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Apple Offers Mac OS X 10.3.7 Update

Posted by pudge on from the get-it-while-it's-hot dept.

An anonymous reader writes "MacNN reports: 'Apple has released Mac OS X 10.3.7 via the Software Update utility. Key enhancements include improved AFP support for saving documents with long file names, improved OpenGL technology and updated ATI and NVIDIA graphics drivers, improved FireWire device compatibility, updated Preview application, and improved compatibility for third party applications. The 10.3.7 update is recommended for all users of Mac OS X 10.3 'Panther.' It also includes all previous standalone security updates.'"

75 of 457 comments (clear)

  1. Dear 10.3.7 by Letter · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Dear 10.3.7,

    Holy sh..

    I just upgraded and I got a 2.2 times OpenGL speedup.

    Wow, Letter

    1. Re:Dear 10.3.7 by The+Illegal+Pirates · · Score: 5, Funny
      Dear Sir or Madam:

      We, the Illegal Pirates of the Internet Who Must Steal Everything No Matter What, already have a cabal of Freedom Hating Illegal Filetraders feverishly working on a cracked version of 10.3.7 which we will release publically for free. Apple's lack of copy protection and free distribution via Software Update has seriously impeded our efforts to violate the DMCA and cost people money, but even these extreme measures will prove insufficient to stem internet piracy of copyrighted software.

      Signed,

      The Illegal Pirates of the Internet Who Must Steal Everything No Matter What

  2. PearPC by IO+ERROR · · Score: 4, Funny

    Oh no, this is going to take forever for PearPC to install.

    --
    How am I supposed to fit a pithy, relevant quote into 120 characters?
    1. Re:PearPC by c0p0n · · Score: 2, Funny

      It took me 8 hours to get just 1 of the 4 OSX discs installed on my PC....

      But it does because you do it the wrong way. You can start PearPC on a Win2k VMware virtual machine, so you can pause the execution at any time...

      --

      Your head a splode
    2. Re:PearPC by spacefrog · · Score: 4, Funny

      Install worked great on CherryOS, even on this ancient dual P3 box.

      Oh wait, that was a dream, never mind.

    3. Re:PearPC by Tom+Davies · · Score: 2, Informative

      Buy a 2nd hand G3 imac on ebay.

      You'll get decent performance for not much money.

      --
      I have discovered a wonderful .sig, but 120 characters is too small to contain it.
  3. All the right fixes? by dave1212 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Here's hoping it will fix the MIDI issues that occurred with Reason and 10.3.6. It's getting very frustrating to have to troubleshoot this stuff all the time with the Audio MIDI Setup Utility.

    Any word on if Safari has been updated to support type-ahead-find yet? I won't be updating until I hear some Reason users speak up, and this is a sweet feature that should be in Safari by now.

    1. Re:All the right fixes? by purplemonkeydan · · Score: 2, Informative

      Install Saft for type ahead find and other nifty stuff.

  4. And, oh yeah, don't forget... by metrazol · · Score: 4, Funny

    World of Warcraft. One game is the focus of most of the updates to graphics drivers. Shocking, eh? Makes you wonder, who wanted the patches more? Blizzard, the user base, or Apples lab full of level 40 somethin' developers?

    --
    "Life's funny sometimes." "And sometimes it isn't." --Cat's Cradle
  5. Good news for iBook, Powerbook owners by amichalo · · Score: 5, Informative

    According to this note, the ATI and NVIDIA updates in 10.3.7 are good news for laptop owners because they reduce power consumption, thus improving battery life.

    --
    I only came here to do two things; kick some ass, and drink some beer...looks like we're almost out of beer.
    1. Re:Good news for iBook, Powerbook owners by Rude+Turnip · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Before installing 10.3.7, I had 43 minutes of juice on my iBook G4 800...after installing 10.3.7, I've got 1 hour and 3 minutes! Can't wait to see what it's like when I'm fully charged up again. I was already getting 5.5-6 hours on a full charge.

      --
      Bill Clinton: Pimp we can believe in. - The Shirt!!!
  6. Better not install it yet by lakeland · · Score: 5, Funny

    After all, we've all heard the horror stories about windows users who installed the windows update only to have lots of software break.

    Surely apple will be similar? ;-)

    1. Re:Better not install it yet by Moofie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Something about Apple, like their almost bulletproof list of successfull OS upgrades?

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    2. Re:Better not install it yet by nordicfrost · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Things can go south with Apple as well. As I mentioned in this topic, I got a /etc/ttys file overwritten after the latest security uodate, and the system just hung on reboot at the "starting logon window" notice.

      Now, as the shit had hit the fan, I was without computer as I oly have the Apple Powerbook. I tried everything I knew, but to no avail. If I had access to another computer, I'd known that the file was overwritten by mistake and restorable from the ttys.applesaved file. Also, the system would start up in single user mode to correct this problem. But I didn't know.

      Anyhoo, I decided to do a Archive and Install type from the 10.3 DVD that was included with the PB. I was prepared to spend the rest of the evening restoring settings and loading programs, but, I was stumped after the install. Everything was at its right place, spare for the wallpaper. Even the document I saved just before rebooting was on the desktop. Every setting, everything was as I remembered it, but the whole system was brand new 10.3 from 10.3.6. Incredible, but a part of the *nix goodness of keeping settings apart from the system on a user base.

