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Note Taking Devices for Students?
Gavin Scott asks: "I'm looking for solutions for a college student who needs an inexpensive mechanism for note taking in class. She suffers from a condition that makes writing notes out by hand slow and painful. One of the small sexy sub-notebook computers would be ideal, but at $1,500-$2,500 these are completely out of reach budget-wise. She has a perfectly good desktop system at home, so something that simply allowed typing in notes that could then be transferred to the PC would be ideal. I've considered things like a Palm-type device with an external keyboard, but I'm interested in knowing what other options people might suggest. Or any opinions on what kind of lightweight almost-laptop devices are good in, say, the sub-$500 range?"
Universities usually have an office for dealing with disabilities like what you mention. They can help with special arrangements if needed. I know this isn't what you wanted, but if note-taking is slow and painful, imagine what taking an exam would be like. :/
As for hardware, I would recommend a laptop. They'd be of much greater use than a PDA would (from experience).
US businesses that currently accept chip and PIN/signature
sheesh.
Signed, Your Boss
:D )
(Yes, I really am his boss! Note to Slashdotters: Don't send a link to your f1rstp0zt on Slashdot to your boss during your working hours.
Simpli - Your source for San Jose dedicated servers and colocation!
Might not be entirely ideal but it's a fairly quick way of making notes and they aren't massively expensive.
Texas Instruments makes a keyboard compatible with some of their (older) graphing calculators. With their NoteFolio program it cant be too hard to take notes in class with a graphing calculator like the TI-89 and the keyboard. http://education.ti.com/us/product/accessory/keybo ard/features/features.html
How about a small voice recorder and a digital camera ? Less than $500 and very effective.
Laptop... Ebay...
Dell sells a lot of stuff on eBay. Most of it consists of refurbs and returned leases. Probably pretty good for saving a load on a lightweight laptop. http://stores.ebay.com/Dell-Financial-Services
There is a difference between "insightful" and "inciteful" other than spelling.
Assuming you're in the US, each state has a Voc Rehab department which provides funding for the disabled going to college. They pay for the entire tuition for me, and my books as well. Sounds like she has a fully qualifying disablity, so VR should be able to buy her a laptop. They did buy me one too, and it was $1800. Just find a VR office in your area and arrange a meeting with the counselor. Also bring proof (doctor's note, records, etc.) of the disability.
"Black holes are where God divided by zero." - Steve Wright
It's durable and has a full keyboard. You should be able to pick up one of the year or so old G3 models for about $500. For that price, expect a 700-odd mhz snow (white) model. Those have 1024x768 displays. The older color, toilet-seat style models have 800x600 displays and because of that I wouldn't recommend them.
When I advertised on Craigslist (LA) for an Apple laptop, I got a PowerBook G4 (original model) for $600. However, for a student the iBook might be better because it's closer to being indestructible.
If you don't like Apple, any used laptop would probably do better than a PDA, even with a keyboard attachment. I used a color palm with the keyboard attachment for a while, and I found that the keyboard folded up on me whenever I tried to type! She would have similar problems, especially considering her health situation.
For a non-Apple laptop, the best quality is probably an IBM ThinkPad. Older ones are dirt cheap, and they will still run reliably and connect up to the mother ship to send back the notes.
If she wants something fuss-free, though, I really don't think you can beat an iBook.
Hope that helps.
D
Affixing Bionic Arms.
Perhaps you could try to get her into some kind of pilot program so that it doesn't cost her anything. Then not only will she be able to take notes, perhaps with her new super-human strength she could fight crime on the side.
Seriously though, I think the palm idea is a good one. A notebook is a lot to lug around, and the head aches involved with an out of date one (the kind you will get for sub $500) may not be worth it. I picked up my last laptop ($350) for this very purpose, and the stinking hard drive crashed on me in the first month. Laptop components take a lot more abuse than desktop computers, so it is worthwhile to consider the wear and tear a used laptop has already endured.
A palm (or other pda) on the other hand doesn't have any moving parts, so they are a lot harder to break.
- Sub-$500
- Quiet
- Bulletproof [once the hinge cable is fixed!]
- Easy on the batteries
- Can draw sketches as well as type
NewtonTalk email list"You might as well get your son a ticket to hell as give him a five string banjo." -unknown minister
The now End-Of-Life apple Emate would be PERFECT for what youre talking about. It was basically an Apple newton in a small laptop form factor. If I remember correctly Apple marketted them to schoolkids for this exact purpose. Here's a nice synopsis at everymac.
It can at least sync back to a mac, getting it to sync back to a PC shouldnt be a problem. They're SUPER cheap on ebay.
Get an iPod and the Belkin iPod Voice Recorder. No muss, no fuss, complete transcript of the class under 400 dollars.
If she's a Windows User, I'd recomend an IPAQ with the $50 thumbboard upgrade (the H2200 series is what I use- total cost $350 retail, but you can probably find it in the $250 range online). If she's a Linux or Mac user, then PalmOS is your better bet, and I believe Handspring makes a Visor with thumbboard for under $400.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
Battery life.
Even a brand new battery may not have the kind of battery-life required for a daily class schedule. A pda will last much longer. Either way, expect to have to recharge daily.
If price is an issue, what about one of these:
Apple eMate 300
I have one in the closet, and they work pretty well. You can buy them on eBay for about $60 or so, and they have a touch screen, a full keyboard, and 12+ hour battery life.
I have heard of people getting them working with modems and ethernet, but I have not tried it myself. It has a PCMCIA slot though, so it's certainly feasible.
- Vincit qui patitur.
At my university if there is a student that may be unable to take notes for a class due to a disability then all he/she needs to do is inform the dean of students. They get in contact with the professor and the prof makes an announcement in class that they are looking for someone with good hand writing to take detailed notes. They make copies of the notes for the person with the disability and pay the note taker a small fee for their extra work. You may want to check to see if your college provides this, it beats spending hundreds or thousands on some piece of equipment.
http://almostsmart.com
Okay, this may not be very practical, but I thought I'd suggest it anyway:
.WAV files from the PocketPC on your desktop. Although I can't imagine she'd really need that as once she's transcribed them she's got them. But I was shocked that these files a.) Don't automatically synch with the desktop and b.) They don't play without a special codec installed. Grr. Leave it to MS to break something like that.
PocketPC with a voice recorder. I dunno if she can get away with talking, but I figured it's at least a unique answer. When I did system testing a year ago, I found it was quicker just to have my PocketPC nearby, press the record button like a walkie-talkie and record my notes. Then I'd get back to my PC, listen to each one, and transcribe what I said.
There are a couple of caveats here:
1.) Obviously she's gonna haveta talk out loud for this to work. This worked in my situation, but possibly not in hers.
2.) You have to download a special codec to play those
"Derp de derp."
I'm not going to remember the name right now but I spoke to a writer at a conference recently -- the device just had a tiny lcd attached to a keyboard. she plugged it into the usb port on one of the public desktops there and uploaded the text to wordpad. it was pretty cool. she said she got it because she didn't have the money for a laptop so it can't be that expensive.
here's one i found quickly on google. http://www.calcuscribe.com/missing.html
What comes first, finding a teacher or becoming a student?
AlphaSmart has a few products that may interest you. The AlphaSmart 3000 (US$200)is a dumb keyboard which stores about 100 pages of text, and 3 AA batteries run it for 300-700 hours. If you need to take notes involving graphics, the Dana (US$400), which is a Palm OS hybrid, may be the right thing. The Dana Wireless also has Wi-Fi access.
For something with a bit more power than the 3000 but not a full Palm OS hybrid, you may be interested in the Neo, which is due to be released in September.
Recently finished degree, had palm 3xe and folding keyboard, took all my notes, super easy to carry and small enough to use on any desk. No problems with battery life either, no way any laptop can make it thru a full day of classes without being plugged in...
I got an old NEC mobilepro for similar requirements. It's small, has a keyboard similiar to handheld keyboards and is nice and cheap. The only problem I had was that it ran WinCE 2.11. That version of CE prevented me from using my wifi card with it. So I installed BSD on it and now it works perfectly for viewing, editing, and transfering files on the go.
Get a Dana from AlphaSmart. It's just a laptop that runs PalmOS. Full keyboard so you don't have to use the stylus to take notes, although it may still be necessary to use a stylus as a mouse.
Still, I think getting a laptop is best. Especially if you'll be taking courses that involve lots of math, you'll want to have a program that allows you to type equations easily (such as Mathematica).
I'd agree with parent. ... Though, that would usually bust the economical frame you mentioned.
It's a lot easier to take notes on a laptop, especially since it is easier to structure the notes in a word processor than in, say, Palm Vx-notepad. Get on of those with a full-sized keyboard if she needs to take notes involving many numbers.
In general, it's nice to have a laptop. If she buys a used laptop and a laptop-specific webcam, she can even take pictures to add to her notes, in case there's illustrations she needs (mind the quality of the picture, though, it's often quite illegible if there's any writing on a blackboard more than 3 metres away)
As long as the student in question has good eyesight (or good eyesight correction), you can spend a few bucks on a Palm M100 (probably find them used for $20-40) and a cheapo keyboard. If you scrounged eBay, you could probably find them for less than $50 USD together. They're small and portable, can fit in a purse, and 2 megs of memory is more than enough for a day's worth of notes.
Another option would be to get one of the fancy Sony ones with cameras, whcih can also capture overhead screens.
--Dan
A friend of mine recorded his psychology-lessons on MD for future reference. Had a whole library of lectures.
Assuming her disability is legit and recognized, isn't there a department at the school that can help, or governemnt funding? I know that's the case here in Canada. She can probably get a laptop paid for by the school (or the government). Much easier to investigate that than using an "ask Slashdot" and far more effective ;)
It's better to burn out than to fade away
I recommend the AlphaSmart, they are basically portable keyboards with a bunch of memory. Connect to a computer with a special keyboard wire, and send. There are many different types, and all shouldn't be too expensive.
- Move "Sig". For great justice!
The Alpha Smart is exactly the device you are looking for.
It's used primarily (and geared toward) the K-12 education market for students exactly like the one you described.
They are excellent for notetaking and incredibly simple to use. The essential idea is that it's like a miniature word processor that will repeat your keystrokes once you plug it into the computer. Of course, you can edit what you're typing on the builtin LCD.
With the original Alpha Smart (not being produced anymore, but easily findable on Ebay) and the 3000 ($200 direct) interfacing with the computer is embarassingly simple. Simply plug the thing into ANY PC or Mac's keyboard (has ADB and PS2 -- the new ones also have USB), open Word, hit send, and it mimicks a keyboard typing the document. No software required.
That's $200, easily within your price range. I've used them in the school I work in, and find them to be an incredible tool for the students which need them.
If you want something more advanced, $400 will fetch you a similar device with a bigger screen powered by palmOS and 802.11 built in. I've never used them, but with alphasmart's reputation, I expect it to be just as good.
Oh yeah. Did I mention it's designed for K-12? They're durable as hell. I've seen them take a serious beating without being damaged. Thank god for no moving parts and shatter resistant plastic!
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
I am not a l33t hardware guy, or anything, but this gives me an idea for a product:
... and which buffers your keystrokes into a couple of K of RAM, then writes it all out to a CF card (or flash card standard of your choice).
... just increment a pointer on every keystroke, writing the scan code into the cell; decrement the ptr on backspace ...
