Slashdot Mirror


WiFi Free-For-All

my_LART writes "Information Week reports that WiFi access is becoming a free commodity. Pittsburgh International Airport (PIT) has recently dropped its pay-per-use model and has installed free access to the WLAN in the food court and will be expanding access to the gates. On a similar note, Choice Hotels International is planning a WLAN rollout at its 370 Comfort Suites and 140 Clarion properties by the end of May. Choice Hotels International plans on expanding the rollout to two more of the company's brands by the end of the year. While this is great for us Road Warriors, how can this make financial sense? Choice Hotels can certainly markup the cost of the rooms by a few dollars per night, but how is PIT planning on reclaiming the costs? Regardless, lets hope other airports and hotel chains follow suit."

94 of 339 comments (clear)

  1. How will they pay for this? by detritus` · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Easy, three little words, Airport Improvement Fee... Part of the way your $50 flight ends up costing $100+

    1. Re:How will they pay for this? by miratim · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Actually, most places that started charging for WiFi access eventually realize that the cost of supporting the paying customer is a lot more than just providing the pipe for free. When it's free, they don't have to have someone to fix it when it breaks or someone doesn't know how to connect. So they end up with very minimal overhead, but still retain the increased business of having code monkeys like me spend hours at the place buying drinks and swearing under our breaths.

      --
      ~ The Fudge Report @ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/fudgereport/
    2. Re:How will they pay for this? by Bi()hazard · · Score: 4, Informative

      That's right. But not the whole story-if you've been paying attention to PIT there's a lot going on.

      US Air has a huge hub there, but the airline also has a strong presence in Philadelphia. Not surprisingly, the airline never seems to have enough money, despite the fact that the government paid for expansions to the airport at the request of and according to recommendations made by US Air. Maybe they could cut costs by switching to a single hub in Philly? Could be...but whether that's a good idea or not it's a great threat to extort concessions from the Pittsburgh Airport.

      Meanwhile, anyone who flies through PIT will see banners everywhere celebrating "Yesterday's Airport of Tomorrow". Um, yeah...I suppose that makes it the airport of today...they put up plaques explaining the glorious and futuristic history of the airport, and how traveller friendly it is. Citizens of the Twenty First Century, fly PIT, fly the Future!

      Both of these factors are major motivations for free wireless. Travellers will be more likely to spend time in the airport, they bolster their high tech futuristic image, US Air gets free access for its employees (working ones can really use it, ones on breaks really love it) and the airport gets to justify those Airport Improvement Fees and tell taxpayers how they're being innovative and luring business. (They just love justifying higher fees in a city where there's such a serious budget problem some politicians have actually suggested eliminating bus service on Sundays, the bastard whores)

      Free wireless internet has something to offer for all parties involved, and the days of pay-as-you-go wireless are numbered everywhere. Once the free stuff becomes more affordable to provide and more common, users will come to expect it. They'll simply refuse to pay fees for wireless, and organizations that keep trying to charge will be considered greedy and outdated. PIT certainly doesn't want that, they want to be the leaders into the glorious pro-consumer (and pro-business at the same time!) future.

      Does anyone think it's really going to be that many years before hotels that currently provide broadband for $10/night give it away for free? The up front installation may be expensive, but once it's paid for itself the service is really cheap.

      Getting off topic, has anybody ever flown with a pocket flashlight that has the batteries side by side, rather than in a long column? Those things really seem to piss of security screeners. Every time I leave one in my pocket or bag, they pull me aside and rape me or something. Anybody have any idea why? Does it look like a secret micro gun a spy might carry? Do bomb manufacturers always put their batteries side by side? Or is it just an excuse and I'm too cute, cuddly, and rapable for security people to resist?

    3. Re:How will they pay for this? by Hadlock · · Score: 4, Informative

      it looks like a two-shot primitive gun. not terribly uncommon. they're usually packed to look like a keychain or wine bottle opener. two AA or AAA battery "slots", especially in a metal casing, make for a decent, close range gun. i'd just buy a mini-maglite and be done with it.

      --
      moox. for a new generation.
    4. Re:How will they pay for this? by Moofie · · Score: 2, Funny

      Just for that, I'm building a gun into a MagLite.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    5. Re:How will they pay for this? by Short+Circuit · · Score: 3, Funny

      What's the security gaurd's opinion when someone who hasn't shaved in two weeks is always hanging out at the airport?

      Or do I just wear a business suit?

    6. Re:How will they pay for this? by SplendidIsolatn · · Score: 3, Interesting

      >>Meanwhile, anyone who flies through PIT will see banners everywhere celebrating "Yesterday's Airport of Tomorrow". Um, yeah...I suppose that makes it the airport of today...they put up plaques explaining the glorious and futuristic history of the airport, and how traveller friendly it is. Citizens of the Twenty First Century, fly PIT, fly the Future!

      While I appreciate the fact that you pay attention to the banners there, you're a little off in terms of what they mean. Those banners refer to the OLD Pittsburgh International Airport (now since relegated to cargo planes), which, when it opened 50+ years ago, WAS The Airport of Tomorrow. As opposed to some other airports, Pittsburgh International IS pretty modern and with the times. Like many other airports, the biggest complaint there is the lack of a larger security area, which was originally designed NOT with post 9/11 security measures in mind. The banners for the new Pittsburgh International make note of how it used to be a farm.

      BTW--here's your trivia du jour -- Pittsburgh International is the largest major airport in America not directly serviced by an Interstate -- They are trying to get Route 60 (and 22/30) designated as part of I-376 so they no longer have that distinction.

      --
      sig--we don't need no goddamn sig
  2. Same as the soap in the bathroom by rcpitt · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It makes sense because the incremental cost of providing the service is probably lower than the cost of the soap (lots in my flight bag) and the capital is less than the cleaning budget for the toilets for a day or two

    --
    Been there, done that, paid for the T-shirt
    and didn't get it
  3. Easy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Landing fees.

    1. Re:Easy by geekoid · · Score: 4, Funny

      actually, you make a good point.
      Set up your own Server, then use a 'age verification' process the gets numbers for, well, age verification.

