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Novell Suggests Linux Program Replacements
An anonymous reader writes "As a result of over 14,000 votes since the beginning of January, Adobe Photoshop, Autocad, Dreamweaver, iTunes, and Macromedia Flash are currently the top 5 'most wanted' Windows/MacOS-only applications in Novell's online survey. From comments made by the survey participants, Novell has also listed suggested substitutes for each of the five. What do readers think of these suggestions?"
Because then we linux fans can also churn out web pages that are an eyesore, full of bloat, proprietary ...
Yeah ,,, whatever.
Autocad is, for better or for worse, the standard. Right now, there are no comparable products - its somewhat like suggesting that people use Write instead of Word. For simple stuff, yes, it works just fine (and indeed with just a few enhancements would probably be better than Word for most people). For anything more complex, like most real-world uses of AutoCad (as opposed to folk just doodling around in it), you need a full blown package.
I'm sure there are people running small shops off of [insert your favorite linux cad program here] who can't wait to tell us about them. However, if you're running even a moderate sized shop, you probably need the real thing. Besides, one of the real strengths of ACAD are all of the add ons, like Land Developer Desktop, that you certainly can't get for just any random cad-lite package.
You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
Adobe Photoshop : The Gimp Dreamweaver: Bluefish or Quanta iTunes: Amarok And who wants those annoying flash-images anyway :P
I rm -rf
From the perspective of a home user / small business those may be options - I've not yet experimented with them all. But medium to large architectural and engineering companies usually have a large investment in training, tools, libraries, and licenses that they are unwilling to give up, especially if it means they might lose one micron of functionality or productivity.
I for one would have no problem writing checks to AutoDesk for AutoCAD if it were ported to Linux.
-- "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity." - R.A.H.
Story posted to the general public at 9:35
Site Slashdotted 9:43
Way to go crew !
I wouldn't go as far as saying "GIMP fucking sucks!" I do agree, it is no where near being on par with Adobe Photoshop, but it still is a great piece of FREE software. I can honestly say I am more than impressed with what it has accomplished.
It works great for basic and intermediate graphics, anything above that it can be hit or miss. Especially if you are no familure with it. With Photoshop essentially the standard in graphical applications, having to relearn a program like GIMP just isn't worth it in advanced applications. Plus, I think Photoshop has one of the best UI interface layouts I have ever used, Adobe as a whole is great at that.
In conclusion, GIMP does not "fucking suck", it is just different and has its uses.
No offense, but the Linux community already has thousands of 14-year-olds cranking out helpful information like this -- it hardly seems like Novell needs to join in.
What I'm listening to now on Pandora...
already slashdotted.
Maybe this will work.
But really, the programs suggested have reasonable alternates that I know of (minus autoCAD, since I haven't used that since college).
Photoshop -- gimp
itunes -- there are multiple, but i'm still content with xmms
flash -- HTML web pages. i'm not the only one browsing with flashblock on, for good reason
dreamweaver -- vi & emacs -- nuf said
This is good first step -- I want better apps available on the Linux platform. Personally, I'd like to see a good file manager ported to Linux (comparable to Directory Opus 8). So far, every file manager I've tried are either functional copies of DirOpus 4-5 or that old Norton Dos-app.
Has anyone considered that regular joe soap computer (windows) users might be put off by using software called (The) Gimp. I use it all the time now but before I switched of to linux on my desktop I would have assumed it had somthing to do with a prono site.
Although, Joe Soap: "I went looking online for some porn and I ended up a photo journalist. I'm so confused."
it
I rm -rf
this is so going to be GIMP-vs-Photoshop all over again, with doses of Flash-sucks, Vi-rules, and the usual dose of propietary-app-is-THE-standard and even worse, those OSS-app-must-behave-like-commercial-app trolls, which are the same OSS-doesn't-innovate trolls... for heaven's sake, can't we just have a WEEK without these flamewars? I think it was better when we had a new story every week hailing our new Google overlords...
No problem is insoluble in all conceivable circumstances.
Since the site is down, here's the list:
1) The Gimp
2) Blender
3) vi
4) mpg123
5) libascii
No doubt that Photoshop has some features that GIMP lacks, and that professionals can't do without (CMYK color, higher color depth, etc.). The next generation of GIMP will be based on GEGL (Generic Graphical Library) which will provide the bulk of these features, but it's development has been a bit slow. Lend a hand and we can help bring GIMP on-par with photoshop.
http://www.gegl.org/
Todd
As of the most recent release (yesterday), WINE 0.9.8 has reportedly fixed PS7 to run in Linux (obviously x86 only).
UGS is also porting software. http://www.ugs.com/about_us/press/press.shtml?id=4 367
Personally, I'd like to see SolidWorks ported. Yes, I ditched Acad for solid modelers 12 years ago and would be very reluctant to go back.
The world is made by those who show up for the job.
Novell did the original survey. Desktoplinux.com (a ZD thing, apparently) is suggesting the alternatives.
Linux substitutes for "most wanted" Windows-only software
DesktopLinux.com has reported recently on Novell Inc.'s survey of the "most wanted" Windows/MacOS-only applications among Linux users. As a result of over 14,000 votes and comments that have been registered since the beginning of January, some useful suggestions about good Linux substitutes have come to the fore.
Adobe Photoshop, Autocad, and Macromedia Dreamweaver continue to run 1-2-3 in the balloting, according to the online survey currently in progress on Novell's CoolSolutions community website.
