Slashdot Mirror
Brain/Computer Gaming Interface Coming in 2008
An anonymous reader writes "Emotiv Systems today unveiled a brain/computer interface system with a helmet and software applications at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco. The Project Epoc system can move objects based on a gamer's thoughts, reflect facial expressions, and respond to the excitement or calm the gamer mentally exerts, the company said....While Emotiv is not yet ready to announce any partnerships, [they] did say the product will be coming to market in 2008."
Ive seen studies on invasive technology on brain-digital connection, and it works the best, UNLESS it gets infected (often).
Infection in the brain is bad.
Well, how do they plan to hook up the player? Some helmet might work if the user shaves their head..
It'll probably work as well as the Phantom Console (Vaporware).
Some game players will learn to enjoy the 'Force Feedback' electroshock feature!
I can't wait for an 'adult' game to kill someone with a feedback loop of excitement and stimulation. That would be awesome.
I remember a freind who had a Sega Genesis? controller that slipped on your index finger and supposedly moved by thought. What turned out was it was really good at knowing which way you are moving your finger.
Sorry, no links. The only thing I remember about it, it was around 1995-96 and I think I saw an add in gamepro for it.
"When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
Ive saw this on TV 12 years ago. Back then it was VERY slow moving something with your thoughts. Even if it is faster with out physical feedback how accurate can it be? I doubt your going to be racking up the headshots with this.
Libertarian Leaning Political Discussion Forum.
I'll make sure to get one when they're released so I can play Duke Nukem Forever :)
"Don't break my arse, my bargey wargey arse, I don't think my pants would understand..."
If brain implant of microchips can do it in 2005, I'm sure it's trival with a helmet in 2007.
Virtual Betting on Facebook for non-geeks.
Now when you say you cant get a game out of your mind, you'll be right!
Finally, I can smoke crack and play GTA at the same time.
But will it play Duke Nukem Forever?
This sig is false.
a computer-brain interface, now I can finally replace that outdated operating system running on my brain with Linux. ;)
Emotiv Systems plans to target the Chinese pigeon market first, as many of the birds have already had the necessary equipment jammed through their craniums.
Release titles include "GTA: Bread Crust", "Microsoft Flight Simulator 2007: Parked Lexus Alley", and of course the much anticipated "The Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Hideous Chinese Biolab Bay".
Read Pynchon.
You just know it!
Let's do this reverse. The computer working the brain. We'll all turn into MS Bob. But at least with this I can learn perl in my sleep.
What?
Sure beats an ergonomic mouse. But does this mean that I have to get an adapter for my USB bioport?
Bio-ports were made fashionable by the Cronenberg film Existenz btw.
"In the near-future, "eXistenZ" is the newest and greatest gaming experience from designer Allegra Geller (Jennifer Jason Leigh). She meets Ted Pikul (Jude Law), a novice security guard, at a public preview of the new game. eXistenZ is part of an organic gaming system, the main console of which - the MetaFlesh Game-Pod (!) - is a living organism genetically engineered from fertilized amphibian eggs stuffed with synthetic DNA. Players plug directly into the system via their 'bioport' - a fashionable addition to the base of one's spine to enable full sensory interaction with the MetaFlesh system - and the human body is used as the power source for the game pod. When fanatics burst into the preview test and attempt to kill Geller, Pikul is forced into action and escapes with the game designer - setting up a cat-and-mouse chase between the world-famous Geller and her would-be assassins. Whilst on the run, Geller convinces Pikul to have the operation to implant a bioport so that he too can experience the cutting edge of gaming technology. The two of them enter into the game world of eXistenZ where murder and intrigue abound and the boundaries of reality and fantasy are almost impossible to perceive. As they spend more and more time in the system, becoming embroiled in a complex and dangerous game plot, their bodies in the real world are exposed to the forces of the anti-eXistenZalists."
http://www.dso.co.uk/fr0083.htm
brings mind control to games
Sounds scary, doesn't it?
What?
I love the skullcap glove. It's so bad!
... will this work through my tinfoil hat?
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Anecdotally, the system seems to work best with children and others open to believing in their capability, according to Breen.
Sounds like the force. Or Scientology.
"The detection works best when you think about that action in a particular way, repeating that thought pattern," Breen said.
"We have had a number of kids try the equipment, and they often get the best results right away," Breen said. "Part of that is because the kid doesn't have the same kind of barriers as an adult does. Lots of kids can fantasize about moving a cup and believe it."
Adults, on the other hand, are more definitive in their thinking and thus have a barrier to believing that they can do something out of the ordinary, Breen said.
