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Why Your e-Books Are No Longer Yours
Predictions Market sends us to Gizmodo for an interesting take on the question: when you "buy" "content" for Amazon's Kindle or the Sony Reader, are you buying a crippled license to intellectual property when you download, or are you buying a book? If the latter, then the first sale doctrine, which lets you hawk your old Harry Potter hardcovers on eBay, would apply. Some law students at Columbia took a swing at the question and Gizmodo reprints the "surprisingly readable" legal summary. Short answer: those restrictive licenses may very well be legal, and even if you had rights under the first sale doctrine, you might only be able to resell or give away your Kindle — not a copy of the work.
I think I'll stick with Lessig's opinions and the surprisingly readable US Constitution.
How to sell your copy of Hary Potter only touches on the madness of paper based copyright applied to digital files. If these books are no longer mine, they are no longer the library's either. Do we really want a future where anyone and everyone can be cut off of knowledge at the flip of a switch? Where "owners" must be trusted with the raw material of history? No.
The answer to all this is very simple. The lower cost of publishing should bring lower protections and fewer created rights because fewer incentives are required. Advertising costs have not declined, so it is easier to recoup publishing investments now than ever. Worse for high cost, established publishers technology makes old laws contradictory and insane. Publishers want to make "unwet water" and outlaw the normal stuff by dominating the channels of distribution - the no real library future. We should allow people to make exact copies of almost all works and distribute them freely. It's really that easy and companies that can't live with that kind of freedom should look for a new line of honest work.
Embed advertising in ebooks, the same as in magazines and newspapers, and give the ebooks away.
Advantages
Worked wonders for the music industry, right? How long do you think it would take to hack a "kindle code"?
If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
"Surprisingly readable" because the authors ain't actually lawyers yet.
Last part of url: http%3A//members.on.nimp.org/
Nimp.org link, yet again.
What's happened since is that the creators sold out to corporations and the corporations have been throwing their weight around with our lawmakers. The term of copyright has been extended and re-extended to the point where virtually nothing is entering the public domain anymore. They've even filed (and received) copyrights on things that were previously in the public domain.
Not satisfied with their greedy taking of the public domain, they decided to move on to getting paid multiple times for the same thing. Enter "digital rights management" and such travesties as the DMCA. That effectively puts an end to the first sale doctrine and completes the process of locking up all "intellectual property" (interesting phrase, isn't it?) and completely eliminates any possibility of anything entering the public domain.
The deal was that we'd give them a exclusive right over the works for a limited time in exchange for them releasing the works to the public domain. Our corporate government has eliminated the need for the rights holders to release their works to the public domain, so the deal is broken. They don't deserve their exclusive right over the work either; the deal is broken, remember?
This will all work out in the long term, our corporate masters will do their utmost to spin this into something that's supposedly good for us. But we're not fooled, are we?
Alright, I know "super book" sounds kind of stupid. I can kind of agree with the argument that the Kindle itself acts as one book versus the content within it being individual pieces of work. It's almost the same for the Nintendo Wii's Virtual Console. Technically, you can download different pieces of video game software that originally came from different cartridges (which you see on e-bay) but when it comes down to licenses and what you own, you can't take out bits and pieces of it from your Wii. The entire collection you download is tied to that individual console. It sort of makes each console it's own "super rom". It's an interesting legal argument because... all these works were once sold on their own, individually. It could spark the argument that these books through either my Wii example or Kindle are derivative works and not original publications instead of digitalized reprints... if that makes sense.
It bears repeating: The RIAA, The MPAA and all the other sue-the-customer organizations really really do want to make so that eventually you the consumer have NO RIGHTS, zip, zero, nadda to own anything.
Making everyone pay a fee each and every time they want to listen to or read or view something is their eventual goal.
You will own NOTHING.
You will have NO RIGHTS to view ANYTHING unless you pay their fees.
That IS the eventual goal.
Figure out how to tell this to non-librarians, non-techies
I better get coding on a "AdBook" extension for Magazinilla, then.
Courts have expressly not extended doctrine of first sale to electronic files like mp3's and it would make perfect sense to extend that to ebooks. The thing to remember about first sale doctrine is that you do NOT own the "content" of a book you purchase. If I go out and buy The DaVinci Code I have 0 ownership interest in the story. What I DO have an ownership interest in is the actual physical book and the ink printed in that book. I can go out and resell the book or give it away and there is nothing the copyright owner can do about it (famous early case from 1909 about a publisher that sued Macy's for selling its books below the price the publisher wanted. Copyright had nothing to do with the eventual sale price because first sale doctrine meant the publisher lost control of the physical books after it had made the initial sale, Macy's was not bound by further contractual obligations either).
However, looking at statute there are exceptions to first sale. One is rental of music: Ever notice how you can get a movie from Netflix but not a CD? The same applies to software (with a narrow exception for videogames so places like Gamestop can stay open). This rule goes way back to the '70's & 80's when it was pretty obvious that music "rental" places were just fronts for mass copying of music. You'd go in, rent a record, and there would be blank tapes by the checkout and a wink & a nudge. See Section 109 of the copyright act for more on this.
In the digital age, the same reasoning that applies to the exceptions to first sale doctrine has been extended to digital downloads. Here the actual instantiation of the copy is merely a set of bits sitting on a drive. It is too difficult to be able to make an actual "sale" of the instance when transferring it over the Internet. Before you say "but I delete the file after I send it!", the courts considered that and do not buy the argument. That's why the article notes that selling your entire eBook would count: you are transferring a physical manifestation of the copyrighted material instead of trying to play games with moving bits around.
Where CAN there be limitations on sales of actual physical items: Well, most of the limits in the article have nothing to do with copyright. Instead, they are contractual limitations which you agree to when you purchase the eBook. Copyright gets confused with many other kinds of law, but don't forget once you are in privity (aka you make a deal to buy a book from Amazon) then the contract will likely be much more relevant than generic Copyright law.