"All the feedback and participation has been great thus far. As the survey continues, I wanted to share some of the suggestions that people have made regarding the top-requested applications. They have been both impressive and helpful," CoolSolutions site editor Scott Morris said.
"The more people we can expose to the survey, the more the independent software vendors (ISVs) will listen," he added. "For right now, there appears to be an abundance of software available that we can use while we are waiting for our favorites to be ported to Linux. Take a look and see if you can't find something that fits your needs."
By a good margin, Adobe Photoshop is the one application that most people want ported to Linux, Morris said. Free and open-source software (FOSS) already available for Linux that have similar feature sets to Photoshop include:
* Pixel Image Editor
* The GIMP
* Krita (Part of Koffice)
* Photoshop also works with WINE
"So, if you're looking to get Photoshop ported to Linux, you might give these suggestions a try [in the meantime]," Morris said.
Many suggestions were listed as replacements for Autodesk AutoCAD, including:
* VariCAD, which has a version specifically designed for SUSE Linux
* LinuxCAD
* arcad
* Cycas
* Synergy
"After checking these applications out a little, some of them look pretty slick. If you need a CAD app, check these out," Morris said.
Macromedia has a couple of applications on this Top 10 Most Requested list, Morris said. Two suggestions for what to use in place of a Linux version of Dreamweaver are:
* Nvu
* Windows Dreamweaver, via WINE
"There were a handful of great suggestions for iTunes (replacements)," Morris said. They include:
* AmaroK
* gtkpod
* Syncpod
* Yamipod
Fifth on the list is Macromedia Flash. "Surprisingly, there are actually a number of useful resources already working on Linux," Morris said. Those are:
* SWF Tools
* KToon
* Blender3D (Available directly from YAST)
* SoftImage|XSI
"There are quite a few people taking advantage of making their opinions known," Morris said. "Let's see how many people we can get to take this survey, so the ISVs will pay attention and start porting their products to Linux."
So it is Novell...ZD is just taking everything and reslicing it with minimal quotation marks. And not linking the original source. *headdesk*
Please, for the love of god, Learn the concept of an MDI.
I have not seen a single OSS (GUI) application which uses this basic interface concept.
I'm sure this is a religious issue, but I've not actually seen the arguments against MDIs.
-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
If Novell want people - especially corporate users - to move to their Linux distribution instead of using MacOS or MS Windows, then yes, identify the things that are blocking them, and then identify alternatives.
If someone says they need to run Adobe Creative Studio (say), you have three choices:
(1) see if it's possible to give them Linux with some combination of open source/Libre software, and have them be as effective. In a corporate environment this will probably involve training.
(2) see if you can get Adobe Creative Suite (or whatever it is they say they need) to run on Linux, either via a system like WINE or by arranging for the software to be ported.
(3) arrange for the corporation to employ someone else.
People's needs and people's beliefs are not the same. It's not sufficient to say "you could actually work in this totally different way with these tools that are totally unknown to you" because that just creates anxiety, nervousness and distrust. You have to be gentler than that.
There's also motivation -- people may perceive it to be easier to get a job using PhotoShop than a job using GIMP (I am not saying whether it is true or not, but only that people may have this belief).
The hardest place to make changes is at the periphery of an organisation - the people who deal with other groups. For example, the person who receives AutoCAD files from external engineering companies, or the person who works with print firms and ad agencies who say "send me the Quark file and the PSDs for your images", or the external copy editor who says "send me the Microsoft Word file and I'll use Word's revision control to mark all the changes", there are a great many examples. You can't generally get outside organisations to change unless you are a major customer and they are a small firm, but when they are using high end CAD packages licensed at $30,000 per user (yes, that's a real figure) and they have spent, say, $150,000 on training in the past three years, they aren't about to change.
Instead, Novell needs to demonstrate that they have a viable platform for a lot of use cases, and it's clear today that for many people that this means running some existing commercial applications. And furthermore that it isn't only about features of those applications, or which is "better".
Liam
Live barefoot!
free engravings/woodcuts
If SVG ever becomes standard, we'll be able to do all the animation we want.
But does a solution involving SVG allow for synchronized audio? For instance, if I wanted to use SVG instead of SWF to make an animated series such as Homestar Runner or Weebl and Bob, would that work?
To me this is kind of funny.
The apps that the most people want are ones that I never use.
On linux I already have IBM WSAD, Eclipse, and the standard dev tools.
I've got Firefox (which I would use on windows if I used it)
I've got Evolution (there is no good Windows equivalent of this)
I've got GAIM so I can use all my IM's in one app
I'm not a graphics person, and I'm really surprised that there are that many of them (so much for photoshop). I don't really do design (so much for autocad) and I'm really surprised there are enough people paying that much money to rank the proggram that high in the survey (unless there are that many pirated versions). As for HTML, the text editor in WSAD or MyEclipse is excellent (everybody knows WYSIWYG editors are evil).
If these are the most desired apps for Linux, then I am very surprised that there aren't more people moving toward it. Seems the apps used 90% of the time by 90% of the population are Web/IM/email. Then again, for typical usage, the OS is really unimportant. Good Web/IM/email apps are available for just about every OS, and I'd bet most consumers probably don't care.
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
And who wants those annoying flash-images anyway
Try telling that to any fan of Homestar Runner, Weebl and Bob, or any other animated series distributed through the web.
This article reminds me of another article which explained why professional Photoshop users don't want to switch to The GIMP.
