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Review: LinuxCertified LC2210 Laptop
'It's me' writes "OSNews reviews LinuxCertified's LC2210 laptop, which comes with Xandros Desktop 2.0. That laptop is meant to be 100% certified with Linux, but Xandros seemed to have problems with it (namely there is no "sleep" function, while WiFi was not as robust as users would want it). LinuxCertified said that newer distros should be able to support this laptop with no hickups. The reviewer concludes that this a great purchase, as long as you are more selective over the distro installed."
Great. When are manufacturers going to really give us the details that they want?
that certified actually doesn't mean certified completely. I'm sure this will instill a lot of confidence in non-linux users going to linux.
The reviewer concludes that this a great purchase, as long as you are more selective over the distro installed.
Well, thats the case with windows machines too.
Even if there are a few hiccups, it's still nice to know that there are laptops available that don't have the "Designed for Microsoft" sticker on them.
Free Firefox news reader.
This is an encouraging step forward. I've bought a few laptops off ebay in my time and spent many an hour researching beforehand to ensure that every part would work with my favourite OS.
What would be great would be an independant company that could certify linux compatibility for a one off fee. I realise there are various websites where users can submit whether it worked for them or not, but it can take a while for new hardware to be listed and the information is often out of date.
I'm not particularly in touch with this aspect of Linux, but I've heard that power management features haven't been all that great in Linux...and if that's true, then it comes as no surprise that there isn't a "sleep" function.
For linux acceptability and use to grow, as others have been mentioning, it has to have other, not-so-geek important features that ordinary users will keep asking for
http://efil.blogspot.com/
That laptop is meant to be 100% certified with Linux, but Xandros seemed to have problems with it (namely there is no "sleep" function)
Sleep?! Linux geeks dont need no stinkin' sleep!
But seriously, nice to see linux certified consumer hardware making its way into the market.
Sorry for they thinkgeek plugging, not associated, just a happy part of the smart masses
Im dreaming ofa big bndwdth, That can resist the
"that this a great purchase"
What exactly is the promise of a Linux certified laptop ? Honest. With off and on support of WiFi, and neglible power saving I don't see any advantage. The hardware itself doesn't sound like anything special. With the use of linux on embeded systems rising, it would be great to see a more fine tuned approach to specialized 'Laptop' distros. heh!
I don't see this appealing to Joe User outa the box either, considering the hoops one would have to go through to get it completely 'functional'. Might as well install a fresh distro and make sure the hardware you buy is well supported. I know of at least a few freinds with better laptop setups, who did exactly that.
Many more generations to go! right?
I appeal to the wisdom of fellow
this article doesn't mention price but i'm curious to see if any fees were payed to the SCO.
He recommends the laptop "with another distribution", but doesn't actually try it with another distribution. There are no pictures of the laptop, and a very poor description of it. I smell "reviewer who got a free laptop if he would write a review but wasn't qualified to do so".
somday, someone will get everything working out of the box for linux.
It's All Politics
Don't they still have the 2.4 Kernel? I would assume the missing power features would have worked with a 2.6 Kernel or even a 2.4 Kernel with the ACPI-Patches.
Everything should work out of the box or there is no point in trying to sell it. I am sorry, but if I buy something that says linux certified on it, the sleep function should work without any effort my part. Why not just hack at a new machine without the linux sticker on it myself like I have been doing all these years? Most of us linux folk get some sort of twisted pleasure out of that kind of thing anyway. Furthermore, why would a linux novice buy a machine without a working sleep function? Its one thing to sell a house or a car and say that it is an ole' fixer upper. A laptop? C' mon.
Yes it is a great step forward, but it just seems like a half-assed one to me. Call this trolling, but if linux ever hopes to gain any respect as a desktop OS, then people shouldn't be selling "linux certified" products that don't work as they should.
It works!
/etc/yum.conf with the offshore repositories that have decsslib. CHECK
Really, though. For my needs, it's AWESOME. I use Fedora C1.
X works out of the gate, as expected. CHECK
Sound works with the base install, as expected. CHECK
Network card works immediately, as expected, at 1 Gb. (w00t!) CHECK
CD-Burner works immediately, as expected. CHECK
DVD works simply by updating
ACPI power management and CPU throttling (with cpudyn) works easily. (had to google to find that I had to put "acpi=force" on the linux line in grub.conf) CHECK
USB stuff works as expected in the base install. I've hot swapped my mouse and a digital camera - both work instantly and easily. CHECK
What's left?
