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A New Elena Story
SwiftBoy writes "Elena, of motorcycling through Chernobyl fame has gone riding again, this time to dig up the history of Kiev's fortifications. Interesting that after 60 years all that stuff is still there."
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about whom there was much doubt as to the veracity of her story?
Here is one of a good number of debunkings. Naughty, Naughty!
Hot chick riding a motorcycle around in a post-apocalyptic wasteland!
Now thats some porn I would like to get addicted to.
let's all just admit it. this article is only here because 90% of readers love pretty european women.
war schmore.
System.out.println(syynnapse.getSig());
Previousely discussed back in March/2004
Hulk SMASH Celiac Disease
There's a 4MB panoramic image on the debunking site mentioned in the parent post: http://www.web-axis.net/~pulse/chernobyl/prypyat-p anoramic.jpg
That's one hell of a case of deja vu for those of us who just spent all day immersed in Half-Life 2.
What's really amazing is that Elena, after motorcycling through Chernobyl, is still there."
Looking for a job?
Want your resume written professionally?
DON'T USE TUNAREZ!!!
Shame that can't be done automatically for all postings...
Now watch - someone else will probably have posted this link at the same time...
Coral Link
We just did to the server what the Chyrnobol reactor did to that Russian town.
Table-ized A.I.
there is some info here http://www.gsc-game.com/index.php?t=community&s=fo rums&s_game_type=xr&sec_id=6
was the first to say "she was not allowed to be there, so she wasn't there...".
Elena goes to visit Junis in Afghanistan to photograph the Commodore-64s running Linux.
Actually there really is stuff just lying around all over the place in Europe (probably depending on exactly where you are). I know my old landlord in Germany had a museum quality collection (I say this because he loaned it to a museum in Speyer on a couple occasions) of pre-historic artifacts and fossils sitting in the garage. This was all stuff he collected while cutting wood up in the forest. The house I lived in was over 200 years old. He also had a collection of late 19th century farming equipment and a bunch of world war one artifacts which were actually passed down through his family.
You can still find bullets, shell fragments, peices of old weapons, helmets, and various other things on the ground up around the Maginot Line and also in the countryside around Bastogne (where the Battle of the Bulge took place). Other areas, like Normandy, are more "cleaned up" but still show rather evident signs of historical events of note. Hard to take two steps without bumping your head on something historically relevant.
Of course that's without even mentioning all of the other "important" historical periods that took place around Europe. With so much history to so little square footage, it's no surprise you can hop on a motorcycle and find cool stuff all over the place.
I imagine the same amount of history is lying about the americas as well. It's just that there's far more surface area to human history that took place here. So the stuff is all piled up on itself.
BTW, my eagle project was a food and clothing drive for people living in Belarus (current country where Cherbnobyl is located). They still can't drink milk or eat meat from cows in the area or eat certain foods grown in the soil close to the accident. But people do still live there. I remember having passive radiation detectors in our classrooms in the late 80s... Although that might have been more a product of the cold war, since the military base I lived near was actually a short range nuclear(that's an assumption) missle site(this isn't).
Who cares if she faked it? Who ever really cares if a hot woman fakes it?
So therefore I will attract her with my castle in the swamp and save you poor sods the heartache.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
There really are tours of the area, and she evidently went on a tour, so the pictures are real. What's fake are her claims that she rides her motorcycle alone in the radioactive zone.
HOWEVER, once I found out it was faked, I was extremely upset. The original impact of the story was immediately gone, and I felt like I was cheated out of those emotions of awe and wonder. There's no way I'm going to go out on a limb again and trust anything that woman says.
There was a story here previously about the journalistic quality of blogs on the Internet and how they couldn't touch real journalism. I now understand what that's all about. IMHO, /. shouldn't be giving any credence to Elena after her previous scam was unearthed.
Condemnant quod non intellegunt.
She has no credibility, I really don't understand why people continue to encourage her lack of character by giving her this kind of attention.
The highlight of the story for me is the fine example of eastern European cycling prowess ("scooturo") or as she calls it, a "son of a ditch".
Of course, I would love one!
