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First Look at GIMP 2.4
Liam30 writes "Newsforge (ed: part of the OSTG family) is running a story that gives a first look at the next version of GIMP." From the article: " A major update to the GNU Image Manipulation Program (GIMP), widely regarded as the leading free software raster image editing program, is scheduled for this month. The 2.4 release is expected to include a number of new features and enhancements to existing features ... The first thing most users will notice about 2.4 is the addition of three new tools to the palette: the Align tool, the Foreground Extraction tool, and a new 'Simple' Rectangle Selector. The Align tool lets you vertically and horizontally align image layers -- a task you had to perform manually before. You can align an image to any edge or the center, specify an offset in any direction, and adjust vertical and horizontal alignment separately."
That 'SIOX' object selection stuff looks really really cute; you have to wonder if it would come in useful for machine vision/AI as well.
Anyway - good luck to the GIMP guys - a nice tool!
Now If we could just have a non-X11 Aqua version of Gimp for OS X, I'd be very happy!
For a while, I've had fairly negative views on GIMP. Sure, it's powerful, but it still lacks what Photoshop has out of the box, and it's got some fairly abstract configurations. But taking a look at SOIX and all, it's really going to push up against Photoshop. But now GIMP has to stop adding little features like simple rectangle select, and start adding more features like SOIX and superseeding PS to get it out there onto the commercial market.
I'll subscribe to Slashdot when I see a month without a dupe, a typo, or an article the "editors" didn't read.
http://micke.hallendal.net/archives/2005/10/gtk-ma cosx.htmli mp-on-os-x/
http://gimpfoo.de/2005/10/06/an-early-glance-at-g
Ok, ok, it's not quite there yet, but there seems to be a lot of progress lately.
So when can I edit CMYK screenshots of Duke Nukem Forever in GIMP?
I'm agneglectic, too lazy to care if there is a God.
They need a better one. Yes I know I can learn it but with paintshop or photoshop I just start the programe and I can do what I want. I didnt, and dont, have to learn how to use their more common functions. With gimp I do, and until they improve the ui its advantages are outweighed by the loss in productivity.
Still lacking in anything over 8bit *sigh*. Granted you have Cinepaint and PS "which is still gaysauced in 32bit imo" geting better but their still isn't that many paint or image editing applications out their. You have IFX's Amazon Paint along with a few others but not a wide selection. Only reason I seem to complain is I've latched onto ILM's OpenEXR. I've coded quite a few tools for working with OpenEXR. The whole working in a channelless enviroment is a godsend in the film compositing world I live in. Still nice to see another open source app maturing and growing. Some nice new features I'm sure users will like.
In older version of The Gimp it was very difficult to draw perfect concentric circles in it. I had to manually measure and mark the corners of the bounding box around the circle, and then I had to adjust for the "Stroke" feature drawing one pixel down and to the left instead of inside ... and so on.
It's the little things that separate the good programs from the bad. Not the amount of features.
"We mustn't be caught by surprise by our own advancing technology" -- Aldous Huxley
A Leica M lacks what a Canon SureShot has out of the box; that doesn't make the SureShot a better or more professional tool camera. Ease of use and multitude of features are not the measure of how good a tool is for commercial use.
I think both the Gimp and Photoshop are poor photo editing applications for professional users because they have too many extraneous features and don't focus on addressing the essentials well.
In the case of Photoshop, its real problem is that, in addition to trying to be a photo editing application, it's a web design application, an application for creating computer art, and lots more. It's the typical feature bloat that successful Windows applications experience.
The GIMP interface is teh suxxor! (But of course, I can't be bothered to tell you what would make it better.)
Please do not put this article in the Linux section: GIMP can target several platforms (and deserves a widespread adoption IMHO).
Please don't flame me if I am talking nonsense, but I've been told that GIMP is still based on the old 8-bit technology.
If I am right, may I know if the new 2.4 version has any improvement on this front ?
Thanks !!
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
I have been a GIMP user for the past few years. I started using GIMP first on windows and then when I switched over to linux, it became my graphics package of choice. I think GIMP will become a real threat to Photoshop in the near future. The only thing stopping it is CMYK support which (most probably) will be added in the next version.
I think it pays to use open source or GPLed software.
Linux Help
for all things on Linux
Anyone noticed that the gimp icon (on /.) is moving its eyes now and then? Funny ...
Hopefully somebody will do a KDE-frontend. The Gnome-HIG and especially their new dialogs are just a pain.