      There were two minor SNAFUs with the rollback, I could not start System Preferences from the Apple menu and I had to reinstall Salling Clicker (But it even understood that I had bought and registered the program after install). A quick lookup in the Apple Discussion boards adviced me to chick the old saved system in the thrash and empty it, I did and the System Prefrences menu worked.

      This was something quite different from the time when I had to reinstall Windows 2k to restore the system from some b0rkness...

      MacOS amazes me, but not as much as peoples resistance to it amazes me.

    3. Re:Better not install it yet by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      SP2 has caused more havoc with more people's networking than, I suspect, any other OS release ever put out by any company. I know too many people, personally, who have been fUx0r3d by it to believe the "a few specialized apps" line.

      As for 10.3, see what I said to another poster in the thread.

      I'm sure I'll get modded down for this ...

      I've always believed that anyone who qualifies their statements with that line deserves to be modded into oblivion, just on principle. If you've got something to say that you believe will be unpopular, just say it -- don't try to impress us with how tough and brave you are putting your karma on the line. Or whatever.

      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
    4. Re:Better not install it yet by ender81b · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yeah SP2's failure rate - where by failure rate I mean turn computer into an unusable state requiring a fresh reinstall - seems to be about 1%. As for breaking specific applications I would say around 5% of people have problems. This is all based on experience working tech desk at an ISP and being a computer tech for the univeristy library.

      Of course, it could be worse. I love SP2 for the fact that as soon as somebody installs it I can immediately shut off Norton "Internet Security" also known as Norton never works right, Norton constantly breaks itself on updates, Norton randomly decides to block port 80 and 25, and - oh by the way - Norton doesn't offer tech support so have fun supporting our product ISPs!

      Not that I hate Norton or anything ;) but, seriously, I wish that company would get sucked into an enormous black hole and never ever ever return.

    5. Re:Better not install it yet by ChuckleBug · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I've always believed that anyone who qualifies their statements with that line deserves to be modded into oblivion, just on principle. If you've got something to say that you believe will be unpopular, just say it -- don't try to impress us with how tough and brave you are putting your karma on the line. Or whatever.

      AMEN! I can't stand that kind of preemptive whining. It's obnoxious. Only in extremely rare and egregious cases is complaining about being modded a reasonable thing to do.

    6. Re:Better not install it yet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      I'll be modded to oblivion for this, but I agree.

    7. Re:Better not install it yet by Moofie · · Score: 2

      Perhaps your Windows programmers are more experienced with their platform than your Mac developers? Just a guess, mind you...

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    8. Re:Better not install it yet by Farmbubba · · Score: 3, Informative

      1% failure rate is impressive. I've had 4 machines that I was hoping SP2 would "fix" and didn't help at all. And several machines that were broken after SP2. In the old days a good rule of thumb was that windows 98 would self destruct after a few years. Now a good rule of thumb is Win XP will self destruct with the first teenager that browses the internet with it.

    9. Re:Better not install it yet by ChuckleBug · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I can't speak for everyone else but I can tell you why I resist Macs: it's because of people like you. Frankly, I find your amazement at MacOS and blind belief in Apple frightening.

      Choosing not to use a type of computer because you don't like the attitude of some of its users is pretty stupid.

    10. Re:Better not install it yet by nbvb · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Right, they issued a bad point release, so that makes the OS a non-datacenter-OS?

      Go back under your rock.

      I guess you've never seen a Sun BADPATCH.

      Or a withdrawn patch under HP-UX.

      Or even a bad patch with OpenVMS.

      Grow up. Get a clue. Bugs happen. The magic is in what the vendors *do* about it.

    11. Re:Better not install it yet by nordicfrost · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But here's the point: it didn't shaft my computer. Everything was working right after the error was corrected, it was like the error never occurred. I have never claimed that the Mac OS is perfect. It has error and the developers screw up from time to time. But when the error has occurred, it is usually very, very easy to fix and widely discussed by Apple fans raving over 30 minutes downtime on their laptop.

      For the record, here's what I believe about Apple: they are a corporation. They have shareholders and need to cater to their shareholders like every other share-based company. However, they seem to put more work into their product than similar companies. Their computers look nice. Their computers are sturdy. Their OS is nice to use. They contribute to the Open Source community. And most important; currently they are an underdog that has to fight to convince people about their products. This makes for better products.

      I hated Macs in the mid 90ies. I thought that they were buggy, childish and a pain to use. Then Jobs came along and introduced the iMac. I liked the ideas about all-USB and no disk drive, thinking "it's about time". But the OS still sucked. Big time. Then came OS X, especially in its second incarnation. Holy hell. The power of *nix AND a desktop you can look at without thinking "Relax" by Frankie Goes to Hollywood is the current #1 hit? And it plays better with Windows computers than they play among themselves?

