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100-Year Domain Renewals?
Ryosen writes "I received an email this morning from Network Solutions. Seems they are offering their current customers the ability to renew their domain names for 100 years. Is this is a realistic investment considering most companies don't last 100 years? Given that the Internet is a recent phenomenom, is it realistic to expect it to be the same in 100 years? Will Verisign be around that long? Does this make sense?"
I can't imagine this is a worthwhile investment for the myriad of reasons the submitter. Stick with the 10 year renewl option.
Maybe they are better informed than us /.'ers and everything is going to change in the near future rendering your 100 year domain useless.
Synical, me? Naaaa.
Nice to be paid up front for a service you may well not end up providing.
For the users, it's pretty much equivalent to being able to buy your domain name for all time, with no risk of it somehow falling to a domain squatter because you failed to renew. If you've got the money to throw at that sort of peace of mind, then why not?
++ Say to Elrond "Hello.".
Elrond says "No.". Elrond gives you some lunch.
100 year registration is plain silly. Ten year ones currently are popular but really only to those who have very valuable names or dont want the hassle of re-registering names every year.
The idea of allowing a user to specify a date for renewals is best, for example April 1st could become the date all the domains for a company are renewed, rather than scattered dates throughout the year.
My Auction: Pan Tilt Moveable Ethernet Webcam, UK!
...for Network Solutions' bottom line. ;-) But in all seriously, this is the kind of short sighted, pump up stock crap I would expect from the MBA set. Take in a huge amount of money up front at a severe discount and then lose the regular income over the long haul. The only way this would work for netsol is if they invested most every dime of it in long term investments and were really conservative with it. The reality is, there will be a peny or two higher dividend this quarter.
Who are you? The new #2 Who is #1? You are #617565. I am not a number, I am a free man! Muhahaha.
It looks to me like they are out of decent ideas to generate revenue and also want to give the impression that this service somehow is going to be around for that time period.
Face it, the current system will not last through leaps and bounds of technology that are coming. We are still in the stone age compared to what is ahead.
It would be better to take that money and buy ten years and invest the rest so it is actually doing something useful for you.
Best,
BJ
the thing is, if you're a company like MS or IBM, spending $1000 on a domain is worth the tme it would otherwise take to get it renewed every 10 years. You don't know the paperwork, the invoicing, the bills, the accounts, the 'why do we need this domain' questions... buy it once for $1k, forget about it.
and, as far as Network Solutions is concerned, they get the full money, even if the client does go bust! Its win-win all round.
The submitter makes valid points. On the other hand, for a large company, we're really talking about very little money here and the internal administrative costs of dealing with a renewal are probably fairly significant. So , for a Ford or GM or whatever, it may well make sense to pay the few thousand dollars for their various primary domains and then not have to worry about it.
I really don't think that would be useful. Not only will you be dead in 100 years, but the company issueing these names may not be. But, I guess its up to you, at least you wouldnt have to worry about someone trying to steal it.
I don't have time to comment my code, the program is late already.
For some people, heck for most, money can buy you conveniences.. This is just an additional service offered by them for a nice round number of years. They're just promising to take care of the hassle of domain renewal. At the end of the day, 10 year or 100 year renewal makes little difference. The person/organization which is organized won't need ANY renewal services, while others may opt for this service.
Some people pay money to buy tax software, while others hire an accountant and yet others do their taxes by themselves. It's the degree of customization and service which differs. Isn't that all there is to it ?
I'm not sure if the internet as we know it will exist in a 100 years, but then, people were arguing that snail mail would be extinct and there would be paperless offices throughout the planet. That hasn't happened yet. Let those who want this service spend some additional cash and buy themselves peace of mind, if they have the cash to spare and wish to do so.. Simple.
If network solutions dies, where do those ownerships go? That's a critical question, and one that this article is really asking. Suppose Microsoft steps in and buys the outstanding interest in Network Solutions... the results could be really disastrous. On the other hand, the government could step in and regulate ownership of domain names, and then it would be like getting a business license or something like that. One last thing - it's spelled PHENOMENON.
stuff |
Just before the Nationalists fled mainland china to Taiwan, they pre-charged everyone something like 50-years worth of taxes.
Let's just say that for everybody that paid, it wasn't a very good investment.
(That said, it's not that people had a choice in the matter or anything)
My life in the land of the rising sun.
You have godaddy.com which is alot cheaper. Others maybe cheaper...
:)
With godaddy, you can subscribe for a few years, I know at least 6 years in advance. I can't remember if it's more.