      Load a trojan onto the laptops, so the next time they boot up, it runs a wav file of someone screaming "I'VE GOT A BOMB, AND A GUN, AND I AM GOING TO KILL YOU ALL".

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  4. Hmmm by gid13 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Could we just cover the globe and get it over with? :)

  5. WiFi access at airports by MadHungarian1917 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From a traveller's point of view 'free' wireless access will influence the traveller's choice of airport so the airport authority will benefit indirectly by attracting more passengers.

    Also - first post

    1. Re:WiFi access at airports by coryking · · Score: 5, Funny
      (lady): "Gee, what do you think honey? Should we go to bumfuck, idaho or hawaii for our honeymoon?"

      (MadHungarian): "I vote for idaho, i hear they have free WiFi access in the airport"

      Yeah, way to win one with the ladies dude...

    2. Re:WiFi access at airports by LostCluster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Actually, it will make a difference in terms of passengers who have a choice. US Airways rents more than half of the gates at PIT... so for flights that involve a non-major city, it's a safe bet that if you pick US Airways you're going to go through PIT, and if you pick Delta you'll hub at ATL.

      For two otherwise equal situaitons, this could be the tiebreaker. In fact, somebody might be more inclined to pick US Airways because of this, and that might be worth the money to pay a few bucks extra for the ticket.

    3. Re:WiFi access at airports by zaxus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      However, in places like Chicago (Midway, O'Hare) or here in South Florida (Palm Beach Int'l, Ft, Lauderdale Int'l, Miami Int'l), people do have a choice of which airport to utilize. I for one would certainly give some weight to WiFI access, since we (USians) have to arrive at the airport so early to jump through security hoops. I'm often at my gate with an hour or 2 to kill. Be nice to have Slashdot^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H..er...work to help kill the time....

      --
      /. zen: Imagine a Beowulf cluster of Beowulf clusters...
    4. Re:WiFi access at airports by StenD · · Score: 2, Interesting

      When I'm looking to travel, even when I'm looking at a particular airline, there's often a choice of routing for comparable price and travel time. When that happens, the quality of the connecting airports does play a role in my decision, and the availability of WiFi does factor into my opinion of the airport, as do other amenities.

    5. Re:WiFi access at airports by thogard · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Putting wifi in the airport works the same way as serving nasty food on a short flight. It means fewer irate passengers because they have something to do.

    6. Re:WiFi access at airports by daveo0331 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      One airport per city doesn't necessarily mean no choice in airports. Pittsburgh is an example of this. Since US airways runs something like 80% of the flights out of PIT, they can set the fares high... which means a lot of people drive the 2 hours to Cleveland to save money. Free wifi (or moving walkways, parking shuttles, or anything else that makes the experience more pleasant) will give people one more reason to fly out of PIT and not Cleveland.

      --
      Remember the days when Republicans were the party of fiscal responsibility?
    7. Re:WiFi access at airports by MadHungarian1917 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You have to work for a Airline at least once to appreciate the true humor of your comment.

      My wife and I have been through many unknown airports with limited "amenities" You havent lived till you have flown through PQI (Presque Isle, Maine)or YHZ (Halifax NS).

      As an employee you often need to do "creative" routing to get to your desired destination. So a choice for free WiFi could make the trip pleasant for myself and my wife while waiting to go elsewhere.

      Or you can sit in a MX (Maintenance _not_ mail exchanger) breathing JET-A fumes or you can go to a place with free WiFi and surf while waiting for the next segment on the way to Hawaii.

  6. Not only cost, but what about security? by tliet · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Normally, people that would do hacking, credit card fraud or just plain spamming would be traceable, not anymore so when half the internet is made out of freely accessible hotspots? Or would they block all interesting ports except port 80 and 443 to allow casual webbrowsing?

    1. Re:Not only cost, but what about security? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      hacking - maybe it's time we make our systems secure and hackerproof
      credit card fraud - maybe it's time we stop considering 16 digits to be enough to authorize a transaction
      just plain spamming - maybe it's time we start bouncing un(cryptographically)signed mails

    2. Re:Not only cost, but what about security? by Draknor · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Hopefully, commoditized internet will encourage the adoption of better security policies & protocols. Not right away, of course, but I think eventually it'll happen.

      But then again, I'm ever the optimist!

      And really, the worst that could happen is the current internet gets over-legislated and some new form of networking gains a large underground following while the unwashed masses suffer their daily torment of spam, worms, pop-ups, and DRM.

    3. Re:Not only cost, but what about security? by ewhac · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I have to agree; this is a small disaster in the making.

      This service will be used mostly by business travellers, who will more than likely be doing business-related activities, including pulling down email and shuttling documents back and forth. POP/IMAP passwords are transmitted in the clear, and can be trivially sniffed. Your file server credentials can also be fairly easily sniffed out, allowing someone else to connect as you and start pulling down documents.

      Crypto needs to be standard in such environments, but it's clear that's not going to happen soon. WEP is worthless, and 802.1x isn't in wide deployment, which leaves VPN (kinda ugly and deployed ad hoc), SSH tunnels (better, but still unwieldy), and IPSec (even better, but not very common). So there's going to be a lot of sensitive data floating around in the clear.

      If you're not using crypto, or not certain you're using crypto, change your passwords before and after you use a public 802.11 node.

      Schwab

    4. Re:Not only cost, but what about security? by Esion+Modnar · · Score: 3, Interesting
      change your passwords before and after you use a public 802.11 node.

      Public node, public commode. Always practice good security and hygiene.

      Unfortunately, good security is not as easy as flushing with your elbow and washing your hands. It's technical (uh, I mean the security part), and most people aren't.

      I wonder what kind of legal fine print protects the owners of these hotspots from liability? Has anybody been sued yet for not protecting the customer enough from being hacked?

