Slashdot Mirror
The Power of Persuasion
The book is quite balanced in its approach and unusual in that it looks at the art of persuasion through the lens of psychological field research. Levine doesn't merely muse about the vagaries of the mind; he gets out there and investigates it. He takes a job selling knives from a "multi-level marketing" company. He interviews former car salesmen, entrepreneurs, and marketing directors. His students conduct experimental bake sales.
The Power of Persuasion is at its most interesting when it shows how human behavior frequently travels outside the lines of economic theory. Chapter 6, "The Hot Button," details the situations in which we're likely to do something irrational, like buy the most expensive of four very similar-looking toasters, because a decision-making shortcut in our brain has been tripped (in this case, we equate higher price with higher quality despite there being little evidence for that).
The Power of Persuasion covers a certain amount of ground that has already been covered by such books as Robert Steiner's Don't Get Taken and Gerald Zaltman's How Customers Think. What I liked about this particular book's approach is that it takes a position between the two previously mentioned: for the most part it neither condemns the act of persuasion nor celebrates it. Levine is usually content simply to observe how persuasion is done and occasionally marvel at the way, say, a door-to-door salesman often has greater insight into the human brain than a psychologist.
Levine's writing style is fairly consistent throughout the book. In each chapter, he takes a particular theme or area of the art of persuasion and breaks it down to show what psychological and cultural forces are at work. He does this through well-reasoned arguments interspersed with amusing anecdotes, factoids, and citations of interesting studies and statistics.
For example, in the first chapter, "The Illusion of Invulnerability," he uses the metaphor of Garrison Keillor's fictional Lake Wobegon, where all the children are above-average, to describe how people consistently underestimate the extent to which they are personally influenced by advertising and the likelihood that they would fall for deceptive claims and scams. He punctuates this with a story of how he was preparing a university course on the use of mind control in social psychology and became so wrapped up in his thoughts about totalitarian governments and secret police that a man claiming to be a chimney sweep was able to hoodwink him out of $250. After this, he said, he realized that "it's the people we're unprepared for who present the greatest threat. The fast-talking salesman puts us on alert. But the nice guys, the friendly thieves who sell beneath the threshold of our awareness, put us at their mercy."
The following chapters deal with other facets of persuasion, including:
- The illusion of authority, i.e. "I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TV."
- The use of generosity or kindness to create a sense of obligation.
- Contrasting what you're selling with something very similar or very different to create a "false dilemma" in the buyer.
- Moving from "Yes, I'll look at your brochure" to "Yes, I'll sign over my life savings to you" through a series of "gradually escalating commitments."
- One of my favorite chapters, and one that I identified with personally, is "$2 + $2 = $5," which takes a look at "The Ten Rules of Framing." Just like the lottery is "a tax on people who are bad at math," the rules of framing take advantage of the way we perceive numbers emotionally to subtly influence us toward decisions that don't necessarily make logical or financial sense.
Rule #1, for example, is "Separate Gains." Levine cites studies showing that people would prefer to win a $50 prize and a $25 prize rather than a single $75 prize. "This is because we respond less to the cumulative total of the gains than the fact that it is a gain," says Levine. "Every gain brings pleasure." This is why you always see Sports Illustrated offering you a "free" book, video, or football helmet mug, even though most of us would be better off if they would forget the video and just lower their subscription price. "The company wants you to file the gift in your unexpected windfall account," Levine writes, "where its perceived value is psychologically inflated, rather than mentally bunching it together with the other products into one big purchase."
In fact, I found a number of "hey, someone else wonders about that too" topics in The Power of Persuasion, such as the idea of the JND, or Just Noticeable Difference. This is the idea that you can quantify how much something can be changed before people notice that it has done so.If our product costs $5.49, and we raise the price to $5.59, will customers care? What about $5.99? Levine looks at how the JND is different at different price points and in different circumstances.
There are a few problems with the book:
- It includes some minor factual errors, such as the paragraphs in which Levine discusses the ad campaign that introduced "Infinity," which he describes as Toyota's luxury car brand. (I assume he means Infiniti, which is actually Nissan's luxury marque).
