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Could Doom 3 be a Xbox Exclusive?
acehole writes "Doom III, id's latest and greatest in the realm of first-person shooters, may be coming out as an Xbox exclusive... if Microsoft has its way." This story is very brief, has no real evidence, and should be treated as entirely speculative. I'd be sad if Doom 3 required me to use the X-Box's controller. It's just not right without a mouse!
Where Is Doom III Going?
07-APR-03
An article in the current issue of Wired magazine confirms what a lot of gamers were suspecting already: Microsoft is actively courting id Software for the exclusive console rights to Doom III. According to the article--a feature on current developments in the jaw-dropping PC FPS--the company behind the Xbox is offering an undisclosed amount of money to id in exchange for the right to make their latest game an Xbox-only title as far as consoles are concerned. (It'd still come out on the PC, of course.)
The folks at id reportedly haven't made a decision on the matter yet--it seems a reasonable enough assumption (lead programmer John Carmack has made comments in the past that seem to show a preference for the Xbox), but we'll see how it turns out. The PC game will likely be playable at the Electronic Entertainment Expo next month in Los Angeles.
The Wired article also had one more interesting bit on the PC version: in addition to the multiplayer expansion pack Carmack hinted at earlier, plans are also in the works for a new single-player expansion pack, due to be released some time after the final product hits stores. We'll have more details for you soon, so stay tuned.
It's coming to PC no matter what, this is just for exclusivity on consoles. Perhaps you should have read the article...
This makes a lot of sense, as the Xbox is the most like a PC of the 3 consoles. It won't take as much work for id to port, and if Microsoft is willing to pay them a bunch of money on top of that, all the better.
"The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
It may well be the technology that dictates where DOOM3 can play, as it's going to be very dependent on hardware pixel and vertex shaders. It could likely only make it to Gamecube and Xbox anyway, unless they cripple the engine just to get it running on PS2.
It talks about *console* version only being for the xbox and even says: "It'd still come out on the PC, of course."
Hey, I got a novel idea: How about if the editors acctually read the linked article before they post stories?
Don't trust the slashdot editors, they usually screw it up. If you RTA, which in this case takes only a few seconds, you'll see that the rumour is only that it will be available on X-Box and no other *consoles* - the deal MS is supposedly offering concerns exclusivity in the console market and nothing else. And if the rumour is true, it's basically free money for id, since they were not planning to port it to any other consoles anyway.
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I hardly see anything wrong with buying exclusive rights for games and development houses in order to make your console more attractive to the consumer. Nintendo did this (bought Rare), and I thought Sony did something similar with Square. This is hardly new behavior, and there's nothing inherently wrong with this. See it as a method of adding value by buying rights to things.
If you want Doom3 on a console, you'll have to buy an Xbox. That's the plan. It's not monopolistic, nor is it morally wrong. It's just a good way of doing business.
-Erwos
Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.
Don't be too sure. id knows how powerful its games are in the computer world. When a new game is released Doom, Quake, Quake 2, Quake 3, a mini-worldwide upgrade in hardware generally comes as well. I got to talk with Todd Hollenshead one time and he seems like a pretty shrewd dude in terms of business. They will weigh the pros and cons of only releasing to one console platform and it come out a little something like this.
((Total Projected Sales of units between each of the other consoles) * 25%??? exclusivitiy bonus for the XBox) - (Development Costs to Port to other systems)
If MS is offering more then that then they probably do it. id is powerful enough to demand that sort of deal and MSFT is rich and desperate enough to make that kind of deal. Guarantee you they hit a number like that, they would make it an X-Box exclusive.
Considering that John Carmack wrote a ways back that the XBox probably _did_ have the hardware to handle Doom3, albeit cut down a touch, I don't really see your theory having much support in reality.
Remember, the console only has to run it at 640x480, no AA, and on only one set of hardware. Hand-tweaked assembly isn't going to happen for each computer platform, but I certainly could see it for a single console. How the leaked Doom3 alpha runs on your P4 2.4ghz is not really a good measure of how the final version might run on an XBox (or PC, for that matter).
-Erwos
Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.
So, do you mean Doom III will only work on xbox linux ? :-)
If you own an Xbox, you do. :)
It just seems like saying that companies have done it in the past isn't a good argument of why it should be allowed. Just because something is the way it is doesn't make it right or proper even if it is good business practice.
I guess we should just let Microsoft be and buy up all the companies and rights that they want to.