1) The modem is a funky broadcom chipset that's not supported by linmodem or pctel drivers. I have an old 33.6 3com pcmcia modem card that works fine. =/
2) Wireless with the Intel 2200 BG chipset is spotty, if at all. (so far, unable to confirm operation using ndiswrapper) =/
3) I haven't yet gotten it to see my Verizon Cell phone as a modem to use it for anytime/anywhere/slow service in those rare cases it's needed. For now I'll boot into WinXP when this is needed. =/
Given the problem - that of allowing me to retain the functional capacity of my 2 Ghz Athlon Desktop system in a laptop, it's a resounding success, allowing me to retain my productivity just about anywhere.
Would I *LIKE* wireless? Would I *LIKE* modem w/o card? Sure I would - and I'm still not convinced that wireless won't work.
But the primary issue for me is productivity - not necessarily having every last bell and whistle.
Oh, and I did use 9 of the 60 GB of disk space to keep the copy of XP Home running in those rare cases that I really do need it. (Hello wireless)
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
I'm not as patient as I wish I was, which is a failing many share. As a result I don't want to spend spare hours I don't have just trying to get a system to do what I need it to do. No, installing Linux isn't difficult. But trying to figure out how to install additional (and often essential) stuff, especially drivers, is not easy, particularly if you're unfortunate enough to have spent the past X (meaning, too many) years of your life becoming familiar with Windows, and forgetting about something called a command line (and a very different syntax).
I know Windows pretty damn well now (which is why I'd love to switch to Linux...), and I began in the dark days of MS-DOS, but back then I had the time and the contacts to get help with it, to get going. That's not an option available to me any more, or most of those like me who want to switch after years as Windoze Lusers.
The hand-holding of knowledgable, experienced users helped me get started with computers, and from there I could start figuring things out for myself, but now I just need Linux to work. Once I can do what I need to, then maybe I can tinker and become familiar with the other, more geeky bits. But not if I'm expected or required to spend untold hours of hair-pulling and HOWTO-reading just to get the computer to actually work.
Come on Linux folk: start getting fully-working machines to market, and the rest of us will take the plunge. Or do you feel it should be the exclusive province of uber-geeks...?
Ebay seems like the way to go nowadays for most large ticket items, so long as you buy from reputable dealer. If you want to check out if laptops are compatible with linux, go to Linux on Laptops. On most popular laptops they have detailed lists of what distros are compatible with what portion of the hardware. Some of them like mandrake are better than windows with drivers out of the box.
ACPI... Advanced Configuration and Power Interface
This is the biggest difficulty right now with Linux and laptops. I've had an Inspiron 8600 for months now and it still can't suspend (to memory or to disk).
If you want to get ACPI working correctly a kernel recompile is necessary and I'm sorry but users aren't going to do this.
Either we step forward and fix these issues or we can't expect users or vendors to take Linux seriously as a desktop operating system.
We're so close but 20% of the remaining functionality is 80% of the work.
Sad..
Suspend is NOT an optional feature on a laptop...
The reviewer concludes that this a great purchase, as long as you are more selective over the distro installed.
Wouldn't this statement be true of almost any laptop?
This laptop should be "Linux certified" and even the review says: "Overall, this is a well-working, robust laptop, hardware-wise. My problems were all OS-related." So, what kind of a certification is this? I thought that the whole point on "certifying" something is same as promising that there are no hick-ups in the product - in hardware-wise or software-wise. Why would the company, who makes this kinds of promises, ship the hardware with the software which clearly doesn't support the hardware fully? They even admit that the computer isn't fully functional with Xandros Desktop 2.0.
I can see that in this case the "certification" is more of a promise that the machine will work with future versions of Linux distributions (which is stupid, because the LinuxCertified.com says: "We make sure that all the core components, including the screen in its full resolution, sound etc., are correctly configured with Linux.", which at least for me, is a promise of fully functional OS shipped with the product).
Consumers in general aren't interested in future compatibility of products. They want fully functional product NOW. Without any hassle of installing newer version of the OS later.