The one feature I miss the most in The GIMP is better text handling, like being able to have more than one font/bold/italic/sized text in each text area. It should also have text boundaries which can be properly enforced to do word-wrapping and stuff. It's also nice to be able to have text follow a path, or be stretched into certain shapes.
I also really like Photoshop's 'Save for Web' dialogue, and would like to see something like that in The GIMP.
These are the only things I use photoshop for, everything else is really nice.
One of the things I prefer about The GIMP is being able to have layer sizes different to the image size.
A feature I have yet to see in either Photoshop or The GIMP is being able to use the stamp tool to rotate the source image based on a path before applying it, this would allow you for example to correct problems around the edge of a circle without a whole lot of mess.
GIMP is for amateur losers, asswipe
Can anybody point me to the Windows binaries of the development version (2.3.4)? I can't find them on gimp.org. Thanks in advance!
Or something along those lines - I try the PC port from time to time, and it always turns me straight off that it opens all its windows straight on the desktop (as opposed to one window with all the others in it)
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
The only thing keeping me from using GIMP with no concern for PS whatsoever is the lack of support for 32-bit BMP files (BMP with Alpha). Even if it were implemented in a seperate (linux) program, that could a) convert a PNG with alpha or b) combine two BMP files, one grayscale. Until that point, I still have to use PS or some other tool to do the final edits for textures on MS Flightsim.
I'd like to see the GIMP libraries include window position/shape memory, intersession persistence. Groups of associated windows with their x, y, w, h params stored on disk. So I can open a workspace of multiple windows with a click, watch them spring back to their positions and sizes on the screen. Not just for the GIMP - maybe that feature will find its way to the general GNOME libraries, so all apps can do it. Then I might finally get multiapp window configs stored in a single config, opening multiple apps into useable multiwindow layouts by launching a single icon. This business of manually opening/dragging many windows on my desktop got old around 1985.
--
make install -not war
Can they PLEASE try to make sure it supports the Wacom graphics tablet series out of the box on mac osx. I've got an Intuos3 only to find that osx gimp doesn't respond to the tip pressure of my pen. I've read all the forums and the problem lies somewhere in the software.
So far, I'm considering getting a cracked version of photoshop instead. Come on gimp!
Take a look at inkscape. You want vectors, not pixels for doing simple squares.
I would love to see a comprehensive listing of what can't be done with GIMP 2.4 that you can do with Photoshop. Then, tack on a list of what features can be covered by other applications (open source or commercial) from the list of missing features in GIMP. That would give me a very nice look at comparing the two and deciding which way to go. Also, it would give me a sense of how much money, if any, I have to spend to acquire the capability of Photoshop or being better.
Take the circle selection tool and make your circle however you want. Then in the selection menu, select border. Set the border size to 1 or more pixels depending on how thick you want the circle. You can also feather the selection if you want a softer circle. The border tool is also useful for making outlines of other shapes as well.
.. please tell gimp developers to fix Curves dialog and use splines instead of Bezier, just like photoshop does... oh, and while we at it, please, please... PLEASE add duotone/tritone support. As semi-pro photographer, I couldnt care less about "foreground extraction" tools and "simple" rectangular selections.. please add what we need.
Meanwhile, I'm staying with PS.
Did you try the UFRAW plugin?
It can load RAW files from almosy all modern cameras and can process the brightness, contrast, saturation and WB in full 12/16 bits before loading them into Gimp.
This is not full 12/16 bit support but, as you mention, it is hard to see the difference between 8 and 12/16 bit during normal processing.
Use of SIOX will most likely increase Fark and Worth 1000 entries. No comment on if this is a good or bad thing...
Click here or here.
GIMP is an Image editor (Image Manipulation Program, afair), not a diagram creator.
However I do agree that there is a need for shapes often. Mostly there is a need to tweaking selections, paths, etc.. Much like you do in a vector drawing program (e.g. Inkscape - wonderful program, btw!).
But then I have to agree with your trolling a bit. Many new users find the GIMP very confusing simply because it forces them to change all their habbits. There aren't any shape tools, changing size of the brush isn't strait-forward (it isn't visible to new users).
An advice to the GIMP creators would definately be to make it more user friendly towards newcommers and improve startup time. Another thing is the much questioned window-hell they have. I am one of those users who just hate it. I know there are plugins for this, but they are unstable and extremely bad quality (i've tried).
Without an entire virtual desktop to work on, the GIMP is a drag to work with, since minimizing it takes ages wasting productivity time.
On another note, I am curious to find out if GIMPShop will be updated. I know several people who really like that port of GIMP.
