" when there was the IE way to do it or the Netscape 4.7 way to do it (layers) and neither way was standard but it was the only way to do it. Now Mozilla and Netscape 7 come along and don't support (or fix the support) of the Netscape 4.7 DHTML/CSS model and thus, the sites don't look right. But since IE still supports a lot of its older, IE-only stuff, the sites still look OK. I don't know if I agree that Mozilla should support "IE's DHTML model," but the problems aren't caused by poor site design, because the sites weren't poorly designed at the time.
There are obvious exceptions to this so please don't give me a big list.
I'm just saying, it's not an accident the sites worked in any browser. It's most likely that they worked in only one at the time because it was the only way to do it. Or the only feasible way to do it; who is going to write 38 lines of this-browser-only code when "this.hide" works in what 98% of the traffic is using? Probably not many people.
I think there are two basic architecture issues that turn a lot of people off. The first is Javascript (ECMAscript). The only place this language has a foothold is in HTML. If the real goal is to have people write general applications, nobody uses javascript and so this meets a non-demand.
I'm not so certain Mozilla was created to meet this non-demand as it was to make Microsoft's worst fears about Netscape come true. IIRC, MS went after Netscape when they realized that the browser was a likely candidate for being a true cross-platform development platform, with complete applicaitons and everything. Realizing this, they had to crush netscape or else run the risk of having a whole slew of applications come out that didn't require Windows.
So, while going under, Netscape thought "Well, why don't we just make those worst fears come true? By opening up the source code and making it Free Software with a newer BSD-style license, Microsoft can't kill it, and nobody need fear the GPL with it."
Thus did the great lizard begin walking the murky depths of the ocean. Let's summon up the Lizard by developing applications with it, and it'll walk up from the Puget Sound and stomp it's way across East Seattle, sink down into Lake Washington, and once again arise. Spitting fire all the way through downtown Bellevue on its way into Redmond, where it will destroy the One Redmond Way.
Damn, I'm glad I live in eastgate. I'll get a ringside seat without having to move out of the Lizard's way.
Like what I said? You might like my music
This may be an unpopular view, but this effort reminds me of the way another desktop environment developed. Creating more and more apps that rely on the mozilla codebase makes it central to the desktop... rather like IE.
To my knowledge, no desktops require Mozilla to work. Sure, GNOME has Nautilus (still? Or did they shitcan it?) which has Mozilla embedded, and Galeon is the GNOME browser, which has Mozilla embedded. However, and this is important. If Mozilla goes a direction these guys don't like, they can fork the code or put in a new renderer. YOU are not stuck with Mozilla, and you can change your directory browser (as far as I know, in KDE you can) and your default browser, and so forth.
The idea of making the browser integral with the desktop isn't inherently a bad idea, it's just that Microsoft did it specifically to drive Netscape out of business. Also, in doing so, Microsoft opened up holes in their system so big that Windows is now a whore to script kiddies. Any embedded MOzilla application doesn't run the risk at this time. (it might one day, but I don't think so)
It might be an unpopular view as far as Mozilla is concerned, just try to keep in mind that when you're talking about Free Software, the situation changes. It doesn't make it right (although in this case I think it is right), but it does change the way you have to evaluate the situation.
Like what I said? You might like my music
Opera shrinks or magnifies images along with text, just press 0 to step up, 9 to shrink and 6 to reset to 100%. Also, 8 adds an extra 100% while 7 takes it away. There's also a handy dropdown list to change it for each window.
Opera 7.03 was released the same day as Moz 1.3. Go get it!
Use ISO 8601 dates [YYYY-MM-DD]
> Because Mozilla happens to tbe the only app you have that uses
> the particular functionality that's buggy in the driver, whatever
> that is?
The newest Sun Java implementation for Windows does work around
a crashing bug with ATI drivers. I experienced the bug myself.
It is likely related to this one.