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Live Demo CD of Microkernel-Based TUD:OS Released
Norman Feske writes "The OS Group of Technische Universität Dresden (TUD:OS) has released a live demo CD of their custom operating system project. TUD:OS is a microkernel-based operating system targeted at secure and real-time systems. Some highlights of the demo CD include a new approach for securing graphical user interfaces called Nitpicker, multiple L4Linux kernels running at the same time on top of a custom L4 microkernel, a survey on the reuse of device drivers on the TUD:OS platform, native Qt-applications, the DOpE windowing system, games, and a lot more. More information is available at the demo CD website demo.tudos.org. And yes, there are screenshots, too!"
...the DOpE windowing system...
That's all I needed right there. I'm checking this out right now.
This guy's the limit!
so near, and yet so far....
Find Japanese addresses in English on Google Maps Japan: http://diddlefinger.com/
So why do the turn indicators on Mercs and BMWs never work?
It's true I tell you, feller at work's next door neighbour read it in the paper.
Not too shabby lookin. I say we get all these underground OS's together. And overthrow Vista before Microsoft takes over the world. Oh wait, too late...
Truly revolutionary. I can't wait to get this bad ass up and running.
Karma means nothing to me, so suck it...
Besides the (already made) jokes about 'TurdOS', the fact that the last three letters of the name are 'D', 'O' and 'S' might lead people to pronounce it "Two DOS", and think it's a DOS clone like FreeDOS...
With spending like this, exactly what are "conservatives" conserving?
so in debian a package kernel-image*.deb was renamed to linux-kernel*.deb just so that packages netbsd-kernel*.deb, hurd-kernel*.deb or openbsd-kernel*.deb can be added. Now I'm anxious to see plans for including tudos-kernel*.deb in debian.
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#\ @ ? Colonize Mars
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Hurray for TUD:OS! Kudos for actually managing to get a functional but custom operating system into working live-CD form.
The system architecture looks fine and dandy (L4 is a pretty good base microkernel), and I love the capability to make this system perform 9 different scenarios, including running L4Linux for when they lack their own software.
Mazl tov!
Hey the people who are driving them know where they are going. Dont you?
Because Volkswagen nicked them.
Why is HURD still nowhere near finished (as in: ready to be used)?
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
Ok they specify that this "L4Linux" is a modified kernel to allow linux programs to run. Now is it using a virtualiztion layer and running a FULL kernel or is it a PARTIAL kernel that simply provides familliar hooks that the real linux kernel uses.
If it is a Partial kernel do they have plans to include something like Xen to allow for the use of this as a server base and then have linux on top?
Somebody set me strait.
Procrastinating life a way at a rapid rate of speed.
Anyone have a torrent, or has downloaded the ISO and can make one?
This signature is far too complex to have been created by chance.
This kind of thing goes to show that an OS designed for security can provide it without the need for the so called "trusted computing": the user can still have the machine entirely under your own control.. programs can be isolated from each other so that keylogging and other spyware techniques do not work, but the user can still do what the hell he wants with his machine (including tampering with the "secure" applications he is using if he wants to).
Because the people who buy them are assumed rich enough that mere mortals scurry out of their way. Or at least the asshats drive that way.
Because they use Windows CE
HURD was aiming to be a general purpose OS, not a realtime or embedded secure OS. That said, just by looking at its CVS, looks like HURD became undead over a year ago. It's ok, GNU has given us everything else an operating system needs, probably Linux and the BSDs sapped the life & development mindshare out of HURD.
As I was scanning the Slashdot RSS feed, I had a "bite the wax tadpole" moment when I misread the article title as "Live Demo CD of Microkernel-Based TURD:OS Released".
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
...were they able to polish this o/s?
and I always thought that germans are known to have no sense of humor...
sweet, good job guys! Keep it up!
The opportunities seem boundless.
Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
The basic principles around TC are sound (or didn't you notice that IBM is involved?). The problem people have is with the keys, not the cryptological foundations.
"(including tampering with the "secure" applications he is using if he wants to)."
That's assuming the user can be trusted. As I've said repeatedly if you don't like the terms that content is being offered under, then don't have anything to do with it, in any kind of form or fashion. Period! DRM is irrelevent to those who don't possess or have any intention of possessing illegal copyrighted content.
"TUD:OS" is simply an acronym of "Technical University Dresden Operating System". Their computer science department has done amazing work on the l4 microkernel, and continues to release all its code under free licenses, btw.
gopher://cramer.plaintext.cc http://cramer.plaintext.cc:70
They keep having to rewrite it, because the hardware is improving faster than the ability of EMACS to bog it down.
So why do the turn indicators on Mercs and BMWs never work?
Based purely on observation, I'd guess it has something to do with radio interference from the drivers' cell phones.
Old people fall. Young people spring. Rich people summer and winter.
in humorless germany, the os turd you?!