      --

      They say the first thing to go is your penis. Well, it's either that or your brain. I forget which...
    5. Re:Not only cost, but what about security? by Bastian · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Too bad for the lay user, but I think from a legal standpoint it's fair to to say that people don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy when they broadcast things over radio frequencies. If I used a business's cordless phone to have a conversation in the bathroom and someone happened to intercept the signal, the business wouldn't be liable. I think the same situation applies to wireless networks.

      Besides, you don't have any more reason to expect someone isn't grabbing your packets on an unencrypted wireless network than if you were on a copper wire network that is hubbed rather than switched. The only difference on a wireless network is that it could be the next-door neighbor - nobody has to physically walk in and plug a cable into your hub. This isn't much of a difference when you're sitting at a public place such as an airport or coffee shop.

  7. My local trendy cafe... by centralizati0n · · Score: 5, Interesting

    My local trendy cafe/art gallery, The Canvas (Lincoln and 9th in San Francisco, right on the corner) now has free wireless during business hours. You can walk in, and its full of people - most with a laptop, but they also have one important thing: the food they bought at the cafe. So, the Canvas can get 1.5 mbit DSL for $40 a month, and get at least 40 more people a day buying more food, probably at least amounting to the total cost of the DSL per month, every day.

    1. Re:My local trendy cafe... by horatio · · Score: 2, Interesting

      We have a couple of coffee shops here in the Columbus (OH) area that offer free WiFi. However, my roommate who worked at a non-WiFi'd coffeeshop in an upper class neighborhood told me that the upper management refused to put WiFi in, saying that they didn't want anyone sitting around the coffeeshop, but rather they wanted to move customers in and out of the store. The argument sounds logical if somewhat contrived.

      How do you convince your local coffeeshop that putting in WiFi would be good for business? What about offering to install and maintain it, in exchange for say, free coffee now and then? How would you make a proposal like this?

      --
      There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
  8. paid off already by yuri82 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Maybe the paying customers already made up for the initial cost of installation, and now the remaining costs must be so low they can make it available for free.

    --
    Who is this Karma guy and why is he bad ??
    1. Re:paid off already by trentblase · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I don't know if PIT is going to have a bandwith saturation problem. SFO it ain't... I've spent many an hour at the gate and rarely see people with a laptop in hand.

  9. Every bit of business sense by JumperCable · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While this is great for us Road Warriors, how can this make financial sense?

    Simple, Airports get more business (& more fees), Food courts get more people grabbing a danish & a little wi-fi access (most of these road warriors just want to check e-mail anyway, not exactly high bandwidth stuff). Hotels get more business & higher paying business. The business traveler is not paying the bills himself & will tend to select the places with better amenities. Full hotel with free Wi-Fi vs. Empty hotel with no or $20/night Wi-Fi.

    1. Re:Every bit of business sense by Bastian · · Score: 2, Funny

      Those cafes sure don't get more business when they come across asshole road warriors like me who park next to the building and check their e-mail without getting out of the car.

      heh heh heh

    2. Re:Every bit of business sense by JumperCable · · Score: 2, Interesting

      See, the people traveling are a captive audience, if they want to fly, they have to show up, and unless you live in an area with multiple large airports you're stuck with that airport maybe possible back east, but where I live the nearest large airport outside of town is 4+ hrs away).

      OK. You already have pointed out the multi-airport part of it. The other part is the layover part. Almost every flight most people take today includes a layover. The costs are much better if you accept one, & longer international flights pretty much require at least one.

      I am a smoker. And before, I didn't care where my layover was. Now that they are making some airports completely non-smoking (i.e. no smokers closet), I definitly go out of my way to make sure I don't get stuck at a non-smoking airport for my layover. The more people travel and understand that some airports have these types of creature comforts, they will tend to select the terminals that have wireless available.

  10. Why not? by sssmashy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Since most quality hotels are quite willing to offer free cable internet access within their rooms, why shouldn't airports and public areas with lots of retail/food businesses (such as shopping malls) follow suit? You provide an extra reason for well-heeled Wi-Fi users (who generally have more money to spend than your average joe) to stick around and spend money on coffeeshops, etc. Plus they will be more likely to return.

    I bet those places that offer free Wi-Fi will soon be satisfied that it's a cost that pays for itself, and we can expect the trend to continue.

  11. Re:Uses by rcpitt · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You've obviously never sat for hours at "the gate" waiting for the late plane that will carry you to your next destination. The gate is where we all hope there is coffee and entertainment - and if you have a laptop with IP connectivity you can at least fake the entertainment ;)

    --
    Been there, done that, paid for the T-shirt
    and didn't get it
  12. Re:Where I work by xoran99 · · Score: 5, Funny
    At the ISP where I work, I can sit in the lobby and pick up about 3 other free wide open WiFi APs from the couch in the lobby.

    Imagine that... An ISP employee looking for internet access at work...

    --

    Karma: Bad (mostly due to all those "In Soviet Russia" jokes)

  13. Easy by Ooter · · Score: 5, Funny

    Sniff credit card numbers on the wireless network and charge them "convenience fees" which most flyers probably won't complain about :) Lazy americans (myself included)

  14. Forgive my ignorance... by PasteEater · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Please forgive my ignorance, but wouldn't these kinds of WiFi access points be an ideal place to upload a virus or any other type of malicious code onto the internet? I mean, it would be almost untraceable, right? If so, it would seem that almost anyone could write the code/test it on their own machines, and then unleash it on the world from one of these points.

    --
    There are two kinds of people in the world: those with loaded guns, and those who dig.
    1. Re:Forgive my ignorance... by rcpitt · · Score: 3, Insightful
      That's why you run a firewall (yeah - turn that function that now comes with XP on) or do what I do... run Linux (with full firewall via IPTABLES) and then run VMWare with Win2k inside if you absolutely have to run M$

      --
      Been there, done that, paid for the T-shirt
      and didn't get it
    2. Re:Forgive my ignorance... by xoran99 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Nothing new, though... I can go to my local library and do the same thing through the public computers. They'd never find me... MWA-HA-HA!