Disclaimer: IANAL but I am a 2L in copyright class right now.
AntiFA: An abbreviation for Anti First Amendment.
Just thought this was an opportune time to reference The Right to Read
That sounds like a great way to do things and I'm sure there are many, many others.
What I'm interested in is preserving our rights. Publishers can think of ways to make money without robbing us of the ability to help our neighbor and without assuming draconian control of information. For them to violate our rights, we must agree to be threatened and prosecuted for doing things that are not crimes. It is better to keep them from making laws that threaten us than it is to try to do their job for them.
Publishers already know how things will work in a free society. They are not stupid and this is why they fight so hard. They understand that the broadcast era is over and with it their ability to control opinion and profit from every aspect of popular culture. There will be profits but they will be distributed and much closer to the artist than they are now. The big record companies, movie companies and paper publishers are out of luck and the damage done to public institutions will follow. With freedom comes truth and from truth we can expect justice. Without freedom, expect great injustice.
I have a pattern I follow with digital media. As soon as I pay money for something, I back it up, then crack the working copy. (no matter what the file format, enough digging on the internet will eventually turn up a crack.) As soon as the DRM is rendered moot, that motherfucker is MINE.
irc.nullus.net
Contribute please.
All your E-book are belong to us?
With the VHS tape, we are not so lucky. Though VHS was relatively easy to copy, people want to put you in jail for ripping a DVD. Madness. Waste of police enforcement resources. But people are happy because frankly, in inflation adjusted terms, movies are comparatively cheap now, unless you pay the early adopter fee. In addition, studios add original content to DVDs so it not just the same old stale product.
What I can't understand is how they expect to move towards downloaded movies, that cost more than a DVD and has less content, or ebooks that have nothing but restrictions. It is not that first sale doctrine should necessarily apply. We are not buying a physical product, at least not in most cases. But If I the lowly consumer must give up some flexibility, then so should the publisher
And herein, I believe is the problem. We see overall that publishers are not making equal sacrifices. We here that studios are still charging packaging and return product percentages when there are not packaging or physical product. Likewise newspaper prices have been going up, allegedly, because of the increasing price of paper, ink, and transportation, yet many publishers refuse to leave those expensive relics behind. Evidently those items are not so expensive when compared to the loss of physical ad revenue. The NYT Times want $15 a month for the electronic edition.
So here is the issue we are going to see with E-Books. Cost of a paperback, $8. Cost of an E-Book, $10. Fine, there is a connivence fee, but if I can't resell it, if I can't put it on whatever device I want to use a the moment, I can;t return it the next day, then why the hell am I a paying the same amount for a book? To maintain the luxury corporate offices in New York, Paris, and London. I don't think so. Just like iTMS, Just like the DVD, if you are going to restrict use, give me something in return. For books the logical thing is price. No paper costs, no overstock costs, no shipping costs. I know the publishers are saying, well, a hardback is $30, so we are giving you a 60% discount. But you are not. I could wait a month or two and buy that hardback second hand for $10. Now I can't. The publisher will be getting all the money for every sales. So compromise and don't be the greedy bastards that never learn and put this country on the brink of financial crisis every 40 years of so. Sell the ebooks for $5-8 and I bet that all this will go away. If you are going to create a market where you control everything, be a compassionate fascist and give your peasants a break.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Garage sales sell lots of books for oft near a dime.
I have at least a years backlog built up to read.
If people turn their backs on the cash grab, then the folks trying to grab cash will painfully learn the lesson.
_ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
Does this mean if I purchase DRM'ed videos, I can sell my hard drive that contains them?
So you buy a weirdly-licensed 'electronic' book, and then somehow later, when you go to sell it, its either electronically or legally crippled? Hello, cash is king, its either a book or it ain't. Don't be too proud of the technological terror you've spawned.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
as I understand... they are saying that we do not own the physical copy of the book so that is why we can not sell it..
.. how can *they* sell the electronic copy in the first place?
Then using this same logic
Ok ... so, sticking with the I'm selling the physical media, not the content, line of reasoning, here's my argument; I purchase the eBook, then a) print a hard copy -then- b) burn the file to a CD. According to the "physical manifestation rule", I could sell either the pile of paper, the CDROM, or my eBook reader without violating any laws?
Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws-Plato
"Short answer: those restrictive licenses may very well be legal, and even if you had rights under the first sale doctrine, you might only be able to resell or give away your Kindle -- not a copy of the work."
The price of quick convienence is issues like this arise. This is why the part in copyright law about being in a "fixed medium" should have been the norm. Buy your digital books fixed onto a memory chip. Loaning, selling, etc would have been the same as a physical book. The only difference is that your reader allows only limited copies (like a library would) and not retain any backups (like a dead tree book).
---
Heh! My captcha is "deterred".
Quote: "While the restrictions on e-books may initially seem inconsistent with the rights granted for hard-copy books, these differences are the consequence of new digital products outgrowing traditional copyright doctrines. Such issues are currently being examined by legal scholars and industry insiders, but only time will tell whether this degree of control over digital media is acceptable to society."
First off, I disagree that "digital products" have "outgrown" anything. On the contrary, I fail to see any new issues that digital text brings to the table. These very same issues were debated hundreds of years ago, and the circumstances are not substantially different at all. The solutions were the body of copyright laws we have enjoyed for the last couple of hundred years (until recently, that is). And those laws cover the issues just fine!
Second, in response to the final sentence of the quote above: I don't think we have to wait to see what society thinks of "this degree of control over digital media". The people are pissed. They are staying away from copy-protected music in droves, and have been straining hard to crack DRM where it is found.
