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PowerBooks & iBooks Get Speed Bumped

Currawong writes "Apple has, as rumors predicted, speed bumped its line of portables. The PowerBooks now come in 1.33 and 1.5Ghz G4 versions, including either NVidia 5200's or Radeon 9700 video hardware. The iBooks can now be had at 1 or 1.2Ghz with Radeon 9200 video included. All can be purchased at the Apple Store. This complements nicely the recent speed and feature increases on the eMac range."

89 of 751 comments (clear)

  1. Good news! by protonman · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Good news, I've been looking at getting a notebook for some time now and my little research indicated a superior battery life on Apple notebooks.

    The prohibitive price is still a bottleneck for me though.

    --
    The man of knowledge must be able not only to love his enemies but also to hate his friends.
    1. Re:Good news! by capmilk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's a bit like buying a Ferrari: The first one is really costly, but resale value makes later models pretty affordable.

    2. Re:Good news! by millahtime · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "The prohibitive price is still a bottleneck for me though."

      Go price out a PC notebook with all the bells and whistles in an apple. then compare prices. The apple will be less expensive when it comes to bang for your buck.

    3. Re:Good news! by oscast · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's not entierly true...

      On a PC... you can buy less and therefore pay less but that doesn't make it cheaper... but rather... more configurable.

      I've done these comparisons several times... and in every instance, at WORST the Mac comes out even. Rarely does it come out more expensive. With regard to laptops... Apple's laptops alwaays come out less expensive.

    4. Re:Good news! by millahtime · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I have done the bang for your buck with comparisons and you get more with apple. You need to price them out as equal systems. Take a 15' powerpc and compare it to a top end speed PC laptop with dvd burner, dvd authoring software and all the other bells and whistles including bluetooth and the 54mbs wireless plus gigabit ethernet.

      You have to evaluate bang for your buck. Apple wins out there.

    5. Re:Good news! by JohnTheFisherman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Go price out a PC notebook with all the bells and whistles in an apple.

      No, go price out a PC notebook with all the bells and whistles that you want. What if you don't need firewire? Most people don't. What if you don't need wi-fi? What if you do need a serial port? A parallel port? USB adapters don't solve these issues all the time either.

      The only time it makes sense to stuff a PC full of all the specific bells and whistles that an Apple comes with is A) for someone who needs the exact feature set of a mac but insists on buying a PC anyways, or B) those silly price comparisons that Mac zealots do.

    6. Re:Good news! by The+Infamous+Grimace · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm typing this on a 1998 PowerBook (G3 300) with 10.3.2 installed with a little help from XPostFacto. And OS X has gotten faster with each successive release. Don't let the higher initial cost fool you; PowerBooks maintain their value for a long time. Check eBay and see how much my PB is going for these days; one sold the other day with specs similar to mine for ~$300. Not too bad 6 years later.

      And yes, I've said this before. No, I am not a karma whore. Yes, I want to change some perceptions regarding the Macintosh platform.

      (I should add that XPostFacto has broken a couple of things,

      (tig)

      --
      Ignorance and prejudice and fear
      Walk hand in hand
    7. Re:Good news! by Twirlip+of+the+Mists · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Dell: 533 MHz FSB
      Mac: 800 MHz FSB

      Dell: ATA/100
      Mac: SATA

      Dell: 100 Mbps Ethernet
      Mac: Gigabit Ethernet

      Also lacking in the Dell: ports for 802.11g and Bluetooth, FireWire 400 or 800, optical audio I/O ports, AGP 8X, and a capacity of 4 GB of RAM.

      You proved the poster's point: yes, you can build a PC that has fewer features and costs less than a Mac. But you can't find a PC that is feature-comparable to a Mac and yet costs significantly less.

      (The 1.6 GHz G5 is kind of a waste of money, anyway. It only has room for 4 GB of RAM as opposed to 8 GB in the other G5's, and it doesn't have PCI-X. The 1.8 GHz is a better value.)

      Your response here, based on the normal Slashdot way of doing things, should be something along the lines of, "Nobody needs FireWire anyway, 'cause USB is faster." Or something like that.

      --

      I write in my journal
    8. Re:Good news! by cosmo7 · · Score: 5, Funny

      You forgot to yell "you kids get off my lawn".

    9. Re:Good news! by wchin · · Score: 4, Informative
      Nobody NEEDS gigabit ethernet.

      Obviously to you, if you don't perceive a need for it, then nobody needs it.

      I don't know ANYONE who has a gigabit ethernet network.

      You don't get out much, do you? I know a number of people that have gigabit networks in their homes (including mine), much less at work. There are quite a few inexpensive gigabit ethernet switches on the market, including the NetGear GS108 (8 port) for $150 and the GS105 (5 port) for $80.

      With gigabit, I can do AFP or SMB transfers at over 50MB/sec which is a good 5x faster than a 100mb network to/from the network file server, and that is w/o jumbo packets.

      Even the slow ATA drive in laptop can push 20-30MB/sec, so network performance would benefit from gigabit over fast ethernet. Try pushing around some video clips and you'll appreciate the speed difference.

    10. Re:Good news! by System.out.println() · · Score: 3, Informative

      Psst.... should we tell him that Powerbooks [mine at least] measure brightness based on 16 rather than 10? Nahhh.....

      I do agree, though - I turn the brightess down a lot when I'm not plugged in; I've been sitting here about an hour on battery and I still have >65%.

    11. Re:Good news! by gabebear · · Score: 4, Informative
      what laptop is this at that price? The warranty matters a lot on laptops. If I were buying a Dell laptop I would probably get the Inspiron 8600 (The whole 8000 line has been great).

      The 8600 configured as you speced, except for a 9600Pro w/ SXGA+ screen, and integrated bluetooth is $2,654(they are running a free dvd-burner pro-mo so this will be a little higher after wed). Buying your second stick of 512mb at crucial brings the price down to $2,509

      A Powerbook specced similarly, but with a G4 1.5Ghz, a 9700 w/ SXGA+ screen, and a 5400rpm drive is $2,999.00. Buying the second stick at crucial brings the price down to $2,829

      The powerbook costs $320 more, pretty close. A sale in the other direction could make the powerbook cheaper.

      I want a portable laptop, the 12" powerbook is considerably cheaper than a inspirion 300m, it also has more options.

    12. Re:Good news! by Twirlip+of+the+Mists · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Could any (well, all) of those features not be compensated for with some of the $1,000+ one saves buying the PC?

      Sure. But in that case, you're not saving all of that money, are you? You're having to spend it to get what you want.

      As for the FSB, the PC has a faster CPU anyway, so the FSB isn't going to catch the Mac up.

      Uh... ;-)

      If things like 8X AGP are really worth $1,000 then buy the Mac. But I think it's a disservice to say Macs are a better value than PCs.