      --

      Karma: Bad (mostly due to all those "In Soviet Russia" jokes)

    3. Re:Forgive my ignorance... by tabdelgawad · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You're right, but that's part of the price of online anonymity in general. Ubiquitous, open, WiFi in the US also means P2P without RIAA subpoenas (I'm sure that doesn't sound too bad to some people!) and whistleblowers without lawsuits to disclose their identities. Globally, it would mean the end of censorship and the redundancy of something like Freenet.

      Maybe it's my libertarian instincts, but universal anonymous internet access seems worth the price you mentioned.

      --
      Imposing Libertarian views on everyone online since 1992.
  15. Competitive Advantage by Draknor · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Think of it as a value-added service - Choice hotels wouldn't even have to mark-up the price of the rooms to cover the marginal cost of WiFi. If I, as a road-warrior, have a choice between a hotel with WiFi and a hotel without, I'm going to choose WiFi. Some people will choose it even for a price premium, but then you start getting into economic slopes & such that I haven't messed with in ages.

    Similar for the airport - granted, the market there isn't as fluid, but if the airport starts gaining more interest because it offers free WiFi, it can gain more shops and fast food outlets (= rental revenue), and possible in the long run (and by a long shot) attract marginally more airline business.

    Like most people, I think WiFi will become a commodity. It is a relatively inexpensive service to provide that provides a competitive advantage in the short term; as more companies adopt it, it lessens the competitive advantage because everyone has it, and hence, becomes a commodity. Consumers everywhere win!

  16. Re:Uses by xoran99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I've spent enough time waiting at gates to appreciate the utility of having wireless internet there. It's not that I need to get something out while at the gate, but that I have an hour or more (I like to get there early...) to get something productive done while I wait.

    --

    Karma: Bad (mostly due to all those "In Soviet Russia" jokes)

  17. What costs? by jurgen · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What costs? You mean the $60/month for a DSL the DSL line that's shared by via 802.11 here? That's petty cash, not a cost.

    It's so cheap it doesn't make sense to charge for it. The administrative overhead of charging will eat most of the income because not many people will pay. But a lot of people would use it and be appreciative if it's free generating far more valuable goodwill.

  18. the devil is in the happy meals by switcha · · Score: 4, Insightful
    (PIT) has recently dropped its pay-per-use model and has installed free access to the WLAN in the food court and will be expanding access to the gates. ... but how is PIT planning on reclaiming the costs?

    There may be a sucker born every minute, but I find that rate strikes me as low when watching people snatch up $6 shit-burgers from under a heat lamp at airport food courts. I'm sure the glut of people hanging out in the food court for wifi, who just may need a snack will take a healthy bite (baddum-ching) out of the wifi bill.

    --
    You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
  19. Re:Uses by Cmdrx · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've used a dial up line near the gate to sync my email so that I could keep working on the plane. Wireless access would simply make this easier. In addition, many Wireless systems I've used try to "force" the windows browser to a specific start page, which may be leveraged as an advertisement for shops that are local to the Access Point.

    Hmmm.. new business advertising model? Setup free WIFI, but hijack the initial page to a custom advertisement for the business hosting the hotspot?

    --
    I could write something witty for my sig, but instead wrote this...
  20. Re:Uses by StenD · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You've apparently never travelled on business. There's times that you have to go straight from the airport to the customer site, and you're far more likely to have WiFi available at a hub airport than a spoke airport. As such, it can be quite useful to be able to connect to the corporate VPN and download email with updated status at the customer site in the 15 minutes available at the gate.

  21. HTTPSniffer == security madness by miratim · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Good god. I "work from home", so I often go to the local cafe with free WiFi for a change of pace. All my work stuff is done through encrypted VPN, and I use a software firewall and SSL for everything else. So I'm running EffeTech's HTTP Sniffer to debug my app server, and by default it dumps ALL HTTP traffic on the LAN. So I saw all full HTTP request and responses from all the laptops in the cafe. Mostly dull web surfing, but a lot of people check email using plaintext connections, which blew my mind.

    --
    ~ The Fudge Report @ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/fudgereport/
  22. It's about time! by daddy+norcal · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Service. Say it again with me, s-e-r-v-i-c-e. Remember that out dated concept? Where we actually got more for our money?

    It's hard to believe any airline giving us a service like wifi for free, but it would be a step in the right direction for an industry in deperate need of some good PR. Hopefully, this roll out continues and we see wifi continue to grow across the nation.

  23. It's crazy! by chunkwhite86 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I agree this wifi free-for-all is getting out of hand. Heck, I've got three different neighbors providing free wifi! ;-)

    --
    I'd rather be a conservative nutjob than a liberal with no nuts and no job.
    1. Re:It's crazy! by starshot · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Here in my little town (Fayetteville, NY) nearly every small business around runs their own wireless network. If the weather's nice i can sit in the little park in the town square and connect to usually 3 or 4 networks. (for free of course)

      I once had an admin walk up to me and ask if i was connected to a wireless network, so when i truthfully answered that i was connected to his, instead of being upset, was thrilled and wanted to know how well it was working!

      By the way, that network was located in the bank. I haven't investigated how secure it is though, because i want to keep it all good.

  24. Heightened Security Breaches? by pararox · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It's exciting to hear that wireless internet is becoming more prevalent in public places. It seems the US of A has been several paces behind other countries such as S. Korea when it comes to adoption of widely available, public internet access. Hopefully the ease of setting up wireless networks will remedy this situation.

    My excitement to have instant information (via the Internet) at my fingertips, is, however, rather subdued when I consider the lack of precaution many people take securing their computers and networks. The recent spate of worms has proven a _real_ bother - my school network has been slowed to a grinding halt with the excessive bandwidth consumed by all this malware floating about.

    The possibility that these worm issues escalate in direct proportion to the number of communities who go wireless is a concern of mine. I'm curious if any of you have read studies comparing wireless and wired networks, with respect to the rate of security issues that develop within large-scale communities?

  25. Hotel WiFi - Even in the middle of nowhere by E-Lad · · Score: 4, Informative

    Just this past week, as a part of my Baltimore -> San Francisco roadtrip, I stayed at a Days Inn in Farmington, New Mexico. This is a small town up in the way remote area of north-western New Mexico.

