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No Windows 7 XP Mode For Sony Vaio Z Owners
Voyager529 writes "While virtually every Core 2 Duo processor supports the hardware virtualization technology that powers the Windows 7 XP Mode, The Register UK reports that the Core 2 Duo processors in the Sony Vaio Z series laptops had the virtualization features intentionally crippled in the BIOS. Senior manager for product marketing Xavier Lauwaert stated that the QA engineers did this to make the systems more resilient against malicious code. He also stated that while they are considering enabling VT in some laptop models due to the backlash, the Z series are not among those being retrofitted."
Senior manager for product marketing Xavier Lauwaert stated that the QA engineers did this to make the systems more resilient against malicious code.
If they don't like Windows XP they can say so. Calling it malicious code will piss off Microsoft no end.
If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
Hey, it's Sony. What kind of customer support did you expect.
It's not like they've got a long history depicting a care for their customers, rootkits being only 1 example.
They probably want to protect their customers from Rootkits that some manufacturers put on their CDs: http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/10/31/2016223
If only there was some way to replace the BIOS, with some sort of flashing... I'm sure at some point they'll be a alternative firmware for those people silly enough to think that Sony would embrace anything that wasn't one of their proprietary formats.
Since DOS died the BIOS has been little more than a glorified POST. So why can't the OS just enable any features that the BIOS doesn't? Its not like any modern OS uses the BIOS once its up and running anyway - just some information the BIOS may have provided which the OS can double check for itself anyway.
::Sony BIOS SCREEN::
Virtualization: Disabled
Complimentary Rootkits: Enabled
In other news, Sony has decided to disable the second core in many of its dual-core models. Senior douchebag Joe Schmo defended the decision, saying "Often the second core just allows people to run malware in the background without noticing it."
Um, no thanks, Sony. How about you let your customers decide whether they want to turn off processor features?
"Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
...because we already know Sony is evil as hell and we don't buy their laptops.
And anybody who went and forgot that lesson deserves whatever abuse Sony heaps on 'em.
The virtual technology extensions of my Lenovo Thinkpass T400 has also been intentionally crippled. Sony isn't the only company making bad decisions with higher-end laptops.
Can the bios be re-flashed with something more useful?
I'd like to know if this is a purely commercial move or if there is actually technical merit to it ? I doubt this move actually will drive up sale but I think there is a case that older codes can be security problem.
Given that they wrote their own.
Disabling useful functionality to protect against hypothetical malware? Priceless. Especially given that one of the highest-profile rootkits was DEVELOPED and DISTRIBUTED by Sony.
If they really were worried about malware, they'd lock out installing Windows...
"Senior manager for product marketing Xavier Lauwaert stated that the QA engineers did this to make the systems more profitable by creating an artificial differentiation we can use to charge more money for basically the same thing."
www.eFax.com are spammers
Comment removed based on user account deletion
This is exactly why I don't buy Sony products, whether it's a computer, camera, music, etc. Consumers have been burned by them enough times with their retarded proprietary formats, lawsuits, rootkits, and just an overall blatent disrespect for consumers that I'm surprised anyone buys their crap anymore.
Why not just have an on off option for VT extensions in the bios?
My thoughts: because sony will call VT extensions on newer laptops a feature not included in previous laptops.
They have done this in many other older models too. I had to boot my laptop with a dos boot disk (yes, you heard that right) and set a certain value.
The best thing is that which value to set depends on the model and needless to say is not documented anywhere... It took me a whole day to find the right one by trial and error, rebooting and testing after changing every record...
Nice job, Sony!
When was the last time that a hardware fault contributed to malware on a typical PC that there are many thousands of varieties (as in, not a mobile device, and not a Mac, because there are only a few models of those). In 99.999% of malware cases they are flaws in the OS, user or programs. Not a flaw in the CPU, motherboard, RAM or monitor. And really Sony, why disable a feature that a lot of people might have bought a high-end laptop to have that in it? Not that I know why anyone would even think about buying an overpriced Vaio, but really, don't disable features and make it impossible or hard to re-enable.
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Just an fyi, the LinuxBIOS project was renamed Coreboot.