The Kai's Semi-Updated Website Thingy
CMYK has been going to be in "the next version" for what, 2 years now? The fact is you cannot do any print work with the gimp, and they clearly don't care or they would have dealt with this already.
I've used GIMP now for a few days and although it's not as intuitive as Photoshop once you get the hang of it it's not bad at all. But for the life of me I can't figure out how to draw a rectangle or a circle! Probably the most basic features that even paint-brush has, yet I can't find them. I can create a rectangle of circle selection, but not a drawing...
The power of Christ compiles you!
It doesn't bother me personally, but most traditional Windows users will always be turned off to the separate GTK download. This is a form of "dependecy hell" that Linux users have come to accept and Windows users never will. Even PDF Creator managed to integrate AFPL GhostScript.
Research shows that 67% of those who use the term "research shows", are just making shit up.
Many people do not use the GIMP because of the interface issues. It is useless for people to learn another interface. The reason many people do not use GIMP, the reason I do not use GIMP is sheer laziness, I do not feel like learning another interface.
h tml-5243http://plasticbugs.com/?page_id=294>
So, Scott Moschella made this modification. He isn't a programmer, he just is a GIMP user. It's called GIMPShop. A conversion that just rearranges the menu's to Photoshop style. Linkage for your pleasure... Gimpshop is available for Windows, Solaris/Sparc, Linux (detailed instructions), Debian, and RPM's. GIMPShop runs native under Mac.
ahref=http://plasticbugs.com/?page_id=294rel=url2
I've had to use GIMP (and its cousin, Inkscape, who's interface shows a close family resemblance) only once or twice. It feels like an application made by people who think of a UI as gratuitous -- a necessary evil for those too lazy or stupid to use a command line. When it starts with no documents open, there are at least 4 or 5 freely floating windows, including a main window with umpteen stacked toolbars.
And now I find that people have been using it for years without such basic tools as "Align". Aligning manually is like kerning your fonts by hand -- what's the point of software in this case? I bet the export as EPS function opens a text editor.
Gimpshop 2.4 would be ace, i'll definately install that when someone creates a package for me to install on SUSE 10.0.
Most video cards only do 32 bit "true color", that is 8 bits each for R,G,B and an 8 bit alpha. You won't see any difference between 8, 12 and 16 bit per channel images with most cards. You might have a fancier card with fancy drivers that are set well. Then you might be able to see the difference.
Nvidia 7800 has up to 128 bpp. So do other fancy cards.
My crummy nforce4 has no such options, even with the nvidia driver. This is no big deal to me now.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
I have been using GIMP for a long time but when I switched to PhotoShop I suddenly got a lot better at doing graphics. It isn't any one feature that I can point to the Photoshop has or does better then the GIMP it is just the interface in photoshop is somehow easer. Layers seem so much easer in Photoshop then in the GIMP, Finding filters to run seems much simpler too. Perhaps it is because photoshop put the features you use the most more readily available while GIMP seems to give all the features all the same level (Cryptic). With tools like GIMP and Photoshop there is a fine line of usability. And if GIMP could get it right it would be a lot better. I wish I could give better deatails on what they should do but I am not sure myself. I personally don't care much for the photoshop interface as well but compared to the GIMP is is just more usable.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
On Linux, it isn't difficult to write cool plugins in C, which can do effects that are very difficult to do otherwise. On Windows, this is extremely challenging, because getting the build environment setup is a pain. This leaves one with their Scrpt-Fu (scheme)language for plugins. While I haven't been limited by its features, the lack of a decent debugger and manual makes programming in it extremely painful (though I program in scheme (well, one of it's derivatives) nearly every day).
In one case, I found a plugin someone else had written that would do exactly what I wanted. But of course it was in C (and the compiled version only available for Linux), so I had to port it to Script-Fu before I could use it, and it took forever to run (doing pixel-by-pixel operations is very slow in Script-Fu).
Had they chosen a standard scripting language like perl/python/whatever, all plugins could be cross-platform, and would be much easier to write/debug. And don't talk about Pygimp or it's siblings. I am not aware of a single one that works with GIMP 2.2 and has been ported to windows.
The windows port is to some extent a second-class citizen, which is too bad, IMHO.
Features working in SVN include:
* CMYK
* OpenEXR
* 16 bit/channel RGBA images
* Many more filters
* Painting with watercolors
* Adjusting brightness and contrast with curves
Long story short : it's still way inferior to Photoshop, but Linux zealots will claim it's not, and prove to you it's useable by showing you a ten pages tutorial on how to crop a picture.
