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U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft Resigns

andyring writes "In a move that will undoubtedly make many /. readers jump for joy (although perhaps not myself), Attorney General John Ashcroft announced he will resign, according to multiple news sources. While many here dislike him, others have more favorable opinions of him. He became the point man on the USA Patriot Act, which typically ignites harsh opinions on both sides of the aisle." Reader cnsc1rtr , referring to the AP's version of the story, writes "He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated, 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'"

144 of 1,275 comments (clear)

  1. SAFE! by Elwood+P+Dowd · · Score: 5, Funny

    'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

    That is the BEST NEWS EVER! How come he didn't tell us about this before?

    --

    There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
    1. Re:SAFE! by siliconjunkie · · Score: 4, Informative

      OK. Here's the article. The statement in question occurs in paragraph three. Please explain how was it taken "out of context"?

    2. Re:SAFE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yes, they left out the first bit:
      "With my resignation the objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved."

    3. Re:SAFE! by Auckerman · · Score: 5, Insightful

      'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

      This is and example of one thing the Bush administration understands, how to kill discussions. The trick is to say something so outlandish and WRONG that everyone who pays attention will know as wrong and the discussion dies there, while at the the same time, the less observant get the desired impression. The fun part is, if you have a valid argument that is even remotely related (rational or emotional level) against the individual, a lot of people will dismiss you without hearing you thinking 1. you are on the same level as them (that's just how politicians are) or 2. you're a conspiracy nut. (he's just reading too much into this political nonsense).

      Really impressive use of the media if you ask me. If you say enough factually wrong soundbites, people will dismis you AND the people who are after you. Those who don't dismis you will think you are amazing.

      --

      Burn Hollywood Burn
    4. Re:SAFE! by Rei · · Score: 4, Funny

      Without Ashcroft around, who will there be to dilligently protect a woman's right to give birth? Or to protect a terminally-ill patient's right to keep living? Or an atheist student's right to participate in school-sponsored prayer? Or a muslim's right to be given a surprise trip to a tropical carribean island? Or even a pipe maker's right to have a long-term vacation to Huntsville?

      I fear for this country without Ashcroft around. Let the eagle soar, John. Let it soar.

      P.S.: If you need someone to annoint you with cooking oil for your next job, just give me a call. I've got a bottle of Wesson in the cabinet.

      --
      That's it, Mr. Giraffe, get all the marmalade.
    5. Re:SAFE! by g3head · · Score: 5, Funny
      'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

      That is the BEST NEWS EVER! How come he didn't tell us about this before?

      well, he's just now resigning....

    6. Re:SAFE! by Caiwyn · · Score: 4, Insightful

      AWESOME.

      So, can I have my rights back, now?

    7. Re:SAFE! by The_Rook · · Score: 5, Insightful

      not to be a killjoy, but has it occurred to anyone that ashcroft is resigning as attorney general so as to prepare himself for a nomination to the supreme court?

      --
      when religion is no longer the opiate of the masses, governments will resort to real opiates.
    8. Re:SAFE! by BrynM · · Score: 4, Funny
      BTW, Re: the statute behind him in the picture, I thought they had covered that statue up already?
      Nipple(s) are OK if you are and two of these:
      • Made of Stone
      • Made of Bronze
      • Made of Plaster
      • Standing behind a Bush Cabinet Member
      • The verdict is still pending for made of Silicone
      Being made of flesh and showing nipple(s) is strictly forbidden! Think of the children! No! Don't think of their nipples you perv! Think of their small impressionable minds! Without taboo they would be heathens.
      --
      US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)
    9. Re:SAFE! by siliconjunkie · · Score: 4, Informative

      From Ashcroft's letter: The demands of justice are both rewarding and depleting. I take great personal satisfaction in the record which has been developed. The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved. The rule of law has been strengthened and upheld in the courts. Yet, I believe that the Department of Justice would be well served by new leadership and fresh inspiration. I believe that my energies and talents should be directed toward other challenging horizons.

    10. Re:SAFE! by NaDrew · · Score: 5, Informative
      If you say enough factually wrong soundbites, people will dismis you AND the people who are after you. Those who don't dismis you will think you are amazing.
      It's called The Big Lie and it's a technique with quite a lot of history.
      --
      Vista:XPSP2::ME:98SE
    11. Re:SAFE! by peawee03 · · Score: 3, Funny

      *choke*

      Wow. Every joy I had about this just left my body. I will now choke on my own tongue, thankyouverymuch

      --
      I wish I could write clever and witty sigs.
    12. Re:SAFE! by BroncoInCalifornia · · Score: 3, Insightful
      'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

      That is the BEST NEWS EVER! How come he didn't tell us about this before?

      For the election we were supposed to be in fear of terror. There is no way Bush could get elected unless we were in fear.

      Now that the election is over, we do not have to be in fear any more.

      --

      Religion is the main cause of atheism.

    13. Re:SAFE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Anyone else notice the boob is back in plain view at the Justice department?

    14. Re:SAFE! by mefus · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yet, I believe that the Department of Justice would be well served by new leadership and fresh inspiration. I believe that my energies and talents should be directed toward other challenging horizons.

      So he wants to sit on the Bench with the other SCOTUSes and burn heretics?

      --
      mefus
      In Open Society, GPL Software frees YOU!
    15. Re:SAFE! by LilGuy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yeah, I heard about this from a couple of other sites. I was surprised it wasn't mentioned in the article.

      What else would you think he meant by saying he wanted to open himself up for new challenging areas?

      I thought it was awful that he was the Attourney General.. but I can't hardly fathom him as an SPJ. The country is no longer going to hell in a handbasket.. oh no, its going on a silver platter.

      --

      You're nothing; like me.
    16. Re:SAFE! by dameron · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's the same thing as with "intelligent design." This administration will say -anything-, even the most blatant lie (like Ashcroft's victory lap quoted above), and use that as a position to -start- the "debate". Suddenly the "truth" has quotations around it and the lie get's equal play.

      It's not even a strawman, it's literally the fucking Chewbacca defense.

      That the press and most (maybe) of the electorate falls for this is the main reason why so many on the left are willing to believe the election was rigged.

      -dameron

    17. Re:SAFE! by TiggertheMad · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.

      Say, John, you ever catch that person(s) who were mailing ANTHRAX all over the country? You know, ANTHRAX, that EXCEPTIONALLY DANGEROUS disease?

      Anything at all?

      So, they could be roaming about right now, planning their next, even bigger anthrax attack?

      Right.

      Stupid fucktard.

      --

      HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
    18. Re:SAFE! by spazimodo · · Score: 3, Funny

      the other day after bush made his bogus comments about wanting to heal the country, one of the commentators on NPR made a pretty funny comment.

      as bush: "the first act of my second term is to nominate john ashcroft to the supreme court; now let the healing begin!"

      --

      Fsck the millennium, we want it now.
      Millennium Crisis Line: 0890 900 2000 [calls cost 50p/min]
    19. Re:SAFE! by Moofie · · Score: 4, Informative

      No, Clinton was the master of the nuanced evasion. Bush and his handlers are the masters of doublethink.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    20. Re:SAFE! by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 4, Funny

      I've heard it described that photographers will go through great contortions to get the boob in the frame with Ashcroft. Not that he didn't have that coming.

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    21. Re:SAFE! by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Bush and his handlers are the masters of doublethink.

      Maybe his handlers are masters of doublethink, but Bush himself is master of nothink, and that's why his handlers picked him.

    22. Re:SAFE! by johnnyb · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I see you are forgetting the fact that John Ashcroft fought for Muslim's right to wear clothing in keeping with their religion in schools.

    23. Re:SAFE! by ottothecow · · Score: 3, Interesting
      filibuster.

      There are people in the senate who, if the have to, will take turns ceding the floor to each other for 8 hours at a time until someone else gets nominated.

      Ashcroft will not sit on the supreme court (besides...he is clearly biased and has predetermined verdicts on many possible cases) as long as there is somone reasonable on the floor or the senate.

      --
      Bottles.
    24. Re:SAFE! by einhverfr · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I know I should not feed trolls but....

      Who will dilligently protect the Americans who would be murdered otherwise? Don't think unborn children are lives; then I guess a misscarriage would be a noneven in your family?

      Given the realities of abortion in the US before Roe v. Wade, I don't think that it is any question that it is a good thing. But everyone should be happy because abortions are actually declining in the US.

      Who will protect a terminally-ill patient who really wants to live out their remaining days from being pressered into giving them up by greedy relatives or physicians with a social agenda?

      What about those with sound mind who plainly claim that they don't want to suffer any longer? Are you requiring their lives to be prolonged?