      When you buy a Mac, you generally get more stuff--more features, more software, the whole package--for the money. Therefore, by any objective measurement, the Mac is a better value, where value refers to amount of stuff obtained per dollar spent.

      --

      I write in my journal
    13. Re:Good news! by juiceCake · · Score: 5, Interesting

      "Mac users (me in particular) don't admit we're paying a huge premium for the Mac brand name because, in fact, we're not."

      That's great and of course not. The valuation of what one purchases is very much subjective to the party involved. To you, it's not a huge premium, to others it is. There is no right or wrong in this case.

      "Anyone who believes a bottom of the line Dull is comparable to a Mac workstation deserves exactly what they get when buying said Dull."

      A spectacularly impressive argumentative tactic, taking the name of the particular company being argued against and turning it into name calling. This gives about as much credibility to your presentation as someone referring to Apple as Crapple or the Macintosh as the Crapintosh. Just wonderful.

      "You're comparing Apples with oranges (or better yet, Apples with crap)."

      I've worked with "crappy" Dells and Apples and great ones. It's true!

      "add in a OS to compare with OS/X (oops - there aren't any)"

      Wonderful. Continue the absurdity by stating that nothing compares to OS/X. Statements like this make a constructive, sensible debate impossible. You sir, are a wall.

      "and the other standard software packages (iTunes, iMovie, iDVD, etc., etc.)."

      It is wonderful that you like these and see value in them. That said, others do not. Like me for example. Don't care for any of them, particularly iTunes. But that is just my opinion, and in no way is a statement that you to must see it as I do.

      "Why can't PC bigots get over the fact that today's Macs are price competitive with PC's?"

      What is a PC bigot exactly? A person who sees things differently is a bigot? Here in Canada, Macs are, in my humble opinion, very much competitive with PCs in the laptop area and yet bigot that I am, I still prefer the PC and one of the factors is price, and the other is features. Having said that, other opinions are welcome and not judged, unless of course they offered in oh you unholy unwashed masses sense. Let's take a look at an example or two shall we?

      The 17" Powerbook is $3,699.

      The 17" Toshiba Satellite P20 is $3499.

      Features vary, such a RAM, Firewire ports, etc. but its all down to which one you like better. What's your name for Toshiba? Toshita?

      Now as for desktops, I recently upgraded to a P4 2.8Ghz with a Gig of RAM, 800MHz FSB, 36 GIG SATA, Pioneer 107 DVD-R+R, ATI 9600, 120 GIG ATA second drive, new case, external drive enclosure for the CD-ROM, external drive enclosure for a third Hard-Drive (ATA - 80 gig) for $1800.

      I can pick up a PowerMac G5 1.6 Ghz (I know, the speed varies across platforms and OS's) for a mere $2499! I find the PC in this case to be a far better deal in this case. Does this make me a PC bigot? Does recommending the new eMac to a client who personally finds using Macs easier make me a bigot as well? My god, just the other day I was praising InDesign and talking about its advantages over Quark (I didn't say Quirk however). I must be an Adobe bigot! Oh the humanity. When will this rampant platformism ever stop?

      Very peculiar. Do people actually see other people as defined by their computer system? Are there millions of PC people out there? What sort of clothes do they where? What strange foods do they eat?

    14. Re:Good news! by jovlinger · · Score: 4, Insightful

      value is calculated as ultility / cost.

      The key is that utility is a function of desired quality.

      For me, for example, 3d acceleration has zero utility, while an extremely high-res (I'm eyeing the dell laptop w/ 1920x1200 @17") LCD has a very high utility. Likewise, I prefer MB over MHz, and low weight over internal optical drives.

      I think many people who object to apple's prices do so because you may get a lot for your money, but you may not WANT half of it.

    15. Re:Good news! by Sparks23 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I really hate trying to compare Mac and PC CPU speeds, since -- as you correctly note -- the differing architecture makes the speeds comparitively meaningless; my 1Ghz Powerbook runs as fast or faster than my 1.8Ghz Pentium 4 desktop, so I gave up on trying to make the clock speeds map in comparison in any meaningful way.

      What really makes more sense is to compare what you're trying to do with the computer, and what will work best for you.

      For instance, I find my Powerbook is much easier to write on; for whatever reason, Microsoft Office X for the Mac seems cleaner and less clunky than Office XP on my desktop. I also find my Mac is generally easier to do my UNIX development on since I have X11 and gcc right there, and it's a BSD system under the hood. Similarly, playing with music composition and digital editing seem to be easier on my Mac. With the digital audio output, my Powerbook makes a better stereo/DVD player for me in my room as well. I also like that it has great battery life, so I can pop it onto 802.11b mode, and wander around the house with it; it's nice to be able to have the Mac there to look up recipes on wirelessly, or to work on my writing (stored on a network file share) in the kitchen while cooking.

      On the other hand, 3D gaming is definitely easier on my Windows box. And I find, for whatever reason, that my Windows box works better for me when I'm doing website dev; probably because I have Opera, IE and Mozilla installed, because I tend to work best in JASC Paint Shop Pro for doing web graphics, and because I find Evrsoft's 1stPage the best 'notepad on steroids' solution for HTML editing, even if it's defunct and no longer supported. And obviously, doing any sort of Windows development is way easier on my PC desktop than my Powerbook!

      Does this make one or the other of them better? Not really. I admit I tend to prefer my Mac lately simply because it seems to run faster/smoother for me, and I've been doing a lot of writing. But my PC gets a lot of daily use as well.

      Sure, I could've gotten a 'faster' Windows laptop than my Powerbook. But a six-pound little slim thing with 1 gig of RAM, built-in wireless and firewire, and suchnot is not to be sneezed at. I find the large, crisp screen works well for me when I'm traveling and when I'm writing. To /me/, the money I spent on the Powerbook was worth it and it's a better solution than a laptop PC would've been.

      That doesn't mean that's true for everyone else. :)

      --
      --Rachel
    16. Re:Good news! by DebianRcksLindowsLie · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Some people just look at price alone and nothing else. Try doing video editing an a PC laptop and you'll understand why people get Mac laptops for video work.

  2. Damn! Damn! Damn! by toupsie · · Score: 5, Funny
    I bought a 12" PowerBook six months ago! I would have waited if Apple would have told us that a faster one would come out in the future! Damn you Steve Jobs!

    Guess now I will just have to wait for my carbon-fiber, dual G5 PowerBook with fold out twin displays and fuel cell technology battery with 12 hours of life that the rumor sites are talking about.

    --
    Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
    1. Re:Damn! Damn! Damn! by butane_bob2003 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Wait all you want. What you need to do is get your wallet ahead of the hardware curve. Cause you know, once you buy a notebook, you're stuck with it. There's nothing to upgrade but the RAM. And maybe the hard drive.

      --


      TallGreen CMS hosting
    2. Re:Damn! Damn! Damn! by pknoll · · Score: 4, Informative

      The resale value on Macs (Powerbooks especially) lets me upgrade the whole thing for less than I could do with an equivalent PC notebook.