Why wouldn't the more 'definitive' thinking of the adults with the patterns more ingrained be easiest for their detection system to pick up? Or does this magical system only exhibit itself the best in those who exhibit magical thinking.
But thanks for playing and please accept this lovely home version of our game as a parting gift.
Faith: n. -- That human impulse that drives them to steal appliances when the power goes out
Here is their homepage: http://www.emotiv.com/
Looks like they're looking for people to test their brain control devices on...
http://www.gumtree.com.au/sydney/07/8397907.html
Unexpect the expected!
Check out SmartBrainGames
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I think we're getting a bit ahead of ourselves here.
I for one welcome our Borg Overlords. Resistance is futile.
vague pr0n use ideas begin now!
TLF
I do not respond to cowards. Especially anonymous ones.
They are called my hands, and they work very well, thank you.
I've been using a system called bio-feedback that interfaces with the brain through a series of very small electrodes, sometimes as few as 3 (one on the back of each earlobe, and one on either of the hemispheres). It works by displaying your brainwaves in a way which the brain finds easy to understand, and forcing you to enter a certain frame of mind to control the program. This means the treatment is often done in the form of games. The games the treatment uses are usually very simple (for example, one called Space Race forces the user to relax and to concentrate in order to cause one spaceship to speed up and two others to slow down), but with enough electrodes in the right places, and with an (indeterminate to someone outside of the industry by myself, and probably varying from person to person) amount of training, I can see this coming to fruition in the near future. I really don't know whether 2008 is a realistic date, but it is coming, and sooner than a lot of you think. On a related note, the laptop in my therapist's office required that the electrodes enter a box, which output to a parallel connection, which they had to send to a parallel/serial adapter, then to a serial/USB adapter. Needless to say, it took me a while to trace the amalgam of cords sitting on that desk.
I remember DOS games like Red Storm Rising that came with a keyboard overlay because you needed that many different commands. Heck, imagine how much easier it would've been to play games like System Shock if you could've issued commands by thought.
Of course, this could be a problem in The Sims. I can see my wife accidentally screwing up in the game because she briefly thought about cooking dinner or playing with the dog. Of course, if her sims kept accidentally getting it on, then I would have a good signal she was in the mood!
Those damn aliens are trying to take over humankind again using The Game!
If you've never been modded as "flamebait" or "troll," you've never tried to argue a minority viewpoint here!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EXistenZ
It is a odd movie.
What is one of the most important factors in judging the quality of an input device?
The correlation between the users intent, and what actually happens.
If a device cannot do what the user intends at an optimal level, then it is a poor input device, and will be doomed to fail.
At this point in time, we don't have the technology to get a correlation between intent and what happens high enough to use consistently as an input device. When we do, it still will be a long way from the sort of complex controls required in the majority of modern games.
With sufficiently precise brain wave monitoring it should be possible to detect very complex patterns. At the same time the user would 'learn' how to create certain patterns, just like how any person learns how to move their arms or blink. Eventually you could make your avatar run and jump without feeling a twitch in your legs - your brain knows what patterns are needed to make your avatar take actions.
I can imagine this being useful for other things than games in the long run. This, of course, would be the more obvious Neuromancer style future where your control over the computer is almost entirely brain based. Once again, with sufficient resolution in a device like this one you could probably type at the speed you can think. You would be able to give 'voice commands' faster than you can talk. Need to view another object on your screen? Just think about it.
The ramifications would be enormous. What if people could write a book in half the time simply because they were no longer constantly distracted by their own typing? Even further into the future when there is some kind of feedback device, maybe you would be able to 'feel' your way around data, rapidly moving through it at the speed of your thoughts. Perhaps you would ultimately be able to search faster and better than Google.
The "wow" factor for the use of this technology by healthy people to play video games can't be denied (if, in fact, the device works as it says it does). My huge question about this, though, is why if the technology is so good, it hasn't been implemented to help people with neurological abnormalities better control the world around them. I'm sure many a quadriplegic would be ecstatic about the opportunity to control their wheelchair or utilize a mechanical arm to help feed themselves using a helmet and the "power of thought." Instead, it seems like the first application being touted is for video game control? That doesn't make much sense to me - I would think the medical market would be where the money is at AND the population most likely to adopt such a new technology without it having to be 100% accurate all the time.