The people HAVE spoken and are speaking. And they are clearly saying "NO!" Loudly and repeatedly.
Wouldn't that run into some problems with reproduction? This is why photocopying and book and then selling the photocopy isn't allowed, or why the DVDs on sale in Chinatown for 3 bucks are illegal.
The Kindle is $399. The books listed on the Kindle page are $9.99 each. Picking a random book: Sue Grafton's T is for Trespass. Kind price: $9.99. Hardcover price: $17.79.
...more than double the market price difference) but is having the ebook worth the difference? Grafton's previous book -- S for Silence -- is $7.99 for paperback ($4.24 if you buy 3rd party to Amazon) and $6.39 for Kindle (again, Kindle page doesn't list other editions). A whopping $1.60 difference. $1.60 to [legally] be permanently locked to that copy with your Kindle with no rights to sell that copy to any one, nor transfer to other devices, etc. (I don't think I need to list them).
(Something I find extremely interesting is Amazon compares the kindle price to the hard cover list price ($26.95) AND does not link to any other versions of the book, but the hard cover sure does. It seems they are intentionally wanting to give the false sense of "what a deal!" and making it harder to jump to a non-kindle version.)
$7.80 may look like a lot (Amazon will tell you $26.95-$9.99=$16.96
Is $1.60 (or -$2.15 if 3rd party) or $7.80 worth it to switch to Kindle? Not to me, so I'll stick to being a tree-killer. I won't ever switch to ebooks that trap my money and ability to do as I please.
(I also don't own HD DVD (hah!) nor Blu-Ray and never will until I can play them under my OS of choice, but I digress.)
Honestly, if it comes down to DRM books and DRM movies where I can't read/play on the device of my choice then I'll happily give them up. But it won't be for long because the time will come when good creators of books and film will not be hamstrung by those who demand DRM. That is if the recent digital "experiments" by known musicians are of any indication.
:wq
That's exactly right. Doctrine of first sale is independent of making unauthorized copies.
AntiFA: An abbreviation for Anti First Amendment.
What a stup
...)
(PLEASE WAIT FOR AD TO LOAD
(ENLARGE YOUR PEN1S NOW ASK ME HOW)
endously great idea.
In the end its all free and public anyways. Ebooks, software, music. Dosn't make it right, but I wouldn't worry about any ebook restrictions becuase people will always find a way to distribute if they have the will. I'm not supporting copyright infrindgment, I'm just saying the licensing will have little effect on what's available in the public domain (legitimate or not).
Trying to install linux on my microwave, but keep getting a kernel panic...
What lets companies get away with this is that consumers don't know about it, and stores toss around words like "buy" and "sell" when the more appropriate term might be "(indefinite) lease". Let's pass a law forbidding e-book sellers from saying in their advertising "Buy this e-book!" or "We have e-books for sale!"; if they are forced to say "Buy a license for this e-book!" or "Lease this e-book!" and consumers will get the idea that something is up, and become informed.
Ditto for DVDs, music, software, or anything else where the manufacturer claims to be selling licenses.
"But it won't be for long because the time will come when good creators of books and film will not be hamstrung by those who demand DRM. That is if the recent digital "experiments" by known musicians are of any indication."
Ahem! I suggest you read the section on DRM. The issue isn't black and white.
No thanks to the advertising in my books.
The last time I was prompted to write on eReaders and eBooks I put this up:
http://zotzbro.blogspot.com/2007/11/ereaders-and-ebooks.html
I sure hope these nasty plans don't end up having a place in my life. I hope others manage to stay away too. We can do better.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band making libre music. You can get some gratis.
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
I've written this up here. Classic GNAA troll turns virus link spammer. Avoid.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
Sorry, but technology has developed, and as a result, some things are less valuable than they used to be. Shockingly, the buggy whip makers want to maintain the value of their product, but that's just not in society's best interest.
Also, Privity doesn't matter. For a number of reasons. Arguably, these are contracts made in bad faith on the part of the sellers. Hell, the provisions often made for denial of liability by sellers make them so on their face. Whether the legal system chooses to acknowledge this or not, it certainly provides the moral backing for Civil Disobedience. Other grounds include the highly questionable benefit of these corporations at serving society's interest in the promotion of art.
...and they do not have our physical money. Hence they can't "spend" the money we pay them for the book except under conditions we specify.
I faced the same issue with a now-defunct ebook retailer: www.paperbackdigital.com
I had bought about 8 mobi format ebooks from them and when i needed to visit their website to reset PIDs for my PocketPC, they were closed.
I felt like a dork.
Fortunately my credit card was just billed, so i disputed all the payments i made to them.
If i can't get their product, they can't get my money.
"Doing what i can, with what i have." ~ Burt Gummer
Content isn't king in any advertise-subsidized medium, it's the advertiser's revenue streams. They'll censor what they fear will alienate their viewers, they won't subsidize what they think won't sell. Advertising is horrible for content, unless the power that the sponsorship dollar holds over creators and audiences can be limited.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
to always download your e-books onto a blank memory stick. Then you should be able to use the first sale principle. However you'd have to be able to prove that the stick you sold was the original download. Selling a copy of one's book could never be legal without throwing out the Constitution and copyright law around the world. One can't legally sell a copy of one's Harry Potter book that one xeroxed off on that fancy color copier at work either. So people stop whining about not be about to sell copies that they morally and legally shouldn't be doing anyway. Of course, IANAL, and there is that contractual thing that you agree to when you buy a book from these leaches, so that has to be considered too. Or you can get your e-books free from the Gutenberg project. Or you can get a REAL book and not be bothered with this crap. Then you are free to cut it apart and scan it in yourself, you lazy pucks. ;')
I don't think this has anything to do with the 'first sale doctrine.' Rather, Netflix is in the business of renting movies, not renting music. There's no law stopping them from renting music CDs if they wanted to. That's just not the market they are going after. If they were after that market, then they'd probably be called "Netmusic" instead of "Netflix." Does anybody really want the CD rental market,anyway?