  3. Instead of a speed increase at the same price... by Anonymouse+Cownerd · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Why does Apple never drop the price of current hardware instead? I would love a 700mhz Powerbook for $600 or so (no thanks, refurbed units).

    --
    http://www.rayn.net . Funny. Stuff.
  4. powerbook improvement by millahtime · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I have a year old powerbook and the new ones for the same deal I got have halk gigahertz speed improvement, 20 gig bigger hard drive, over twice the speed of dvd burn, faster wireless, faster firewire bluetooth and more. And it's the same price. That's quite an increase for a year. It's so cool to see yet so depressing at the same time.

    1. Re:powerbook improvement by Kjella · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Don't worry, you'll get used to it. I've "regretted" every computer purchase I ever made a year later "Why couldn't I have waited just a year longer?". Give it another year and it'll have another half a GHz, 20gig bigger HDD, dual layer DVD burning, wireless broadband and whatnot. And those that bought it now will find it "cool, yet so depressing".

      I wonder when computers will really flatline. My dad was hired because the local IBM was just starting computers, you know with radio tubes and all. They were always asking "When is it going to stop?" Like, decades ago. So far, it hasn't.

      And I honestly don't see much indication that it will. Dual layer DVD? Blue-Ray? Internet connections as fast as local networks today? LCDs taking over for CRTs (still on CRT here)? OLED taking over for LCD? Wireless broadband? ATI and NVidia shoving fps through the roof?

      There's so much that hasn't been done yet. I wish a computer from the future would fall out of a time warp or something. Just in my time, I've gone from 64kb -> 1gb of RAM. That's 16,384 times greater. It won't stop there...

      Kjella

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  5. Parity with the Pentium-M by the_2nd_coming · · Score: 3, Informative

    it is looking like Apple is going to keep the G4 around for low powered mobiles, just like the Pentium-M .

    all that is needed is a 15 inch and 17 inch G5 model, I was hoping that it would be this summer, perhaps in the fall.

    --



    I am the Alpha and the Omega-3
  6. G5 Laptops by MoonBuggy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Is there any news available about if or when there are going to be G5 based laptops released?

    I'm looking to get an Apple notebook in about 6 months but I don't want to have a big jump like the G4 to G5 be released a few months later when I could've gone without it for a little longer and then got the G5.

    1. Re:G5 Laptops by squaretorus · · Score: 5, Funny

      It will be announced the day after they charge your Visa - no sooner, no later!

    2. Re:G5 Laptops by NaugaHunter · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's likely they already have feasible prototypes. However, IBM is currently having problems turning out enough G5's just for the towers and XServes. They are not likely to push ahead until they are certain supplies will be maintainable.

      And really, the need to handle power/heat issues in a laptop may be causing other problems with getting one in a laptop anyway. If they went through the trouble of introducing a speed bump G5 laptops won't be in the next 6 months. In addition, when they do arrive they will probably be only in the high end at first, so if your thinking low-end money range it will probably be longer still.

      --
      R: That voice. Where have I heard that voice before? B: In about 365 other episodes. But I don't know who it is either.
    3. Re:G5 Laptops by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Informative
      The PowerPC 970FX chip, used in the G5 XServes, is low power enough to go in a laptop (24.5W at 2.0GHz, my guess would be they'd start off with the 1.6GHz versions). The next problem is keeping the other components low power enough (faster memory controller, etc). I would assume that they started prototyping those parts with the PPC970 (used in the towers), and are now using the 970FX in testing.

      Unfortunately, the yields on the 970FX are nowhere near high enough yet for them to have enough to satisfy demand for G5 Powerbooks.

      I currently use a 15" Albook (1.25GHz G4) as my primary machine. The only time it's ever slow is when I'm doing something complicated in Final Cut Express, or running VirtualPC (which runs at about PII 266MHz speed).

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  7. Speedbumped? by Ratface · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Is this a standard term to describe the process of increasing processor speed in a line of computers? If so it's very poorly thought out. A speedbump is normally something that is used to slow down motorists on a tretch of road. So I instinctively interpreted that as meaning that Apple had released a line with capped processor speeds!

    I suspect that this is just the poster's own term to describe this. Oh well!

    --

    A little planning goes a long way...
    1. Re:Speedbumped? by Andy_R · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You are mixing "Speed Bump" up with "Speedbump".

      The term "Speed Bump" has been in use in Apple circlessine at least the time the original 8100 PowerPC went from 80 to 100 to 110 Mhz.

      --
      A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
    2. Re:Speedbumped? by easter1916 · · Score: 4, Funny

      "Bumping" is the act of taking little fingernail amounts of coke and snorting them on the fly, and that certainly speeds things up. Given that the Mac community is a creative and marketing set, this might explain the use of "bump" in this context. :-)

  8. Hold Over? by creative_name · · Score: 4, Informative

    The real question (rumor?) floating around other mac-specific news sites is whether or not this is just to hold us over until the release of G5 notebooks sometime in the not to distant future (January?) A couple interesting threads:

    Apple Insider

    MacNN

    --
    Posting as directed.
  9. Re:5200's? by jone1941 · · Score: 5, Informative

    seriously, if you are buying an apple laptop with the prospect of playing doom3 or half-life2 you are an idiot. I am not entirely sure if half-life2 is even slated for a mac release. In any case, for a laptop that you are using to do day to day stuff with, then a 5200 is a pretty decent card. If you honestly think you might use it for gaming get a laptop with a 9700. In both cases you are looking a mobile version of these cards which means you are getting a somewhat underpowered card to begin with.

    --
    Fear trumps hope and ignorance trumps both
  10. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by Tyrdium · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Because dropping the price would kill their nice margins, and they wouldn't make as much money. Let's say it costs (pulling numbers out of thin air) $500 to build a $1500 laptop, and $200 to build a $800 laptop. Assuming they sell the same number of each, which are they going to want to sell? Of course, they'd probably sell more of the $800 laptop, but they'd have to sell a lot more to make it worthwhile...

  11. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by spanklin · · Score: 4, Informative
    Why does Apple never drop the price of current hardware instead?

    You can usually find good deals on older hardware right around the time that they are about to announce a new model. They just don't offer it to everyone through the Apple Store. Instead, I usually see them advertised in the Mac User's Group store and places that other long time customers have a chance at them.

  12. Pricing by Mtn_Dewd · · Score: 3, Informative

    So I have been looking at getting a 15" powerbook in the last few days and it's probably good I didn't do that. I noticed a few retailers started selling their models with price cuts a couple days ago -- now I know why. Anyhow, the base price of the new line is cheaper than the old line, which I find to be interesting.

