Slashdot Mirror
DARPA Grand Challenge Updates
GraffitiKnight writes "After only 1 team managed to successfully navigate the DARPA Qualifying course, DARPA has rewritten the rules to let almost everyone compete. Wired has the story, which also mentions rumors that the race will run to 150 miles, much less than the original plans of 210 - 300 miles." Here is some earlier Slashdot coverage of the race.
I would be pissed! To change the rules at the last minute to allow the teams that didn't do designing so well? Stupid!
Hmmm.
Is there any way one can view the coverage via the web?
I hear that it will be the machines hunting a prisoner or something over a 150 mile course.
..that there's something wrong with DARPA's mentality.
You don't accept substandard results if nobody can produce. This is something you intend to throw massive money on eventually, you'd want the would-be contractors to put up or shut up real quick.
From the Previous Story
Quoting Frank Dellaert, co-director of Georgia Tech's robotics lab from the article, 'I would have trouble driving some of these roads myself. I think it's beyond the capabilities of autonomous vehicles today.'
I guess he was right after all...
If I was the one team racing unless there was a time restriction I'd go Mars rover slow.
No sense taking risks when there are no competition.
...as the article makes them out to be.
All the Wired article states about the Caltech and Ohio State teams is that "The squads from Caltech and Ohio State University were also allowed in, even though their drones did not complete the obstacle course. "
From the Caltech team site: "Bob completed the test route flawlessly until the last few feet. He was stopped by DARPA officials seven feet away from the final obstacle -- although had he been allowed to continue, he may have stopped himself in time..."
Seems close enough to me.
Will the newly included teams be eligible for prize money as well, after CMU's team has already completed course?
. . . are the same guys who set the standards for testing strategic anti-missile systems.
"OK, I suppose it's reasonable for enemy missiles to have florescent 'HIT ME' signs with blinking red bull's-eyes and a GPS system transmitting their coordinates."
(Seriously, the race is still pretty cool. I'm rooting for the CMU team, who used to test their vehicles in Shenley Park.)
Stefan
Is that this "Running Man" show I keep hearing about?
DARPA put up a $1,000,000 cold hard cash for an autonomous vehicle and they got dozens of shoddy immitations that couldn't even navigate the test course.
Normally they have to pay a defense contractor BILLIONS to get something that doesn't work.
They saved loads of money, and they don't have to pay until it works, unlike, oh, other DoD projects, like the Osprey, Comanche, Patriot, TW Missile Defense, etc.
"Life's funny sometimes." "And sometimes it isn't." --Cat's Cradle
....a prisoner or something
So PV HS, since their entry hunts down principals, could do quite well?
I'm sure if every project follows this model of diminishing goals, morale will be at all time high and productivity will skyrocket! I mean, failure is a terrible thing and nobody should be forced to cope with it and try to do better. Trying is hard!
Hey, it works for the public education system, right?
Screw it. If one team qualifies, one team takes the challenge. Chances are they're a shoe-in anyway considering they've already proven themselves more capable.
To all those that failed: Better luck next year, guys!
=Smidge=
This is qualification. If you have no-one qualify, it's kinda pointless to hold the event. Mod parent down for trolling.
I do security
Well, I can't say this is a good thing. If only one qualified, then the rest need to go back to the drawing board.
It's the same in any situation. If you lower your expectations, you'll get a lesser product/whatever. If it can't make it 200 miles, then it isn't worthy of being in the race.
My 2 cents, anywho...
Excuse my speling.
Making The Bar Project
"I say we must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling twirling twirling towards freedom!"
-Kodos
From what I understand, the Red team kinda put this thing together quickly. Politics within CMU caused Mr. Whitaker to enter the competition and inspire (drive) his team. Congratulations to them. I know they put in a LOT of hard work.
-- You can't spell geek without a EE.
Not! If anything, the govt. had very high standards on this competition.
Take the development of the stealth fighter, aka the F11A. For the preliminary round of competition, all the competing firms had a simpler start: make a model of a plane that could withstand wind tunnel and radar tests. It was way lower in scale, and was only the shell reflecting the shape of the plane. Not to mention these guys had about 6months to a year to develop just this.
With this precedent in mind, this competition was asking *way* too much for within the alloted time. Perhaps they could have used model cars or golf carts over a smaller distance of terrain. Or perhaps just one terrain as a preliminary test.
baby steps...
until the autonomous vehicle wins the race and runs over your team as it celebrates. Of course, it would be no loss for these schools.