-- Por mais que eu ande no vale das trevas e da morte, meu PowerMac G4 Não Travará!!!
Because they have a built-in right of way (they are expensive enough for that :-P)
I love it, but can't find any documentation on how to get a dhcp network up under linux. Running it via qemu, and it rocks though!
Aside from this, it's true that having a hardware safe for cryptographic private keys (the fritz chip) is sound from a security perspective (while takign control of what the chip will or will not sign away from the user is bad).
The reason I was comparing this TUD OS with TC is that the intel and AMD TC platforms both implement memory curtaining to isolate programs from one another, which this project seems to do quite nicely with a software-only solution.
And let me rebuke this OT but blatantly false line: It is relevant to anyone who has any interest to legally buying content which is sold with DRM restrictions. Even in the best of worlds, where the content sellers play nice, DRM stops me from playing something I bought from company X on anything but the players approved by company X. (iTunes audio files on anything but an iPod?). And if company X goes out of buisness or just decides not to support that format anymore you may be unable to play those files ever again.
And in the real world, companies which can effectively write a different copyright law for each piece of content will use this to their advantage and to the user's disadvantage: to milk more money by selling the same stuff multiple times, and to hinder interoperability in anti-competitive ways.
OMG OMG. This thing runs:
- state-of-the-art applications like xterm.
- latest games like chess and tetris.
Looks like a student project. Otherwise I'd add the slashdot-monkey question about so how is this different from every other OSS project that keeps reinventing the wheel year after year without ever innovating something first.
They have ISOs and vmware configuration files... I have to say, it looks like they want to get the word out. I'll bite soon as I get home and download the puppy... :-)
how about firefox or lynx on it?
I wonder if they're able to load closed-source drivers like nvidia, and have accelerated OpenGL graphics...
at least, there's an interesting relationship: http://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/hurd-l4.html
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-hurd/2006-03 /msg00091.html seems to indicate that the devs are still discussing HURD...
...of course HURD is the Gargantuan Ancient Granddaddy of Cathedral vs Bazaar style development ...
http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/samizdat-respons e.html
GNU:TUD:OS
And what part of "do not have anything to do with" do you not understand? If you have only approved content in your possession (you created or someone else created and said it was OK)? Then DRM is absolutely irrelevent. It's like conplaining about the baggage handling at the airport when you have no intentions of ever setting foot there.
"On the other hand DRM is at most an inconvenience to hackers , pirates and other users of "illegal copyrighted content" . I can't think of one form of copy protection that hasn't been cracked."
The same argument could be leveled towards security in general, and I don't see anyone saying that we should stop doing so.
[js_sebastian (946118)]
"I don't care if they trust me. I'm the one buying the computer and I trust myself to use it however I see fit (and if I break any laws with it I can be tried for it, same as with my kitchen knife if I use it to stab someone)."
Not according to slashdot you're not. Pay attention (or just google for it if you really care about the truth), and see the primary reaction when someone is prosecuted for using their computers to violate the law.
"
The reason I was comparing this TUD OS with TC is that the intel and AMD TC platforms both implement memory curtaining to isolate programs from one another, which this project seems to do quite nicely with a software-only solution."
And has been repeatedly demonstrated, software-only solutions don't work against a determined hacker.
"It is relevant to anyone who has any interest to legally buying content which is sold with DRM restrictions. Even in the best of worlds, where the content sellers play nice, DRM stops me from playing something I bought from company X on anything but the players approved by company X. (iTunes audio files on anything but an iPod?). And if company X goes out of buisness or just decides not to support that format anymore you may be unable to play those files ever again."
Well I'll let someone who's used steam and iTunes show you the reality. I however want to address the simple fact that this whole situation is a demonstration that those who intentionly disrupt society are no one's friend. It sucks to be caught in the crossfire but heapping damnation on those who have legitimate concerns over those things they work hard to bring to us will not make the situation any better. Willfully violation the law will not either and it only leads to an escalation of the situation. Not a resolution.
"And in the real world, companies which can effectively write a different copyright law for each piece of content will use this to their advantage and to the user's disadvantage: to milk more money by selling the same stuff multiple times, and to hinder interoperability in anti-competitive ways."
Since we're addressing the "real world". Why doesn't slashdot dispense with the "us verses them we hate anything organized" attitude? Do you really think that copyright violations happen ONLY to those you choose to hate? The audiance may not like DRM (much as we may not like having to buy locks for our possessions), but as long as others have a "fuck you" attitude towards their fellow citizens, and the middle majority continue to lack the will to use the means that societies provided for change. Well we will get DRM, and all the other baggage.
They should turn the acronym around and call it "OS:TUD". That would avoid most of the issues with the existing name, yet still communicate the same information.
DRM is irrelevent to those who don't possess or have any intention of possessing illegal copyrighted content.
That should read...