    --



    My little sad piece of the internet: www.mtndewd
  13. Re:5200's? by crackshoe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Ummm... i assume thats why they're offering the higher end video card - to those few dedicated mac gamers, or those who do graphics work. but they offer a lower end card so a general user doesn't have to pay for something they really don't need. this is, as far as i recall, the first time that apple has offred a video card option in its laptops.

    --
    Don't worry - its just stigmata. Pass me a napkin and don't you dare tell my mother.
  14. Re:Ah... Now I want one even more... by scrotch · · Score: 4, Funny
    ... poor collage kids with a large portion of their annual income devoted to beer and video games...

    Maybe if you get a Mac you won't have to drink so much...

  15. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by BWJones · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why does Apple never drop the price of current hardware instead? I would love a 700mhz Powerbook for $600 or so (no thanks, refurbed units).

    The answer is simple really. Apple would like to maintain their products as objects of desire. Sexy bits of computer art that both inspire lust and allow us to accomplish our work easier and/or faster than ever before, making a difference. To lower the prices would reduce Apple computers to commodity items much like the rest of the Wintel world.

    How many Dell, HP, Compaq, graybox etc.... hardware rollouts are greeted with the same kind of fervor that Apple computer hardware announcements inspire?

    --
    Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
  16. Re:Converted by troc · · Score: 5, Funny

    That depends which conversion algorithm you use :)

    The "Apple Zealot" converts 1.5GHz G4 into 3GHz P4

    The "PC Weenie" converts 1.5GHz G4 into 0.1 GHz P4 as that's about the speed it runs Virtual PC (probably, assuming anyone actually bought a Mac. Which nobody does. etc)

    The "Geek Index" says 1.5GHz G4 is about 2-2.5GHz P4 probably but it depends what you are doing and anyway it's all easily fast enough to code stuff and surf for pr0n.

    The "SETI Weirdo" calculates that a 1.5GHz G4 does more units than their rival^h^h^h^h^hfriend. So that's ok.

    The "Arty type people" think oooh a mac. It runs FCP.

    8 out of 10 CEOs go "a shiny thing"

    etc

    Troc

    --
    Troc's dubious podcast and blog: http://www.trocnet.net
  17. Re:Converted by Mateito · · Score: 5, Funny

    Troll?

    Hey Taco:

    I propose a new poll:

    "Which sub-group on Slashdot take themselves too seriously?"

    My vote has to be the coders. Post a joke in a Perl thread, and you will be modded -1 flamebait. These people are obsolutely incapable of laughing at themselves. Maybe they should get out more.

    Some of the Mac people here are almost as bad. This guy asked for a speed comparison between Intel and Apple procs. Sure, it may be a troll, but its not as obvious as the "Apple is (still) dying" thread.

    At least the BSD guys usually post the obligatory "BSD is dying" message before anybody else gets a chance too.

  18. Re:Benchmarks by Johnny+Mnemonic · · Score: 4, Insightful


    How much faster, I will not say, but a 1.4GHz G4 is very different from a 1.4GHz P4. Or P3.

    And impossible to do, really, because the amount of difference depends heavily on the application being used. Some applications can take, and are designed to take, better advantage of the PPC + Altivec. Other applications don't benefit nearly as much.

    So it all depends on what you want to do with it, really--and I recommend that you determine what you'll be doing with such a laptop most of the time, and then clock those processes. If speed is your chief concern.

    --

    --
    $tar -xvf .sig.tar
  19. Re:Ah... Now I want one even more... by somethinghollow · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The 1.25 GHz eMac is a steal at 749$ with your college discount. Mine is serving me well, and it is a 1 GHz. If you hate the all-in-one design, there is some good news. While you won't get extra PCI slots, the eMac does have 4 channels of IDE (instead of two), can do display mirroring out-of-the-box (dual display with a little software hack). With a little work / modding, you could get past the all-in-one ness and have a pretty nice desktop.

    If all-in-one is okay, then you should have no other complaints. The price is right for all the apps / great OS / great hardware. Besides, it's easier to move around than a monitor + box. That is important if you move from room to room every couple of semesters.

  20. Temperature woes by PlatyPaul · · Score: 5, Informative

    A caution to anyone who'd likely buy one of these new PowerBooks: may your lap beware!

    I own one of the "older" 12" G4 PowerBooks (867 MHz), which I absolutely adore, but it has heat issues. The main heat venting location on the case (that I've found) is the bottom rear of the machine. This means that if you're sitting down with it on your lap and you're wearing shorts, prolonged use (3+ hours) may result in warming to the point of extreme skin discomfort. This isn't usually a problem, though it's something you become aware of after the first couple of times you accidentally scald yourself. With the increase in speed, however, the speedy processor would cause an even higher temperature level, barring a radical change to the way in which heat is vented (which is not apparent from the official specs).

    Mercifully (in a way), a semi-recent update changed the fan kick-in temperature to a lower threshold, meaning less built-up heat but a lower battery life. Expect the batteries on the new PowerBooks to not quite last as long as they're listed as, though they'd probably last long enough as is. For a college student like me, just having them last through class so that I can go back to my dorm and plug in for the evening's homework is fine.

    I'd still buy one (if I had the money and needed a new computer), though I'd be careful to do most of my work on a table.

    --
    Misery loves company. Online misery loves unsuspecting random strangers.
    1. Re:Temperature woes by kakapo · · Score: 5, Interesting

      This is true of the first generation 12'' PookBooks, but is much less of a problem is the second generation models (and the newly released ones are the third generation).

      There are two 12'' 1GHz models in my household, and they never get uncomfortably hot -- neither is used for gaming, but I do a good deal of development and numerical computation on mine, which means the CPU can be pegged at 100% for lengthy periods. The fan does kick in fairly regularly though.

    2. Re:Temperature woes by Morgahastu · · Score: 4, Informative

      I used to have the first version of the 12" PowerBook, the same one you speak of.

      For financial reasons I had to give it up and then I managed to get another one a few months later just after the second revision came out (1ghz, 256mb standard, usb 2.0, fx5200) and the heat issue was nearly gone alltogether.

      It's still noticably warm but it's no longer _hot_.

      As a general rule, stay away from first versions of any new hardware, in this case the new PowerBook enclosures.

      Sure I'd love to get a G5 powerbook as soon as they come out but I would wait until the second or third revision before buying one.

    3. Re:Temperature woes by fritter · · Score: 3, Funny

      The main heat venting location on the case (that I've found) is the bottom rear of the machine. This means that if you're sitting down with it on your lap and you're wearing shorts, prolonged use (3+ hours) may result in warming to the point of extreme skin discomfort.

      If you're spending a hot summer's day sitting down with your laptop for three uninterrupted hours, you probably weren't using anything down there anyway.

  21. Computers getting faster ... who woulda thought? by gkuz · · Score: 5, Funny

    In keeping with a 50-year-old trend, the latest computers from [insert name here] are faster and more powerful than the previous generation. Wow. There's news.