It makes me wonder if this is just a lot of hot air to get a company's name thrown around in places like Slashdot. Yay! Control video games with your brain! Then why is it researchers at the National Institutes of Health as recently as two years ago still couldn't get a similar technology to work with a level of accuracy greater than that of random chance just to tell whether a person was going to move their right or left arm before the motion actually took place? Oh, and those analyses were done with EEG, which involves the use of a skullcap with 30+ electrical leads stuck directly to a person's scalp with a special electro-conductive gel. I'm sure if that's required to make this "helmet" work, it probably won't go over too well since setting up a clinical EEG skullcap takes upwards of 10 minutes and can be rather painful, depending on how much hair a person has.
So if my brain blue screens while I'm wearing this thing I guess that will give a whole new meaning to the "3 Finger Salute".
/me puckers anus.
On a TV show from the early 90's called "Beyond 2000" there was an episode that showed a lady hooked up to electrodes, controlling a computer character in a 3D environment by thought. I have often wondered where that technology had gone. With as fast as computer technology moves I thought it would have been here well before 15 years. I have Googled for info on that epidsode but can't find any.
If you could reason with religious people, there would be no religious people
did you hear that? that was the sound of thousands of geeks silently orgasming..
No way this is even mildly accurate. It was all-but a breakthrough to do this with exposed brains and ECOG. The Moran lab at Washington University gets 2-3 degrees of freedom from that.
No way they're getting more than 2 even after *long* training periods from EEG without using exotic (and accordingly expensive) components.
The next CounterStrike champion will be an epileptic patient?
...will never be the same!
Maybe the kids have thinner skulls so the signals can get through more easily.
Don't go to a brothel if you want to buy broth
Combine this with the Sony's announcement today that PS3 will have a persistent online "street" where everyone will have an avatar and their own apartment, and it's basically the metaverse. Sweet.
StarCraft 2. Oh to be one with Kerrigan's Swarm again...
These guys are the real deal. I witnessed a prototype demo back in early 2006. In addition to developing an input device, they've also been using the thing to test video games under development: test where players are bored, surprised, learning, etc. Its really exciting stuff!
Doesn't anybody remember the PS2 commercial featuring the "PS9"?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=PLiiUkh_r7U
Please tag the article PS9.
the Brain/Computer interface controls YOU!
Sure beats an ergonomic mouse. But does this mean that I have to get an adapter for my USB bioport?
I crammed a USB cable up my ass one time, seemed to fit pretty well, I think it would be feasible to use that to feed data to it, but don't eat any beans before you play.
Think of the next level: ForceFeedback
Excuse the troll-like subject title above, but if a neuro interface that could actually reflect precise movements and commands had been invented, the company would be running straight to the vastly more lucrative military market long before taking a look at home consoles.
The fact that its coming straight to home consoles suggests that hype and hope will be the products primary market drivers.
My two cents.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
I made a "brainwave joystick" as part of my graduate research in neuro-engineering. http://www.picobay.com/projects/2006/05/controllin g-video-game-with-brain.html
This is not new technology... it's been around for about twenty years now, but about every year or so CNN reports on it like it was just invented yesterday. It does have a high "gee-whiz" factor, but the reality is that the error rate is very high. There are thousands of neuroscientists working on brain computer interfacing at any given moment. What makes you think the first breakthrough is going to be for gaming? A more noble cause is to allow the paralyzed to control wheelchairs with mere thought and that hasn't happened yet (even an error rate of 5% is too high). Systems that are a little more accurate involve implanting electrodes in the brain. Unfortunately, scar tissue slowly surrounds the electrodes and the signals become weaker and weaker. Eventually after about 1 or 2 years the electrodes have to be surgically removed and placed in another location (and the patient has to be re-trained). So despite what the latest "future show" on the Discovery Channel may say, we are still a loooong way off from driving our cars with brain waves.
Exclusions: Does not work on blondes.
[Could... not... resist... I'm a bad, bad person. :-) ]
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
"You mean you have to use your hands? That's like a baby's toy!"
I'm going to the casino. Don't gamble.
Call it lacking an open mind, if you will, but, by the sound of it, it sounds like a lot of work and a heck of a learning curve just to play a game. I thought the game designers were finally learning the idea that some of us just want to play a quick and unchallenging round of a game to relax, rather than have to spend a month just getting past the learning curve.
And the most successful interfaces and peripherals are those who don't require much practice either. Take the mouse for example. I actually made the experiment of taking my 80 year old grandma who's never touched a computer before, and trying to see how she does in a city building game. Within an hour she was using the mouse like a pro, with the sole hurdle of the left and right mouse buttons. I guess with an Apple mouse that would have been easier. Gamepads? Same thing. You can just get one and be comfortable with the thumbstick in no time. Heck, even taking non-gaming things, there's a reason why historically the crossbow was more popular than the much faster firing longbow: any peasant can point and click.
