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The Pirate Bay Seeks Interesting Route To "Pay" Fine
Drivintin is one of many who have written to tell us about how The Pirate Bay has taken an interesting approach to the 30 million SEK fine levied in their recent court case (which they said they wont pay). "The bill inspired anakata to devise a plan involving sending money to Danowsky's law firm, but not to pay the fine of course which they say will never be paid. Anakata's clever plan is called internet-avgift, internet-fee in English. Anakata encourages all Internet users to pay extremely small sums around 1 SEK (0.13 USD) to Danowsky's law firm, which represented the music companies at the Pirate Bay trial. The music companies will not benefit from this, instead it will cost them money to handle and process all the money."
So for winning the court case, they still have to pay. I approve.
Does Sweden have contempt of court?
Trying to become famous by taking photos. Visit my homepage please.
Just remember they'll make you sit there while they count it.
A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
To help pay for compensation, I shall contact my banking establishment to inquire if there is any possible way to make daily recurring payments of Superman III sized amounts of money to Danowsky's law firm.
My work here is dung.
I assume there's an equivalent of "contempt of court" over there, and probably that would let the firm on the receiving end sue for damages. Is this really the best time for them to be just digging themselves in deeper?
Are they working on the assumption that the Law and the Government are basically impotent?
(No, I did not RTFA. It's broken already.)
Nearly 4 million USD.
Reminds me of people who try to pay the government in pennies, or I guess that dimes would be more appropriate in this case. However, it's the pirate bay who owes the money, and need to pay, not 'random people'. I suppose that they could collect the (I'm guessing) coins and haul it to them in wheelbarrows, but it's likely that's been done to lawyers already and it's somehow prohibited.
The force that blew the Big Bang continues to accelerate.
Now there's a flaw in our economy that's waiting to be exploited. Handling fees that are higher than the amount received, effectively draining the company of cash.
It would also drain resources and create massive amounts of paperwork. Even though the process may be mostly automated I'd hate to revise those books, assuming enough people had done this.
Kind of like a distributed denial of service attack.
Of course it's easily remedied by blocking all cash transfers under a certain amount. I guess you're not obliged to accept money, but still it'd cause some extra work. Probably not enough to bring any given company down, but an interesting thought nonetheless.
computers let you make more mistakes faster, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila.
^^^ Just my 2 cents.
mirror
Come again? Anyone who wants to "punish" me by sending me 13 cents, by all means feel free.
If 30 million people each pay one Sek, how does that not pay the fine? And does Sweden not have some sort of teeth to their court-imposed penalties whereby simply not paying means people go to jail?
There are these things called processing fees. The point is to send them an amount that is less than the amount it takes the process the incoming amounts and as such they use money on each transaction. This is pretty standard for services like Paypal or other internet money transfers.
From TFA; "A friend of anakata told Blog Pirate"
Well, with that kind of authoritative inside knowledge, what could possibly go wrong?
Anyone who imagines this is a way to bankrupt a company, as opposed to just giving them money, is as dumb as this idea is. And any defendant who thinks that attempting to bankrupt the opposing party's law firm is a good response to losing their case... well, dumb doesn't go halfway far enough.
Come again? Anyone who wants to "punish" me by sending me 13 cents, by all means feel free. If 30 million people each pay one Sek, how does that not pay the fine?
The time honoured reply: RTFA! RTFA RTFA!
they should have tried a legal ddos first.
Depending on the law in your jurisdiction, you might be obligated. At least in the US, businesses aren't obligated to sell you goods or services for legal tender if they don't feel like it; but creditors are obligated to accept legal tender as payment for debts.
"The pertinent portion of law that applies to your question is the Coinage Act of 1965, specifically Section 31 U.S.C. 5103, entitled "Legal tender," which states: "United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.""
TPB are, obviously, not in the US and the law may well be different and paying in the equivalent of pennies might fall under some sort of "court's discretion to smack down raging assholes" provision.
On the one hand, I applaud them as Magnificent Bastards for devising a plan by which they can stick it to the big corps.. but on the other hand, I wonder whether it's really wise at this point to poke them with a stick like that.
Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
Car analogy: That's like using a bullhorn to tell the cops outside your house that you'll be out shortly to stick a banana in their tail pipe. When you get there, you'll find a 46" diameter tail pipe and you'll only have a one banana.
TPB may have gotten themselves in trouble, and been convicted by a biased court, but playing silly games isn't going to solve any problems. Childish acts, even if committed by thousands of kids on the inernet, will never amount to more than a flea on the war machine that is corporate greed. They have an organized team fueled by money, and you've got pent-up angst fueled by living in your mom's basement.
Who do you think will win?
Didn't TPB appeal?
Pirate Bay Founder Devises DDo$ Attack
Pirate Bay founder Gottfrid Svartholm (aka anakata) recieved a bill for the 30 million SEK that he, along with Peter Sunde (aka brokep), Fredrik Neij (aka TiAMO), and Carl Lundstrom, was fined in the verdict of the Pirate Bay trial just over three weeks ago. The bill inspired anakata to devise a plan involving sending money to Danowskyâ(TM)s law firm, but not to pay the fine of course which they say will never be payed. Anakataâ(TM)s clever plan is called internet-avgift, internet-fee in English. Anakata encourages all Internet users to pay extremely small sums around 1 SEK (0.13 USD) to Danowskyâ(TM)s law firm, which represented the music companies at the Pirate Bay trial. The music companies will not benefit from this, instead it will cost them money to handle and process all the money.
The plan can be called a Distributed Denial of Dollars attack (DDo$). The plan is an away-from-keyboard DDoS attack. DDoS attacks involve lots of users overloading the victim with internet traffic damaging their ability to provide services. Money, instead of Internet traffic is used in this case. The victim is Danowskyâ(TM)s law firm which represented the IFPI at the Pirate Bay trial.
A friend of anakata told Blog Pirate that the bank account to which the payments are directed has only 1000 free transfers, after which any transfers have a surcharge of 2 SEK for the account holder. Any internet-fee payments made after the first 1000, which includes the law firmâ(TM)s ordinary transfers, will instead of giving 1 SEK, cost 1 SEK to the law firm. Since Danowsky & Partners AdvokatbyrÃ¥ is a small firm, all the transactions are handled by hand. Handling all payments will be time consuming, costing the law firm in productivity. Maybe it will even affect their success in other cases.
Make direct payments to
Danowsky & Partners Advokatbyrå KB. Plusgiro 79 31 21-5.
Additionally if after paying the internet-fee you determine that your payment was erroneous, Swedish law states that you can request the money back, putting an additional load on Danowskyâ(TM)s law firm.
Since the Pirate Bay crew was provided with such clear, logical, and well explained methods for calculating the damages in the trial, an explanation on how the internet-fee was calculated is provided. Use the formula below, substituting anything anywhere, to check that the internet-fee really is 1 SEK.formel
[MATH DIAGRAM GOES HERE]
The name internet-avgift, as well as the layout of the site is based on tv-avgift and they layout of its site. Radiojanst, a state owned company, is responsible for collecting TV license fees in Sweden.
There is that priest-radical in Poland, who is known as Father Rydzyk, and all young people hate him and his movement. So they decided support him by sending 0.01 PLN (about 0.003 USD) each. Lots of students did just that, each one paying 0.01 PLN.
The case was that Father Rydzyk's movement was having special deal with banks, that they were paying all fees for incoming money. So, for each 0.01 PLN paid in, they had to pay about 1 USD - now this where Swedish guys had the idea from!
First, the law-firm would close down the account faster than lightning, only costing them the work to open a new one and sending out (handwritten) letters to their clients.
Second, the morals of this is equal to: "We didn't like the executioner, so lets burn down his house and kill his family, while we ignore the ones who gave the order"
He wasn't just a member he was on the board of directors of one of the copyright lobby groups.
That's definitely easier than abusing the banking system and pissing of a law firm that is known for it's bad temper with these silly "dog poop on the porch"-shenanigans. Doesn't exactly speak for the integrity of the "we're innocent" point the guys are trying to make when they start calling for crap like that. Even when it's hearsay evidence from some unrelated third party. Each one will have their account registered by the lawyers and they will definitely try to do "something" against the people who actually transfer money. They'll probably find a way to get the banks to hand out the names or such. I don't know what but as we all know ... they get kinda "creative" when it comes to annoying of the young'uns. To me this is just stupid. If anyone cares ... wait for the second trial (which is coming -no doubt) and after we win just send them the pennies anyway but don't ask for them back. They will need the money.
Well, this will probably work just as well as that other loophole TPB found - you know, the one that made TPB legal and untouchable in Sweden...
The more I read about the PB guys, the more they appear to be a bunch of arrogant bastards who want a blank check to do whatever they want. There is certainly enough wrong with copyright law in Sweden as it stands now, but this Internet mob mentality is not the way to go about it.
To sum it up, the law firm has been DDOS:ed, the lead lawyer have received threats, as has the head of Sweden's anti-piracy board - and now this. This may be just the stunt for TPB's fans, but if you're trying to reach out to the "other side", and I have, shit like this just makes it harder.
Thanks anakata, or whatever the fuck you want to call yourself, thanks for being a childish dork and fucking everything up.
How do I go about doing this? I'm in the US, and I don't know how to use the given address to process an electronic transfer.
Hell yes, I'll send them a nickel - then ask for it back!!! This is funny as hell. (And yes, I DO enjoy expressing my contempt of officials and/or officious boobs. It is MUCH more enjoyable when done face to face, but this will work for me!)
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
If you participate in this you run the risk of being found guilty of whatever crime "annoying law firms" sort under. I have no idea.
But I'm fairly certain that claiming a "wrong payment" when the payment was 100% intended is fraud.
They're asking pirates to pay for something. 30 million of them? Hell, they won't make the 1000 necessary to get the law firm over their free transfer limit.
"Is there some other way I can pay you?" only works in pornos.
In some ways, it's like repackaging all of those unwanted mail solicitations, stuffing them back into the postage-paid return envelope (the one intended for your subscription slip, check, or other payment), and dropping it into the mail. The company that sent the junk not only has to pay for the postage (more than the amount normally incurred for a one-sheet reply slip), but also to discard the additional junk mail in the envelope.
Definately not nice, but seemingly poetic justice.
I use irony whenever I can, but my shirts are still wrinkled...
There is no such limit.
Interesting, how so? Not even clever by a mile. As I see it there are several flaws present.
First of, the firm and the bank can see that the transactions are not normal and can probably work out a deal to minimise the finacial impact.
Secondly, the bank (after being contacted by the laywers) can cancel/reverse all 1 dollar/sek/... payments to the account.
In both the above cases, assuming it is possible to do, it won't really affect the lawyers, but instead office workers at the firm and bank(s). So they are hassling people that have nothing to do directly with the MPAA/RIAA/etc.
And why should the firm even accept these payments anyway, they are not even from TPB. It seems very far fetched that they would even spend the time to process any of them. Most likely they will just box them up and store them away. Who knows, maybe they can even use it to show the character of the people running/using TPB in future cases.
All in all if you want revenge, go after the right target and in a fitting manner. This just makes Gottfrid Svartholm look like a giant douche bag to me, the MPAA/RIAA/... will not be affected by this at all.
Carbon based humanoid in training.
Write a personal mail to your MP:s/senators etc instead. A few polite sentences, asking for restoring copyright to premium creativity instead of greed. If you can, send a paper mail. Some perhaps even answer their office phone. Just remember being nice albeit firm. 30 million unique mails can probably make some impact. At least far more than the original proposal.
Except they're not. You missed the part where they then said to ask for payment back. So no one would be paying the fine.
Canada: The US's more awesome sibling.
Kinda like sitting at the front of the bus when it's illegal to do so. Trivial and childish sounding yes, but society changing nonetheless.
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
Well then it's a good thing TPB guys didn't download anything.
The ordinary meaning of infringement is "an an encroachment on the rights or privileges of others." infringement
In plain English, if you maintain a clearing house for the illicit P2P trade you are as guilty as the traders themselves.
This is not exactly a novel principle in civil and criminal law - and the geek might usefully ask himself if he really wants to see it eroded.
just make sure your bribe is big enough to get your personal law enacted...
I would like to introduce a modest compliment to Godwin's Law:
When the geek launches into a rant on the theme of bribery, all hope of intelligent discussion has ended.
There is in the UK:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound_sterling#Legal_tender_and_regional_issues
Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
This is why in some stores that accept credit cards you will see signs saying that you may not use credit for purchases less than X.XX amount. This is because small transactions like that actually cost them more money than they make.
Those signs are (probably) in violation of their Merchant Agreement. For instance:
http://usa.visa.com/download/merchants/card_acceptance_guide.pdf
"Always honor valid Visa cards in your acceptance catagory, regardless of the dollar amount of the purchase. Imposing minimum or maximum purchase amounts in order to accept Visa card transactions is a violation of the Visa rules" [emphasis in original]
For some reason one of the british tabloids was running some kind of investigation where they encouraged members of the public to send in letters and artifacts protesting against gay rights. A few people i knew researched the royal mail freepost they had on their incoming address and realized it'd take any second-class mail package.
They sent them a broken washing machine.
Kinda like sitting at the front of the bus when it's illegal to do so. Trivial and childish sounding yes, but society changing nonetheless.
No, it's kinda like sitting at the front of the bus, getting convicted for doing so, and then punching the judge in the face.
Just to remind, when Rosa Parks was fined for sitting in front of the bus, she appealed the decision, and rallied the Black community to (legally) boycott the buses in the area. Speaking of which, have you stopped buying (or otherwise obtaining, by any means) anything published by labels that are members of RIAA and MPAA?