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Standards For Interconnecting Virtual Worlds
Tao Takashi writes "Linden Lab, developers of the popular 3D platform "Second Life" started to think about an open standard for interconnecting virtual worlds. The motivation behind this is to make Second Life more scalable but also to allow connection of other grids not hosted by Linden Lab. The process of defining components and protocols is supposed to be handled completely in the open with community participation. When finished the protocol documentation is supposed to be submitted to standard committees such as IETC, W3C etc.
The discussion has already started on the Second Life wiki and you can also find a first architecture proposal by Linden Lab."
Cool, I'm glad there are some smart people there at Linden Labs. I've been thinking about this for a while now, that there needs to be some group for developing such a protocol. Basically, this standard would encourage people to run their own servers and that's where it would really take off. Give people ownership, and they will run with it. Now all we need are 80 core processors and gigabit wan connections to the house.
I only hope that if they are altruistic enough to see the value in doing this, that they are good enough to make it as open as it should be.
Or else it could end up like this
That would be something to see.
The simple truth is that interstellar distances will not fit into the human imagination
- Douglas Adams
I see huge potential. Imagine the day when the internet itself is just referred to as Second Life, replacing the ubiquous web browser with an SL client, or that SL-only machines are sold...
Or even a way to directly interface with the human mind....
Gibson, you were right.
Karma Whoring for Fun and Profit.
Aye Matey - soon we'll be a sailin our pirate ships o'er the internet! Me crew shall pillage vast new oceans and search for precious booty!
I said no... but I missed and it came out yes.
They have promised to open up the server code for years, the only reason they are doing this now is so they don't get left behind.
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Main_Page
At school we've been taught that VRML is the standard language to define the virtual reality. So I guess Second Life standard would be something similar to it, maybe just an extension to VRML?
Second Life = notagame
After all, look what happened in the Chronicles of Narnia. You get one witch in from one world and let her into another, and all hell breaks loose.
"Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past." -- George Orwell
I wonder if each grid will have it's own currency and economy. Linden would compete to be the most vibrant economy but there would be nothing stopping others from competeing. There could even be free grids like the sandboxes that exist now. Just a thought.
Awesome. This would take Second Life scams to a whole new level.
All your Linden Dollars are belong to us.
I'm not a standards guy neither a game developer, but I'd propose something based on other standards, like XMPP for messaging, connectivity, chat and X3D for virtual world 3D models.
So it goes like this... you pay some premium fee and in effect it signs you up for every MMO out there and pays those fees (from your massive fee), creates a character with that name and as close to appearance as possible on each one of those worlds (reserving names would be problematic), and from the outside framework have portals to each that you enter and play each in windowed mode. And if really ambitious, have some way of coding objects to resemble gear from each one for when you step out of them. Something like that, yes? and then, to top it off, create an exchange rate between wow gold, uo gold, eq gold, linden lucre, tabula rasa credits, dereth pyreal etc etc etc...
"Waste not one watt!" - CZ
I'm glad to see Linden Labs is moving in this direction. Unfortunately, unless they are bringing on help, they don't have the resources to handle all the issues in their main grid (which is what generates their revenue) so I do not see them being able to remotely support this initiative the way most people would expect.
Enter Croquet: http://www.opencroquet.org/index.php/Main_Page
Croquet allows for the creation of multiple, connected worlds through a system of portals and is already finding use in educational scenarios. Oh, and the fact that it is open source doesn't hurt either.
-PS
Given the perennial problems that LL's backend suffers (servers going down under the load of a few dozen avatars, servers going down because someone sneezed, data corruption, awkward-at-best internal scalability...) I'd really prefer to see another group build something from the ground up with this kind of extensibility in mind. Open source is a good step, but the impression that I received when I heard about this months ago, and still get now, is that LL is basically trolling for free geek work.
Global virtual world somehow reminds me "The Matrix"...
