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Virtual MMO Currency Trading Crippled By Fraud
Thanks to Terra Nova for pointing to the Gaming Open Market website, home of "the next generation of [MMO] game commodity trading", where there's an announcement that: "Until further notice, Gaming Open Market will be closing its doors to all game currency trading except Second Life." There's more information in a post at the official Second Life forums, where Jamie Hale explains: "Yesterday, I had a user breeze through spending over $3000 USD on [EVE Online] and [Star Wars Galaxies]. Immediately after taking delivery of the ISK and credits, he reversed all the payments, claiming he never received the goods. This is a well-known loophole in PayPal's seller protection policy. Basically, I have no recourse at all. PayPal accepts no form of proof of delivery except physical waybills (UPS, FedEx, etc)."
I heard recently that the "virtual economy" created by the world of MMORPGs is larger than the Chinese stock market.
Quit messing around with Paypal, and call the District Attorney where the guy lives.
He has admitted he commited fraud, get him arrested and see him in court.
From the thread:
"So basically, we're out $3000, or about 70% of our profits since January. And to be completely honest, it hurts."
Sorry, you sir need to get into a new business. The one you are currently in sucks for you, sucks for the game, and sucks for the people playing the games. MMORPG's are NOT a job. People who are spending real money for in-game advantage through third parties should be shot in the street for being so stupid.
That said, you're an idiot for using PayPal. Blame yourself, not the person that caught you with your pants down.
schild
editor, f13.net
What you need to do is ship a cd to the buyer with the codes to access the virtual items/characters.
That is a physical delivery, and paypal WILL support you and help you solve your problem. Very sad that you had this problem, but you need to make sure to use any/all services you subscribe to your advantage and not blindly trust in your customers. There are a lot of people that will do you much worse than a couple thousand given the opportunity.
Who's going to start the first escrow service for gamers..
People who are spending real money for in-game advantage through third parties should be shot in the street for being so stupid.
Now, why is that exactly? Let's look at the situation.
Person A spends 20 hours a week playing MMOX to build up his level 245 Necromancer Dark Elf Paladin. He then enjoys playing the game as such.
Person B spends $200 on a level 245 Necromancer Dark Elf Paladin. He then enjoys playing the game as such.
Frankly, I don't see any objective difference between the two. Granted, the specific gaming experiences for players A and B are different, but externally they're the same. One spends his time, the other, his money. Both to play A GAME! IT'S A GAME! GAME!!! It's supposed to be FUN! FUN! GAME!
Games are NOT serious. Player B didn't enjoy working through a level grind to get the character he wanted, or maybe he makes enough per hour to justify the expense. Either way, it's all for the sake of fun. Just because he has fun with the result, while you have fun with the process, doesn't mean he's any different from you.
You see, these are GAMES. You play them to have FUN. Not everyone has fun in the same way.
So, my question is basically why does this suck for the game, and for the people playing games, if the purpose of a game is to have fun?
GeekNights!
Late Night Radio for Geeks!
Yep, if a theif is able to steal something, he should be entitled to keep it and go free. I'll try that line the next time I "teach Best Buy a lesson."
The best argument I've heard thus far FOR the practice of buying MMO items and money is that some people simply don't have the time to play as much as others. To some it's not a big deal to spend some cash to get themselves to the point where the powergamers already are at. I'm not saying I agree with the tactics of the fraudulent bunch out there, but I don't think executing people for legitimately spending their money as they see fit is a valid argument either.
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
-Hoban Washburn
It sucks for the game because the person who bought the level 245 Necromancer Dark Elf Paladin is skipping the majority of the world that the developers put their blood, sweat and tears into.
It sucks for the players (not all of them) but the ones he might interact with because having skipped the majority of the game, in all likelihood, doesn't know shit about the game and will wreck nothing but newbie havok upon those stupid enough to group with him.
MMOGs are a game, yes. But it's also a type of business that relies on player retention. When someone skips from the beginning to the end the chance of retention is probably dropped about 90% because the only thing the player will take part in is the endgame.