Besides, the Gimp isn't the only player in town
Which "town"? I'll explain why an important "town" is cross-platform applications that work on both Microsoft Windows and *n?x.
In eleven days (Feb. 27), we'll release the rc1 of KOffice 1.5, with Krita 1.5 in it. And Krita has already cmyk, 16 bit support, lab, raw import and lots of other fun features.
I've read that the transition from Windows to KDE is easier if you migrate users to the apps one at a time before you switch the operating system and desktop environment. For instance, one would replace Paint Shop Pro with GIMP or Krita before replacing Windows and Explorer with KDE and Konqueror. So how well does Krita work on Microsoft Windows?
there are multiple, but i'm still content with xmms
The word content has two meanings. You used it as an adjective meaning happy, but it is also a mass noun meaning works of authorship other than computer programs. So given that xmms lacks iTunes Music Store, do you find the other kind of "content" through iRATE?
flash -- HTML web pages.
Please point me to the HTML version of Homestar Runner.
Photoshop: No substitute is available. Even if we filter out all the whiny bullshit that some of the graphic artist weenies expect (I want all 4000 commercial photoshop plugins too!), we're still left with things that really matter that Gimp can't do. CYMK is the killer feature. And it's apparently nothing that can be hacked in so easily. There are still some usability issues that need to be addressed (though again, some of the weenies will never be happy unless it matched pixel for pixel). There are undoubtedly major issues that a non-photoshop user like myself aren't even aware of. For now we have Gimp, but it is no substitute.
Autocad: No substitute is available. Again, it's a case of all the commercial plugins... if they really make photoshop worthwhile, well, then they basically *ARE* autocad. They make all the difference. This is going to be a tough act to follow, and worse, there are 100 graphic artist wannabees in open source for every engineer wannabe. I'm not familiar with any of those suggested by the article, but I expect they are pretty much to Autocad what Gimp is to photoshop. No real substitutes available.
Dreamweaver: Nvu. It's pretty damn close. It could be Dreamweaver with not an incredible amount of work. But I hope that we don't do that. Mozilla/Firefox aren't just IE, they're better than it is. That's what Nvu should be, or some branch off of it (know it's Mozilla Composer at its core, but is it OSS or proprietary? I never really checked it out). The best part is, that it shares some heritage with Firefox and Thunderbird, and that means in theory, writing plugins for it should be possible. I think that could be really useful in an application like that.
iTunes: Didn't we just see an article about Songbird here recently? The screenshots look pretty slick. Again, based off of mozilla code, I think this could end up being a replacement, even if it isn't yet. Though nothing would ever satisfy the mac weenies, I suspect.
Flash: Inkscape. It's not there yet, animation isn't ready. They're actually trying to design the interface correctly, rather than just imitate all the other animation software we've seen over the years. Also, they do seem to sort of be waiting for software that can view it (for most purposes, this means browsers that support SVG/SMIL). This will probably be every bit as powerful as Flash... there will be those who disagree of course, but who wouldn't have laughed if you'd suggested that mozilla would be the superior of IE in the beginning?
I'm surprised that Rhythmbox didn't make the list of iTunes replacements. It looks like iTunes, it interacts with your iPod in a similar fashion, and it even supports DAAP. Other than the iTMS, it's almost a complete replacement.
-jagWhen all you have is a hammer, everybody looks like a Messiah.
It Flash AUTHORING that is in question here. Do you author those things? If you do, stick with Windows.
You appear not to want an alternative to Flash to exist. Why would you support such a monopoly? Why should an animator outside the United States have to import products from Microsoft, a United States corporation, and Adobe, a United States corporation, just to make an animation?
I really like the GIMP, but I still laid out the coin for Photoshop CS and am getting ready to (behind the curve, I know) pay for the upgrade to CS2. I'm not flush with cash, so I'd love to use the GIMP if it did all that Photoshop does for me and wouldn't cobble up my work-flow (that's a biggie).
Next time you take a Photoshop Tutorial, try to replicate it in the GIMP. Sometimes it's just as easy and other times it's not. It's those other times that keep me on the Photoshop bandwagon.
Oh, by the way, I didn't even have a windows box before taking my photography digital and acquiring Photoshop.
--
As a matter of fact, I am a lawyer. But I play an actor on TV.
Having a look at the CVS repository at Gnome, the last real changes made to any source code was +6 months ago.
Reemi
as a Corporate user, I dont care what the OS is. the TOOL you need is all that matters. Dont go well xxx software is free - most corporations dont care.
All Novell said was here is what the Corps want and thats what you should be going for. A Native version for Linux. - not wine, or here is something that can do it. I have Adobe Creative Suite - Cost like $1000 - just to learn another tool, when i have used it for 5 years.. same for any high end tool.
until everyone gets off that everything for linux MUST be OSS, it will never be 50% of the Corporations. What would happen if Oracle buys MYSQL - and Said you must pay for it now.. every linux person would have a fit.
Sure, Krita will work on Windows one day, and on OS X, too. It doesn't right now. But that's not relevant when when discussing free equivalents to proprietary applications to run on Linux, is it?
So you appear to claim that retraining costs are irrelevant. GIMP has the advantage over Krita that retraining can be performed gradually, applications before desktop environment, and people who have completed retraining to the new desktop environment can exchange files with people who have not. Without a working Krita for Windows, it's not Photoshop keeping me on Windows but instead my knowledge of Photoshop keeping me on Windows and my collection of files in layered formats supported by Photoshop keeping me on Windows.