    I was going to stay at the Holiday Inn there, but what made me change my mind when I rolled into town at 12am was the big banner on the side of the Days Inn which touted "Fee broadband access."

    Who would pass that up? Days Inn got my business, and my PowerBook got a open WAP with a great signal in the hotel room. The Days Inn seemed to have a rather decent ADSL connection from local provider digii.net

  26. Re:From Mr. Understatement... by 0xfc · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The library is a public place. Anyone can use it for whatever means.

    What one can do to abuse wifi is pretty well known. It appears they think the risk is worth it. Why let a few bad apples ruin it for all?

    If the admin is capable and has a minimal budget, he can alleviate a lot. Bandwidth shaping (let it burst at first, but after so much data throttle it back). I guess one could filter known attacks.

    Also people are actively working on these problems. Check this out.

    Roland van Laar has a new, significant wi-fi patch for FreeBSD 5.1 and higher. The patch, available for download and testing, blocks clients with an empty or 'ANY' ssid and disables ssid broadcasting using the underlying firmware feature. SSID (Service Set ID) is used to identify wireless clients to a wireless / wired gateway.

  27. So you're saying ... by pavon · · Score: 5, Funny

    they are going to pay for it by not providing soap and not cleaning the toilets twice a month? :)

  28. PIT planning on reclaiming the costs? by djupedal · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Simple.

    Same way Starbucks does...get you in a seat, and sell you stuf...

  29. WiFi should be like air conditioning used to be .. by RageEX · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hotels: "Vacancy, Color TV, Pool, WiFi"
    Dinners: "WiFi for Your Convenience!"
    Theaters/Stores: "WiFi Inside!"

    It's a cheap commercial draw. Combined with public networks, wISPs, Mobile WiFi, etc. the future is looking increasingly cord-free.

  30. Possible Motivation by ortcutt · · Score: 5, Informative

    I grew up in Pittsburgh and the airport was designed as an "Airmall" where people waiting for flights or waiting to pick people up would shop and eat. Unlike many airports, the prices are no more than they would be on Main Street. However, all of the shops are on the secure side of the security controls, and so when after 9/11 they changed the rules so that only ticketed passengers could go through security, the shops and restaurants lost half of their customers. Part of the motivation must be, I guess, to help out the restaurants by hoping that passengers will linger for a coffee or a Big Mac while they check their mail before they go to their gates.

  31. What's next? by dakan · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Coffe shops, book stores, airports, hotels, what's next!? You know where I want to see WiFi access? How about the doctors office, or the DMV? Where I unwilling have to spend hours of my life waiting for someone or something! Or what about WiFi at the grocery store so I can post my shopping list to my blog and then read it off to myself from the comfort of the grocery store asiles.
    **Ends Rant**

    --
    -This sig has been discontinued after a sudden realization.
  32. I'll tell you where they will get the money by BlueCoder · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Advertizeing of course. People are spending more time in airports than ever before. Giving them something to do reduces stress and makes everyone happier. But it also gives advertizers a market of financially well of people that can afford airline tickets and laptops. Expect to see advertizing with web url's all the more. And remember sitefiner... The airports can do the same thing. They can also supplant web pages temporarily with their own with click throughs. There are millions of ways they can afford it.

  33. balance between being here and being here too long by rcpitt · · Score: 2, Insightful
    With all the seats in various establishments such as hotels, airports, bistros, coffee shops, etc. vying for our bucks... the question of balance between getting your butt in the seat and getting "turnover" so that the seat generates income is going to become a real problem.

    I predict that there will be a market for software that will degrade the quality of a WIFI connection based on the time from first discovery and extended by the amount of coffee (or other valued product) ingested.

    --
    Been there, done that, paid for the T-shirt
    and didn't get it
  34. ignorance... by frovingslosh · · Score: 3, Informative
    So how do you think just being at a public point is going to give you access to put things anywhere you want on the internet? I don't expect many public access points will give you access to a mail or news server (if you need to check your mail you'll likely have to use a web based service, or at the very least connect back to your own mail server (although the normal mail port will likely be blocked)). You don't just send a virus down the wire, you have to deploy it somehow, and that isn't going to be any easier to do at a public access point. Certainly not a major one like would be at an international airport; if you do find a system without good port blocking it will more likely be at the mom and pop operations in your own home town offering free access in their coffee shop, or even driving around and finding someone who just plugged in an access point at home without enabling any security than hacking at "these kinds" of WiFi access point like the subject here.

    Don't think that you are completely secure and private when operating from such an access point anyway. You still have a MAC address. If you want to believe that Tom Ridge and John Ashcroft don't have a database with your MAC address in it, that's your business, but more than one computer user has learned the hard way that the MAC address identifies them.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
    1. Re:ignorance... by binarytoaster · · Score: 4, Informative
      You still have a MAC address. If you want to believe that Tom Ridge and John Ashcroft don't have a database with your MAC address in it, that's your business, but more than one computer user has learned the hard way that the MAC address identifies them.

      That's wonderful. Wait, just a second...
      ifconfig en0 hw ether 00:00:00:00:00:00
      Oh, "snap", now they have a different address to trace.

      Fun fun. Everything is configurable. ;)
  35. Wifi draws business by Linus+Sixpack · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Everything else being similar I'd go where I could get free internet.

    At this point its probably more expensive to bill and track than it is to deliver. I hope it rapidly becomes a case where no wifi is the exception. Heck there might be cases where no office connection is a feature!

    LS

  36. Word of mouth by tuxedobob · · Score: 2, Insightful

    1. You post on /. that PIT has WiFi.
    2.Travelers with a choice between PIT and, say, Cincinnati choose PIT.
    3. Profit!!!