The person who played 20 hours a week may very well have catassed his way up there. But I can guarantee you he'll generate more free PR through word of mouth than the guy who dropped his wad on a pre-leveled character.
Doesn't sound like you play MMOGs much.
schild
editor, f13.net
Not completely disagreeing with you. But MMORPGs go well beyond games for a lot of people. They are environments for social interaction with other humans. As such, the word "game" is almost derisive.
And I rarely heard my fellow EQ players 5 years ago call the level grind fun. City of Heroes might be a different story from what I've heard.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
What you are failing to see is that MMORPG's aren't just about your experience, they are about everybody's experience.
If I sepnd $200 for a level 245 Necromancer, that is probably because I can't get there myself, either because I am a dumbass, or whatever. I haven't experienced enough of the game to have attained that level (in general). I am going ot make bumbling, stupid mistakes that the original player wouldn't have. I don't care, I am having fun.
Until I start routing newbie areas out of frustration, so the the real newbies can never get any XP, because I have killed an entire zone by looking crosseyed at it.
And then there are the people that would buy this character, again, because they could never get one of their own that high, but with malicious intent. They want to exact revenge on someone they think wronged them.
They ruin the game for other people. I don't think they physically should be shot, but I think roving gangs of high level PK'ers should identify these characters, and make their life hell.
Now if a certain development house (NCSoft) would just kick Chinese IPs from their NA servers like they did to NA IPs on their Korean servers, I can start really playing, and I can safely ignore cries of RANG RANG and 999999 from ebay/etc. adena farmers.
Finally, one less site selling in-game stuff for money. Almost every MMO has a policy against this, but they do it anyway. It has to stop. It is cheating. I don't care about any arguments about the time it takes to do X in the game. Why not just create an idspispopd equivalent? That's what developers are doing if they don't at least fight this.
Heute die Welt, morgen das Sonnensystem!
It sucks for the game because the person who bought the level 245 Necromancer Dark Elf Paladin is skipping the majority of the world that the developers put their blood, sweat and tears into.
The person who played the character to level 245 didn't skip the majority of the world.
Mail them a piece of paper that has the codes on it. They have to sign for the letter, they are liable.
My user number is prime. Is yours?
No. Defrauding someone like the guy in this article did is illegal. Show me a court case or law proving that selling virtual goods is illegal. Simply put, it isn't. There is a difference between being against the EULA (which selling money and items in MMOs usually is) and being against the law.
If you want to keep control of 'your'character, the solution is still simple. Create a third online character, give the third character all the virtual money, send the codes for the third character via registered post.
This may require a new subscription to whatever game you happen to be playing, but in the grand scheme of things the cost for one month's subscription is peanuts compared to $3000.
Second Life is not a game. The developers ENCOURAGE online money trading.
SL is more like massively multiplayer productivity software with a social aspect. In it, you can create just about anything you can imagine, you can build 3D objects, script them, you can customize your avatars to the hilt and make custom animations for them in poser. It is a dream for machinima.
After setting up a shop and making a few cool items, you can make money without spending a single minute in world. Since 99% of the content in SL is provided by the players, the developers offer the players monetary rewards in US dollars every month for the most popular content, and encourage anyone who is left out of the "rewarded few" to sell their game money on GOM and IGE, so that they are still rewarded for their content development effort.
The amounts of money involved are nowhere near trivial. I have made the equivalent of $800 USD, and my lifetime membership only cost me $160.
Stop posting about that which you know nothing about. Oh, wait, this is slashdot, I should be expecting this kind of thing already.
Buying and selling money is a normal aspect of SL, encouraged by the developers. And SL is not a game either.
Except breaking the EULA is the same as copyright infringment, and is against the law.
You don't have the right to use a copyrighted material in anyway unless the creator grants that right. In the case of these games, the EULA describes how the creator is granting those rights. Abuse of the EULA is copyright vilation.
Is it right or wrong? Different debate.
No offense, but $800 dollars in a MMORPG game is not that much money.