      Is it your suposition that Atheist students are so unsure of their quote faith that whitnessing others expressing this will shake it. Its it bad for someone born to an Atheist family to whitness others practing perhaps enjoinging their faith thus provinging opertunity to understand and perhaps decide personally if it might be for them?


      The issue isn't whether it is so horrible that an atheist might :gasp: observe someone's religious practices, but whether the state should be endorsing them. In a school setting, there is just too much pressure to participate. I also believe that schools should teach the "prevailing scientific view of the day" and to Hel with everyone's religious objections. Schools are here to teach people how to reason, not to be an accessory to the church.

      Look, I don't know if you actually believe what you are saying, so I am giving you the benefit of the doubt. But you seem to be arguing from the premise that everything should be organized around religeous principles. The only religion whose scripture teaches this is Islam, and this is only because Islam is the most pure (and extreme) form of monotheism. Indeed the idea that one can describe in any way the will of God perhaps leads one to this premise. And if you do this, then the clergy are the ones who are really in power (look at the role of the democratic institutions in Iran, for example).

      No thank you. I don't want to live in a theocracy, and this is one of the great things about Western society-- we inherited from our pagan ancestors a healthy separation of church and state. While the complex cosmology which was the foundation for this is now gone, we have retained the institutions.

      Abortion should be protected because it is good governance to do so. Evolution should be taught because it undermines the mission of our schools not to. School prayer should be banned in the interests of a more inclusive society. Marijuana should be legalized because it is good governance to do so. Terminally ill patients should be allowed to die in conditions of their own choosing, even if this is with the assistance of another, and simply because it is in the interest of the dignity of our people.

      --

      LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
    25. Re:SAFE! by mattkinabrewmindspri · · Score: 3, Funny

      So he's a shoe-in then?

    26. Re:SAFE! by uradu · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And the Nazis championed animal rights. Yet somehow they don't seem to be much remembered for that.

    27. Re:SAFE! by Guppy06 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Don't forget the rights of folks on federal death row to be executed in Puerto Rico, where it's against their constitution.

    28. Re:SAFE! by feidaykin · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Sure, if you can name one right that has been taken away from YOU.

      How about the right to know if the government has peaked at my medical records, or noticed what books I've checked out at the library? Now, I can't prove they have, but no one can prove they have not since I simply don't have the right to know. I would like that right, and I would like the right to not have to think "Anything I check out here can be used against me" while I browse for books.

      If the US government wants freedom to be "on the march" shouldn't we, as an example to the nations we wish to make free, be steadfast in preserving our own rights and freedoms? While the death of 4,000 on 9/11 was of course a tragedy and measures need to be taken to make us safer, is sacrificing freedom worth it? About 40,000 people die in car accidents every year, yet we don't have a "war on cars" that I am aware of, and I'm pretty sure in every state you can drive before you are legally an adult.

      Americans are still very emotional about 9/11, and will likely remain that way for years to come, just as it was with Pearl Harbor. However we can learn from history, and I tend to believe that perhaps half a century from now the PATRIOT Act will be viewed almost as negatively as the Japanese Internment after Pearl Harbor is viewed today.

      --

      "To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit." -Stephen Hawking

    29. Re:SAFE! by richie2000 · · Score: 4, Insightful
      it is entirely illegal to lie about it in court.

      Technically (which is what counts in court) he didn't lie. He asked beforehand what the phrase "sexual relations" was defined as, got the answer that it specifically meant intercourse and proceeded to tell the narrowly defined truth: "I did not have sexual relations with that woman". He omitted "She did suck my dick once and I did push a cigar up her pussy which I then proceeded to smoke with great pleasure, but y'all didn't ask about that, now did'ya?".

      Then again, it's more serious if the President almost lies about if he got a blowjob or not than if he lies to invade a sovereign nation, killing 100,000 ragheads and a few thousand GI Joes in the process.

      They just happened to be the ones he was stupid enough to utter under oath.

      Clinton is many things, but stupid isn't one of them. He's like a combination of Nixon's slickness, JFK's libido and the fiscal sense of FDR. Bush OTOH has Nixon's malice, no libido, no fiscal sense and Quayle's brainpower.

      --
      Money for nothing, pix for free
    30. Re:SAFE! by MartinB · · Score: 3, Insightful
      this is one of the great things about Western society-- we inherited from our pagan ancestors a healthy separation of church and state.

      *cough*EnlightenmentPhilosophersNotPagans*cough*.

      You lot took it, along with much of the rest of the founding principles, from the French, specifically Voltaire and Montesquieu. Those gentlemen were informed in turn by Paine, Hume and Locke, none of whom could be called pagans in the sense of a pre-christian heritage.

      In the 17th and 18th Centuries, a secular state was a novel, radical concept, not some underlying thought from over a thousand years before (ie the time before Christianity became a state-sponsored religion). And even before that, state religions were standard practise, if only to deify the king/emperor.

      --

      The only thing you can accurately describe as "Scotch" is a sticky tape made by 3M. And it's

  2. Today Ashcroft by rbochan · · Score: 5, Funny

    Tomorrow Cheney!

    oh please oh please oh please oh please oh please oh please oh please

    --
    ...Rob
    The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
    1. Re:Today Ashcroft by superpulpsicle · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not to be mean.... On one hand I want Bush to leave.

      On the other hand, I want to see Bush-voters who cheered "4 more years" to suffer financial & economical devastation. Nothing against you, but if you wanted a president who has more involvement in Iraq than your own country, you mind as well turn in your U.S. citizenship. Before you mod me down to -100, I am just fighting for the U.S middle class.

    2. Re:Today Ashcroft by deanj · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So says a fellow using the words "Go back to jesusland, redneck", showing exactly how seriously his opinion should be weighed.

    3. Re:Today Ashcroft by Rei · · Score: 4, Interesting

      What IRS stats do you refer to - Bahrain's? The middle class in America has been being soaked into the lower class. Don't believe me? Is the US Census Bureau good enough for you? Here's an article:

      http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/08/26/census.poverty. ap /

      "WASHINGTON (AP) -- The number of Americans living in poverty increased by 1.3 million last year, while the ranks of the uninsured swelled by 1.4 million, the Census Bureau reported Thursday."

      It was the third straight annual increase in a row under Bush. Just like during Reagan and Bush Sr., the wealthy have been doing very well, and the poor very poorly. And these numbers are actually worse than they sound, because many other expenses have been going up at the same time, largely due to administration policies (college tuitions due to state aid cuts, gas prices due to a tight reserve policy and the weak dollar policy (and that whole "invasion" thing), etc)

      A stable Iraq? What, you mean like there was BEFORE we made it a terrorist haven and gave the middle east a rallying cry?

      What if we had left Germany and France after World War II? You mean, we shouldn't leave countries that aren't resisting our occupation of them? Good idea! Now what are your ideas for countries that *are* resisting our occupation of them?

      --
      That's it, Mr. Giraffe, get all the marmalade.
    4. Re:Today Ashcroft by NoMoreNicksLeft · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Middle class, definition:

      A mythical group of people who are neither rich nor poor, generally believed to own real property of significant, if minor, value. They would have reasonable balances in savings accounts and/or retirement accounts, and the means to retire to a comfortable life before they die of old age. In much the same way that biology can prove that there isn't enough fish in Loch Ness to support a sea serpent, simple economic theory relegates a supposed "middle class" to works of fiction such as sunday paper editorials and presidential campaign commercials.

      See also: compassionate conservatism, journalism, projected deficit

    5. Re:Today Ashcroft by jemenake · · Score: 4, Insightful
      On the other hand, I want to see Bush-voters who cheered "4 more years" to suffer financial & economical devastation...
      I feel you, man.

      In Clinton's last year in office, the national debt actually went *down* (when adjusted for inflation) for the first time in ages... probably my lifetime or even longer. Then, during Bush's first term, it has skyrocketed. It has increased by almost 50% (*not* adjusted for inflation... but inflation isn't anywhere *near* 50% per 4 yrs.)!

      Every election season, there's a call to reduce the deficit, and it always seems to fall on deaf ears. I think that most Americans have no idea what it really is, but (because they keep hearing politicians mention it so much), tacitly agree that we need to keep it down. However, I think that their level of conviction to that belief ranks right up there with trying to not consume quite so much saturated fat and salt: "Yeah, yeah... I know... I need to cut down one of these days.".

      With this latest election, I think I'm finally giving up. So, this is where I agree with you. I think I'm now going to support any legislation or budget that swells the deficit even further. Up until now, I've been telling people that, if the deficit is left unchecked then, someday, the interest on the debt will be more than our total tax revenue... at which point, there will be no way to stop the meltdown. However, they all seem to look at me as though I'm talking about an asteroid hitting the earth. They've never experienced it happening, so they don't really believe that it *can* happen.

      Well.... okay. If it can't happen, then I have no qualms about bringing it about as soon as possible. I'll start moving my assets to a country with a sensible fiscal policy, and then we can start doing what we can to make sure that the national debt swells into a runaway freight train as soon as possible.

      And.... to be quite honest, I'm sincerely curious to see what *does* happen. Will the gov't default on all of its loans and have the dollar become worthless overseas, or will our own economy (and gov't, too) implode as well? - Joe
  3. does that mean... by ZiakII · · Score: 5, Funny

    does that mean i can take off my tinfoil hat?

    1. Re:does that mean... by josh3736 · · Score: 4, Funny
      Blastphemer!!!

      As most other tinfoil hat wearers are aware, the only reason Ashcroft has resigned is so he can catch a lift up to the mind-reading satellite and read your mind directly! It's all a part of their global domination plan.

      (Sadly, that last bit has some truth to it. [tinfoil hat securely back on])

  4. I'm Confused! by Steve+B · · Score: 4, Funny
    He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated, 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.

    I thought that it was the overthrow of Saddam Hussein that did that....

    --
    /. If the government wants us to respect the law, it should set a better example.
  5. He's encouraging criminals. by readpunk · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm going to commit crimes just to spite him.

    --

    ./revolution
    1. Re:He's encouraging criminals. by Ba3r · · Score: 5, Funny

      kazaa loading.....
      eDonkey loading...
      bitTorrent whirring...
      cds ripping...
      dvds burning...
      firefox running... oh wait, a couple months too early to call that illegal

    2. Re:He's encouraging criminals. by Barlo_Mung_42 · · Score: 4, Funny

      "I'm going to commit crimes just to spite him."

      I can top that. I'm going to have gay sex just to spite him.

    3. Re:He's encouraging criminals. by Chris+Burke · · Score: 3, Funny

      Don't leave out lesbians, who can also exercise their patriotic libido by imagining what it'd be like to bump uglies with the feminine personification of freedom. Oh yeah...

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    4. Re:He's encouraging criminals. by 808140 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Shhh. Everyone knows AIDS is a disease only faggots get. Didn't you get the memo?

      Good, god-fearing Americans abstain from casual sex. That's why information regarding birth control and condoms doesn't need to be taught in school.

      Yes, my friend, faggot-sex will be the end of America as we know it. Luckily, George Bush has a plan to save the butt pirates. Through love, Jesus Christ, and make-you-straight boot-camp, we will teach these homos to do what's right for America, Jesus, and themselves.

      Or we'll kill them, I guess. That works too. Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to go watch NASCAR.

  6. We Won! by dasheiff · · Score: 5, Funny

    'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

    Yey we won! Now we can pull out of Iraq. No more airport security lines. I just hope W. can read script.

    1. Re:We Won! by Elizabeth007 · · Score: 5, Funny
      Hey, wait just a damned second here.

      I voted for that Bush guy because we weren't safe, and less than two weeks later we are?

      That was sarcasm. I swear.

  7. Huh? by Blue+Neon+Head · · Score: 4, Funny

    "The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved."

    Phew! Finally. Guess we don't need a DoJ anymore.

  8. Mission Accomplished by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful
    > 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

    At what cost?

  9. Ashcroft by ZX81 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    In all honesty I can only say good riddance.

    It's almost unbelievable that the USA would allow him to work on bills such as the Patriot act.

    What I don't understand is why are you guys not protesting?

    Have you given up?

    --
    -={ Security does not exist - give up }=-
    1. Re:Ashcroft by Drilian · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I think it's that Americans as a whole don't notice what's going on in their (our) government. It's a sad state of affairs, really.

      But yeah, I'm glad he's gone, too. Maybe we can finally uncover the statue of Justice.

    2. Re:Ashcroft by danheskett · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It's not trendy to dissent on the Patriot Act around here, but probably a solid 90% of the bill accomplished SORELY needed reforms.

      There were literally hundreds of pathetic attempts to seperate government agencies for a no good reason.

      The rest of the bill that you hear so much about is what really burns most civil libertarians.

      Everyone should be asked to read the whole act at least once in their lives. Most people would be surprised how much stuff the government *couldn't* do that just made sense before hand.

    3. Re:Ashcroft by DogDude · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You have to understand... the US government has done an EXCEPTIONAL job of keeping its people scared and ignorant. Hence, the election results. People in this country have no fucking clue as to what's going on, and those who do, get it from TV, which just spews out gov't propoganda designed to keep people fucking terrified. It's very Machiavellian, actually.

      We don't have an educated, informed population. Apparently, half of the US really IS made up of Jesus Freak, Nascar worshipping bigots.

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    4. Re:Ashcroft by f8free · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Ummm, we are. Been to a "free speech zone" lately?

    5. Re:Ashcroft by imuffin · · Score: 4, Informative

      Everyone should be asked to read the whole act at least once in their lives. Most people would be surprised how much stuff the government *couldn't* do that just made sense before hand.

      Well, according to Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, the members of congress weren't even allowed to read the PATRIOT act before voting on it.

      From the article:

      Paul confirms rumors circulating in Washington that this sweeping new law, with serious implications for each and every American, was not made available to members of Congress for review before the vote. "It's my understanding the bill wasn't printed before the vote -- at least I couldn't get it. They played all kinds of games, kept the House in session all night, and it was a very complicated bill. Maybe a handful of staffers actually read it, but the bill definitely was not available to members before the vote."

    6. Re:Ashcroft by Bob9113 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      but probably a solid 90% of the bill accomplished SORELY needed reforms.

      If I were offered a drink that was 90% fruit juice and vitamins, and 10% stricnine, I would choose not to drink it.

    7. Re:Ashcroft by fleener · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Have we given up? No. Big Media simply avoids reporting on most protests.

    8. Re:Ashcroft by MacDork · · Score: 3, Informative

      What I don't understand is why are you guys not protesting?

      Have you given up?

      Google for 'Miami Model'. Then mod Fleener and F8Free up.

    9. Re:Ashcroft by LMariachi · · Score: 4, Funny

      Or what if someone offered you an analogy that was 90% bullshit and 10% stupid? Or maybe vice-versa...

  10. Will Bush appoint a more conservative replacement? by mind21_98 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Is it possible that Bush will appoint a more conservative replacement for Ashcroft? That's been the danger, especially since up to four Supreme Court positions may open up this term. How would a more conservative Attorney General affect the US?

  11. And now Bush has his first Nominee by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    For the Supreme Court...

    --
    SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    1. Re:And now Bush has his first Nominee by stinerman · · Score: 5, Funny

      Don't you dare joke about things like that.

    2. Re:And now Bush has his first Nominee by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Umm, shouldn't a Supreme Court justice actually have spent some time being a judge? Seems unlikely you'd be able to ram a prosecutor through...Asscroft has no qualifications for the job other than being a religious right wackjob.

    3. Re:And now Bush has his first Nominee by thisissilly · · Score: 4, Informative

      Nope, only requirement for being on the supreme court is for the President of the US to nominate you, and be confirmed by the Senate.

      IIRC, if you look back at history you will find several ex-state governers were made Supreme Court Justices.

  12. Uncover those breasts! by SmilingMonk · · Score: 4, Funny

    Set them free. Freedom is a good thing, right? :-)

  13. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by darnok · · Score: 5, Funny

    I hear there's a former Iraqi Information Minister who's still looking for a job.

  14. Horray! Now he'll be free for his true passion... by Disperz · · Score: 5, Funny

    I for one can't wait for his music career to jump off!
    "LET THE EAGLE SOAR, LIKE SHE'S NEVER SOARN BEFORE!"
    http://www.cnn.com/video/us/2002/02/25/a shcroft.si ngs.wbtv.med.html

    --
    Do you see how my mind works? It's like a laser!
  15. Re:I Don't follow politics much .. by eln · · Score: 4, Informative

    He resigned because of health problems and exhaustion. Apparently he has been having various medical difficulties over the past year or so. I don't think this one was Bush's decision.

  16. *more* conservative? by Goonie · · Score: 3, Funny
    Are you trying to tell me that there are *more* "conservative" (they're really radicals) people Shrub could potentially appoint than Ashcroft? Just how scary do your wingnuts get?

    In any case, I don't know whether you were intending to but you've alluded to an interesting point. Justice Ashcroft anyone?

    --

    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
    --Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
    1. Re:*more* conservative? by tji · · Score: 4, Funny

      Ashcroft ensured our safety by covering the breasts of statues in the justice department.

      His more radically conservative replacement will complete this initiative, furthering American safety, by requiring burkas for all female statues.