  37. Free Wi-Fi at Quad City International Airport -MLI by DocChaos · · Score: 2, Informative

    Within the last month, the our local airport has had WI-FI Installed throughout the building here in Moline, Illinois (www.qcairport.com). I doubt its addition will raise any fees for anyone. Mediacom, our local cable company/Hi-speed cable provider, has big signs posted around saying "Free WI-FI Provided by Mediacom Online" so, one can assume that the airport may actually be making money or at least getting it for free by providing advertising space for Mediacom and Mediacom providing free internet access.

    www.insanelygood.com

    --
    DocChaos -------- I may be crazy, but then again I may be crazy.
  38. Re:Free Access great for pedophiles by frovingslosh · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yea, because so many more perverts like to go to places like highly monitored government buildings crawling with security people and checkpoints and other people and cameras that can see their screens than, say, just drive around the 'burbs in the privacy of their cars looking for an open access point.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
  39. Re:Uses by DirtyBirdy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    to be honest, i get a lot of work done in airports. It also keeps me connected (i know i know, its cliche, but true) At the narita airport in tokyo japan, after spending hours upon hours of mind numbing hours on a plane form the states, there was nothing more that i wanted to do than to track down somewhere to plug in and get to my email/regular sites/etc. turns out i was there for 14+ hours. i paid for the wireless connect so i could keep myself sane. that might be a valid use: maintiaining sanity. Narita has an amazing lounge which is accessable for all airlines with well lit desks, comfy chairs and a juice bar. the wireless (which was relatively cheap, at that) plus the lounge made me all the more inclined to request my return trip be connected through Narita. I believe that mindset/ market is what PIT is attempting to appeal to as well.

  40. Airconditioning/heating by TheLink · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I bet airconditioning and heating costs a lot more than WiFi+Internet.

    And the airport provides these to anyone who walks in for free.

    Heck without the dynamic access controls and payment stuff it's only slightly more complicated than providing piped in music and announcements.

    Of course if more people started supporting my suggestion of using http://here/ to get more info about the network you are using "here", there'll be more scope for some interesting stuff. e.g. malls can redirect you to a different website depending which Mall Zone's "here" you are in - listing specials. Heck you might even be able to vote for the piped in music you want ;).

    Similarly for a cafe - you could chat/play games with patrons locally.

    --
  41. all it takes by frovingslosh · · Score: 2, Interesting
    all it takes though is a good worm sent to another user's...

    If you really can do that, you can do it right now to most users on the Internet. Most users don't have a hardware firewall in place. If they have a software firewall in place they will have on on their laptop, so no differences there. Do you think you need to be in the same room with the guy to send him that virus? Do you think those users are logging your IP address so that you can only magically infect them from a public IP address? The flaws in your logic are that you don't just send a worm and have it somehow infest another system, unless you're Will Smith or Jeff Goldblum; and if you could such attacks would be much easier to carry off driving around an office park or the 'burbs than to do so in a location where cameras have taken your picture, security people have made you show ID, computers have a record of your being there, and a bunch of bored gun-ho security monkeys are looking for a fight.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
  42. Same reason there's no ticket taker in elevators. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It makes sense because the incremental cost of providing the service is probably lower than the cost of the soap (lots in my flight bag) and the capital is less than the cleaning budget for the toilets for a day or two.

    It also makes sense because providing the internet feed is dirt cheap, while trying to meter it and collect fees is NOT.

    It's called a "marginal service" - like the shaver outlet in the bathroom (without a meter and coin slot), providing lighting (rather than requiring you to bring your own flashlight), or the free elevators (without a ticket taker). It's MUCH easer and cheaper to include the cost of the service in the overhead cost of the environment (and the goods and services you buy there) than to try to bill for it specifically.

    Closer to the shaver outlet than the elevator, by the way. Unmetered internet service is dirt cheap to provide. Installing and maintaining elevators is DARNED expensive.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  43. I try and schedule flights through PIT now... by spagthorpe · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I flew there for the first time a few months ago, and was happy to find open WIFI in the food court, as well as shops and food that were not jacked up to normal airport prices. Nothing there was any more than at a regular shopping mall. Since then, I have intentionally scheduled my flights back to where I work so that my layover is at PIT. If I'm stuck there a few hours, I could care less. It's perfect for catching up on mail and surfing. In my case, it IS making a difference.

    --

    WWJD -- What Would Jimi Do?
    (Smash amp, burn guitar, take home the groupies)

  44. Re by zfractal · · Score: 2, Interesting
    While this is great for us Road Warriors, how can this make financial sense? Choice Hotels can certainly markup the cost of the rooms by a few dollars per night, but how is PIT planning on reclaiming the costs?



    Wow - imagine the uproar at companies providing better services! Is it so implausible to think that things can get better for the same price?

  45. Already at the gates... by AusG4 · · Score: 2, Informative

    This may have been said already, but I think the WiFi is already at the gates. On a recent layover in Pittsburgh, I pulled out my PowerBook while waiting for my flight to Toronto... low and behold, there was access. This was in a US Airways terminal.

    Just though I'd say so.

    --
    bash-3.00$ uname -a
    SunOS panda 5.10 Generic sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-2
  46. Strange rumblings by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Is this some strange sort of troll, with believable naivete?

    hacking - maybe it's time we make our systems secure and hackerproof credit card fraud - maybe it's time we stop considering 16 digits to be enough to authorize a transaction just plain spamming - maybe it's time we start bouncing un(cryptographically)signed mails

    Hacker-proof is just silly. Nothing is hacker proof. But even so, the issue here is that free wi-fi everywhere means hacking becomes much, much easier to do safely. You remember how they caught the Blaster worm guy because someone saw him launching it at the library? How are you going to catch someone who only has to be within 150 m of a base-station and could just hide in a toilet stall with his laptop?

    More than 16 digits on a credit card? That's like requiring 45 digit passwords. It just makes people more likely to write the damn thing down, which actually LESSENS security. With a 16-digit credit card number, people often memorize it, and less often store it in a text-file on their computer for easy reference.

    As for cryptographically secure e-mail... well, whatever. The e-mail system is so badly broken it's a wonder we still get service at all. Cryptography is just one of a dozen issues.

    1. Re:Strange rumblings by Pete+(big-pete) · · Score: 2, Funny

      With a 16-digit credit card number, people often memorize it, and less often store it in a text-file on their computer for easy reference.

      Yeah - I wrote my 16-digit number on the back of the card, so it's easy to find...

      -- Pete.

  47. Oh, "snap" by frovingslosh · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Oh, "snap", now they have a different address to trace.

    And if no one had ever been caught through their MAC address, this would be a good argument. But people have. Some hardware and software might not support that simple MAC address change, and most users will not think to do it. And very few abusers who are stupid enough to try to infect systems in a place where they had to show ID to get in, had cameras take their picture, have computers keeping records of their being their, and likely have security cameras watching and maybe even a bit of electronics listening in on what they do on that wireless link, will be smart enough to cover all of their traces, including the MAC address.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
  48. Re:Free Access great for pedophiles by bl1st3r · · Score: 2, Interesting

    They don't have to look at it to get it.

    According to the DoJ report that was released a while back (I don't have the URL), they claim that 42% of all P2P pornography is kiddy porn.

    Believing that number to be true (I think its high, but whatever) you could set up KaZaa to download lots of porn on the public network to your laptop and look at it when you get home. Noone would be the wiser.

    The other implication to this is the RIAA.

    "Uh, PIT. We need you to give us the names of all the people that used your network to download Britney Spears songs."

    We'll probably see some ridiculous figure like, "RIAA's Profits Dropped 2000% Since PIT Opened WIFI Hotspot."

    -Eric

    --
    hrrm.
  49. They should have done this a year ago by clymere · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I got bumped off a flight and spent 8 hours waiting around Pittsburgh International Airport last August. Huge airport. I think I had a drink in every bar there(gotta be a tleast a half dozen). Wi-fi access certainly would have helped pass the time...especially if it was free!

    --
    once you go slack, you never go back
  50. youknow what would have been better? by geekoid · · Score: 2, Funny

    hookers.

    Free Hooker access points. You would have people lined up around the block. Hell get rid of the damn planes, they just cost too much.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  51. Economics by Effugas · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Cost to DSL providers for providing net access to a residence is down to $20/mo. Quintuple that to $100/mo for shits and giggles. Tack on another $100 for the access point.

    For a year, that's $1200+$100 = $1300 / 365 = $3.56 per day per access point. If your business can make an extra three and a half dollars per day by having net access around, you should set up wifi.

    Of course, if you TRY to charge, and TRY to set up all these complicated access mechanisms, you have to spend all this money on support -- money you never make back.

    --Dan

    1. Re:Economics by Kludge · · Score: 2, Insightful

      you need something more reliable and faster than DSL, a failover setup, ...

      No, you don't. You're giving something away for free. People aren't going to expect a lot. If they need something more reliable, they can buy it elsewhere.

  52. Re:May I borrow yours? by Technician · · Score: 2, Funny

    Oh really? When I installed one on my XP notebook, I had to load drivers from the CD as well. Other people with different brand cards need different drivers. And this is certainly one area where Linux doesn't make it easier than Windows; most wireless cards don't even have Linux drivers. I don't really see this as an easy way to use someone else's MAC address, even if you could find someone willing to just let you share their card.

    Another fine example of how Plug-N-Play works to make life easy! somehow I think Plug-N-Play is not named correctly. It should be load driver software-Plug-Pray-Reboot-Pray-Configure-Play.

    --
    The truth shall set you free!
  53. Financial model: write virii to copy your data by MMHere · · Score: 2, Interesting

    PIT can simply write (or download root kits and assemble) virii/worms based on commonly known platform vulnerabilities such as this.

    Then, they can loose such nasties in the gate area to gather valuable privacy and financial data of oblivious surfers.

    Or, they could bump the passenger egress airport fee by a buck...

  54. Makes a lot of cents by ducomputergeek · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The cost to implent wifi and broadband these days is pretty cheap. I worked for a short time a couple years ago that was attempting to place internet kiosks into hotels, however I kept saying that the company needed to find another market because WiFi was going o replace their pay per use and advertising model.

    I got fired, formed my own consulting company and now our business is taking off and my old company is in Chapter 11.

    But that's beyond the point. One of my favorite places o go is a locally owned coffee house. About 4 years ago they bought a couple used laptops and rented then out for $7 an hour. About 18 months ago, they started giving free WiFI, guess what, they've made a lot more money, because people like me use it to work away from work. I deal with customers from 10 AM - 5PM, then about 5:30 goto the coffee shop, grab a bite to eat, a bottomless cup and do my work until about 8PM, then go home. Guess what though, I am so regular as soon as I walk in, they tell the exact bill and everything's ready togo. We often meet clients there as well because of the asmostphere. $100 in gear and $80 a month for a commerical Cable connection is pretty cheap to bring in repeat customers. Hell, they proably almost recover the bill from me alone. When they switched to free mode, two new coffee houses were opening in the area. Guess what, they are still in business, one is out of business, and the third is still there, but doesn't do near the business as the local favorite.

    Hotels are another story. I was at a meeting/seminar at a hotel and I was the first to test their WiFI connection. Its extremely handy and we quickly booked our next daylong seminar because of the easy access. Now others offer the same, but its a convience, and if they can improve bookings by 5 - 10%, it will more than pay for the service.

    My last story is that of our favorite all night diner. Its not uncommon for us to work until 1 or 2 AM. Usually take an hour off for news and Leno's monologue then go out for coffee and a late night snack. Well, we noticed that they too put in free WiFI access. We sometimes have working lunches there as well, although its not widely used as say the coffee house.

    --
    "The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money" - Thatcher.
  55. Priceless by smoon · · Score: 2, Funny

    10 wireless access points: $1,000
    Internet T1: Already in place, so free
    dsniff, mailsnarf, etc. sensor: Teds old P-400, so free

    Getting thousands of people to provide their personal info unencrypted over our network every day so that we can re-sell it to marketers: Priceless

    Sorry. Had to be done.

