Zelda - Wind Waker Sequel Confirmed

Thanks to Shacknews for pointing to the Computer and Video Games site, which has an interview with Eiji Aonuma, the project director of Zelda:The Wind Waker for Gamecube. Among the subjects discussed are a Wind Waker sequel, of which Aonuma says: "..as I did between Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask, I will use the same engine and the same graphics of Wind Waker for its sequel. However, I do plan on powering everything up a bit." He suggests the sequel should be playable for E3 2004, and also discusses other subjects, including the choice of cel-shading and puzzle design for the original Wind Waker.

Comments

Playing original now

[smoondog]

The original (wind waker) got me into vid games again (dammit) and really like it. So this is cool news. Wind waker reminds me a lot of the fun of the original game. Although I still wish I could light those little leaf guys on fire, I hope they add that feature for the next one. Particularly the one that tags along with you for that dungeon. :)

-Sean

rabble-rabble-rabble

[sweeney37]

including the choice of cel-shading

I never quite understood the brouhaha over the cell-shading of the first one. So many people were so upset by it, this was obviously Miyamoto's original intention and since it's his he should do what he sees fit.

(btw, the game is amazing and I can't wait for the sequel.)

Mike

Re:rabble-rabble-rabble

[MBCook]

I think the fuss was because a demo of the GCN (I think it was shown at Spaceworld) showed Link fighting Gannon before the system came out. The demo looked amazing, it used the version of Link that is now in Soul Calaber (spelling?). I think that game would have looked awesome, and I think many others thought the same way. So when the look was changed, you have to be disapointed in a way.

I wasn't worried about Zelda when I heard about the change, but I wasn't sure it would work too well. As more and more screenshots and videos came out, I became more sure. Once I played the game though, I have to say that they did an AMAZING job with it. The game still doesn't look like a cartoon (no cell shading game has gotten that good. They might have moments, but...), but it does have great style. I can't wait to play/see the sequel.

Also, remember that there weren't that many cel shaded games when the change was announced. You had Jet Set Radio (which was good) and Klona 2 was out then too (I think), but other than that the few games that were celshaded were pretty bad (like that one wacky-races-twisted-metal hybrid that was supposed to be pretty bad). There just weren't many games that did it successfuly. But people should really learn to trust Nintendo more, it turned out great, didn't it?

PS: OT: I just got my Technician License last Sat and yesterday the FCC gave me my callsign. Yeah!

Re:rabble-rabble-rabble

[Anonvmous Coward]

"I never quite understood the brouhaha over the cell-shading of the first one."

People tend to overweigh negatives. They saw the semi-realistic Link and were thinking "Whoah! This will be really dramatic! Maybe it'll be like Final Fantasy! Bitchin!" When they saw the cartoon version they tought "Brilliant. This'll be an adventure version of SpongeBob Squarepants."

In other words, they were more worried about losing the drama than about gaining fun. Me personally, I was excited about the cel shading after I saw the video of it. The screen shots didn't look particularly exciting. The potential was always there, though. I'm part-way through the game and I'm loving it!

Re:rabble-rabble-rabble

[startled]

"(btw, the game is amazing and I can't wait for the sequel.)"

I still can't get into it. Slow, unskippable, repeated cutscenes (plus, I have to wind wake again!? yawn). It's also too easy. I initially really liked the no jump button innovation, but then he kept taking flying leaps off of bridges into the lava, whereas in any sensible platformer with a jump button, the character would grab onto the edge of the ledge rather than taking an obviously stupid jump.

Too easy + bad jump controls meant that 90% of my deaths were a result of the no jump button "innovation", while only a handful were due to boss monsters, other enemies, and real platform challenges. Despite the clearly breathtaking art style of the game, I just can't consider that sort of gameplay as best of class.

For some reason, I was able to overlook some of the same flaws Waker has in Ocarina-- just a better game, I guess.

Re:rabble-rabble-rabble

[Mex]

Actually, in interviews with Miyamoto it is clear it wasn't his original intention, but was convinced by a co-producer (whose name I forget) to switch to this Cel shaded "kiddy" style.

He mentions being very nervous about the criticisms of the switch from the "original" (Spaceworld) look, and the final GC, but later said he was satisfied that the look was apparently accepted, and in some cases praised.

Re:rabble-rabble-rabble

[Snowspinner]

See, I have the exact same problem, only reversed. I couldn't stand Ocarina, but absolutely love Wind Waker.

Then again, I have a friend who loves the Game Boy Zeldas, but couldn't get into Link to the Past. No accounting for taste, I suppose.