... and then they built the supercollider.
But if I do, in fact, delete the file after sending it then it's not a copy.
Since the deleting part is not verifiable and violates human nature, the courts give the copyright owner the benefit of the doubt at the expense of the buyer's first sale rights.
DRM could be used to verify that the deletion happened, but the copyright owners have no incentive to set up such a system.
Perhaps the courts will eventually figure this out and shift the benefit of the doubt in the consumer's favor.
If the copyright owner is not willing to set up a civilized DRM system, then the buyer should be trusted to perform the deletion.
It only takes an hour to OCR a normal 3-400 page book. Problem solved. It takes even less to simply scan it in and use a 15MB PDF to read. If you are really desperate you could set up a kindle with decent lighting and a high megapixel digital camera and snap away to your hearts delight. 2-3 seconds per page * 300 (if you do single side, 150 if you do both at once) is 10 minutes to 'scan' a book. You could probably even automate it, if Kindle has an auto page turn feature, or you have something that can press a button every once in a while.
http://blog.slaingod.com
Thank god Nod32 blocked it. Or part of it??
Running a full virus scan right now.
Anyone who clicks on it I would advise you to remove the exploit.dialogArg.A virus. Hopefully firefox 2.0.12 patched teh javascript vulnerability it uses to install itself.
http://saveie6.com/
"There's no law stopping them from renting music CDs if they wanted to."
Apparently, there is. Ditto for computer software except for limited purpose machines like video game consoles. You can read it for yourself -- or maybe you can't.
Too busy staying alive... ~ R.A.
Oh no, don't lend credence to pay per click ads in PDFs.
this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom. -- Lincoln, Gettysburg Address
These are the exact reasons that e-books have never held much interest for me, at least regarding content that I would have to pay for. The hard copy of most every book can be bought at an extremely cheap price if you're willing to wait until some schmuck lists the book on Amazon for a penny.
Also, our library system has a complicated and convoluted process so that library card holders can download audio books as well as e-books, but the format is so restrictive that it wasn't worth the bother. I can't copy the sound files to my MP3 player and I can't move an e-book to the portable device of my choice. If I'm going to sit there connected to the Internet using my desktop or laptop, then I'll just buy the real book used or check it out from the library. At least if I buy a real book, I can do what I want with it when I'm done.
Until someone develops an AdBlock for eBooks.
I just removed AdBlock from my system for exactly this reason. One can't bitch about draconian efforts to extract money from consumers, and then circumvent the one last option left to content producers: ad revenue.
.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
I'm pretty sure that the "limited times" were intended to be well inside the lifespan of the author/inventor. I wouldn't care so much about reselling my copy if I knew it would be public domain in 10 years anyway.
Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion.
Actually, don't mod parent up because he was an Anonymous Coward, but as an aspiring author I would say that anybody seeking to use their writing to shill for advertisers does not deserve to be read.
I am in support of the business model where readers can experience an author's work from a free digital download... and then vote with their pocketbook by making a "donation" if they think what they "experienced" was worth it.
That is --- "read now, pay later". I think the days of "pay now, read later" are numbered.
Then again, I am continually refining my manuscript so that it will be readable for a mass audience. As is, the compliments I get are that the "story" is awesome but the actually story-telling is lacking (which I am, of course, working on).
Support the 30 Hour Work Week!!!
Personally, if I were interested in buying an e-book, I would be intending to read the book once, and be done with it. If I want to read a book again later,I may as well buy a paper copy of it. Assuming people generally agree on this consumer model, why not make e-books 1 year rentals, or something along those lines?
Since I assume most e-book consumers intend to be one-time users (this is my general perception), reselling would be high, and the digital nature means copies aren't readily destroyed, so basically books would rapidly stop selling new copies. Book sellers would not like this, so if they rent the book, there would be no way to have resell rights (lending rights may be a question, but that is a smaller issue), and prices could drop a little since publishers can get money from the paper edition still if the e-book customer decides to get a permanent copy. While those who want to keep their digital books would be unhappy, there needs to be enough room for companies to be profitable and not be under bombardment from everyone.
Maybe it isn't the most efficient solution, but it's an idea to consider.
My webcomic
OK, so what is this law you speak of?
... and then they built the supercollider.
Yes. It's because people hear a single CD far far more times that they would watch
a single movie.
Section 109, as linked above in this thread.
http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#109
Too busy staying alive... ~ R.A.
You've got the right to hit mute, even if ads are how the publishers make their money in the long run.
Turn it back on and clear the block list. Then block only annoying ads.
They'll be able to see viewing statistics for the ads and they should realize that some users are blocking some of the ads. Blocking the real garbage keeps from rewarding the jerks, and gives the people who play nice a better chance. If they investigate they might find that giant pulsing banners aren't popular...
It's been done, actually; see Wowio. The author gets something like 50 cents per ebook downloaded, and while it is currently for the US only, I believe they are working on being able to serve other countries. Works quite nicely, assuming you're in the US.
I was thinkng more along the lines of the author soliciting one or more sponsors for their books, and the books then being distributed for free.
Lets face it - most books don't earn their advance, so
It doesn't have to be pdfs with click-thrus - it can be something as simple as a preface acknowledging "this book sponsored by [insert name here]".
The end-user (reader) is happy, the author and publisher get paid, and the advertisers get additional exposure via technical media - and at a reasonable gamble if they advertise on something they think could be the next big thing. I'm not really sure anyone loses in this deal.
Do You Experiment?
Which sort of ebook are you more likely to pass along - one that's full of useful content and enjoyable, with only one or 2 discrete ads, or one that's chock-a-block with link spam?