.. maybe even around $25 (given enough volume ... keyboards are < $10 nowadays).
a device consisting of a keyboard, with a 1 line LCD Screen across the top (can even be segmented, like on a cheesy calculator), that allows you to type, and see what you are typing, and not much else
Maybe even skip the flash; just have a MB of RAM; that's it. the KB could have a regular old kb connector, and you can hit a special key sequence to dump the memory to the KB Port. (The software here would be SO simple
The point is, this could be manufactured REALLY cheap; and would be ideal for taking notes. You could even outfit it with the guts of one of these to take snapshots of blackboards, etc.
It would seem like something like this could sell for < $50
Even starving college kids could afford one.
This is the typical boss-mentality. This guy took 5 minutes out of his day to provide assistance to someone in need and all the boss can say is "Get back to work!" An employee who is a decent enough human being to provide a small bit of assistance to someone suffering from a disability shouldn't be castigated like this.
Yeah, I know this is a joke and SlashChick is probably a pretty cool person (with a name like that how could she not?) but, seriously, there are a lot of PHBs which would howl if they new their employees were doing anything other than what they were paid to do. Kinda sad.
If all she needs is a cheap device she can type on, then why not consider a TRS-80 Model 100 or 102? They are super-cheap, have a full-size keyboard, and an RS-232 port for uploading the notes to her desktop machine.
I see two possible downsides: The keyboard doesn't have as good of a feel as a new laptop, and the small amount of RAM (32 KB) might be a problem. (I have no idea how many KB a day's worth of notes would be.) However, the websites about the Model 100 and 102 claim that there are a lot of writers who use them as portable text-entry machines, so it might be a decent solution.
Logitech io.
'nuff said.
I just used a laptop. A cheap one, either used or closeout. I got one partway through high school, which then lasted until my senior year of college. Walmart is selling new generic ones for a few hundered now.
The trick is to set up style sheets and macros and such for Word to allow you to get all of the symbols and stuff.
Of course, typing may not help too much if you have hand problems.
Most unversities, when faced with a student who has a medically documented problem taking notes the normal way, will generally provide you with "accomidations". All you need is a doctor to vouch for you. Accomodiations will generally be some sort of notetaking service, at least.
Different schools do it differently. Some schools can move heaven and earth for you if you have a documented dissability.
Gentoo Sucks
I too have a condition that makes writing slow, and slightly painful (cerebral palsy). That being said, I have no trouble with taking notes. It is generally doing essays and so on that cause me trouble, and most schools are more than accomodating (as well as the province for my provincial exams; I got to use a computer). I used to have a Palm and a PocketPC, both with folding keyboards, and I must say that it isn't a perfect solution. I still take notes by hand, and I just ask nicely for computer time if I need to do anything longer. The person in question should also try to not make the notes verbose, that could help.
http://www.club100.org/
Check 'em out. Cheap, unbreakable, full-size keyboard.
The (old) Apple eMate would be a good choice, as many others have pointed out. It's a durable laptop based on a hybrid of the Newton 130 and Newton 2000. It uses the software from the 2000, but the logicboard of the 130... still, it's more than fast enough for the bundled office suite and many other lightweight Newton apps.
Note that some CPU-intensive apps designed for the 2000 may not work well on the eMate, as the Newton 2000 has about 7x the CPU performance.
It's easy to pick up an old Apple Newton from somewhere like eBay.
I've got an MP2000 myself and it's great for taking notes with it's handwriting recognition. If you need something a bit more than a basic "Notes" program, then there's software like Newton Works and external keyboards for them (I have both).
As long as you have a serial port (or a usb to serial adapter) you can sync it up and transfer documents and packages across. Or if you have a Mac, you can sync over TCP/IP.
Since you can get a Palm for about $80 and a keyboard for $25, I can't image why you would want to fish for $500 solutions, but - hey - it's a free world (in some locales).
-I like my women like I like my tea: green-
But I gotta ask: what condition does your friend have that makes it easier to type than to handwrite?
"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
Hmmm. I'm thinking more along the lines of what a court reporter uses. Fast, accurate, small.
Sure. $250 for the first and $25,000 for the second.
This post written under Gentoo-linux with an SCO IP license.
whatever happened to using a micro cassette recorder?
retrobox.com has a fantastic selection as well - the HP Omnibook 6000 I'm typing this on, a PII700 w/384 meg ram, came from there(just over $300)
clicky clicky
...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
I'm not sure if she has a problem with smaller keyboards, but if not I would check out a WinCE handheld PC. The Jornada 720/728 ($200-600 used or refurb) or the Sigmarion 3 (~$450 imported) are both very nice. They keyboard is smaller, about 75% of full size- however, the mechanism is just like a regular laptop, and I can touch type on one with my fattie fingers with no problem at 60-70 WPM. There is also the NEC MobilePro line (~$200 for the 780 to $600+ for the 900) which some folks prefer because the keyboard is full size. For me, they're too big- I prefer a device I can fit in my pocket, which I can do with the Jornada 72x or the Sigmarion 3. These all have network capabilities, through PCMCIA slots (MobilePro and Jornada) or CF (Sigmarion, Jornada).
Another option worth looking into is the AlphaSmart Dana line. Keyboard is pretty big. I've never had one of these, but I've heard good things. A little more expensive, and they run Palm OS which is both good and bad.
If she wants to be really cheap, she could look into getting an Apple Newton eMate. You can get them on eBay for $50-150, and they're *very* nice for notetaking. They keyboard is very nice, and they're downright indestructable. The AlphaSmart Dana snapped up lucrative educational market whole that the eMate left open when Jobs killed off the Newton. They may be older, but they're still very capable, still can talk to modern Macs, PCs and even Linux/Unix, can get online via wifi or ethernet, and get the best battery life out of all of these except the low-end Dana.
All of the above devices have touch screens as well. She may not be using it much, but it's worth noting.
Working toward a usable PDA environment in the spirit of Newton OS: Dynapad
These are the original laptops, virtually indestructable, and get 16+ hours to just 4 AA batteries. You can transfer files to windows via serial port with a null modem cable, and the SerialKey devices Accessibility option.
BAN BPL! Keep the radio spectrum free fro
Why not buy an old laptop from ebay? Some sell for less than $50. Even if it can't network, the floppy should at least work.
Not only do I type about twice as fast as I handwrite, but typing gives you the ability of organizing, formatting and editing what you write after the fact.
Handwritten notes simply don't (unless you feel like wasting time copying them over and over).
+++ATH0
Maybe she could learn stenography ? and/or to use one of those steno machines.
Alphasmart Dana
Alphasmart Dana Wireless
Virtually indestructable, designed for people who tend to beat it, drop it, dunk it or slam it - i.e. for my teenage daughter, and me.
And has a great keyboard.
'nuff said.
You aren't remembered for doing what is expected of you
The IBM WorkPad z50 and Vadem Clio (also sold as the Sharp Mobilon Tripad) are clamshell-style PDAs with full keyboards. They both get excellent (7 or 8 hours) battery life and are comfortable to type on, though the Clio's curved keyboard takes a little getting used to.
I've mentioned these devices before in a different context.
This machine isn't in production any more, but it's actually a perfect notetaking computer: runs off AA batteries, has a small touch screen allowing stylus drawing, and a clamshell design with a workable keyboard -- documents can be translate to/from PC and a CF slot provides additional storage. It powers on and off instantly, and is small and portable. There's even a browser, email and other network tools, plus the inbuilt IrDA allows SMS/data interface to a mobile phone.
You can pick up second hand 5mx's for a good price, probably no more than 150$USD.
What I say is from actual experience because I used a s5 take notes for my degree over 2 years. Other similar form factor PDA's are impractically designed for this purpose, as are larger and more clunky notebooks. The s5 was perfect, and many other students commented on how neat it was. I carried it around in a small A5 sized carry case -- fitted easily in my bag, or I could carry it by hand (fantastic when you go for lunch/dinner/pub after class and can hold the carry case in your hand when you go to toilet/etc -- no concerns about expensive notebook being stolen).