Castles and rares in UO sold for THOUSANDS at a time, I was too young to know what the hell was happening or how much money was actually changing hands. However, there were cases of people in Asheron's Call made upwards of 50k a year selling (duped) items and pyreals, and one character in September 2000 sold for $5000. I never played Everquest, so I don't know the numbers on that game, but even in the "non-major" games there has been lots of money floating around.
And although it may seem like a lot of money to a college student, $800 is nothing to someone that has been around the scene for a while.
So how big is the community in there : And are they mostly 3d-modelers/ coders on there, or a more general mix of people ?
Yeah, because no one ever gives someone an advantage they didn't earn in an online RPG.
well, except people who power-level others. and friends that pump up friends with ultra-twink gear. oh, and people that just out-grew a set of equipment and are willing to give it away for free.
about the only thing wrong with item currency exchanges is that it's an unfair advantage over other players that stick solely to the game. but, it's not like they're the only ones out there "cheating". In fact, about the only ones in persistant world games not cheating are those weirdo role-players sitting in the bars and taverns just hanging out and absolute noobs.
I've never used them, but if someone's not willing to put forth the effort, but willing to shell out the extra cash to play, why the hell not?
The World's Worst Webcomic!
The person who played the character to level 245 didn't skip the majority of the world.
So what? It's not a 1:1 correspondence; the Level 245 characters tend to come from one person making characters and selling them as a job. Besides, you're not refuting his point at all; if the person who bought the character instead started from scratch, then you'd have two people playing through the game instead of one.
Rob (I almost typed "paying" up there instead of "playing." That certainly would've been apropos)
You post sounds like someone who only plays single-player games. From that POV your post makes complete sense, but this isn't about single-player games.
"Not everyone has fun in the same way."
For example, griefers have fun by ruining the fun of others. And cheaters have fun by changing the rules midway through the game.
I ask you to choose a game you really enjoy, play it with either a griefer or cheater, and then TRY to repeat your assertions.
This is not my sig.
It sucks for the game because the person who bought the level 245 Necromancer Dark Elf Paladin is skipping the majority of the world that the developers put their blood, sweat and tears into.
So what? If he paid for the game like everyone else, then the devs got their money for their blood sweat and tears.
It sucks for the players (not all of them) but the ones he might interact with because having skipped the majority of the game, in all likelihood, doesn't know shit about the game and will wreck nothing but newbie havok upon those stupid enough to group with him.
And that's different from about 90% of the rest of the idiot players how exactly?
MMOGs are a game, yes. But it's also a type of business that relies on player retention. When someone skips from the beginning to the end the chance of retention is probably dropped about 90% because the only thing the player will take part in is the endgame.
How is this the player's problem? If the devs made the game more interesting in the beginning instead of just a leveling treadmill, then maybe people would be more inclined to play all the way through.
The person who played 20 hours a week may very well have catassed his way up there. But I can guarantee you he'll generate more free PR through word of mouth than the guy who dropped his wad on a pre-leveled character.
Again, that's someone else's problem, not the player's.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
"This incident has been reported to the FBI Internet Fraud Department, and tomorrow to the RCMP. We have compiled as much information as possible on this person, including his name, address, phone number, email addresses and the IPs used to log into our site. All of this information will be turned over to the authorities."
And that should just about make sure the guy is found. Paypal does do some 'decent' checks to verify your identity when setting up accounts.
Definitely more artists and creative types. There had a "waiting list" for approval by the developers, to make sure you didn't say anything offensive. in SL, pretty much anything goes. The creative output of the playerbase is nothing short of amazing.
hookers and grits.
On the surface SL looks a lot like There and Active Worlds, but the difference is that SL is more geared to giving everyone tools and letting them create the content instead of feeding you with content created by the company itself.
There are a lot of amateur and professional coders and 3d modelers in SL. I know of at least a few people who have admitted to me that they currently work with big 3d game companies and have shown me their real-life professional portfolio.
The tools are actually surprisingly good too for such an environment. Most technically-minded people seem to be impressed by what they've created.
- Building and linking models using 3d primitives
- Scripting objects to interact, move, or exhibit certian behaviors. The syntax is much like event-modeled C and the API has over 200 function calls.