    2. Re:*more* conservative? by bladernr · · Score: 5, Funny
      Listen to Savage Nation once in a while (for as long as you can stand it) to find someone you can really label 'radical.'

      Want a Democratic majority in this country? Make all Republicans listen to Mike Savage for a solid 4 hours. 90% of Republicans would think "THIS GUY is on my side?" and switch sides.

      (No I'm not kidding. How many Republicans really agree with those talk-radio whack-jobs?)

      Of course, I could also make 90% of Democrats become Republicans by making them listen to Air America for a day. You think the ring-wing guys are paraniod tin-foil hatters? Listen to Air America for a while.

      That's the beautiful thing about American politics: I can choose either major party and be guaranteed to be in horrible company.

      --
      Sarcasm and hyperbole are the final refuges for weak minds
  17. Poor Mr. Ashcroft by agent+dero · · Score: 3, Funny

    "He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated"

    I have a new found respect for John Ashcroft, it's pretty respectable that he thinks Bush will read five-pages of his letter.

    At least he "still believes"

    ;)

    --
    Error 407 - No creative sig found
    1. Re:Poor Mr. Ashcroft by Triumph+The+Insult+C · · Score: 3, Funny

      s/will/can/

      --
      vodka, straight up, thank you!
  18. Self-fulfilling prophecy by jinxidoru · · Score: 5, Funny

    'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

    Am I correct in assuming that his resignation is what is bringing this achievement to pass?

  19. As well as secure us from sex, drugs and P2P by isolation · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Thank God. I wish Ashcroft could read this.

    I am a Christain and a Conservative and I am glad to see him gone. His record on states rights vs federal law proves that the current administration cares nothing about the will of the people and only about the power of Federal law. I dont want the state coming in and telling me what I can and can't put in to my body or who I can have sex with. I could just see this guy dragging homosexuals in if the amendment had passed. I dont want the state to come in to my marrage or a gay marrage anymore than I want the state to come in to my relationship with God.

    This guy got his rocks off dragging people in to court over matters that should never have been law in the first place.

    See you around John.....

    --
    Free Unix? Free Windows. http://www.reactos.com
    1. Re:As well as secure us from sex, drugs and P2P by back_pages · · Score: 4, Insightful
      I wish I had mod points. I'm not a Christian and these days, I'm apparently not a Conservative (not trying to be flippant, I just wish we could stick to the Constitution) but it's nice to hear a self-identified Christian Conservative recognize the dissonance between that political stance and certain aspects of the Bush administration.

      I don't have mod points, but you got my respect.

  20. LOL by John+Seminal · · Score: 5, Funny
    He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated, 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.

    And Bush had to have someone read it to him.

    --

    Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."

  21. two thoughts spring to mind by way2trivial · · Score: 4, Funny
    the humor, 1- "He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated, 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'" the fact that it was addressed to the receipient it was- makes this an oxymoron...

    the serious 2- I recall a quote attributed to the then director of the patent office, requesting the patent office be closed, as all concieveable inventions had been made.. both the quote and the historical snip I give seem to have a spooky similarity

    --
    every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
  22. A good thing by ravenspear · · Score: 5, Funny

    The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.

    Does that mean the Patriot Act can be repealed now?

  23. We're saved! by mcmonkey · · Score: 5, Insightful
    'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'

    So they figured out how anthrax from US Army labs was mailed to various members of congress and media outlets, and captured those responsible?

    Oh...they haven't done that, eh?

    Well, at least gays can't marry.

  24. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by Sylver+Dragon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Like who, Joseph Stalin is dead?

    --
    Necessity is the mother of invention.
    Laziness is the father.
  25. great by nizo · · Score: 4, Funny

    I knew I should have hurried up with my idea for a four horsemen of the apocolypse t-shirt, now one of the horsemen has resigned....

  26. Re:Ashcroft wasn't so bad by John+Seminal · · Score: 5, Insightful
    You know, when you look back Ashcroft wasn't so bad. He turned the FBI around and changed its mission radically.

    Yeah, he did change the FBI. They no longer need search warrents, and they have no respect of our civil liberties. If you ask me, he damaged the USA. We were a more free people before he came to power. And don't forget, Ashcroft was the guy who lost his senate seat because the people of his state elected a dead guy rather than have 6 more years of him.

    --

    Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."

  27. Re:Today Ashcroft...Tomorrow Justice Ashcroft by Dante333 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Your thinking short term. Now that he isn't a AG, he can be a SCJ.

  28. What a day! by The+Hobo · · Score: 5, Funny

    1) Firefox 1.0 Released
    2) Halo 2 Released
    3) John Ashcroft Resigns
    4).... Profit!!!

    What a day it's been!

    --
    There is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men. -- Boondock Saints
    1. Re:What a day! by PMuse · · Score: 4, Funny

      This is one of those days when there's only one thing you can say: Praise the Lord.

      --
      "We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
    2. Re:What a day! by Alsee · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't understand why everyone's celebrating Asscroft leaving.

      Who the hell does everyone think Bush is going to replace him with? Michael Moore??

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    3. Re:What a day! by deltagreen · · Score: 4, Interesting
      You seem to be right in your concerns. According to CNN and Associated Press, the new Attorney General might be Alberto Gonzales. From the AP-article:
      Gonzales has been at the center of developing Bush's positions on balancing civil liberties with waging the war on terrorism - opening the White House counsel to the same line of criticism that has dogged Ashcroft.

      For instance, Gonzales publicly defended the administration's policy - essentially repudiated by the Supreme Court and now being fought out in the lower courts - of detaining certain terrorism suspects for extended periods without access to lawyers or courts.

      He also wrote a controversial February 2002 memo in which Bush claimed the right to waive anti-torture law and international treaties providing protections to prisoners of war. That position drew fire from human rights groups, which said it helped led to the type of abuses uncovered in the Abu Ghraib prison scandal.
      He certainly doesn't sound any better than Ashcroft.
  29. Now Up in the batters box by eclectro · · Score: 3, Interesting


    Is Mr. DMCA himself, Orrin Hatch.

    You will long for the days of Ashcroft.

    --
    Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
  30. Ashcroft was a HORRIBLE Attourney General by TrentL · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Before 9/11, Ashcroft's top priority was targetting pornography. Since 9/11, he has been embarassingly ineffective in capturing terrorists.

  31. Hey does this mean... by TiggertheMad · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...That I get to see lady Justice's boobie again?

    That may be worth a trip to D.C. for that alone!

    --

    HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
  32. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by stinerman · · Score: 4, Informative

    Whoa ... Stalin was an authoritarian communist. Probably the complete opposite of what is considered "conservative".

    Take a look at http://www.politicalcompass.org

  33. Re:Good Riddance by Trurl's+Machine · · Score: 5, Interesting

    You are most certainly wrong. I'm not even sure if Palmer was the worst one. With all due (dis)respect to Mr Ashcroft, nothing even remotely like Palmer Raids happened during his tenure. Palmer was the key factor behind the 1917 and 1918 "Espionage Act" and "Sedition Act", comparing to which Patriot Act is a teddy bear. According to this law, an elected member of Congress was refused a seat because of his pacifist views - and sentenced to 20 years of prison just because he didn't believe that America should join the slaughter of World War I (more on Victor Berger you can find here. The Palmer Raids themselves rendered the question of American "constitutional rights" simply irrelevant - it appeared there were none of them. To quote Wikipedia:

    Starting on November 7, 1919, Palmer's men smashed union offices and the headquarters of Communist and Socialist organizations without warrants, concentrating on foreigners. They arrested over 10,000 people (...) In January, 1920, another 6,000 were arrested, mostly members of the anarcho-syndicalist union Industrial Workers of the World. During one of the raids, more than 4,000 Communists were rounded up in a single night. All foreign aliens caught were deported.

    The public reaction to these raids was favorable, stirring up a storm of anti-communist sentiment. In a murder eerily similar to the lynching of Germans during World War I, a group of young men in Centralia, Washington hanged a radical from a railway bridge. The coroner's report stated that the communist "jumped off with a rope around his neck and then shot himself full of holes." For most of 1919, the public seemed to side with Palmer.


    I don't want to defend Bush & Ashcroft, but it's simply naive to see them as "the worst that happened". No, it's not the worst in American history. When you look on the whole American history it turns out that only the post-WWII period really resembles contemporary understanding of constitutional democracy (and even then there were authoritarian hiccups of McCarthyism or Watergate).