:)
The only team worth saving wouldn't have this problem anyhow, seeing as they qualified.
Not that I have a favorite.
Technology Consulting & Free Downloads
10 hrs if i remember correctly... The Red Team's bot, Sandstorm, won the qualifier be cause it has some of the best sensors. I would be pissed to not have any other bot to prove I was better than.
Darpa put out a press release yesterday after
m
the Wired article. Three more teams have qualified:
SciAutonics II, Team Cal Tech, and Virginia Tech
See: http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/media_news.ht
Notice its dated 10 AM yesterday.
The Virginia Tech team at least claims on its website that they completed the qualifying course.
http://www.me.vt.edu/grandchallenge/
The 6WD chassis we're using is one of the most bump-tolerant platforms around. It can go over railroad ties at top speed without problems and without going airborne. The center of gravity is low.
:)
I'm curious- what sort of shocks were you using? I'm creating a a robot for a local battlebot-style tournament, and I'm in need of some heavy-duty yet lightweight shocks. It's for a... let's say... "creative" new type of weapon
Using GNU/Linux - Windows-free zone
What kind of data are you preloading to help with the route planning? Contour map? Satellite imagery? Hand-crafted data, etc.?
Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
The whole point of this to to have unmanned vehicles able to navigate hostile terrain. If this keeps up can we just ask the enemy forces to change their rules and take it easy on us cause we're still learning? ;)
The results of the attempts of today's group break down as follows:
Okay, besides the endless references to Terminator I could make, this really sucks. So, we have high-school kids doing weapons research free of charge for the DOD now?
I sincerely wish that people would put more ethical concerns regarding science in the right place. While people are bemoaning the evils of stem cell research, we're happily spending money on this sort of thing.
The happy-go-lucky attitude of the article, the competition, and not to mention slashdot is a little disturbing as well. Heyhey! That's right kids, it's time for the Darpa Competition! Just build us a robot that can run around by itself, and we'll take care of putting a gun on it. It's science-fun, just like Mr. Wizard! Even Dad's helping out!
This isn't just "neat" stuff - this is stuff that has an impact in the real world, and I suggest that those people involved consider what sorts of contributions they're making. Personally, I would appreciate them not building autonomous robots for the DOD.
where the hell did you get LIDAR and doppler radar sensors from and how much did they cost ?
I'm curious- what sort of shocks were you using?
Whether or not you do a lot of heavy duty off-roading, you should look at the higher end, heavy duty shocks for your vehicle. They may cost you a lot now, but will not require replacement down the road. The cheaper shocks will save you $$$ now, but may cost you in terms of poorer performance later on.
I've cooled on Monroe stuff after my experiences with Monroe shocks in my father's 73 Suburban. The shocks lasted about 15,000 miles before I needed to replace them again. I've also experienced quality problems with other Monroe items, notably gas-charged struts, in the past 5 to 6 years. Maybe it's just my bad luck...
If you don't want a gas shock, look at a Gabriel Adjustable "E" shock for all four corners. These are a hydraulic-only shock with an adjustment that allows you to set the ride from very soft to rock hard. Pay attention to the instructions, though, because if you set the shock too hard, you can rip suspension mounts. I put a pair of these in the back end of the aforementioned Suburban, and ripped one of the shock mounts off the rear axle! You can avoid this problem by having a competent welding shop reinforce the welds on the axle. Note: I do not know if these are still available, the last set I purchased was almost 6 years ago. I purchased these shocks through Super Shops, but anyone who handles the Gabriel line of shocks should be able to tell you if they are available.
they will learn to spell...
"Faith: Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel." - A.B.
Isn't John Nagle aka Animats the real guy behind Team Overbot?
This seems to be a troll.
Known poor quality control, I don't think patriot is that good.
I would prefer that the rules stayed strict. The results of the competition are more likely to push the technological envelope that way.
You mean like the 'Star Wars" Missile Defense System which has failed numerous tests of increasing ease, but is being used anyway because "it beats nothing", except that "nothing" doesn't violate treaties we signed, creates a false sense of security, doesn't motivate anyone to 'get it right' and wastes trillions of dollars.
Or the Patriot Defense System, which routinely targeted friendly aircraft during development, failed miserably the first time it was put into use(for a use it was never intended- it's never been used for what it was originally designed for, shooting down planes) and then 10+ years later was used again and resulted in the deaths of dozens of UK soldiers because it couldn't tell the difference between a helicopter traveling at less than 100 kt and an enemy missile traveling over the speed of sound?
