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New iPod Touch Has an 802.11n Chip

eggboard writes "iFixIt has discovered a Broadcom 802.11a/b/g/n chip in the just-announced iPod touch (32 GB and 64 GB) models that uses single-stream 802.11n. Single-stream doesn't get the full power of N, but it boosts speed enough that — along with space-time block encoding, a feature coming soon to Wi-Fi access points with two or more radios — the iPod touch could be an effective networked media server, for streaming and transfer, possibly through the new iTunes Home Sharing feature."

135 comments

  1. Why didn't they tell us? by maharb · · Score: 1

    Why didn't they tell us earlier? Seems odd to me.

    1. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by alen · · Score: 3, Funny

      now that the spec is final, Apple will write a driver and make sure to enable n only via their WiFi access points

    2. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Tubal-Cain · · Score: 2, Informative

      Why didn't they tell us earlier?

      iFixIt? Because they just found out.
      Apple still hasn't told anybody.

    3. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by NoYob · · Score: 5, Funny

      Why didn't they tell us earlier? Seems odd to me.

      It's part of their marketing. Now, when fanboys say that Apple products are NOT more expensive when you compare them feature to feature with others, the fanboys can also point out that you're also buying features that you don't know about! See how superior Apple products are?!

      --
      It's NOT me! It's the meds! I'm on 1000mg of Fukitol.
    4. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by maharb · · Score: 1

      OK. Why hasn't Apple told anyone?

    5. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Undocumented Features?

      Back in my day we called those "Bugs"?

      P.S. Get off my lawn!

    6. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by RedK · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Because the iPod Touch doesn't support 802.11n networking, only b and g. What purpose would it serve to say "Hey, the device is 802.11n capable, but the software won't let you use it". They probably used that particular chip for cost reasons. The chip is perfectly capable of doing b and g and probably costs less in volumes than the b/g only chips now that technology has gone forward.

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    7. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by jzk · · Score: 1

      This is almost certainly the precise reason.

    8. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Funny

      They aren't allowed to rewrite the drivers. Sawbones-Oxleaf act or something.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    9. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by v1 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's possible they may sell another $5 upgrade for N as they did when N first came out, for the macbooks that shipped juuust before N was announced on them.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    10. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by icebike · · Score: 4, Informative

      Maybe because this chip really does not support N?

      Just because it is from that family of chips doesn't mean it has N.

      Look at the designator on the end of the chipset full designation: BCM4329FKUBG That BG at the end may be telling.

      I'm sure when Apple calls, Broadcom pays attention, and will burn custom chip sets, omitting any feature Apple does not want.

      the full BCM4329FKUBG designation does not appear in Broadcom's catalog. Its a custom chip.

      Besides, N requires special antennas. They were not found.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    11. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by mr_lizard13 · · Score: 4, Funny

      And for $10 it will enable the camera.

      --
      "We live in a global world" - Harvey Pitt, former Securities and Exchange Commission Chairman
    12. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by sydbarrett74 · · Score: 4, Funny

      I wonder if it's a coincidence that the near-last digits are FKU....

      --
      'He who has to break a thing to find out what it is, has left the path of wisdom.' -- Gandalf to Saruman
    13. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Dhalka226 · · Score: 5, Funny

      FKUBG... hmmm. Fuck You Bill Gates?

    14. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Dog-Cow · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      God-willing you will die horribly and painfully for being such an asshole.

    15. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe because this chip really does not support N?

      Just because it is from that family of chips doesn't mean it has N.

      Look at the designator on the end of the chipset full designation: BCM4329FKUBG That BG at the end may be telling.

      [...]

      the full BCM4329FKUBG designation does not appear in Broadcom's catalog. Its a custom chip.

      Besides, N requires special antennas. They were not found.

      The trailing characters following a family name (BCM 4329) usually specify package type and other options. Full documentation for this kind (i.e., something that contains radios dealing with new standards) of chip is only provided to users who are going to buy at least a few thousand, but I'm sure someone on /. can find a more complete PDF than this. Maybe you're right about the "BG" or maybe not. However...

      What I found more interesting is that this family of chips contains an FM transmitter. Bye-bye aftermarket add-ons for transmitting to your car stereo, eh?

    16. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by jo42 · · Score: 1

      For the iPod touch, all you have to know is where to find the link for the latest ipsw file (off of Apple's own servers even) and save a few pesos. Google is your friend here.

    17. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Very wrong. N does NOT need special antennas.

      N uses same frequencies as bg and a (2.4 and 5 GHz respectively), so the physical aspect of the antennas is the same

      N can use " more" antennas for implementing spacial diversity (MIMO/SIMO depending on how many you got).

      So you can have full N on the same antennas as bg, just you will get 3 antennas instead of 2, if your particular N chipset has 2x3 or 3x3 MIMO

      So, this client chipset in the iPod can fully implement N capabilities with a single antenna (assuming that the chipset is capable, as it could be a custom), altough it will not be able to use high data rates MCS, as it would have a single spatial stream

      Regards

    18. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by janhalcion · · Score: 1

      They didn't tell anyone that the ipod touch was fully capable of using Bluetooth. It was 'added' later with the last big upgrade. So everyone had a device that was fully capable of being bluetooth enabled, but they didn't know it because Apple disabled it and only gave it to you when you paid ten dollars for an upgrade. The Bluetooth chip wasn't just sitting there being unused either, it was what they ran their Nike sports platform on.

      --
      This is where I put my faggoty, pseudo-intellectual sig.
    19. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by YesIAmAScript · · Score: 1

      I agree with you about the antennas.