    --
    "But actually trying to use m4 as a general-purpose langage would be deeply perverse" --ESR
  56. My little Canadian town has this already by glyph42 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The airport in my little town of Fredericton NB Canada has had free wireless for quite a while, and in the past several months, the whole downtown area of the city has had free wireless. Yes, you can walk downtown, sit on a bench, open your laptop, and surf the net on 802.11g! In the next couple years, they will cover the entire city. Sweet.

    --
    Music speeds up when you yawn, but does not change pitch.
  57. Jet Blue has Free WifFi by jelevy01 · · Score: 2, Informative

    Jed Blue gives free wifi access in certain airports, specificity JFK and I think Long Beach.

  58. Razor-blade model? (Free Wifi pay for power?) by swb · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'll admit to paying for wifi at MSP, but I also get to expense it, so the cost doesn't matter to me. What drives me batshit is the scarcity of *outlets* at airports! Maybe this is how they plan to pay for it, by putting in paid electricity!

    What's the deal with outlets at airports, anyway? I know it'd be far more expensive to add outlets in the middle of the floor or in places where there was no easy access to power, but it's hard to find ANY outlets, and when you do find them they're often far from your specific gate, in the middle of a hallway, or just nonexistent. Part of the reason I find this so surprising is that most electical codes require an outlet every 6 feet or something, yet in an 2000 sq ft area I found three, with only two in a usable place -- and when I dug around in my bag looking for something, I had two people approach me asking if I was leaving, eyeing the outlet.

    Battery power is fine if you don't turn on the laptop during the flight or carry a couple of extra batteries. I don't (weight, etc), and I like to save my batteries for watching DVDs during the flight. But with outlets so scarce, I think I might be forced to get a couple of extra batteries just to deal with the lack of power.

    Besides the tongue-in-cheek reference to paying for power, the other idea that occured to me is the dreaded advertising model for wifi -- give away access, but transparent proxy all web requests and add popup and banner hijacking advertising. Sure, it won't affect those of us that use VPN or ssh tunnels to our own proxies, but they can solve that with NAT and/or locked-down access.

  59. Sponsorship by CenoTrope · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Believe it or not, but the best way to pay for airport wifi is to get the airlines to sponsor it. That way they can proudly claim to support the white collar worker in his ever growing lust for a permanent state of being "at work". Actually, the Longbeach Airport, in Longbeach, CA also has free wireless access, sponsored by the greatest airline out there... JET BLUE!! It makes flying in/out of there a real pleasure.

  60. Rough road, I've been there by telemonster · · Score: 2, Interesting

    One of the products our small startup as tried to market in Southeastern Virginia is basically free to the customer wireless internet access. Everyone knows how much a DSL circuit costs, and we see it as an added benefit for customers. The business can use the internet circuit for other uses as well, weather it is POS or security.

    It is actually kind of odd, but I went to the local airport board and said "If you will pay the $100/month DSL fee, we will provide all of the hardware, installation, and support to provide free wireless internet at Norfolk International Airport"

    I got turned down. They said I should bid on putting in for-pay kiosks. They couldn't get involved without a competitive bid process. $1200 a year we are talking, they spend that much on one run of advertisements (15 or so) on the local radio station.

    We have a setup that blocks outbound pop3 requests, as well as a few other important things to prevent abuse (spammers, some attacks). With the number of cameras and the number of other open wireless access points why would someone go to an airport to commit a crime.

    It is a rough sell. We tried malls, but they don't want people to do anything but quickly buy things and leave. Hotels want the signal in every room, and many are serviced by lodgenet.

    So at this point we have only managed a limited number of deployments. The airport though, I figured it would benefit everyone so I would put down the money for the hardware. Good publicity and a useful service.

    Doh. Our setup has a splash page with ads and security information that the user must view, then they are free to web browse. We still might end up in one of the local malls, time will tell. We are going to try to get one of the other businesses at the airport to sponsor it, but no telling if it will work. TMobile has one of those hotspot things, but it is only at one particular gate (how useful).

    --
    Southeastern Virginia REPRESENT!
  61. Re:Same reason there's no ticket taker in elevator by Kozar_The_Malignant · · Score: 2, Informative

    It also makes sense because providing the internet feed is dirt cheap, while trying to meter it and collect fees is NOT.

    Tangentially related thought... If I stay at a hotel costing over $150/night, local calls from the room cost $1.50 each, and high speed internet access costs $10-15 per day. If I stay at a motel costing $45/night, local calls and internet are free. It's not so much the cost of providing the service, but what people, particularly those on expense accounts, are willing to pay.

    The future of pay wi-fi providers such as T-Mobile seems limited.

    --
    Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
  62. Excellent. by mindstrm · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Now.. we just need the FCC and other regulatory bodies over the globe to allocate a PROPER chunk of bandwidth, with more power and better rules, specifically for wifi.

    Look how much has been accomplished in 2.4Ghz ISM...who would aruge that license-free use of this spectrum was not totally to the benefit of society.

    Think of what things could be like if some real spectrum was allocated, with better power.

  63. CMH (Port Columbus International) by horatio · · Score: 2, Informative

    CMH has had WiFi access throughout the airport for some time now. I happened to be coming home around Christmas time and saw a random sign while waiting for my luggage about WiFi being available.

    I went down to an empty corner of the baggage claim area to wait for my ride to show up, and sure enough there was what appeared to be unhindered (no port blocking, etc) WiFi access. And I never really considered CMH to be one of the "leading edge" airports in the country.

    --
    There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
  64. airports with free wifi and paying for it by joey · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The article includes a quite to the effect that this is the first airport in the US, and second in the world with free wifi. That's not true, I have found free wifi in a few large airports. And my smalltown local airport (TRI) has extensive free wifi throughout, plus free public terminals.

    TRI's network is sponsored by $LARGE_POLLUTING_LOCAL_COMPANY, which happens to fly lots of employees to Atlanta on a semi-daily basis. I belive that it was economical for them to sponsor the free wireless because now their employees can get some work in at the airport. It probably paid for itself quite fast.

    --
    see shy jo