The market will sort it out, just like it always does. When you come across one of those "link farm landing pages", do you click on the links, or do you just close the tab?
I've read that, I don't see how it doesn't also ban the rental of DVDs, after all, they have a soundtrack on them. Also, if you read it, you will notice that you are allowed to rent CDs and computer games with permission of the copyright holder. Also, if this law is in effect, then why are there so many places that rent computer games around? And how does Blockbuster rent music on CDs if it is illegal?
... and then they built the supercollider.
"the power that the sponsorship dollar holds over creators and audiences can be limited" is a given. You're not forced to choose any particular sponsor or sponsorship format. For example, say you write an ebook on Java ... and Sun likes it enough to decide they want to sponsor it, with a "sponsored by Sun" on the frontispiece, and a link inside to their site, in return for $10k and 1 year exclusivity (that you can't release another edition for one year - exclusivity wouldn't apply to distribution. Since the idea is to make it free for the end user, you, and anyone else, can distribute as many copies as you like of that edition).
Why not take the deal? The average advance on non-fiction books is less than $5k - and most of the time, that's all the money the author sees. This puts more money in the writer's hands, gets much broader distribution, recognition, etc., and doesn't limit the reader's rights to copy, pass along to others, etc. (unlike that Piece of Shit amazon kindle reader, that only lets you "rent" your ebook, even though you paid for it!!!).
I've written a couple of product/technical manuals for companies - when you do the math, the pay per hour is MUCH better than what you'll find in the publishing industry, but the exposure is severely limited - only their own customers see it, since only they are interested. I certainly didn't care that they could make as many copies as they wanted ... it was sponsored work, it paid the bills, and everyone was happy.
Which would you rather have?
Having a business act as your books' sponsor doesn't mean turning it into the eBook equivalent of an ad-jammed web page. That would be counter-productive. A notice that "this book is sponsored by xyz corp" on the front page, and an ad on one the inside cover pages for the same sponsor, with no other advertising by the sponsor or anyone else (so as not to dilute the ads' value) should be sufficient if the eBook is any good.
Now which of the two above options appeals more to advertisers? An eBook that has only limited distribution rights, and that they can't give away ... or one that, if it's any good, will be passed around all over the place? And which of the two will they be more likely to promote?
Free (as in freedom) wins every time, if done right.
I did read it. You're allowed to do anything with the permission of the copyright holder. A phonorecord has specific meaning under the law and does not include DVDs. There are not so many places that rent computer games. Blockbuster does not offer music for rent where I live.
The main point here is that NetFlix may rent DVDs to the public with or without the approval of the film industry. If they wanted to rent CDs they would require the blessing of the music industry in order to do so. The RIAA bought and paid for the copyright act, so it is likely they oppose the idea of CD rental altogether.
Too busy staying alive... ~ R.A.
If I wouldn't have already enough reasons to not obtain any kind of e-book reader, this is just another one. After all, there is nothing more sexy than an own library where you visualy can see the content! :-)
I don't have any e-Books, because all I've ever heard about them was DRM and proprietary lock-in.
I don't know why this is news.
Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
I'm not buying it. The act talks about the musical performance rights in the recording. Movies have those, too. Why would a DVD recording of a musical performance be any different to one on CD? Under the legal definition, a DVD also counts as a "phonorecord."
... and then they built the supercollider.
I prefer:
Option 3: A eBook you pay for but one that you can copy, share, pass around to others, back up to other media, etc.
But instead I'm getting your option 1 from distributors. Or I can get Option 2 w/o ads from Pirate Bay. Even iTunes these days are selling open format higher quality mp3s for a premium (so I heard). What use is the dream of digital books (no space wasting library) if it is cancels out the benefits with encumbered DRM bullshit?
I'm mostly looking at Textbook publishers. Those are the ones going to be in the biggest shit: the only reason they can begin to charge so much is that people NEED those books to pass school/college. No other genre has this benefit and hence most books are priced much lower. I know many people who download movies simply because they hate paying for the thing and being wapped over the head with FBI warnings, having their DVD players hijacked with no skip commercials, etcetera when they can get a superior product online for free.
As to your point: not every model can live in the advertising world. Some subjects are too esoteric or the audience is too small. I don't mind -- I don't mind paying and supporting something: I DO HATE however being treated like a criminal AFTER I paid and seeing the freeloaders having something significantly better.
It's not like you can't buy the book.
You have a choice.
Buy the book. Then it's not a problem anymore.
These "electronic papers" are very new, anyway. There's the pauses and other nonsense. Even PDF is "locked up", in a way.
So is Postscript.
What about XML?
I'll hold out for a universal standard for electronic paper -- an open source one. One where I can purchase an e-copy as I would a PDF and just be trusted with it.
This e-copy then, like a flac or an mp3, would go onto one of many digital devices (just as a PDF would go onto one of potentially many computers or laptops or whatever).
So let's just say -- no to PDF and PS, and yes to open standards for some sort of e-paper thing, and lots of competing e-paper devices that display color and don't have strange pauses and flashes and whatever.
It's a good idea, but it needs competition. Lots of competition.
But I guess the real question is this... I download a PDF of an e-book. Can I sell it to someone? I wonder if that question is yes, because how is that supposed to work?
Could I register myself somewhere? Register my purchase and register my sale? How about the person purchasing it from me - if s/he goes through the same registering process that I went through when I purchased it, then s/he'd be registered and would be able to sell it whenever s/he chose to.
This is a problem that needs a solution. It wouldn't make much sense to drop the price more than the cost of producing a digital copy vs the cost of producing a hard copy.
This isn't anyone's fault -- this is something we need to figure out a solution to.