- Custom texturing where you upload arbitrary TGA/JPG textures which you can place on any object or wear as clothing
- Custom sounds where you upload arbitrary WAV files and can script them to play however you want
- You can now also upload custom "poser" animations you can script or apply directly to your avatar
Of course with a lot of amateurs there will be varying degrees of quality for different builds. Some people are content with sticking with the default "plywood" texture that comes when you build, and others seem to remind me of the days of the netscape (blink) tag as they like to try to use every feature in the toolbox on their builds. But for the most part it's a trip to explore the world and quite easy to make things.
Admittedly the name of the world is quite cheesy, but the technical achievement is fairly impressive and worth taking a look at.
My sig contains a referral, but if that offends you, click here instead to go directly to the website.
Ignore the crappy screenshots and BS marketing crap on their website, it doesn't represent the in-world well, and you'll find it's a lot more impressive once you log in than the website will lead you to believe. =)
Please consider making an automatic monthly recurring donation to the EFF
I can't comment on how good or evil it is to buy your way into a MMORPG, since I don't play those, but I can say that Gaming Open Market has provided an excellent serviced to Second Life, which isn't a MMORPG at all. There's no treadmill, there's no game objectives, and buying and selling goods is part of the purpose of the SL metaverse. The developers of SL encourage people to trade cash on GOM, because it served the valuable purpose of keeping the cash moving in the virtual economy. If it weren't for GOM, then most of the cash would be tied up in the accounts of a handful of wealthy players. I've played SL for months now. I run a business in-world where I build and script vehicles and sell them. GOM helps me in two ways. First, new players who want to go shopping can pick up a few extra "Linden Dollars" at GOM. Second, I can sell my in-world profits on GOM for US dollars. Now, when you say, "People who are spending real money for in-game advantage through third parties should be shot in the street for being so stupid," I think it's obvious that you don't understand what people are paying for. Buying Linden dollars is like buying software, or buying that expansion pack for your favourite game. By spending US dollars to buy a Second Life game currency, you're buying an enhancement to your entertainment software. Are you saying that it's stupid to pay for software? That's an entirely different argument. I don't see how buying and selling Linden dollars for US$ could be wrong or stupid when it helps the game economy and makes the game more enjoyable. Sounds like a good way to spend your entertainment dollar to me. I'm really sorry that this happpened to GOM and I hope they get back on their feet soon.
That's a pretty unnecessary statement. I'd venture to say he's played them enough to know full well what the phrase "level grind" means. Well enough to understand why some people will spend real world money on preleveled characters to skip the whole process.
Personally, I play several MMOs, and I'm the type who levels his character through the conventional means, grinding away. Because for ME, it's about experiencing the game the developers created -- that's FUN to me. But for some, it's not. *shrug*
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
-Hoban Washburn
PayPal seems to try and market itself as the new way to pay for things online. However it is completely incompatible with any sort of online only system.
I work for a small software company, $20 buys you the current version of our software, and all future versions for free. You pay via paypal, use the software for a while, then force a refund since (as has already been mentioned) there is absolutely no way for us to contest it. The PayPal resposne boxes just don't work allow for anything other than a tracking number. You get the refund, and we get squat.
This is only moderatly bad for us, I can delete the account, so there is no real loss (apart from my time). But take a company like www.TransmissionFilms.com, if they took PayPal and random client B watched a movie, then reversed payment, they have no recourse. And worse than that, they might be contractually obligated to pay the creator of the film $X since the film was watched.
I think that PayPal needs to step up and embrace the technology that allows it to thrive. Allow merchants to specify exactly what will be provided during registration (ie username, password, account name, etc), and possibly some third party way of validating that data. The customer would be presented with information on exactly what PayPal thinks they should be receiving, at time of purchase. The fraud department would also need to be staffed with people, not drones, to deal with issues that arised thereafter.
paul reinheimer
Actually no it's the gaming companies that suck. They should be providing equivilant services, rather than catering to the whims of a few loudmouthed brats who scrape their $15/month together to sweat and slave in their parents basement then get upset when someone else buys a level 245 character.