If you will, it's not entirely a matter of believing I'll fail, but a matter of what the heck would be my motivation to put some work in _that_. I can see how someone would be motivated to do that after a stroke, since you mention patients with nerve damage, because, simply put, they can't choose to "play" another RL. But in a game, between one where I have to spend months just learning to use the controls, and one where I can have fun within half an hour, I'll go for the latter every time.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
I don't care about movement, but if I can switch weapons instead of fumbling for keys, I'll be happy.
... Google orders 100,000 units in order to monitor employees thoughts.
The company responded with a statement announcing that the reason was to make sure they were not doing or thinking evil.
THINK IN RUSSIAN?
Sorry, Firefoxhttp://imdb.com/title/tt0083943/ sure did leave some horrible scars...
Biofeedback has been around for a very long time (I remember reading a popular electronics article about mid 1960's) however instead of training your mind to attain a certain "alpha" rhythm relaxed state you need to have to train your brain "waves" to change very quickly if you want to control a game and that is not easy. There is also quite a big difference between connecting finger clips to connecting a head set which may get quite uncomfortable over extended time. Either way you still need to train your mind to do something and this is not remotely like manipulating a keyboard or game-pad, which can be done by just about anyone with hands or manipulating appendages.
I would not be surprised given the state of the US patent department if there is a patent on this even though this methodology is well known and has been around along time. Basically all you have here is a more comfortable?? skull cap and more sensitive selective amplifier. Of course don't forget the software.
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
So buying one when they come out. I really don't care what the cost. I've been wanting one of these for years to play my games.
To master this game, you would need to have an ample amount of Midochlorians in you.
By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes: Open, locks, whoever knocks!
FTFA: "[...] according to Breen."
What? No one is concerned that we have a Mr. Breen in charge of research? Are they sponsored by a company called Black Mesa by any chance?
Its only the beginning ...
Tie two birds together: although they have four wings, they cannot fly. (The blind man)
I guess at the end of the day, most adults have a firm grasp of the laws of physics, It's easier to say to a child "You can move a cup with your mind!" and have the child believe and try doing it, than saying it to an adult and not having them laughing at you because they know it's physically not possible.
while i am gaming. What if the interface picks up a strong one of those thoughts and messes up my game ?
Read radical news here
It would better if they would work on perfecting the brain/mouth interface.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Mind Drive. I've had one of these since 1995.
d driv.htm
http://www.altered-state.com/index2.htm?/mind/min
It's called "biofeedback"
#!/
The idea of an invasive human/computer interface for the transmission of data extends (no pun intended) way back in time before that movie.
Try Neuromancer, Voice Of The Whirlwind, Snow Crash, Syndicate, Deus Ex for starters...
"Brainstorm"
;)
Sooner or later I knew it would happen. Thanks Walken.
--
Mac_8100_G3
Here's one for the tinfoil hats:
Bright flashes can generate epleptic fits in some people's brains.
The frequency, duration and color of the flashes plays a role in whether it will trigger.
An attack would go something like this:
1. During gameplay, game analyses user's brain to see if and how he is susceptible to epleptic fits.
2. Computer game produces bright flash of light on screen according to analysis.
3. Brain/computer interface detects some sort of feedback from brain, feeds it to game.
4. Computer game analyses feedback, determines how and when the next flash will be sent.
5. Goto 2.
Eventually, put spasmic gamer in bathtub with soap and dirty laundry.
I am currently enrolled in a graduate level course on Neurobotics, taught by one of the leading researchers in the field. I can tell you guys right now, that Brain-Machine interface is YEARS away from reaching the point that would make this "mind-reading" helmet feasible. At this point, state of the art research conducted by MIT can barely manage to manipulte an on screen cursor in 4 directions, nothing near the amount of control you would need for video games.
Also, the aforementioned experiement is conducted by inserting probes DIRECTLY onto the brain to measure neuron firing activity, not just with skull surface probes picking up EEG. Even with the probes placed directly onto the brain surface, the complexity of the frequency signals picked up renders decoding a VERY streneous task even for fast fast computers.
For the simple cursor control tasks, the experiment actually maps the subject's desire to move specific muscle groups (arms, hands) and translates that movement into movement for the cursor. In short, the data methods are currently only good enough to pick up on actual muscle movement controls, not potential desire/planning.
The simple term for this technology is Psionics. Avionics is electronics concerning aviation, psionics is mind/machine interface. D&D got it wrong. What they can Psionics should be called Psychogenics. Or we could call it Protoculture. Hehe.
Utilizing the synergization of benchmark e-solutions to pre-workaround action items!