  34. Successor? by cnsc1rtr · · Score: 5, Informative
    from The Yahoo News/AP story:
    Speculation about a successor to Ashcroft has centered on his former deputy, Larry Thompson, who recently took a job as general counsel at PepsiCo. If appointed, Thompson would be the nation's first black attorney general. Others prominently mentioned include Bush's 2004 campaign chairman, former Montana Gov. Marc Racicot, and White House general counsel Alberto Gonzales.
    [...]
    Washington continued to buzz with speculation about the futures of Secretary of State Colin Powell and Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld.
    [...]
    Condoleezza Rice, the president's national security adviser, is considered a possible successor for either Rumsfeld or Powell. She has let it be known that she does not want to remain in her current role in the second term, and officials say her path is up or out. Rice said a year ago she wasn't interested in getting enmeshed in the bureaucracy at the State Department, but aides don't rule that out now, particularly with prospects for change in the Middle East.

  35. Re:Much ado about nothing by Chatmag · · Score: 3, Informative

    The resignation was written November 2nd. Election Day. You're right, this is a custom that's been going on for many years.

    In this case, I think it to be true. I just saw it on CNN'S site. It mentions some remarks by President Bush in regards to the resignations of Ashcroft and Evans.

    --
    Pete Carr Owner Chatmag.com
  36. 5 page letter? by danielacroft · · Score: 5, Funny

    "He gave Bush a five-page, handwritten letter in which he stated, 'The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved.'"

    I hope he attached an audio book version to the letter.

    --
    Something intruiging...
    1. Re:5 page letter? by eclectro · · Score: 5, Funny


      Actually it's five pages because he had to use a crayon.

      --
      Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
  37. Re:Ashcroft wasn't so bad by zerblat · · Score: 3, Insightful
    While the FBI has had a lot of false positives, it hasn't had many false negatives.
    And that's supposed to be a good thing? You know, it isn't hard to eliminate all false negatives if you aren't concerned about the false positives. Just assume all cases are positive.
    --
    Please alter my pants as fashion dictates.
  38. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by Java+Ape · · Score: 4, Funny
    Is it possible that Bush will appoint a more conservative replacement for Ashcroft?

    No, Ashcroft is moving to the bereau of weights and measures to serve as the standard of "Absolute Conservative". As such, it is impossible to appoint a more conservative replacement.

    Doubtless, Bush will attempt to redefine the "Absolute Conservative" standard when selecting Ashcroft's replacement, but experts agree that he's likely to appoint a "Facist Extremist" by mistake.

  39. Yes, completely out of context! by Wakko+Warner · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The entire text of the letter is here.

    Taken out of context, it loses very little. The man claims we've beaten both crime and terrorism.

    Have we?

    - A.P.

    --
    "Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
    1. Re:Yes, completely out of context! by a+whoabot · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's your objection? "He's obviously talking about the objective!" Of course he's talking about "the objective." That's what he actually fucking said: "The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved." You don't have to say "it is obvious": it actually is. But then you go on to say what "the objective is." He says what the objective is: "the objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror." You don't have to offer your intepretation of what "the objective" is friend, he tells you right there what it is. Quit trying to precariously argue for the existence of the "liberal bias" the foam-mouthed AC above(probably you) reflexively screamed out.

      The paragraph:

      "The demands of justice are both rewarding and depleting. I take great personal satisfaction in the record which has been developed. The objective of securing the safety of Americans from crime and terror has been achieved. The rule of law has been strengthened and upheld in the courts. Yet, I believe that the Department of Justice would be well served by new leadership and fresh inspiration. I believe that my energies and talents should be directed toward other challenging horizons."

      Wether he actually meant what he said is another thing. Which I don't care about one way or the other. Useless politics...

    2. Re:Yes, completely out of context! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It depends how you define 'terrorism'.

      Outside the 19 that supposedly died on the planes in newyork (nearly half have turned up alive), how many other have been charged with the crimes relating to the largest terrorist attack on US soil.

      100,000 Iraqis have died since the Iraq war.

      1,000 US soldiers.

      What is terrorism?

      Who were the losers?

  40. Sadly by fluxrad · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Tomorrow it's almost certainly Colin Powell. There is general agreement that he will leave, having been forced into an outsider's viewpoint by the ranks of the neoconservative faction of the Bush administration, i.e. Rumsfeld, Cheney, and Wolfowitz to name just a few.

    While I am absolutely elated that Ashcroft has resigned, I have no doubt that we will most certainly see four more years of the same foreign policy that has dogged the US since Bush's first inauguration. That, combined with the fact that Ashcroft has already done significant domestic damage viz. the PATRIOT act paints a rather bleak picture for the US in the coming years - even if the inside players are different.

    The stage has already been set.

    --
    "It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
    1. Re:Sadly by tuxlove · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You may be right about Powell, but it's still a load of crap. Rumsfeld should be the very first to go, even before Asscroft. He's a bumbling idiot, too naive and careless to be filling his seat. How many soldiers have died because he didn't listen when the military told him they need more troops than he was sending? Or because he stupidly believed that the Iraqis would welcome the US with open arms and occupying the country would be easy? And so on, and so on. He can't even open his mouth in a press conference any more without putting his foot in his mouth. It's time to retire him, the same way we retire an old nag of a horse with a lame leg.

  41. Re:Ashcroft wasn't so bad by Catbeller · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Reno let the rabid dogs have a special prosecutor, who spent seventy millions bucks to mount an impeachment fishing expedition. What else would you want?? JEEZ.

    And it all came up empty.

    Now Aschroft? Snatched defeat from the claws of victory, and completely let Microsoft walk after it was convicted, fried, toasted by the Reno Justice Department. Dragged his heels on the Enron investigation -- helped Bush run interference as the billions were stolen. Slow-walked the Valerie Plame treason investigation past the election. Didn't investigate massive election interference in both 2000 and now 2004. Let the Pubs walk on using Homeland Security apparatus to interfere in the Texas redistricting. Won't instruct Bush to comply with the Supreme Court's stunning orders to let the concentration camp prisoners have access to a fair trial - they are ignoring the law of the land and performing show trials. He rammed the Patriot act into law, effectively repealing at least three ammendments in the Bill of Rights.

    And the FBI was gutted by Freeh, the Clinton appointee who turned for the impeachment elves and committed 50 full time agents to investigating Clinton's sex lives while Al Queda was moving into position. Freeh "reformed" the FBI by eliminating an entire middle level of analysts, and "streamlining" the flow of information from below into the executive offices - ie, him. The warning from field agents were ignored because experienced analysts no longer existed to read the damned reports.

    The FBI was "changed around" by Freeh. I doubt much that Ashcroft did didley to restore the analysts back to duty. Waht Bush/Ashcroft are doing, really, is to make every information asset we have responsible to and report to the executive, ie Bush. Not only do we not have the middle level of analysts back, we instead have a pack of political true-believers distilling info for the President's consumption. It's a wreck.

    His resignation was rumored for over a year. no surprise. However, his replacement will be much worse.

  42. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by ajakk · · Score: 4, Informative
    Giuliani has all of qualifications:
    • Went to prestigous law school
    • Clerked for a federal judge (S.D.N.Y.)
    • Worked as an assistant U.S. Attorney
    • Worked as an executive U.S. Attorney
    • Worked as a full U.S. Attorney
    • Was Associate Deputy Attorney General
    • Was the Associate Attorney General (third highest position in the DoJ)
    • Well liked by members of both parties
    • Track record of being extremely tough on crime
  43. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by Fnkmaster · · Score: 3, Funny

    Gee, it must suck to have a label like "conservative" misappropriated and turned into an insult meaning "authoritarian". See how it feels when the President does the same with the word "liberal", which has been turned into an insult meaning essentially "communist"?

    Cry me a fucking river. After the besmirching that my state, Massachusetts, got from nutjob Shrub, I really feel bad for the poor conservatives that their ideology has been wrested from them by authoritarian whackjobs like Ashcroft. Boo-fucking-hoo.

  44. your own link disagrees with you by Trepidity · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Stalin's at the top left, Ashcroft's at the top right. They're both on the top, which is the "authoritarian" side. They differ on economic issues, but that's irrelevant, because the attorney general's job is not an economic one. On the relevant issues, they're similar.

    1. Re:your own link disagrees with you by Fnkmaster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And literally "liberal" means "1. not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry; 2. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded".

      Now try to imagine the type of person that reads that definition and says "nope, that's not me at all", or even worse, thinks that word should be used as an insult. And you get an inkling of what's wrong with America.

  45. Re:Will Bush appoint a more conservative replaceme by stinerman · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Conseravatism is a very subjective word. I wouldn't consider any neo-con to be a conservative, but I tend to use it in casual conversation to mean someone that tends to vote Republican.

    In my opinion, Ashcroft is a fascist ... and before I get flamed, fascism is simply authoritarianism on social issues and a corporatist economic policy.

  46. Re:Ashcroft wasn't so bad by cje · · Score: 3, Informative

    The only thing I remember her doing was frying a whole bunch of fellow citizens down in Texas.

    While I have no strong opinions about Janet Reno (pro or con), I think you're leaving some basic facts out of the equation here. The Branch Davidians (the "fellow citizens" you're referring to here) were in violation of several firearms laws at varying levels. Law enforcement authorities obtained a proper warrant and served it on February 28, 1993. If you're keeping score, that was almost two weeks before Janet Reno was even sworn in as Attorney General on March 12th. In the resulting raid, four federal agents were murdered by these same "fellow citizens" that you are (at least tangentially) defending. These were men with families, and they were just doing their job. I've never understood why it's not okay for the government to enforce the law, but it's all fine and dandy to kill law enforcement officers.

    Janet Reno made the best of a bad situation. Even though she had only been in office for a couple of weeks when the final raid happened and had very little to do with its planning and how it was executed, she took full responsibility for it. She was, after all, the Attorney General at the time that it happened. But there's a certain amount of logical inconsistency here; we are told that we cannot blame President Bush for the intelligence failures that led to 9/11 because he had only been in office for eight months before it happened, but we can blame Waco on Reno even though it started before she became AG and she had only been in office for a couple of weeks. (For the record, I don't blame 9/11 on President Bush.)

    You know that the FBI/ATF bent over backwards to bring the Waco siege to a peaceful conclusion, don't you? They repeatedly tried to negotiate with Koresh, offering food and other basic supplies if he would just release some of the children from the compound, to which he replied (literally) "kiss my ass." The way that the situation resolved itself was tragic and there will probably always be questions about it, but the basic fact of the matter is that the Branch Davidians had 51 days to end the standoff peacefully and they chose not to. And I've never understood the mindset that can dismiss the murder of law enforcement agents, particularly in the post-9/11 era.

    --
    We're going down, in a spiral to the ground
  47. I not a religious man, but... by the_mushroom_king · · Score: 5, Funny

    Halle-FUCKING-lujah!!

  48. Don't be a jerk about it by HBI · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Eisenhower, Bradley, Halsey, MacArthur, etc all were permitted to accept honorary knighthood from the Brits. It's just something cute nowadays. Back in 1787 it was a real consideration.

    --
    HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
  49. Stalking horse by daveo0331 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's unlikely that Ashcroft would make it onto the Supreme Court, but Bush might use him as a stalking horse. Nominate him, watch the country go crazy, watch the Democrats use up all their time and political capital fighting off Ashcroft... then when everyone is worn out from blocking the Ashcroft nomination, Bush appoints a relative unknown who turns out to be as bad or worse.

    The Democrats need to watch out for this, and keep up the resistance against anyone on the right wing that Bush tries to put on the Court. We still have 45 seats in the Senate, that's enough for a filibuster. The ability to filibuster is there for a reason -- to stop a President and 51 Senators (or in this case 55) from the same party from putting an extremist on the Supreme Court. The Democrats need to make sure Bush comes up with nominees that are at lease somewhat moderate.

    --
    Remember the days when Republicans were the party of fiscal responsibility?
    1. Re:Stalking horse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Ashcroft may have suppored the USAPA, but he didn't enact it.

      Again, HE WROTE IT.

      Over 90% of the words in the act are directly from his office and most of that directly from his hand.

      Yeah, he also "supported it" by scaremongering congress into enacting it without even reading it.

      In any rational examination that makes him PRIMARILY responsible. All the others are just contributory infringers. They may have abrogated their power to him, but he did not turn it down and still brags of his actions today.

    2. Re:Stalking horse by Rei · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Wait, are you going to pretend that he *hasn't* been one of the most "activist" attorney generals in recent history? From trying to overturn Oregon's ballot-initiative-created assisted suicide law, to doing the same sort of thing with California's medical marijuana law, to dredging up an obscure 1872 law to bring a case against a nonviolent greenpeace protest 15 months after the fact, to coming up with the "secret detention/secret trials" nonsense, to pretending to be the Supreme Court in declaring that the justice department has no authority over most cases of gun control regulation due to the second amendment, to *drafting*, using USDOJ resources the USA-PATRIOT Act, and then using government funds to go on a *cross-country tour* to promote it?

      He's not just a postmodern bureaucrat. He's a bloody nihilist.

      --
      That's it, Mr. Giraffe, get all the marmalade.
    3. Re:Stalking horse by Rei · · Score: 4, Informative

      Oh please yourself. Ashcroft *did* have the DOJ write the Patriot Act, and its principal author was the assistant attorney general Viet D. Dinh. Who did you think wrote it?

      --
      That's it, Mr. Giraffe, get all the marmalade.
    4. Re:Stalking horse by Debillitatus · · Score: 3, Funny
      Nihilists? Shit. Say what you will about the tenets of National Socialism, at least it's an ethos.

      I did not watch my buddies die face down in the muck, in the meaningless theatre of war, to return to a world where rules are trampled on willy-nihily.

      --

      Come on, give it up, that's

    5. Re:Stalking horse by Rei · · Score: 4, Informative

      *Sigh* - where do you get this stuff? Newsmax? Washington Times? Try doing some work for yourself, will you?

      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d107:SN0 15 10:@@@S

      STATUS: (color indicates Senate actions)
      10/4/2001:
      Introduced in the Senate. Read the first time. Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under Read the First Time. (text of measure as introduced: CR S10307-10333)
      10/9/2001:
      Read the second time. Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under General Orders. Calendar No. 187.
      10/11/2001:
      Measure laid before Senate. (consideration: CR S10547-10630)
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1899 Amendment SA 1899 proposed by Senator Feingold. (consideration: CR S10570-10575; text: CR S10570)
      To make amendments to the provision relating to interception of computer trespasser communications.
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1899 Motion to table amendment SA 1899 agreed to in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 83 - 13. Record Vote Number: 299.
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1900 Amendment SA 1900 proposed by Senator Feingold. (consideration: CR S10575-10577; text: CR S10575)
      To limit the roving wiretap authority under FISA.
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1900 Motion to table amendment SA 1900 agreed to in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 90 - 7. Record Vote Number: 300.
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1901 Amendment SA 1901 proposed by Senator Feingold. (consideration: CR S10583-10586; text: CR S10583)
      To modify the provisions relating to access to business records under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978.
      10/11/2001:
      S.AMDT.1901 Motion to table amendment SA 1901 agreed to in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 89 - 8. Record Vote Number: 301.
      10/11/2001:
      Passed Senate without amendment by Yea-Nay Vote. 96 - 1. Record Vote Number: 302. (text of bill as passed Senate: CR S10604-10630)
      10/30/2001:
      Senate vitiated previous passage.
      10/30/2001:
      Indefinitely postponed by Senate by Unanimous Consent. (consideration: CR S11247)

      Note something that's missing? You guessed it - the complete addition of a new section (securing our borders). it was *already there*. Kerry voted *against* the amendments listed.

      Here is section IV of the bill *AS SUBMITTED* to the senate:

      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r107:1:./t em p/~r107BHdfjx:e359387:
      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi- bin/query/F?r107:1:./tem p/~r107BHdfjx:e371105:
      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi- bin/query/F?r107:1:./tem p/~r107BHdfjx:e382616:

      You people are incorrigible.

      --
      That's it, Mr. Giraffe, get all the marmalade.
  50. In other news... by Greg+Larkin · · Score: 3, Funny


    ...Ashcroft's statue was seen disrobing upon hearing of his resignation!

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  51. Five Words for You by onosendai · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Better the devil you know ..

    --
    <? include ('signature.inc'); ?>
  52. Yeah, the US is much safer. by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 4, Insightful

    After arresting scores of innocent people at the instigation of this and other war criminals and convicting the big amount of 0, zero, zilch, nada of activities related to terrorism.

    In one case the damning evidence was a video of the alleged terrorists spending time in Disneyland.

    And the only ones the neo-ayatollahs have any hope of "convicting" of any terrorism related activities they have safely guarded them in Guantanamo or Abu Gharib, were confessions can be conviniently extracted at the pleasure of the torturers and kangoroo courts will sentence in accordance to the public, on record wishes of the reelected Orwellian master overlord.

    And the poster of the article still has the indecency to find something good to say about this individual.

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.
  53. Aha! by FunWithHeadlines · · Score: 3, Funny
    " does that mean i can take off my tinfoil hat?"

    Ah, got you at last, ZiakII! You finally show up on our radar screens, and our agents will be at your door within minutes. Please cooperate fully. Thank you.

  54. NPR had a stroy on the other day by CptSkippy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    inwhich they said that it is tradition for all of the President's staff to turn in their resignations and then the President decides whose he'll accept.

  55. Some thoughts on Ashcroft by kbahey · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is too late in the discussion, but I just saw it a little while ago and Ashcroft strikes a nerve. So here goes.

    Ashcroft reminds me of Ministers of Interiors in Third World dictatorships. He is a tool for the dictator and the regime, and not there for his main job, that is protect the people.

    His argument that he did achieve his objectives in protecting America from crime and terror is much like the guy who sprayed pepper on his front lawn, to ward off elephants. When his neighbor told him there are no elephants here, he says : "See! It works!"

    Not a single case in the past 3 years was prosecuted successfully as a terrorism case, with conviction. All of the high profile arrests where Aschroft made press conferences with huge pomp, touting them as major victories in the war on terrorism, are just for show. For example, the Lakawanna Six (Buffalo, NY) Yemeni-Americans all pleaded to lesser charges and were convicted. The case of the African American bunch in Oregon is similar. The same goes for the Holy Land Foundation in Texas, and other Muslim charity cases. Most cases that Ashcroft said to be terrorism end up getting convictions for immigration irregularities or ID fraud (SSN, Driver License, Food Stamps, ...etc.). No terrorism at all, except the constant drumming up of fear in the masses, and no one remembers what happened to the poor souls who got caught and made examples of.

    Of course, the Patriot Act, Secret Evidence, and the eroding civil liberties that goes with it, is exactly what is wrong, since terrorists have achieved an objective with these things.

    There are other incidents that show his short comings as well, such as making a big deal of a statue with the bare breast, his fundamentalist view, him attacking Islam while in office, and more.

    Someone should really make up a web site about Ashcroft Watch or something, lest people forget all this.

    Well, his letter of resignation says "I believe that my energies and talents should be directed toward other challenging horizons." What does that mean? Is a Supreme Court Justice position waiting for him (despite the poster above who said that it has to be someone with judge qualifications)?

  56. Ashcroft wasn't always a civil liberties foe by hawkestein · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Remember the Clipper chip? Ashcroft sided with the ACLU in opposing it. Even more ironically, Kerry supported it.

    --
    -- Will quantum computers run imaginary-time operating systems?
  57. Your rights shot to hell by wurp · · Score: 4, Insightful

    *One time* foreign terrorists killed 3000 people in the US. It's a terrible tragedy, but so are the 45,000 people who died in car accidents that year. And the 700,000 people who died of heart disease.

    We have gone insanely overboard in how we handle terrorism. America is founded on the freedom of the people. So much so that these freedoms are written into our founding document - the Constitution. When someone tells me that we need to "protect America" from something that had a negligible statistical effect by taking away my Constitutional rights, I'll rightly tell them they're stupid, crazy, or very ignorant.

    1st amendment - "right of the people peaceably to assemble" - except near the Republican National Convention in 2004.

    4th amendment - "no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause" - except when the Patriot Act says it's OK.

    5th amendment - "nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law" - except if we can find some way to call them enemy combatants, or we declare they can't be tried publicly due to security considerations.

    6th amendment - "accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial" - see above.

    8th amendment - "nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted" - except in Abu Ghraib, or (maybe, how can we know?) Guantanamo.

    10th amendment - "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people." - this one's been shot to hell for ages :-(

    If I tried to live by the Constitution, I'd end up shot by federal agents inside of five years.

    1. Re:Your rights shot to hell by wurp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      When did I belittle the tragedy? It is you who pile tragedy upon tragedy by using the deaths of those innocent people as an excuse for the government to take away every American's civil rights. If you want to live in a nanny state, go found your own somewhere without that pesky Bill of Rights.

      Secondly, try looking into what Richard Clarke has to say about the great protection the Bush administration has given us from terrorism. He should know, as a National Security advisor.

      I never said that terrorists aren't horrible, evil people - but becoming more like the hyper-conservative religious states that foster terrorism is not a solution to the problem. Our devotion to freedom for everyone who doesn't harm others; our devotion to fair trail, probable cause, and public trial - those are the things that make America great. Those are the things being destroyed as a response to terrorist actions. Terrorists can't destroy America - but we can.

      "Normal Americans" are sheep like you who've been led to react like Pavlov's dog to the magic word "terrorism". Normal Americans are unAmerican, and have the gall to tell me that *I* am.

      You think about the situation when the Constitution was written, and try to tell me that they didn't have a hundred times the reason to worry about their security. Then think about why they chose to protect their security by securing their liberty. I am ashamed at how we've honored that choice.

    2. Re:Your rights shot to hell by rco3 · · Score: 3, Informative

      "Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always
      be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is
      tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of
      patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any
      country." -Hermann Goering, Nuremburg, 1947

      You've been brainwashed, krimka. Brainwashed. Nobody wants terrorism here. Neither do we want our Constitutionally-mandated civil rights abrogated.

      FACT: PATRIOT Act has been abused. More than once. More than twice.

      If you could say that PATRIOT Act could and would ONLY be used to investigate terrorists, that would be a different story. But you can't say that: firstly, because we've already seen that it isn't true; secondly, because the more power you give to law enforcement personnel, the more those individual persons will abuse it - it's just too easy to say, "uh, yeah, it's a terrorism investigation, sure"; and thirdly, because you won't know that they're terrorists until AFTER you've violated their constitutional rights.

      The fact that a group of assholes have committed horrible crimes against Americans, in the name of Islam or whatever, does not justify the abrogation of the Constitutional rights of Americans, and *I* resent your implicit belittling of the sacrifices of those thousands (millions?) of Americans who have *knowingly* and *willingly* fought and died to protect those rights.

      --

      Ce n'est pas un vrai mouvement de robot!
    3. Re:Your rights shot to hell by rco3 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "You are the one who, in the face of all that, is still shouting about it being unconstitutional."

      Well, me and U.S. District Judge Audrey Collins.

      Don't be stupid. Laws have been passed and found unconstitutional before. So have parts of this one, already, and I believe that a challenge to certain other parts would be successful as well. Hell, even Amendments to the Constitution have been repealed when they turned out to be oppressive and wrong. The only way this law would survive a real Supreme Court hearing is if Bush packs the SCOTUS with the ultra-conservative puppets that he so clearly wants to.

      Just to set the record straight, that's NOT all you're saying. You're also saying, in so many words, that people who oppose PATRIOT Act are people "who don't think we are in danger from terrorists" and aren't "Normal Americans" and that as a result terrorists have "Americans like you on their side". You are essentially stating that my (and others') opposition to the unconstitutional and oppressive PATRIOT Act makes us unpatriotic, unAmerican, and a danger to America. Just like Goering said.

      No, sir, the real danger from America comes from you and your sheep-like ilk. "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin. Doesn't get more American than that.

      --

      Ce n'est pas un vrai mouvement de robot!
    4. Re:Your rights shot to hell by rco3 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And discourse with you is like listening to a recording.

      I've already read your statements that PATRIOT Act is in effect. I've read your statements that it was enacted by Congress and signed by the sitting President. I've heard all that. Several times. Yet you feel that if you just say it enough, I and others will realize that it makes everything OK, and PATRIOT is my friend, and if my congressmen voted for it it must be OK...

      It doesn't make the bill a good bill. It doesn't make it constitutional. What makes a bill constitutional is for the bill to be compliant with the provisions of the Constitution and its amendments. The way that gets tested is that a Federal court hears a case in which a specific section of the law in question is challenged, and then hands down a decision. This decision can be appealed, by either side, all the way up to the SCOTUS, who can then decide whether or not to hear the appeal. Their decision is final, unless they choose to revisit it. The SCOTUS is the ultimate arbiter of Constitutionality in the USA, and they have not handed down a SINGLE decision re: PATRIOT Act that I've been able to find.

      IOW, krimka, your assertion that PATRIOT has been approved by the SCOTUS will require additional evidence. Repeating the assertion isn't evidence.

      Would you like to know why I object to PATRIOT Act? Here's a sample: The Patriot Act defines domestic terrorism as conduct that violates state or federal law and is dangerous to human life.

      WHAT?

      By that definition, you could just as easily say that driving in the rain without your headlights is domestic terrorism. Is that a reasonable interpretation? Of course not. But consider this. The FBI, at the bidding of the MPAA, used the PATRIOT Act to obtain financial records to be used in the prosecution of a website administrator. The charges? That he was distributing old episodes of Stargate SG-1. Now, I don't care HOW much you hate Stargate - that's not terrorism. That's abuse of powers.