      I was convinced and dropped Linux for Mac. I am now a Mac fan, since I have so many good experiences with the Mac, Mac OS and Apple. They are very professional and that is a big issue with me. I hate having to call Dell three or four times to solve an issue that is clearly under warranty. I hate it when a computer is not ready to be used by me, its owner at any time. I hate downtime and issues. With Apple, I have had excellent customer experience, it is a robust system that has proven a catastrophic failure is easy to recover from. So easy in fact that it required three user actions (Insert disc, press command - C during start up, choose 'Archive and install') to recover and have the user settings intact, the computer settings intact, the registration on bought programs intact, everything as it should be. I did computer support for Windows around 2001, and I felt it was something wrong with the system when the callers had to wipe their harddrives to reinstall from OEM discs. This was not the way a computer should work. With the Mac I feel that it is a tool for me to use, like a hammer. Not a veteran car that needs constant attention and tuning just to fulfill its primary obejctive.

      But, above all, I do not believe that Apple is perfect in any way. They ar just currently the best alternative by far.

  7. so far so good... by bennomatic · · Score: 3, Informative

    installed a couple of hours ago, and everything's working great

    --
    The CB App. What's your 20?
    1. Re:so far so good... by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 4, Funny

      Bennomatic just rung me to tell you all the rest of his message:

      so far, I'm just going to test the finder."

      For some reason he was cut off whilst sending it, and can't get back onto his desktop.
      If anyone could get an engineer sent to his house he would greatly appreciate it.

      [/only_joking]

      --
      liqbase :: faster than paper
  8. Few things I'm wondering about... by zwilliams07 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Such as this issue with 10.3.6 having Firewire problems and DVD Player issues has been fixed or not. I'm going to wait a while and see what comes up at MacFixit.com and then decide if I want to upgrade.

  9. Calculator by Raven42rac · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Calculator is still being goofy. It won't draw the calculator itself if you have speak button pressed enabled, you have to disable it, then restart calculator for it to work. This is just my experience. YMMV.

    --
    I hate sigs.
  10. Not to insult the hordes of Mac users.... by dteichman · · Score: 2, Interesting

    but doesn't that sound a bit like the press release they issued for the launch of the last update. Not to bag on them too much. 10.3.7 is good software. I've used the dev edition for a little while now (thanks to a good friend). It runs much faster than the previous version I had (original Panther). The speed increase of Open GL is extremely noticeable. Other than that, I haven't noticed much else.

  11. Also a patch for server by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=300 376

    And I must say, it was painful beta on this one

  12. Installed... by nordicfrost · · Score: 4, Informative

    ...works like a charm. Last tim I installed an update, the whole system got b0rked due to an error in writing to /etc/ttys The file got a byte sum of zero, and the logon window hanged upon next reboot.

    No such thing this time, and I think. I feel. I believe that the system is a bit, just a tiny bit snappier in writing to the screen. I'm on a newish Powerbook.

  13. woohoo by famouswhendead · · Score: 4, Funny

    Now I don't need to format my external drives myself.

  14. I use Panther and... by mwielgosz · · Score: 5, Interesting
    this update (10.3.7) seems to have made my old iMac G3 respond faster than before. It seems to draw just a bit faster as well, making my experience with OSX much better. Before 10.3, OSX was extremely laggy on my 400mhz (G3) 128mb ram hardware.

    With performance increases like this, OSX seems to just be getting better - good work Apple.

    --
    -Mike
    1. Re:I use Panther and... by ravenspear · · Score: 3, Funny

      I believe the technical term for OS X updates is "snappier."

    2. Re:I use Panther and... by Steve+Cowan · · Score: 4, Funny

      I agree. Since I installed 10.3.7, my mouse now has a second button!

  15. Disconnet Firewire Harddrives by SteveM · · Score: 4, Informative

    Apple's release notes say to disconnect firewire drives prior to installing.

    From the notes:

    If you have a third-party FireWire hard drive connected, turn it off and disconnect it before installing this update. Reconnect it and turn it back on after installation is complete and you've restarted.

    SteveM

    1. Re:Disconnet Firewire Harddrives by weston · · Score: 3, Funny

      If you have a third-party FireWire hard drive connected, turn it off and disconnect it before installing this update.

      You should see what the release notes *used* to say:

      "If you have a third-party FireWire hard drive connected, turn it off and disconnect it before installing this update. In fact, put it in a seperate, EM shielded room. Actually, now that we think of it, please also back it up. Twice."

      --
      Tweet, tweet.
  16. Re:Wonder if this'll help World of Warcraft by Nermal6693 · · Score: 4, Informative

    According to Blizzard, the 10.3.7 update helps, but a forthcoming WoW patch will make it run even better.

  17. DP 2.5 G5 6800 Nvidia and UT 2004 by thedogcow · · Score: 4, Informative

    I just updated to 10.3.7. I did run Cinebench but I don't think that is an accurate method of bench testing.

    I ran UT 2004 on my DP 2.5 G5 w/ 6800 Nvidia. WOW. Its like playing on "slomo 2" without using the cheat. Much faster. FPS averaging around 110 with everthing turned on to max.

    --
    Yes! I listen to NYC Speedcore and do math at 3AM. I suggest you try it too.
  18. Re:hypehypehype by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The ones from Apple tend to be minor bug fixes and even improvements in the way things work.

    The ones from MS tend to be way overdue security fixes that arrive late, are quite monolithic, break shit and generally a hassle to clean up after. Hmmm, sounds like "Steve Ballmer, party guest from hell".

    Halleluiah.

  19. update "magic" by SuperBanana · · Score: 2, Insightful
    ...works like a charm. Last tim I installed an update, the whole system got b0rked due to an error in writing to /etc/ttys The file got a byte sum of zero, and the logon window hanged upon next reboot.