- The penultimate chapter is entirely devoted to an analysis of Jim Jones and the cult of Jonestown, whose members committed mass suicide in 1978. The analysis is interesting, and someone who hasn't studied Jonestown will find a good introduction here, but I wasn't convinced it deserved a chapter to itself. Levine's rationale appears to be that Jonestown represents the logical extreme, the "dark end of the dark side of persuasion," and there but for the grace of God go we, etc.
- The last chapter, "The Art of Resistance," turns toward the advocacy that I was so relieved not to find in the rest of the book. It contains advice on "asking disconfirming questions," avoiding groupthink, and being sure to practice "persuasion with integrity." This advice is very intelligent and well-founded, but most Slashdot readers will probably find themselves being told things they already know.
I would strongly recommend The Power of Persuasion to anyone whose job involves selling, who has ever wondered why in the world they bought that sweater/car/time-share, who lives in a capitalist economy, or who is just looking to fill a few hours with a fascinating book. It's an insightful, scientific look at a force that permeates the existence of anyone who has to interact with other people but that we rarely take the time to examine.
Besides being a cracking good read, it's fully footnoted, indexed, and so stuffed with information as to make a worthy addition to anyone's reference library. The next time you wonder what possessed you to pay $50 for a medallion commemorating the series finale of Friends, you'll know where to turn.
You can purchase The Power of Persuasion: How We're Bought and Sold from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.
This is not the book you want to read.
It is no longer uncommon to be uncommon.
Yes, we're all individuals! ...I'm not.
The Kai's Semi-Updated Website Thingy
Well, I'm sold.
There's an unclosed [em] tag in your story... please fix it!
(This post will look really stupid after it's fixed)
I often find that the best way to pursuade someone is to call them an insensitive clod, or a dolt, or something equally as curt and dimeaning for not seeing my point of view.
Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
Don't try and persuade me that my Friends medalion was less valuable than this book.....
Maybe I just have a sick mind, but I parsed the story title as "The Power of Perversion" I feel like a dirty old man now...
/* oops I accidentally made a comment, sorry */
"From television to telemarketing and from self-deception to suicide cults, Levine takes a hard look at all the ways we attempt to persuade each other [...]."
Hmmmm. I wonder where Slashdot moderation fits in that spectrum....
to persuade some one just scream at them.
Why isn't this #1 on the best seller list?
Then you need a "Persuadertron" from Bullfrog's circa 1993 game Syndicate :)
The real measure of how good this book is, I think, is whether or not the author persuaded you (the reader) to believe his points. ;)
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
"The Power of Persuasion".. you will buy this book..."
Trolling is a art,
As pointed out on the Howard Stern show this morning, tiny changes in speech can make a big difference in the perception of the audience, like between "friends" and "friend" (group vs. individual).
On that note, friend, I'd like to ask you to visit my artist interview. See? It works!
stuff |
This is the book you want to read.
These are not the droids you are looking for.
It is no longer uncommon to be uncommon.
Sting said it best already...
"Poets, preists, and politicians
Have words to thank for their positions."
Sometimes I doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion.
Why is this icon used on this story. Are they tryoing to persuade us that the author is a smart guy? I've certainly never seen a more misused icon on Slashdot, unless the irony is intended.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
I think physical persuasion is most effective in the end even if it's not moral or right...it is simply effective.
You will RTFA... You will RTFA...
I am Rudy Giuliani - Yes on 232 I am Rudy Giuliani - Yes on 232 I am Rudy Giuliani - Yes on 232
SAILING MISHAP
Have you read 48 Laws of Power, The Art of Seduction, or any NLP books by Bandler et al? These are interesting books on how we think, and how to utilize the autopilot behaviors to "persuade" others. Its a grey area, yes, but a fact of our lives.
Robert Greene (48 LOP) has an interesting point when he says that we're all aware of the enemy, but unaware of the motives of a "trusted" friend, who can be more dangerous !