      The final letters in an electronics part name are almost always a package code. Especially in this case, where UBG could easily stand for Micro Ball Grid (u being a mu), meaning a micro (high pitch) ball grid array package.

      I think this article is really dumb. Almost certainly the new Touch doesn't do n at all. Just because the chip can do it, doesn't mean Apple loaded on the software that does it. And why should they if it only has a 2.4GHz antenna?

      On this same front, if Apple didn't put in an FM antenna, it isn't going to be receiving or transmitting FM either, even if someone does manage to smack the software into there somehow.

      --
      http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
    20. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by icebike · · Score: 1

      Except that mbg is not used for surface mount chips.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    21. Re:Why didn't they tell us? by YesIAmAScript · · Score: 1

      All ball grid packages are surface mount, including micro. Through-holes are not required to sit balls on!

      --
      http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
  2. Anonymous Coward by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    This would be cool if it had a camera

    1. Re:Anonymous Coward by jo42 · · Score: 0

      Apple wants you to buy an iPhone to get a (crappy) camera. Despite all the rumors, I don't see an iPod touch with a camera in the near future.

  3. Panties STINK!!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Troll

    Panties Stink!
    They really, really stink!
    Sometimes they're red, sometimes they're green,
    Sometimes they're white or black or pink
    Sometimes they're satin, sometimes they're lace
    Sometimes they're cotton and soak up stains
    But at the end of the day, it really makes you think
    Wooooooo-wheeeee! Panties stink!

    Sometimes they're on the bathroom floor
    Your girlfriend- what a whore!
    Sometimes they're warm and wet and raw
    From beneath the skirt of your mother-in-law
    Brownish stains from daily wear
    A gusset full of pubic hair
    Just make sure your nose is ready
    For the tang of a sweat-soaked wedgie
    In your hand a pair of drawers
    With a funky feminine discharge
    Give your nose a rest, fix yourself a drink
    cause wooooooo-wheeeeeee! panties stink!

  4. Awesome! by commodoresloat · · Score: 5, Funny

    Wireless! More space than a Nomad! I finally have a reason to get an iPod!

    1. Re:Awesome! by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 0, Redundant

      LOL

    2. Re:Awesome! by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      No camera. Only syncs with iTunes. Lame.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  5. Server? by royallthefourth · · Score: 1

    the iPod touch could be an effective networked media server

    I doubt you could call it effective when it would still be tied down by battery life. That could be remedied by plugging it in, but if you have a computer, it seems it would just make more sense to stream from the computer than the iPod.

    1. Re:Server? by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I doubt you could call it effective when it would still be tied down by battery life. That could be remedied by plugging it in, but if you have a computer, it seems it would just make more sense to stream from the computer than the iPod.

      Your comment makes sense, until the moment you want to take a movie you own over to a friend's house to watch.

      --
      "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    2. Re:Server? by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 1

      Your comment makes sense, except why would you have movies stored on your iPod? Surely you don't try to squint at a 4 inch screen for 90 minutes.. Keep them on an external drive (where space doesn't cost you $25/GB)

    3. Re:Server? by ZackSchil · · Score: 5, Informative

      iPods output to televisions.

    4. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Shouldn't that read "iPod docks that cost twice as much as the iPod itself output to televisions"?

    5. Re:Server? by RedK · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No because you don't need a dock, just a cable.

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    6. Re:Server? by MadnessASAP · · Score: 2, Informative

      But then it's not a streaming network server is it, it's a portable device with a shitty composite output.

      --
      I may agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to face the consequences of saying it.
    7. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1, Informative

      Weird, googling "iPod HDMI Out" didn't lead me to many adapter cables...

    8. Re:Server? by Sir_Lewk · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I certainly don't see a USB port on my television.

      --
      "linux is just DOS with a UNIX like syntax" -- Galactic Dominator (944134)
    9. Re:Server? by /dev/trash · · Score: 1

      Your comment makes sense til you say that he owns the movies. They're actually being licensed.

    10. Re:Server? by RedK · · Score: 4, Informative

      HDMI is only one way to connect to a TV. How bout you try to get informed before spouting nonsense : http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1454.

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    11. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 0

      HDMI, DisplayPort, DVI, it's all the same. No, composite is not an option. No, S-Video isn't an option.

    12. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      So what do I do with those weird looking plugs? :P

      Do TVs still come with composite inputs? I know all my displays have D-Sub/DVI/HDMI/DisplayPort, so I guess I'd be SOL if I had an iPod...

    13. Re:Server? by RedK · · Score: 1

      What are you blabbering about ? First, the Apple article shows that Component is a valid a connection (and no, Composite and Component aren't the same thing) and even then, S-video, Composite and Component all permit a iPod to hook up to a TV, contradicting your initial statement of even needing a dock.

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    14. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      I'm blabbering about the fact that I'd prefer digital content to stay digital on its way to the digital display instead of going through D/A/D conversion, as well as having to pass through a crappy overpriced (probably badly shielded) iPod=>Component cable in analog form.

      Or maybe it's the fact that I don't actually know anyone that has a device in their home that accepts component inputs...

    15. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      Very concise, me likey.

    16. Re:Server? by PIBM · · Score: 1

      The ipod touch right here would support

      2. 480i/576i.

      On my nice 1080p TV. I'm so going to downgrade the latest bluray to 480i !

    17. Re:Server? by Idiomatick · · Score: 1

      The cable for component output (which is only 480i) costs 55$. Which would cost about 10$ normally. But since apple uses their own proprietary output it costs a lot more. Yay hating standards to raise prices. BTW mini/micro usb is better in all ways (ubs 2.0) not to mention the plug is like 1/8th the size.