If you are willing to risk potentially bricking your laptop, somebody came up with a way to re-enable VT on some laptops with an InsydeH20 bios.
Check it out:
http://feature-enable.blogspot.com/
I think the real reason is so Virtual Box and the like will not run, making the Sony Microsoft only. Once M$ figures out how to allow XP virtulazation without letting "malicious software" such as Linux run, everything will be fine.
* Carthago Delenda Est *
Sounds like, if you want to use VT, they will sell you a "different" laptop model, for probably 25-50% higher price, which is the exact same laptop with a BIOS that doesn't disable this feature.
Only 6 out of 11 of the 45nm Core2 duo chips support VT according to info on intel.com. That's not "virtually every".
Not nitpicking for the sake of it, just don't want people to assume that the Core2 they're intending to buy supports VT. Best to check.
Back in 2000, when Win2K was out and happy but the proles were stuck with Win98/ME, I decided I wanted a laptop.
There was a cheap Sony laptop with Win98/ME on it that looked good to me and was on sale. I checked, there was a version of the same laptop with Win2K available, but it was a few hundred dollars more if you could FIND it, and the UC CS dept had a site liscence/arrangement for Win2K.
So I figured, why not? Buy it at fry's, reinstall with a remotely tolerable Windows OS, be happy.
Get the laptop, blow away the Win98/ME crap, put on Win2K, only to find out that Sony locks all the drivers with BIOS strings and the like so the drivers from the Win2K version won't install on any other notebook, even when the chipsets and everything are identical!
Fortunately, Fry's had a good return policy. So rather than going hunting for manufacturer sites for drivers, I said, screw it, popped in the reimage disk, and restored it and returned it.
A few weeks later, I bought an IBM notebook off a friend with PowerBook envy, much prefering the IBM site wher you put in the model # on the bottom and you get every driver for every OS variant, including Linux, in a nice neat grid...
But even nearly a decade ago, Sony was gimping their laptops badly. Glad to see they are keeping THAT tradition alive...
Test your net with Netalyzr
VT can potentially cause problems on a system. It isn't likely, but it is possible. Usually it is if two VM programs try to use it at the same time. Regardless, it is something that, for now, most people don't need. Thus many manufacturers disable it by default. My Intel DP35DP board had VT disabled by default in the BIOS. However, there was nothing stopping me from enabling it. Intel, of course, is not interested in crippling their own products, they are very happy about VT and like to market it. They just figured, correctly, that you can turn it on if you want it.
So check your BIOS. If you can turn VT on, then do so if you want it.
Come from the marketing teams? Senior manager for product marketing Xavier Lauwaert http://www.b2blog.com/2006/dt040319.gif
My Acer Aspire 2930 laptop (Intel Core2Duo CPU) has the VT extensions disabled at BIOS level. Don't buy this model, and be aware of buying other models from Acer.
For sure I will not buy anything from Acer. In addition to the VT %$%$$%-ing, the laptop VGA output it is not properly shielded because of poor design, and produces a signal with a bit of flickering (to get a digital DVI output you have in addition to spend over 125 € for a "Easyport IV" dock station).
"While virtually every Core 2 Duo processor supports the hardware virtualization technology that powers the Windows 7 XP Mode"
That is virtually wrong. In the mobile computing market, most Core2Duo machines that support Intel VT live in the higher end of the price spectrum, such as the P8600. A great many mid-range machines use the T6400,T6500 CPU's, which do not give you VT support.
"While virtually every Core 2 Duo processor supports the hardware virtualization technology that powers the Windows 7 XP Mode"
This is not my understanding. I believe there are a number of Core 2 Duo CPUs which do not support Intel VT:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Core_2_microprocessors#Core_2_Duo
Plus, many other Intel non Core 2 Duo CPUs are excluded. The media seems to leave out the detail that many users will not be able to use XP Mode.
The first line of this summary is quite wrong. Intel has LOTS of Core2Duo's that do not support Intel VT. A quick look through their processor matrix will confirm this. Still, it's common practise for laptop manufacturers to disable things like VT on their consumer models. My Toshiba satellite has it disabled (not changeable in BIOS), but the pro version of it (same mainboard and cpu) has the option. I'm sure there is some way to get it working via a hex editor or something, but then we're into voiding warranties (if the bios gets fubared).