A primo example of the "feeling of obligation" sales pitch that the author mentions is those vacation timeshare sales pitches that promise a free or discounted event ticket.
They're really common in Las Vegas and in the Orlando area. They have booths set up in hotels and in small buildings located in the parking lots of plazas in commercial districts.
They give you a nice little breakfast buffet at a nearby resort, and tell you that they'll only take 90 minutes of your time, and there's no obligation.
Four hours later you're signing one document after another, agreeing to pay thousands and thousands of dollars over the next ten years for something that's not worth jack squat, and then you go and get your stupid theme park tickets.
Stay away from those things, and if you do go to one, don't buy into it. You can buy them second-hand MUCH cheaper from someone else who got suckered. When they start trying to close the deal, you say, "Nope, not signing anything. Give me my discounted park passes now, please." If they hem and haw, and say that the deal they're offering is only good if you sign right there and then, you have to say, "Then I guess that's my loss. I'll take my discounted park passes now, please."
Don't let the mind control kick in.
And if you do sign up, you've got ten days to cancel, at least in Florida. But it's much easier to just not get suckered in the first place.
You are in error. No-one is screaming. Thank you for your cooperation.
"Virus of the Mind".
See http://www.memecentral.com/votm.htm.
As a sidenote, there is also thhis nice (e)mail chain-letter debunking page:
http://www.memecentral.com/antidote.htm
IMHO, the everything's-a-meme-thought is a bit exaggerated today, but it is still interesting.
You will pay the $699 licensing fee, you cock-smoking teabaggers.
I spent all my money on an icon of a diamond ring for a person i've never met on a website.
Price runner shows that Amazon are the cheapest but they are still ut of favour for aggressive and stupid patent practice, so pick another supplier from the list
blog.sam.liddicott.com
If you come up to me and say "My, what a nice pair of shoes you're wearing!"
I'll think:
You want to sell me something..
You want money for nothing..
You want someting
I think it's worse for us Americans because everyone is trying to sell us something!
I once took a class from an Asian Chi Gong master. During his lesson he said that he had videos on sale. All of us just groaned under our breath. To make a long story short, he was sincere and wanted us to buy the videos to remember his lessons. Nothing else! He was the exception.
I'm still jaded and I haven't been wrong since. We're continually being bombarded to spend our precious income on shit in America. Companies are demanding that we buy their crap in order for us to be happy and to keep "our" economy working. My friends, who really care about me (I think), say supportive things, I just think they want something! I thought it was just me, but I'm beginning to think that it's a side-effect of living in America. Watch out, anyone who says nice things to you wants to sell you something!
Makes me want to shave the rest of my hair off, move to Thailand, and become a Buddhist Monk!
The Psychology of Influence
Robert b Cialdini
I would love to read an equally well researched analysis, with concrete examples, of how politicians use these same sales techniques -- on the one hand to pimp themselves to the money people, and on the other to convince the rest of us that democracy is still real.
Do what is patriotic and good for your country by not reading Slashdot! Help out your homeland to keep us safe from the axis of evil by putting all of your code under evil, propriatary licenses that require the buyer to give up their firstborn son.
The Cheese Stands Alone.
Or your supporting terrorism.
...belong in apple.slashdot.org?
I'm not normally an irrational zealous dickhead, but I figure "When in Rome..."
Great, but will it work on my wife? Can I make her easy to persuade, and yet hard to persuade both at the same time :-/
Wow, I wonder if good 'ole Darl submitted this or what? I'm sure it's mandatory reading over at SCO.
Mod +5 Drunk
One of the canonical books on the subject which I read and greatly enjoyed is "Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion" by Dr. Robert Cialdini -- it breaks down (scientifically) six major principles of influence.
It's pretty cool -- after reading it you'll be able to read into (or see through) a lot of marketing/sales techniques that you see out in the real world (and won't be fooled by them -- or conversely, can use them for your own business or personal goals.)