  22. Re:Worst. Title. Ever. by avalys · · Score: 4, Funny

    And usually a troll is a mythical being that lives under bridges and eats people who pass by.

    Terms and expressions can mean different things in different contexts.

    --
    This space intentionally left blank.
  23. Re:Converted by Morgahastu · · Score: 4, Informative

    I have the previous version of the 12" PowerBook running at 1ghz and it's noticably faster than my p4 1.5ghz. I'd rate it as feeling about the same as a 2.0ghz p4.

    So I'd say the 1.5 would be about a 2.8 or 3.0ghz pentium.

    While we're on this topic I'd like to point out that Macs feel much faster than they actually are because of the superb multi tasking and UI response under heavy load.

    When I am encoding a video on my Windows machine I can't do anything else on my computer, if I try to click something it takes about 30 seconds for the menu to popup.

    On the other hand, my Mac can have 20 apps running and encoding a video at the same time and the UI still responds beautifully.

    This is why using a Mac is a great experience, you so rarely get frustrated at it because it just works.

  24. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by squiggleslash · · Score: 5, Informative
    They just don't offer it to everyone through the Apple Store.
    Actually, usually there is a "Previous model" entry on the Special Deals part of the Apple store (no link, stupid store uses session IDs embedded in the URLs, but it's usually on the left or right of the Apple Store page with a big, red, "Save" "tag" on it.)
    --
    You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  25. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 4, Funny

    The local CompUSA is trying to hawk a 500 MHz icebook for $1000... It's a loaded machine, too. 10 GB Hard Drive. CD Rom, 128 Megabytes of memory. And it runs 9.2.2 like a dream.

  26. Re:G4/G5 benchmarks by Morgahastu · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Because a benchmark of a modern FPS game is a terrible way to benchmark the processor since most of the work is dependant on video cards.

    Here's is something from a post I made somewhere above concerning speed compairisons:

    --------

    I have the previous version of the 12" PowerBook running at 1ghz and it's noticably faster than my p4 1.5ghz. I'd rate it as feeling about the same as a 2.0ghz p4.

    So I'd say the 1.5 would be about a 2.8 or 3.0ghz pentium.

    While we're on this topic I'd like to point out that Macs feel much faster than they actually are because of the superb multi tasking and UI response under heavy load.

    When I am encoding a video on my Windows machine I can't do anything else on my computer, if I try to click something it takes about 30 seconds for the menu to popup.

    On the other hand, my Mac can have 20 apps running and encoding a video at the same time and the UI still responds beautifully.

    This is why using a Mac is a great experience, you so rarely get frustrated at it because it just works.

    ----

    FYI it has the same NVidia FX5200 the new ones have and it plays all the current games very well (Except the super high end FPS games like Ut2004...playable but not that enjoyable). Anyway, anyone who intends to do serious gaming on a laptop is a damn fool, even more so on a Mac laptop.

  27. Re:Any system software updates also? by Johnny+Mnemonic · · Score: 4, Informative

    So on the offchance that you're not trolling:
    • Fink isn't developed by Apple, and they have nothing to do with it, aside from some possible back channel help. However, it did not come "included" on your PowerBook, unless you bought it used.
    • You can check for a more recent version of fink by: % sudo fink selfupdate
    • You don't need to sell your hardware to update your software.
    Hope this helps. Welcome to the Mac.
    --

    --
    $tar -xvf .sig.tar
  28. Re:Speedbumped? Speed Increase? by skinny.net · · Score: 5, Funny

    'Speed increase' is no better. If there's more speed, why is it in a crease?

    Perhaps 'road hump' doesn't mean gettin' some in the car anymore.

  29. Why doesn't BMW sell the 2002 3 series anymore? by amichalo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I surely wish BMW would sell me a 2002 3-series instead of the improved 2005. I don't want to buy a used one, I just want to buy a new old one. I mean, surely they keep all those old parts around.

    Dude, warehousing old graphics cards, HDs, etc costs money and would actually increase Apple's Cost of Goods Sold (COGS). If they then dropped prices, they would have slimmer margins in both directions (lower revenues, higher COGS).

    I got my dad to buy a Apple refurb iBook and save $300. It works great, has no physicial defect and as far as I can tell, is identical to a new one with three $100 bills stuck in the DVD/CDR combo drive.

    --
    I only came here to do two things; kick some ass, and drink some beer...looks like we're almost out of beer.
  30. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by grue23 · · Score: 4, Informative

    resellers including smalldog.com and macmall.com often offer older models (ones that are totally gone from the apple store) for more reasonable prices.

  31. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 4, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  32. iBook RAM increase by h0ss · · Score: 3, Informative
    One thing I'm particularly excited about with the new iBooks is that their maximum RAM is 1.25 GB, instead of 768MB.

    This is a HUGE difference for me, since the stuff that I'm most interested in doing isn't so much CPU intensive as RAM intensive. I can live with just about anything, but under 1GB of RAM was a deal-killer on the iBooks.

    For me, this changes everything.

  33. Re:Converted by quantum+bit · · Score: 4, Informative

    When I am encoding a video on my Windows machine I can't do anything else on my computer, if I try to click something it takes about 30 seconds for the menu to popup.

    That's a result of Windows's semi brain-dead priority system. Pop open task manager, find the encoding process (the one that's gobbling all your CPU), right click on it and set priority to 'Low' or 'Idle'.

    I used to play Unreal Tournament while encoding videos all the time without a problem. It encodes slower at low priority but UT didn't suffer much of a performance hit. Made me miss my old dual-CPU system though.

    Unless of course you're running that 9X/ME crap, which even most Windows users these days realize sucks.

  34. Re:5200's? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    That this is a video card for a low-end consumer laptop, not a 1337 game system, maybe?

    Hold on a minute there. One moment people here claim that all Apple hardware should be compared to medium or top-range PC stuff, and that this makes them reasonably good value for money. And then, when people do exactly that, it is suddenly unfair because the Apple is really a low-end system?

    You cannot both have your cake and eat it. Either the 12" model is quite overpriced as a "low-end consumer" machine at $1600-$1800, or it's got a really shitty graphics card for a medium/high range machine.

  35. Re:I'll keep my 64 bit laptop by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Your sig is ironic.

    So your whole point is that your 64b Athlon computer is only good for games?

    How about XSan? Motion? FCP? FCP HD? DVD SP? Shake? Logic? BLAST?

    You forget that some people actually make money with their machines. :)

    You also forget that for some people, especially those that earn something in the $40 to $50 an higher an hour range, time is money. Linux, BSD, and Windows is too expensive, and strangely enough, Macs, with their plug and play nature, are cheaper. Literally, if it takes me one day to set up something in Linux, and 10 minutes on my Mac, that's the difference between $500 spent/wasted and $10 spent. Over the course of a month, then, a Mac will have paid itself off.