Here's what I want to see:
I want to be able to rent property in Second Life (or some other virtual world) and have it "link" to my own server, so that when your avatar enters my house, you (transparently) continue playing on my server, using my bandwidth, CPU and my rules.
That way, the main Second Life grid can handle much more people, while I can decide how much I want to handle. If I'm IBM, I will put up a server farm to handle my advertisement/community events. If I'm a private person, I'll plan for 10 concurrent visitors with enough spare capacity to handle spikes of 20-30.
One way or the other, my virtual home is no longer dependent on Linden Lab's server farm. If Second Life gets overloaded, the visitors in my virtual corner of the virtual world won't suffer. They might even come to me because my place always runs smoothly. Suddenly, there is an interest in upgrading the infrastructure beyond "it must work, mostly".
My place can be small (one house) or large (an entire island). Just like property in SL is already. Sure, the transition will be a bit tricky (at what point exactly are people transfered to a different server, and how do they "see" the content inside/outside?), but that's a technical challenge that is, in principle, not that hard.
In fact, I'd be perfectly happy to have it work the Oblivion way (e.g. you click on the door, you are teleported inside. Windows both ways are faked with textures if at all.)
What is cool about this is that it removes the scarcity of land. I can rent a small house in SL and have an entire world inside. Hey, why not? It's not as if physical laws matter. Sure, Linden will have to adapt their business model, but since the server load isn't theirs anymore, they should not have to worry too much.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
I'd like to be able to go to sleep in one world, and dream I'm in another, only to wake back home when I die in the dream.
And I want to visit worlds where girls who wouldn't date me at home are instead suddenly nyphomaniacs.
--
make install -not war
I worked for http://worlds.com/ back in the mid 1990s (remember the billboards in S.F. and other major cities? What a freekin' JOKE), and we had the basic technology to do this back then. The system included a world builder as part of the product, although it needed at least another year of work to become a real product. The backend also allowed for this, you could link to other servers on different machines. Users of Worlds have been hacking on it to create their own worlds for years (the server really only tracks your location -- the textures and such are served up from HTTP servers, so once you get the server to a location that YOU have created, you can just distribute your world to your friends and serve up the textures). The problem was that the management at the time blew their entire wad on marketing (see above) and other follies, rather in focusing on anything that might be of USE! It was truely frustrating.
I am impressed by the tenacity of the current president -- Worlds.com has gone broke twice and is STILL hanging on and appears to be planning something for this fall (what it is, I have no idea -- I haven't worked there for over six years).
If this is possible in Second Life, how about across other platform games and systems. Wouldn't it be nice to run some of your characters through other maps and worlds?
Why stop there? I'd like to transport my profile, postings and comments between all of the social networking sites. It would also be nice to check all of them from a single page and be able to post/lurk without remembering where I stored the "this thread is useless without pics" icon.
Of course, whomever did this would have some great job opportunities in the Middle East afterwards.
I thought there already was a "3D world" standard.
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
While this is obviously a necessary step in creating the next internet revolution since the world-wide web, I have serious doubts that it will be based upon the Second Life software.
Most likely, the honor for create the virtual internet "world" will come from either an industrial thinktank (AT&T, IBM, etc...), the game industry (EA with an evolved form of The Sims merged with Spore and SimCity) or the porn industry (as a quality product with tons of cash behind it, complete creative freedom and a self-sustaining internal economy).
This rush to start an open protocol for interconnecting these "worlds" is most likely a last-ditch effort to keep Second Life running a couple years longer before it gets completely replaced by a far-superior product. After which, it'll erupt into an all-out patent war between Linden Labs and whoever wins the race for the first globally accepted virtual world system.
In the meanwhile, there are some other pressing issues involved, such as making the tools necessary for creating and managing these virtual worlds (and their respective data/database content) intuitive enough for anyone to use. The open-source community alone probably won't be enough to accomplish this. (Interface design consultants, anyone?)
8==8 Bones 8==8
Moving beyond the proprietary system unique to a single game, there's new initiatives like metaplace.
http://www.metaplace.org/
I think this is more likely than expansion of one world from its custom, proprietary software.
technical writing / development
Last time I read an interview with LL, they said something about 11,000 servers running 2nd life.
Huh?
That would explain the atrocious lag, at least.
Sorry, I'd rather have someone else designing something a bit more...streamlined... if we're going to talking about a web-wide standard.
-Styopa
Can anyone code up a knife that allows me to cut a portal in space-time between two worlds?
"Open the pod by doors, Hal" > "I'm afraid I can't do that, Dave" sudo "Open the pod bay doors, Hal" > alright
They're both already building initiatives. IBM internally and Sun with Project Darkstar.
Or get out into the real world.
It's really kind of exciting all the stuff you can do... surfing, scuba, go to a play, see a movie, visit a museum, ride a horse, visit a cafe, enjoy some new food that you've never tried before, feel the sun in your face, ski, sit and listen to a waterfall.
The imitation world pales in comparison to the real thing. The real thing always has surprises. Staring at a computer screen to imitate life? I... umm.... I think you'd be better off just getting out to the park and reading a book.
Once again, the MMO world grabs ideas from the world of Muds.
UnterMuds did the same thing 15 or so years ago - you could log in to your home Mud, then travel through portals to other Unter-compatible Muds.
(there was a downside - I took one character through a few portals that way, but then got stuck because the Mud I was on went down. Attempting to log in to my "home" Mud didn't work because it tried to forward me on to the next one.)
I agree with you. I think it is more likely that LL want to be in charge of the system which is bad. So I guess they would offer some kind of payment system that requires you to pay them to host a server, followed up by having currency mandated by them.
The thing is SL is for the most part pointless. There is nothing in it that can't be done better in other systems (web, IM, video/voice chat). The system seems to thrive on Furries and prostitution. Previously gambling as well but they banned that.
Great! Now I can open my casino in a more tolerant place.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
We need to get a client-plug in for that.
What I envision is something like this: We have several offices at various places in the world with low-cost labor and good wifi coverage. When you (in Second Life) enter a portal for "Real World(tm)", you pick one of these offices. At this point a hired "avatar" dons a pair of wifi goggles that lets you see what he sees, and gets commands from you to move about in this "Real World", and does so (they will require some minimal training). The offices should be positioned with a number of real world activities nearby such as playgrounds, beaches, bars, etc. You can either type commands that your hired avatar will attempt to say, or use voice chat to have you speak directly to other "Real World" people.
Should your avatar become incapactitated, it will be necessary to get some friends to do a "corpse run" to get the goggles back so you can venture forth again...
awesome!!
"Waste not one watt!" - CZ
Does that mean orcs may visit my house now?
It was a cat herding party of monumental proportions. The first year was the design phase - it was amazing. We found out a need to fix Java so it had distributed garbage collection, closures, and the like. We made our own VM with these add-ons, and invented a world specification language called Pluribus for knitting together object aspects which represented the multi-party nature of distributed awareness.
Like many first attempts at "ontological revolution", the performance was less than spectacular. It didn't take long to build stuff that was beyond our understanding, either. Later, when aspect-oriented programming was invented, and the rest of the world starting thinking about distributed cyberspace, it has become possible to do what we were trying to do then. Even Java has caught up, co-opting most of the add-on features we had to come up with.
My advice to those approaching the problem today:
- Don't reach too far beyond what the average C++/Java programmer can understand.
- Don't invent anything that you can't make-do with that is already out there.
- Plan on getting stuff wrong at the beginning. (E/C released their first product without a version number in the protocol!).
- The start of the art of standards specification is not good enough to deal with this problem. Your only hope lies in producing a "Literate Reference Implementation". Doing that probably requires doing a rough-pass first, then recoding it.