Amazon link (not a referrer link)
Check it out.. the book rocks.
-fren
"Where are we going, and why am I in this handbasket?"
But seriously, if you want that question answered, don't look in this book. Instead check out doubleyourdating.com and sign up for the free newsletter. Just reading the free content that comes through a couple times a week can be very eye-opening, especially in "the geek set" the members of which are probably amongst the most likely to fail over things like being too nice. Check it out, you have nothing to lose other than time spent reading.
Kevin Nealon was way ahead of the author (your place or mine?). I mean, he was doing that persuasive thing (watch Saturday Night Live) for years, and I'm sure he (Kevin Nealon is God) didn't have to read a book to figure it out.
How come Slashdot can't post a book review without forgetting the closing italics tag and messing up all the stories below it on the front page?
I saw that... that was dang crazy.
/. regularly and realizes that all the nerds use linux. The next thing the kid does is he gets his older, non-nerd, but better at computers (than a 12 year old) to install linux on their family PC... the kid is now officially a nerd.
offtopic from your post but i don't want to post 2 comments..... i read the reviewed book, and there was an interesting section on how people who want to be classified as something, they will do whatever other people who are classified as that do.
now just as an example (this was actually an example in the book)... a 12 year old kid thinks he's good at computers, so he considers himself a nerd. He visits
There was another section on how people like to stand out... which can be compared to the people here on slashdot who use windows and love microsoft products. The same can be said to the people who use linux and talk about it outside of slashdot (like their communities, where everyone else uses windows server stuff)
sorry that was just a long random rant and my own personal review of the book... mod me down
Perhaps in some cases a student may learn better from a good teacher than a good doer, but at least with the doer, the student can always learn from example.
:)
Plus, "persuasion" might even be considered a form of teaching, so the best doer may in fact be the best teacher.
All in all, the AC has a good point. Ultimately, though, the fact that it isn't a #1 best seller might be more illustrative of the limits of the power of persuasion and its haphazard effects than of the author's abilities.
Don't get taken every time
He also speaks at seminars sponsered by Credit Unions , (Anyone can join one these days) which is where I met him.. got my (secondhand) book autographed too.
The people who sell you stuff are trained by professionals.
* They are NOT YOUR FREINDS!*
For the sake of your bank account and your sanity, it's worthwhile to educate yourself about the methods that are used, and how to circumvent them.
Reading AlexisKai's review, the book sounds remarkably similar to "Influence: Science and Practice" by Robert Cialdini who, like Levine, is a social psychologist (at Arizona State University), took a job (as a car salesman) to research the various methods of persuasion, uses examples where he himself has been fooled (he calls himself a patsy), and categorises the various "weapons of influence" under concepts such as "reciprocation", "commitment and consistency", and "social proof". It's a very persuasive read ;-)
The genre seems to be getting a bit bloated, though, with the review itself mentioning yet another two recent books covering the same ground--Robert Steiner's "Don't Get Taken" and Gerald Zaltman's "How Customers Think". There must be some great thinker who came before these guys to pioneer the field. I thought of Charles Mackay's classic "Extraordinary Popular Delusions & the Madness of Crowds", but it deals mainly with people as a herd (only one aspect of persuasion/influence, falling mainly under the umbrella of Cialdini's "social proof").
Is there a seminal work in the field of persuation/influence covering all the bases, or is this really just a recent thing?
on a psychology (that's not really science) article.
It's available online at www.mbusa.com
This book could tell us why so many people open email attachments?
I can't stand sales pitches.
It's gotten to where I find something cynical to say about every TV commercial I watch, even the story lines in TV shows. People have told me how cynical I am, but I feel like I have to fight against this seething mass of industrial psychology that's shoved onto us at every opportunity.
Why don't they teach this stuff in school, so we can be educated enough to make it go away?
I'm wondering if this kind of despair hits anyone else here on slashdot. Does being a code geek create a greater sense of distance between ourselves and the external influences on our lives, so that it bothers us that much more when we're fed a sales pitch?