    Especially when you're talking about a $1,400 iBook. Make a DVD? Insert a disk, arrange the menus, and hit burn. 20 minutes later you're done. Make a movie? Plug in the camcorder, import video, arrange the video, and 30 minutes later you're done. Send the DVD off for replication, make 500 copies, and start on your next project.

  36. Enough nonsense, really by Tibor+the+Hun · · Score: 5, Funny

    First a disclaimer: I am a Mac fanboy. I've got one, I love it and I reccomend it to everyone who's looking for a new computer.

    But what the heck is with all the sexy nonsense? Since when did we start humping Macs and iPods?
    "Sexy bits of computer art that both inspire lust..."
    Lust?
    Sure their products might be sleek and very well designed, but to call them sexy and lusty ALL the time? I'll take good ol' T&A over hardware any day.

    --
    If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
  37. Re:Converted by LEgregius · · Score: 5, Interesting
    From what I can tell, for integer-only code (i.e. no altivec) a G4 is a little slower than a Pentium 3 (not 4) or Pentium-M (which is a modded P3) running at the same clock speed. In fact, my 1.25GHz G4 runs C/C++ code in OSX at about 2/3 the speed of the same code on my 1.7GHz Pentium-M running linux (both using gcc 3.3 and pretty standard optimizations). Since a 1.7GHz Pentium-M is about the same speed as a 2.2 or 2.4 GHz Pentium 4, that makes the G4 reasonable faster than a P4 at the same clock speed. Both of my machines have 1GB of RAM, btw.

    Altivec code, on the other hand, seems to be very different. Code that heavily uses the altivec, like MP3/AAC encoding, graphics work, Folding@Home, and the OS X UI seems to be much faster at the same clock speed. For doing Folding@home, for example, my 1.25GHz G4 is quite a bit faster than my 1.7GHz Pentium-M. A few years ago, I had a 667 G4 and a 1.2GHz athlon. The G4 was nearly twice as fast as the athlon when doing Distributed.NET type stuff (rc5-64 at the time, I think).

    For those of you doing Java, a G4 seems to run Java code of any sort, including the compiler, the same speed as an Athlon XP or Pentium-M at a 50% greater clock speed, or 80% higher for a P4. I did tests compiling the same code in the same IDE, doing code refactoring, etc. The disks drives, btw, were approximately the same speed and the ram was the same for all these tests.

    I know I haven't done really official tests, I'm just stating my experience.

  38. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by easter1916 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Search for "refurbished" at the Apple Store for great deals. These are usually returns, got a 1GHz G4 17" with 512MB RAM, 60GB drive, superdrive, Airport Extreme, etc., for $2300 there about two months back. In perfect condition, no less.

  39. Re:5200's? by NeGz · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Granted they're not the fastest cards available, but they're not absolubte rubbish for gaming.

    My current laptop (not a Mac) has a 64mb Geforce FX5200 Go. I've been using it over the last few weeks (combined with a Pentium M 1.5 and 512mb of PC2100 DDR) to play Farcry, which seems to be a pretty graphics intensive game.

    I've got texture detail set on high with everything else set on either medium or low. The game may not be running at a hojillion frames per second, but it's completely playable with no annoying choppiness or lag.

    Incidentally, my notebook's graphics card was advertised as being 64mb (128mb reserve.) Anyone know what this means? Can I buy a memory expansion card for it? There doesn't seem to be a BIOS option to dedicate it more memory.

    Note: I have actually got the card overclocked to FX5600 Go clockspeeds, something I don't normally do, but it doesn't seem to be effecting temperature or stability in any noticable way, so I may as well take the bonus. :)

  40. Re:5200's? by fupeg · · Score: 4, Informative
    it claims DirectX 9 capability
    Hey news flash, there is no DirectX on a Mac, it is a Microsoft technology. On a Mac, it's all about OpenGL. Nvidia has generally fared better at OpenGL than ATI, even though ATI's 9500/9700/9800 is generally considered superior than Nvidia's FX line.
  41. Wrong, the worst part is... by jared_hanson · · Score: 3, Insightful

    your ignorance.

    I have both a dual 2.0 GHz G5 and a 1.25 GHz 15" PowerBook G4. The G5 is without a doubt faster, but for the typical user and his/her uses, it doesn't offer much. The G5 excells at video encoding and also compiles larger code bases much faster. However, for typical uses (web browsing, word processing, etc.) there is not much of a performance gain.

    As for your two-button mouse argument: TRY IT! I figured I wouldn't like it much, but I find it to work out quite well. Now, I always have one hand on the keyboard, which makes me operate my computer much more quickly and efficiently. My experiences with Apple lead me to believe that if they are doing something, there is usually a damn good reason for it, and that reason is usually right.

    So, instead of loudly proclaiming your ignorance and demand Apple do things your way, I suggest you open your mind to "thinking different" and begin to realize that things can be better than the way you've been ingrained to beleive.

    --
    -- Fighting mediocrity one bad post at a time.
  42. I was writing this DMCA takedown notice by acceleriter · · Score: 3, Funny

    and all of a sudden, the computer was like BEEP BEEP BEEP. Now I have a Powerbook and crank out C&Ds in record time, with no crashes.

    --

    CEE5210S The signal SIGHUP was received.

  43. Re:Converted by tesmako · · Score: 4, Informative

    It is not an CISC vs. RISC issue, it is an IPC-count issue. The G4 typically has better IPC-counts than a P4 thanks to a pipeline flush being a lot cheaper. They are still slower overall of course on account of the P4's pipeline allowing the rather incredible clock frequencies it does. The current G4 is not really cache-starved, at 512 kilobytes of L2 it is behind the P4 but it is not really bad. It features more L1 cache than a P4 and has lower access latencies for both L1 and L2.

    All in all the G4 is faster clock-by-clock than the P4 in most cases. It doesnt make it faster than the P4 either way though since it still clocks far too low, but it is a competent CPU.

  44. The7 stages of grief of highly effective people by teamhasnoi · · Score: 5, Funny
    Shock: "What? G4s in the IBOOKS?
    Denial: "This must be some poorly researched article on /."
    Bargaining: "Maybe I can return my powerbook and get an iBook..."
    Fear: "What if Apple won't let me return it because its a build to order??"
    Anger: "Those SOBs KNEW and didn't tell me before I spent all that money!"
    Despair: "Now my Powerbook will have no resale value when I have to eBay it for the new G5 laptops!!"
    Acceptance: "Wait a minute - this this Powerbook kicks ass! The girls want to be with me, the guys want to be me, and I consistently get benchmarks higher than a dual 1 ghz G4 Powermac. The Airport Extreme rules, the battery life is lengthy, it runs nice and warm and winter is coming! I guess I did ok..."

    Fast forward one year. "The G5 laptops are OUT?!?...."