ScooturoRapidly approaching the Zener knee...
About Makhno army:
"The anarchists on the photo, they kept in terror all this region" (Makhno in the center) It was other way around. Makhno anarhist army was composed of local peasants and small core of anarchists. Makhno was hugely pouplar among the locals, mostly because he defended them again devastating communists "food tax". Later soviet propaganda tried to make a common bandit out of Mahno, but havn't succeded much.
Interesting that after 60 years all that stuff is still there
It's that way in Germany, too. I know that in Hamburg, some of the major bomb shelters were so incredibly massive that they simply never tore them down. They put nightclubs in there now. You can see them pretty easily, they're these huge masses of concrete... one of the most touching things, besides the bombed-out cathedrals left unrestored, and the occasional Kennedyplatze or Eisenhowerstrasse you run into...
We don't really have a parallel here. This is one of the reasons that I believe that when Americans and Europeans think about war, they actually conceptualize very different things.
dude this is old news; she already had pictures of kiev ww2 battle ruins the last time /. posted about the woman.
riding through Chernobyl on a motorcycle would be inherently risky, dangerous, unlawful and maybe even lethal.
Are you refering to dangers from radiological contamination? The danger is real, but it's not as bad as you may think. The other reactors at the site were kept operating after the accident. It was not until December 2000 that the last was shut down.
This means that over six thousand people worked right next to the containment building, and traveled to and from the site almost every day for several years after the accident.
A few rides through town on a motorcycle would expose you to a accumulated dose many thousands of times less than what a lot of other people have voluntarily chosen to live with.
I'd guess that it would be riskier to ride a motorcycle through downtown LA than through the town section of Chernobyl. (If it were allowed to ride through Chernobyl.)
Ozymandias
I met a traveler from an antique land
Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read,
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them, and the heart that fed,
And on the pedestal these words appear:
"My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings:
Look upon my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.
-Percy Bysshe Shelley
1792-1822
Fuck that "Running to Canada" shit. How about standing up to usurpers like Dubya in order to make life better for the people who live here? That means sticking your neck out for your principles, even if your countrymen hate you for it. They may not thank you for opposing them, but their children might.
"OH SHIT, THERE'S A HORSE IN THE HOSPITAL!"
It seems that the only thing the opponents of Bush are good at are yelling and marching in parades. They'll be just as effective in Canada.
Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
Ahh, here they come. I call your bluff, my faceless brown-shirted antagonist (now there's a redundancy.) I'd email you my name and address so that you could come visit, but like most of your ilk, you snipe from under cover of anonymity, or attack en masse and never linger to claim responsibility. You construct straw men like "Euro-lefties" for your rhetorical bayonet practice, never entertaining the thought that the object of your hatred isn't a socialist or even a liberal, that he has principled reasons for opposing war and tyranny, and that he loves his country and his people enough to tell them to pull their heads out of their asses when criminals are robbing them and leading them into the abyss. Quit following the herd, man. All of you ultranationalists are being used by "leaders" who despise you as much as the peons (their term) like myself who see through the ruse that war is; pickpockets always need a distraction. And as for "packing my shit up?" I'd rather die. What a pity it is you're so keen on seeing that happen.
Here. Look this up. Now go look in a mirror.
"OH SHIT, THERE'S A HORSE IN THE HOSPITAL!"
you should see this. I want to visit this place :)
I don't really care about the Chernobyl issue. Serpent's Wall was far more educational and entertaining, particularly "Elena's" sardonic sense of humour. Probably more honest also. Bring back fertility festivals!!
insecurity asks the wrong question irritation gives the wrong answer
For anyone who missed something (ie me) can someone explain basically whats fake and whats real? I mean, Chernobyl is real, no-one is disputing that, the pictures of empty buildings and landscapes are real (unless they are empty buildings somewhere else). The big Lenin slogans on walls are real? the checkpoints? which bits were faked? If she didnt ride there alone on a bike then who and how did she get there? anyone?
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
Yo. Link with this instead.
[CORAL-LINK]/serpents-wall/
Perfect time for CORAL
How about standing up to usurpers like Dubya in order to make life better for the people who live here?