The Ten-Second Review...
I'm a slow reader, you insensitive clod!
I've been looking forward to this all year! Free Karma for anyone who asks! So come one come all, mod me up!
;)
(and no +1 funny's
"No "The Cheat" can resist my Powers of Persuasion."
StrongBad
Back in the sheltered days of college, I attended one of those informational meetings for selling encyclopedias door-to-door during the summer. In order to get offered a position, you had to show high drive, excitement, and a little naivite. I considered my actually getting an offer to be the sign that they were just scamming the newbies.
To-do List: Receive telemarketing call during a tornado warning. Check.
"Pull" information is fine. If I want something, I'll use Google to find it. But I don't want people pushing stuff in my face. Is that too much to ask?
Tesco have the book at a fair price, UKP 13.88
blog.sam.liddicott.com
As I read this, I wonder if anything in here is useful for scoring chicks. Cuz then I'll buy it damn I just bought it.
Goddamit... I hate telling this story because it shows how weak I was...
I was on a cheap trip to Vegas with my Fiancee... Cheap meaning we drove there, stayed in $30/night hotel room, and $10 in nickle poker machines. While walking around we got stopped and offered free tickets if we listened to their talk about time-shares. We say okay because free stuff on a cheap trip cannot be refused. Long story short... 3 hours of talking and I was ready to put $2k down on a timeshare... ofcourse I only had $200 in my bank account (ie. the cheap trip). Me and my s/o fought it out... he even left so I could pursuade her and even kept trying to boost my male ego.
Thank god for the level headed, no-bullshit woman I married. She almost left me after all the shit I gave her during all that presentation. Ofcourse she'll never let me forget... and so I still remember the horrible feeling I had afterward that I was manipulated.
Ohh the humanity....
--D3X
I just realized that this book is available in PDF format at the website of my school's library (U. of Alabama in Birmingham)
A student log-in is required, of course.
I hadn't even realized that my school carried e-books. Each individual page is a separate PDF, so dowloading it for offline viewing would be annoying.
Anyway, if my college has it, yours might have it too.
Do I get anything free with this book? Or does it cost just a few cents more than the book next to it?
THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS!!!
Me too! Especially if I can persuade them that their spelling is demeaning to the language; research has proven that insults open the door to buying behavior.
stupid git.
"Nothing was broken, and it's been fixed." -- Jon Carroll
Who needs the book when you've got a persuadertron?
-Turkey
Although I have not read this book, I have read one that sounds VERY similar (So similar I had to grab the book and double check they were different authors). The book is titled 'INFLUENCE: Science and Practice,' by Robert Cialdini. One of the most prominant ideas in his book is what he describes as the 'Click and Whirr' response, or the trigger of subconscious fixed action patterns. Cialdini identifies many of these common patterns, such as the equating of expensive merchandise with quality, and offers a variaty of suggestions to safeguard yourself from them. The author also describes many other complience techniques used by salesmen, scam artists, and marketers, such as consistancy and commitment, social proof, and scarcity. Definatly a must for those out there like me that have ever been duped into buying girlscout cookies they didnt want!
Then for only $99.90 (excl tax and shipping) you can have the following items:
- "Why you need this book" by Ivor Lesson 4U
- A copy of Ivor Lesson's personal photo album
- A copy of Sports Illustrated Swimsuit edition 1995
- Three blind mice
Stocks are limited, and we only accept credit cards, cash, gold bullion, PayPal, rare minerals and fresh human organs.
So hurry! Be the first on your block to get I. Lesson!!
(PRICES exclude handling and stocking fees and MAY BE REDUCED or increased arbitrariy for inflation or the current price of crude oil).
Go Bulldogs!
There's an element of groupthink in that idea too -- that if others are doing it, so should I. They don't wield the con-man kind caliber of persuasion this book seems to favor, but they play on the idea that you'll be smarter, more attractive and a better person if you buy their brand. People will build emotional affinity with a company vastly out of proportion with the usefulness of that company's products.