In general, I like the idea that there will be companies who are willing to guarantee that the hardware will work with Linux. But I also want to see products that are usable without any additional tinkering.
Ever heard of free? As in speech? Charging money for this goes against the entire philosophy of GNU and FSF.
Huh? How is a company charging money to put a piece of hardware through a series of tests against the philosophy of the FSF?
The manufacturer would then gain the right to put a "Linux certified" sticker on their product. Consumers who want linux compatability just have to look for the logo to be sure it will work.
Trying not to troll... My next computer will probably be a laptop, and it will be an iBook - maily because they're better made than other notebooks, rather than because I'm a Mac fan (I'm not, at least not yet). At the moment, the choice is a no-brainer. I can get a sub-1000 quid iBook these days that will do all that I want a wintel/*nix laptop for, but with very good quality hardware and *nix set-up with everything working. Compare that to spending the same cash on a less sturdy wintel item with an OS I dislike, or a less sturdy item with a reduced functionality for linux (simply because linux on a laptop is a pig to get working). I'm sure it can be done, but I just don't want to invest cash and then time as well getting it working. But rather than saying "Use OSX!" I'd say "take a lesson from Apple". Engineer a linux solution specifically for the hardware. Because trying to make it work with every distro is plainly not working, and that's not going to get me to part with my hard-earned wedge...
...because the last thing you'd want is to hick your laptop up. I've now got disturbing mental images of an old Toshiba laptop up on blocks with a rattlecan paintjob.
I agree with this. Though, there are inconsitencies. You could say "Linux 2.6 certified", while it may not work with one distribution's set of kernel patches. Well, if the LSB could be extended somehow, one could use that as a base for certifying. "Linux Standards Base 1.2 Certified" would do better, because distributions could say they are, too. And that's nothing you can fool. Either the lsb test suite runs, or it won't.
It's hiccups, not hickups. ;)
These are all questions that should have been answered, they certainly were hinted at. But no, show Eugenia some pretty pictures and she'll do a friggin backflip for you. This thing is hardly functional and she gave it seven points out of ten. In the configuration shipping to customers it won't go to sleep and the WiFi is shoddy and unreliable at best. How in the hell can something like that get seven points out of ten? Somebody got themselves a free toy laptop and gave the POS a good mark-up so the company will let her keep it. This article needs to be posted in the "How to Review Linux" story as a fine example of how not to write a review.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
Linux vendors need to understand that they are not selling the possibility that you can recompile and fix an issue, they are selling the fact that THEY have recompiled and fixed the issue for you.
:)
Geeks are using a lot of Powerbooks because the hardware is supported seamlessly for sleep, DVD play etc: Apple has recompiled bsd for you
This is not a signature.
When I know my WiFi card will work on a Linux box as well as it does under Windows (or better!), and everything else too, without me having to "learn computers" all over again, I will become a Linux user. Until then, no. I just don't have the time to spare. Which is a real shame, because I really do want -- need -- a better OS!
And we all know that /. editors LOVE geekgirls! Remember Blackbird Alder? What did she do professionally that 1,000s of guygeeks can't, and better? Nothing. But she's a...well...she. A geekgirl stereotype, right out of Hollywood's 'People in Computers' 101 course: hard as nails, cool as ice, big boots, black clothes.
/. editor in particular certainly helped to keep her "news" item on the /. front page for a record length of time.
Oh, and being the object of one
So that's all there is to it: be a chick computer reviewer (or chick computer anything), and you're guaranteed a primo spot on 'Slashdot; News for Editors who really wish they could get a girlfriend'...
Oh, and watch us both get modded down to (Score:-1, Troll, Flamebait, Meanie) really, really fast!
Anyways...as I said before, it's a good sign that companies are starting to make the effort to differentiate their notebook offerings on the basis of explicit Linux support, even if there is a little work that needs to be done yet. I am certainly interested in ordering one of these machines, as my old Dell Inspiron with a 500MHz Pentium III CPU running GNU/Debian Linux is certainly starting to show its age. I would still have a few questions about the LC2210's Debian compatibility though. Not mentioned in the review is the notebook's compatibility with apt-get, for instance. Do people think that I would be able to use apt-get without running into typical issues like robust ACPI support? Does anyone know what graphics chip this thing is using, and if so, would it work without screen corruption when using heavily GUI-oriented apps like dselect?
I look forward to the community's response!!
All the information is out there, why not just provide it freely to end users. After all, information wants to be free!
Dang, I have modpoints but amongst all the options there is not ability to mark this post 'Product of the fevered mind of a pinhead'
Huh? How is a company charging money to put a piece of hardware through a series of tests against the philosophy of the FSF?
because YHBT
cooincidentally i was reading another review (from their site) of the same laptop recently, but this one is with redhat. interesting comparisson.
personally i am actually interested in these LC laptops because for me (in australia) they are so cheap. anyone with personal experience of shipping/delivery costs/times overseas, problems etc, would be appreciated.
can it run windows?
;-)
yes i know it can, it was a lame joke right from the start
They act as if this laptop is any worse than any other when it comes to Wi-Fi. It's just the way Linux is... Wireless is such a PITA in Linux - missing simple features such as the ability to scan for SSID's that are broadcasting.
-Imidazole2
If you need to develop with Java using a modern IDE, an Apple laptop might not be what you are looking for. G4 is a lot slower running Eclipse than Pentium-M.
:)
Anyway - I am currently typing an 800Mhz iBook G4 very happily and even run Eclipse on this one occasionally
Vaadin - the best open source framework for building web applications in Java - no plug
RANTMODE on
I've looked high and low for computers, available to John Doe-home-consumer, that had Linux preinstalled. Oh, they exist, there are places where you can buy laptops with Linux preinstalled. But, look at them, either they are from companies that refuse to sell home systems with Linux preinstalled like IBM or Dell, or they are a generic non-branded factory laptop sold by seemingly an upstart.
The later is no biggy, truthfully we have to start from some where, and frankly many of the IBM/Dell lines are rebranded components. No secret, ever take apart your cheapo radio (Emerson) to find the speakers are Pioneer and the electronics by JVC?
In any case, the available solutions are rather pathetic. For example, I have been unable to find a laptop that boasts a 1600x1200 LCD, preinstalled with Linux. Unless we happen upon a Dell from a service that will sell you a refurb, but that's totally different; at some point, Microsoft still made a dollar on that machine. So, some of the readers don't value the LCD resolution as much as I do, but other components are pretty sore as well. Compare hardware specs to a new Dell/Apple to one of those generic no-brands. Pretty pathetic, and the cost of pre-installed Linux laptops are extrodinary; even when the laptop is a re-sold item.
VALinux, IBM both have tried to sell laptops to the consumer market with Linux preinstalled. Or, atleast I thought IBM offered the T22 with Linux, I'm not 100% sure. The T22 wasn't all that great a machine to me, now and then. As for VALinux, they sold a laptop, that was several hundreds of dollars more expensive than a comparable one with hundreds of dollars in pre-installed software, Microsoft software.
So, now, we have the Walmart line of desktops with Linux pre-installed. I wouldn't buy one. My god, the hardware is a joke. For some reason, it seems, companies think that just becuase the OS is free that those who use Linux opt for the cheapest quality and lowest line of hardware. No! I don't want a Celeron, or Centrino(whatever) CPU. I want the same hardware, middle line on up, that is found in the rest of the market, only with Linux preinstalled and the price reflecting it.
I can only assume, Microsoft is behind it making it more expensive to avoid giving them money than to just pay up. Which, I think should be illegal but apparently it's not.
RANTMODE off
to work with Linux, unless you use the wrong distro, or the wrong version, or use unsupported peripherals or...
Damn, I left my good sig in my other pants
--if I had just bought a *brand new* expensive laptop (well, to me anything brand new is expensive, heh) and the buttons on the desktop didn't work I'd be seriously annoyed. I know if I was SELLING them I just wouldn't do it, would keep tweaking until they did. "The internet" is sorta the most important default application stuff that should "just work" when you get any new machine for most people and uses. And what's the issue with WiFi anyway, the companies who make these things are jerks when it comes to drivers for linux? If so seems like a nifty way for some unemployed geeks to collaborate on a product out there, a wireless card that runs on all OSes of note, built from scratch from the ground up. Proly take some VC to build it, but a real product has merit when shopping for money.
IS there a good battery life, runs all linux and runs it well, direct from the factory laptop out there now? I don't follow that too closely to know. I do recall reading here a few times about the transmeta chips, wonder if a laptop built around them would be better as a true mobile device. That and bring back dual hot swappable batteries built-in.
I work for the RIAA. I'd be very happy to take care of your request:
Just give us your full name and address, as well as the name of your ISP. Within four to six weeks you will receive a letter from our attorneys requiring you to return a form detailing which albums you have downloaded, which network you have gotten them from and whether you have shared them with other people (i.e. P2P). It then works out like this: if you just downloaded the music and not shared it with anyone else, you will be offered the chance to make payments regarding the music you have pirated, usually at the rate it is sold at iTunes. If you have shared the music in P2P networks, the formula becomes a bit more complex and I sincerely advise you to contact a lawyer who can negotiate an acceptable payment scheme, although the going rate is about 335 USD per track.
Should you prove reluctant to willingly give me your details I will be forced to contact the Cmdr Taco regarding this matter. I am certain he will be more than willing to furnish us with the IP addresses used to post from your account rather than be involved in a long drawn legal battle. Also, if you are not a citizen of this country, we shall contact local authorities in your country of residence as well as the local recording association so that steps can be taken. We are usually very lenient regarding exchange of music on the internet, but when someone blatantly admits to a crime on a public forum, it is my obligation to not let the subject pass.
Kind regards,
F R McAllister, Esq
Has anyone tried running Yellow Dog Linux on a PowerBook?
I would be interested in hearing the performance and ease of use. I am particularly interested in the performance of the PowerPC chip and the integration of the hardware with the OS. In fact I would be interested in purchasing a Mac and wiping the OSX to run native Linux - can someone enlighten me on OSX; is it like running Cygwin on a PC?
The main reason towards my shift on the MAC hardware is the PowerPC chip, the keyboard lights discussed recently, Titanium/Magnesium Frame & shell, FireWire 800, the list goes on. What does other Slashdoters recommend on running Linux on a PowerPC architecture?
Ignorance and prejudice and fear
Walk hand in hand
Basically acoording to her little bio she has no clue how to review hardware. Dont blame her for being clueless, blame the moron who hired her.
Name: Eugenia Loli-Queru
Title: Editor in Chief
Email: eugeniaosnewscom
Personal website: http://www.eugenia.co.uk/
Birthday: 1973
Current residence: Bay Area, CA, USA
Short biography: I served for 2 years at BeNews, serving the BeOS and its community (this is all past now, but still full of great memories), and before that I was contributing as a news editor for a well known Gaming news site for about 8 months and I also co-held a fan site (LandOfEden) in the early development days of Lionhead's Black'n'White game. For more information about me, you can always check my homepage. Alternative email address: eloli --AT-- hotmail --DOT-- com
I am Greek and english is not my native language. I do OSNews for pure fun (it is just a hobby for me in order to fill up my free time), so if you have a problem with my spelling and grammar either:
a) do not come back (spare us and save your time too)
b) send me a proofread version of the article in question. Whining about something I can't radically improve overnight, is not an option.
Or do you feel it should be the exclusive province of uber-geeks...?
Too often the same applies to Windows 2000 and Windows XP. Come on, admit it. Bet you can't accurately remember how many of your family members and friends you've helped with problems installing hardware on Windows.
You probably don't remember because when it comes to Windows, all's forgiven when things go wrong. It's expected things will go wrong, but that's alright. It's Windows. (I help businesses, every day, with their Windows messes using a sweet, reliable Linux laptop.)
Of course, the reverse expectation is true for Linux. It's expected to be a pain. So when it is a pain, OMG! There you go, just not up to "perfection", yet, is it...
About the only way you're going to get better than Linux or Windows is to have an iron grip on hardware variables and a very high-bar for software standards. So, why aren't there more posts bashing Windows with an Apple?
Let's face it: When it comes to affordable computing, there's a lot of crap out there in the hardware department. It's hardware manufacturers -- not Windows or Linux -- who need to get their act together. That, or peopple need to simply "get it" when it comes to where the real problems are at.
I am all for buying hardware where the vendor guarantees Linux compatibility. I think the main reason people claim that Windows is "easier to maintain" these days is because they compare laptops with Windows pre-installed to oddball laptops on which Linux needs to be installed by hand.
But there are plenty of laptops that run Linux well, and there are plenty of companies that pre-install those laptops with Linux (your choice of distribution) and guarantee that it works. So, I wouldn't really put too much stake in this one review either way.
OK, I fibbed. It's a Linux notebook.
Summary: Very small portable computer with a regular keyboard. The base system is built on a name-brand hardware (Sharp) with a customized Linux distribution on it. The customizations take care of the specific hardware; just like Dell, IBM, Compaq/HP, Sony, and -- well -- Sharp do for the customized versions of Windows they ship. Includes support, and yes you can update the packages -- just don't expect support for packages they don't provide.
The company selling this one has other name-brand hardware that fit other categories of notebook/laptops.
Element computer also has a good selection of hardware customized for Linux. Not rebranded IBM/Sony/Sharp/... though you can get a notepad laptop of you want -- ready to go -- and it looks like good stuff. They do not sell Windows, so you won't be paying Microsoft like Emperorlinux had to (using top-notch hardware with Windows already bundled on it).
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
Best IBM Thinkpad ever. The outside is thick rubber.
I am using a t40 now - great laptop but I miss the design of the 600E.
By the way, I would never stand on a Thinkpad. Is that really true?
with windows, you know the certified drivers will work for your hardware.
with windows, you can be pretty sure the NON certified drivers will work for your hardware.
for linux, you just.dont.know. it might work great, if some decent coder happened to purchase the same item you did, some months before. otherwise, good luck.
Does it disturb anyone else that this "certified" laptop was made by the same people who offer linux training and certification?
:-P
maybe it's part of the certification to fix it
-mix
I'm procrastinating something right now, so I think I'll kill some time by feeding the trolls.
The Smartass ResponseA UNIX user only uses the mouse for one task: switching between terminal windows. One mouse button is sufficient for this task.
The Serious ResponseInterfaces to Mac programs are designed in such a way that one mouse button is sufficient, just as MS Windows programs are designed to work with only two mouse buttons. You only need the extra buttons when running X11 programs. If you do this only occasionally (as I do), you can emulate the other buttons by holding the Option or Command keys while clicking the mouse. Otherwise, as another poster suggested, you can simply plug in a three-button mouse. When I bought my iBook, I bought a three-button USB mouse thinking that I would be using X11 all the time, but the only X11 programs that I use are xfig, ddd (a gdb frontend), and the GIMP, and those aren't programs that I use every day.
The mouse button issue is very overrated, in my opinion. On a desktop system, there is nothing to prevent you from replacing the Apple mouse with the pointing device of your choice. On laptops, cramming mouse buttons below the touchpad isn't very practical, anyway. There isn't much space to work with, and as you cram more buttons into that space, the buttons must be made smaller so that they can all fit, and using the mouse buttons becomes increasingly awkward. I've found that, for casual use, it's faster and more ergonomic to use the Command and Option keys to emulate the extra buttons than to reposition my hand so that I can find the button I want to click. If you're using something like xfig that requires lots of mouse use, a laptop touchpad really isn't suitable regardless of how many buttons it has, and you're better off using a USB mouse anyway.
SteveSo basically... linux certified is saying that I can get it to boot up, keyboard, mouse, and an X interface all work
WTF
I'm sorry, but the laptop I'm running on right now is more linux-compatible than the so-called certified machine, and even then I wouldn't put a stamp on it (winmodem hasn't a 'nix driver yet).
all the major hardware/functionality to work (including your keyboard/mouse/video/modem/NICs/keys/sound/APM).
Seriously, if I bought a "certified" laptop only to find that these things didn't work (or didn't work properly), I'd be rather pissed. As it is I get annoyed at my currently laptop when I have to switch into windows (dual-boot) to use the winmodem when I'm not able to connect to high-speed.
If you're that hard up for it, you buy yourself an external mouse or plug in the one that you already own or install SideTrack and stop complaining about stupid shit.
T Money
World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
... and again, not being a member of slashdot means that like three people will read this, but whatever.
/root/lc2000 and instruct you to copy them somewhere else before you reformat the machine (or as goes unstated, before something happens to the drive, because the install DVD alone won't put your machine back in the proper state). The CD burner worked out of the box, immediately put to use burning CDs that should have shipped with the machine!
/etc)?
First of all, it's not Linux certified, it's "Linuxcertified" - a brand name (though even they miff the spacing sometimes, like on the install DVD they give you: "Linux" is written to the right and "Certified" going down).
Secondly, I was real surprised as I found out that the little silver buttons on the front do nothing, and I felt the same way about suspend.
The "function" keys in general don't seem to do anything. "Brightness up" and "brightness down" buttons work fine (probably because they are straight hardware), but F1 (a little moon image, probably for suspend) does nothing, I've never tested the "laptop / monitor out" button, "vol up" and "vol down" don't do anything (I don't care, either, to be honest.
Mine shipped with Fedora (I've been mostly a RH guy, curse my corporate libertarian soul), and as far as actually using it, once I got over the hiccups, it's been great. I say this because I'm going to list the problems, and I think they are typical of a novice with a Linux box, and it might sound negative- but I love my new laptop.
1- They install a ton of drivers to make things (like MP3s) work at the factory, and updates. They ship you the install DVD (for Fedora), and put all the other drivers and associated files in
2- Without suspend, it has to go on and off a lot more than normal. It has a "rapid shutoff" feature that happens when you hit the power button, that works ok. But turning it on takes quite sometime, as it sits there humping the wifi card, presumably trying to activate it. Shades of Solaris. I disabled it, figuring I'll turn it back on, you know, when I'm near a place that can use it.
3- Go hunting down reviews of this, and you'll see some complain about a "jumping pointer". This is replicable (and tech support knew all about it, though they didn't have it anywhere on their website or in a note or anything) by adding the "monitor battery life" applet to the gnome bar. Maybe some other things do it. Their tech support told me to type acpi to view remaining battery life. Ok, but how about a heads up that moving that graphical applet to the bar (and remember, adding applets in Gnome is supposed to be one of the things a nontechnical person could do, it's supposed to be something you can feel safe with, unlike anything under
That's pretty much it. I haven't had time to test everything in the universe on it and such. It takes longer than me 3 GHz machine to launch OO.org, but hey, I was expecting that. It's at a lower resolution than I'm used to, but I was expecting that too. I wasn't expecting the lack of hardware integration- they obviously buy these things from a manufacturer (in Taiwan, I believe) that has them built for Windows, and they don't have the work arounds to use the proprietary buttons yet. They should, it makes it look unpolished.
Many of the reviews here say "Buy a Dell (or other namebrand)." There's nothing really wrong with this, but I'll say this in LinuxCertified's defense:
1- They may not be Dell when it comes to market penetration, but if you have a problem with your Linux configuration, you can send them an email and the response will never be "Linux? What the hell is that, boy?!"
2- Also, Microsoft doesn't get any money- which isn't going to be a competitive advantage in the marketplace, but might be here on Slashdot. Other vendors offer this in varying amounts, that Element computing company does that as well. Emperor Linux does not (but I bet their suspend works out of the box).
3- The buttons don't work *yet*. Suspend doesn't work *yet*. This is a free software OS, a solution is inevitable.
There's no market for it. Why do you expect Dell to spend many thousands of dollars of R&D to produce, nice, high-end Linux machines, of which they may sell a handful?
A. Most people don't want Linux for a workstation. That's a fact.
B. Those few people who do are generally too cheap to pay for a nice, pre-configured system, and would rather buy a piece of shit and download Linux themselves and spend their own time wrestling with it.
It has nothing to do with MS other than the fact is that people want W2K and WinXP on their laptops, not Linux.
I bought a dual-boot system from LinuxCertified in middle of February. I had thought that I would be using both parts of my system half the time. But, I am completely dependent on Linux now. I have not even booted Windows since early April. I am looking into shrinking that part of the system down now ;)
In any case coming back to the point. Here are my observations about this laptop:
I ordered with Fedora (which is what the sales guy on the phone recommended):
Mini-pci built-in wireless card works flawlessly. I think I have achieved the best range possible - hopefully my neighbor is not reading this ;)
Magic buttons on the front work. after power on, click on a button and my email shows up...
My kernel compiles faster than on my desktop (which is about one year older though). I do driver development work - in case any of you have any open projects.
My only negative (which is my fault) is that I have a 1024x768 screen. I should have ordered the version with higher resolution.
Unfortunately that is the problem with the Dell 8600 (and 8500 like I have). APM is not an option on these laptops and the only available DSDT that works is a bit tricky to figure out.
I've had to go back and forth on my laptop with Linux and XP mostly because of that fact... it's pretty hard to deal with no suspend on a laptop.
Secondly, I think people should use what works for them. If windows works for you then use windows.
Unfortunately, Windows is causing major problems for people OTHER than its users, on the net and elsewhere, due to its poor design.
First: The poor security of windows results in repeated bursts of traffic clogging the net for days at a time, as the latest security vulnerabilities are exploited by viruses and worms. Microsoft has shown little competence at fixing these issues, which are becoming more rather than less of a problem with time as the malware authors improve their designs faster than Microsoft can fix their systems. There is no sign that this trend will reverse.
Arguments that the wider deployment of Microsoft products makes them a bigger target are disproved by the web server counterexample: Apache is far more widely used than Microsoft's IIS, yet IIS gets virtually all the exploits.
But with actual industries based on malware exploiting Windows security bugs, malware authors are polishing destructive payloads. With every passing year this increases the threat from malware ports to other more secure (though imperfect) systems, once windows is finally on its way out. It's much like the way large reservoir of disease increases the risk of plagues to currently uninfested areas.
Second: Microsoft's IP stacks "cheat" when setting the Quality of Service (QoS) bits, demanding higher service levels than the applications actually need or request. This once gave them improved performance over their competition. But it puts their low-priority traffic (like file transfers) in the way of streaming applications (like VoIP or videoconferencing).
This has impeded deployment of QoS sensitive applications, as well as proper deployment of QoS support and QoS-dependent services in both the enterprise and the network core. Currently they're supported by hacks - such as putting the VoIP phones on a separate virtual LAN that is given higher priority, VoIP phones with an "extension" outlet for the workstation which rewrite the QoS bits on the workstation's packets, and other router/switch/bridge/firewall/edge-router hacks that downgrade or selectively downgrade the QoS settings on customer packets.
This rewriting of QoS bits means that streaming applications running on Windows workstations can't get the service levels they need, and thus don't run as well as they should on workstations (which is part of why you see separate IP phone hardware, and why VoIP applications are so flakey). So it finally bit Microsoft, too. They now have an incentive to fix it. But projects to do so are delayed behind their frantic attempts to patch their security bugs. And even once they DO fix it there would be the problem of getting the fixes deployed, and onto legacy systems as well.
Meanwhile, OTHER OSes which DON'T cheat also have to deal with an internet where QoS isn't properly implemented, and where in some cases their packets get the same QoS-rewriting penalizations as are necessary to defend servers against Microsoftware's misbehavior.
The Microsoft shepherd cried "Wolf!" repeatedly (and still does). So now the townsfolk won't respond when ANY shepherd cries "Wolf!"
Third: Microsoft has deliberately deployed proprietary data and interface formats that don't interoperate with the products of other vendors, and has "embraced/extended (i.e. broken)/extinguished" even some proprietary standards. This results in things like email, web sites, and documents that won't work with - or even break - other people's tools, locking their customers into Microsoft products and impeding communication, not just between them and other internet users, but also among other internet users (as, for instance, clueless web designers write sites that assume Microsoft's browser).
This has placed an extra load on application designers, as they must reverse-engineer and support Microsoft proprietary formats so their users can communicate with the people still stuc
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
I have a Dell Latitude CSX and it works like a charm. Debian (installed through Knoppix) is the most compatible (works better than windows on my father's same model laptop!), (SuSE was ok but had to re-insert the card after sleep and Mandrake 10 Community would sometimes crash after sleep).
I went through some training classes from LinuxCertified before. At the time I was still some what new to linux and the instructors of the class were very informative and had been using linux for a while. There was also a free laptop included with the cost of the class. It was an old refurbished Pentium II IBM Thinkpad, but it was handy at the time, and still is as a crash-n'-burn test laptop. I've upgraded the RAM and the hard drive to 20GB. I get occasional time errors on boot up, but that is because of the battery that is dying and I'm to lazy to replace it. Overall a good company. Worth checking out...
You are not root, go away.
I'm not trying to be RMS-ing on anyone, but seriously if your laptop can only run a specific distro with specific proprietary drivers, sooner or later you may become that hardware/software vendor's bitch.