Or the Osprey tiltrotor, which suffered an astronomical failure rate and again, caused dozens of deaths of US marines?
Then there's the Comanche helicopter, which they've been kicking around for years and finally decided, after spending billions, to just say "oh well, so much for that"?
The defense department is famous for bidding scandals(if contracts are put out to bid at all), and being happy to look the other way and fudge the requirements(or ignore them completely) if the system fails to meet original requirements.
Curiously, the russians never quite had such problems. Their fighter jets, for example, don't require pristine runways and constant maintenance; they're built like tanks, because the people who designed them knew they'd be held responsible if it failed unreasonably...and responsible doesn't mean "loose their job", it means "end up in Siberia" or "in a river with a bullet through your brain".
This country needs three things. First, a true capitalist system for defense contractors. You want to sell the Army a tank? Fine. You can do so all on your own, without a single fucking dime, and then try and sell it. If it can't compete, too bad, your company goes under- that's the way capitalism works. Second, defense contractors need to be held responsible for when their products fail. Refunds for starters, contracts that can be invalidated on failure, civil/criminal punishments for gross design/construction failures. Third, absolutely, positively, no secret budgets of any kind. I am entirely pissed off with the pentagon filling up with all the kids who had secret treehouse clubs when they were kids and want to do the same shit now that they're 40.
Please help metamoderate.
From the press release:
The results of the attempts of today's group break down as follows:
SciAutonics II, Team Cal Tech and Virginia Tech completed the course.
Team CIMAR , Team ENSCO, TerraMax nearly completed the course.
Axion Racing, Digital Auto Drive, The Golem Group, Palos Verdes High School, Team CajunBot, TerraHawk partially completed the course.
The Blue Team, Rover Systems, SciAutonics I and Team Phantasm terminated their attempts.
In any case there isn't much harm in allowing anyone to compete. It looks like many of them will fail in the first few minutes leaving it to Red Team.
Lasers Controlled Games!
Whether or not you do a lot of heavy duty off-roading, you should look at the higher end, heavy duty shocks for your vehicle. They may cost you a lot now, but will not require replacement down the road.
Well, like I said- this is for a new type of weapon, not for off-roading. Weight and strength are the primary concerns. Like I said, this is a local tournament, so we may have to sacrifice weight for the moment, and move up to better shocks once we've got some prize money.
It shouldn't be too hard to get some prize money, though. We are using Embedded Linux for the onboard logic, so we will definitely have the most "brains" of any of the other bots. Most people are using weak VDHL logic boards, and only one other bot is using a real OS for the brains, and they're using Windows!! They'll probably crash in the middle of the fight, since they're aren't using rock-solid open source software.
Using GNU/Linux - Windows-free zone
After only 1 team managed to successfully navigate the course, DARPA has rewritten the rules to let whoever the flyin hell they want to win.
I don't care if it's a good idea to see more entries, it's just not cool to change rules in the middle of the game. If they want more participation, there'll always be time to lower standards later.
This is a troll. I've seen the exact same post elsewhere under a different name, but am too lazy at the moment to find it.
The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
Ok, let them drive through this. I mean, I just can't figure it out. :D
(btw no need to click on the images etc. just crap below)
'nuff said.
I know a little sig that's just ten words long
The QID was pathetic. We spent two days watching vehicles move around at 1MPH and hit big, obvious obstacles. No way can most of those vehicles operate effectively offroad.
The big design mistakes seem to be these:
Only CMU is doing well. It's not the money, by the way. Their actual cash outlays are only about $300K to date. It's the body count and the fear. They have about fifty people on the project, a slavedriver boss, and the full backing of CMU. CMU has to do well; most of the Robotics Institute funding over the last three decades is from DARPA, and DARPA can turn that money off at any time.
John Nagle
Team Overbot
Too bad the army gave out the contract 4 months ago (http://www.gendyn.com/news/press_releases/2003/De cember%209,%202003%20News%20Release.htm) to General Dynamics Robotic Systems and SAIC. (GDRS has a long standing partnership with CMU and SAIC is a sponser of CMU's entry)
General Dynamics Corporation (ticker: GD, exchange: NYSE)
News Release - Tuesday, December 9, 2003
Press Contact: (586) 825-7930
General Dynamics Robotic Systems Signs $185 Million Contract to Develop FCS Autonomous Navigation Capability
WESTMINSTER, Md. - General Dynamics Robotic Systems and Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC) have signed a $185 million contract for development of the Autonomous Navigation System (ANS) for ground vehicles as part of the U.S. Army's Future Combat Systems (FCS) program. SAIC, together with Boeing (NYSE: BA), comprise the FCS Lead Systems Integrator team. SAIC will administer the ANS multi-year agreement with General Dynamics Robotic Systems.