See
http://marcansoft.com/blog/2009/06/enabling-intel-vt-on-the-aspire-8930g/
Maybe a similar trick also works for Sony notebooks (if it is UEFI based).
They're more expensive than MacBooks and not nearly as trendy!
Lots of cheap Intel processors don't even have Intel VT, while most of the AMD processors in the same price range have it enabled. While I like the fact that some of the new Pentium processors run really cool, I would never consider buying a new processor without virtualization support. Yet most of the current cheap machines (laptops and boxen) that come with Intel use processors without virtualization. Kinda limits your choices. But then again I always liked AMD better.
.. because if you can install a hypervisor, you can use it to virtualise devices, which means you can use it to produce digital copies of media.
VT is a HUGE security risk that malware writers exploit and can write rootkits for. Its disabled on my desktops for good reason. HP also disables it.
Most I.T. departments request VT to be disabled and I was not aware that Windows7 used the hypervisor to run XP (makes sense). I will add its possible to reflash the bios to support using it but I would not recommend it. In this day and age and I am shocked at the amount of malware out there and how easy it is to get infected. Its like the wild west and most users do not know about security and will click on things that look like Windows pop ups or read email from trusted sources that have links for browse by infections. These are Sony's customers not to mention after the bad press with the rootkit fiasco Sony probably overeacted by making there laptops they way they are.
With VT you can not remove the malware without a complete wipe as its undetectable by any anti virus package and its as scary as the lojack bug that runs at the bios level and can't be disabled.
There is no real use of VT anyway since cores are now dual.
http://saveie6.com/
Intel charges more for chips with VT enabled, they use it as an up sell. Many laptop manufacturers are choosing not to pay the extra, especially on low end laptops with razor thin margins. This isn't just a Sony problem. As any Apple fanboy can tell you, Apple pays for the good stuff.
Toshiba does this on some of their laptops, too, including mine, as I discovered recently. It's there as a bios option, but no way to change it from "disabled".
I hope Toshiba decides to provide an update to re-enable the VT, but so far they haven't made a statement about it at all, AFAIK.
"Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
--- Jerry Garcia
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/si...cid=MIGR-64409
Virtual machines are a security feature. A VM establishes a security barrier around the OS> If you're infected, you just roll back the VM to the last snapshot and you're clean.
Security is like sex, once you're penetrated you're ****ed. Blocking useful security tools because they make it very slightly easier to hide after a successful penetration is asinine. And complaining about the cleanup cost? I normally reformat and reinstall after a virus is detected... and I've had to do that ONCE on any computer I've owned since 1986.
If people took some responsibility for their computers instead of depending on hacks like AV software to detect and clean up after they screw up, there wouldn't BE a virus problem.
As for your last line, "There is no real use of VT anyway since cores are now dual."... I have no idea what you mean by that, so here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.
This is the same crap as cell phone companies disabling features on those phones. You read a great review of a new cell phone (or CPU), only to find out that when you buy it from this manufacturer that it won't do that.
Now as to why Sony will enable it on some laptops, yet not others, truly boggles the mind.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
feature-enable.blogspot.com and any VT-worries on current Sony Vaio Z series with current bios versions are gone.
I was recommending Dell lattitudes, IBM thinkpads primarily a few years back.
An executive wanting to be cost conscious because he didn't use any serious programs wanted to get a Sony. Lasted 2 years. Went and got another one and lasted about the same amount of time. Has yet another one, this one is going on 3 years. The remaining users (4) that got the Dells and the IBM's have been chugging along for 5++ years.
As for OS. I have some data mining software that I use and for the last year I have seen people complain over and over again that they are seeing slow performance on Vista. In some cases it is 4x. It's proprietary software and the people who do the programming just aren't that literate on what is going on. But basically it boils down to, they do not understand why their program runs slower in some cases on Vista. So Vista users in this case are screwed, blame it on Vista or the 3rd party vendor.
Maybe sooner or later consumers will realize that they are getting less with the latest computers primarily because the OS and the software on top just runs less efficiently.