There is a demand for this sort of service to go on. The world of MMOs is getting crouded, and sooner or later some publisher is going to latch on to the idea (actually, Second Life already has but sooner or later the pack will get a clue) that your character in a MMO is yours and not theirs and they'll let you treat it as your property, sell it, trade it, etc.
I mean, on one hand I agree with you clueless noobs buying a level 245 are annoying. But are they any less annoying as level 1 clueless newbs begging for items and buffs? No. It doesn't matter what level they are they're still clueless noobs. Better they be 245 and don't drive off your actual new player population by pissing them off.
It's as bad as whineing that people with $$BIG BUX$$ and faster connections/computers own your ass at quake. Life isn't fair. Games aren't either. Learn to cope.
*: Note, some bitterness in this post may be due to missing out on selling game items by the poster due to finally quitting a game that also happens to have recently banned the sale of items period.
As always, the Turbine MMO rule remains: exploit early, exploit often. Enjoy D&D and MEO.
Slashdot Patriotism: We Support our Dupes!
Let me see if I understand this correctly. On the board (link in the article) Jamie Hale admitted that he knows why Paypal won't do anything about this. Namely because there was no physical shipment. Well, why don't they throw that step in? Ship out something the user has to recieve as verification, and talk to paypal to verify that it would count as "goods recieved".
Or how about actually creating a working relationship with the company that produced/developed the game? Then he could have re-couped all his loss, but because he didn't workt hat step out, he's out of the profit.
It all sounds like personal problems to me...
For those of us who do take a character in an MMORPG and raise it from Level 1 to Level Whatever for the pure enjoyment of the game - meeting other people, learning the lay of the land, testing how our spells and items work in specific situations and against different types of things - feel slighted by people who don't want to do the groundwork in the early levels to build that character. That's a fact. I can't believe that any FFXI player who spent weeks upon weeks building a character to Level 20, getting a support job and a chocobo license, would be thrilled if their friend paid $200 for a similar character on eBay and then started playing.
I'm not disagreeing that these services have a place in the realm of MMORPGs. I think some of them may. But, honestly, the selling of characters and rare items does nothing but create an atmosphere of competition between the haves and have-nots when something like an MMORPG should be something that blurs the reality of those lines.
So, yes, in the end, it is cheating.
Actually, probably not as the person selling the character wouldn't be creating the character to sell in the first place. And what if the person purchasing the character decided he didn't have the time required to play the entire game in the first place, so he never p(l)ayed at all.
As much as gamers like you hate this, this is part of what keeps these games going. It's all about the Benjamin$ and this tactic brings in more of them.
No, it's not cheating, it's market forces at work. As much as you'd like you MMORG to be seperate from RL, it's not. The very foundations of commercial MMORGs are based on the market. That's why you're paying a subscription fee, that's why the developers get paid, etc., etc.
"Time is money" is a cliche of capitalism, but it's still true. Right now, I have some guys doing yardwork for $8/hour, because my time is more valuable than $8/hour. Sure, I could do the work myself; it's probably great for character building and would give me a real sense of accomplishment.
I think part of your problem is that you've fallen for the fantasy that these virtual worlds are somehow egalitarian, that everyone starts out on a level playing field. Sadly, it's not so. Obviously, those that join the game early, and play steadily will be more powerful and wealthy than someone joining much later. And what are these powerful characters to do with their surplus goods? Trade or barter or give them away. (Even those that give them away might in effect be bartering for allies, no? Or even creating good will? Remember, good will has a cash value in the real world.)
The external market for virtual property is a natural extension of the capitalist underpinings of the commercial game. Capitalism and competition aren't infecting the game, they are the basis of the game, the reason why a company chose this means of creating wealth to begin with.
That's just the way it is. If you don't like it, I'd suggest finding a noncommercial game to play or creating your own. However, since we all live under capitalism one way or another, and time still equals money, I doubt a noncommercial game can stay "pure" forever.
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
Sega's Phantasy Star Online has the best approach for money, items, and cooperative play:
- It has a strict limit to the amount of items one can have and store.
- The in-game shops never sell the best armors and weapons, you have to fight to get them.