I am over here... now I am back over here!
If Microsoft splashes enough money id would bite. Like everyone id has it's price. When money comes into play everyone is a whore.
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One is born into aristocracy, but mediocrity can only be achieved through hard work.
I feel terrible having to say this, as I have long given the slashdot editors the benefit of the doubt, but CmdrTaco's comment here about using the mouse just goes to prove that they don't even read the articles that they're posting. It was said numerous times, as the poster above pointed out, that it would still be out for PC, and if the article was read before being posted on slashdot, CmdrTaco's comment would not be as it is now. I've lost a lot of confidence in this site today. That said, it'd be terrible if Doom III came out for XBox only as far as console is concerned. Still, how many people actually play FPS games on console compared to PC? I don't think it would be a drastic thing.
Keep in mind that Microsoft has a long and rich tradition of buying anyone that makes better products than they do that they can't otherwise quash.
Remember Bungie, once pretty much the only significant Mac-only gaming company?
IIRC, id is a privately-owned company, but what if *you* were Carmack and MS offered to fund *your* rocket-making experiment, plus more Ferraris? Would you at least consider an exclusive license on one game?
I mean, here's what I'm saying. Carmack is a really damn good software engineer, and id is a really good company. Carmack's done tons and tons of work for Linux and other platforms -- he's been a powerful OpenGL ally, he's pushed Linux gaming, wrote large portions of the XFree86 GLX 3d driver for my Matrox card as volunteer work, has released all his games crossplatform (and I think id has consistently lost money on Linux releases). Lots of interest in Linux gaming came about *because* of his work, so he's indirectly responsible for much Linux gaming.
Yet, does him doing all this justify everyone expecting him to say no to lots of money *again*?
May we never see th
As somebody already ported out ID were unlikey to port it to the PS2 as the number of comprimises they would have to make wouldn't justify it being connected to the PC version. (Not to start a flame war or anything but the PS2 can't really compete graphics wise with the GC or xbox anymore).
An xbox version would be easy to port due to the fact that it basically a pc and uses directx.
A gamecube version might possibly be worthwhile but it is very different architecture from the PC and Xbox, and chances are that MS will offer up more than enough money than could be realistically made by a GC port.
And even better yet:
"money to id in exchange for the right to make their latest game an Xbox-only title as far as consoles are concerned. (It'd still come out on the PC, of course.)"
I can live with people commenting without having read the articles, but now the editors add their clever comment without having read (or understood) the article
- We are the slashdot. Resistance is futile. Prepare to be moderated -
Reading the articles is cheating.
It's easy to get loads of karma by reading the articles and then making well thought out comments about them.
Be a man and do it the hard way.
... and I highly doubt that Nintendo, with its reputation as a for-kids console maker, would like the idea of making Doom III (which is likely to be the goriest first-person shooter ever created) available on their console anyway.
As opposed to games like Resident Evil, Resident Evil 0, Eternal Darkness, and others?
Christ, just because Nintendo's core titles are pretty much geared for all ages doesn't mean they're not going to go for mature titles as well. Hell, they stopped censoring their games back in 1994, after they tried censoring the original Mortal Kombat and got spanked by Sega in sales as a result.
As far as the subject matter goes, though... this really is a non-story, as Carmack's been saying for a while that the X-Box was pretty much the only console he was planning to release Doom III on. Nothing to see here, folks...
But this rumor isn't that they are buying id Software, it is that Microsoft wants Doom 3 exclusive to the Xbox. It would be no small coup if it happens, either.
This happens ALL the time in the console world. Sony is particularly fond of this tactic, paying off companies like Square and Eidos (Tomb Raider) so that these companies' games will be released first for the Playstation/PS2 and 6-months later if at all for competitors' systems.
In fact, I'm pretty sure that Microsoft has already engaged in this practice with Konami for Metal Gear Solid 2:Substance. Just now is the game being released for Playstation 2, yet it has been available for the Xbox for a long time.
Yeah, but if they had actually reported what the article said, they would've missed the chance to bash Microsoft.
Having not pried into the numbers of this field which are what ultimately determine whether any of your or my points are valid, allow me to offer a converse assertion.
Porting costs can be very high. Each additional platform Doom3 goes on will require (1) rewriting potentially large chunks of graphics code, if not other things if it turns out some things have to be squeezed a little extra to fit inside the console; (2) perhaps more expensive, extensive play testing to confirm the new hardware doesn't cause strange new problems; (3) creating a production line for creating media and packaging; (4) negotiating with stores shelf-space for an additional title; (5) providing tech support for yet another platform.
You seem to assert that for every additional platform the game is available for will mean more incoming revenue. Whether you meant this or not, it is not the case. Many people have multiple platforms -- XBox and a PC, PS2 and a GameCube, etc. Once more, some people may buy a new console simply for the newst, hot game out. And Doom3 will be coming out with a rather large amount of fan fare. If these two groups are a significant portion of the purchasers of Doom3, you start seeing diminishing returns very quicly -- perhaps even after supporting only two platforms (e.g. Windows and XBox)
Further, the game is already going to run in a Windows environment, doubtlessly. This means that XBox will be the easiest to port to, both because of a minimal amount of code rewrite being necessary and because the mostly stock hardware means that not as much XBox specific testing would be necessary.
You like splinters in your crotch? -Jon Caldara
From the May 2003 print edition of Wired, page 153:
"We're being offered a pretty significant amount of money to sit on it until an Xbox port is done." -- John Carmack
"It" meaning Doom 3, of course. So MS is trying to get Id to delay Doom 3 for all platforms until an Xbox port is done. (Presumably, it'd come out for the PC first without any outside influence.) Do you really want to sit around while Id finishes the Xbox port, knowing that the PC version of Doom 3 is done?
Umm... id Software games have always been OpenGL based. Seeing how the XBox only supports Direct3D, and I don't seen why John Carmack would waste the time porting the entire codebase to Direct3D.
You mean MS products like Windows? Id's main market is on Microsoft products.
Exactly! Id Software is John Carmack and John Carmack is Id Software. John Carmack is the kind of guy that has his games ported to Linux out of the goodness of his heart, not because it is making him money.
Furthermore, John Carmack is also the same guy that releases his game engines under the GPL, once they are past their prime. Finally, John Carmack has also worked on open source projects... if I remember correctly, he helped develop Matrox drivers for Linux.
Also throw in the fact that the openness of the PC allows and the openness of Id Software's previous games veritably created the mod scene that spawned such things as Threewave CTF, Team Fortress, Rocket Arena... and arguably Half-Life, Counter-Strike, etc... Not releasing a PC port would kill this aspect of the community, or at least it would leave Id Software out of it.
Well, it *is* monopolistic, but that doesn't implicitly mean it is illegal (moral is another question altogether). Unless of course, the monopoly is *illegal*, and in this case it has been shown that microsoft has used illegal tactics to protect its monopoly from free and fair competition.
It wouldn't even be illegal for MS to take all its profits from selling its OSs and give it to id in order to seal the exclusive console deal - unless MS is shown to have an illegal monopoly in OSs (which they have). Even with the illegal OS monopoly, they could make the deal as long as the funds came from a product where an illegal monopoly wasn't held. For example, if the funds actually came from their console business (which is impossible since it hasn't made any money). The whole point is, are they using the unfair/illegal advantage they have in the OS market to enter markets they would otherwise be unable to enter. And I think it is safe to say that without their OS business they would be unable to continue to fund a console business that has been nothing but a money hole.
What makes you say it's not true? Did you read the article at all anyway? The article states that Microsoft is courting id Software to get Doom 3 to be a console exclusive on XBox. What's so unbelievable on that? I wouldn't doubt that Microsoft is courting them. Why wouldn't they? The game will obviously still be out on PC (as the article also states). Regardless, XBox is the only logical console to port the game to as it would look like ass on a PS2. And id would make a pretty penny off of it from MS, as well.
The PS2's tech is about a year behind XBox, so I would expect it to at least look worse.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
I believe he's trying to point out that one could read the article and be deceived into thinking that the game is only going to the Xbox especially with the "It's just not the same with the mouse" statement. I think we should be asking Taco if he read the article.
If you actually read things, you'd realize that people are talking about the exclusive console version of the game. It's getting released on the PC no matter what. id isn't stupid.
You're forgetting one thing, a GC port is possible, because the CPU is very similar to the Mac. True, it has a custom ArtX (now owned by ATI) gpu, but, assuming that Doom 3 supports macs, porting it to GC is plausible. And the other question is how long is the deal that Id has to sign with microsoft. they could have an exclusive xbox port for a year or two, and maybe then port to GC, which will still be around, as nintendo won't drop support until after they have a next gen console established to replace it.
https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html