Sounds like cheap entertainment to me. Please don't break anything important on your adventures.
"What's the frequency Kenneth?"
I see you've found your windmill to tilt at, dude.
Don't be such a bloviated turd.
"What's the frequency Kenneth?"
Perhaps a poster child for my moral decline as I wouldn't kick her out of bed.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Elsewhere downtown is mostly newer houses dotted with small clusters of stuff looking like 1880-1930. That's the hard hit places. I've also walked the wooded hills around Kaiserslautern where you'll often find those little round waterholes size ~4m. (10-15 ft). That's bomb craters - according to an old guy who lived there "they're bigger when new". Kinda tells something about why the idea of war is so repulsive to the average german.
Any sufficiently advanced libertarian utopia is indistinguishable from government.
"Why do women fake their orgasms?"
"Because they think that men care."
Which is kind of harsh if you think about it.
There are no credible debunkings of this story. All debunkings are potentially just as filled with garbage as the original Elena writings are.
In any case, she is one hot chick that I would love to go on a motorcycle ride with.
"Champagne for my real friends - and real pain for my sham friends!" http://ericblade.postalboard.com/
I hear the extra eye she sprouted really helps her frame the photos.
--- Ban humanity.
PS, Stalin et al were *Russians*.
Actually, Mr. Vissarionovich was a Georgian.
Communism did not invade and conquer Russia.
Invasion? That would actually not be a totally inaccurate description.
Most of the prominent bolshevik/communist leaders were plotting their military coup d'état (a.k.a. "revolution") while they lived abroad. They also received funding, training and support from Germany, who believed that the success of these people would weaken Russia.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
http://www.kiddofspeed.com/serpents-wall/_images/p 8-image1.jpg !!! (on page7)
WE DON'T NEED NO BLOG CONTROL.
Activists do a lot more than that about which you can read on e.g. an action mag or on an online website.
WE DON'T NEED NO BLOG CONTROL.
There seems to be a lot of anti-Elena sentiment here, mostly due to the fact that she didn't really take those pictures on a motorcycle.
Who cares? I sure don't.
Her stories, fact or fiction, are a great read, and provide a wonderful thread connecting the photographs. The photographs themselves (which certainly are real) are a great record of the past that tell a story on their own.
If someone posted a "space log" with lots of beautiful pictures of the planets, and linked the pictures together using a story about flying in a spaceship from one to the next, no-one would think the story was real, but many would still enjoy it. Elena's made-up story just happend to be a lot more down-to-earth and believable.
She mentioned at one time that she was planning on turning the Chernobyl story into a chapter of a book she was working on (I can only presume that the Serpent Wall story will be another chapter). If such a thing comes about, you can bet I'm buying it! Why pass up such a great collection of photographs and enjoyable stories?
Elana,
Thank you for another good story from your homeland. These are things that Americans (like me) never really get to see. When we read one of your stories, it humanizes you and your people far more than any history book could.
I've read your stories, and am impressed - I hope you keep up your work and that the skeptics don't stop you. In your own way, you have done more to help relations between your people and the rest of the world than your government has. After reading your stories, I feel like I know a bit more about you and your people than I ever have before. It is now easier to understand some of the things about you and your people than before - because I can see some of your roots.
As a student I studied these wars, but they were abstract. Now they are real. The numbers still astound me, probably even more now.
Thank you,
I
wasn't! It was great and it was the best history I've seen in a long time. I just now went through two-thirds of the serpent's wall blog (it is slow going---each page takes several minutes to load) and decided to check in at slashdot to see how others viewed it.
Nice. There is almost no praise for this really moving document. I don't think it's as good as the Chernobyl one, although that is partly because I was alive during Chernobyl, but not during the event this describes, but it really gives me a sense of Ukraine and I know that for many people Kiev is the center of Europe and Asia and it's worth my time to see this perspective on it.
Plus, I can't help but compare it to Iraq and the 51 casualties we suffered vs. 1000 of the enemy in Fallujah. It's moving to see the many identifying artifacts of the Germans vs. the lack of identity of the Soviets.
