Gmail Becomes Google Mail in the UK

akadruid writes "As of today, UK Gmail users are seeing 'Google Mail' at the top of their Gmail accounts, and Google is warning they may lose their '@gmail.com' addresses in the future. All new signups from the UK will be assigned '@googlemail.com' addresses, and existing accounts will be able to use either domain for now. Gmail's help pages explain this is related to their ongoing dispute regarding the Gmail trademark."

Comments

FAQ-ing confusing

[eyeoftheidol]

Anyone else confused by the FAQ? Q4 and Q5 are the same ("What if I'm a UK user who already has a Gmail address?") but the answer is different! Am I missing something? ....

Re:FAQ-ing confusing

[bedroll]

Q4:

What if I'm a UK user who already has a Gmail address? Will that address ever change?
Unfortunately, we don't know. We would love to say that your address will always remain the same. But the trademark issue is still unsettled, and unfortunately, we cannot predict what the other party or the courts might do here. You can always use your same username with an @googlemail.com address to avoid this issue later on. But trust that we will do the best we can to make sure your email address won't ever have to change.

Translation: They cannot guarantee that your address won't change if you have an existing account and are allowed to continue using the gmail.com domain.

Q5:

What if I'm a UK user who already has a Gmail address? Will I also need to change that address?
No, this change doesn't affect existing Gmail addresses. For now, our plan is only to issue @googlemail.com addresses to new users. Trust that we will do the best we can to offer all our users a reliable and consistent email experience.

Translation: You don't need to change your address right now if you have an existing account that is allowed to use the gmail.com domain. New accounts will not be issued gmail.com email addresses, in favor of googlemail.com.

They are very close, but there's just enough difference to make them both valuable questions and answers.

I work internationally

[danormsby]

So I can pretend I'm not from the UK to avoid the issue? Sure I registered in the UK but I work all over the world. I'm working in Sweden this week. If I leave a proxy running out here and connect through that will I keep my gmail address?

I didn't know Google even kept a geographical address for my gmail account. Doesn't appear when I search for it!

Re:I work internationally

[FinestLittleSpace]

if you already have one you don't 'lose' the address. I'm a UK user and it's still @gmail.com ....

I am worried that they may be forced to change ALL addresses to googlemail thjough..

Re:I work internationally

[geoffspear]

Unless a UK court issues a decision against Google that also requires everyone else in the world to switch from the current DNS system to one that will easily allow Google to own the "gmail.com" domain everywhere except the UK and someone else to use it inside the UK, then yes, having them stop using the domain in the UK will probably mean they stop using it everywhere.

I imagine the change now in the UK has a lot more to do with their right to market their service in the UK as "Gmail", rather than any anticipated future technical problems with using "gmail" in their URL.

On the other hand, it's been quite some time since they started redirecting any web traffic from gmail.com to mail.google.com, so it is possible they're expecting to lose the domain altogether. But if so, it seems foolish to keep giving non-UK users new gmail.com addresses.

Re:I work internationally

[itsme1234]

They're been doing this redirection for a long time now, the reason is that they can give you a "google.com" cookie and track you accross services (for better or worse).

Article to the original lawsuit

[Augusto]

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/legal/0,39020651, 39218121,00.htm

It seems they already did this for Germany too, didn't know that.

Re:Article to the original lawsuit

[k3s]

Why doesn't google switch from Gmail to Gmail.com?

Similar to Open Office and OpenOffice.org.

Quick!

[semaj]

Someone from the US login to my account so they don't think I'm in the UK!

Username: semaj
Password: onlyjoking

Seriously: I wonder what criteria they'll use to decide if someone is "in" the UK or not?

Re:Quick!

[Mantees de Tara]

To the Author: please delete this comment. I am working in a IT support phone service and I am currently being flooded by request of "why semaj email doesn't work on my computer"

IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[grandmofftarkin]

They were using it for a web-mail application targetted at investors in currency derivatives. Since that was 3 years ago and they have a business around it I would hardly call them freeloaders.

Google should have checked this stuff out before rolling aout the name around the world.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[Threni]

> Google should have checked this stuff out before rolling aout the name around the
> world.

They're not rolling it out - Gmail is still in beta.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[SimilarityEngine]

According to the BBC IIIR did not already own the TM before Google announced their version of Gmail:

After Google announced its Gmail plans in spring 2004, IIIR rushed to register the Gmail trademark with Ohim, the European Union's trademark office, and the US Patent and Trademark Office.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[jschrod]

They owned the trademark, but did not register it before.

There is the difference between TM and (r), you know?

I have several projects where I haven't bothered to register any trademark for. If a giant like Google or Yahoo would announce a project with the same name, I would be quick to register my existing trademark, too. After all, they exist and are established and I don't want to loose them. Every business would do so, everything else would be neglection.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[fabs64]

Yes because checking that there is no trademark violations for EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD is completely feasible.

Welcome to the Internet, sometimes things here are grey.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[SimilarityEngine]

There is the difference between TM and (r), you know?

You're right, of course. I really wanted to respond to the statement that Google were at fault for not checking for already-existing trademarks. I could be wrong - please correct me if so - but it must be trickier to check for unregistered trademarks.

I'm not saying Google should get their own way, but it may not be entirely their fault that this situation arose.

Re:IIIR used the gmail name since 2002

[Peyna]

Owning and registering a trademark are two different things.

You "own" a trademark as soon as you use it in commerce. You register it to gain certain other rights, including a presumption of validity in a lawsuit. But, the basic test is first to use, not first to register.

It's nice to see this

[Kawahee]

As much as I think people are going to hate it and find it inconvenient, it's nice to see Google handling this without any backstabbing and lawyers and the like. Unlike Microsoft which is going to muscle the "Windows Vista" name through IPO despite the fact that "Vista Windows" and "Vista Blinds" already have a very similiar name registered, and their office is just down the adjoining road from 1 Microsoft Way.

Hmmm...

[jolyonr]

I hear they wanted 25 million GBP (over $40 million) for the gmail name in the UK.

Did they trademark 'BlackMail' too?

Jolyon

Re:Hmmm...

[Astatine210]

Maybe someone had patented "Checking whether someone had trademarked a name before you use it" and was asking for £26m before Google could use it.

Re:Hmmm...

[EnsilZah]

No, i believe that's an open standard.

Re:Hmmm...

[MacGod]

Did they trademark 'BlackMail' too?

Hey! We call that "AfricanAmericanMail" now, you insensitive clod!

Gmail Notifier got too much?

[Spitfire15]

I just went onto Firefox this morning and found out, that it needed an update. I installed it, and just got me loads of mail messages, which were already read. Ouch! I said. So I found out that UK users have a different address than their usual one.

So much for

[w.p.richardson]

"Archive, don't delete"...

Kind of a moot point when you lose the email address.

Do no evil, and ignore the courts

[Umuri]

Google obviously thinks they are going to win this case or else wouldn't they want to extend googlemail to all sections of the globe? I mean aren't trademarks protected internationally, so someone couldn't just make mickey mouse entertainment somewhere in china? All in all i think it's nothing to worry about, the UK's court systems are a TAD more sane when dealing with common sense issues....

Re:Do no evil, and ignore the courts

[FinestLittleSpace]

AFAIK, you have to register them for each different country 1 by one, but you CAN do blanket policies. something like that...

Re:Do no evil, and ignore the courts

[Motherfucking Shit]

Google obviously thinks they are going to win this case or else wouldn't they want to extend googlemail to all sections of the globe?

They've already done so. Email sent to username@googlemail.com will be delivered to username@gmail.com, regardless of where the account owner lives. If you have an existing GMail account, try sending yourself an email at username@googlemail.com. You'll get the message.

Anyone who's still unconvinced that this is fully transparent,

dig mx gmail.com
dig mx googlemail.com

Re:Do no evil, and ignore the courts

[tehshen]

If you have an existing GMail account, try sending yourself an email at username@googlemail.com. You'll get the message.

Keep quiet about it, I'm trying to get people to buy all the new special GoogleMail invites I have

gmail - googlemail gateway?

[Dan East]

Couldn't they keep the gmail.com addresses, and simply require the users to access them via googlemail.com? So all the UK user would see is someone@googlemail.com, although anyone could still email them them as someone@gmail.com.

If so this isn't nearly as big an issue at it would seem.

Dan East

What are they doing with the trademark?

[ModernGeek]

What I want to know is what the other party is doing with their trademark. If they built an email service, and had millions of people relying on it, I'd understand, but if the trademark owner isn't doing anything with the name, I'd say give it to google. I hope the court takes into consideration the confusion this will bring to all these people with email addresses, and takes a look at the few, if any people who are currently confused because of the original trademark holder.

Abbreviation

[notthe9]

I really don't see why the gmail.com URL cannot just be an abbreviation of the name of the service: Google Mail. If this company wanted gmail.com, they should have bought it. They did not, leaving it up to any kind of service to legally use it with their own, non-infringing service.

Re:Abbreviation

[Comboman]

If this company wanted gmail.com, they should have bought it.

They're only operating in the UK so they bought http://www.gmail.co.uk/ instead (before google bought gmail.com). One of the biggest problems with the current DNS system is that if you register http://www.nasa.gov/ it doesn't stop someone else from buying http://www.nasa.net/, http://www.nasa.com/, http://www.nasa.org/, or whatever. Time to get rid of top level domains altogether.

Is Google String in the pipeline???

[jkrise]

Time to trademark G-string...
-

Re:Is Google String in the pipeline???

[hotdiggitydawg]

Personally, I'm looking to see if there's a trademark for G-Spot, but if it exists I can't find it...

links and background info

[cyclomedia]

quick google search (heh) turned up this:

http://www.internetnews.com/bus-news/article.php/3 394361

suggesting that a bunch of people attempted to register gmail as a trademark at the same time back in march/april 2004, including google who were a bit slow off the bat. this applies in the US and i assume it's been resolved, anybody?

as for the uk this guardian article

http://technology.guardian.co.uk/online/news/0,125 97,1568223,00.html?gusrc=rss

suggests that the company registered it waaaay back in 2002, therefore not qualifying for bandwaggoning and actually probably having a legit claim.

No problem at all (for now)

[xtracto]

I read the article from BBC news before this morning. It seems they have lost against IIIR, who wanted an "exorbitant quantity of money" for the name.

And so, this change is the second one (after they changed the name in Germany). It seems this company (IIIR) thought of a "great" plan to make money uh?

Anyway, from the article and Gmail site, current users do not have anything to fear, and of course you can always change your country location when you sign up and get an actual gmail account.

On a side note, I guess 90% of pepople on slashdot already knew that, as they certainly have gmail...

Re:I hate these freeloaders

[bodger_uk]

Any large corporation would / should search before they use a name. Given that the German company had a TM registration application in 2000 and the UK company has been providing service under that name since 99 then opportunism does not come into it. It is likely that they raised objections as soon as Google launched their service but it has only just come to a head and been made public. Maybe if Google had used a well known search engine before launch it would have shown the name already in use.

Re:I hate these freeloaders

[gilesparsons]

I don't think they're trying to cash in; rather, they registered the name a couple of years before google started using it, and it would have been far more sensible for google to examine the international legal status of the trademark before launching it. the guardian ran a story about it a month ago: http://media.guardian.co.uk/site/story/0,14173,156 8222,00.html?gusrc=rss

branded addresses

[Anonymous Coward]

If google would offer a branded email address service, they could stand to make a lot of money. I.E., I would like to see them offer email service for mycompanyurl.com. MX records would have to point to google servers, addresses get masqueraded when people send. Presto, I no longer have to maintain any email infrastructure.

Of course, companies with confidentiality/privacy concerns might be loath to adopt this; but for others, it could be great.

Re:branded addresses

[bastardsquadmuzz]

Google already has the option to send mail as if from another address, and almost all mail servers can forward recieved email to a different address. This is exactly what I do -- all my personal mail (*@muzz.co.uk) is sent through sendmail to my google address, and all outgoing mail is re-written with my personal address. For how to do this, see

http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answe r=20616&topic=1571

Thankfully...

[cianduffy]

Google understands the difference between the UK and Ireland, meaning I get to keep a gmail.com addy even if the UK is made go to googlemail.com

Unlike Microsoft, who now offer you a hotmail.co.uk adress if you say you're in Ireland.

No more changing your email

[alexo]

> I'd hate to have to go to all the websites I visit and change my stored address AGAIN...
> when this time I wouldn't be getting anything new for all the bother

Given the rock bottom prices of domain names nowadays, you should never have to change your email address again.

Re:No more changing your email

[dema]

I think spam will likely fill any e-mail address I get...

That's why you get a domain and create/delete as many emails as you please. I have one primary email that is almost entirely spam free and two or three others that I use when I sign up for "shady" stuff. Not to mention the probably 50 or so I've created and deleted for one time use (:

Re:No more changing your email

[Armour Hotdog]

If you don't want to bother creating/deleting emails in your own domain (or for those without personal domains), I've found these services to be very useful for this sort of thing:

http://www.spamgourmet.com/
http://www.sneakemail.com/
http://www.mailinator.com/

Re:No more changing your email

[MyTwoCentsWorth]

That would be a false statement. Yahoo does NOT require you to buy any other services in order to buy a domain at 2.99 /yr. I just checked and I could complete a full 5-year domain registration for $14.95.
So, do you work for GoDaddy or just volunteer for them ?
Happy Posting.

Re:No more changing your email

[Tinidril]

This has been a great strategy for me. I have my own domain that forwards to my gmail account, and google now allows me to send mail using the gmail interface from whatever email address I choose. (As long as I can recieve mail sent to that address.) My domain is hosted at mydomain.com which has free dns hosting and email forwarding, so its all real easy to manage and costs almost nothing.

The one gotcha is that I had an SPF record to restrict what servers could send email from my domain. When I started sending from google I added "-all a:google.com" to the SPF record and its been working great.

Re:No more changing your email

[AlecC]

I have all my private domains forwarding immediately to GMail. Nobody sees my gmail address, but I use it to read most mail. GMail's spam filter is pretty good, so that, while I get 1-200 spams a day, only about 3-4 make it to the inbox.

For me, the switch to using GMail has been pretty positive. And if I have to change to GoogleMail, I only have to repoint my three private domains.

Re:No more changing your email

[bedroll]

It really sounds like you did one of the following:

1. Used one of the generic addresses that most website administrators have (i.e. webmaster@, administrator@)
2. Forwarded all mail going to your domain to one address (i.e. *@mydomain.com --> my@email.com)
3. Whored your email out to every website that asked for it.

It's my opinion that you have a better chance at avoiding spam by having your own domain. You can set your name in the email to be any random thing you want, so spammers have a much lower chance of figuring it out. More over, you can create new addresses specifically for higher-spam duties. I hardly give out my @mydomain address, especially not to websites, I get no spam and only a few less than welcome newsletters (my laziness, not their fault). However, the webmaster mailbox does get spam, just because any domain will have that happen.

As someone else pointed out, it's not a bad idea just to forward your @mydomain email to a service like gmail. Then you get the benefit of their spam filtration and interface, but you get the added benefit of owning your email address and controlling it. If gmail closes down tomorrow you simply forward to somewhere else.

Switching domain is never good.

[Destoo]

Our email service stays the same no matter what the logo is or what follows the @ symbol. This change lets our team focus their time on continuing to bring you excellent service.

It may not seem like much, but we lost a lot of business when the address @ibm.net switched to @attglobal.net

Same would happen with a change from @gmail.com to anything longer.

Other company has had an email service since 2002

[grandmofftarkin]

They are using it for an email service already and have done since 2002. They don't have millions of users but I don't think that should matter as long as they do (and did) provide a viable email service of the same name.

So, who...

[Vo0k]

Who's that lovely company who dared to stand up against the evil giant? Give us the name and address so we could send them our love!

Re:So, who...

[VJ42]

Here you go: http://www.iirgroup.com/
From the contact page
Independent International Investment Research PLC
Head & Regestered Office
30 City Bussiness centre
St Olav's court
Lower Road
London
SE16 2XB

Email:salesinfo@iirgroup.com
tel: +44(0)20 7232 3090
fax: +44(0)20 7232 3099

Privacy issues?

[zonix]

Hmm. If Google have to give up gmail.com, then whoever gets the domain instead would be able to receive a shit load of people's private e-mails?

z

Re:Privacy issues?

[generic-man]

That's okay. All the really important e-mail has a disclaimer at the bottom noting that it is for the intended recipients only. That makes it illegal for another person to read it. If another person reads it, they have to notify the sender and delete the message.

/me takes tongue out of cheek

Re:Privacy issues?

[fabs64]

Amazingly enough there's not yet a response saying "NO".
Google still own the "gmail.com" domain, whether another company owns the trademark in the UK or not, mail addressed to @gmail.com will still end up at a google server.

Re:Privacy issues?

[generic-man]

If it were on the top, it would occupy the entirety of the preview pane, effectively making the preview pane useless for reading e-mail. Putting the disclaimer on the bottom is every bit as effective and legally-binding as putting it on the top.

@googlemail.com address may be a collector's item

[MCRocker]

If this legal dispute goes Google's way, then they'll probably discontinue the practise of handing out @googlemail.com addresses, but will likely keep existing ones active. As a result, having one of those rare email addresses might actually have some caché amongst the technorati. I'm sure that someone will try to sell an @googlemail.com address for big bucks on eBay.

The trademark registrations

[Rogerborg]

Show Google filing 6 months before anyone else in the UK.

Now, just because they registered first doesn't mean that another company wasn't already using it as a de facto trade mark, but it does occur to me that the value of the mark should be determined by what it was before Google started using it, not what it's worth now. That the other claimant has a total market value of £3.24m ($5.6m) should be an indication that the GMail mark isn't worth "$48m to $64m" as they claim.

I actually prefer @googlemail.com

[Phantasmagoria]

I actually prefer @googlemail.com. Firstly, every time I say @gmail.com over the phone or even in person to someone, half the time they hear @email.com, and I have to repeat myself. Plus, I suspect @googlemail.com will be much easier to remember, since most people I know (who have email) recognize the google name. Since it seems anything to @googlemail.com will be redirected to @gmail.com (or they are the same, whatever), I'll start using @googlemail.com from now on in my documents and conversations.

Will I keep my username?

[mark2003]

Maybe I haven't read this properly but I can't find explicitly stated anywhere that I will be able to keep my username after the change from @gmail to @googlemail - i.e. if I have xyz@gmail.com will they reserve xyz@googlemail.com for me?

I have a really common name and getting a user name that was remotely like my real name was only possible by getting hold of an invite right at the start. I'll be really pissed off if someone else can swipe it. I've tried opening another account with myname@googlemail.com and it is not available - hopefully this indicates that they have reserved it for me.

Re:Will I keep my username?

[Finuvir]

Try sending an email to [yourname]@googlemail.com. You'll receive it in your Gmail inbox. They haven't reserved the name for you; they've already given it to you.

Definition of "in?"

[portscan]

Well that all depends on what the definition of "is" is...

Re:Yep

[TedCheshireAcad]

Granted, whoever wins claim to 'GMail' is going to have some extra SMTP traffic to deal with ;-)

Re:@googlemail.com address may be a collector's it

[Xarius]

Every person with a gmail account has a googlemail.com address anyway.

Some more info

[houghi]

on the Beeb: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4354954.stm

It also tells about Germany where the same situation is happening and Google already lost. Looks as if Google tries to strangle companies out of their rightfull names and they lost.

How would you feel is in the message Google was to be replaced by Microsoft and Gmail by Vista?

Double-edged sword

[pedestrian crossing]

When I signed up for Hotmail, I entered my country as 'Pakistan', since I didn't think it was Microsoft's business what country I'm from/in. Also, I don't live in the country I'm from, so it's pretty much meaningless anyway.

But lo and behold, when Hotmail upped their storage to 250MB, my account stayed at 2.5MB (later upped to 25MB). Why? Because I'm not in the USA. Do you think changing my profile to USA upped the limit? Hint - the answer is not yes.

Yes, I know Hotmail != Gmail, but the point is that initial profile choices can have unintended consequences...

Re:Yep

[ngoy]

More information here http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4354954.stm. The company (International Investment Research) has some stupid button that says gmail on an app, and then decided to get it registered after google came out with gmail. The company is only worth $5.6 Million anyways. I hope google decides to just do a hostile takeover (they are publicly traded on the London Stock Exchange) and then fire the dumbasses and their legal team for being conniving assholes.

Re:I hate these freeloaders

[Armour Hotdog]

Well, as long as you're changing your address anyway, it's the perfect opportunity to switch providers. Given the reviews of Yahoo Mail, I might take the opportunity to switch myself if Google drops the gmail domain.

Re:Yep

[KillerDeathRobot]

And that's why Gmail still says "BETA" at the top.

How on Earth did this get modded insightful? Not only is this just regurgitating the same thing people say every time we talk about Google products on Slashdot, but it doesn't even make sense on this one! Gmail is still in Beta because of trademark disputes? Huh?

GMail users already have GoogleMail!

[jbarr]

You may not realize this, but if you currently have a GMail account, you already have a GoogleMail account. Next time you login to Gmail, append googlemail.com to your username, and it will let you in. Have someone send you an email addressed to your.address@GoogleMail.com instead of your.address@GMail.com, and you will receive it.

So, for those of you who are concerned about losing your coveted gmail address when "switching" to GoogleMail, don't fret. You already have it on GoogleMail!

-Jim
http://gmailtips.com/

Re:Not all lawyers are backstabbing...

[quibbler]

I wear a white hat, not a black pointy one; There's a huge difference between a megacorp "stomping" a little-guy, and a generally good company, stumbling on a obscure little-used trademark in one country; subsequently trying to do the right thing and buy the domain, etc., and being stifled by the greedy little-guy who's suddenly found themselves holding a platinum piece of virtual real estate and wanting to cash in since the domain just went from 1% to 99.5% of their now-great-with-child balance sheet.

My original point was not that we need to enable "stomping" of the little guy, but rather recognize that domain names have very different implications (jurisdiction-ignoring technology) than could the framers of trademark laws have ever predicted.

Google search redirects

[astralbat]

I live in the UK
I've noticed recently that going to http://www.google.com/ redirects me to http://www.google.co.uk/

Handy, but it's a shame I use http://www.google.com/ig/ for which there is no UK local alternative :-(