The fifth, iTunes, is a proprietary DRM package that it would be best to stay away from (although it too, is popular in geekdom).
/.) who have never purchased any music from iTMS and have never had to use a DRMed file. Personally I've only ever bought two, out of a total library of close to 20,000. The Music Store is not iTunes' "killer feature." Ease of use, a basically seamless interface, and tight integration with the iPod are. The new automatic features for subscribing to, downloading, and maintaining Podcasts on an iPod are going to be more important as people realize how cool a thing it is.
If you could make a program which replicated everything that iTunes does, without the iTMS or DRM functions, I think you'd do what 90% of people want.
I know a lot of iPod owners (and I'm sure there are quite a few here on
But replicating the DRM functions isn't necessarily important in terms of coming up with a free alternative to iTunes, it's replicating that useability experience and other features that is.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
Not a word about Visio. If I could find a viable alternative to Visio, I'd drop Windows tomorrow. I already use Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice and a dozen other open-source programs on Windows, as well as on my Linux partition. If I had a good Visio clone on Linux, I could dump Windows and never look back.
And yes, I've tried Dia and all the other Linux diagramming tools. Not even close.
BTW, I like Visio better when it was an independent product. Now that Microsoft owns it, it's becoming bloatware like all the rest of their products. And, of course, they killed file compatibility with earlier versions, as is their style.
Serving your airship needs since 1995.
The point isn't that app X on Linux as "nearly as good" or "as good as" app Y on Windows, it's that, when it comes to hiring, there are people out there who know app Y but not app X.
App X has to be (a) better in some way (to get people to switch) and (b) easy to use by people familiar with app Y (to stop them giving up after 5 minutes).
And there is still no viable solution for video-editing on Linux. Sure, there's cinelerra, but its interface is unintuitive and it crashes frequently. Jashahka crashes, too. I haven't even been able to pull off any editing with it because it crashes all of the time. Now, if Novell can suggest a OSS solution for video-editing, that would be something.
I love NetHack.
Fix. The. UI. Then we can talk features, mmkay?
,always. It's called a CONTEXT menu. Be selective. Present reasonable choices.
Resize selections, please. Not by adding or subtraction, but by dragging, like in All Other Apps(TM).
Not everything on right-click
Resize brushes by pressing buttons, remove limitations - I don't want to create new brushes to get a new size.
And so on. This has nothing to do with imitating photoshop or anything, it's just common sense and removing frustrations. Just because the people who have been developing Gimp since the 90's are able to work *effectively* in it doesn't mean anyone else can.
Others can help fill this list, then someone maybe, maybe dares file a bug or ask the list. Then again, Carol the Dragon *will* bite your head of for it unless one of the others get there first, so wear flame-safe suit.
I remember when I first saw that article on slashdot - I rushed over to vote (If you call opening the link in a new tab "rushing") and what I saw was Quickbooks at the number one spot. I was needless to say hopeful that it would remain there but after a few weeks it started dropping.. Dropping in favor for the likes of iTunes, and Flash, and Dreamweaver...
;-)
The first thing this tells me is that the people who responded most to the survey were of average to below average competency in the world of *nix thus choosing their favorite windows apps instead of seeking out the many superior alternatives that DO exist.
Seriously?? I can understand ACAD and PhotoShop, but I would only recommend the other cruft to my mom... Actually.... I take that back - I wouldn't even recommend them to her.
Dreamweaver, Flash, and iTunes does not a desktop replacement make.. not even close. Those with ACAD and Photoshop in mind had the right idea - professional applications with a relevance to professional users who have no real equivalent in the *nix world as much as some people want to believe they do.
In my own case for example I challenge someone who knows of a good accounting app in the unix world that I can use with similar features to Quickbooks Pro to come forth - I would love to hear it - but I bet I can still list 20 features Quickbooks has that a *nix alternative does not. A general ledger system cannot compete with the complexities that a package like Quickbooks can as simply as it can, all while allowing a basic user to take advantage of them without a huge learning curve. I'm not a CPA and don't think I should have to be in order to effectively use my accounting package or spend FAR more time doing my bills than actually billing and making money.
Quickbooks is the sole reason I have any sort of windows install whatsoever to run my business and it's run via VMware on my laptop which is running Gentoo as it's sole OS, only because it is superior to to the other tools available for my purposes. Quickbooks contains features essential to my businesses accounting needs. This idealogy applies to a number of applications - why use Blender 3D if you can use 3DSMax? Why use GIMP if you can use PhotoShop? If a commercial product can truly outperform it's open brethren because it's had a much longer development cycle and gobs more R&D put into determining what's needed, what's nice, what's fastest, what's required, what interface users feel most comfortable with etc. etc. then why even bother making a business case for the open-source version? It's not whether it's open or closed source - what's driving this idealogy is what software people want to use. They want to use Linux because it's a superior OS to MS Windows, but they want to use applications designed for MS Windows on Linux because they are superior to their open-source pseudo-equivalents.
If Novell is really serious about making Linux the desktop contender it wants - they need to build a base system to support the functionality of ALL applications.. Not just the pretty ones with cute icons and brushed metal GUI's that oh so many 14 year olds love to fill their desktops with... I think WINE is a great start but I also think far more intelligent people than I can come up with a better solution than a poll on Novell's website could ever touch. I think it's safe to say a web-poll is not a legitimate or appropriate data set to study demographics due to it's highly directed audience, and the ability for the pollster to misinterpret which audience he or she has in fact targeted for polling while analyzing that data. I offer my repeated choice of Cowboy Neal anytime that option is available on a slashdot poll as proof...