And I can't really say that Linux is immune to this.
I recently looked into purchasing some data analysis software and found that it cost $1000 dollars extra to be able to run it in SMP mode.
since many years ago. Their PC lines are the most crippled PC products I have ever seen. They often use some strange/closed hardware that nowhere to find open source driver. And now this. Toshiba is not much better. Lenovo/IBM usually much better than them anyway. I would rather even stay with DELL if I have to.
Perhaps there is already some hypervisor running that we don't know about?
As a Z owner who is planning on upgrading to Windows 7, this pisses me off. That machine was nearly as expensive as my mac... my mac!
It's worth noting that, scarily enough, it *was* still cheaper than my MBP, and the MBP has all sorts of issues running Windows. Sadly, the one ideal computer to run all OS's is actually three and a roll of duct tape.
As the unhappy owner of a sony vaio VGN-FZ240, I was also a victim of sony's stupidity.
Not only I couldn't use the VT extension on my CPU; they also decided not to release hd controller drivers for Windows XP, which made it impossible to install XP instead of Vista.
I contacted their support staff for both issues, and of course, there was no solution from them.
After some yahooing I found how to enable VT:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=189228
If you own a Sony Vaio Z series laptop just follow the instructions in the thread and you will be able to use VT.
I was also able to install XP by creating a custom install CD with the drivers from a similar model.
As was mentioned, Google is your friend. You can find out how to "hack" this to work on a number of laptop forums. Within a week of buying my VAIO AR670 about 18 months ago (also with VT disabled in the BIOS), I found the hex byte signature to look for in a BIOS image file and patched them to enable VT.
Some technology disabled in some laptop is somehow presented as Windows flaw! Sometimes I am amazed by your journalism skills.
Even models that are supposed to support this mode. Why take the chance?
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
So I'm actually posting from the Grizza, it's a Sony Vaio 'desk top replacement' PCG-GRZ530. And it's a POS.
Sure, it's from 2004 and sports a 2.4GHz P4 with 512MB (maxed out) RAM. Upgraded HDD to 60GB (3rd drive in system up from 20GB low rpm stock drive). It's worked reliably since Jan/Feb 2003 since I bought it NIB...
#1 CPU overheats. Turns out they had shitty design of cpu/heatsink and it's a common problem for everyone. Solution: Sony says send it in for a fee. Real fix: Blow the dust out every 2 weeks or so.
#2 Hinge breaks out of NO WHERE! Having babied this bad boy for ever it's unacceptable that it breaks. Turns out its bad hinge design. I barely fixed it after having been busted for 2-3 years and it turns out BOTH hinges can't be turned by hand at all. You need some good pliers. Soaked in WD-40 and they still don't turn. The screws that go through the hinge attach to the plastic cover plate! So of course they are busted and should have the cover replaced. Bring in the Ghetto! Tiny nuts and bolts fix that problem, cover just hanging on with retainer clips!
#3 Good luck getting help from sony and or their "authorized" service centers. They all rob for non-service. Look at the complaints people have posted across countless forums. Look up my model and see it for yourself!
#4 "Like no other" is right!!!!!!!!!!!!
So i'm not surprised they are burning more customers. That's why I will NEVER buy as long as I can help it another sony product. Here is my list of experiences (all ending badly):
- walk man
- tv's
- home stereo's
- car stereos
- speakers (these were "ok")
- remote controls (various)
- note book (PC)
- DiscMan
- Home Phone
LoL A lot of this stuff i didn't buy but ended up with. All junk!
The only 2 good things I can say about this note book is that it runs FreeBSD without issues (had to do some work to get screen brightness controls working - reminds me, have to reply to another post on how to get that to work) and the screen has been pretty bitchen. It has a white spot in the top left quarter of screen the size of an pencil eraser.
Oh and while working on the hinges i "broke" the power and memory card reader ribbon cables. So from paying $35 for 1 of them from sony i got both for $18 on ebay (thank god). Then i tried to replace the heat paste on the heat sink only to find out it can't be removed, they must have used that sticky shit on it instead of regular spread wtf?
It's old, heavy and a bitch to use with modern software (windows 7 testing ATM - runs good actually) but i'll replace it only until it won't turn on again (and i can't fix it!).
My abilities are only limited by my imagination
If Sony is disabling features to make their laptops more resiliant against malware attacks, can we expect them to offer support and resolution to malware attacks that occur because of their hardware/BIOS?
I bet not. So why not leave alone that which you are not willing to fully support anyways?
On another note, Intel (amd probably AMD) mess with the VT features, scattering them all over the processor product lines. You need a frakking CPA to work through the permutations and find the processor(s) that have all the features and performance you want or will pay for. !Simple. !Friendly. Evil.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
why, oh why don't people just buy Apple. I don't know one single person that don't love their macbook. no registration key, posix compliance, boots from suspend in a second, stable, secure, only very minor bugs, shiny new OS for $30 and even a pro for much less than you used to pay for a DX4 66 back in the day.
WINRAR!
if you have the money for a Sony, you might as well get a Apple.
Trying to characterize the modern Sony in any meaningfully consistent way is an exercise in futility. Sony, like any major Japanese company, has always existed in a number of fairly distinct units or "silos," but in their present incarnation, they are spread across such a wide variety of markets that it's almost a coincidence they bear the same brand name.
Sony BMG, obviously, is the most consumer-unfriendly, as well as the least market-savvy. The rootkit debacle of four years ago has stayed with the tech community and poisoned its perception of the entire brand, but it's not really fair to conflate that with anything the VAIO division does -- VAIO is off in its own world from Sony BMG.
VAIO, as evidenced by this story, obviously has its own struggles, as does Sony Computer Entertainment, as does each Sony business unit in its own way. But they do not move as one.
Your mind is clear / The things that you fear / Will fade with how much you / Believe what you hear
msoft is involved with or actively and quietly coercing hardware manufacturers (especially consumer computers/laptops/cell phones/multipurpose devices capable of loading and usefully running Linux or non-windows apps/OSs), then i dare say that ms needs to be NUKED TO HELL by any and all means possible. I won't do it myself, but if an escrow account asking for money popped up, i would seriously consider donating a few dollars (unless the government turned me into a pussy wishing to avoid jail/prison time).
If they call it something like "Legal fund to put ms into restraints" (or, at least didn't use obvious terms that imply illegal plans to illegally depose ms once and for all), then i would imagine those in favor of crippling/knee-capping and skull-cracking ms the entity should be legally safe ... After all, there are all sorts of charities that are not under scrutiny (and some, for anti-terrorism reasons and banking irregularities/money laundering activities) in which a court might not find against an individual. I would imagine the perps would have to set up, operate, and account as a legitimate business... until the VERY END, when they hear that frackin' tune that switches Cylons on...
But, tell you what, I'd rather be a sleeper Cylon or turgid Hybrid water than yield to mshaft... If, only IF i had a magic wand with any wish available... of ALL the possible wishes, i'd even give up immortality to see a handful of companies pummel mshaft into permanent oblivion. It would force individuals, companies, and countries to pull ms' trunk out of their rear ends and take control of their computing landscape.
(Go ahead, mark me troll/flamebait/inflammatory/etc... At least this will get read.)
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
Isn't that what their media branch thrives on?
Sounds like the left hand isn't taking to the right hand in their corporate headquarters. ( or the market guys, since its hard to sell designed in defects as features )
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Bought one for my wife some years ago. Never again. Full of crapware and misleading Sony hardware specs. It will only boot from a $300 Sony CDROM; well no. The $80 Sony mouse will only work on Sony laptops with WIN98; well no again. I'm tired of all their BS and screwy restrictions. No Sony computers, no Sony TVs, no Sony cameras!
Sorry, but gray text on gray background is making my eyes bleed.
It came crippled. Sony sucks.
I had to boot a DOS disk and change a single flag in the address space mapped to flash for BIOS options.
That was easy. It took weeks to find the correct flag however. NEVER buy Sony (though I'm sure most nerds knew this already).
my MBP runs Windows like a dream in Parallels. XP, not Vista.
Ask Me About... The 80's!
There are "fixed" BIOS files for this fixed on the internet or hex editor instructions if you are not so trusting. These fixed the problem for me.