    18. Re:Server? by NewNole2001 · · Score: 1

      Or maybe it's the fact that I don't actually know anyone that has a device in their home that accepts component inputs...

      My brand new Samsung UN55B8000 (Check it, it's their top of the line LED set) has one component input.

      My LG 47LH55 (bought in June) has two component inputs..

      Heck, it even has one composite input.

      Something tells me you're wrong.

    19. Re:Server? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or maybe it's the fact that I don't actually know anyone that has a device in their home that accepts component inputs...

      Every TV I own and every TV I've seen for sale in the last 5 years (excluding some already obsolete SDTVs) has a component input on it. So what, you don't know anyone that owns a TV?

    20. Re:Server? by RedK · · Score: 1

      Hum, the initial premise was that the iPod could do TV output. You retorted the following :

      Shouldn't that read "iPod docks that cost twice as much as the iPod itself output to televisions"?

      I corrected you saying the dock wasn't necessary at all, that just the cable was. Now you're just trying to not be wrong by changing your original message (which is impossible through editing, so you're trying to troll it away).

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    21. Re:Server? by RedK · · Score: 1

      You do understand you can buy third party solutions for much cheaper right ? The connector might be proprietary but there are tons of 3rd parties that do make devices for iPod with it and Apple doesn't prevent it.

      --
      "Not to mention all the idiots who use words like boxen."
      Anonymous Coward on Monday August 04, @06:49PM
    22. Re:Server? by oman_ · · Score: 1

      iPod movies are a great way to pass the time on airplanes, or on layovers in airports. I always take the AV cable when I travel so I can hook it up to the TV when I get to the hotel room.

      --
      Rats would be more funny if they could fart.
    23. Re:Server? by mabhatter654 · · Score: 1

      because the 30 pin iPod connector has extra pins for all sorts of things... USB in, power in, power out, audio-in, audio-out, video-out, and some spares for when Apple feels like new features. Yes, they could have 3 standard plugs across the bottom but the dock has been a pretty good socket the last 5 years or so... it's not going anywhere. The adapter lets them make all the iPods the same and pickup whatever standard connectors they feel like blessing the masses with in the adapter, making things cheaper for the majority of users that will never bother with anything but the standard cable.

      I'll be blunt, I bought all the cables for my last iPod and never actually USED them for more than a curiosity (ok, I have an Apple TV for connecting to my TV and it has HDMI out and Component) I would like to see a dual alarm bedside clock that also pulls out the video to something 6-8" or so.

    24. Re:Server? by m.ducharme · · Score: 1

      I have a television that accepts component inputs. Oldish Panasonic Tau CRT television. Has inputs for co-ax, composite and component, no digital. Not everyone gives a shit about digital television, you know.

      --
      Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
    25. Re:Server? by LaraineMae · · Score: 1

      My Bravia has a USB port, but, whoop-de-do, it views only jpegs and mp3s and only when they are on Sony-branded media (only Sony camera or Sony MICRO VAULT drive). And I found out from costco tech support that it's only USB 1.1.

    26. Re:Server? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      10$? you mean 2$ max.

    27. Re:Server? by Sir_Lewk · · Score: 1

      (probably badly shielded)

      And that's when I write you off as an AV-phile. Let me guess, you also raise and seperate all of your cables with little wood blocks to "dampen the vibrations" too.

      --
      "linux is just DOS with a UNIX like syntax" -- Galactic Dominator (944134)
    28. Re:Server? by Dog-Cow · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Or maybe you're a fucking asshole. Oh wait. No maybes about it.

    29. Re:Server? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      So what do I do with those weird looking plugs?

      Troll the internet with them?

    30. Re:Server? by ZackSchil · · Score: 1

      All my TVs do, both the CRTs and LCDs. It's also the cable I bought for the Wii to use it in progressive scan and the video cable that came with the XBox 360.

    31. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      Nope, I mostly just buy stuff that's priced right and works well... I'm not one of those idiots who buys $300 Monster HDMI cables or anything like that, but when it comes to analog signals (whch I don't actually use for video any more), I'm pretty careful about the cables I use. I've used my share of composite/component/s-video cables (work as a live sound tech part time, and often that includes setting up video of some sort - usually old projectors that have analog inputs and such) that didn't provide all-too-good quality, especially when run past fun stuff like racks full of dimmers or amps.

    32. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      Interesting. I was under the impression that most people had moved to digital inputs, and that Component was purely legacy for stuff like old VCRs or older console systems. Again, why would you put a digital signal through DA, run it through a length of cable in analog form (in which it's bound to change in SOME way or other), and then convert it back digital before it's displayed on the (digital) screen?

      As for the "I don't know anyone with equip. with component inputs" part: Obviously, I was exaggerating a little. A buddy of mine has a 30" tube TV that most definitely has component inputs...

    33. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      In case you're still wondering, you're obviously right. An iPod can output a signal to a TV via component cables. For anyone who's still confused: RedK WAS RIGHT.

      I've long moved on to discussing the component connection, which is a completely different issue... I just find it slightly insulting that a modern device sold with "TV Output" only does component, when every other device is moving on to DisplayPort/HDMI.

    34. Re:Server? by dwater · · Score: 1

      the ipod shuffle didn't have the same connector...don't know about today's line up but even though they had the same connector available when they designed my shuffle, they chose not to ... Probably for size reasons, but still, it does not let them choose it for all ipods because it is too big for some of them.