FCS is a networked "system of systems," using advanced communications and technologies to link soldiers with manned and unmanned ground and air platforms and sensors to significantly enhance the Army's effectiveness and maneuverability.
Under the FCS ANS program, General Dynamics Robotic Systems will be responsible for the design, development, manufacture, integration, and testing of a system that is capable of autonomously controlling any of several vehicles designated by the Army, including the Multi-functional Utility Logistics Equipment platform, the Armed Reconnaissance Vehicle, and Manned Ground Vehicles. The period of performance for the ANS program is through September 2009
ANS will provide navigational, perception, path-planning and vehicle-following algorithms and the requisite on-board sensor package for autonomous mobility. It is a major subsystem in the FCS manned combat system.
"ANS will comprise field sensor and software solutions based on autonomous mobility technology that we have been developing for many years," said Mark Del Giorno, vice president of engineering at General Dynamics Robotic Systems. "The ANS system, the 'brains' of the FCS robotic vehicles, will enable the Army's vision of a lighter, faster, highly effective future force."
General Dynamics Robotic Systems is a part of General Dynamics Land Systems (Sterling Heights, Mich.), a wholly owned subsidiary of General Dynamics Corporation (NYSE: GD).
General Dynamics Corporation, headquartered in Falls Church, Virginia, employs approximately 66,900 people worldwide and anticipates 2003 revenues of $16.1 billion. The company has leading market positions in mission-critical information systems and technologies, land and amphibious combat systems, shipbuilding and marine systems, and business aviation.
Is this "trolls in a circlejerk day" on Slashdot?
Could the two of you talk about how the robots you've invented in your mind are affected by the DMCA, the RIAA, and software patents?
Since you're using embedded linux, has SCO tried to sue you yet?
Has John fucking Titor come to steal your pretend robots yet?
Get the fuck off my lawn, you ingrates.
Slashdot is jumping the shark. I'm just driving the boat.
This was posted already this week in an attempt to karma whore.
Would you do it for some scoobie crack?
Didn't DARPA put a cap on the number of entries because they were swamped with applicants not long ago?
Maybe more entries is a good thing, since so few are able to qualify...
... The pathfinding strategy is indeed borrowed from video game technology.
You see, good things came from the Half-Life 2 source code leak.
Photos of our vehicle: http://vislab.ce.unipr.it/terramax/
Is this "trolls in a circlejerk day" on Slashdot?
Could the two of you talk about how the robots you've invented in your mind are affected by the DMCA, the RIAA, and software patents?
Since you're using embedded linux, has SCO tried to sue you yet?
Has John fucking Titor come to steal your pretend robots yet?
Get the fuck off my lawn, you ingrates.
YHBT.
P.S. This post is valid XHTML, to the point that I can control.
I don't think any other team is taking it out of the race, unless someone has a tank.
BAHAHA!! Yuo spelted challegne all funny lookin!!1
Yeah, they need to keep it real after that whole online terrorist "stock market" trading plan of theirs.
Intrepid government agencies...
Get the fuck off my lawn, you ingrates.
Oh yeah, one other thing: when you're hot, you're hot. Check out my highly moderated repost of an Amazon customer review in my comment history.
I confess my trolling in the name of sacred jihad.
... then they shouldn't drop the requirement. Just let the CMU entry go it alone.
C'mon Slashdot!
The official rules linked from the Wired article have not been updated since January 4, 2004.
The rules actually refer to the field test part of the QID as a Demonstration of basic abilities. It never says anywhere in the rules that they have to fully complete the demonstration to be qualified.
The rules have always stated that 25 teams would make it to QID but only 20 teams would actually compete in the race.
Yet another shining example of the media trying to make news where there is none...
I run one of the Grand Challenge teams, Team Overbot...
6 386 from March 8 and http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=83384&cid=7297 464 from October 23. The actual author is John Nagle, aka Animats. Please mod it down (and then you can mod this down too.)
