Slashdot Mirror
Otherland MMO Announced
Eurogamer breaks news that German games publisher DTP Entertainment will be making an MMORPG based on Tad Williams' Otherland series of books. As anyone who has read the books will know, this could be an interesting new spin on virtual worlds. Quoting:
"For want of a better soundbite, let's call it the first cyberpunk MMO: a virtual world about virtual worlds, in which your avatar is an avatar, the NPCs play NPCs, and you explore a multiverse in which you might be in realistic historical surroundings one minute, and cartoon fantasy ones the next. Everything changes, even your own appearance, and nothing is even pretending to be real. ... You start the game as one of those consciousnesses in a place called the Land of the Lost, a nightmare scenario which you're trying to escape. You'll run, be killed, and reborn in a 'baby' state as a simple, low-rent sim (though we suspect the game won't be using that term, for obvious reasons) - a blank, featureless avatar that can be male, female or even neither."
I may have to pick up a book or to and get familiar with the story line.
if I were able to see further, it was because I stood on the shoulders of Giants -Newton
Wake me up when a mutant is using hypnotic mind-control to make me believe I'm actually in the game. Until then I don't think this is going to be a particularly compelling MMORPG.
End of lesson. You may press the button.
You forgot to answer the most important question.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Boss: Okay guys, we have to come up with some better ideas for this new MMO.
Producer 1: I think we should go for the most realistic historical surroundings!
Producer 2: That's boring! How about a cartoon fantasy world?
Four hours later
Boss: You still haven't made a decision.
Producer 1: Oh yeah we have. We're gonna do both!
Boss (disheartened): Both?
Producer 2: Yeah! It'll be a completely open world, totally unfocused! A sandbox! The user makes the choices!
Producer 1: With open-endedness! And it'll be like...so, meta-
Boss: Oh, for fuck's sake. Just throw in a bunch of crap stolen from BladeRunner and call it 'cyberpunk', then it will sell.
Producer 1: You're the boss!
(-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
Oh my GOD, that is the most awesome news I've heard all week!
No, wait, the other thing. Yet another MMO, cause, you know. There's totally not enough of those around.
Wake me up when... eh, I'll wake up when I'm ready.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is kinky.
The onion did a piece on "World of World of Warcraft", where players play a character sitting in a lonely basement playing warcraft. The "your avatar is an avatar" part reminds me of that, though technically they imply different things... and actually that statement doesn't imply much...
http://www.theonion.com/content/video/warcraft_sequel_lets_gamers_play
-Taylor
Worldwide Military budgets: $2100 billion. Worldwide Space Exploration budgets: $38 billion. Really, world? Really?
Those were some good books, but the "it's all a dream" aspect of the setting can lead authors into self-indulgences. Essentially, there are no rules for the world. That was the major problem with it. Also, since "it's all a dream", a lot of the drama seemed false. The real characters were interesting but most of the time spent with the dream characters is just that many more pages of inconsequential stuff.
The "no rules for the world" quality would destroy an MMO. You can't just change the rules all the time or all the players will just hang out in the part with the most advantageous rules.
It sounds rather neat, I may have to go start reading the books. I never played Second Life, mostly due to the entire island owned by the bloody furries. Nor did I play The Matrix: Online because it seemed so bland.
This, on the other hand sounds very interesting.
da w00t. mtfnpy?
So, any fans of the SF/Fantasy genre out there who can say why Otherland? Why not Steven Erikson's Malazan Empire? Robert Jordan's Wheel of (too much) time, Tolkien, or Terry Pratchett for that matter? What makes Otherland more suitable than the others?
after RingTFA, my questions are the same as the article writers: how is any of this stuff more than changing the name of common MMORPG elements? Like, you get "code" that "alters the fundemental reality of the world" from killing monsters, doing quests, trading, balhblah. Maybe I am being skeptical (along with the author of TFA), but it sounds a lot like other games where, say, you have to grind monsters to drop spell components, or gear, balhblah. I like the sounds of "leveling up" changing into "learning how to modify the code" but if it does the same thing in the end... That being said, the grapics look cool, and hopefully the wide range of areas actually feels like a wide range of areas, not just cyberglacier, cyberruins, cybervolcano, etc.
I will be replying the daylights out of this thread since I really liked the series.
It is a tetrology of 4 books, all gorgeously detailed! I really liked that a crucial feature is two AFRICAN characters as lead heroes! One from a modern province, and one a classically trained Bushman.
Tad W. does a brilliant job of showing how the Old Bush Ways could provide crucial insight into our modern era.
I hate MMO's, but I'll probably have to get my own little corner of this one solely because of the books.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
I'm not knocking the content since it sounds like a neat idea but maybe put up a story when they are farther than the "will be making" phase. Like when they hit the "have funding" and "are in development" phase. Otherwise this is less newsworthy than the pseudo-cancelled (pseudo because it was never truly started) Halo MMO.
I think I "will be making" the first Super Mario FPS. Maybe I should create and post an announcement so I can get on the front page of slashdot?
"Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?" - Patrick Henry
I mean the whole point of Otherland was that people got trapped there ... does that just mean they wont cancel your credit monthly if you quit?
Make sure to give both the books and the MMO the benefits of the doubt. I am prepared to accept if the publishers wind up with only a mediocre translation.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
Given the fast raise of OS X marketshare in colleges and universities, where the actual gamers are, I still find it incredibly short-sighted that companies continue to insist on making Windows-only games.
Dual-booting is not an option since Macs don't come pre-installed with Windows, and people don't want to pay for yet another OS, split their hard drive in two partitions, etc. We buy Macs to use OS X, there's no actual need to buy a "gaming OS" on top of all that.
Does Windows has a higher total marketshare? Yes, of course, but that also includes all the corporate desktops which will never be used for gaming.
Life's a Dream.
It is by Dream alone I set my life in motion. It is by the juice of green tea & absinthe that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains, the stains become a warning. It is by Dream alone I set my life in motion.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
what it must have is some aspect of a hidden "otherland" built into it... but not mentioned or even hinted at by the makers.
In a strange way, the slashdot summary actually sounds a lot like second life.
haven't tried any MMOs, They look too addictive.
I won't play this
I really like the books.
I won't play this.
I won't play this
I won't play this.
I won't play this
I won't play this.
I really like the books.
I won't play this
I won't play this.
i really like the books.
i will play this.
You know how it is with these MMO designer types: "Confident, cocky, lazy, dead." My God. Why is that quote still taking up space in my head?
Insert witty comment *here*. I'm fresh out of wit...
Now I can reconcile my urges to cross-dress and taunt male gamers with comments like "that made my vagina hurt," and my inherent shame of playing a female character in a role playing game. Asexual meets it halfway.
Conscience is the inner voice which warns us that someone may be looking.
They made tried to make "The Street" from Snow Crash?
Meet new people, and kill them.
It sounds like a game about Second Life, where you get to play being Ordinal Malaprop or Cubey Terra, for people who don't have enough skill... I mean telemorphic ability... to be Ordinal Malaprop or Cubey Terra.
"let's call it the first cyberpunk MMO: a virtual world about virtual worlds, in which your avatar is an avatar, the NPCs play NPCs.."
.hack beat them to it by a six years.
If that's the defintion of a cyberpunk MMO, then
At first I thought it said Outland MMO... Oh well.
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
like many other SF/Fantasy series, Otherland started strong, but it became obvious in the second volume that the author hadn't thought it all through and just started making it up as he went along (ala George Lucas).
there should be an exception to copyright rules that would let someone step in under these circumstances and write the sequel that the initial story deserves.
as for the online game aspect, why should we expect it to be anything other than one more level grinding bore with pretty graphics? when it's gotten to where character classes have generic descriptions (tank, etc.) no matter what they are supposed to represent, all that's left is changing the pictures.
MMOs have become a lazy way to make games.
No, don't make a game based on "Otherland". Create "Otherland".
Outside of the neural interfaces I think we have the computing power or cloud power to create an environment that is like Otherland. Personally, I would say Second Life is already there, but it's too focused on just being a better chat room IMHO.
They need to create a place where anything goes within a certain constraint of game physics / tools with a couple of core rules.
Take something like the old world MOOs where there are central places created by the main "company" and then allow players to build their own worlds attached somehow.
Sure you will have quality issues of some worlds / rooms being basic, but some will be awesome.
I'd even go so far as suggesting that you allow external servers to exist, etc...
You would of course have some issues with:
-violence, some people don't like it
-sex, including child versions there off
-age based access control to areas for the above
-plenty of other issues
Honestly, I don't think the people of this world, especially the US, are ready for such an open ended game. Far, far to many puritans and close minded people who want to push their nose into other peoples business. The Koreans or Japanese will probably come out with something like this first.
My .02$
I really liked the books, but I think they will translate quite poorly to an MMO. Still, it's worth a look. And Tad W need to write more!
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
ZOMFG! Where the hell is my T-Jack????!!!!
I'm gonna be ho dzang at killing stuff!
Some one beat you to it.
One of the main characters in Otherland is a seasoned MMO player who spends all his time gaming, and only stops playing the game when another sneaky protagonist hacks his game to send him on a quest outside of the game, but still in virtual reality. One of... I emphasize, ONE OF the virtual worlds they all get to is a 100% accurate, realistic, and living ecosystem simulation of Middle Earth, of the Lord of the Rings variety. ONE OTHER of the virtual worlds is a 100% accurate, realistic, and living ecosystem simulation of ancient Egypt, and the entire Nile River Valley. ONE MORE of the virtual worlds is an endless House, with eternal carpeted stairs, bookshelves, rooms, bannisters, roofs, windows, etc etc etc and the characters are about 2 inches tall. The only way anyone could make anything resembling Outland would be to link all current and future MMOs together inside a great big meta-MMO. I don't see how this would be possible.
Ever since I read the series I have done periodic checks of the web to see if anyone has setup a version of the Treehouse even just as a forum.
Either no one has "borrowed" the idea and run with it, or they have and stuck close to the origins in making it super exclusive and very hard to find.
It will be interesting to see how this concept is translated into the game. Maybe it will be where the actual game developers hang out.
Drunkeness is an electron free version of virtual reality.
90% of them are horrible implemented with bugs on release. No story beyond starting area. Terrible concepts of everything. Horrible non immersible worlds with instanced zones...
The more hype, the more they suck. Leading to huge failures after launch. Most people quit, and many are so disenchanted they return to WoW, even if they had quit the game before!
what about a shadowrun MMO
I mean based on the RPG not like this shitty game where they put elves a humans together in a sci-fi/fantasy scenario and call it shadowrun. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadowrun
There's a reference to an Otherland character in Menethil Harbour in WoW. See if you can find it.
Strangely no one has posted http://www.tadwilliams.com/ which has its front page turned over to news on this new game including a huge amount of artwork and many of Tad's thoughts on the project.
The console .hack games were simMMO. I guess this is the next level of recursion?
Media that can be recorded and distributed can be recorded and distributed.
-kfg
Unless it is in the name itself, I won't. I have no desire to be on w.o.w.
T.
(New-ish login structure suxxors for quick replies.)
Maybe I'm really really stupid and can't quite grasp what's happening in the MMO market but it seems to me that successful MMOs are based on original IP while soso or downright sucky MMOs are based on licensed IP. Also I thought it is quite obvious what the next big MMO needs to have: player generated content done RIGHT. So how's about this, game devs: do an MMO with player generated content and a minimal (just enough to provide a 'theme' to the game world) IP as far as story and background goes. MMOs and story do not go together and the problems plaguing the genre all stem from the fact that designers feel the need to have a story as centerpiece. Instead of designing crutches aimed at hiding the fact that every other person in the game world can kill Overdreadlord Monsterkill how about you build a big playground where people can actually develop the story themselves?
___
No power in the 'verse can stop me
In Otherland, the main protagonist is a boy Orlando who has progeria. He basically lives online. One of the themes that helps shape the plot is that Orlando's physical body won't live much longer.
SPOILER ALERT
But at the end of the epic story, Orlando finds a way to move his consciousness online, and he gets to be immortal (as opposed to about to die from progeria), change whatever physical characteristics he wants at will, etc etc. This may be a dangerous idea for people who get addicted to these games, because some of them are not critical thinkers, and may believe that this is actually possible. Then they will completely lose all interest in their real lives.