The winner of war writes history, but don't assume the 'good' side did everything Godly, Noble or whatever. They made their mistakes. They had their own
When the victor is the aggressor in a war of conquest that is often true, however in the Second World War context that argument is a load of crap. Primarily because the people who surrendered to the western Allies were not subjugated. West Germany and Japan were quite free to write their own histories, to continue their cultures, to continue their langauges, etc. Hell, the losers are free to claim they were right and being lied about, no shortage of Holocost denial propoganda as far as I can tell. Despite the fact that you probably abhor those idiots and probably do not share their "politics" your moral relevancy nonsense is not too removed from their way of thinking. You merely dress it up better. There was right and wrong in WW2, there was good and evil, this was the historical anomaly. The attrocities committed by US personnel were individual criminal acts, not highly organized state sponsored crimes receiving large scale support from the citizenry as in Germany's case.
And I have photos too -- can I get to frontpage now?
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
The area isn't totally deserted, nor is it that hazardous for short vists with suitable precautions. Some old residents moved back into the area. Two of the Chernoybl power reactors were operated until 2000. Hundreds of cleanup workers still go in and out. A few vehicles are driven in the area.
So it's not that tightly closed an area.
It's not clear exactly how far Elena was able to take her bike. From the pictures, you see her bike in pictures up to the Dytyatky checkpoint, but not thereafter. Her pictures within the exclusion zone are very similar to those taken by others who've taken that tour. She appears in some of those pictures. So the most likely thing is that she rode her bike to the checkpoint and took the tour bus into Chernoybl.
Yes such as for example """terrorism""", the buzzword of the 21st century.
WE DON'T NEED NO BLOG CONTROL.
Haha. Maybe the electric street lighting is another clue? Maybe the COLOR postcard?
That's not a photograph from 1240. It's recent photograph (obviously) of a recent postcard (also obvious) that shows something similar to what the Mongols saw when they got there.
Also, the "family" photograph states clearly that the family was killed in 1240 during the siege, and that the photograph shows the remains that were dug up much later, like when photography existed.
Excellent article, very interesting. This girl certainly has an interest in anthropology, history, and alcohol!
Actually he's not Mr. Vissarionovich. He's Mr. Djugashvili... Vissarionovich is his middle name and only indicates his father's name was Vissarion..
No one in exUSSR uses just a middle name to name men. It'd be Joseph (Iosif) Vissarionovich.
- Arwen, I'm your father, Agent Smith.
- Well, you're just Smith, but my father is Aerosmith!
...this days people forget their history, ask anyone in downtown where is bunkers, they don't have no idea what is bunkers. They can only show pubs and I can show both bunkers and pubs
(and she knows how to cook, too)
I doubt that we will ever figure out - and I suspect that even if we did figure out we couldn't do much about it
Oops. Yes, of course there's not supposed to be a "Mr" (gospodin) in front of a middle name.
But referring to people with their middle name, at least in colloquial/familiar speech, is very common, isn't it?
(Better keep this OT stuff free from extra karma bonus)
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
It was pretty common in ex-USSR among some closed group of friend or colleagues, as you noted... It's more playful/respectful than official. And is usually used as an alias.
In modern russia it's very uncommon actually.
- Arwen, I'm your father, Agent Smith.
- Well, you're just Smith, but my father is Aerosmith!
Sorry, but this is absolute bullshit.
First of all, Chernobyl is not in Russia. The name of the country is Ukraine. If you don't know it, probably you are american.
I think you read too much yellow papers.
Look, there are more factual errors in your post, then in the previous, that you are trying to correct.
I believe Poland never has 25 000 people as their intellectual elite. Soviets killed a few thousands of polish soldiers there. That is - captured soldiers, not scientists. If Poland would have so much intellectual elite, they wouldn't loose a war within 2 weeks.
If you had RTFA, you would have noticed that most pics are fake or taken from the web / museums, postcards to make the trip seem "cooler". just like the last time.
That is considered compulsive lying IMHO.
HI O WISE PRINCE. WHT TOOK U SO DAM LONG?
Canada here I come for many reasons!