This is a karma troll; it's been reposted every time we discuss this race. See http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=99774&cid=850
Here in the states NPR had a good story on one of the teams yesterday (wednesday) during their All Things Considered show. You can listen to the show here:
NPR LINK
The NPR Summary of the story is: At the crack of dawn this Saturday, a 200-mile race across the Mojave Desert begins. The competitors are robotic vehicles taking on the form of SUVs, dune buggies and golf carts. It's a contest sponsored by the Pentagon to spur advancements in the field of robotics. NPR's Melissa Block talks with competitor Red Whittaker.
I will be more impressed if the autonomous motorcycle makes it ten miles than I will be for Red Team to win the whole thing, because at least this bike is fully autonomous and has some radical new ideas going into it, instead of just tons of resources and brute-force mapping.
----------
Host your WAP site, automatically
If you're going to bring up The Running Man, read the book, forget the movie.
'nuff said.
There's no offline preplanning. Wouldn't help in the real world.
Since when is offline planning not part of military strategy? Sending some drone to do a close flyover, and having a human in the loop to correct obvious mistakes, is probably what the Future Combat Systems will look like.
No humans in harms way, but lots of human interaction and planning. To expect a robot to act on human-level with sense & response alone is crazy. Humans barely do it without a map, and we have a 20TFlop computer on our shoulders. Why would we be able to beat biology when our sensors are worse, our computation is slower, and our intuition is non-existent?
The red team will do the best, and I'm glad. Solving a problem first, then reducing it to a more affordable & minimal solution is called progress. Not solving the problem, while taking the high road, is nothing but failure.
Hopefully next year, or the year after, when DARPA offers the next prize, there will be fewer teams all with better funding. Clearly the next step to me is to not provide the way-points, just the final target. Also, multiple robot interaction would be nice, especially if there were a flying bot involved.
Robo-Blogs of the world: UNITE!
Well, see DARPA funded the initial development of this toy we've all come to love and refer to as "the Internet". So whenever DARPA starts pumping money into newer and even more exciting toys, all the geeks' little ears perk up... "Wow, the things I could do with an autonomous robotic off-road vehicle! Why, I might even get laid!"
Now, personally, I'd rather have my own Predator drone, but I can see the appeal of stomping around the boonies in a vehicle you don't have to steer while you're tipping your beer back. Or while going into the cooler for another beer. Or while taking potshots at what appear to be deer in orange reflective vests. Or ever steer, for that matter. Frequently lost? Embarrassed to ask for directions? This is the vehicle for you! However, it requires a special breed of owner: somebody with several million dollars burning a hole in his back pocket, who is also not afraid to admit that his off-road vehicle is smarter than he is. Much, much, MUCH smarter.
By the way, google sez DARPA is the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency Note the ".mil" suffix; this denotes it is run by the greatest toymakers in the world: the US Military Industrial complex.
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
it is just me, or all of the vehicles they have shown really crappy looking?
its 2004..don't we have some Terminator-looking vehicles they can throw out there? not mangled acuras or hummers? damn.
noone of the vehicles they've shown even look like that are worth 1 million, even though a few of them claim to have cost way more than that to build.
and some of them can't even go 10 feet without failing.
I should enter my RC car into the mix..I think it'd get farther.
I'm concerned that the spin on this event from much of the news media is negative. It's starting to look like DARPA will end up with egg on their face if none of the vehicles do well.
What these writers forget is that the event was intentionally designed to be incredibly difficult. In earlier news releases, the idea was expressed that this would be something that would be run every year until a robot manages to win it. This is in the spirit of other super-difficult prize competitions, like the X-Prize or the ancient quest to develop a method to compute the geographic longitude of a ship.
It's too bad that an inventive, flexible and interesting approach by DARPA is being spun as a failure just because the first tries haven't been all that successful. I'm really hoping that no teams win and that DARPA does run it again next year, because by then we'll have many more good contestants. This year's entries will have gotten the basic bugs out of their systems and be genuinely ready to tackle the course; and there will be a few new entrants as well, finishing up at the last minute and just hoping that they have something that will run. Each year will see improvement. To me that would be far more interesting and enlightening than a one shot deal.
Let's hop in the WAY BACK machine, and put a different spin on this...
Okay, besides the endless references to Terminator I could make, this really sucks. So, we have high-school kids doing weapons research free of charge for the DOD now?
I sincerely wish that people would put more ethical concerns regarding science in the right place. While people are bemoaning the evils of stem cell research, we're happily spending money on this sort of thing.