With the money you tie up, you can invest, use the investment earnings to pay for more years or hosting. Or even better yet, free beer for your friends.
I'm not affiliated with godaddy, they're just my domain name registrar.
Money cannot buy happiness, but can buy something soo darn close, that you can't really tell the difference
I thought about registering iamanidiot.com, but found it is already registered to network solutions. Oh well should have seen that coming.
A Fatal OE Exception has occurred, Sig will now reboot.
your one of those small scam campanies who change their name every year?
Or, in the immortal words of P.T. Barnum: " A sucker is born every minute ".
The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
Another interesting thing to consider -- as a recent snap names customer, (for a domain I feel I have the right to but don't own and dont want to pay ICANN $1000 to arbitrate) this would really negate the value of snapnames. In fact if the ower of the domain I want were to purchase 100 years I would certainly want my money back from snapnames.
meep
While the company is not one most geeks would trust I do admire this move.
Other registrars are complaining about the control and lack of innovation by ICANN yet Verisign is finding ways to intruduce new products.
If nobody buys this service then it is a failed experiment but I suspect they will do a slow but steady business selling these virtually unlimited domains. I know many companies that went out and registered their domains with the longest expiration possible at the time. If a 100 year registration was available I'm sure at least one would have done it.
Of course in 100 years from now and your company has moved 6 times, phone numbers have been extended many times, email addresses in the form used now don't even exist anymore so all the contact info on your record is completely stale. Is someone going to remember to renew? Will the renewal notices ever have a hope of arriving?
For those of us with Family names as domain names, holding that domain name for 100 years.. while debatably evil.. does become a viable use. It can be passed on from generation to generation. A legacy kinda thing.
"If you are falling off of a mountain, You may as well try to fly." -- Sheridans Father
This does not even come near the truth. If one dollar that you're paying now is used in a hundred years, you would actually have $131 when taking interest into account (assuming 5% each year).
What a loss!
In 1759 Arthur Guinness, rather speculatively, took over a deserted brewery at Dublin's St James's Gate, moreover he leased it for 9,000 years at a rent of 45 per annum - obviously intending on staying awhile.
Source:
I guess he made a great deal don't you?
I only read slash. for the articles...
VeriSign is selling the functional equivalent of a lifetime registration.
You know, like US copyright law.
Sure, it's not for every domain, but $1000 for 100 years of not having to rely on the kindness of others (who may even hate you) because the boneheads in your internet services division let your company's registration lapse is dirt cheap. It probably won't sell like hotcakes, but jalapeno poppers isn't out of the question. Speaking corporately, it's a lot cheaper than lawyers and bribes you'd need to fund to win your lost domain back.
"Lawyers are for sucks."
- Doug McKenzie
If you buy a domain for cheap, build up a decent web site (profitable would help), your 100-year lease on your domain becomes one hell of an asset.
Take the property market in the UK, for example. In London, most properties are "lease-holds", which means even though they're owned by private entities, when the lease-hold runs out (about 100 years), the property is given back to the Queen (so people can't just buy up all the expensive real-estate, and keep it). Most people use a long lease-hold as a selling point to buying their house. It guarantees you the house for as long as the lease-hold. It's the same with domains. You can't just look at the obvious financial aspects, but see how it pans out over time. A guarantee is sometimes worth more than the product itself.
www.microsoft.com isn't very useful if it's only yours for 2 minutes. A 100-year lease, however, would be worth billions.
And thus Cain rose up and slew Abel for their father had given Abel his birthright, the domain name of Abraham.Com, and witheld FTP rights from Cain.
And God said unto Cain, 'Why aren't thou using the latest kernel as they brother?'..............
Don't park drunk, accidents cause people.
I don't think the problem is whether or not my company will last 100 years (or, for that matter, whether I will last for 100 years). I would ask whether Network Solutions would last for 100 years.
The max term of a domain name lease is 10 years. Network solutions provide this 100 year lease by automatically adding an extra year to your lease on a yearly basis. If Network Solutions suddenly disappear, then your lease it left at 10 years, and you loose the other 90 years that you paid for.
T.
in one century I do not think my corporate maintenance procedures created today will be available / archived
in one century I do not expect to be working any more, so procedures & knowlegde will be lost
in one century I do not expect to be able to find my Verising login/password neither my bill to renew my corporate domain name for another century
when you do not regularly work with nor do you maintain something it disapears from your thoughs.
In one century many corporations (if they live that long) will just forget to renew.