Wisest is he who knows he does not know.
I can't believe that LinuxCAD was even listed, that program is ten years out of date, and never was any good to begin with. I wasted my $99 on it around 1998 and AFAIK they haven't ever updated it since. They distribute a RPM built for RedHat 5 or something. It was maybe ok ten years ago, but it was never updated and I doubt it even works on modern Linux systems without a slew of compatibility libs.
QCad is my preferred 2D CAD program for Linux right now, and it wasn't even listed. Its nothing super fancy, but it gets the job done, and its a free install.
Microstation or VariCAD are relative unknowns to me, so I can't comment on them personally. I'd like to get Pro/E going, but its a bit beyond my home budget unless they have some kind of non-commercial offering available.
AutoCAD is pretty much a standard in the industry, but I use TurboCAD at home. Its mostly compatible, lots cheaper, and actually a pretty sweet drafting package for the budget-minded home drafter. I guess TurboCAD has a Mac version out, 2D only, but the 3D is really what shines in TurboCAD.
Clickety Click
So, here comes some jet-fuel for your match...
I'm afraid I don't care if GIMP ever gets CMYK (etc, etc). Until they fix that piece of sh*t interface I will never touch it again. It is just plain user-hostile. And it is hostile to both beginner and expert user alike.
Nor does the name do anything for the program -- it sounds like it was named by a bunch of teenaged boys. "heh heh, gimp, get it? heh heh". Quite frankly, the few times I have even mentioned the program to non-techies they always gave me a "is that some sort of porn thing?" look until I explain that the name is an acronym and (more importantly) "that it was named by the geeks that made it". Hardly a ringing endorsement or credibility builder.
Lets face it GIMP has been around for years and the GIMP developers just aren't interested in going mainstream. If they are happy with that, that's great for them (really). I just wish people would stop mentioning it as real alternative for photoshop. It isn't and probably never will be.
Hi there, this is a nice discussion I've been involved in many times. It's very funny to see that Novell proposes such alternatives to the demand of those big apps... I say it's funny mostly for two reasons: the first is that apps such as Photoshop, Autocad, Dreamweaver, Flash are really quality apps. I'm a Linux geek, but I've always been involved in computer graphics for the last twenty years. Now I've tried using Gimp. Ok, it's good, you I can achieve results similar to photoshop in terms of filters, layers, brushes... But it misses all the rest that makes photoshop unique: the careful and well balanced UI design, the web publishing tools (slices, javascript generation) and all those tools that a graphics professional needs: color correction, color libraries and the rest. Gimp can't be a good substitute for a professional, the same way Paint Shop Pro for Windows cannot be like that. Moreover Photoshop is integrated with lots of applications such as the entire Adobe Creative Suite (that if you work in multimedia you surely use 80% of the time). Simalar words may be spent for Autocad, Dreamweaver, Flash and the rest. Then the second reason that makes me laugh about these substitutions is that novell try to persuade people that they can use their linux desktop without feeling in need of the big apps. This is like those sellers in the old west that tried to sell you miracle shirups or magic pills to cure anything. If you are a graphic professional you need Photoshop to work faster, if you are an architect you need Autocad to create projects that are readable by other people and other apps (such as 3dstudio) and if you are a web developer you need macromedia dreamweaver, because I tried the rest and it definitely sucks beacause are just cheap apps, mostly poorly written.
I can change all of my productivity apps to work with my desktop OS.
or...
Maybe I should change my OS to work with my productivity apps?
Let's replace Novel Linux Desktop with Windows!
Much better.
Looking at the list Adobe products make up 40% of the list. I think it would be in their best interest to port these applications. Companies use the excuse that "no body runs linux" as a reason not to port. But clearly If Thats what people want, you should give it to them. I love Gimp, but Its not Photoshop. Photoshop is an INDUSTRY standard. My Fiance' (I can not spell that word to save my life), is a Visual Effects Major at SCAD. She loves using linux for her work, but She has to use windows cause CS2 doesn't work in linux. 7 Works fine, but its 2 versions old. I myself Love Dreamweaver. I also do not think WINE isn't stable enough with these 2 pieces of software to do the trick permanitly. I am a Linux geek like the rest of us. But as much as we love OSS, Commercial software has its place. And its about time, they see Linux is a viable market. Maya and Apple Shake run better in linux than they do in the native OS they were made for. (we have checked.) I am curious what the software industry wants, to enable them to port their software. If you they were to port the top 10 list of software, I know that it would also be easier to switch people. But then again. My arguement for not switching is lack of a standard for installing software such as windows executables. Yes, Industry standard is needed for this debate. end users do not need to learn a million things to do to install and use software. To many people they will argue that this is what makes linux different. But it is also what keeps the general population from trying something different. People do not want to learn to install files they need to use a RPM for this, or ebuild for that, or even to untar a file, configure, make, and install. Thats too much for them. I have rambled on too much. SimonTek
SimonTek
First, we need a coherent set of tools that let peripherals such as smartphones and PDAs sync with Linux calendaring apps as easy as they do with Outlook - something that's as transparent as plugging the device into a USB port and it 'Just Works'(TM) - that will start to make some lukewarm-to-Linux Managers sit up and take note. For the 'interim', we also need a bridge between Outlook and whatever app is being used under Linux - eGroupware (for example) is getting there with Outlook integration, but it still has some very rough edges. Looking at my desktiop needs, the only things that really stop me going 100% Linux are Outlook and Corel Draw. The other things I use regularly in Windows are easily sorted: Firefox FileZilla SecureCRT/PuTTY PSFTP (SFTP batch file transfers) Word Excel PowerPoint Looking at my users' needs there's two problems: 1) A proprietary app written in A Windows dev framework with an SQL server back-end. Our current supplier has no intention of porting to a LAMP (or Java) environment but one other has written a really good alternative using JBoss that works with a MYSQL back-end and they may get our business. 2) A spreadsheet app that copes with Macros and has 100% interoperability with Excel - we have a few complex spreadsheets with some macros and pivot functions which just choke on OpenOffice but without the Excel-specific stuff we couldn't do half the things we need. The other issue, of course, is whatever we do internally, we will always be thrown stuff (docs, spreadsheets etc.) from external sources and will just look plain daft if we cannot handle it, plus we are in a specialist medical care environment and some tools we use (or have demo'd to us) are Windows-based so we'd be at a disadvantage if we were 100% Linux.