    I love it when people are surprised when an update works.

    The whole system "got b0rked" probably because you a)didn't check the disk b)had disk errors c)didn't have journaling turned on.

    I support 100+ macintoshes, and when I check the system disk first (using Diskwarrior off an external drive) and repair permissions, I have yet to have anything more dramatic than the installer not complete the install requiring a second application before rebooting the system. That happened...get ready...ONCE. We have everything from Clamshell iBooks to G3's to Dualie G5s; you name it, we've got it.

    Diskwarrior is excellent insurance, and one can make a boot CD/DVD or use an iPod for booting. Wait about one day to see if there's any major problems with the update or it gets pulled. Run the checks before any update, and boom, you're good.

    --
    Please help metamoderate.
  20. Re:Graphic drivers? by hunterx11 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Because Mac OS X uses I/O Kit.

    --
    English is easier said than done.
  21. Network Browsing by Khuffie · · Score: 4, Insightful
    What really pisses me off is network browsing. In the original Panther release they fixed this: you could click on the Networks tab, see the computer on the network you want to access, and immediately see the folders on there.

    Then they go and for some reason disable that (it was the number 1 most useful 'upgrade' in Panther), to what was there before: you'd see the computer on the network, and you'd have to mount any folder you want to access...it's really annoying. They have that in the Tiger beta...hope they keep it.

  22. Re:Graphic drivers? by phatmatt · · Score: 3, Informative

    OS X has its own style of drivers, completely different than any other operating system. It uses c++ to code their IOKit drivers, which make it easy to program, but not portable at all.

  23. Re:Extra extra(?) by Myuu · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I am sorry if I come off as harsh but I am sick of seeing these comments and am probably going to copy this reply to every one of these.

    Slashdot is such a damn immense community that it has to appeal to everyone. As a Mac owner, this ia big news to me and the comments are helpful. However, I really couldn't give less of a crap about a new kernel update, FreeBSD, a crappy MMPORG release, RMS bitching about something, or a new rc for slack or moz. Yes I use firefox and am a religious debian user, but I really don't care. So you know what I do? I scroll down, I don't go into the thread and post a 'wtf' type comment.

    Its been a couple months since the last point update and the security updates don't make the front page, so yes, I do think it is FP worthy.

    --

    forget it.
  24. Re:Extra extra(?) by Colgate2003 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It IS, however, free like 10.3.1-6 were...

  25. Re:Screen Spanning Doctor by xen0side · · Score: 3, Informative

    I have screen spanning doctor running on 10.3.7 and it works fine.

  26. Install script is still stupidly written by ldesegur · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I started the installation and went to do some shopping (xmas) to come back and have a dialog on the screen asking me to quit iCal before it could get updated. D'oh! That was prior to installing and "optimizing" (wtf?) the big update. I know that it's ok because I didn't have to restart everything but... Would have it be nice if the installer had asked me AHEAD prior to download to quit iCal instead of waiting the middle of the installation? Doing installs of Quicktime brings up the same stupid dialog (update to pro.) Why does Apple assume that users keep their eyes on the screen during install at all time? A better way would be to answer all questions for every single update upfront then go with the install.

    1. Re:Install script is still stupidly written by the_2nd_coming · · Score: 2, Interesting

      optimizing defragments the large chunks of data on the disk.

      --



      I am the Alpha and the Omega-3
    2. Re:Install script is still stupidly written by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Before you run softwareupdate from the CLI, run this:

      $ export COMMAND_LINE_INSTALL=1

      The Quicktime dialogue box will be blocked.

  27. Re:um, how about SMB browsing fix? by Trillan · · Score: 2, Informative

    This sounds promising:

    • Resolves an issue that prevented printing to some Windows-based print servers.
  28. Quicker by ickoonite · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Whilst I, like others, question the need for this to be the stuff of the front page, I am grateful for the notification and can now report back post-install.

    I can't quite put my finger on it, but I'm pretty sure I can detect a speed increase, definitely for UI responsiveness - I've got an 800 MHz iBook G3 and a 400 Mhz iMac G3 here, and both seem to have gained a certain je ne sais quoi from the update, the iMac especially.

    Thank you once again, Apple, for a free speedup to my ageing iMac. It is much appreciated!

    iqu :)

    (Seriously, it is commendable, the work that seems to go into these releases. Each point release is bringing genuine improvements, such that it is quite a shock to go back to a mint 10.3 install or suchlike. This is an area where Apple really excels - making even relative relics like my iMac more usable with every new update.)

  29. How good is OS X, really? by freelance+cynic · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This isn't flamebait, but an honest question.

    I'm thinking of buying an 12" iBook or PowerBook to replace my old computer. Now, there are a few things that bother me physically about them (they're big and heavy (twice as much as my Lifebook P2040), the battery life isn't really good and there's a blasted trackpad instead of a trackpoint)...

    BUT! I could overlook all that, because I'd really like a computer that Just Works(TM). I love tweaking things in Linux (I run gentoo to give you an idea), but my life is catching up to me now and I find I don't have the time I used to to play with my computer (without doing anything "productive" done).

