Slashdot Mirror
Indian Government Lifts Ban on Blogs
iDope writes "The Department of Telecommunications of the Government of India has lifted the ban on blogs (reported previously on Slashdot) following pressure from the Indian blogger community and the media. Even with the lifting of the ban several bloggers from BloggersCollective are getting ready to file a Public Interest Litigation (PIL) (similar to a Class Action Lawsuit in US) in the Supreme Court of India against the Government censorship of the Internet."
- Steve.
(Yes I am really being named Steve, and the weather here in Bango...r, Maine is wonderful! We in America are overjoyed to be reading this and posting about it on your Slashdot!)
Even though I don't live in India, this is good. I'm all for people saying whatever the hell they want, regardless of any governmental restrictions or intrusions. Now, if only we could get the government off our backs here in the states...
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How about China, with one fifth of the world's population, learns from this and stops censoring their internet, allowing Chinese citizens to fully participate in the online world community?
Ever hear of wikipedia? Anyways, try this link
I really hope /. keeps up on the coverage of this story if it goes to court. It would be quite entertaining to see a govt get it's hat handed to them for strongarming their population.
...against the US Mainstream Media?
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
Good news! Now we can outsource Blogging to India!
If the blogs were illegal, why is the Govt. caving in to such criminal 'blogger' community. This is pandering to the criminals. What next, Pakistan O.K.ing manufacture of C4 by terrorists?
India is on a slippery slope here; today they allow bloggers, tomorrow they got homosexuals burning Indian flags at their weddings to celebrate partial birth evolution.
Obama likes poor people so much, he wants to make more of them.
What we are seeing here is the difference between a democratic government like India (which has things like elected officals eventually accountable to their constituents and thus amenable to influence by public pressure; and an independent judiciary with the power to check the elected officials if they violate the citizenry's fundamental rights), and a state like China.
Democracies can be imperfect; democracies like India can make mistakes, or do things (like this Blog censorship program) which are wrong. But at least in a democracy, there is some kind of mechanism in place that can be used to eventually fix the mistakes and correct the wrongs. China has no mechanisms in place to correct the wrongs of those in power. And so you can wait, but the wrongs are not going to just go away.
All the ISPs had the same technical error? How about a technicality error, by the Indian govt, giving incorrect information out?
If those poor Indian citizens couldn't get their daily supply of Livejournal emo teenagers, I don't know *what* they would have done. Peaceful protests or some-such - oh, wait, they did.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
All things cannot be set right at the same time. Any progress is good.
Hate to burst your anarchist bubble, but the reason the Indian Gov't was concerned about annoyed bloggers was because they COULD VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE if the problem was not fixed. Also note that India, like the USA, has rules against the gov't just sending troops in to kill everyone that annoys them. Think about it, Michael Moore might have had an atomic bomb dropped on his lard ass by now otherwise!
They walk the good talk about public safety, terrorism, etc., but it's always just a ruse to get their foot in the door of censorship. Blocking a blog won't stop the terrorists behind it. Racist speech is only dangerous when it gets the mystique that comes only from being banned by hand-wringing bureaucrats who are open about fearing it.
Repeat after me, censorship is always bad except in the most extreme cases like publishing a how-to FAQ on building a portable nuclear bomb or up-to-date troop movements. Why? Because speech never killed anyone and the fastest way to make the very people who might strengthen an idea interested in hearing more is a legislative or executive attack.
It's a perfect example of why "if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear" is a bad argument. People quickly turn to the "anti-racist/sexist/anti-homosexual/terrorist" state and say, "what are you trying to hide?"
This is certainly good news for the Indians, but I wonder if this will be good for business too. Right now I would guess that China and India are pretty fierce competitors for offshored business from the West. China holds the edge right now in manufacturing, while IT related work seems to be India's forte (I reserve the right to be completely wrong about this). I don't really see manufacturing moving to India any time soon, but I think there is some pressure for more IT to go to China where the workers are increasingly cheaper than those in India as Indian wages increase due to high demand.
But I would guess that the less than free and open society in China coupled with China being looked upon, by the U.S. at least, as a dangerous competitor on the world stage, is putting a brake on IT work freely flowing into China. Seriously, China and the U.S. could be at war tomorrow if Taiwan declared independence. India can play this to their advantage by doing as much as possible to resemble the free and open society that Americans claim to love so much. India is, afterall, the world's largest democracy, so playing the freedom angle isn't too much of a stretch with the right marketing.
I'm not saying that there is any concious orchestration going on. But stories like censoring the internet don't help the image the government probably wants to project, so reversing that can only be to their advantage.
To the making of books there is no end, so let's get started
The indian government took a wrong step there, it's good they reversed the decision.
We're all having to learn how the internet works. Governments, great lumbering beasts that they are, are prone to dumb decisions when it comes to new technology, at least at first.
I wonder what unseen pressure group was responsible for that. Google's blogspot was blocked. Hmm, I do wonder what microsoft were whispering in the ear of indian politicians before the decision.
can snakes even manufacture boots? I mean, the whole insult is just kind of silly. Snakes can BECOME boots, but there is no way they can hand-make boots.
Monstar L
So, the article says that ..
.. the blanket ban on blogspot and typepad was in ERROR ... the ISPs' mistake .. not the big bad govt's.
a) The govt. had infact NOT asked for all blogs to be banned. It was just ISPs being clueluess. Repeat after me
b) The govt. had infact asked for 20 odd blogs and sites to be blocked - these were allegedly trying to incite hatred against certain minority communities, by blaming them for the recent bomb blasts in Mumbai. It was felt that such hate campaigns may lead to a violent reprisal against these communities.
c) While banning said sites may also be an attack of freedom of speech (though I think this is similar to the ban on Nazi propoganda in Germany). it is NOT in the same league as that in China and North Korea.
d) This (and by this, I mean blocking the original 20 sites, not the whole of blogspot, etc) is ALSO different from the US govt's reaction after 9/11. There was no attempt to use temporary public anger to justify aggression, infact quite the opposite - the govt. has tried to defuse such tensions and ensure sanity prevails.
I think you need to use preview, you mispelled worthless!
Plus blogs are usually fairly worthless.
Ahhhhhh, much better
You can be an atheist and still not want to succumb to some weird cross-over sheep disease -- AC
In a previously highly rated post a reader claimed that democracy doesn't guarantee freedom. From a strict standpoint, he's absolutely right. But democracy makes freedom MUCH easier to attain since in general people want freedom and not opression. I think this reversal of the policy nicely illustrates that. As several others have pointed out, contrast this with a country like China where there's no democracy, and the government keeps a tight grip on its citizens. It's like the addage that money doesn't buy happiness, but the corollary is that it makes it whole lot easier.
AccountKiller
Wow, I have never seen a more rhetorical question from a guy who comes from India and is apparently settled in US (visit his website). Somehow I feel that you are one of those millions of Indians in US who feels they care about their country and express it in soulless words. If you were all that concerned, you wouldn't be waving racing flags at Nascar races, but instead be in India and help the poor in that country get education or something goddamit.
If you think this was just about getting some blogs unblocked? This is about government censorship of the Internet (and media in general). It's about freedom to speech. Do you really think overlooking this issue would make India's other problems go away?
I suppose if you want the Public Image Limited edition.....
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
The truth is out there....on the internets!
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
Either people aren't reading the article or are completely oblivious to recent events.
Trains in Mumbai (Bombay) were recently bombed in what many people suspect was an act of Islamist terrorism to further the separation/Islamistization of Kashmir.
The blogs in question were inciting violence against India's muslim population in response to the train attacks. The blocking of these blogs were done to prevent the incitement of retalliatory attacks and to prevent the issue from escalating into an unmanageble situation like what is currently happening in Israel/Lebanon. I for one think this is the only legitimate use of censorship and applaud the Indian government for its foresight and action.
Many people fail to realize that India is not only the world's largest democracy and for the most part has a responsible government. Unfortunately, India too often gets lumped in with the Islamist extremests to the west (of India) or the Communist despots to the east (of India).
dude, you're taking this too personally. I'm here in the U.S. to work & study. Yes, I go to Formula1 (that's not NASCAR stupid!) but that's because I can afford to do so and its a passion. At the same, through my parents back home, I make annual contributions to Indian NGOs. What do you do to help third world countries?
Help a man when he is in trouble and he will remember you when he is in trouble again.
Yeah, or the difference between India and America...