Nintendo Fans

[willr7]

Ahhhh, the sweet smell of nintendo fan-boys, and I love it.

I'm with nintendo until the grave.

Xbox = PC in a box
PS2 = quantity, not quality
Gamecube = getting my gaming experience just right

Whatever game that isnt on Gamecube I can play on the pc, whatever game that is on gamecube i cant play anywhere else.

When your favorite games are 80% nintendo exclusives, how can you not own a Cube?

Re:Nintendo Fans

[Omkar]

I don't know if you're being sarcastic or what, but when Nintendo releases precisely the games I'd like to play, I'm happy. Sure, I'd like to play Halo and GT3, but, on the whole, I'm extremely happy with Nintendo. Mario, Zelda, Metroid - what else do you need?

Re:Nintendo Fans

[willr7]

I'm not being sarcastic at all. I love my GameCube.

And like I said in my post, Halo and GTA3 are on the pc!

Re:Burn, Nintendo - burn.

[paradesign]

dont you mean JSR for the DC? or you a recent addition to the consoe bandwagon?

Re:Burn, Nintendo - burn.

[easychord]

If they could quit making Mario 64 over and over and come up with some original games in new product lines, perhaps they'll attract my interest again.

There are some non nintendo games. I enjoyed Super Monkey Ball and Lost Kingdoms.

They only made one Mario 64 sequel as well, and when you make what some consider to be the Best Game Ever, a sequel that isn't quite as good as the original ain't necessarily a bad thing.

I think that the whole industry has a problem with releasing original games that are really popular. Singling out Nintendo is a bit anti-fanbi or fanboi for another system, as they seem to be doing better in this regard than some others.

Re:Burn, Nintendo - burn.

[easychord]

I loved that game.

Don't know why they didn't update it for the gamecube and ps2 as well. Its weird in a way, it looks like XBox got JSR, ps2 got Rez and GCN got Skies of Arcadia.

I really hope that...

[utawoutau]

they get rid of the whole water thing though. It was kind of a neat idea but traveling from island to island was very uneventful (and boring), and even when it was eventful the control was incredibly awkward. I cannot tell you how often Link would struggle up into the boat only to be knocked off it again a second later.

Re:I really hope that...

[AlexMax2742]

Didn't they use water on purpose, to keep the loading times to a minimum? That was my understanding, and seeing how this was the first Zelda on a CD median (except for the god awful CD-I games) I think they did a pretty good job.

Re:I really hope that...

[d3kk]

I really enjoyed it, actually. It made the world seem huge, even though it was simply many small islands spread across the sea. Besides, one has the capability to get the teleportation song pretty early in the game.

Re:I really hope that...

[Lewisham]

I love the way the journalist bottles it during the interview:

Interviewer: Will the sequel to The Wind Waker be sea-faring again or do you plan to include a different mode of transport?
Aonuma: Did you find it a hassle to travel by boat?
Interviewer: I was playing it through in Japanese at first, so I didn't know about the fish who marks locations on your sea chart, but when I found that it was fine.

I found the sailing excruciating, I actually read a magazine most of the time. I pointed the boat and went. The sailing did create the feeling of epic proportions, and it did show off some amazingly cool scaling effects (looking through the telescope and shouting "Land ho!" never felt so right. Or attracted so many looks) but it was also incredibly tedious. Galloping across Hyrule Field elegantly jumping fences and shooting arrows at evil-doers was far more exciting. There was a better feeling of speed, you controlled your direction (without resorting to stopping, playing the same damned song on Wind Waker, then starting again) and it was *a lot shorter*. There was so much you needed to do in the Wind Waker, as well as travel silly distances (the distances were still silly even with the teleportation). You had to find the Merman. Stop the boat. Feed the Merman. Change the wind direction because you inevitably went off course. If you were lucky, the Merman wouldn't tell you couldn't get on that island yet, you had to go to the other side of the map to get something. It was all padding. All of it. And 80% of the games playing public twigged it very early on. I'd rather have taken a shorter, sweeter game than sitting through 4-5 minutes of monotony. It felt like I had to earn my way into the dungeons by simply enduring.

Seems to me Aonuma-san has already twigged that sailing wasn't great. Otherwise he wouldn't have asked the question, would he?

Majora's Mask?

[Mupp252]

Hopefully it won't be as unappealing as Majora's Mask was. It just felt like it was a bastardised(SP?) extension of OoT. I got no pleasure out of playing it. The "mask" and "good deeds" system got on my nerves. I don't know, maybe I just didn't "get it". Anyone else feel the same way?