    Now, I'm asking Apple fans (and detractors too) here: is OS X really *that* great, as I heard? Does it really Just Works(TM)? I'm asking because I've nearly went and bought my new Apple laptop, but then discovered that iTunes doesn't play .ogg files (not without tweaking anyhow). That Appleworks doesn't cut it for me (I need feature that aren't available with it) and since I'm not about to pay a kazillion $ to MS to use Office, I'll have to install OpenOffice. And I could go on... So I'm getting stuff like an .ogg player, OpenOffice, Firefox, etc... which I could all get on Linux (or even Windows). So, tell me, what's so great about OS X? There must be something I'm missing... I'm *this* close to buying an Apple notebook because everyone saying they're great, but I have this nagging doubt that it's not all it's claimed to be.

    Right, wrong? I'd really appreciate your thoughts on this one...

    1. Re:How good is OS X, really? by BandwidthHog · · Score: 2, Informative

      Any of us Mac geeks here could go on for hours responding to your post (and undoubtedly somebody's writing up a 6,000 word post as I type this), but I'll answer it this way:

      I'm an old school Mac user (print shop graphics since '88) and when OS X hit the scene, I was really looking forward to living my life at the command line, becoming an über hacker, since all my years of troubleshooting skills would need to be relearned. Only problem is, there's nothing to do.

      Sure, in the early days (10.0.4) I was using unsupported machines (603 and 604e clones with G3 upgrades) so some trickery (thank you, Ryan Rempel!) was required to get it to install. But once installed (and I've since moved to a G4 tower), there's just nothing to do. It really is true: everything Just Works(TM), which in my case, has been something of a disappointment.

      I've seen one kernel panic in the past two years, and that happened at the end of the install process for one of the 10.3 point upgrades. The machine booted fine after that, so I don't even really count it. I spend at least as much time using XP at work as I do using this thing at home, and even though my well specced office PC has ~5 times the clock speed, my Mac is *much* harder to bog down or destabilize.

      Also, OpenOffice has been surprisingly good since I started using it recently. In addition to that, I recommend two additional apps for a new Mac user: A $25 app called Little Snitch for more fine grained control over IPFW, and a freeware app called Desktop Manager that gives you a totally freaking awesome virtual desktop implementation with mind bending eye candy.

      In a way, it was actually easier ten years ago to convince people... all you had to do was point out that Macs cost four times as much, but we still bought 'em. Now that they're comparably priced, that argument doesn't work anymore. Ain't that a bitch? Well, no. Otherwise I'd still be using my old dual 604e tower.

      --

      Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
    2. Re:How good is OS X, really? by SSpade · · Score: 4, Informative

      OS X just works. (Almost - I've seen occasional issues with the CUPS subsystem in older releases that needed either a reboot or a manual daemon restart to fix. But almost.)

      Ease of connecting wifi is one example. To get this powerbook to connect to a netgear AP with WPA was trivial. It just worked. Trying the same connection from an XP laptop was a nightmare of driver upgrades and obscure hex strings.

      The GUI isn't perfect, but it's better than Windows, KDE or Gnome, IMO. (Even if you prefer KDE or Gnome you'll probably still consider the GUI quite workable).

      And it's a BSD box under the covers, with a decent X server, and lots of (good) development software bundled with the system.

      The downside is that while the software that's available tends to be really good there isn't quite the vast range of software you'll see under windows (particularly games).

      I've had two major hardware failures on my powerbook (both fairly normal laptoppy failures - HD started getting flaky and the smart charge circuit in the battery went bad). My laptop gets around 12x7 usage, so no big surprise. Under the AppleCare contract, though, they fixed 'em both (HD was out to be repaired for 4 or 5 days, battery was a no questions swap in the store). That's about the same failure rate I've seen with Dell and Sony laptops - but trying to get Dell or Sony to support them (or even sell spare parts) was an exercise in futility.

      So, while it's not as Truly Perfect as the Apple True Believers will try and tell you, it is a damn fine system. I have a range of systems that I use (Windows, Linux, BSD, Solaris, Mac) but both the laptop and my main desktop are Macs by choice.

    3. Re:How good is OS X, really? by Seanasy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Think of everything you like about Linux.

      OK, now imagine an OS with all of that plus a good desktop.

      It'a as easy as that. When you get it you'll start using it, doing the things you normally do with a computer. It'll be pretty, it'll be nice. Then you'll get one of those 'itches.' Can't I write shell script to do this more efficiently? I wonder what running a Tomcat server is like? I don't want to switch out of Terminal to control iTunes...

      It really is the best of both worlds.

    4. Re:How good is OS X, really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      As someone who was in exactly your position, I say, "No."

      Ultimately, the problem is that while a lot of Apple's apps are nice, there are nicer solutions out there. I used Safari for awhile, but gave in to Firefox because, if it doesn't work better, it's at least got a feel that I like more. iTunes takes a long time to get used to, and I started longing for my XMMS (even after adding in .ogg support). I also stuck with Open Office which meant dealing with the X11 app (very nice integration, but still not all there--it'd be nice to be able to OA-Tab directly to specific X11 aps when multiples are running). Mail.app is very nice, if you don't want a text-based client. Terminal itself has slightly different ansi-color attributes that I was used to, so I ended up grabbing two different terminal programs to handle my various wants and needs (one for mudding with Tinyfugue, one for general SSHing). And speaking of Tinyfugue, it takes quite a bit of tinkering to install.

      Put simply, I was installing tons of 3rd party software, which is something I could have done with any PC I'd bought.
      I also noticed significant screen lag, which perhaps would have been addressed in 10.3.7, who knows. To illustrate the point, however, get on a Linux box and the iBook, ssh to a server somewhere, start a screen session, and start cat'ting logfiles. The Linux display will finish noticeably faster every time (in fact, this was the annoyance that got to me most).
      The Aqua gui is nice, but it's not something you spend $1200 on, and on top of all of this, buying an Apple means you lose a significant portion of software you could be running if you'd bought a PC. Overall, it's nice, and if your needs aren't high, then it definitely Just Works. But When it came right down to it, all the drawbacks did not outweigh the positives for me.

      I love the way everything feels on an iBook, but it just doesn't do what I want.

    5. Re:How good is OS X, really? by gbrandt · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I get 6 hours on my ibook 14". Frankly thats way better than my Dell laptop which tops at 4 hours. And my iBook is very light.

      For equivelant power and useability, iBooks are light and last longer on battery power.

      Gregor

    6. Re:How good is OS X, really? by MacDaffy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Your misgivings are well-taken. I've been using Macs for seventeen years. I came to them after a career as a programmer on PC's and the HP3000. Just some observations:

      --You immediately jettison your obsession with malware/spyware/worms, etc. If you aren't obsessed with them on a PC, you're cruisin' for a bruisin'. And that's worth something right there.

      --I don't use AppleWorks unless it's necessary. But there's a myriad of software--free, shareware and commercial--that fits the bill. BBEdit, Nisus Writer, TextEdit--it's MUCH easier to find all kinds of good quality, low-cost software for Macintosh than it is for Windows. There's a much lower ratio of trash-to-treasure on Macintosh because crap just doesn't survive very long. A trip to the Mac OS X side of Versiontracker will bear me out.

      --Wireless networking is mature in Mac OS X. Acquisition of networks is easier. Configuration is easier. The antennas built into the machines get better reception than Windows machines do--and that's laptop AND desktop.

      --Apple hardware purchases hold their value. This machine is four years old. It can be had for about $800. I'd take one in a minute for running Mac OS X. But a new iBook G4 is $100 more. The used Mac market is crazy because the machines are so useful.

      It's not all sunshine and roses by any stretch of the imagination. Panther Release 10.3.6 was a disaster, from what I hear. Busts FireWire. Windows-Mac networking interoperability suffers. There are the shortcomings you mentioned in your own situation. It's a balance. Since you're a knowledgeable user, you can make a more informed decision than most people. Macintosh does have its shortcomings, but everything about it is geared toward one thing: Helping you get your work done.

      Good luck. Hope this helps.

    7. Re:How good is OS X, really? by nordicfrost · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'll address every topic in order:

      Does it really Just Works(TM)?

      Usually, yes. I have yet to install a driver on my PowerBook. Every printer I have dried to connect to has been automatically found on the network and installed, every weird-ass camera connected has just showed up in iPhoto to import the images. The bluetooth mouse worked on the first try. The Microsoft Bluetooth adapter that refused to work on Norwegian XP SP1 (Since the drivers wouldn't load on the Norwegian edition) worked out of the box on an iBook.
      I have had two instances where it didn't just work. One was a weird-ass printer in my girlfriend's flat, it required a download of some open source drivers. The other is that there is no support for the Microsoft fingerprint scanner that I got to test from Microsoft.

      iTunes doesn't play .ogg files (not without tweaking anyhow)

      Itunes does play ogg. It even has a file icon for ogg, and many rumor mongers among the Apple fan base suspect that ogg support will be native in iTunes soon. Not on the iPod, but that's another issue. The ogg support is done via plugin, but if you want, there's a really kick-ass application called Audion that does a lot more than iTunes. One of the best music players, regardless of platform.

      Appleworks doesn't cut it for me

      Me neither.

      I'm not about to pay a kazillion $ to MS to use Office, I'll have to install OpenOffice

      I have to say, MS Office for Mac is really slick. Using Office 2000 on Windows when I'm at work now feels like I'm writing on cave walls with deer-blood as paint. Lots of nifty and well though through features that actually are useful. Like a toolbox that fades away so you see only the actual paper you are writing until you need the toolbox, then it fades in. Very non-clutter like.

      As for OpenOffice, I used it on Linux before I switched to Mac. I liked it, but it really feels old compared to Office on Mac. Very, very, very old. The experience I had with it on Linux was that it was extremely slow. I think this has been fixed, and there is an very active effort to get the Mac version native. It now runs under the X11 subsystem (Another cool thing with the MacOS X).

      I can tell you how I got into Macs. My mother got a budget for buying a new computer, printer and accessories to use when she edited an online magazine. She had a horrible AST Windows 98 computer that constantly locked up (And it costed me a term paper when it was W95 when i accidentally hit the 'sleep' button on the keyboard that actually crashes W95). Having long since moved out, I was looking for something that needed little attention from my side, and I advised her to by an iBook, after strong recommendation from a photographer friend.

      The ibook was ordered and set up. Everything worked, right out of the box. There was a program for the Agfa Snapscan I donated and the Logitech wireless two-button mouse worked without any thing other than plugging it in (and syncing it with the base). The number of family support-calls went down from four-five a week to every other week. Now, this is remarkable. The Mac had so few issues, that I just needed to have a look at it every six months doing routine maintenance like repairing permissions, checking that everything works as planned. Updates go ahead automatically every week. I have had one problem with the updates, but that's it.

      Then my GF was out to buy a new laptop. I told her that if she got a Windows computer, I would not help her when something went wrong. I'm tired of being the person everyone calls at 22:00 because the term paper went away or the internet connection is down. She got an iBook, and loves it dearly. It seems that persons not familiar with computers see the Mac hardware as a companion, a work mate more than a cold tool that you sometimes have to fight with.

      Some friends that run a company said they would take my advice and buy Macs next time they were going to upgrade. Macs pl

    8. Re:How good is OS X, really? by katamerry_damatree · · Score: 2, Interesting
      In 2001 I had to buy a new computer, and despite being a lifelong PC user, went with a newly-remodeled iBook.

      The first thing you notice is that you can't download everything anymore and expect it to work (well, you know what I mean). But it's no biggie; eventually you break the google habit and hang out at versiontracker or sourceforge instead. It's annoying at first- it took months for me to run into X-Chat Aqua, the only free IRC chatter on the platform w/out running ircII etc. out of Terminal, which I can never get working anyway- but you grow into it. Signing up for the ADC emails helps keep you abreast of some of the cooler up-and-coming projects, too.

      You can get .ogg playback easily in iTunes by downloading a quicktime plugin. You install it by dragging and dropping it into one of the working locations. That's it. There's a slight lag when played, and they don't show up for sharing, but iTunes can both convert them to a more comfortable format and burn them to disc, so if you *need* them shared you can still get around it.

      The painless wireless was already mentioned, but can't be understated- Apple's built-in client handles WEP, WPA, and 802.1x networks with ease; sharing is a matter of going into the Sharing prefs and checking the right boxes, rather than the mysterious restarting affairs of XP.

      Hardware can sometimes be an issue with Apple. My iBook debuted the Combo drive in a spectacularly busted manner, but they had it back to me in less than a week, shipping covered, w/ free backup of data (since I couldn't burn anything). My 2003 12" powerbook's main speakers were crackling- somewhat common that year- and had a few dead pixels, but I didn't bother calling it in. I replaced it with a new one about a year later, and this one has an occasionally unreliable left arrow key. *shrug* YMMV, but their support is great if something does come up. Just consider extending it past the 90 days.

      Yes, I'd say OS X Just Works(TM). Even running beta versions, the only OS crashes I've had were when I was doing something I wasn't supposed to be. Another YMMV, of course, but the unpredictability of Windows drives me crazy now.

      I don't think the "I could get this other software on Linux/Windows" statement is the right way of looking at it. I'm happy I can get most of the better multiplatform software on my Mac. If you need additional features than the bundled software with the OS, it's there, but you have to get it yourself, per usual. But there's a bigger selection than with Linux (and between fink and X11, most of the common Linux choices are here anyway) with- generally- much less effort, and Apple's bundled software is worlds better than Microsoft's. Even if you're stuck with Safari before you can get Firefox or Camino, you're not facing the internet ass first with MSNoPants in your process list. And though it has little to do with word processing, wait until you play with Garageband. ;)

      If you don't like Appleworks (me neither), try AbiWord or OpenOffice, as you mentioned. With any OS you're going to have to fill in the gaps for your use, but Apple has done a great job providing core functionality. TextEdit alone may surprise you.

      USB and Firewire have a monopoly here, so if you're into hobbyist kits and/or PCMCIA hardware, you're either SOL or are planning on starting an adapter collection (and may still need drivers). I have used a Keyspan USB-Serial adapter with my Pbook and it works beautifully, but this still wouldn't be my platform of choice for experimenting with non-mainstream hardware.

      Nevertheless, if you're looking for reliable productivity there's nothing like OS X. Millions of iPod silhouettes can't be wrong.

    9. Re:How good is OS X, really? by Steve+Cowan · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Aqua is nice, but it is admittedly ahead of its time, and is sluggish. 10.3.7 seems to have improved scrolling across the board, which is nice.

      But I really believe it is a next-generation UI, and is slow just like the classic Mac UI was never really snappy until the 68040 machines came out. (I'm not counting pre-System 7, because it didn't multitask).

      Despite Aqua's shortcomings, it really doesn't seem to bog down the machine when it comes to raw processing. Instead, when the processor gets busy, everything still hums along at full tilt, but Aqua gets choppy.

      In the meantime I still am really liking the direction that Apple is forging with OS X and the consistency of its UI across apps. Despite its sluggishness it continues to get faster with these incremental updates, and in a few years when a base system is a 3 GHz G5 with video on par with a GF6800, we'll forget about its little annoyances, just like nowadays we forget about trying to run System 7.1 on a Mac LC. Then the fruits of Apple's labour will really pay off, while we enjoy our little search boxes, cool zooming effects and drop shadows. Mac OS X will make Longhorn look clumsy, much the same way System 7's UI wiped the floor with WFW 3.11, and using OS 8 made Win 95/98 feel like a toy.

      In my opinion, right now XP and Linux interfaces are nice and quick, but once I now that I've been using OS X for a few years I find other interfaces primitive, despite Aqua's sluggishness.