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Even though Govt of India ordered to restore acess to blogspot, The 18 sites that Govt decided to ban is still banned. But for most of those sites & blogs I cant findout reason to block. Still ministry is silent on it. It again the duty of bloggers community to file Right to information Application to know why this ban. The news came on Indian Express Newspaper addresses this issue in some amount. Are Bloggers are happy after removing the threat to their own blogs? If they can block a blog like http://princesskimberley.blogspot.com/ they can block any of the blog site. Is there Govt have a justification for blocking each & every site? why a website talking about dalit nationalism ( i didn't seen any hate content on http://www.dalitstan.org/ ) is blocked in a country that addreses diversities...? so Indian bloggers must move on this way to ask the reasons for the censorship.
Govt of India never banned all blogs. After terrorist attack in Mumbai, 22 sites were ordered to be blocked to prevent communal hatred and riots. The order was misinterpreted by ISPs who blocked blogspot.com (this was just a mistake).
I am against all kind of govt censoring (including this). But this ban should not be compared to one in China. The two are fundamentally different as India is a democracy and Indian Constitution provides freedom of expression. But this ban was not unconstitutional as freedom of expression does not allow one to spread opinions of hatred.
My right hand is broken. Typing one handed all day makes one prone to mistakes. :-P But this is off topic.
You have the right to speak freely using your body, your tools and your property. No law and no politician can change that.
Actually, yes it can. A human being does not have any god-given de-facto right to own property any more than a llama does. It is the law that gives you right to own property, and the law could just as easily take it away.
The only "right" you are born with, the only "right" granted to you by nature, is the right to live, think, and die as you please. Any other "rights" you have are granted by the law and/or society, as seen fit by the community as a whole. If there wasn't law and/or general consensus on those "rights" they would not exist.
Just out of curiosity, do you really believe that his BMI is more significant than his politics?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
does this 'troll' rating mean i'm a humaniod of poor intellect?
Help a man when he is in trouble and he will remember you when he is in trouble again.
You know, I did mod some people, but I'm gonna dump that just so I can say this one word to you.
NO.
Okay, I lied, there are more words. This was a big fubar on the ISP's part, *NOT* the government. Didn't you RTFA? (I actually decided to, for once.)
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Hurray!!
Not really, but then again I believe strongly in the right to say whatever you want to. So I really don't think anything bad should happen to him at all. Kind of like all the people that make satiric drawings of Pres. Bush as a chimp don't actually beleive he is a Simian instead of Homo Sapien and also aren't really trying to insult chimps either.
I never thought India was perfect, but contrast with China or Korea or (insert favorite fascist hell-hole here) where the only response would have been a qucik trip to the local prison. India's gov't surely does pay some attention to the mood of the public.
funny, all i seem to find out there is pr0n
Refer to this comment for some advice.
There is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men. -- Boondock Saints
I have always wondered why people think that God or 'Nature" will come and give them rights. An animal has the right to live until some stronger animal kills it and eats it. In a place like Somalia you have the right to whatever you are strong enough to capture and keep away from everyone else. Modern liberal western society is a "virtual" world where we all decided that everyone has certian rights and then formed various oragnizations to preserve them. Prior to 1865, of what use was the Bill of Rights to a slave? He had the right to be free if he was smart enough and quick enough to escape to the north, otherwise he was PWNED in the most literal sense.
that's the nth time my big mouth has got me into trouble ... now i'm just going to make wise ass remarks about trivial topics.
but since we're in this subject ... what is the total percentage of people in India who actually read blogs? About 2% of the population have access to the Internet in India. I totally agree that "freedom of press" is important, but we don't see that even in the traditional print medium.
I'd say this story is more worthy of /.
Help a man when he is in trouble and he will remember you when he is in trouble again.
Great. Now how about the ban on exporting dahl?
Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
ergo: pr0n is the truth.
Reason why there is hope for the future generation #364:
"I wish my grass was emo so it could cut itself."
You have to bear in mind that this govt is a Left-wing coalition, and so their willingness to resort to things like censorship will be greater.
The center-right political opposition, the Bharatiya Janata Party, have in the past championed laws such as the Prasar Bharati Act to protect independence of the media from arbitrary government censorship, precisely because the Indian Left have a long history of playing these types of games.
That's why the Left favors the notion of big govt at every oppportunity, because they like to use Big Brother tactics on political opponents.
Read here about the State of Emergency which was declared by the Congress Party in 1977 as a stunt to grab absolute power and arrest political opponents.
The Supreme Court struck down the Emergency with their court ruling, and despatched law enforcement personnel to arrest Prime Minister Indira Gandhi, who had re-named her party Congress(I) -- I for Indira.