I think discerning readers who read both will get a better idea of one of the problems of our times: if we turn on, tune in and veg out, someone is going to try to take advantage.
I recently attended a get-rich scam revovling real-estate. (I wasn't interested but my wife wanted to check it out).
Man, those guys were slick! Almost every other sentence had the word "money" in it. After watching a series of testimonies by people who claimed to have made thousands of dollars in just days, the speaker conducted a pep rally to get everyone excited about how rich they were going to become. He gave helpful pointers on how to deal with all the extra money coming in, like, "after you make your first sale, reward yourself with a cruise...", etc, etc. It was really sad to watch, because the room was filled with people getting really pumped up and excited.
Needless to say, I wasn't able to stay the entire time, but I did a little research once I got home. According to a Washington Post article I found, the weekend Training Seminar they try to pull on these people was priced at $3000.
So just like the Big Tent Revival scam artists in times past collected large sum in exchange for divine promises, scam artists are still setting up camp with similar tactics to soak the poor and gullible.
I know this site doesn't go into as much depth as a book could, but it's a good start. I honestly think that this material should be the basis of a required course in high school, or at least interwoven into english and/or history courses. The widespread use of propaganda is perhaps the greatest threat to democracy today.
When someone tries to convince you of something they usually come at it with a million little assumptions in their head about what your arguments are going to be and what their counters are. The best way to totally de-rail someone trying to convince you of something is, to use their own assumptions against them. Destroy all the preconceptions they have and they'll be so confused that you're likely to gain the upper hand.
sales enders I've used:
"Don't you want to save money?"
"No, I'm not really concerned with my budget."
"Please vote for candidate X."
"I don't believe in voting."
"Everyone should vote!"
"Oh yeah, tell me why."
"Who makes the decisions you or your girlfriend?"
"I let her decide every single aspect of my life. I'm basically just a pathetic sycophant."
Try them out, at least it will spice things up a bit!
Was that supposed to be a challenge?
Or am I not up to the Slashdot reading level yet?
I've tried NLP (Ross Jeffries), double your dating, and U.S.S. (Undercover Sex Signals), and I've found U.S.S. to be the best of the bunch. And as far as I can tell, the only one that actually works. U.S.S. By Leil Lowndes is the only "how to date hot chicks" manual based on actual experiments in psychology. Though the others claim to be, I haven't found any evidence. The gist of U.S.S. is that there are certain signals a woman gives off when she is interested in a man. The goal of U.S.S. is to learn those signals and some other science of love, and you will never be rejected again. This is also the only one who's writer/creator also has a version for women, "How to make anyone fall in love with you". Though it's not completely woman centric, it's the closest. Here are the amazon links: U.S.S. How to Make Anyone Fall in Love with You I've tried "Double Your Dating" but I've found it to not be much better than most anything out there on dating. David DeAngelo seems to have tried to use the persuasion science of Cialdini, but as you get further into the material, you realize it's all about numbers. Though the numbers game does work, it really isn't a good self esteem builder. Especially for those most likely to be reading about dating on slashdot. If you want to see for yourself, check out doubleyourdating.com. The last on the list is the worst of the bunch. Speed Seduction based on NLP (neurolinguistic programming) by Ross Jeffries is the closest thing to a cult that I have ever been associated with. A friend of mine introduced me to Speed Seduction, and for about 3 years I tried everything I could to get it to "work", before I finally figured out it didn't. I saw many examples of when it didn't "work" and few examples of when it did, but I never could get myself out of that cult mindset. I didn't move beyond Speed Seduction until I read "Influence the Psychology of Persuasion" by Cialdini, and realized that NLP is all but worthless. If you want to learn about cults, Speed Seduction or any NLP training course is the way to go (beware the "You're just doing it wrong" trap). Otherwise, don't waste your money. Speed Seduction could be found at www.seduction.com To sum it up: Leil Lowndes = science David DeAngelo = wannabe science Ross Jeffries = Jim Jones
Advanced Anti Spy indicates...
"Special offer: $59.95 (If you decide to buy until Wednesday, March 31, 2004)."
If you view the source, you will see that the date is javascript: my_date()
First of all, Donald Duck is going to have a SCREAMING ORGASM tonight when Daisy Duck sucks him off.
Finally, I have a prediction that I am absolutely sure will be correct: This post will be modded down.
Neuro-Linguistic Programming is a mishmash of pseudoscientific dribble. It's great for those Tony Robbins followers or anyone else who needs someone else to build up their self esteem, but you can't get some girl to sleep with you just by pronouncing your words slightly differently.
Skeptic's Dictionary: NLP
The Daily Show (pre Jon Stewart) did a great segment on these guys - they even tried to pick up on the interviewer (Beth Littlefield?) "Stop - it's not working on me." "I mean it, you're creeping me out."
Surprisingly, the most informative books I read on persuasion, perceived value, behavior modification, etc. were while I was doing an English paper on the internal environment (historically) of mental hospitals. Have a look into 'token economies', specifically the experiments that have been performed in this area in terms of psychological 'marketing' strategies tested against patients. The correlation of these experiments' findings to the assertions, images, situations, etc. commonly used in modern marketing pitches is somewhat spooky.
Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
There is programming all over the place. It affects people on levels which are not even associated with advertising.
"Turn the other cheek"
"Forgive and Forget"
"The weak will inherit the Earth"
Sound familiar? These are nodules of effective societal control which were deliberately included in the standard hotel room Gideon which affect even those who claim to not be religious. It's one of the ways psychopathic CEO's are able to climb the ladder so effectively. Heck, Christ dying on the cross in his oh-so-dramatic "I'm so good I let the bad guys kill me" is a primo example of social control. Another is how fiercely your average Christian will defend both the reality of this event and its validity as a message. Propaganda doesn't have to come fresh from your television to still be an effective control measure!
Conversely, the whole 'Skeptical' Science-as-Religion trend over the past century has been another massive control measure. Stops people from looking at these kinds of stories without the accompanying automatic doubt/ridicule/I-feel-clever response. --At least until Upper Management is ready for the release of such technologies and 'realities'. And that's primo mind-control, baby!
Seen a chemtrail recently? Most people are reluctant to look up. Talked about Psychopaths in business and politics to your workmates recently? No? That ugly feeling which makes you want to change the subject is another little nugget of social engineering telling you to look away from one of the most prevailent problems in society; one which can only be solved through open discussion.
Books like the one reviewed are fine to a point, but they need to take the next step to be truly useful. Until then, they are almost part of the problem in that one can come away thinking they know how to defend themselves. Newsflash: Which brand of Cola you buy isn't the issue. There are thoughts of much greater importance to certain groups that you be thinking which have nothing to do with your preference in running shoe.
-FL
I'm still not persuaded to read this book, and I can't see any reason why I possibly should. It's not like I've fallen for the seductive promises of a colorful Microsoft commercial with a dude in a butterfly costume before.
On vit, on code et puis on meurt.
We equate higher price with higher quality despite there being little evidence for that).
Um, no. We equate lower price with cheapness, and there is much evidence of that.
Higher price is only a factor when the item is already "expensive". And then many factors are at play. When a software package costs more, it is assumed to have more features, because it is expensive. Not better quality, just more of an "enterprise" edition. It can also give social status, and the like. As for it being better quality, that is usually only when the other item is of the same brand, and in those cases it is usually true.
Have you read my journal today?
I recently had a meeting with someone who knew more about how to dominate meetings than about business.
We were selling software software through a reseller. The reseller dissolved, and the partner we knew took her client list to a startup being funded by a VC firm. As far as I can tell, the startup has 2 people: the entrepreneur and a "manager". The manager, Jeff, probably works for the VC firm as a roving manager.
We were lured to a meeting with the entrepreneur to "discuss future possibilities." The meeting time was changed at the last minute (we were already in the car) to the following day so that Jeff could be there.