The happy-go-lucky attitude of the article, the competition, and not to mention slashdot is a little disturbing as well. Heyhey! That's right kids, it's time for the Darpa Competition! Just build us a network that can connect computers to other computers, and we'll take care of making a weapon out of it. It's science-fun, just like Mr. Wizard! Even Dad's helping out!
This isn't just "neat" stuff - this is stuff that has an impact in the real world, and I suggest that those people involved consider what sorts of contributions they're making. Personally, I would appreciate them not building network of powerful computers for the DOD.
3. The participating teams are not required to develop an Emergency-Stop system. DARPA will provide and operate the E-stop for all teams.
I like that rule, personally. Here's a quick translation.
3. Your vehicle is not required to have an Emergency-Stop system. We have tanks which will provide and operate the E-stop at all times. Hope that allieviates your concerns!!!111
The teams that have been allowed in have shown that their vehicles can handle most of the obstacles. And those teams that have completed the QID have over a million dollar budgets. Those teams without the the exorbiant amount of cash had to use inovative means to solve the solution of AI controlled vehicles. We should be rooting for the underdogs not big red. Because the inovative solution, not the brute strength solutions are alqays better. Teams like Axion Racing who have less than a million dollar budget have made incredible strides. And they would have completed the QID, if they didn't encounter transmission problems. I'm hoping Axion racing blows big red out of the water.
From the look of things, the Ohio State Robot just decided that it could go right through something as tiny as a van - I think it had the right idea, they just stopped it before it could uttery crush the van.
Was there some kind of rule against destroying objects in your path instead of navigating around them?
Actually I am half serious as what happens to an automated supply convoy when the lead vehicle is destroyed by a mine? You'd hope the remaining vehichles could just push the thing out of the way and go on.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Personally I think it's beautiful. Perhaps too efficient for mere humans to navigate, but that doesn't make it bad. Can you think of a better way of interchanging between five two-way roads that takes as little time and space? (Yes, England could be blamed for having such archaic road layout that five roads could end up converging at all, but that's a different issue.) The fact that its officially called "The Magic Roundabout" suggests that the people who made it at least acknowledge its weirdness. :)
Yes, I'm sure it's not entirely simple to navigate from the ground, but at least it's a fractal and symmetric pattern. And if you need some time to think about it, you can just sit on the inner lane of any of the roundabouts.
Well no, the Grand Challenge has been talked about for close to two years now. Most of the basic rules were around then - any team could just have started building it in anticipation of the rule tweaks that happend when the contest 'officially started.'
:)
So the timing is a bit tight, but only if you found out about it late
Can you think of an environment where an autonomous vehicle would need to be on the ground before it could be mapped by a flying autonomous vehicle? As long as the US has space dominance, anything the DoD is paying for will have satellite photos before it sets down on the ground. And Mars is being carefully mapped as we speak...
It's just good design to divide an autonomous system into a seeing part and a moving part -- you can't see as well from the ground no matter how good your optics are.
You can't go Mars rover slow. According to this NYT article:
"To win the $1 million, a vehicle must complete the desert course, expected to be as long as 200 miles, in less than 10 hours."
200 miles in 10 hours equals a min speed of 20 MPH. If they cut the couse to 150 miles it will still require a min speed of 15MPH.
Will Stokes Album Shaper http://albumshaper.sf.net
All the 3l33t hax0rs can spell it w/out EE. Most of 'em probly don't even have an 'e' on the keyboard.
Most contracts work like this:
the more worrying aspect (for those of us who read the article... ;)) was that the preliminary tests were for "safety reasons"...
so the bots that weren't safe enough to enter the race can now enter...
although, this could be pretty cool when the bots go insane and start beating each other up...
and if you see me strut, remind me of what left this outlaw torn...
Dissapointing, but I suppose it's a good idea so one team with a good hunter-killer bot doesn't stop anyone else from winning!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The teams are competing by entering the qualifying runs. However, the Darpa and the teams would learn a lot more if they were allowed into the "big race." A one mile obstacle cources is a man-made tightly controlled and densly packed stretch of problems. A 150 mile stretch of land between Death Valley and Las Vegas is a much more natural laboratory, ripe with other foreseen and unforeseen problems. For example, vermin. Allowing the cars to run will provide much valuable data, even if it is to confirm for the first time that the testing track is a valid representation.
Furthermore, if Darpa wants to maximize the return from this venture, they want schools to invest more money into it. If a school invested 100k of precious resources into the robotics venture only to be sidelined before the big day, it would make it far less likely to commit the same or more resources the next year. A driving billboard is not going to draw in 100k dollars, especially if it didn't make it to the big race the previous year.
The goal of this competition is autonomous vehicle research. The rules setup around this competition are in support of that goal. DARPA would be a fool not to change the rules when they are not in support of that goal, and in this case disqualifying everybody does nothing towards the greater goal.
Don't get so stuck on the rules that you forget why they were created in the first place.
The ______ Agenda
They had to do something with the guys from the Comanche program.
The ______ Agenda
If I knew I was gonna lose the race, I'd have my bot detonate its internal EMP device.
NO one wins, how do they like them apples!
It's easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
still pissed we are always saving the world?
Haha. That's amusing. I think I'm going to start a company called WarPork Inc. That name really made me laugh.
Sig removed because it was obnoxious
It's not going to win, and they don't expect it to. It's a technology demonstration. I've met the people doing that project, and they have a coherent vision. They view the Grand Challenge as a beginning, not an end.
For those interested in seeing video from the qualifying trials... Some slow lumbering vehicles, (not to mention huge file size), but pretty cool nonetheless.
Damn! I knew I should have kept working on my Volkswagon bug with The Club based steering system and the Brick based throtle control.
... there was a regular roundabout at the same site before, which was the town's single most accident-prone intersection. The new one, amazingly, greatly reduced accidents. The locals seem to like it, although strangers do tend to be a bit confused the first time they encounter it. Now where did I put that link...
I got no problem with this. My 200 Battle Tanks just find their path and approach the enemy in a second. I just need to click.
Maybe your pathfinding is either too simple or trying to be too smart or you approach it from the wrong angle.
I'm still trying to figure out what people mean by 'social skills' here.
The BBC have also got a story about this. They say that the people in the co-running darpa vehicle will have a "kill switch" in case the robot starts to "run amok". What if the robot running amok kills them first?
Get the fuck off my lawn, you ingrates.
YHBT.
P.S. This post is valid XHTML, to the point that I can control.
It's people like you who have fucking ruined slashdot. You go around exposing the group think and the general shodiness of the moderation process. You and your ilk just have to point out that the Editors don't bother to read their own damn site, the posters don't read the articles, and the moderators don't bother to read the posts. You point out that Slashdot has a signal-to-noise ratio bigger than CmdrTaco's mom, and that no effort has been made to fix it.
And, now you're not even posting in fucking XHTML.
You fucking slashdot ruining asshole!
No, wait. Were you trolling me? Oh... nevermind. Carry on.
Slashdot is jumping the shark. I'm just driving the boat.
If we can find enough on-site people with cell phones and decent signals, we could run all-day live audio streaming coverage of the event on IT Conversations. If you're interested in listening or providing some of the commentary/coverage, let me know at doug@rds.com.
It's really amazing watching an automotive vehicle going havoc :) :)
Robot Vehicles Take To The Desert (videos on last page)
Obviously they're trying to do a preemptive strike on the journalists fearing bad publicity!
Still, it's a pity the motocross from the blue team couldn't start properly. But finally, they qualified as most of the other teams when DARPA lowered the terms of qualification.
There are more videos on DARPA's Grand Challenge Gallery
I wonder whether we can expect Number 5 (Short Circuit) to be on the next years list of competitors
The race begins at 6:30am PST. So far we don't have anyone to cover the start of the event, but if we do we'll be on the air that early. Check back here during the day for our live streaming schedule. If you're attending the event and would like to contribute via cell phone, send a message to doug@itconversations.com.
Thanks to Limelight Networks for use of their streaming audio content-delivery network.
I'm not sure where all this is coming from. Having been at the racetrack in question for two days watching the teams attempt to complete the QID, I can emphatically say that teams did in fact complete the course in question. During the first half of Wednesday, CalTech (BOB), Ohio State (TerraMax), and another team from California (not the high schoolers), managed to complete the course. In reference to the high schoolers, the car in question did not hit the wall the first two times out of the gate but made a wrong turn to the right towards the control tower whereupon it went into pause mode and was driven back to the gate. The stands were considerably far away, and the principal in question was about midway up the stands. Typical of most media to overblow a situation. Rewriting the rules or not the achievement is something to be noted. DARPA has it's own goals in mind, the Grand Challenge is only a end to that means.