If I were a student again: I would use a psion for class and library use, and have a notebook at home for serious work (i.e. assignments/etc) - sometimes necessary to take the notebook into class or library, but rarely.
It's a real shame the psion series 5 was stopped: it has a very definite market space for this type of activity.
You can get a very powerful brand new portable for $600 from walmart.com. This is a real price without any rebates troubles. It is full featured with DVD, wireless, etc. I have one and recommend it to anyone with limited funds.
Have the professors wear a microphone and pocket tape recorder.
They have a reasonable keyboard, Windows OS, a voice recorder if you need it, plus the usual Microsoft apps. No messing around when you get back to home base, either, you just sync it and you're good to go on your desktop with what you've done during the day on the palmtop.
Why not just record the prof's lecture and then transcribe what sections she needs to back in the dorm?
Some other poster mentioned that he had cerebral palsy and that it was next to impossible for him to write longhand, but he was capable of typing (at a markedly slower rate, I'd imagine).
+++ATH0
Unless you believe that "being a geek" IS a disability.
It is.
I'd recommend getting a used but still in good shape laptop + new battery. Until fairly recently, I was using a 366mhz iBook (clamshell, baby!) for taking notes, and with a brand new battery I could make it through all my classes no problem. Shop around Craig's List, and since you're at a University, picking up a laptop on the cheap should be easy (my school surpluses them fairly routinely -- lately I've been seeing Lombards and Wallstreets -- and kids are always selling them towards the end of the quarter for extra cash) Set it up with a minimal OS installation, a text editor, and you should be good to go. I especially liked my old iBook, because it was really really energy efficient. As in, I could leave it sleeping for days and it would lose less than 1% of it's battery. (Unlike my powerbook, which slowly leaks power during sleep. Grr.)
i use an ipod with a griffin italk, it works fantastically. i'm told it's better than the belkin, particularly the inbuilt speaker. having a copy of the lecture, along with the notes i jot at the time, helps a lot when exam time comes, i find.
It means that everyone else in your society (US, Canada, wherever you live) is picking up the tab. It's not "Santa Government", it's sucking 10% from everyone healthy's paycheck to pay for the 1 in 10 who can't cut it.
Yes, -1, Flamebait, but +1, Not Mean If Its True
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
Not to restart Palm vs. PPC but...
The Palm Tungsten T(1/2/3) has a voice recorder. It records either to an SD card or to internal memory in a bog-standard WAV format. If you write to the internal memory it'll sync to the desktop as well.
Other than a new system, I'd second the other suggestions about a used laptop. I may be buying one or more used tiny Compaqs for $300 a pop, so they can be had. If you're looking for a note-taking machine, an older, less powerful laptop shouldn't be hard to find on the cheap.
If trying to write it all down hurts, use a tape recorder. Jot down brief notes, but realize that you have the casette which you can review later and write out on your desktop PC/coputer lab. Shucks - most people recommend rewriting you notes after class anyway.
Some places may have an issue with tape recording lectures, but with a confirmed disability, those should disappear.
sony clie UX50. $400 if you find a good deal. Clamshell design with built in keyboard, that is the size of a pda. It will record voice, movies, and take pictures. Wi-fi and bluetooth enabled.
I use an old Acer TravelMate 370 to compensate for my handwriting problems. I use stock kWord for equations, and otherwise I have no problems.
-Meeper
I sell PCs and peripherals for a living. I've recently had a run on students buying Creatve Labs Muvo TX 512 and Muvo Slim 512 (they can be used as digital voice recorders) and then buying "Dragon Naturally Speaking" apparently they hook up the headphone jack on the Muvo to the microphone jack on the PC and voila the PC transcribes for them. It's fairly accurate and the cost for the package us under $300 (US)
The emate has a tendancy to eat its display/digitizer cable - but you can easily fix it: Here Or here
"You might as well get your son a ticket to hell as give him a five string banjo." -unknown minister