- On the other hand, decent items are not hard to get, and even the rarest ones are nothing out of this world.
- Players can't hurt each other, making sure high-level assholes would not slay and loot newbies.
- Only four players per game.
- It is an action RPG.
Consequences:
- As amassing craploads of money and items is nearly useless, veterans usually give away money and really good items to the newbies.
- As acceptable items are not that hard to get, spending real money in them is pointless.
- Players actually cooperate to beat the game (oh, and it does not take a lifetime to beat).
- It's not an ultra-boring click-click-click crapfest, a la Diablo.
Circumcision is child abuse.
Perhaps you should take your own advice. (Hint: the person who "bought" the items and didn't pay was not buying SL money. He was buying SWG and Eve Online stuff).
By that argument, using steroids isn't cheating for an Olympic athlete, and corking a bat isn't cheating for a baseball player. Market forces drive them to do it, after all.
Market forces are irrelevant to what is cheating. Cheating is determined entirely by the rules. For many MMORPGs, it is stated right in the rules that it is cheating. Market forces might determine why someone cheats, but not whether or not what they do is cheating.
And, no, you are wrong. The problem at play is that these systems are not part of the game itself. It takes place outside of the game. Let's continue to examine the FFXI example above:
Player A has played the game since introduction, building the character into quite a forceful Level 75 Monk. Player B has just bought a Level 75 Black Mage on eBay because he wants to play the game with "the big boys." Together they head off on a mission... and Player B, due to lack of experience, knowledge and wisdom, manages to help contribute to a total party kill. A fun time was clearly not had by all.
This is a case where hands-on experience is a massive need. I'm not arguing against capitalism, nor am I saying someone deserves losing $3000. I am saying, however, that common sense dictates that, if the need was there, it would be part of the game.
Whenever one has to go outside of a game's system to play the way they want to, it is cheating. Using the logic you offer above would mean that it is completely allowable for a poker player to find out, by any means, what his opponents are holding.
There is no difference between a player who cheats at poker and one who buys his way into a specific position in an MMORPG.
Now, you did say one thing that made sense: making a game of one's own. Which means if the player who feels the need to buy his way into a game because of the time commitment, etc., that the game asks for, then I would suggest it is the player who is in need of finding another game that suites his desires, not that his desires overwhelm the players who are playing within the system. So, in that aspect, you were right.
I'm one of those people that occasionaly buys money online. I've done it in the past an Anarchy Online, and just a week ago on City of Heroes.
My reasoning is that the money provides a slight advantage to me for what is a trivial cost to myself (roughly $20). It lets me enjoy more of my limited time playing the game instead of chasing down money. On the other end of the deal, I look at it as supporting a college kid who just paid for ramen for the week.
Its all good.
Thanks for the info : Most likely will give it a try next week.
There is no difference between a player who cheats at poker and one who buys his way into a specific position in an MMORPG.
There is a world of difference. Poker is a zero-sum game. In order for me to succeed, you must lose. Any MMORPGs I've played do not have that property -- in general, everyone can go along being happy, killing things that get in their way, finding treasure, making bandages, whatever.
You might not want to hang out with with a level 75 Monk n00b, but you may also not want to hang with a jerk who's worked his way up to level 75 who's going to killsteal and make a pain of himself. One can be just as damaging as the other.
The solution? Don't hang out in-world with people you don't like. Whether they've catassed their way up, or bought an ubercharacter shouldn't make a difference. Live and let live.
You're right, I apologize. It's rude to make a perfectly innocent stranger into a strawman like that. You are innocent, right? =) I was rude.
Anyway, my point is that there is a larger system with it's own rules that trumps the rules of the game. Let's use the poker analogy. The sort of cheating you are talking about is akin to actual game hacks and loophole exploits. What I'm talking about is bringing more chips to the table. The house has no problem with a player buying more chips and bringing them to the table. The house is trying to profit, and anything that will bring more profit is going to be OK with the house.
Someone else mentioned steroids and bat corking in sports. It is against the economic interests of those that control sports to allow such aids. If it was in their economic interest (or if they discover in the future it is in their interest) they would (or will) allow it, either explicitly, by making a rule change or implicitly, by looking the other way. Tournament poker is the same thing. Each player is given an equal amount of chips for the tournament, and are not allowed to bring in more chips, because it's in the economic interest of the casino and organizers of the event.
Now, let's look at command economies, such as was seen under Soviet socialism. (I'm avoiding making a Yakov Smirnoff type joke here.) In Soviet Russia there was a thriving blackmarket economy that pervaded all levels of society, despite (or because of) control of the economy by the government and the party. The rules of capitalism trumped the rules of socialism in the country that was the very bastion of socialism.
Now back to the games. If it was in the economic interests of the gaming companies to enforce the rules, then they would. Because the opposite is true, they implicitly support this "blackmarket" activity by looking the other way in the great majority of cases. I wouldn't even be suprised if the blackmarket activity extended into the companies themselves.
The fact of the matter is that there are explicit rules and implicit rules and the Golden Rule. Whoever has the gold, rules. Part of the rationale behind not openly allowing trading in most of these games is that the companies must maintain the illusion of egalitarianism. That's what keeps people coming on board. That's why people invest in pyramid schemes, for that matter. Eventually, the game will not be fun anymore because of the abuse, but guess what? The company is ready to roll out a new game, and people sign up hoping it will be different this time, or that they'll get in early enough to become rich and powerful themselves. The company has recouped it's investment many times over, and could give a shit.
Supply and demand is like water seeking it's own level. Where there is a supply of something and a demand for it, you'll have some form of capitalism. Economic interests will trump just about anything else out there.
(And now for my special karma whoring: And this is why FOSS is truly revolutionary.)
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
looks like one A$$hat in the Virtual Sales industry has been both Pwnd and Griefed by someone with even less morals. The one thing that MMORPGs have taught me is that in the absence of consequences, someone will always be willing to sink lower at the expense of others. Not that I think this will stop folks from selling Virtual Goods or change anything.
So what does "+++++++++++++1241241243124124124" mean to asian players? looks like a macro got stuck in text mode to me....
I was in the Lineage II OB, and the gratutious bot farming was completely gamebreaking. But Lineage's primary market is Asian. I doubt NCsoft gives a rats ass how Lineage II fares in North America. (Sure was the impression I got while playing)
In my opinion both the company and the thief are in the wrong here. But opinions aside, paying USD for in-game items is against the ELUA that the user has to agree to every time they start up SWG (and probably EVE, though I haven't read through that ELUA).
You must know at least one of this person's character's name as well as the date & time of the transaction, and you know his real name and billing address, assuming he didn't use a stolen credit card. Report him to SOE for paying cash money for in-game items and SOE may ban him. Doesn't get you your money, but it may give some satisfaction.
Slim Cognito
I have seen some stories about an MMO in development that is based on Gold. since the value of gold is consistent across the world, it is the perfect medium of exchange. Everything in the game can be exchanged for gold, real gold. And all in game items are can be bought/sold/traded for gold. The NPC merchants keep a percentage of all transactions, kind of tax, so the developer continues to make money over the cost of adding new items/treasure in game. Now if that would be the highest subscribed MMO in history, I don't know what would.
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Sorry, you sir need to get into a new business. The one you are currently in sucks for you, sucks for the game, and sucks for the people playing the games. MMORPG's are NOT a job. People who are spending real money for in-game advantage through third parties should be shot in the street for being so stupid.
From what I understand the site's a faciliator for others to do their trading on game goods. So it's rather odd you'd state that "MMORPG's are NOT a job" since no one in this story is making them one.Personally all I got from your post was you hate those who buy money/goods/characters in MMORPGs so, ergo, everyone should and the people at this site deserved what they got. Bet you're a real joy to party with online, I've noticed over the years that those with attitudes such as yours tend to be real asses in-game too, thinking that they know the only "right" way to do anything and everything. Perhaps you enjoy your gaming, but I can assure you a LOT of people probably despise you behind your back. You might want to re-evaluate your attitudes on life and gaming.
Take a look at Penny Arcade's take on the MMO trading fraud situation.