      Lastly, let's settle this thing about "rude". Every time you question whether someone who opposes PATRIOT Act is truly an American, suggest that they are on the side of the terrorists (whichever terrorists we're pissed about this year), or suggest that their only motivation behind opposition to PATRIOT Act is to garner some sort of "points" in some game, you insult that person most poisonously. Dissenting discourse is about as American as it can get, and the unAmerican way is to try to suppress discourse from the opposition. In the face of that, my telling you NOT to be "stupid" is a fart in a hurricane. I'll retract my suggestion that you have the potential to be stupid the moment you retract your assertion, in every commment you've made attached to this article, that opposition to PATRIOT Act is unAmerican.

      Every time you repeat the calumny about "jeopardizing our safety so they can score some political points" and "weak on security", you echo the words of another manipulator of sheep. Since you seem to think that repetition==argument, I'll repeat those words for you again. See if they sound familiar.

      "Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country." -Hermann Goering, Nuremburg, 1947

      --

      Ce n'est pas un vrai mouvement de robot!
  58. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by slinky259 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Coincidentally, my dad's friend from work ate dinner with him today, and this came up at the conversation.

    Both of the aforementioned men are in the Navy, and our guest knew someone on the Lincoln that day. The "Mission Accomplished" banner was actually meant for the crew members of the ship - they had just finished their nine month stint away from home, and had "accomplished" their mission. It wasn't meant for Bush's visit.

    ~stephen

  59. 5 Page Handwritten Letter? by victor_the_cleaner · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Does anybody else think a five page handwritten letter sounds a bit psychotic?

  60. Re:Yesh... this is transparent by EmagGeek · · Score: 3, Informative

    PREDICTION: Unless Bush has problems passing a law allowing Corporate America to loot social security (instead of the neo-cons looting it), the "Alert Level" thing is going to quietly fade away.

    Wow, troll bait, but I have to bite. If you look at the numbers, you'll see that Social Security has seen a bigger surplus in the first 4 years under Bush than it saw under all 8 years of Clinton.

    Click here to see the numbers for yourself.

    You'll also see that we only saw one year of REAL surplus under Clinton - 2000. There was an 86.6 billion surplus in the budget. 1.9B the year before, but that's not anything to have a party over.

    One other interesting thing you'll see is that the national debt, in terms of GDP, was higher under Clinton than under any other President in the presented data. Under Bush, the national debt has fallen from 49.5% GDP at Clinton's highest point to 36.1% in 2003.

    Finally, if you look at total government spending in terms of GDP, we're spending on average less now than we did under Clinton.

  61. On the contrary... by Onan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The compartmentalization of agencies was most certainly not for no good reason. It was to make law enforcement less effective, which was a good and important goal of our governmental design.

    The thing that Mr. Ashcroft and the rest of the executive branch have forgotten is that we need to be at least as suspicious and limiting of our government as of the people from whom our government is supposedly protecting us. Instead, the executive branch has taken the absurd view that their enemies are "Evil", and thus that their own actions are--definitionally--Good.

    This is a dangerous premise. History has taught us that governments very reliably stray from Good. Every single act undertaken by a government must be carefully evaluated with questions like, "Does this make us the bad guys? Is this worse than what we're trying to solve?" And even after such questions have been asked, we need to still assume that they've been answered incorrectly, and place harsh limitations on the fundamental things a government can do.

    This is the origin of bans on interdepartmental cooperation, statutes of limitation, limitations on search and siezure, the specificity of of search warrants, and so on. After all, if your government were always the good guys, you wouldn't need any such protections, right?

  62. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative
    It's amazing, then, that Karl Rove regrets using banner.

    Does that mean he regrets congradulating those Navy guys on their 9-month trip?

    Or was it just foreshadowing that they probably had to get sent back because of the depth of the quagmire we're in.

    And since Bush's speach was announcing the "end of major combat operations", are you saying that Bush ended the operations before he thought the mission was accomplished!?! That's very irresponsible.

  63. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by jalefkowit · · Score: 3, Informative

    Both of the aforementioned men are in the Navy, and our guest knew someone on the Lincoln that day. The "Mission Accomplished" banner was actually meant for the crew members of the ship - they had just finished their nine month stint away from home, and had "accomplished" their mission. It wasn't meant for Bush's visit.

    Sorry, but this is one of those after-the-fact rationalizations that people have invented to justify the banner once it became clear just how ridiculous it was.

    How so, you ask? Well, if it was a banner meant for the ship's crew, to celebrate the completion of their mission, why did the White House make up the banner and bring it to the ship? Not the sort of thing you would expect if it was just something the Navy does as a matter of course at the end of a long voyage.

    The President and his people are saying that the banner was the "Navy's idea" so they don't have to take responsibility for their gaffe. But then blaming the troops for the Commander in Chief's screw-ups is something the GOP is getting pretty comfortable doing these days.

  64. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by blueskies · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yeah, you mean the banner that the sailors made, which Bush had nothing to do with?

    Don't you feel like a jackass after the AC posted this link with Rove regreting using the banner? Quote: "the White House staff had it made by a private vendor"

    Then began the reconstruction phase of Iraq in which the military's mission is security and training. But I guess these concepts are too hard for liberal sheep to grasp.

    Well, in defense of sheep, liberal or conservative, Bush seems to indicate that things are going as "planned," and if that is the case I don't think their mission has anything to do with security.

  65. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by slinky259 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'm not even going to bother trying to understand that...

    Ok... I concede defeat. Major combat operations have ended on Slashdot... (crosses fingers)

    I was just passing along the dinnertime conversation - apparently no one in my family has done their research.

    ~stephen

  66. Resigning To Focus On Core Responsibilities by MooseByte · · Score: 4, Funny

    "well, he's just now resigning...."

    Clearly due to the fact that his stint as Attorney General was interfering with his duties as Sith Lord.

  67. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Let's see now:

    On the one hand, an AP report by someone who did the research, tracked the documentation, talked to the people most directly involved,

    VERSUS

    A /. submission that he said that he heard over dinner from his friend that HE heard...

    WHO DO I BELIEVE? PLEASE, GOD HELP ME, WHO DO I BELIEVE?

  68. What I hate about the PATRIOT Act... by cr0sh · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Well - other than its "name", which puts the term "patriot" to shame...

    What I hate most about it is not the Act itself (though it has its despicable parts) - but the fact that as a citizen, I wasn't represented by my congressmen when they passed it. It came out of the blue, it was voted on, and nobody read it...

    Worse, my fellow citizens don't seem to care about this important fact: that a law so broad and reaching as this Act became law without their so-called representatives reading it, understanding what it said, and debating its merits! This isn't what these guys were elected for, right?

    But this is what America has become - don't read the fine print on that contract you sign - and don't read it if it only likely will affect others who elected you - fuck 'em, right? Because you are now in office, and who gives a damn about the people, right? Just give me some more cash, err, donations - Ms. Rosen and Mr. Valentti, all will be OK. The people - screw them!

    Who cares about the people - they'll elect me again, right? Shit, Bush is the dumbest motherfucker on the planet (you know they are thinking this) - yet the people spoke up for him again, too. Me - I'm a shoo-in!

    Damn - I would at least have a little more respect for my so-called representatives had they at least read it (how many pages was it - 500?), questioned it, debated it, discussed it - and then, only then - voted on it in full conscience on what they were voting for. Hell - you would have thought at least one of them (well, there was one guy - Russ) would have had issues. I also wonder why no one even bothered to ask how such a large piece of legislation just "suddenly" appeared out of thin air - like it was waiting in the wings for just this sort of thing (9/11) to happen.

    Assuming, of course, that nothing more meets the eye on that little bit of history either - I still have my doubts on the why's, how's, etc of that day - questions that have yet to be fully answered in my opinion - things don't add up.

    But maybe, just maybe, if we close our eyes, plug our ears, and scream "nyha, nyha, nyha!!!" - it will all go away - ya think?

    At least, it seems that is how the rest of America is...

    --
    Reason is the Path to God - Anon
  69. Re:This whole article should stop now. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny
    Godwin is watching.

    Yeah, he can be a real thread Nazi.

    Oops, here come the Godwin Nazis to shutt me up.

    Oops. Here come the Spelling Nazis to correct me error above.

    Oops. Here come the Grammar Nazis to correct the error following the last error.

    Oops. Here come the joke Nazis to say i should have stopped after the first line.

    Oops. Here come the /. Nazis to say this would be much funnier if it had a 1)? 2)? 3)Profit! in it somewhere.

    Oops. Here... I give up. Call me France. I surrender.

  70. Re:Misson Accomplished!! by gowen · · Score: 4, Informative
    Well, lets read what Bush said while standing under that banner:
    "Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed."
    Must be reassuring to the USMC presently in Fallujah that what they're doing isn't a major combat operation.

    Because it looks like one to me.
    --
    Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.