    (This is a repost of an old post of mine, but as relevant today as it was then...:)

  45. Re:G4/G5 benchmarks by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    My (highly subjective) experience is quite similar, but I'd like to point out two things:
    1. AltiVec. A lot of Mac code is AltiVec optimised. This means making explicit use of the vector libs, rather than just hoping the compiler will auto-vectorise for you). Much less code on x86 is optimised like this, since you have to support MMX, SSE, SSE2, 3DNow!, 3DNow2! etc, so most code either uses MMX as a lowest common denominator, or doesn't use the vector unit at all. This means that such code will run 2-4 times faster than on an equivalent x86 machine. The QuickTime MP3 and AAC encoders are examples of this.
    2. Memory. OS X likes memory. Most of the time you don't quite applications in OS X, you just leave them running with no windows open. If you do close them, then OS X will try to leave the application binary in the disk cache for as long as possible so that you can reload it quickly. The disk cache is quite aggressive. I was browsing through a load of PDFs on a CD the other day, and part way through, the CD span down. It had cached the entire CD (or at least all of the PDFs I looked at after it had spun down). Adding more RAM will have a huge effect on your perceived speed.
    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  46. iBook cannibalizing PowerBook sales now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The previous generation iBook 12" was slow (800MHz G4) and had a low RAM ceiling (640MB) with 256k L2 cache on-chip.

    The iBook G4 12" announced today is no speed demon, but at 1GHz, it's fast enough for its target user (students/education professionals), and the 512k L2 cache certainly helps. With up to 1.25GB DDR RAM, the machine is basically identical to the previous generation 12" PowerBook.

    Add an Airport Extreme card and upgrade the disk to a reasonable size (60GB), and you can get the machine for $1273. The 12" PowerBook, meanwhile, costs $1600 in more or less the same configuration.

    Is there a really compelling reason to buy the 12" PowerBook if you're Joe Student? Doesn't seem like it. Graphics are nominally better, but the nVidia 5200 isn't so hot, is it? There's a 333MHz speed bump, which nobody will notice during normal use. Bluetooth is included, but you can add it to the iBook for $50 if you need it.

    So I wonder if the current iBook rev. will take a bite out of PowerBook sales. There are few (if any) "must have" features on the PowerBook 12", and the current iBook speed and RAM capacity are finally on par with other modern machines.

    My money would be on the iBook, I think.

    1. Re:iBook cannibalizing PowerBook sales now? by MalleusEBHC · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I'm a college student who will be buying either a 12" iBook or a 12" PowerBook as soon as I get a chance to try them both out in person. (I'm only referring to the 12" models in this post.) Before this update, I was very much leaning towards getting an iBook rather than a PowerBook. The iBooks used to be much better than the PowerBooks in terms of bang for your buck. However, having seen these new models, I'm almost assuredly going to get a PowerBook.

      With my education discount, I can get the PowerBook for $1399 and the iBook for $1155. The PowerBook is the stock 12" without the Superdrive, and the iBook is the base 12" with a combo drive, Airport Extreme, and a 60 GB HD. (The Airport and bigger HD are BTO options to put it on par with the PowerBook. So now I'm looking at a $250 difference, or ~20% if I look at it that way. For this 20% more in cost, I get a 1.33 GHz G4 vs a 1 GHz G4 (33% improvement), a 167 MHz system bus vs a 133 MHz system bus (25% improvement), a nicer video card (double the VRAM), and other random PowerBook niceties like the ability to do monitor spanning without OpenFirmware hacks. Not to mention the PowerBook is lighter and smaller in all 3 dimensions. The only real advantage I see in the iBook is the greater battery life, but the 5 and 6 hour quotes are to be believed, the difference is all but negligible.

      While the iBook is still an excellent option, I just feel I'm getting more bang for my buck with the PowerBook. This is a laptop that's going to last me a long time, so I think the extra money spent will be well worth it in the long run.

  47. Re:Ah... Now I want one even more... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    At least he won't have to spend money on any more games.
    *badum-tish*

    "Lots of games, like... <mumble>Photoshop...</mumble>"

  48. Re:No G5, and the worst part... by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Let's play feed-the-troll!

    "Gee, a G4 is all you need, you don't need any more speed".

    What do you, personally, need more speed for? The only thing I ever do that taxes my G4 is video editing and running VirtualPC. Everything else is more than fast enough. A G5 would probably help the video editing, but it's not something I do every day, and I'm happy to just set everything up and leave it doing the rendering while I'm asleep. VirtualPC is about PII 266 speed, and I don't really need it to be any faster (sure, it would be nice to run it at P4 speeds, but if I really needed to do much x86-specific stuff I'd have bought an x86 laptop).

    The G4's FSB is only running at 167mhz. That's pathetic in 2004. Its why the G4 chip never seemed all that fast and why the G5 kills.

    Right. I need a faster chipset, because that would, uh, use more power and drain the battery quicker. Oh, and make the machine hotter. Seriously, when was the last time you did anything on a laptop that was limited by FSB speed?

    build a goddamned 2 button mouse into the case.

    Have you ever actually tried using a trackpad with two buttons? I still haven't found one that's comfortable. The trackpad in the PowerBook is amazingly nice to use. Oh, and I have yet to encounter a Mac app that actually needed a second button.

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  49. I Love Apple! by ThisGuy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I ordered a PowerBook 1.25ghz 15" SuperDrive on Friday. I awoke this morning to see that my order had been cancled, but re added. I was pretty confused until I saw this post on slashdot, and I checked some emails, and bam! They switched my order for me! Why do I think this wouldn't have happened with a company whose name begins with M and ends with -onopoly.

    1. Re:I Love Apple! by bfg9000 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Why do I think this wouldn't have happened with a company whose name begins with M and ends with -onopoly.

      Because Microsoft doesn't make PCs?

      --

      I'm not normally an irrational zealous dickhead, but I figure "When in Rome..."

  50. RTFSS by phillymjs · · Score: 4, Informative

    SS = "spec sheet"

    The 15" and 17" PowerBooks include a single Type I & II PC Card slot, and always have. The iBooks don't have it as a means of feature differentiation from the PowerBook line. The 12" PowerBook doesn't have it for obvious reasons.

    Of all the people I know with PowerBooks, absolutely none of them have ever used a PC Card in one. Why would you, when every PowerBook since about 1998 has had everything you'd add via PC Card already built-in?

    The only thing I can think of anymore that someone might have a use for is a memory card reader-- but why buy a PC Card one and limit yourself when you can use a USB one on any computer?

    ~Philly

  51. Re:I'll keep my 64 bit laptop by switcha · · Score: 4, Funny
    Make a movie? Plug in the camcorder, import video, arrange the video, and 30 minutes later you're done. Send the DVD off for replication, make 500 copies, and start on your next project.

    So, you're the one who was responsible for the last Matrix.

    --
    You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
  52. Re:Lose Airport Extreme, add PCMCIA by cbiffle · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Ahrm.

    So why is it you need PCMCIA? Is the current Cardbus slot not sufficient? It's like PCMCIA, only much faster and with a wider bus.

