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The Self-Tuning Guitar
CowboyRobot writes "With the TransPerformance Performer you push a button to activate a mechanical re-tensioning of the strings to any of a few hundred tunings, 'accurate to within 2 cents over the entire tuning range', in a couple of seconds. They can even refit your existing guitar. There's a long audio interview with Jimmy Page on the site. It's funny to hear him speak."
It's being done with pianos:
See this New Scientist article
-- jaf
Now if only they could get one to automatically play a real F or some of the more complicated SUS7#'s for us...
I have the fealing that most guitarists use the F just to stop me from trying to learn the song.
--Turvey
I had a flame... but she had a fire.
man, I feel bad for the roadies.
No more tuning the guitars.
Sucks to be them.
Guess its mic checks from here on out. Sorry fellas.
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Now if only we can get these for vocalists...
I wonder how many guitarists will take to this since to them it is such and art and about what they hear. Can a computer really tune to the level that they can hear it needs to be tuned to for them?
Evolution or ID?
For those who don't know, Jimmy Page was the guitarist for Led Zeppelin. While he doesn't have the best technique when it comes to playing the guitar, he really really does have a grasp of melodies. He's a genius, you'd better listen to that guy. :)
now I don't have to be concerned that I'm putting to much tension on my G-string... phew!
The original generic sig.
Well, someone was going to say it...
This is really cool. However, maybe I'm showing my age here in that I'm not sure I really like the idea. I've been playing for 25 years (since I was 12) and IMHO a huge part of learning to play is developing a good ear and being able to tune your instrument by hand. I never cared for electronic tuners for the same reason.
;-)
That being said, since I *can* tune by ear, I probably wouldn't mind the convenience of being able to 'dial in' whatever tuning I want.
Let's just make sure that newbs learn things right before you let them have one of these
well my first reaction was "Great! More tone deaf 'musicians' who can't even tune thier own guitars ... at least they'll just suck instead of also being out of tune."
... guess that's why I USED to play with him.
But then I remembered I fellow I used to play with who was enamoured with oddball tunings. I would have loved to get him one of these, because he had to change tunings so often that the audience would get bored in between songs. Wouldn't have been so bad if the guy had had a pesonality to keep them entertained with
Take a look under the testimonials section...Used by the band "Paul Allen and the Microsofts"??? I'm not sure if this is a joke or not, but /.'ers believe you me, its an omen. This thing must someone be evil.
The FAQ says it costs about $4000 to retrofit it onto your guitar. This is not for your average guy who plucks a bit on the weekends.
The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who cannot read them. - Mark Twain
100 cents = 1 half-step = the smallest pitch distance on a piano
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Hello, don't hate me for it, but I followed the link and read the story. Seems like the bridge is replaced by motors that tune the guitar by moving the bridge slightly, thus increasing or lowering the string tension. I can't speak for everyone, but I for one like my strings in a fixed position from the frets. I want the distance between the strings and the frets as small as possible. Does anyone else see a problem with that, since moving the bridge alters that distance? Or do you think those movements would be so subtle that one could hardly tell there was a movement at all?
Each guitar has it's quirks. Depending on the intonation the "b" string on a guitar needs to be tuned manytimes slightly flat to allow chords to ring true.
The human ear has a problem with "b". Even though the tuner may say it is perfectly in tune a simple "D" chord will sound awful.
Compensating bridges make up for this intonation problem but it is still not exact.
Automatic tuners may look cool but will go the way of locking nuts. Remember those locking nuts and big ass whammy bars forced on us by Eddie VanHalen in the 80's?
and i meet students all the time that don't want to learn to tune because of digital tuners. i would imagine how "bad" music would sound when they can figure out they can just press a button to retune their guitar. people listen. you ear tune to train your ear.
This seems like a cool thing, but all it all I doubt seriously it'll catch on. Plus, I can't can't see anyone who can afford a $2k(US)+ guitar taking a chance at killing its resale value by doing this mod.
From their FAQ: Some wood is removed and replaced with the computer and mechanical device.
geeky stuff I'm proud to have been a part of: linux.com / themes.org / sourceforge.net / sicnus.com
Don't seem to understand what this product is for. It's not for tonedeaf idiots who can't tune a guitar.
It's for professionals, who want to expand their sound by being able to change tuning midsong and at a rate of a tone a second, so that you can get effects and changes in sound that are impossible on a normal guitar tuning headstock (believe me, I just tried to emulate this video with my guitar: http://www.selftuning.com/video/video.html )
I think the price tag of 3300$-3899$ says it all really.
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...the locking nut whammy bar. The best invention since the electromagnetic pickup! Floyd Rose is a genius!
Paul Allen is funding this, therefore it sucks. But Allen is funding SpaceShipOne, which is cool! But SpaceShipOne is Armadillo's competitor, therefore it sucks! But... *head explodes*
Things are more like they are now than they ever were before.
I can understand maybe with people just starting out in learning the guitar, but with someone that knows how to tune a guitar, and having a guitar that stays in tune (ie, don't buy cheap crap), is important. But learning to tune the guitar by ear is part of the learning process.
The tuning of your guitar depends on many factors, and only one of them is the quality of the guitar. For example:
- How often and how hard you bend
- How hard you bang your guitar while you play (blues vs. punk)
- The gauge of the strings
- How fresh/old the strings are
- Use a tremolo/whammy bar? Things go way out of tune with those.
- Retune your guitar often for alternate tunings? This can also affect the stability of the strings
- Alternative playing methods, a la Sonic Youth (playing with drumsticks etc)
For some people, it is easy to stay in tune. For others, tuning between each song is a must, even with really good equipment.
Uh, cars are self tuning now.
"Tuning" on a car, as in a "tune up," refers to the adjustment of the fuel and ignition systems to provide maximum efficiency. On mechanical cars, this meant adjusting the carburetor, adjusting the timing, adjusting the ignition points and condensor, etc.
All of these parts are computer controlled, and have been since fuel injection became popular around, well, some time between 1980 and 1990. It's even more efficient that way. And the computer is auto-adjusting -- it senses microscopic knocks and adjusts the mix on the fly. When a computer part fails, it fails obviously, unlike the gradual loss of power you face with a carburetor. I had my Ignition Control Module go on me two weeks ago and it was OBVIOUS...one cylinder just stopped firing (ouch).
So yeah, cars are self tuning. In fact, anybody in the past 10 years who's sold you a "tune up" either did nothing at all to your car, or checked a lot of other things that had nothing to do with what we called a "tune up" before the 80s.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
Paul Allen's band, Grown Men, have a website with mp3 (interestingly, not WMA) samples and lyrics, from their debut CD.
It's a conspiracy developed by the wives of guitar players to eliminate a reason for buying another guitar!!! The "I need another guitar for an alternate tuning" has been ironclad for the last 50 years. If you run across one of these turn away. Don't look at it. Next they'll comeup with a guitar that lets you interchange bodys, neck and pickups to eliminate the "I needed a (insert one: Gibson (insert one) LP, SG, ES335,etc Fender (insert one) Strat, Tele (insert one) w/HB,, w/S, 12 string, Rick, Gretsch, PRS, etc) justification.
Pragmatically speaking, there are (as far as I'm aware) alternate tunings for pianos, organs, and harpichords which relate to specific musical periods, such as the baroque. Thus, for truly faithful reproduction, you may want to tune to the Werckmeister III scale for performing some baroque pieces. Not to mention the different "pure" tunings for all the major and minor keys.
proof, n. A demonstration that a conclusion is implied by certain premises and axioms.
Guitar tuning has a lot to do with the nut (save the jokes...). This is the piece of plastic, bone or graphite on the end of the fretboard that holds the strings in place before they hit the tuning machines. Most guitars that won't tune aren't so bad because of the tuning keys, it's that the nut is not cut properly for the size strings you're using. If they don't sit right, they won't stay in tune, simple as that. Oh, and STRETCH those strings when they're new! Search google, its very simple and your new strings will behave very nicely after a stretch, because you get the kinks out.
Also, there's a handheld tuner that you can buy that physically turns the peg for you, all you do is pluck the string. I'm surprised no one's mentioned it yet, it's been around for over 10 years. The difference is that it only does one string at a time, and you hve to physically hold it in place while you tune.
In the long run, tuning a guitar is not rocket science and keeping your nut in good shape and having a decent set of tuners (even ones on a cheap Fender Squire are pretty good nowadays) will keep you playing alright. This invention is pretty cool for a wow value, but it's like using an Abrahms tank to kill a mosquito. I play several guitars with old-school Bigsby tremolos and I don't have any tuning problems.
tuning, as it turns out, is inherently flawed. This occurs because of the "Pythagorean comma": essentially, the combination of a perfect fifth + a perfect fourth leads to an imperfect octave. Hence, there are actually multiple different ways to tune instruments, each of which makes sense in its own way. One example is "Well-Tempering" (as in Bach's Well-Tempered Klavier), which places priority on tuning keys near C. Chords like C, G, etc. played on a Well-Tempered scale sound particularly in tune, whereas chords like F# sound less well-tuned.
The most common scheme today is "Equal Tempering", in which every half-step is a multiple of 2^(1/12) above its neighbor. In this scheme, C# and Db (for example) are considered the same note, whereas in other schemes, they are not. The upside of this is that all keys sound equally "in tune"; the downside is that no key sounds perfectly in tune.
Historical note: some early Klaviers had seperate keys for sharps and flats, since those notes were not considered to be the same.
So, the "science" part of tuning is what you see in the autotuner. The "art" part is tuning the instrument to make the music sound like you hear it in your head.
Bottom line: if a guitarist tunes all of its open strings to a piano, it will not sound "in tune" to the guitarist. Of course, an autotuner can presumably be customized to taste.
Human being (n.): A genetically human, genetically distinct, functioning organism.
IMHO the posts about "ruining the musicians ear" are bogus. If you RTFA you'll see that this gizmo allows the scales to be tempered to suit the musicians taste. You want to modulate the B-string a few hertz flat -- go ahead, that's what a tempered scale is. Besides, you develop a good ear by playing a well-tuned instrument, not by compensating mentally for a discordant mess.
I have a reasonably good ear, and use harmonics when "ear tuning" because they're more accurate than the fret placement (and less subject to the rising tone problems caused by fretting the previous string, which raises it's tone slightly). I'm at least as good as the cheap electronic tuners, but not as good as the higher-end needle-guage based units. Based on the price of this unit, I'm betting it uses a pretty high quality tuner - far better than most guitarists ear! Having strings 1 hertz off doesn't make much difference on a six-string played with high distortion at a rock concert. But on a twelve string, even a small difference between paired strings leads to an unpleasant audible "beating". The same thing happens with classical guitars, where it becomes annoying (usually when lower strings are fretted above the twelvth fret, and sound out of sync with a supposedly identical note played on a higher string).
So, this unit is faster than a human, more accurate than a human, allows complete control over scale tempering, and stores a couple of hundred alternate tunings. It's got me beat hands down, and I suspect that's why professionals are paying nearly 4g to get one!
Why? Is he out of tune?
-- clvrmnky