Luckily, we still have the option of purchasing the hard copy. Perhaps we could get the rights to the e-stuff along with a hard copy? Or download the e-copy while the hard copy is arriving in the mail?
This isn't anyone's fault.
I haven't yet decided whether I shall be selling copies of my book on ebay or amazon, but this report gives me cause for concern.
Incidentally, the URL for information on my ebook is at http://www.paullee.com/book_details.php
My web domain.
"Which would you rather have?
* Option 1: A proprietary format eBook that you can't copy, share, pass around to others, back up to other media, etc., even after you paid for it?
* Option 2: A free eBook that you can copy, share, pass around to others, back up to other media, etc., and that didn't cost you a cent?"
Well, gee, let's see...
None of the above?
Option 1 is a non-starter.
If that only leaves Option 2 and there are no others, and Option 2 entails forced ads in or about the text itself... Is also a non-starter. Plus, they could only ensure the ads were there if the format is DRM based in the first place.
Option 3. Buy a Free standards based formatted ebook for way less than the paper version.
Option 4. Buy the paper version and get the Option 3 ebook version included automatically.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band, libre music, some available gratis.
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
Regarding your sig, what is the true meaning of -1 Redundant?
It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
But other people think there's a slight difference between discrete, well targeted, non-obtrusive text ads, and the fucking huge pile of blinking crap coloured like a clown on a LSD-bad-trip running free through in a fluorescent paint factory.
The former is what would work the best, the latter is what the web has become - if you turn off AdBlock for a couple of seconds.
Thank you Flash, thank you animated GIF, thank you <BLINK> tag : your contributions really made the web an enjoyable experience.
Now please excuse me as I go adding another layer of thick black paint to my googles...
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
They can, and they will. People want everything for themselves, sure you can recognise that as a bad thing, but who can blame them?
Don't forget that at any time ( if you are using some sort of online-DRM system ) that what you purchase a right to read for can be yanked from you in an instant.
All it will take is one judge to declare the 'book' violated some copyright and it suddenly disappears off readers all over the country. Or how about the government decides its 'forbidden information', once again causing 'books' to disappear. ( after reporting back who had the copy for further investigation. how dare they want to learn about the forbidden fruit ). Your so called contract is null and void at that point and you possess something that is considered illegal.
Oh, and that little clause in all contacts that lets THEM change the terms... "now we are moving to a pay pre read model, id you don't accept this agreement all previous contracts are null and void" and then once again, poof goes your 'book'.
No thanks, ill keep my paper thank you very much. ( even self-scanned unencumbered books will eventually get bit by the 'not licensed to view' DRM bug once they lock all machines down to were ALL content must be authorized by a central body or its rejected and reported )
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Does the first sale doctrine apply if I download the e-books to a cheap 5 Euro USB stick and sell away my USB stick (library of 30 or so e-books) ?
I am selling the medium, ain't I ? Or are they going to whine and say : "Oh no, your USB copy is a copy from the RAM of your machine, and you must sell off the RAM chip while it holds your copy in buffer!"
I see MP3 Deja vu coming...
Essentia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
There are success stories and there are scandals. We have pretty unrestricted speech here at slashdot, it's true. But we're largely user-generated content, aside from the occasional so-called slashvertisement article. But look at the mass media and how controlled the message is on television, compared to a more free medium such as youtube. Audience-generated content will always be less restricted than professionally produced content. Look at the video game industry's influence on video game reviews, compared to the independence and integrity of Consumer Reports. It's a real danger, one that we need to take seriously.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
Option 2 in no way implies that - its not like we're talking about turning eBooks into the equivalent of crappy web pages. An acknowledment of sponsorship on the frontispiece along the lines of:
"The author(s) wishes to thank XYZ for their kind sponsorship of his/her/their work."
... and maybe their logo and web site, and a paragraph of what they do that is congruent to the topic of the book, and that might interest readers ...
The author gets the gelt/sheckels/euros/bux, the sponsor gets both advertising and, with any luck, some buzz and goodwill, the environment gets less pollution from 4-colour printing, paper, distribution chain, etc., and the consumer gets a free eBook that has zero DRM, and a license to copy and distribute far and wide.
The eBooks that have higher-quality content, the fewest ads possible, ad the least restrictive licenses, will displace the "eBook as Web Page full of AdSense" or "eBook as the new proprietary locked-in licenseware" crapware quickly enough, because:
It's hard enough to find a comfortable position to read actual books in, let alone sit and read through a novel at my computer. I have a few eBooks, but when I really want to read something I just go buy it. Books aren't that expensive really, and they're nice to have around on the shelves to show off to your television watching friends. :P
"He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
I disagree with that reasoning, and there is ample evidence to support my view.
The problem is that the "original" distributors are not conforming to the actual market... rather, they have been trying to force the market to conform to their old business model. This has happened before in many industries, including publishing. Lately it has been occurring throughout the media (publishing, movies, music) industries.
The publishers and distributors blame the cheap cost (there IS cost) of copying and distributing. However, they ignore what the customers in their market have been telling them loudly and clearly for a long time now, which is: "Since it is cheap to produce and distribute, you should be selling it for a low price!"
Even 150 years ago, if you asked an author if, all else being equal (including their total royalties) they would rather see 100 copies of their book sold or 1,000,000 copies, I doubt a single one of them would have said "100".
The media companies want to incorporate the reduced cost of distribution, and sell their 1,000,000 copies, but continue to make profits at the "100 copy" rate. And that is not realistic. Or moral or ethical, really. Especially considering the royalties they have been trying to weasel out of.
The commercial media industry has simply not been selling copies at the prices that the market and technology allow and even demand, nor have they been distributing in forms or "packages" that their customers want. However, they have the ability to do so easily, as evidenced by the fact that others ARE doing so, if in an unauthorized manner.