What happens if they do not renew in 100 years ? Do they disapear from the internet ? What can Verisign tell us ? Noone at verisign will be there in one century. There is really no engagment from a corp that will probably not be there in one century.
Besides, would you dare give your provider the responsability of calling you in one century to remind you you must pay ?
I would not dare that.
That total nonsense.
moreover, who can say if domain names will not be free in 30 years ? Therefore you would have paid 70 years more, will Verisign give you change ?
If that's serious news, it's probably more some kind of advertisement from Verisign than a real product. It means "we are confident we will be there in 100 years, you can trust us to register for any length of time".
Sorry mister VS I do not trust you.
The world belongs to those who get up early. - I'm far from being the king of Earth then
Here is an article on the event.
In the United States, long-term structural businesses leases -- typically for an office or shop in any structure from a one-story to a skyscraper -- top out at 99 years, oftentimes because of state law. For instance, Alabama limits leases to a maximum of 99 years. So the 100 year domain name extension is in line with that rule-of-thumb.
You have to keep in mind that even at a paltry 6% return rate, the value of money doubles every 12 years - or about 8 times by the time 100 years rolls around. That's why these company's love these long-term domain renewal options - even if they charge you one half of what you'd pay over 100 years, they'll still, in the long haul, get 4 times as many real dollars out of you.
In business, it's always better to get money sooner over later. 100 years early isn't a "trick", it's almost theft.
paintball
Ladies and gentlemen this is Chewbacca. Chewbacca is a Wookiee from the planet Kashyyyk, but Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now think about that. That does not make sense. Why would a Wookiee, an eight foot tall Wookiee want to live on Endor with a bunch of two foot tall Ewoks? That does not make sense!
Rocket science is easy. Neurosurgery, now *that's* difficult.
So why not offer 20, 50, or 100 years at $12/year? I'm sure MANY businesses will leap at this, since it's the equivalent of guaranteed online trademark protection for your single most valuable asset, your domain name and online identity.
Dude, where's my packet?
Levi and Coca-Cola have been around longer than 100 years just to name a few.
"There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death." Proverbs 16:25 (NKJV)
I think MS will buy this service. Some years ago the forgot to pay a domain affected to hotmail and produce an outage. It was "fixed" by a linux user who paid the domain. Isn't it ironic?
(btw, he was compesated by Ms and he resold his check at ebay).
DNA in your Linux: DNALinux
.. answer this
I've seen a few comments targeted against MBA's in a few weeks and the one I saw today just was too much BS.
The argument that this is a stupid "gain money quickly move" doens't stand.
Well some people obviously have neve heard of NPV, or Net present Value of money.
Net present value gives you the value today of a series of cash flows to happen in the future.
The formula is as follows:
NPV = SUM(Cash Flow *(1+i)^-n) | Where n ranges from 1 to 99 in our case.
i is the opportunity rate. In a company money typically has a greater return value than the money market. IE you would expect money invested in a company to be more profitable than on the money market.
This means that if the money market rate is 5% than you would expect a higher internal return to compensate your risk (risk premium principle). Thus the internal rate of return of a company would be market rate+risk premium.
So the IRR could be 10% in a company.
Let's just imagine these guys at NetSol are a bunch of losers and will only offer the market return rate, or will simply put the money in government bonds at 4% (constant over 100 years for simplicity skaes).
Let's say also that the cost of a web name renewal will be $10 per year for the next 100 years (it's more likely to be more as the inflation cathces in, but heck let's keep it simple).
Even with these very pessimistic variables, the NPV of these cash flows is $306!!! Tha's a $700 profit for the Netsol guys.
So please, don't say they are making a stupid move doing this as you have no idea what you are talking about. This is a very profitable operation.
It is very likely to be a success as people will think " hey 100 years * 10 dollars = $1000. So I am not getting ditched and it is peace of mind. Let's take it"
BTW, if the NPV is $1000, than the discount rate is only 0.12%. Impossible.
Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity
This is obviously aimed at companies. I'm sure IBM, GM, Ford, Microsoft, etc. have no intentions of going anywhere and $1000-$3000 for 100 years of domain registration comes out of petty cash for them.
So when I read about the 100 year domain thing, I thought, "that would be pretty great." Just pay a relatively small amount of money up front, and you're set for life.
But then I realized that there's a pretty big anti-social aspect to allowing 100 year domains. It may not be totally fair that the dotcom domain name ownership thing was a first-come, first take lottery. But we're stuck with it, and, fortunately, nobody owns a name forever -- they have to reregister each year or two or ten. If you can't make a go of flowerpots.com, then it won't be long until it goes back into the pool of unclaimed domains for somebody else to take. Well, that's sort of true anyway. I know at least one company has arrangements with a registrar where expired names fall directly into their hands.
But anyway, my point is that there ought to be some mechanism where the scarcest property in cyberspace, dotcom names, falls back into the hands of the public if they are not being put to full use. And it's not in the public interest to allow 100-year domain names. All sorts of people will register all sorts of useful domain names, fail at making them profitable, and give up on the domain name. However, like neglected inner city property, the domain name will stay in their possession for a friggin century, and deprive the Internet community of using it for any value.
I'm generally "Interesting," "Insightful," and even "Funny" here. What the hell happens to me at parties?
Yeah, but it's like buying a house with a hundred-year lease. You might only plan to live in it for twenty years, but when you come to sell it, the depreciation in value from a hundred-year lease to an eighty-year lease is far less than that from a thirty-year lease to a ten-year lease. So, if you're buying a resaleable domain name, say www.shopping.com or www.computer.com or whatever, then yeah, I'd say a hundred-year contract would be worth it. It's the closest you can get to owning a particular domain outright, forever.
Having said that, I can't imagine that people will access web sites in fifty years (if there's even anything that still exists that's remotely analagous to a website by then) by typing text into an address bar. I don't know what they'll be doing instead, but I get the feeling that owning a cool domain name will be about as valuable as having the rights to a particularly catchy morse code callsign would be now.
evil math within Nature's Cubic Creation!
Take good care of this DNS Zone, it's been in the family for generations.
You would think that buying a domain name for a century would score you a better price break than that. For the 100 year registration, NSI charges $9.99 a year while GoDaddy.com and other companies charge $7.99 a year for single-year registrations.
In addition to that, GoDaddy includes several services for free (domain forwarding, email forwarding) that NSI charges extra for.
The truth doesn't care what I think.
For some companies it's worth the $1000 to register their domain for 100 years so they don't need to have someone worry about it. Granted, it takes 5 minutes to renew your domain, but if they save some money on top of that, it's totally worth it. (Not to mention $1000 is nothing to most companies)
Having said that, I can't imagine that people will access web sites in fifty years (if there's even anything that still exists that's remotely analagous to a website by then) by typing text into an address bar.
Well, in all likelihood, they'll be too busy trying to survive day by day, while keeping on the run from the zombie horde that wants to eat their flesh.
Man, this documentary really freaked me out.
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
By all accounts, this planet we're living on may not even survive 100 years, at least not the current lifeforms that inhabit it...
Umm... Hudson's Bay Company was founded in 1670. That makes it more than twice as old as Canada. In fact, it's older than the United States, the French Republic and (almost) every democracy currently in existence.
I suspect, however, that this is the exception that proves the rule. The only company still in existence from the original Dow Jones is GE. Everything else has been broken up or bought out.
When you have nothing left to burn you must set yourself on fire
You should print this comment out, put it in a shoebox somewhere (or a time capsule!) and open it up in 50 years. You'll probably have a good laugh. I'm not sure exactly what part of this will be funny in fifty years, but more than likely it'll somehow be funny. ;)
Every large company has an asset management department. Their job is to make sure that stuff like this dosn't fall under the cracks. There isn't one single person who is charged with making sure that the domain name is renewed, there is a friggin department charged with making sure that company assets are appropriately inventoried and maintained. Any large company should list their asset management group or their purchasing department as the billing contacts for domain names.
I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
Even if you get the 100-year renewel, Verisign could still give it away. They've got a history of not properly authenticating transfer requests, so you're not really buying any piece of mind.
HIV Crosses Species Barrier... into Muppets
Every post about DNS has someone saying we need to make DNS more complex, more resource-intensive, and more prone to problems. I don't get it. DNS works great.
This is obviously aimed at companies. I'm sure IBM, GM, Ford, Microsoft, etc. have no intentions of going anywhere and $1000-$3000 for 100 years of domain registration comes out of petty cash for them.
And it's good insurance; some bureaucrat forgets to mail an annual $10 checque, and a squatter grabs www.microsoft.com for the next century...
I'll give you half off the already incredibly low low price of $9.99/yr when you renew for a million years! That's right, only $4.99 per year for a million-year renewal*! Think of the convenience! No more tiresome renewal reminders -- for a million years!
* All sales final. Domain names not transferrable.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt