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Retail Theft Detectors and False Alarms?
NichardRixon asks: "All too often I set off the 'shoplifter alarm' when leaving a major department store in my area, after purchasing OTC medicine. Even though I make a point of watching the cashier 'clear' the boxes, it is evidently an imprecise process. As often as not the alarm goes off as I leave, and the security person wants to look through my bag and compare what's found with my reciept. People passing by give me the evil eye, evidently assuming that I've been caught stealing.
This has happened so so many times that my new policy is to refuse to stop for the search, telling the gaurd that they will have to tackle me, and of course they just let me go.
Shouldn't stores be required to use more reliable equipment?" What's worse is that there are many retailers that are just plain apathetic to the alarm. What's the point of having these detectors if all they are is continuing source of false alarms? What good will they be when they catch a real theft in progress and no one reacts properly because of their questionable history?
"It happened to my wife the other day, however, and she felt as though she had no choice but to wait several minutes, embarassingly on display to other shoppers, for the arrival of the manager.
I was wondering if other Slashdot readers have been having similar experiences and if so, how they deal with them."
A deterrant. Retailers don't care if they alarms are reliable; they use them to deter many of the casual wannabe shoplifters out there. And apparently they work, because the big retailers with analysts out the wazoo use them.
-- Microsoft is the most expensive commodity operating system and office suite vendor in the marketplace.
Why not just get that RFID chip removed from the back of your neck...
From my experience, the vast majority of the time the alarm goes off, it's etiher due to something not being demagnetized properly or something I'm carrying on me. I've never really felt that people have assumed I've done something wrong because almost everybody has had such a thing happen to them. AS far as perfecting it, if I were a retailer, I'd rather have it get an extra 99 people out of a thousand who were innocent but also get the one person who was actually stealing something than not go off. False positives for it tend to be rather minor as far as I have ever seen.
Don't you hate pants?
and we routinely ignore the alarm going off, because more often than not it is some other stores security tag that sets off our alarms. As a technology they are worse than useless. I hope RFID actually works.
When this happens to me (*every* time I go to Home Depot, by the way), I just just walk away purposefully, ignoring the cries of "Sir! Sir! You set off the alarm". I don't make eye contact, I don't speed up or slow down. Just ignore. It feels good when you finally reach that Zen-like state of perfect ignoring.
:-)
I made the mistake of stopping once and had to sit there while they wasted my time rooting through all my bags. And yes, it's a waste of *my* time--It's not my duty to give them peace of mind. I guarantee they won't go out of their way to give *me* peace of mind.
This is the same way I handle the bozos at the end of the Fry's line that insist on checking eveyone's bag. I just scoot on past and ignore everything they say. The Fry's guys won't chase you though; The Home Depot people do.
-David
There. Now go play some cool javascript games!
I agree with your solution of just keep on walking. Thankfully the Fourth Amendment protects us in the USA from illegal search and seizure.
-1: flamebait should really be -1: inciteful
You are right about the false positives. They are way too relaxed at times trying to clear the tag from going off.
I would stop an complain to the manager plus when you get home call the head office. Throw a fit and to end it don't shop there anymore if they can't come to a solution.
Running off isn't going to help you'll find a cop on your doorstep waiting for you to get home. They do after all have cameras in the parking lot...
Interestingly, the advertisement I saw just now was. "For the next two weeks you can steal Airopeek and EtherPeek."
The library here (Carmel, Indiana) has a similar problem, and so did the libraries at Purdue. Of course, in a library situation, you are supposed to be giving the books to whoever wants to read them. The problem is that you want the people to then bring them back. The books I want to look at or check out seem to always be mysteriously missing...
*is run over by rotten tomatoes*
I'm not sure how accurate it is, but I was told that a store can't do anything to you without actually seeing you take something. So that's probably why the guards let you go. Otherwise, why have cameras at all... it would be cheaper to tag everything and let it get sorted out at the door.
Also, from what I've been told, it's best to act as if nothing happened. Shoplifters get away with their crime more often than not because they just keep walking and they can be in their car by the time the guard get to them.
The funny thing was, I was getting a lot of false positives for a while. I couldn't figure it out. I finally realized that the wallet I had bought a few weeks earlier had an active security device still in it. It was pretty well hidden (behind a flap in the wallet that I didn't realize was something that could be opened), or I would have removed it earlier. I kept the device after I removed it, just in case I ever decided I wanted to mess with store security :)
psmylie's dictionary: Godzillion (noun) Any number large enough to destroy Tokyo
Do you have a FOB for your car? For whatever reason certain key FOB's set these things off. I wonder if it's your keys and not the OTC medicine that is setting it off.
Is it maybe some kind of insurance policy that is cheaper if they have these anti-theft things? I too have noticed how most store employees don't even pay attention when they go off. The customers get far more upset than the employees do.
:-)
There was a time awhile back when I used to set these things off almost everywhere I went. Eventually I started to remove one item each time I went to the store. First it was my keys, then my cell phone. The alarm would still go off. Then I tried leaving my wallet in the car and just carry in the cash I needed. Lo and behold, the alarm didn't go off! So after some careful investigation I found that my wallet still had the anti-theft sticker tucked inside an unused pocket. What was strange about this is that the alarm problem had only started recently even though the wallet had been with me for years.
After thinking about it a bit, I determined that the problem had to be caused by either one of two likely possibilities (or a combination of them). The most likely explanation is that the old security key card I had had was blocking the anti-theft device. I didn't connect to the two immediately, but the problem of the alarms going off began to occur about the time I turned that badge in. The other possible explanation is that somehow the anti-theft device was re-activated. I'm not even sure if that's possible or not, but I had the wallet before I got the job that required the security key card and never had any problem going through those detectors.
In any case, after removing the old anti-theft sticker, I've not had any problems with those devices. So if you're one of those who keeps setting them off, you might have a look for something like this.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
At CompUSA on Market St. in San Francisco, they check everybody's bag, alarm or no alarm. Seriously.
I always refuse, but it's a hassel. A couple of gaurds followed me out the store one day but backed off when asked them under what authority would they be apprehending me.
I just don't shop there any more.
In the following email to Staples after they had this problem: ...my comment about the in-store experience:
I thought you would like to know that after I bought $350 worth of merchandise, rung up by the store general manager, no less, that the anti-theft system at the front door started going off as I departed.
I stopped, turned around, and went in hoping that someone from the store would help, as indicated by the automatic alarm warning message. I'm telling you, even though there were a gaggle of sales people standing around, no one FLINCHED.
I finally started to approach one of the cashiers. From 20 feet away he called out (over the din of the alarm) "Did you pay for that?" I called
back "Yes"
He said "Why did you stop? Just keep going!"
I turned and walked out. Presumably the shoplifters would have done the same except they would not have paused at the door.
How much money does Staples have invested in this system that is completely ignored? If it's all the same to you, would you please stop
installing these systems and lower your prices? I'd rather not pay more than I have to.
Thought you'd like to know.
But Herr Heisenberg, how does the electron know when I'm looking?
...to not let security people search my bag of purchased good. Once I got into an argument about it with the security manager at a local big box store, since she was not checking everyone's bags, but picking and choosing whom she stopped, and when I refused to allow my bag to be searched, she claimed it was their policy. I told them I didn't know their policy because it wasn't posted anywhere. She relented, and said next time I visit, it will be posted, and if I don't agree to the search, I can shop elsewhere. I agreed. By the way, this was Best Buy.
with a stroller we purchased. The security tag was under the tray, unbeknownst to us. We set it off going into Target, but not going out.
It wasn't until we were going into a store in the mall (when we triggered the alarm again) that a woman who worked there commented that she'd had a similar situation happen. Ran her hand under the tray and found the security tag.
I never stop when the bell goes off, unless the door will not physically open (which hasn't happened yet). I've set the detectors off coming into a store on a few occasions from having picked up one of those tags on a previous purchase, or getting it stuck to my shoe. The store employees have yet to try to stop me, since I haven't done anything wrong.
antipaucity
This is Canada. Zellers staff just have to record why it was set off. They have a clipboard by the checkout, and have to record the alarms. They always just stand at the checkout and put it as false positives.
The best game is getting a big pile of the "setter-offers" and sticking them on colleagues hehe
If it bothers you too much after you paid for the merchandise and the alarm goes off and you are stopped by the security people, do this - After they are done searching for those items on your receipt, you tell them that now you would like to return those items as you have no desire to take them home after the embarrassment caused to you.
There is a Lowe's Home Center near me whose alarm goes off constantly, to the point where whatever employee is closest to the controller simply walks over and shuts it off, not bothering to check bags.
A while back I purchased some small hardware items and a new garbage disposal. Sure enough, the alarm went off, but having long since resolved to ignore it, I walked to my car with no incident.
When I got home and looked at my receipt, I found out why the alarm went off - the cashier hadn't properly checked out the disposal, and so I wasn't charged for it.
I wonder how much they lose by people intentionally taking advantage of the "cry wolf" alarm.
(posting anonymously lest the Lowe's police track me down)
When I left the store, though, I set off the alarm again, and this time someone came to me. I just told her that I had set off the alarm when I came in, waved my bag from the other store through the detector to set it off, and she let me go.
To get something done, a committee should consist of no more than three persons, two of them absent.
After some experiences during my younger days with very imperfect demagnetizers, I got into the habit of shoving the bag, with my new purchases, through the security field before I step through it. That way, the store droid at the door can see that it was something in my shopping bag that set the alarm off.
In all cases where I've set an alarm off like this, they've been satisfied with just going through the shopping bag. No insistence of searching my whole person.
We can believe in you for 3 minutes, but beyond that, even the King of All Cosmos can't be expected to wait.
2 - alarm rings
3 - store bitches
4 - tell them to call the cops, because only the cops have the right to search you **AFTER** they put you under arrest; warn them that you will sue them for false arrest.
5 - they let you off, go home. That's it.
OR 5 - they don't let you off.
6 - they call the cops. Cops don't find anything.
7 - sue them for false arrest and defamation of character.
8 - profit!!!
Very often, upon finding your innocence, they will offer to settle. Some 40 years ago, an aunt got herself to choose whatever she wanted from $BIG_CANADIAN_DEPT_STORE. She chose a mink coat...
After setting off the alarm at MicroCenter (a computer store) I had some creep try and stop me, claiming he "helped with security" at the store. I told him to take a hike and walked past him. He ended up following me to my car, mumbling about "taking down my license plate number". I wrote letters to the store manager, the corporate Customer Service department, and I blogged about it. I never did hear anything from the company.
my aunt walked out of a store once and forgot to pay, and *did not* set off the alarms. when she realized what she'd done she went back to the store, and set it off going back in
By reading this, you have given me brief control of your mind.
I worked at blockbuster for a few months, there was quite a bit of theft. But they had those alarm things there.
:P
:P And calling Blockbuster the Devil to customers, what the hell I wasn't going to get a decent recommendation anyway.
With my mind free scanning endless blue boxes I came up with about 9-10 security problems and solutions that were totally transparent to the customer and staff. They were totally ignored.
Why? Because I also came up with some inherent flaws that could not be corrected, therefore closing security holes would lead theives to the perfect crime scenarios, the illusion of security bolstered by watchful staff and security devices was more important than real security because silly criminals will be scared off. Meanwhile I had flaskMpeg and a Modded Xbox so I didn't really care, enjoy the movies
I'm pretty sure I got fired for handing out photocopies of supernova.org and bittornado.com on little cards
Like many of the posters commented, I just keep on walking. I used to stop, and I used to let them look through my bags - after all, after I buy the merchandise, everything is now *mine* and not theirs. I finally got sick of it since just about every store has this problem. Now, when I'm walking and it goes off, I keep going. If anyone says anything, I keep walking. I did have someone chase me down and tell me I had to come back into the store so my bags could be searched. I hope I didn't run over his feet as I was driving away...
This is very old news so I'm not worried about the ramifications of releasing this knowledge, nevertheless I shall be anonymous...
1) Go to Wal-Mart
2) Walk up to the electronics check out desk or automotive counter desk and pull a plastic bag off of the rack.
3) Walk into the games section and pull out one (1) copy of Trivial Persuit
4) Place Trivial Persuit in bag.
5) Walk out of store.
5b) If woman is checking receipts, walk out with larger crowd of people and let them get snagged as you walk by. Ignore anyone saying "Sir.. sir.."
6) Get struck by lightning. Wal-Mart is on God's side, so you must assume that the converse it true.
Direct away from face when opening.
Self checkout lanes provide me with great amounts of fun in regards to this. It isn't that difficult to figure out which products have the sensors, and since at the self checkout you control which items get properly swiped over the deactivation pad (which is under the scale which is used as the bagging area btw). With a known active sensor, you can either cause your trouble, or you can simply keep walking and have a live sensor to use for nefarious purposes later.
I've worked in a large retail store, and I can tell you with pretty reasonable certainty that the point of such detectors is not to detect people shoplifting, but to give the greeters or store security an excuse to stop people they suspect may be stealing. I've even heard tales of security setting the alarms off on purpose to give themselves an excuse to go after someone they know to be stealing (someone who may have removed the tags from the merchendise).
But aside from that, I think previous posters have hit it on the nose when saying that they mostly function as a detterant, and retailers don't really care how reliable they are.
... stick to internet shopping and don't patronize the stores with flaky sensors.
"Your having a bad day when the voices in your head put you on hold"
Demand to see the manager EVERY TIME it happens.
Make it as big of a pain for them as you.
I have to wonder what right a rent a cop has to detain you? Those sensors are so unreliable they are without a doubt not probable cause. I mean what right does a none police officer have to detain you or to demand a search of your bags.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Lemme ask a couple simple questions here:
Have you ever seen little strips of plastic that are extruded a little in the middle, attached to merchandise?
Do you ever detach these and adhere them to your body because it makes you look cool? If you answered "yes" to both of those questions, let me just say that the trouble caused by such actions is not worth being hipper than a TRL VJ.
I possess an evil sence of humor, and too much free time, but whenever this happens to me, and they try to wave me on, I DEMAND to have them come over and figure out what set off the alarm. That damned machine just announced to the world that I was a theif, and I demand satisfaction!
Nipok Nek
Why choose white shoes?
If shopping at this store is such a hassle, why do you continue to give them your money? Just shop somewhere else.
James
(Bzzzzzzz...Bzzzzzz..Bzzzzzz)
I'm just standing in line for the self-checkout when I'm watching the doorway alarm goes off at a crazy clip...
(Bzzzzzzz)
Sheesh... They never let up... Half of the kin-folks are automatic criminal suspect (Bzzzzz)...
Now, its time to pray, when my turn is up. That my time and date are decided by a crazed-fate.
(Bzzzzz)...
Drat... It got me for no good reason.... Evil eyes lurks on me from all the overflowing lines.
(Bzzzzz) Oh? It got you too? He he he...Join the crowd, buddy.
Not so funny as it seems. I've been "ringing" at all theft detectors. I found this happens if I'm in my indigo jeans. Few weeks later I found thin metallic stripe (apparently from a chewing gum pack) stuck in the seam near the belt.
my sstream of consciousness
It was annoying at first, but I've gotten used to it. You'd think they'd use a mechanism that wasn't trigged by common devices, though.
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
It's amazing how much stuff you can buy that is basically the honor system. It is trivially easy to walk away from a restaurant without ever paying the bill. As for the security alarms, most times I set it off, no one stops me. Or, if they do, they just say, "go ahead". Target has stopped me to actually check my bag, but that's the only place I can recall doing that.
I would set off alarms every time I left a store, could never figure out why. Finally an aggressive security agent had me reveal the contents of my wallet. We discovered a book of stamps with one of those magnetic strips in there. It was never reset properly when I bought it from the local bodega. Once the security agent swipped the book of stamps, I've not had the problem since.
Yeah, well what about the RFID chips Walmart wants in our underwear, socks, pencils, glasses, etc? If they can't get the stupid induction loop thingies working properly, what's going to happen when they scan the RFIDs scattered about your person looking for stolen goods? What happens when CompUSA's "autocheckout" scanners sense your belt and bill you for a PDA they think you just took out the door? How do you later prove you didn't take a PDA?
If all this should have a reason, we would be the last to know.
When this happens to me, I usually know exactly which item caused the problem. When that's the case (*), I remove the item from my bag and hold it out in front of me as I approach either the cashier that checked my purchase, a manager or greeter (in that order of preference). The benefit of this response is that it clearly demonstrates to the other shoppers and store employees that you have nothing to hide and you believe that the checker improperly deactivated the product.
* - If I don't know which item is at fault, I hold the entire bag out and approach the store representative with a quizical look on my face.
Where I used to work (we stopped EVERYONE who set off the alarm) the number one reason people set off the alarm upon entering was a new wallet. There was always a tag buried really deep in the folds of the thing, left active by some apathetic cashier at another store. Shoes were a close second. We also had some people come in wearing either stolen or woefully neglected clothing, with the hard-tags still attached.
Then we had the professional thieves who always had an excuse why they set it off upon entering: "Steel plate in my head (old guy)" or "It's my cell phone" or "I just got new filings". Funny, that stereo sized bulge in your pants doesn't look like a cellphone sir, perhaps you shouldn't be in such a hurry to leave?
The best thing we did was train the cashiers to stop everyone. The cashiers learned real fast, when they had to stop their customers, that it is MUCH better to do a proper job of deactivating. And the store gets the reputation around town that it isn't worth hitting , so the shoplifters just headed to Wal-Mart.
I go to my local Blockbuster quite a bit, and everytime im there the alarm goes off at least once without fail. The workers never do anything about it and just let people walk right out the door. It would be VERY easy to just put an extra DVD in your jacket pocket, rent another legitimately, and then walk right out when the alarm sounds.
Try tin foil...
tasks(723) drafts(105) languages(484) examples(29106)
Unless I'm mistaken, its up to them to prove you took the PDA, not the other way around. That's a big distinction.
On second thought, don't. Tin foil around every article of clothing can lead to cuts in the most painful of places...
tasks(723) drafts(105) languages(484) examples(29106)
Sometimes I think the security people at Wal-mart have the ability to control the responsiveness of the exit doors to delay someone they want to get a longer look at. I've noticed that at a particular store the doors can open soon enough for me to walk at a steady pace and other times I have to stop with my nose a few inches away from hitting the door. I try to always walk through the sensor's line of sight so it can't be because I wasn't seen.
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
After finally making my way through the checkout and purchasing my items, I made a beeline for the door, bypassing the twenty or thirty people standing around waiting to have their bags inspected. There was no way I was going to stand around for another twenty minutes after having stood in line for an hour already. As I approached the exit, a Fry's employee stepped in front of me and said, "I need to check your receipt, sir."
I ignored him, sidestepped, and kept walking. The moron actually grabbed my left shoulder from behind -- not forcefully, but even so it startled the crap out of me because I wasn't expecting to be grabbed. Completely by reflex, I yanked my shoulder away and punched the poor guy in the throat with my right fist (my bag was in my left hand).
It surprised me as much as it did him, and I felt kinda bad about it for a moment, but I hadn't hit him hard enough to do any real damage. He gave me a very unhappy look and made some strained coughing noises, and I walked away. In hindsight, I don't really feel bad about it at all. I had nothing personal against the guy until he touched me, but as soon as his hand landed on my shoulder, he overstepped his authority. If I'd seriously injured him, I would have felt terrible, but as it is, I think he got a good lesson in how to respect a customer's personal space.
...and the problem I have is that some manufacturers make it impossible to deactivate the tags. For example, I've found that many phone boxes have the tag hidden somewhere in the center of the box, where our deactivation magnet cannot reach. GE even puts the tags inside the phone base stations. Digital cameras pose a similar problem (tag hidden inside battery compartment), but since the box contents aren't packed like a fucking jigsaw puzzle (as with phones), it's easy to remove the tag.
"The newly born animals are then whisked off for a quick run through a giant baking oven." --heard on Food Network
when walking out of a store with security gates like that I always hold my bag out at arms length and let it go in alone... it is goes off I say really loudly that "I guess the cashiers need to learn how to actually work the security tag stuff" and keep walking out the door. I feel no compulsion to stop for what is lack of ability to complete a simple task. In addition I have never been followed by security when I have done this becuase to all around it is clear it is the contents of thier bag that I just got from thier cashier with the stuff I gave them to purchase.
My question is, if they can't train people to do this properly why don't they build a smaller version of the gate big enough to slide most items under to check without the alarm? I would think not embarressing your honest customers would be important. Besides, what will happen when some little old man walks out and it goes off and between the embaressment being flabbergasted he keels over with a heart attack? Will the store be responsible for have a known problem that was never resolved? (Ok, so that is just more to make you all laugh.)
"Our records show you left the store with item number XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX" will be good enough for most judges.
If all this should have a reason, we would be the last to know.
As proof? Not likely. Especially when I turn around and show them my receipt from a different retailer (or the same retailer previous to the episode).
If it comes down to your word against theirs, whose word do you think the judge is going to believe? Look what happened to the guy who tried to pay with $2 bills -- who did the cops believe then? Even if they let you go with a "sorry" it's not good enough -- the damage is done, as the original story says. I'm just pointing out the tremendous ability to really screw things up that RFID will introduce.
If all this should have a reason, we would be the last to know.
I was in a liquor shop recently. A man walked in, picked up a case of beer near the entrance, and walked out. The alarm beeped. There are two young male staff behind the counter:
A: Did you see that?
B: What?
A: That guy just walked in and nicked a case of VB!
B: Really?
A: Yes!
B: Huh. Fancy that.
A:
B: Well, it's not our job to chase him.
He was right, really. They're not paid to care.
When an alarm goes off as I leave a store, I head back in and get the attention of a shop assistant. They've never looked suspicious or asked to search my bag - they just reswipe my items and suggest that it's probably a library book or security card in my bag if that doesn't work. Maybe I just look innocent.
It wasn't from chewing gum.
It was from the inside of a music cd cover.
One of your friends was fucking with you.
Don't ask how I know this.
Glonoinha the MebiByte Slayer
I worked at a drug store for 3 years. All we ever did when the alarm went off was to tell the customer to ignore it and "go ahead" out the door. It's what the other employees did while i was being trained so I never questioned it. (I didn't want to get into fights with customers either) The alarm gets activated by tags placed on or inside the packaging. These tags are supposed to be deactivated by a pad under the counter at the cash register, (The pads "beep" when a tag is deactivated) but it doesn't always work the way it's supposed to. Active cellphones also used to set the alarm off and cause the pads to beep, forcing us to shut them off. Since the tags that activate the alarm are usually placed on the outside of the packaging, people who want to steal would just take the products out of the boxes before leaving the store. If you search the shelves at the end of the night you come across a lot of empty boxes of razor blades, medicines, etc. The whole system is pretty useless. It does nothing but annoy the employees and embarass the customers
It is the same reason why locks are on convertable cars, to keep honest people honest. Is it a real detterent? Not even close. Is it an effective psycholigical barrier? Yes, unless you are intent on shoplifting. Now the real question is, why is there interstate highways in Hawii and Alaska? They don't conenct to anything inter-state. They should be called intrastates
Get your free Dropbox account with 2 GB Free storage!
The store personel rely upon the fact that most people don't want control over their lives. The electronic alarm says "STOP", they stop and succumb to the will of the security guard, manager or just about any Joe with an apron or name tag. Nobody is stretching their rights, it's just a customer (or browser) who stops of his/her own volition and offers up his/her person for inspection.
If they want to accuse me of theft, I encourage them to make sure they have the full blessing of LP and management, and only after they have placed me under citizen's arrest and the police show up will I give up my right to privacy. You see, harassment and improper invocation of citizen's arrest laws are very large liabilities. A store would have to have me on tape actually taking something very valuable and be certain I hadn't put it down before they'd put their wallets on that line.
CompUSA, Fry's, Circuit City or Best Buy. If they want to check my receipt, they have to first accuse me of theft. If they won't allow me to leave without it, they'll have to place me under citizen's arrest. Without that, it's just regular Joes thinking they have a right to inspect goods I have rightfully paid for. I have no responsibility to any third party to prove that I own my propery.
I was arrested for leaving a store after the theft buzzer went off, despite not having stolen anything. Now I have a felony arrest on my permanent record for ignoring an alarm bell. Although I doubt I'll ever be interested in a profession where this will matter, I also won't even have the option to be school teacher, hold a high security clearance, etc...
My mistake was walking out while an off-duty cop was sitting in the parking lot immediately outside the store. He ordered me to the ground and called two more cops. There I lay handcuffed and surrounded by three police cruisers with flashing lights while customers rubbernecked on their way in and out of the store.
After being booked, an officer went back in to the store for about forty five minutes to review video evidence and talk to the loss prevention office in the store. Meawhile I lay handcuffed after dark in a cold, wet, oily, parking space. Since I didn't steal anything, and since any fairly continuous video monitoring should have clearly demonstrated that I didn't steal anything, and thus lacking any evidence of any actual crime whatsoever, eventually the cop came back out and the three officers grudingly released me.
But even without charges being filed, my decision to ignore the warning buzzer will probably follow me for the rest of my life. I'm trying to figure out if it's possible to void the arrest record, but it's not likely I'll succeed, it'll cost at least $105 in filing and records fees, and I may have to hire an attorney.
DON'T just walk out of the store. You can be thoroughly fucked over by the Powers That Be for doing so. It's not worth it to stand by your principles. Just let them search your bags and move on. If you want to demonstrate your displeasure with their "theft warning system," do as another poster said suggested and return all your merchandise after the store has decided you haven't stolen it.
I can't remember the last time I was actually asked to submit to a search. It's been long enough that I can't remember how well I cooperated. I do know I don't handle it with much courtesy, particularly if I'm being treated like cattle. If afterwards they said "Thank you," I'm almost positive I replied "and thank you for treating me like a criminal!"
This is not my sandwich.
After purchasing an audio CD at a Best Buy, I left with no alarms, as expected. However, walking into another store set off their alarm. The clerk volunteered to erase the security tag. His theory was that Best Buy purposfully releases random samples of un-erased security tagged items, providing other stores with an opportunity to search bags.
They waved him through! I was looking forward to at least five minutes of LMAO, but they just said, "Sorry 'bout that. Have a good day!" and sent him on his way.
So much for social engineering.
This is not my sandwich.
Also, slightly off topic, but does anyone feel a tinge of guilt (like I do) as they leave a shop without buying (or stealing) anything, because know you know you probably could have nicked something quite easily if you'd really wanted to?
On the rare occasion that I trip the alarm, I turn it into a customer relations problem.
I immediately turn around and go back into the store (ignore the guard, or tell him to walk with you if he wants to talk to you) and march either back to the cashier who checked you out, or to the customer service desk (use judgement). Ignore any line. Slam packages on counter and yell, "Fix it, NOW!"
This has the following, positive effects:
I have never set off an alarm in any one store more than once.
www.wavefront-av.com
You could possibly sue the corporation (since legally they are 'individuals') for defamation of character, eg. slander.
IANAL and this is not legal advice, but I am taking law classes and if a person was to make a
1) factual 'sounding' statement ("you're a thief! beep beep beep")
2) the statement was defamatory
3) the statement was false
4) the statement was communicated and overheard by others (people in the store?) and
5) the statement caused harm/damage (neighbors, possible business contacts think poorly of me now, lost business)
This would definately be a landmark case if it was won.
-- dK
I'll tell him that I have not stolen anything. After that, there isn't much to talk about other than the weather, which happens to be beautiful today.
"Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
"No, he cannot. That would be bordering on assault/kidnapping. The only thing they can do is scare you into voluntarily staying until the police arrive."
Something a lot of people forget. A lot of security guards ARE either former police officers, or police officers off duty.
This is in a certain UK-based Wal-Mart-owned supermarket.
I worked for a retailer (350 stores). They don't prosecute small claims like this. Our internal numbers showed a $40,000 price tag for each prosecution. You'd have to steal something really big or get tackled by the security guy.
Well in Denmark you get something for your inconvenience if you point it out. Might be a good bottle of wine, chocolate, flowers or some other usefull item. I even managed to convince a major outlet to purchase extra detectors so shoppers could insist on being checked in public i.e. while in line, as a proof of innocence rather than having to go to the office/back room.
That way the customers in line behind you would get proof of your innocense as well and no evil eyes served. And best of all your self image would be boosted.
I'm not from the US so I'm not really familiar with the weapons laws, especially since they seem to vary by state. Does this mean then that with a "concealed weapon permit" you must in fact keep the weapon concealed, or that you are allowed to conceal, or perhaps either depending on the State?
If it comes down to your word against theirs, whose word do you think the judge is going to believe? Look what happened to the guy who tried to pay with $2 bills -- who did the cops believe then?
You're mixing up two different things here. A judge's job is figure out what happened. The police officer's job is to assess the situation and act on what he believes is going on. After he has done what he believes is the right thing, it's up to the judge to call in the witnesses and get it all sorted out.
one particular brand i encountered goes off if i carry in my library card. they lost a bunch of customers over that screw up and replaced the things with a different brand.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
This happens to me all the time at Best Buy and at the drugstore. I have developed this reflex where I grunt, roll my eyes, and begin walking towards the guard.
Generally they smile sympathetically and wave me through; sometimes they barely look up and just yell "You're OK." Only once, in Wal-Mart on a slow day, have I had to actually open my bag for inspection, and the old woman who apparently doubled as a greeter was very apologetic.
One time last year at Macy's, I inadvertently helped an actual shoplifter out due to my reflex. I grunted exasperatedly and walked over to the nearest employee, who was in the men's wear section. A woman exiting at the same time as me kept walking. The guy said "Go on through, that thing goes off all the time for no reason." I did, and the second time it didn't go off at all... because the actual shoplifter was probably leaving the mall by that time.