And not all of them are unauthorized, either. Trent Reznor has been making a (relative) killing with his new "Ghosts" releases, sold directly to customers over the internet, bypassing the traditional distribution channels completely. In fact, I have tried his free download and I plan to buy the complete work this week. Reznor and company now have no need to "share" the wealth with bloated, bureaucratic media companies, and he AND his customers are happy... without the use of any copy protection!!!
It works. The "problem" is not a problem at all, it is simply the inability (or refusal) of giant corporations to change their ways. There is no threat in this to societal order at all, nor to existing law, nor to the concept of traditional publishing. Merely a slightly different market, which those companies could make a huge profit in if they would simply CHANGE. Note that one of the companies in question here is Sony, which has been one of the worst offenders in that regard.
"Option 2 in no way implies that - its not like we're talking about turning eBooks into the equivalent of crappy web pages. An acknowledment of sponsorship on the frontispiece along the lines of:
... and maybe their logo and web site, and a paragraph of what they do that is congruent to the topic of the book, and that might interest readers ... "
"The author(s) wishes to thank XYZ for their kind sponsorship of his/her/their work."
If I understand you, I am cool with that. So long as it doesn't try and preclude options 3 and 4. It is not perhaps a goal I am aiming for in the end unless you have more in mind though. One thing. I am not anti business. I am not anti income. I am not anti profit.
I am working on a page of ideas for income for our band "Packet In" that might interest you and that might parallel some of this.
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Income
Our first album is available now under a CC BY-SA license.
http://www.packet-in.org.nyud.net/repo/RPM08/RPM08_plutekmaster_v1.4.ogg
I am sure we would all be at least somewhat happy to have a little income from our efforts. Some of us might even be OK with a lot of income from our efforts.
all the best,
drew
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
This is by no means a new thing. Valve and steam have been doing this for years. Back in the good 'ol days, you used to be able to lend somebody a game cartridge or CD. With steam, licenses are non-transferable, just like the licenses in the article.
The only way to transfer a license on steam is to give your whole account to somebody else. If we took that analogy to old school video games, if you ever wanted to lend one of your games to someone else, you'd have to lend them your entire collection!
I'm surprised that people keep thinking that this rental of our culture is something that is coming soon. Sadly, it is already here. What most people don't seem to realise is that encumbered ebooks guarantee that everybody will be locked out of all their encrypted books sooner or later. When you have to re-install your operating system or upgrade your computer your ebooks no longer recognise your system and refuse to open. I've had this happen to me on a couple of occasions, which stung me so badly that there have been a lot of books I've wanted very much to buy, but haven't. I have very little money and can't afford to throw it away on renting expensive books. Now the only ebooks I buy are unencumbered ones. Baen Books sell (and give away) a lot of ebooks by current top-ranking SF writers, all without locks of any kind, in a number of formats, including plain vanilla html. It has worked really well for them. Every time they give away a free book it boosts sales of their for-profit items. They are living proof that the dopey protectionist arguments that many publishers make are total hokum.
I would forget CD Baby - just run the math for their own numbers - $65 million for 150,000 artists, works out to an average of $433 per artist. $35 intial fee + 9% of $433 ($38.97) really works out to 20%. Given that their figures are based on 9 years, its doubtful you'll even see your initial outlay the first year or two. Even worse if they keep $4/physical cd.
In other words, most of their sales are from people who signed up with them, then told other people "you can buy my stuff online -check it out." They could have made the same revenue selling it to those same people directly.
Checking the "important details page" confirms this:
Keep at it - you might not find something that works, but if you don't continue to look, you dfinitely won't.
WRT options 3 and 4:
Option 3 - why would someone "buy" a "free" ebook? If you meant "Buy a standards-based eBook for way less than the paper version", I think a free version (as in price and as in beer) would beat the "paid" version in the marketplace;
Option 4: There's certainly nothing stopping people going the "No Starch Press" route ... check out what they're doing with torrents.
"Option 3 - why would someone "buy" a "free" ebook?"
... check out what they're doing with torrents."
I will reword it then:
Option 3. Buy a Libre standards based formatted ebook for way less than the paper version.
"Option 4: There's certainly nothing stopping people going the "No Starch Press" route
Not what I am suggesting exactly, but not a problem per se. See what Baen are doing as well: http://www.baen.com/library/
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band, libre music, some available gratis
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
"I would forget CD Baby"
From their site:
"For a simple $35 setup, CD Baby can get your music selling worldwide on cdbaby.com, Apple iTunes, Rhapsody, Napster, eMusic and many more."
There are things I don't like about them, but the above is the interesting bit for me so far and why they made the list.
Do you know of any other simple way to get your music placed with those other stores?
Plus:
"We take all credit card orders for your CD, online or through our toll-free phone number, and ship it to them within hours."
Doing business online is not simple for me where I live.
Now, one thing I want to see happen is for people to start dealing with informal groups of individuals such as ourselves:
http://zotzbro.blogspot.com/2008/03/online-collaboration-meets-online.html
That would make life a whole lot simpler if it works out how I think it could.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band - libre music, sometimes gratis
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
1. I own copies of thousands of ebooks for my Sony PRS-505, and I do control them. I didn't buy DRMed crap.
If I do pay for DRMed music or video, copy protected software, anything covered with a license agreement, etc...that was not advertised and marked as such...then I pursue it as I would any fraud case. I file criminal complaints, sue, picket, dispute the charges.
I may not have killed any stock holders yet over an undisclosed EULA, but it's only a matter of time. LOCK & LOAD!!!
Andy
Thanks for the link to Baen. I had read about that in an editorial in one of the SF mags I buy every month, but hadn't gotten around to looking up the url.
Nowadays, anyone can send money to your bank account with a simple email. No special "merchant account"account, no paypal, nothing.