      I know I'm rambling, but hey - since we're sharing, do you want to know what annoys the hell out of me with Windows these days? The taskbar. If you have an Office app open with multiple documents, each document gets a tile in the taskbar - even though the documents are in daughter windows (don't even get me started on that). You only need to have about 6 open windows on your screen before the taskbar becomes useless. The System Tray is never big enough to show you everything it contains (oh if only things just shrunk to fit their available space like OS X), and the Start menu which causes you to do mouse gymnastics through what is usually 3 hierarchal menus just to launch any app. (click Start, move up and to the right for "all programs", hover there for a moment, move into the list that appears on the right - but not too far or the whole thing will disappear on you, then move up or down to your app's folder, then move down past uninstall, help, readme, and click on the app! now what was i going to do with it again?) Oh, and it's also really cool when it starts hiding items from you when you haevn't used them for a little while.

      Anyway -- happy computing, regardless of which platform's fruits you choose to pick. :)

  30. Re:Graphic drivers? by goMac2500 · · Score: 2, Informative

    ATI does most certainly write their own drivers. Apple handles any integrated card drivers because, well, they are Apple built OEM cards. My Powerbook cannot use the ATI drivers because my card is an Apple onboard ATI card. My G3 tower could use the ATI drivers because it used a ATI PCI card. (Both my Apple supplied Rage 128 and my aftermarket Radeon 7000 took ATI drivers). Nvidia also wrote their OS X drivers as far as I'm aware, although I'm sure they work very closely with APple.

  31. Colour change after awake from screensaver by waffleman · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Has anyone else noticed a colour shift after an awake from screensaver? I'm finding that sometimes there's a shift to a bluer hue. Turning the screensaver on and off sometimes resets it back to the normal colour balance. If this were on a CRT I would say that there's something wrong with the blue gun, but this is on the LCD of an iBook G4.

    Strange. Could it be something with the video drivers?

  32. Re:um, how about SMB browsing fix? by ytsejam-ppc · · Score: 3, Informative

    It is fixed. Not only did it browse perfectly through my Active Directory domain to my XP SP2 shared printer, but then it actually installed updated CUPS drivers when I selected the printer. And the Word doc I printed from my Mac off my Active Directory shared home folder worked beautifully. Who says you can't integrate a Mac into a Windows network??

  33. Whoohoo! Finally, the freakin' scrolling works! by nazzdeq · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've been bitching about the scrolling since OS X was release. Looks like this release finally fixed my concerns. On my iBook 800mhz G3 scrolling is sweet. So, for you lucky G5 types, you should be all set. Nice.

  34. Apple discovers new source of energy? by allrong · · Score: 4, Funny

    Could this be the answer to the World's energy needs? Imagine cities powered by software upgrades...

    Can Microsoft match that?

    --
    What is the inverse of the Matrix?
  35. Still need the Blizzard WoW update by green+pizza · · Score: 2, Informative

    The new drivers in 10.3.7 aren't enough to improve WoW performance, the other key component is an update from Blizzard to re-enable certain hardware rendering features. Then we can finally get the performance boosts that were promised.

  36. Re:um, how about SMB browsing fix? by green+pizza · · Score: 2, Interesting

    > Holy shit, 26.4 MB for the delta update from 10.3.6 to 10.3.7? What crack are they smoking?

    Sounds about right for the major OpenGL changes in both the ATI and NVIDIA drivers.

  37. 10.3.7 by bigt_littleodd · · Score: 2, Funny

    I'm downloading it now, but haven't installed it yet. Already I can tell that my TiBook is becoming... SNAPPIER!

    --
    Let's play Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. I'll be Pestilence.
  38. Re:Extra extra(?) by BlackSabbath · · Score: 3, Informative

    Alternatively you can edit your Slashdot preferences to only view stories on the subjects you like.

  39. Update contents? by carboncopy79 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Why does Mac Os X Update for clients do not update Apache and stuff like that?

    I wonder why is this so. Since ALL Mac Os X comes with Apache installed. And other server (daemons). Why do they just release those update in their Mac Os X Server Update?

    I know 10.3.7 didn't include Apache update, but earlier ones certainly did.

  40. snappy systems by zpok · · Score: 3, Informative

    For all you "My mac seems just a bit snappier" people out there, try using Cocktail once in a while to maintain your system a bit...

    ;-)

    --
    I think, therefore I am...I think.
  41. Just updated. by zwilliams07 · · Score: 2, Informative

    Decided to take the jump.

    I did the usual, repair permissions, run Disk Utility's Repair, disconnected the FW400 (911 Chipset) drive which I was worried about, updated, restarted, and ran permissions fix again.

    No real problems so far, outside of getting the spinning beach ball at login twice. Outside of that, everything seems consistently faster. Safari loaded before it even got to its second bounce and now it absolutely screaming fast at loading.

    REMEMBER TO DISCONNECT ANY AND ALL FIREWIRE DRIVES BEFORE UPDATING.

    Anyways, so far, so good.

  42. Software update via shell by revscat · · Score: 4, Informative

    You *still* can't update a system via ssh.

    What are you talking about? That's been around since at least 2002. man softwareupdate and read up on it.

  43. Re:10.3.7 snappier? Not mail. by reiggin · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Same problem here. Repairing permissions didn't help. Also, DNS resolving takes a lot longer. Very long.