- If you attempt to assemble a "dream team" to put something like this together - be careful about the human-relations stuff. (In our first year, one of our engineers found out he was getting less money then two others and went out on a "passive-aggressive vendetta". This dampened morale during a critical time.)
There is a lot more to say about E/C and its fate. Lets hope it isn't repeated...It was a TV show called ReBoot http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ReBoot/
I thought the term Avatar in the context of multiplayer online games was invented in one of the dungeon style games on the Plato network (Oubliette?) in the late '70s.
This could be interesting if they interconnected with a game like World of Warcraft and put a portal in Shattrath. Then we could like, organize big raid parties, invade 2nd Life and kill everyone in sight.
I suppose their economy could suffer a bit because then people would have to save money for body armor and weapons instead of genitalia, but they could always sell cool stuff like hoof and horn manicures that you can't get in Azeroth. Maybe we could even have interconnected auction houses too. We both win.
Sign me up!
Lu La Ul Gu Hu Ba Be Ge Di Mo Se Co Pi
I can throw myself at the ground, and miss.
He was a verray parfit gentil knight.
I'd like to connect Second Life to my low-sec system in EVE. And greet the new folks visiting EVE from Second Life with a couple Gjallahorns
"I see huge potential. Imagine the day when the internet itself is just referred to as Second Life, replacing the ubiquous web browser with an SL client, or that SL-only machines are sold..."
I see we're close already. Fast broadband, fast consoles and computers, Hi-def monitors and TVs, multiplayer game engines, lessons learned from the past. Now all we need is for someone to put the pieces together in the right combination. Were's Jobs when you need him?
"Or even a way to directly interface with the human mind...."
Feedback loops would be a killer.
Well, that's just great. Now we'll have Chinese people dying from exhaustion after somebody else plays an on-line game for 3 days straight.
Second Life is not a game, but some people do make a game out of it. And I don't mean 'make' as in program or script a virtual game. People called Griefers make a game out of annoying people or crashing the servers. People have scripted objects called followers that follow people around and play an annoying sound loop. You can mute objects, except when they hide inside another object or you are followed by large groups. Of course you can turn off sound, but this also turns off voice chat and the virtual media player. Then there are "trones" or trap cones, that trap specific people inside of them by exploiting an error in the way avatars sit. Trones prevent avatar movement, and the only way to escape them is to teleport out of them into a different parcel. You also can't enter the parcel with the trone in it without getting trapped inside of it again. People have even been able to turn public sandboxes into their own private areas with trones. There used to be countermeasures for trones, but then people scripted counter-countermeasures. Then there are elevators or orbiters which trap inside of them and then shoot up into the sky until they reach the highest altitude achievable in the game. Then you fall down, if your lucky, or get frozen in what is know as "orbit". Then there are object called nukes which deploy incredibly complex objects(very many faces) that replicate out of control and either causes lag or a region crash. A nuke is the virtual equivalent of a DDoS attack and people who use them "usually" get banned. Even if you file an abuse report, the people who run second life, usually do nothing at all. And now someone has found a way to go through the invisible walls that prevent you from entering someone else's private land. So even if you ban someone from the land you own, they can still get in. Clearly something needs to be done about griefers.
Linden Labs have more important things to focus on. Did you know that 25% of all sessions end abnormally (Crashes, loss of connection) according to their own metrics.
They can't even run what they have now let alone having Third-Party server linking into it.
What a disaster.
They've also promised Mono and a newer version of Havok for a long time. All I can say is 'vaporware'
Take NWN 1, make modern and sci-fi skins and textures. Improve the multiplayer functionality. Have a world of doors or portals or some such to interconnect worlds. Allow players to rate worlds in terms of balance and design. Allow players to create and script worlds, they can either host the space themselves or pay to have the owners of the engine host it for them. Perhaps high rated worlds are hosted for free.
Utilizing the synergization of benchmark e-solutions to pre-workaround action items!