AT&ROFLMAO
WTF? Was this a web-developer only "survey". Where are the apps that could really push Linux into new business environments, as opposed to yet another bloated way to make cartoons on a web page...
Gimp doesn't support sane workflows (we _need_ dynamic effect layers!). Krita is promising but still alpha at best. Photoshop does not really run with WINE. The old versions do, not the newest. Running 5 years old versions is not an option.
I've used iTunes very briefly on my father's WinXP machine, and thought it was pretty neat. I then found out about amaroK for Linux and installed it, and have instantly fallen in love with it.
What does iTunes have to offer that amaroK doesn't match?
I'm assuming the online music store would be the biggest one, but what else?
How exactly is XSI a replacement for Flash?
I don't know how exactly a $7000 3D modeling/animation/rendering package is a replacment for flash?
Mental ray (the renderer integrated into XSI) can't even output to SWF, or any vector format for that matter, except for postscript from its contour shaders, which are damn rarely used.
Novell has not thought about any of this stuff at all.
LL
IMO, tools like Dreamweaver are best used by GUI designers to build mock-up which are then sent to development. Having development decide which code to programatically spit out html without a design that's been through an usability assessment is a sure fire way to end up with a fugly and unusable web page.
GNU's Gnash (GPL flashplayer) is being actively developed!
See http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/
Don't most of these run on Linux under Wine/Codeweavers Crossover anyway? http://appdb.winehq.org/
You may want to try the also-mentioned Pixel instead. That one already has both those features you mention. It's not open source though, but shareware.
Donate free food here
Why on earth would one want iTunes when amaroK is available?
"The next generation of GIMP will be based on GEGL (Generic Graphical Library) which will provide the bulk of these features, but it's development has been a bit slow. Lend a hand and we can help bring GIMP on-par with photoshop."
Which shows the downside of the "scratch an itch" development model, as opposed to the reciprocal "work for pay" societies have been built upon. Notice that source code availability nor "a thousand eyes makes bugs shallow" changes the present circumstances for the better.
From TFA (emphasis added):
Ah yes, that's what I really want to do on Linux; run Lotus 1-2-3! :-)
Cool funny t-shirts for geeks, gamers and everyone else
I was interested in checking out a few of the suggestions but they don't have any links, how dumb is that? Without further ado (coralized to attempt avoiding a /.'ing):
Photoshop:
Pixel Image Editor
The GIMP
Krita (Part of Koffice)
Photoshop also works with WINE
AutoCAD:
VariCAD
LinuxCAD
arcad
Cycas
Synergy
Dreamweaver:
Nvu
Windows Dreamweaver, via WINE
iTunes:
AmaroK
gtkpod
Syncpod
Yamipod
Flash:
SWF Tools
KToon
Blender3D
SoftImage|XSI
Getting past lameness filter: Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line. Your comment has too few characters per line.
I dropped Quickbooks in favour of letting a bookkeeper take care of my books, I noticed QB becoming more and more bloated each year and of course they practically force a yearly upgrade on your anyway, which in my case works out to about the same cost as just handing over my books to the bookkeeper and saying "go for it!".
I really doubt QB will ever be ported to Linux, it relies heavily on IE to render its windows, it relies heavily on Outlook Express for sending out invoices (not sure if they fixed that but try using Thunderbird as you default mail application and see what it does to QB).
QB used to be the main reason I stuck to Windows as well, but frustration got the better of me and besides, accounting isn't my cup of tea and more often than not I was months behind in entering anything into Quickbooks.
What does iTunes have to offer that amaroK doesn't match?
Maybe that iTunes doesn't crash continuously?
Seriously, I really like amaroK, but crashes multiple times a day on me... I don't give a whit if it's due to bad MP3s, etc, etc. I want it to just work...
You're forgetting that for 90% of -real- people, Linux is unusable, confuzing, and far too much work. But besides that, yes, I'm sure you are right. Most people don't need advanced professional graphics tools, drafting programs, and all that mumbo jumbo.
This again proves to me that interface and simplicity is key.
http://www.novell.com/coolsolutions/tip/16646.html
This sig kills fascists.
Well... I accept your challenge of finding a replacement for Quickbooks. If you have a small business (under 500 employees or pull's in under 1 million dollars yearly) then try GNUCASH. There is not much complexity in its use.
when it's easy to use. Server capabilities -- no question, Linux is great. It's stable, fast, and is good on memory (well, I've heard bad things about more recent kernels but I digress....).