We arrived at the meeting. The table seated 3 people per side, plus one person on each end. Each team had 3 people. If you want to work with people, sit on the sides so you are close. If you expect conflict, the ends are the power positions. Jeff already had his stuff at one end of the table, with the reseller next to him. So I took the other end, and my associates sat on either side of me.
The reseller greeted us, but Jeff did not appear for about 5 minutes. (Being late implies that everybody else should wait on you.) Then they announced that the entrepreneur would not be joining us.
They already had glasses of water, but my request for some was denied. That is just bad manners. Did Jeff think we would talk less if our mouths were dry? (Later, I left the room while Jeff was talking to have water brought for us.)
Jeff finally entered the room, and as he sat down, he suggested that "Why don't you move closer?" It was a good tactic to get me out of a power seat. (We did not move.)
Then he demanded the source code for the product we sold through the reseller. They wanted to cut us out, and could not support the program without the source. He was quite persuasive saying that he knew they had a right to it because of all his experience and analysis of the situation. I let my business manager debate with Jeff (which he said was fun but pointless), and Jeff never noticed he spent the entire meeting debating with a subordinate. Jeff offered a royalty on future sales, but my manager had Jeff admit they had little interest in selling software. Unfortunately for Jeff, ownership of copyright can only be transferred by written contract, and no such contract existed.
I had fun with Jeff. Even though I have been in the software business for over a decade, and own this company, I gave him the impression that I was the stereotypical unworldly programmer and acted like an egotistical brat. This caused Jeff to make a few mistakes. I did try to move the meeting back to the original purpose of building a partnership relationship, but Jeff dismissed the attempt. At one point, after I interrupted one of Jeff's attacks, he said he was thinking of offering me a job, but now he wouldn't. (If you have read my other posts, you know I would never consider a regular job, and I avoid working with people like Jeff.)
He kept trying to hire my technical assistant. The techie had worked for the reseller and knew the customer's infrastructure. We hired him when he left the reseller. I am uncertain why Jeff tried, since the techie did not talk much in the meeting, and does not have the source. I think Jeff was trying divide-and-conquer, but the techie had already met Jeff, and disliked him intensely.
Jeff "complimented" my business manager by suggesting he should go to college to become a lawyer because "he would be good at it." This happened as we were leaving, so I was able to contain the laughter until we were outside. My business manager has been working in this field since the 70s, and has held upper management positions at several large companies.
Jeff's fatal mistake was to threaten to have the customer's lawyer contact us. Later that week we received a nasty letter from this lawyer. I believe the letter was written by Jeff, since it contained several of the fallacies he used in the meeting. That letter opene
I spend my life entertaining my brain.
Based on the text you quoted, the site is not making admissions that it ignores requests for removal. Whether it does or not, the text you quoted does not state that. I'm not sure how you could possibly read that into "you may contact us... for personal attention" since "personal attention" and "ignore" are pretty much opposite. Maybe you just have an axe to grind with the site owner, some un-admitted personal agenda?
A less negative perspective, for the sake of argument, based strictly on the text of the site's terms that you quoted: Perhaps the site owner has had problems in the past with unsubscribes not working (and guess what, that hasn't exactly been a rare event on countless legitimate lists I've been on, at least as early as the early 90s and BITNET), and has had some people overreact to those problems after being hypersensitized by too much spam (i.e., spam hurts spammers, but as long as enough fools buy product, apparently they don't care). Thus, the site owner is saying something to the effect of "if you attempt to hurt me as a result of technical problems, you'll pay for it."
I have no idea whether unsubscribes work on this list, or are ignored, or anything else about this list. But posting a quote from the site's policies and stating that it says something it doesn't really say just isn't cool. Go fuck yourself, indeed.
It has to be said -- this is the best comment *ever* posted on Slashdot!!! The way it makes its points so beautifully -- it just gives me the shivers! And that last line is hilarious!
I'm still jaded and I haven't been wrong since.
What great irony! You really know how to write comments, I must say. I wish all /. posts were this interesting -- thanks for making my day!