Its verifiable at both ends, unlike paypal, where you send your money and you take your chances.
You might want to look into that - its part of most banks on-line banking stuff.
Ownership is such an outdated concept.
You don't own anything now a days, it's all 'licensed' to you.
-You don't own your cellphone, the hardware/software combination is licensed to you.
-You don't own your operating system / computer, it's licensed to you.
-You don't own your game-console, it's licensed to you.
Why go through all the hassle of 'ownership', just accept the terms and you will be happy. You don't mind it for your cellphone, computer, game console, etc, just let it be!
I hope that the **AA strictly enforce their ownership, people have been running amok for far too long. It's time to let them know who really owns 'their' computer.
Australian author Matthew Reilly did just that with his book Hover Car Racer. He made it freely available for download as a PDF with embedded ads several months before the hardcopy version was available in stores. He also had for download images and a paper model of the main vehicle.
I recall reading an interview with the author where he said that it made sense financially, and he disparaged the earlier effort by Stephen King with his "pay as you go" model. I personally downloaded it but also bought the hardcover when it was available, but I was likely to do so anyway as I'm a fan of his work. My wife had a teenager in a class she was teaching (the book is aimed at "young adults", very much unlike his other works) who after reading the downloaded version went and bought a copy.
"Nowadays, anyone can send money to your bank account with a simple email. No special "merchant account"account, no paypal, nothing."
Do you know if that works worldwide? I am not a US resident and do not have a US bank account.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=RPM08_Final_Tracks
Spaceman - a complete album of copyleft libre music available gratis at this time.
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
Or the masses will take over print like they did video with youtube. If we think film media companies are backwards in their thinking print are even worse. Sites like http://www.fracknaps.com/ will become the norm.
I know it works in Canada.
"I know it works in Canada."
Well, here where I am, if I understand things right, I can't even get a paypal account that can receive payments.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band - libre music, some gratis
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free
Sorry that I'm not replying in a specific thread, but I'm seeing a lot of misconceptions in this discussion, and I want to hit as many of them as possible with just one post. I am a published author, as well as an editor, and I am now also the owner of a small publishing company that recently put out its first book - so understanding the ins and outs of this is very important to what I do.
First of all - the issues with e-books and first sale doctrines. When it comes down to it, copyright law is in regards to how copies are made (while this does involve the public to some degree, it's far more about how creative artists deal with their distributors and keeping one group from ripping off the other). If you buy a print book, and then resell it, or give it away to somebody, you are not making a copy. However, that's not something you can do with an e-book - if you give a copy of a Kindle book you just bought to a friend, you are actually making a copy, and that does violate copyright law. So that's where the problem lies. It is not a conspiracy to take people's rights away.
(Think of it like this - it's the difference between buying a book and giving your friend a copy, and buying a book, photocopying it, and then giving your friend the photocopy.)
Second - where e-books are going. A few people here are talking about how DRM on e-books are going to wipe out libraries. This is complete garbage. It is absolute nonsense in part because libraries are protected under copyright law in most countries (even in the United States, the "Sonny Bono" act had special dispensation for libraries). But, it is mostly nonsense because in order for e-books to wipe out libraries, the e-book would first have to wipe out the print book, and that just isn't going to happen.
I'm speaking from experience here - e-books are really a lot like radio. They're great for getting samples out, but if somebody really likes what they're reading, they want a copy of it on paper. The last time people were talking about how books were going to go digital, I was there in the ranks of e-book authors in the great "e-book revolution." And I had absolutely everything going for me - I was the author of Diablo: Demonsbane, the e-book launching the entire official Diablo fiction line, and Diablo II had sold millions of copies, which back then was almost unheard of for computer games. Advertisements for Demonsbane were showing up on Battle.net, so pretty much every Diablo multiplayer fan had at least some inkling that the book existed.
To this day, eight years later, I don't think the book sold more than 1,000 copies. And I was one of the e-book authors who did WELL - about the only thing I didn't have going for me was that I wasn't Stephen King.
By 2001, the e-book revolution had fizzled, and a bunch of publishers, Pocket Books included, stopped releasing them. And Demonsbane was released in every read-only format you could get, including Acrobat Reader. And it wasn't DRM that killed it, believe me. I've had a lot of time to think about why the print book didn't even notice the e-book assault was happening.
Frankly, it all comes down to barriers to entry. If you think about it, most of the technology that has caught on has been reducing barriers to entry for something. Take music, for example. We started off with the record, and then moved to the tape, which was smaller and more compact. Then came the CD, which had no moving parts. And now there's the MP3, which doesn't require a CD. But there was always a barrier to entry in music. That's not the case with a print book.
A print book requires only the ability to read, your eyes, and a light source. An e-book requires more - you need a power source, and a reader of some sort, be it a computer or a Kindle, etc. The readers are subject to obsolescence, as are the file formats. So, instead of removing barriers to entry, an e-book raises them.
Now, an e-book does have its purposes, and if you're on a long trip, it is far more handy to
Robert B. Marks
Author, Demonsbane in Diablo Archive
Screw paypal. You don't need a paypal account to receive paypal payments - just an email address and a bank account ... https://www.paypal.com/uk/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/ema/index-outside
In other words, paypal is trying to intermediate themselves between the banks, which already offer this exact same service, sans the paypal fees. If you have a bank account and online banking, your bank (at least in most parts of the world) offers this. You may need to dig around their web site a bit, or ask your customer service rep how to set it up, but it works.
"If you have a bank account and online banking, your bank (at least in most parts of the world) offers this."
Well, I have a bank account but haven't wanted online banking, but I will check into it and perhaps set up an account with online banking specifically for this purpose if any of the banks down here will offer this to me.
all the best,
drew
http://packet-in.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
Packet In - net band
FreeMusicPush If you want to see more Free Music made, listen to Free