    Oh, and it's backwards compatible.

    Let me guess -- didn't read the specs? I understand.

  53. Re:Converted by tgibbs · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's true that OS X has far superior multi-tasking relative to Windows. When I do a processor intensive task on my Windows boxes, I have to walk away and let it finish. I'm not sure why more people don't bring this issue up. Being able to perform other tasks and have the system and other apps remain responsive while encoding video in the background is huge productivity enhancer.

    I recently configured a low-end Dell for my sister. I figured the 2.4 GHz Celeron would easily smoke my old 800 MHz G4 TiBook. And I have no doubt that on a single-application benchmark, it would. But in practice, I was cursing at the thing because it seemed so damned slow. My laptop just feels faster. And that perception seems to be because virtually nothing bogs it down, so I've gotten in the habit of multitasking. Start an application installation or system update, and then check my email while it is in process. Start three applications at the same time and browse the web while they load. Start a graphics program rendering a big tiff, then switch to Word and work on a document. I was expecting to do the same thing on the Dell, but often one application will bog down the entire system. But for the way I've gotten in the habit of working, it feels pokey.

  54. Re:Instead of a speed increase at the same price.. by Sleepy · · Score: 3, Informative

    Same reason there's no $199 ultra-low-end Apple product... margins. Compete right in the middle (or at least not the low end) of the bell curve, where the market supports better margins.

    What do you want more -- an Apple and the OS X OS, or a cheap laptop? You can get a desktop eMac NEW for $799. That's a steal. Order one through a school and it's $50 cheaper.

    Powerbook for $600? Ha. Not even an iBook.

    MAYBE you can find a 700MHz iBook on eBay, used -- or dealmac.com -- for $600. I've seen 500MHz ibooks for sub-500 some months back. These systems are suitable for UNIX or Mac development, which is what I use mine for.

    Refurbs are great if you have a warranty.

  55. Were you happy with it when you bought it? by DavidinAla · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you were happy with the product and the price you paid when you bought the iBook, then quit worrying about today and just accept that the timing happened the way it did. Take their $49 rebate and have a decent dinner with somebody.

    There will ALWAYS be "better deals" after you buy. You can only worry about what things were like when you bought. If your reseller won't happen to help you as a courtesy, there's nothing you can do other than irritate yourself further with anger or worry. It's your choice whether you enjoy your new iBook or complain about something beyond your control.

  56. Re:Converted by aristotle-dude · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Since when do you run a computer without an OS? :) Benchmarks are nice for comparing new revisions of the same processor family but are entirely useless for determining if a computer (OS and hardware) will perform well with everyday tasks.

    --
    Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
  57. Re:Anyone want to buy a used iBook? by subtillus · · Score: 4, Funny

    Yeah, I just got mine in december...

    Oh well, at least it's still cooler than the competition.

    ibook12" annecdote:

    I was complaining to my friend in a cafe the other day that when I use airport to download large files as well as listen to itunes, run word, Fire im, and a dozen other apps, my battery life only lasts for about 3 and a half hours instead of 5. He told me to go fuck myself because his computer lasts about half as long and most of that time is spent configuring his wireless card, then his computer froze up and he had to take out the battery to reboot it.

    Man I wish I owned a wintel!
    : )

  58. Re:desktop update next week? by gerardrj · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ... but I don't see G5s there until fall.

    SJ at the release of the G5 stated clearly that they "IBM and Apple are today announcing that within 12 months we'll be at 3GHz". You can hear/see this yourself in the WWDC 2003 video at timecode 1:52:00

    Unless things continue to go horribly wrong at IBM, that means the G5 will hit that mark in June.

    Note that Steve stated they would be at that speed, not announcing that speed. I would expect, based on that statement, that such systems should be shipping by July at the latest.

    At this point, I suspect that Apple will forgo any interim speed bump or upgrades for the PowerMac and is simply stockpiling the 3GHz processors in anticipation of a major buying spree once the new systems are released.
    I recall speculation after the WWDC last year that Steve's statement might mean there would be no major updates until a year later. That speculation seemed to be dismissed quickly by most.

    --
    Article X: The powers not delegated... by the Constitution...are reserved...to the people
  59. Oh, the humanity. Think of the legacy hardware! by danielsfca2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    A DVD burner without a reader is useless to me.
    Are you saying you don't think a DVD burner can read DVDs? Are you saying you don't realize that set-top DVD players can be had for $35 at Kmart? Are you just afraid of the DVD standard because you love VHS so much?

    No parallel or serial port? That means I'd have to throw out all of my hardware and buy new stuff.

    What ghetto hardware do you have that needs parallel and serial ports?? You'd better say $30,000 medical-imaging systems or something, because unless your hardware is highly specialized (or essential for business but not produced in a modern version), you're at serious risk of being branded a silly Luddite. Personally, the last printer I bought that didn't have a USB port was the one I got in 1999. Next one was combo (USB+parallel) and thereafter, they're USB-only. Last serial device was an old Palm cradle (that's $30 to replace by the way, but my current Palm came with USB only.

    iTunes? I've got Winamp. It's free.

    I've got iTunes. It's free too. And it's better--it does everything the paid version of Winamp does (in terms of audio; QT does the video stuff), for free.

    Silly troll.
    Most peolpe don't want and/or need all of that stuff, and certainly don't want to pay for it.

    Correction: Most people want or need most of that stuff, and obviously many are willing to pay for it. Some people want actual modern technology on their laptops! And the only thing Wintel laptops can offer that is cheaper than a similarly-outfitted PowerBook or iBook is CELERON! Sorry, that's unacceptable to me. Celeron is just plain pathetic and I will never own a Celeron-based machine of any kind. Celeron laptops are for people who want to say they have a laptop and who just want to get on the IntarWeb and run Kazaa in their dorm rooms. Real computers are a totally different market.

    Perhaps my entire comment can just be summed up in a revision of yours:

    I disagree completely. I have no need for a parallel or serial port. I need DVD authoring. A portable video-editing studio without DVD recording is useless to me. No FireWire or Bluetooth? That means I'd have to throw out half of my hardware and buy cheap, crappy stuff. Winamp Pro? I've got iTunes. It's free. The Apple laptops are full of actual modern technology that you (and obviously, not many others) are afraid to adopt. Cheap PC laptops are designed for those with a SERIOUS budget problem, and no real demands for performance. They have their niche, but that's all it is: a niche. Many people want or need a lot of those features, and clearly 711,000 people were willing to pay for it last quarter alone.

  60. Re:No scroll wheel / zone? by plj · · Score: 4, Informative

    Apple laptops have ordinary Synaptic's touchpads. You just need a better driver. See here.

    Voilá, scrolling areas and tap corners (==5 mouse buttons). Also a Windows-style acceleration mode, which IMO makes the whole touchpad much more useable.

    --
    “Wait for Hurd if you want something real” –Linus