Why, with all the great features the GIMP has, does it still lack a simple shape drawing mechanism? A feature even MS Paint has.
Proverbs 21:19
i can't fucking fathom why the hell people criticize those designers of FREE software.. are you fucking out of your mind?? you're fucking insane.. if you want it to be better, why not donate some fuckin money to the "son of a bitch" programmer??
of course it needs work, but you're definitely not HELPING by saying, "well, photoshop is STILL better.. blah blah blah I have a stick up my ass.."
do you have any idea of the huge programming team Adobe has?? do you have any idea on how much MONEY they can afford to pay some of the top programmers in the world?? you fucking twits.. god i hate you
*plays the Apogee theme song music*
The first thing most users will notice about 2.4 is the addition of three new tools to the palette: the Align tool, the Foreground Extraction tool, and a new 'Simple' Rectangle Selector.
So, in other words, they've just gotten around to adding something already present in other photo editors like PhotoShop.
Why don't you ask for a refund then? I always find it humorous how people complain about something that is free.....
I have never used Photoshop. I have used the GIMP for a long time, and I like it. It has improved greatly from the early days. But I am not a graphics person either. I know some who are, and who have tried GIMP, but they swear by Photoshop. I have to believe them, it seems to be the consensus. And honestly, it probably will always be like that. Look at what Photoshop is - THE standard. It became the standard by being the best. It costs a lot, yet people STILL swear by it. They are very focused on making their product better and better, and they have the money and resources to do that. Good for them. Speaking of money and resources, I can't justify spending the money on Photoshop. I don't need Photoshop. Heck, I used to manipulate images with Xpaint! Now that took skill. :)
But really, GIMP serves a great purpose. It is a very powerful program that is free. I do find some things frustrating with it, but there are very few programs that don't have that "feature". :) (I think the only exception is Irfanview) For power Photoshop users, GIMP might not be the solution, just as OpenOffice.org doesn't have some of the advanced features that 10% of the people need and use. But the GIMP rocks, and I don't have to break the law or sell a kidney to get a good image manipulation program.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
What are you talking about? First of all, GIMP by default only has two floating palettes: The tools one, and the layers one. Second, the Inkscape interface is completely different--it has no palettes at all; everything is attached to the document window. Maybe you're thinking of Sodipodi, but that only has a single palette. None of these programs have "4 or 5 freely floating windows" or "umpteen stacked toolbars."
Note that I base my assertions on Gimp.app and the OS X version of Inkscape. But maybe these just have friendlier defaults than other versions.
It doesn't suck the same way that the MS "powertoy" multiple desktop utilty does.
New features... Always new features. But Gimp's UI still looks like it's the result of a cryptic c++ competition! The Gimp will never become a serious competitor to Photoshop or other commercial software if its UI remains as it is. Geeky, far too geeky.
The primary reason for needing 16 bit and 32 bit per channel data is not for display but for editing and processing; with 8 bits per channel, there is very little room for adjustments and corrections. And you don't need a display with more than 8 bits per channel for editing 16 bit or 32 bit per channel images, or to see the artefacts resulting from working with 8 bit per channel images.
One of the things that I often want to do with an image is annotate it. That usually means adding text and/or shapes, e.g. drawing a circle or a box around something and adding a label, maybe with an arrow. For this shape-drawing tools are very handy. You can do this in the GIMP, but its harder than it needs to be.
Those of us with a *brain* who actually *program* understand that to *surpass* Photoshop, you have to keep the Gimp infrastructure - an infinitely extensible assortment of plug-ins and features, and not a frozen single monolithic window.
I'll time it with a stopwatch this time to see the flames and -1 troll mods pour in. I'm using it to create an AI algorithm that simulates mob frenzy.
Just a few days ago I was making a presentation in GIMP 2.2 for one of my friends, and we wanted to put some text along a circle arc. No luck. I tried to use Text Circle thing, but it wouldn't work because I had accented (Spanish) characters in the text string. Finally, we just went with an ugly curve bend.
I wonder if that feature will be implemented in 2.4...
Well, then, if people are so resistant to change, how'd they ever learn to use a computer in the first place? Wasn't it an equally high step from the Etch-a-Sketch to the TTY? Man, some of us have to learn a new programming language every six months just to keep up with work - and we do it without nearly as much fussing as people do because they had to poke around menus for five minutes and investigate everything. Please, I'm BEGGING you, STICK to Photoshop!
There aren't any shape tools,
right_click->Filter->Render->gfig
changing size of the brush isn't strait-forward (it isn't visible to new users).
Double-click on the little brush box, the same way you double-click on the colors and gradients.
An advice to the GIMP creators would definately be to make it more user friendly towards newcommers and improve startup time. Another thing is the much questioned window-hell they have. I am one of those users who just hate it. I know there are plugins for this, but they are unstable and extremely bad quality (i've tried).
I *LOVE* the floating palettes! I got sick and tired of monolithic one-window apps back in Windows. With Gimp, I can open/close whatever I need open at the time (improving speed during edit-time), resize and move them where I need relative to the canvas, and if you hate the windows so much, just minimize them *all* except the canvas and right-click to pick your tools from the menu that pops up from the canvas itself! *I* think everybody who doesn't like it owes Gimp developers an ass-kissing. Sure, it's challenging to learn how to do the first time. By this logic, we should all be crawling on all fours and crapping in diapers.
Without an entire virtual desktop to work on, the GIMP is a drag to work with, since minimizing it takes ages wasting productivity time.
Ctrl-F[1-4] to a differnet virtual desktop, a feature supported in all Linux OSes "out-of-the-box", which is the NATIVE ENVIRONMENT OF A GNU PROGRAM - duh! Should I go over to the Macromedia site and demand that they shut down development just because Macromedia doesn't run on Linux?
And how much does Adobe pay you people to post this SHIT??? All this from the people who brought us the documant-reading-interface that forces you to use a stupid little white hand to drag the page around and whose format is a Gordian Knot to translate into any other text file format.
Still only 8 bits per channel? This means it is /still/ next to useless for serious photo manipulation.
Every other aspect of the GIMP is brilliant and very usable, but being locked into 24bpp RGB is a show-stopper for my line of work.
Honestly, it's not that hard to do. CinePaint (aka FilmGIMP) has had this feature for quite some time now. What's the holdup? Plugin limitaitons?
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Granted, I usually do this in CAD, but what I do there is to draw two circles with the radius you want at two of the points, and then the center of the circle you really want will be one of the two intersection points of those circles. From there, use that as your center, draw in your circle and erase the other two circles used in that construction.
r clefrom3/
Now, if you don't know which radius is required for that (ugh!), you may have to do a bit of math:
http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/~pbourke/geometry/ci
And yes, it is a pain in the ass.
Call me crazy, but I have to make rectangular selections a LOT more often than I do this SOIX stuff...
Frankly, I'd like to see them keep adding all the features they can, although I do wish that some of them were more "discoverable"--I certainly didn't realize how much was hidden behind the ctrl, alt & shift keys at first...
http://www.blackfiveservices.co.uk/separate.shtml
But have they fixed the horrible multi-window interface?
Gimp hard to use? I'd like to disagree. I tried to use Photoshop, but found that it was unintuitive, difficult to use, provided very poor help files, and it's UI sucked. No, it blowed. I tried GIMP and boy, it was a breath of fresh air. I love working with the GIMP, it's a joy, not a frustration [like Photoshop is]. Oh, and Photoshop is very much overpiced. I'm pretty sure, that part of your argument is because YOU are used to the Photoshop way of doing things, and because the GIMP doesn't do it the Photoshop way, you're now bitching about it. Tough shit. There's nothing saying the Photoshop way is the right way. For me, it certainly wasn't. I believe that the GIMP's UI is fine. What it does need is 32 bit support, and CMYK. If it can get those two things, then it'll start to attract more Photoshop users. These should be at the top of the list for the GIMP developers imho.
Dave
Slashdot can go and get fucked.
Ya fuckin loser, GIMP is crap, face the truth and stop whining ya asswipe
A lot of the higher ranked posts here is about comparing The GIMP with Photoshop in one way or another. Why not just rejoice that one of the major Free GNU-tools out there has been released in a hopefully enhanced version? What if all those people shouting about bad usability could channel all that pessimism towards writing feature requests and suggestions to make usability higher?
Man GTK sucks, looks like crap. Gimp is a cool software, but it still has bugs (i.e. crashes in Windows in any case...crash on save??)
The parent directly answers the question that was asked. Consequently, it is modded -1 Off-topic.
Ah, slashdot. Where any idiot can moderate. And does, as we see here. You gotta love it.
<meta>Not that any improvement to slashdot is even imaginable...</meta>
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Gimp improvements are a waste of time until they fix the pathetic 8 bit limitation. Jesus. This isn't even worth a point release.