Re:Majora's Mask?

[Anonymous Coward]

I felt the same way at first, but after playing it for about five hours, I was hooked.

I'm an RPGer, and we RPGers like games where you can collect every little thing and do every little task. OoT had many tasks, but not so many collectibles (the masks, spiders, etc.). But Majora's Mask expanded on this, as well as improving on many of the graphics originally found in OoT. Masks in majora were tied to multiple unfolding events, which were then tied to other masks. I love stuff like that, and this was the first Zelda that made such collecting and exploration/re-exploration such a huge part of the game.

Majora does feel like a "smaller" game than Ocarina, but I love them both about the same. Ocarina beats Majora out only by a little bit, because it came first and basically defined the 3-D adventure epic genre. Plus Navi knew how to talk, and Saria was always helpful in telling you what to do next. (OTOH, if you leave a game of Majora alone for a few weeks or months, then come back to it, it can be hard to remember what you're supposed to do next, because there's no in-game mechanismm of reminding you what you were doing before you stopped playing.)

Just finished Wind Waker.

[d3kk]

I actually just finished the game a few days ago, and I couldn't help but think the game was a little too short. There was a huge number of side-quests and places to explore, but it seems Nintendo concentrated a little too much on that instead of the main quest. It just didn't seem like it had much story compared to OOT. Only five dungeons? Come on.

Hopefully this sequel will be a little more like OOT instead of concentrating so much on open-endedness. Side-quests are great, but when the main storyline is much shorter because of it, I don't think it's such a great thing. I guess I shouldn't get my hopes up though if it's going to be anything like Majora's Mask was, which was sort of a flop.

Re:Just finished Wind Waker.

[zonker]

a couple of things...

miyamoto has commented on the length of the game before, basically saying they realize that many, perhaps most, gamers don't finish games. they wanted to give a better gaming experience to the majority of gamers out there, realizing some folks might find it too short, but the numbers they had showed that most folks would enjoy the length of the game.

i think it is like the lotr:tt game, where the game is kinda short if you play it through with a single character. however, it was designed as such that you can get a more full gaming experience by playing it through with each of the 3 characters available, giving it a fair amount of replay value.

i guess it is a matter of trying to please everyone or just a few... :)

Text before voice

[Tsuzuki]

Why did you decide to stick with text-based dialogue rather than using speech?

Aonuma: With conversation, using text has always been Zelda's style - it's always worked that way. And another reason for keeping it text-based is because, when anyone reads anything - a novel, text on a screen - they're able to give it their own kind of flavour, their own interpretation and voice.

Rather than influencing that by making the on-screen characters speak, I intentionally wanted players to read the text. I don't know if you've noticed, but Link never speaks - this is also intentional as I want the player to create their own idea of who Link is, rather than giving him a voice.

All I can say to the above is AMEN TO THAT.

Re:Burn, Nintendo - burn.

[scabb]

Well, I guess some people like to play games, and other people like to play movies

I enjoyed the latest Zelda, although it seemed a hell of a lot easier than Ocarina and it did have its flaws. I must also admit to gaining a deep desire to throttle certain sages from certain wind temples, but overall the dungeons were great. I have more of an inkling to play it again than with Ocarina though.

I personally don't see what's wrong with a lot of your flaws. Linearity can also be a good thing, particularly for a game like Zelda, otherwise it just becomes hell on earth to create the dialogue. I don't think the point of Zelda throughout the tale, it's always been more about creating your own image of Link. Which is why he never speaks. And why the cartoon series was incredibly bad.

WW far too easy

[Sploozoo]

When you killed a monster, they on average gave you a handful of hearts and at least 20 rupees. How can you expect a challenge from a game like this? The first few zeldas (Ocarina suffered some from this easy-disease as well) required you to actually be careful when fighting. In Wind Waker you never had to backtrack to replenish health or make sure you had potions etc. Kinda ruined a big part of the game for me. An easy solution would be to just add a dificulty level, which maybe when beating it gave you an extended ending or something like that. All in all, the lack of fighting challenge probably made this the easiest Zelda ever.

Re:Burn, Nintendo - burn.

[cbensinger]

I have to agree with the Super Monkey Ball games. As far as Nintendo games, I liked the Mario Party games for playing with my daughter. I'm still a sucker for the older Nintendo games like Donkey Kong Country, Diddy Kong Racing (again, a good one to play with my daughter), etc.