"DRM is irrelevent to those who don't possess or have any intention of possessing copyrighted content."
It doesn't matter if it's legal or not, even if I have no intention of buying DRM-protected content legally, DRM restricts what I can do with my own computer. Any even minimally effective DRM scheme will require draconian restrictions. Hardware that only boots cryptographically signed kernels. Kernels that only load cryptographically signed drivers. Access controls based on cryptographically signed applications. Applications that only use cryptographically signed libraries.
It's possible that for all these stages there will be escapes, so that the various secure components will have a way to relinquish their rights and load insecure content so I can still use a media player to play back the recording I made of a class I gave even if I've had to install a patched driver to fix a problem with my computer... but I wouldn't put money down on it.
And you never know what you will need to run. I mean, there's already public material... recordings of town hall meetings and the like... only distributed in proprietary and undocumented streaming formats.
Indeed, a complete fiasco ;-)
8 of 13 people found this answer helpful. Did you?
And what part of "do not have anything to do with" do you not understand? If you have only approved content in your possession (you created or someone else created and said it was OK)? Then DRM is absolutely irrelevent.
You changed the language. You originally wrote "illegal". It's legal for me to rip a CD whether it's protected by Sony's DRM or not. It's legal for me to make a copy of a video, or create a new work of art based on its content. It's legal for me to copy and modify any work that is in my posession.
What's illegal is redistributing it without authorization except as is allowed under fair use.
If the creator wants me to play the work only on alternate tuesdays while showering for no more than 30 minutes at a time, they can implement it in DRM, but that doesn't make it illegal for me to use it in other ways. It's not even illegal for me to download a copy that someone else has already extracted from the DRMed package I purchased so I'm not put to the trouble of muffling my shower and taping it myself. It may be illegal for them to distribute it (though not necessarily, if they were (for example) paying all the appropriate broadcast fees), but it's not illegal to download it.
DRM restricts your rights more than copyright law does, therefore even if you are obeying all the relevant laws DRM is a burden.
First, I had to install proprietary software, mvplayer, to run it.
When I had tudos up and running I tried the qtdemo, but after I browsed the pages descibing how great it was, it wouldn't work. Then I tried the games. Quake wouldn't run, it just gave a bunch of error message trying to setup the video screen, I guess, and then a blinking red-orange ball just set at the "]" prompt and no further keyboard or mouse interaction was functional. Barrage wouldn't allow keyboard or mouse input, so I couldn't run it. I decided not to try Tetris.
I fired the L4Linux and popped up a console box. I could ls the bin, sbin, etc, sys, and dev directories but there was next to nothing in them. "ls" was about all the practical stuff I could do.
I couldn't fire an xwindow client. Even RH5.0 had more power than this puppy.
several of the demos didn't supply a "reboot" option so I had to exit the whole thing, delete the vmware files, except the vmx, and refire wmplayer so I could get the tudos menu again. It's been years since I've run a Linux distro that was this buggy or hard to use.
Oh, the other thing I noticed was that it was slow.
Running with Linux for over 20 years!
"Hardware that only boots cryptographically signed kernels. Kernels that only load cryptographically signed drivers. Access controls based on cryptographically signed applications. Applications that only use cryptographically signed libraries."
Well no. Hardware that can boot anything, BUT can only establish a trust tree for cryptographically signed software. In other words, if you want to build your foundation on something untrustworthy? Then go right ahead.
"It's possible that for all these stages there will be escapes, so that the various secure components will have a way to relinquish their rights and load insecure content so I can still use a media player to play back the recording I made of a class I gave even if I've had to install a patched driver to fix a problem with my computer... but I wouldn't put money down on it."
That would be owner override which is part of the specification. So you don't need money, just reading skills.
"And you never know what you will need to run. I mean, there's already public material... recordings of town hall meetings and the like... only distributed in proprietary and undocumented streaming formats."
Then it's your responsability to ask for them in an open format.
n/t
The good old Vauxhall Vectra isn't much better. I bought one. I tell you, after a year, I still can't get the hang of the indicators. *sigh*
Stick Men
Why did this get moderated as funny? It's a pretty insightful and informative comment.
Your iTMS songs may "degrade" in the sense that your next update to iTunes might disallow burning them to CDs (not because apple is bad, but because they do buisness and if theyhave enough pressure from the **AA's, who knows..). And anyhow you can't play them on any portable player except an iPod. This should be punished by antitrust law IMHO.
OK, if that was just some weird kind of troll, more power to you, I guess. But otherwise, I'm afraid you have to turn in your /. uid and be reissued with a 6-digit one, which is the standard procedure for the poster of a -9, Clueless post.
That or it's Germans not finding it funny. No, silly idea, couldn't be that.
1/3 of jokes get modded OT. If you get the joke, mod 1 in 3 insightful/interesting/underrated to restore karma balance.