Ah, yes. A post about censorship in India under an article about censorship in India. Clearly offtopic.
I don't usually complain about moderation, especially that of my own posts, but WTF?
If you feel you must protect your county no matter what it does, why not reply and explain to me how culturally insensitive I am in thinking that censorship sucks.
If, however, the moderator was on crack or just wasted, please accept my apology and enjoy your experience.
In a pure democracy, the government can do whatever it wants, the government being the majority.
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
There was no vote here to reduce government's intrusion -- there was a public outcry and thousands of individuals who were prepared to just violate the law and become criminals. This is what I like to see.
YOU ARE THE LAST PERSON I AM SAYING THIS TO. DEMOCRACY != VOTING. Democracy = the ability for the people to decide their governmental actions. Thus this was an action of democracy, not the free market. Free marketeers really have very little to gain from preventing the censorship of a myspace or blogger website. In fact, they have nothing to gain, no incentive to try and repeal this. None.
Here is proof that voting is irrelevant -- you can change government by demanding that they stop what they are doing. Put yourself forward and refuse to accept their law and their regulations and their restrictions on your inherent rights that all humans are born with regardless of their citizenship. You have the right to speak freely using your body, your tools and your property. No law and no politician can change that.
I'm tempted to "speak freely" by luring you onto my "property", then attacking you with my "tools", and then kicking you with my "body". And you, by principle, should not try and stop me. Anarchy inherently ignores the neighborhood effect or the respect of others' rights.
Good going, Indians. I just returned from a business trip to India back in March, and I also noticed that most Indian entrepreneurs ignore the business regulations, tax requirements and licensing regulations, too. Here's a competitive country that we should be watching very carefully. They might be living in our mansions and driving our leased cars in a few years. I guess they deserve it, they're the ones loaning us the money to splurge.
There are two things wrong with this statement:
1. It's China and Japan lending us the money, not India
2. This once again assumes that the government does nothing and that anarcho-capitalism works. It doesn't. Look at Somalia as an example of an anarcho-capitalistic country.
Derive Politics
Hi,
First, you should not look at the percentage of 1 billion but actual numbers. If 2 million people (or 20 lakhs as we call it) read the blogs, then its lot of people who are affected. Also, you seemed to miss my point. This is not just about blogs. Its a slippery slope when it comes to freedom of press. Yes, blogs are the least influential media and if there is no resistance next will be local cable channel political programs and then governemnt will move up to mainstream news and news papers.
Also I want to state that most of the blogs censored has content and views, that I am dead against. Our news (I belong to a party that supports rationalist viewpoint and is against Hindu fundamentalism) was censored by the last government and this government attepmts to censor the opposing viewpoint. Although I disagree with everything the blog says, I want the opponent to say it as I want to be able to do the same when I am against the ruling party.
I seriously doubt a handful of bloggers, by themselves, mass the raw democratic clout to decide even a close vote. But then, that's not the point. Democratic politics aren't really about elections - elections are just the safety valve. The reality of politics is that the people the ultimate power not just every so often, but continually. (This is true even in a tyrannny. When a misruled people realise their strength, you get a "color revolution".) If the public en masse decide that politicians must, or must not do something, there usually is no choice but to follow along.
Therefore, politics is about "image", because if the public are stirred into anger, they WILL turn the government upside down, even without an election. A few voices calling out "injustice!" can wield power far beyond their weight.
On this rock is all civil rights built!
The point libertarians make is that property and self ownership constitute the least possible coercion of any system. Economic and interpersonal activitiy would be limited by consent, but never by imposition.
Add more freedom, you allow imposition. Take more freedom, and that is an imposition. Libertarian anarchy sits precisely where the curve crosses the zero.
Yes, the dal issue is more important and more stupid that the ban on blogs. If the dal price goes through the roof what will all the Non Resident Indians do? Where will the vegetarians get their protein?
Where is the outrage over that?
All your favorite sites in one place!
http://outlookindia.com/full.asp?fodname=20060720& fname=blogs&sid=1
Numbers don't tell you anything about impact. Recent experience tells us that blogs are one of the best ways in organizing people; consider how blogs disseminated information during the 2004 tsunami, or the Mumbai blasts.
More than mere navel gazing.
PIL is nothing like Class Action. Class Action is mostly for lawyers to make a lot of money while PIL is for the public good, where lawyers and the plaintiff do it because they care.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it