As far as a desktop OS goes however -- no. There is an elitism about using Linux over Windows where Linux developers and even leaders in the open source movement won't mimic anything Microsoft does -- even if it is particuarlly brilliant.
While I don't find Windows to be that great of an OS, it is still pretty easy to use. Easy to screw up? Sure. But when I can download any program off the web, run a setup.exe file, follow a wizard and see it work, that to me is simplicity. I know Linux zealots will say "oh, what about YUM or APTGET, or UP2DATE"... well folks, sadly to say, sometimes you like to find those little miscellaneous applications that people create for fun, and install them to see what they are all about. Those aren't listed in the repositories, and the fact when I try to use an RPM it's missing eleventy billion dependencies, I realize that my Windows DESKTOP OS is far more useful than a Linux desktop OS will ever hope to be.
Yea, you can have equivalent tools for Linux... but as long as the elitism of Linux stays in place with the 'holier than thou' attitude of development... Linux will remain a server OS, that will be used as the 'the right tool for the given job'. Most intelligent companies use Linux when they see it as a great benefit over Windows, either in cost or stablity (database servers or web servers, what have you).
Hell, even steal ideas from Apple -- they have that idea of just making things 'work' -- specifically when it comes to applications -- down pat. Linux geeks could learn a thing or two from Mac and yes, Windows too.
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
Don't build any applications in .swf and save us all the bother.
he cost of windows and photoshop may seem high to hobbiests, but it's a drop in the bucket compared to what you're gonna pay someone to use it.
.Net environment, or putting the worlds best F1 racer in an average car. Sooner or later, he'll start looking for something else.
I agree here. Last week I had a nice conversation with the graphic designer at our office. The fact we used Macromedia instead of Photoshop was a major turnoff for him.
I've learned something here why Gimp or Macromedia doesn't always do for professionals. For example, can your tool copy layer effects? This is a power feature, very useful when you need to apply that special border effect trice and change it again.
When you're a professional, you want the tools to get things done right, efficient and be proud at your work. Without the tools you won't like it and can't show the world what amazing stuff you can do. It's like putting a php fan in an
The article title says "Novell Suggests Linux Program Replacements"
Unless Novell has been taking a page from Micro$oft, and has aquired Ziff Davis, this is entirely incorrect. If they have taken a page from M$, they really should give it back. That article sucked wind on so many levels it was of low standard even for Ziff Davis.
If I were a Novell executive, I would seriously be looking at firing off a gently worded cease and desist order to Slashdot for associating my company's name with that garbage.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
The debate can rage on regarding Photoshop vs. Gimp but there is a simple fact that remains frequently unspoken. I am a professional graphic artist and I only use Photoshop to do about 10% of my work. The other 90% of my day is spent in InDesign and Illustrator. I need compatibility for the entire Creative Suite. For a professional graphic artist Adobe is God. Without their full support I will never be able to switch my work machine to Linux.
People who go through the hassle of setting up more than one monitor usually like to use them. What good is MDI if the window is stuck on one screen?
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
i was contacted by a macromedia person a little over a year ago about the possibility of dreamewaver on linux. they said they were very interested in it and were not considering making it native but instead were working (or going to work with) with the wine people to make it run perfectly under wine. among their questions, they wanted to know if i'd buy licenses for it for my linux systems if it ran seamlessly through wine.
It costs money, but it's worth it.
Silly me. I would have thought "Score: 0, Flamebait" more appropriate.
"Proprietary" I'll grant you (for Flash, not Dreamweaver).
But "eyesore"? It's a poor workman who blames his tools. If your webpage is an eyesore, it's hardly the fault of the editor you use.
And "full of bloat"? Evidence, please. Sure, Dreamweaver gives you the tools to make bloated stuff if that's what you want. But then, so does vi.
Even experienced software developers have a large rampup period learning its arcane interface
Look, iTunes is not my favorite music app, but "arcane interface"? WTF? (Especially ironic on slashdot, where command-line apps are still given as examples of shining usability...)
iTunes is, IMHO, one of the classic examples of software that actually passes The Mom Test (even my Mom can figure out how to use it without calling me for tech support).
If anything, my complaint is that the UI is *too* dumbed-down, at least for my purposes; some stuff I want to do is either impossible or impractical. But that doesn't make it "arcane" or gives me a "rampup period"!
I actually went to Gnucash because Quicken (not tried Quickbooks) didn't have double entry bookkeeping. I found two problems with Gnucash. One, all the automated tax stuff that Quicken has wasn't there because the program was made originally in Germany and they hadn't got around to doing US tax code stuff. Two, they didn't have a Windows version. :( Other than that, Gnucash was very nice and very simple to use.
It even let me create my own currency after a recompile. At the time, I wanted to record my purchases in FFXI. (Lots of pretty graphs letting me see what I was spending my money on) Being able to create a FFXI Gold -> USD conversion based on the RMT values, I was able to see how much my character was worth in real dollars. That was pretty neat.
By the way, if you've got everything in Quicken files already, GnuCash does import them.