      --
      Max.
    35. Re:Server? by sam0vi · · Score: 1

      Or use the Ipod as a external drive (which is what i usually do, and i think that's what GP meant), download it to your friend's computer (if he doesn't have one his not your friend). Solved

      --
      When my Karma level reaches 0 I feel in piece with the Universe
    36. Re:Server? by makomk · · Score: 1

      Indeed - a cable which "merely" costs a significant proportion of the price you paid for the original iPod. No cheap third-party cables, either - they're having problems bypassing the requirement for an Apple authentication chip before any recent iPod enables its video output.

    37. Re:Server? by makomk · · Score: 1

      For the older, lower-tech iPods yes. The iPhone and iPod Touch, as well as various other current-gen iPods, refuse to enable the video output unless the cable has a lock-out chip that's only available from Apple under strict conditions, including giving Apple a cut. So cheap cables don't actually work with most of the recent iPods.

    38. Re:Server? by Idiomatick · · Score: 1

      Considering you have an apple tv and bought connectors you dont need or use you are clearly a true blue apple fan (aka you hate money). But as it is USB 2.0 transfers more power and more data and is much much MUCH more widely used so you could use the cables with other things if you wished. USB 3.0 Is many times faster and transfers even more power.

      Pretty damn sure there is no reason for breaking standards. Except one of course, and that is to deprive you from your money for no good reason. If you can't see that micro USB is a better solution there is no hope for you, sorry.

    39. Re:Server? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      USB has superior bandwidth, but no guaranteed I/O. Unfortunately, Apple decided to charge royalties for Firewire (which DOES have guaranteed rate I/O in single host/single client-type scenarios) and we ended up with USB instead; 80MHz faster, but dramatically slower and crappier in every real-world scenario.

      History is full of examples like this. 3DFX basically doomed us to suffer Direct3D when they created GLIDE instead of going with MiniGL from the start, which would have been a vastly better idea in every way. They thought they'd own the market, but that was an utterly idiotic thing to think. They opened the door for Microsoft to create yet another graphics API and now Microsoft DOES own a disturbingly big piece of 3D graphics.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    40. Re:Server? by ZackSchil · · Score: 1

      You do know that component is the Red Green Blue, Red-Audio, White-Audio cable, right? Not the Yellow, Red-Audio, White-Audio.

      It's basically a VGA connection (in a different color space) without the sync lines. It's analog but it's high-end, high-def, progressive scan-capable analog. Most people would be hard-pressed to tell the difference between VGA, HDMI, and Component at 720p.

    41. Re:Server? by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      I'm aware of that :)

      The problem here is that (forgive me if parts of this are incorrect, as I mostly concern myself with audio) in order to produce a good analog signal (regardless of connection type), you need similarly good DACs.

      Now consider this: The primary purpose of an iPod is to output audio. The quality of the audio output should, therefore, be top notch... but it isn't quite as good as, say, most Cowon portable devices (obviously it varies from device to device, as well as within the iPod ranks). So if the primary function isn't quite top notch, why would you expect the secondary functions to be?

      It's also quite possible that I'm jumping to conclusions due to previous analog vs. digital experiences. It's funny that you should mention, by the way, that Component is "basically a VGA connection without the sync lines", because my previous dilemna involves VGA and DVI/HDMI. All the consumer class graphics adapters (mostly nVidia and ATi gaming cards) that I've used, have had awful analog output when compared to digital. Now, part of this analog degradation is most definitely due to the ADCs in the TFTs I was using, but, say, a Matrox G400 provided much better (much crisper, more detailed shading, sharper) analog output than the consumer class cards. The digital output on my Thinkpad is also much sharper and more detailed than the VGA output...

      What I'm trying to say is that analog is good when implemented properly, with high quality components throughout the signal chain. However, when you cheap out and use unnecessary D/A/D on a signal, you're always going to get degradation compared to just keeping the signal digital - especially if you take into account any interference/loss caused by the cables. If you're using analog as a cost-cutting measure, I strongly doubt you'll be using top-of-the-line DACs and ADCs...

      Not having tested the video output on an iPod, I can only guess at how the quality is (I doubt they'll output a signal that'd enable the end user to tell the difference between analog and digital anyway), but what's so hard about just using some common sense and not adding completely unnecessary A/D conversion? When you factor in the fact that you'd be enabling use of iPod video on not only TVs that come with component inputs, but also pretty much every computer display on the market these days, isn't it pretty much a no-brainer to just go digital?

    42. Re:Server? by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Don't forget the Brilliant Pebbles; they reduce comb filter effects caused by very high sound pressure levels that develop in the corners when music is playing - as much as 3 or 4 times higher than the average sound pressure level in the room!! The Large size Brilliant Pebbles is also effective on tube amp Output Transformers; on top of speaker cabinets; and on armboards of turntables. Other effective locations include on top of Tube Traps; on side walls at the first reflection points; on the wall behind the listener position at points of high pressure; or anywhere in the 3 dimensional space of the room where a sharp rise in sound pressure relative to the average sound pressure in the room is measured using a test tone and sound pressure meter.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    43. Re:Server? by mabhatter654 · · Score: 1

      you clearly don't get that the ipod's adapter outputs the actual audio and video (scrambled) signals that other devices can pick up as "line-level" analog. If you use USB 2.0 then the device you are plugging into has do to all the decoding work. USB is pointless for things like video.... I mean you could use the unit as a fancy flash drive for that purpose (and it does work if you save the file to the data side)

      Micro USB might be useful for DATA transfer and charging, but iPods can pull more current for quick-charge than the USB 2.0 spec allows... that can harm your standards following equipment. USB for OUTPUT requires host controllers, which are different from what's built into portable devices. An Ipod would have to have a USB OUT to drive USB speakers, video cards, etc to be used in the manner you are thinking of.

      Unless of course, you have those devices where they use bastard "USB shaped" plugs with extra pins for audio and video. I have several cameras that use those, but there's no guarantee that the cords will actually work with another manufacturer's device even though the plug fits in the hole.

  6. iLinkIt by the_other_chewey · · Score: 5, Informative

    WTF is this link-less entry supposed to be?

    Here's the story mentioned above:
    http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iPod-touch-3rd-Generation/1158/2

    1. Re:iLinkIt by girlintraining · · Score: 0, Troll

      It's become traditional on Slashdot that Apple products be proudly displayed on the front page without links, because most Apple products discussed on Slashdot don't really exist either. Didn't you get the memo?

      --
      #fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
    2. Re:iLinkIt by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I wouldn't go as far as to imply that the slashdot editors even read submissions to the point that they could tell if it's about Apple.

    3. Re:iLinkIt by QuoteMstr · · Score: 1

      Remember the Sokal Affair, where a physicist submitted a nonsense article to a humanities journal to see whether there was any substance to the field? His paper was accepted, and there wasn't. I wonder how susceptible Slashdot would be to the same kind of made-up nonsense.

    4. Re:iLinkIt by Haxzaw · · Score: 1

      If we the readers don't even read the articles, why should we expect the editors too?

    5. Re:iLinkIt by poopdeville · · Score: 1

      It wasn't a nonsense article. He just stuck lots of random nonsense in it, to see if it would get caught. There is a difference.

      --
      After all, I am strangely colored.
  7. Not how Home Sharing works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Home sharing is just a way of automatically keeping multiple iTunes libraries up to date with new purchases when they are all tied to the same iTunes store account. It's not any kind of actual sharing service, just a synchronization service.

    1. Re:Not how Home Sharing works by radmarshallb · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yes it is. Home Sharing has an option to allow you to automatically synchronize new purchases, but it does much more than that. You can copy any song from your iTunes library to any other machine on your Home Sharing network. For instance, I just copied a single album (ripped from my own CDs, not an iTMS purchase) from my main library upstairs onto my laptop. If an iPod were enabled for Home Sharing, it would make sense that you could do the same thing. That is, wirelessly sync whatever songs, albums, or playlists you choose to your iPod Touch.

    2. Re:Not how Home Sharing works by radmarshallb · · Score: 1

      Gah, forgot the most important part of that... That is, wirelessly sync whatever songs, albums, or playlists you choose to your iPod Touch FROM your iPod Touch.

    3. Re:Not how Home Sharing works by herojig · · Score: 2

      It's a sync from the store, but not from device to device, or from library to library. It is great u can copy from one machine to another now (with a limit of 5 machines that must be registered on the apple site) but u can't sync the libraries in any way with each other (other then purchased music). That would be really grand, but for now u need other software to do that:)

      --
      I think therefore I can't be ~TTNH
    4. Re:Not how Home Sharing works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You might be wondering, "Why hasn't anyone moderated my comment that is somewhat well thought-out?"

      The answer is simple. U.

      You are not Prince, nor is this SMS with its 160 character limit. There is neither a need for nor a reason to use "u" in regular language. I notice you did not use "ne" for any, "b" for "be", or any of the other shorthand that is typically used when conversing in a space-limited medium. This is not an attack, please don't take it as one, but try to remember in the future that many people (usually myself included) wtop reading after seeing that sort of shorthand in a medium that does not require it.

    5. Re:Not how Home Sharing works by herojig · · Score: 1

      huh? u would do this too if typing on an iPhone. besides, i like it. sorry if it bothers u.

      ps. i don't even know what "moderated my comment" actually means, but thx for bringing that up, i think i will find out.

      --
      I think therefore I can't be ~TTNH
  8. Link to original article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It might help if the summary contained a link to the original article.

  9. Silly by Dan+East · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is silly. There would be so many other bottlenecks on a mobile device of this nature that the speed of the connectivity isn't an issue. I bet the iPod can't even consume (let alone serve) data at 802.11g speeds.

    --
    Better known as 318230.
    1. Re:Silly by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's vastly easier to shovel bytes than to do something intelligent with them. Serving the files to another device is well within the capabilities of the iPhone. I have a DT Research DT168 with a 500 MHz Geode chip, and hooking up a 1TB MyBook to it via USB2 gives me real-world transfer rates of about 7MB/sec to assorted clients (all of which are more than powerful enough to receive the data much faster) over good old 100Mbps ethernet. I'm positive the iPhone or iPod Touch is capable of saturating 802.11g if its storage can handle it; and why not?

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:Silly by PhrostyMcByte · · Score: 1

      802.11g is a little under 7MB/s maximum, with a lot less in most cases. I've never used an iphone or ipod touch, but I'd be surprised if it couldn't use more than 7MB/s. Single-stream 802.11n is about 20MB/s maximum, which doesn't seem too impossible either.

    3. Re:Silly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      802.11n is 2x the range. 91m vs 45m.

    4. Re:Silly by phantomfive · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The iPod touch has a pretty hefty processor at 600 mhz, and would probably have no trouble filling in the bandwidth. I've never actually tested it, but I've heard a 486 serving static pages can manage to fill a T1 line.

      The biggest problem I can see with it is battery life. How much fun is it if you have to stop your movie in the middle because the iPod ran out of battery? You would probably want to keep it charging, although with every computer these days having a USB port, that might not be too much of an issue......as long as your computer is close enough to your TV.

      --
      Qxe4
    5. Re:Silly by dotgain · · Score: 1

      A T1 is only 1.544 Mb/S, I'd say a 4MHz Z80 wouldn't have trouble filling that.

    6. Re:Silly by kc8apf · · Score: 1

      ... I've heard a 486 serving static pages can manage to fill a T1 line.

      It isn't _that_ hard to saturate 1.544Mbps. Most cable/DSL downlink speeds are faster than that. Now, a T3 is a bit more challenging, but nothing a single decent machine can't handle.

      --
      kc8apf
    7. Re:Silly by jmcharry · · Score: 1

      My experience with a Broadcom BCM4311 chipset card is that it won't do more than about 1Mb anyhow.

    8. Re:Silly by Clover_Kicker · · Score: 1

      It's easy to forget just how fast modern machines are. Back in the day, ftp.cdrom.com pushed ~1TB a day from 1 box, a 200-MHz P6 Pentium Pro.

      (yeah yeah, ftp.cdrom.com had industrial quality I/O)

    9. Re:Silly by Keeper+Of+Keys · · Score: 1

      The biggest problem I can see with it is battery life. How much fun is it if you have to stop your movie in the middle because the iPod ran out of battery? You would probably want to keep it charging, although with every computer these days having a USB port, that might not be too much of an issue......as long as your computer is close enough to your TV.

      ... and the iPod is drawing as much or more power from the USB that it is consuming serving the video.

  10. Wait a Minute Here... by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 2, Interesting

    along with space-time block encoding, a feature coming soon to Wi-Fi access points with two or more radios

    So is this something that just came out in the final standard yesterday that all of the pre-standard devices don't implement properly, if at all?

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    1. Re:Wait a Minute Here... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, the final N spec is compatable with Draft-N

    2. Re:Wait a Minute Here... by eggboard · · Score: 1

      The final standard simply confirms what's been shipping in the market in largely unchanged form for over two years. The Wi-Fi Alliance has been certifying devices against a stable draft since 2007. There's no such thing as "pre-standard" devices in this category. Either they have a Wi-Fi seal for Draft N or they don't.

      --
      Freelance tech journalist for the Economist, MIT Technology Review, Macworld, and others
  11. All this means by Fwipp · · Score: 3, Insightful

    All this means is that Apple decided to use a chip that happened to support wireless 802.11N communication. Maybe it was a planned feature, but it got cut. Maybe it was just cheaper or easier to work with than other offerings. Apple will not enable this at some point down the road, just as they won't activate the bluetooth chip inside older Ipod Touches. What _will_ happen is next year, they will sell a new model with the same chips, but this time with the necessary software support and bill it as a new compelling feature.

    1. Re:All this means by itsdapead · · Score: 4, Informative

      just as they won't activate the bluetooth chip inside older Ipod Touches.

      Er, they did...

      If you pay Apple 10 bucks for the 3.0 OS upgrade, that unused bluetooth chip in the second-gen iPod Touch will spring into action...

      --
      In a survey of 100 programmers, 111111 thought that duck-typing was a good idea.
    2. Re:All this means by Yvan256 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually it's only 4.99$ for the 3.1 upgdade.

      At least that's what it cost me to go from 2.x to 3.1.

    3. Re:All this means by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As others have mentioned, Apple did enable the Bluetooth chip. Also, there is precedent for this: many Macs shipped with 802.11n cards that were locked to 802.11g. You could buy an Enabler from Apple for a few dollars, as I recall, to enable 802.11n support. They may do the exact same thing here.

    4. Re:All this means by dotgain · · Score: 1

      GP is probably reporting Australian Dollars or something similar, the 3.0 upgrade cost me NZ$12.95 from memory. Fortunately I only had to pay once to upgrade all (two) of the iPods in our house. And yes, just to confirm, Bluetooth magically sprang into existence on the 2nd Gen, but was lacking on the poor old 1st Gen.

    5. Re:All this means by Fwipp · · Score: 1

      Oh, really? I am mistaken then, thanks for the information.

    6. Re:All this means by itsdapead · · Score: 1

      GP is probably reporting Australian Dollars or something similar

      Nah. GP was mentally converting £6 to dollars and negligently used the actual exchange rate rather than Apple's fantasy £1=$1 rate.

      --
      In a survey of 100 programmers, 111111 thought that duck-typing was a good idea.
    7. Re:All this means by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      In any case it was 4.99$CAD for me, I'm assuming it's 4.99$USD for Americans.

    8. Re:All this means by Dhalka226 · · Score: 1

      I noticed exactly this, but I've seen both numbers.

      My observation/hypothesis is this: When the upgrade they were offering was to 3.0, a major revision, the price they asked was $9.99 USD. Personally I didn't upgrade at that time, because I didn't feel the features were compelling enough to pay $10. A month or so later (from my perspective; I've only had my Touch for about that long) the upgrade is now actually to 3.1.1, and the price was $4.99 USD. Of course in either event you're upgraded all the way to the latest version. So in essence, I got the full upgrade path for $5 instead of $15 if I had been an early adopter.

      Worked out well for me, but I don't think I would appreciate it if I was one of those people who upgrade as soon as I can.

    9. Re:All this means by Dog-Cow · · Score: 1

      No. They just lowered the price. If you had upgraded to 3.0, the update to 3.1.1 would have been free.

  12. 802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by anethema · · Score: 3, Informative

    What I'm more curious about is any of the hardware there for it. Multiple antennas for MIMO? Any 5GHz hardware? The biggest advantage to wireless-N IMO is it moves the wireless out of the stupidly crowded 2.4GHz ISM band. The 5GHz band is (at least for now) far less crowded and this unlicensed band has quite a few more channels to spread the devices out a bit more spectrum wise.

    The chip is one thing but without any other supporting hardware, it doesn't make much difference. The chip could have been chosen for better power characteristics or a few other reasons. Time will tell if apple enables any N style features but I am not holding my breath.

    --


    It's easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
    1. Re:802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

      Well yes 5GHz would be very nice for the reason you mention. I've moved my home wifi net to 5GHz to get it out of the 2.4 muck and it would be nice if I could get an iPod touch that would operate there.

      However it won't be until they show up with a camera too.

    2. Re:802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      replying as ac to preserve mods. You have too many digits in your UID to be popping off about being a low number. You'd be suprised at the number of 3 and 4 digits UID's still lurking :)

    3. Re:802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      "The biggest advantage to wireless-N IMO is it moves the wireless out of the stupidly crowded 2.4GHz ISM band. The 5GHz band is (at least for now) far less crowded and this unlicensed band has quite a few more channels to spread the devices out a bit more spectrum wise."

      Yes, all of us with Macs and Airports are just thrilled that the rest of the world will now be routinely crowding up the 5 GHz spectrum.

    4. Re:802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      It's single-channel N, so probably no MIMO either. Probably has 5 GHz, and Apple will probably enable it for free down the road because other devices will start to come with it. They won't do it right now because very few of their users will demand it and it would be just one more thing to support.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    5. Re:802.11N hardware OTHER than the chip? by anethema · · Score: 1

      The thing is, I just don't think any 5GHz hardware (antennas, etc) was found.

      --


      It's easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
  13. faggot story for faggot shit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Troll

    steve jobs and obama got their dicks up your ass.

    suck it!

    advertisement Sergeant Taggart: Why didn't you identify yourself as a police officer when you were arrested? Axel Foley: 'Cause I was mindin' my own business. Hey, where the fuck do you guys get off on arresting somebody for getting thrown out of a window? Sergeant Taggart: We have six witnesses that say you broke in and started tearing up the place, then jumped out the window! Axel Foley: And you guys believe that? What the fuck are you, cops or doormen? Sergeant Taggart: We're more likely to believe an important local businessman than a foul-mouthed jerk from out of town. Axel Foley: Foul-mouthed? [Taggart nods] Axel Foley: Fuck you, man. Detective Rosewood: [Taggart stands up and draws himself to full height] Hey, Sarge... Sergeant Taggart: You watch your mouth. Axel Foley: [standing] Hey, man, don't square off on me with some bullshit. [shoves Taggart] Axel Foley: You wanna start some static? Sergeant Taggart: Hey, don't push me! Axel Foley: [shoves Taggart again] Fuck you, man! [Taggart delivers hard blow to Axel's stomach... Axel doubles over in pain] Lieutenant Bogomil: [witnessing from his office] Taggart! Sergeant Taggart: Yes, sir. Lieutenant Bogomil: Come here. [Taggart enters Bogomil's office, both emerge a minute later] Sergeant Taggart: Sir... I apologize for striking you. I have no excuse. Axel Foley: [bemused] Forget about it. Axel Foley: Don't you think I realize what's going on here, miss? Who do you think I am, huh? Don't you think I know that if I was some hotshot from out of town that pulled inside here and you guys made a reservation mistake, I'd be the first one to get a room and I'd be upstairs relaxing right now. But I'm not some hotshot from out of town, I'm a small reporter from "Rolling Stone" magazine that's in town to do an exclusive interview with Michael Jackson that's gonna be picked up by every major magazine in the country. I was gonna call the article "Michael Jackson Is Sitting On Top of the World," but now I think I might as well just call it "Michael Jackson Can Sit On Top of the World Just As Long As He Doesn't Sit in the Beverly Palm Hotel 'Cause There's No Niggers Allowed in There!" [Axel pretends to be a male hustler] Axel Foley: Tell Victor that Ramon - -the fella he met about a week ago? - -tell him that Ramon went to the clinic today, and I found out that I have, um, herpes simplex 10, and I think Victor should go check himself out with his physician to make sure everything is fine before things start falling off on the man. Axel Foley: Disturbing the peace? I got thrown out of a window! What's the fuckin' charge for getting pushed out of a moving car, huh? Jaywalking? Police Chief Hubbard: What's this man doing here? Axel Foley: Bleeding, sir. Axel Foley: If something happens to her... Victor Maitland: Hmmm...? I'm all ears. Axel Foley: I'll kill you. Victor Maitland: Really? That would be a neat trick. Detective Rosewood: Wow. You know, it says here that by the time the average American is fifty, he's got five pounds of undigested red meat in his bowels. Sergeant Taggart: Why are you telling me this? What makes you think I have any interest in that at all? Detective Rosewood: Well, you eat a lot of red meat. Police Chief Hubbard: Is this the gentleman who crashed through Victor Maitland's window? Who disabled an unmarked unit with a banana? Lieutenant Bogomil: Yes, sir. Police Chief Hubbard: Who lured Taggart and Rosemont into a gross dereliction of duty at a strip-tease establishment? Detective Rosewood: Uh, it's Rosewood, sir. Lieutenant Bogomil: Yes, sir. Police Chief Hubbard: Is this the gentleman who ruined the buffet at the Harrow club this morning? Lieutenant Bogomil: Yes, sir. Police Chief Hubbard: I just bet that you are the pride of your department in Detroit. Lieutenant, I'd like to see you in your office. Lieutenant Bogomil: Yes, sir. Axel Foley: [mocking Hubbard] Is this the man who... wrecked the buffet at the Harrow club this morning? Sergeant Taggart: Lower your voice, for Christ's sa

  14. Yet still no FM radio. by Kenja · · Score: 1

    Till Apple adds a 5$ radio receiver I'll not be buying one. Not everything can be downloaded from itunes.

    --

    "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    1. Re:Yet still no FM radio. by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      Then you might want to check out the new iPod nano.

    2. Re:Yet still no FM radio. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The chip supports FM radio. Depending on the feedback on the nano's FM radio, software support could be added at some point.

    3. Re:Yet still no FM radio. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Flamebait

      Or every other player not made by Apple.

  15. I can't wait until an Android gets 802.11n... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Troll

    ...to see all the compulsive masturbators among the linux crowd here who tagged this "yawn, whoopdidoo" etc. go crazy and u-turn about how :cool: it is.

    1. Re:I can't wait until an Android gets 802.11n... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Offtopic

      Don't you have better things to do than lurk around /. all day, Steve Jobs?

  16. cures cancer too by Hognoxious · · Score: 0, Troll

    Cures cancer too. But not AIDS or world hunger. You need the multistream version for that.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  17. Link to stories by eggboard · · Score: 2, Informative

    Sorry, I didn't properly include the link.

    My analysis about how the 802.11n stuff works related to an iPod touch, such as explaining what single-stream 802.11n means as a media server is here at TidBITS. The iFixIt tear down is here.

    --
    Freelance tech journalist for the Economist, MIT Technology Review, Macworld, and others
  18. Not surprising by R.Mo_Robert · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is not surprising, and now that it's confirmed, we can expect Apple to release an 802.11n enabler for iPod touch in the future and charge $.9.95 for it. They're so predictable these days...

    What's more interesting than this is that the new iPod touch, while almost identicial to the old one aside from a faster processor and some other things, is almost the exact same inside except for one small change: a space big enough to fit the same camera found on the iPod nano (in previous generations there was an antenna cable socket, which has been moved and, in its absence is now just plastic spacer).

    There were rumors of an iPod touch camera before it came out, even rumors that pinpointed the camera to this exact location in the device, and there was also a recent rumor that they pulled it due to some problems at the last minute. Looks like this confirms that, and I'm sure we can expect an updated iPod touch in the future with a camera. That, in my opinion, is far more interesting.

    --
    R.Mo
    1. Re:Not surprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Troll

      This is not surprising, and now that it's confirmed, we can expect Apple to release an 802.11n enabler for iPod touch in the future and charge $.9.95 for it. They're so predictable these days...

      Serves your own right for being a sheep buying bling over quality. Stop buying apple junk if you aren't prepared to toe the regular funds line, masturbate over this image of HIV+ lookalike Jobs instead. Just as satisfying, much cheaper!

    2. Re:Not surprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's more interesting than this is that the new iPod touch, while almost identicial to the old one aside from a faster processor and some other things

      WTF sort of comparision is that? Do you complain that your intel i7 is almost identcal to the core 2 duo too?

    3. Re:Not surprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's more interesting than this is that the new iPod touch, while almost identicial to the old one aside from a faster processor and some other things

      WTF sort of comparision is that? Do you complain that your intel i7 is almost identcal to the core 2 duo too?

      It's not a complaint--read the rest of my post. I'm saying it's interesting because it's almost the same except they clearly rearranged stuff so they could fit a camera inside--but didn't.

  19. Skynet Cometh! by chill · · Score: 1

    Soon after Apple activates 802.11n compliant mode, with a future firmware update, I predict a specialized iPod/iPhone botnet. It'll hook up with the recently discovered Linux webserver botnet, which has already hooked with the Windows PC botnet and woe unto the human race!

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
  20. Apple sucks you idiots! by Sam36 · · Score: 0, Insightful

    I can't believe you drool over this over priced piece of communism. Don't you love if when people write open sourced software that relies on some garbage closed source api that is only on macs?

  21. more nano sales is the only reason by cheekyboy · · Score: 1

    Apple wants people to buy a nano and an itouch, not just a new itouch.

    Until the production is ramped up of the nanos and the can get more cameras delivered
    they wont be in the itouch.

    This 'intermediate itouch' will be gone.

    --
    Liberty freedom are no1, not dicks in suits.
  22. Component Inputs by Keeper+Of+Keys · · Score: 1

    >

    Or maybe it's the fact that I don't actually know anyone that has a device in their home that accepts component inputs...

    I have two (at least): a DivX capable DVD player and my Archos dock. Never used that feature, don't own an iPod, just sayin'...

    (But actually, I'm quite impressed by this and wondering if Apple has finally started to regard video as a core feature. Do you still have to convert popular formats like AVI, FLV and WMV to that iPod-specific one?)

    1. Re:Component Inputs by bemymonkey · · Score: 1

      I was actually pleasantly surprised as well (even if I find the choice of connection inappropriate and crude)...

      That second question about formats is quite interesting as well.

  23. That's ok by kilodelta · · Score: 1

    I've got a 2nd Generation Touch and I just updated it to the iPhone 3.1 software. I now see bluetooth options on it. This means it has that Broadcom chip that also does FM tuner too. I so want that capability.

  24. iPhone to follow by nalini+kumar+muppala · · Score: 1

    Wonder if we will start seeing 11n in mobile phones http://deviceconvergence.wordpress.com/2009/09/14/802-11n-tipping-point/