My uses for Autocad were not so extensive, but I used it at work. At home I bought Turbocad, and liked it much better. I tried like hell to get Turbocad to run through wine, but it was too intertwined with Internet explorer, which I believe is the case with later versions of Autocad. (never tried to get that going with wine, but I think doubtful) Have recently tried Briscad, and found it on par with my Autocad needs, but disclaimer here.. I am not an archetect or an engineer, but to draw simple parts it is more than adequate.
waiting for ad.doubleclick.net
MTASC. It is a fast, open source compiler of ActionScript 2.0. You write code, compile it, and straightaway have a SWF file. It runs on Linux, MacOSX and some other odd OS.
Works for me.
I am anarch of all I survey.
Right after posting the parent I visit the xmms-kde site and see that they added Amarok support back in 2004. Now I just have to find out how to use it, as the GUI only telly me about XMMS, Noatun and SMPEG...
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
You're wrong when you say that DPI is ignored on computer screens. While it may not make a difference for images, you can specify a DPI to X, and it will use the information for scaling fonts properly, among other things.
Game! - Where the stick is mightier than the sword!
I saw several years ago that it was available for Unix and Linux. It's as powerful as Autocad for drafting work, though may not have your lisp apps. Bridge people seem to prefer it.
I have to say I read this news item and laughed. Hello, Novell! -- you want Apple to do iTunes for SUSE? ... say, where's my Zen client for the Mac? How about a non-crappy GroupWise client? Where's my OS X SDK? I've gone to four BrainShares and have literally begged Novell to offer more Mac support. And I always hear the same thing from them, "Ooohh ... we feel your pain, but Macs don't have a big enough market share to offer us a compelling business case."
So to my friends at Novell: Welcome to the wonderful world of karma.
I'm an engineer in the construction field. (Electrical P.E.) I was surprised to see one program on the list that can give Autocad a run. It's an update of the Intellicad clone. (Briskin??) They have some of the 'must have' add on's, and a pretty good lisp interpreter too. (Autolisp is the main reason for Autocad's success.) I have used both on the same computer. I'd say they are about 95% compatible. That's better than between some versions of AC, or even the same version with different 'add-on's'. Price looks like it has gone up, it was around $650.00. A few uears ago it was closer to $150.00. At this rate, an Autocad upgrade would not be much more expensive.
I haven't seen ANY FLOSS CAD that I would let someone working for me use. They are all VERY not there yet.
This guy is actually ok. He is not talking about that stupid MDI/SDI thing. If you have read his whole post, you would know that he has some very specific suggestions for UI improvement, and that the suggestions actually make sense.
The problem is that every time somebody mentions GIMP, there is always 1000 idiots coming out of the woodwork and screeming that GIMP should have a windows like MDI interface, and consequently when somebody has an intelligent UI suggestion, nobody even listens.
AccountKiller
We get a truckload of PDF forms from upstairs every day that need to be saved and returned. Give me that capability in Unixland and Windows can pretty much go away for us.
Thanks go out to the IRS, who has unlocked the Save functionality in their 2005 tax forms. That is, you can save forms from your reader. Until I did my taxes last weekend I didn't realize that was possible. I didn't think I'd be thanking the IRS for anything in my lifetime...
What I would like for GIMP is not MDI (in the way it used to be or the way Paint Shop Pro etc do it) but a way or an option to have the toolbars and menus attach to the side/top/whatever of the GIMP window like you get in Firefox, OpenOffice and so on.
So, each window contains its own copy of the toolbar.
Me lost me cookie at the disco.
Taking it a step further, Mac-on-Linux should allow you to have both Quickbooks and Linux at the same time ... today.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Surprised there is so little quality statistical software that will run natively on Linux. I know there's R and PSPP, but I'd really like to see SPSS or even Statistica on Linux.
Having used both itunes (on windows) and amarok, I think the latter is more than a good replacement for the former. It interacts seamlessly with my ipod, does great music recommendations using last.fm whilst you're listening (so you always have an automatic DJ with your taste in music), and is continually being developed and improved (a new version came out last week).
Flash has many basic weaknesses. #1 - when you hover over a flash "thing" you can not see where you will be clicking to, #2 - you can't open a flash click in a new window via shift-click, etc., #3 - you can't copy a flash link into the clipboard (to save or send to someone). Equally annoying, you can't stop flash effects (animated GIFs can be stopped by pressing ESCape). Of all programs that Linux should snub, Flash ranks highest in my books.
I come here for the love
BTW, for those looking at the parent posters' .sig - yes her hosting service is definitely worth a look-see. I'm happy enough with it to use my 8,000th post to say so in a -1 Off-Topic but +1 Informative way, mods be darned :-)
And for those who have .sigs turned off ... shame on you - you're missing a LOT of stuff, not just links to good deals on hosting. Its not all "click on this link and help some jerk get a free iPod".
In reading the article and browsing through many of these threads, there are a few more Window apps that will run under Wine than I saw mentioned. For example, Adobe PhotoShop 6 and 7, iTunes and Dreamweaver MX are guarenteed to run under a commercial release of Wine, CrossOver-Office produced by Codeweavers. Although perhaps not the latest versions of these apps at this time, for those that don't like the native Linux alternatives such as the GIMP, it's a start. Only difference between CXOffice and generic Wine is the commercial version contains various hacks not in the Wine developers source tree so as to assure that the commercial wine *will* run the apps they support.
I use it at work (the full version), I'm am completely not impressed.
In my last job we used Eudora, it was a much better email client than outlook for Windows. Outlook is dreadfully slow, doesn't perform well with large amounts of email, and hangs constantly. If you want to bash email on Linux, there are many better email clients for windows than outlook to use as an example. Bringing up outlook may give people a reason to switch.
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern