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Southwest Declares Kevin Smith Too Fat To Fly
theodp writes "Kevin Smith is not a happy Southwest customer. The director was thrown off a flight from Oakland to Burbank, after being deemed too fat to fly. He later wound up on another Southwest flight, but has declared It's On and taken his rants to Twitter. 'Dear @SouthwestAir — I know I'm fat, but was Captain Leysath really justified in throwing me off a flight for which I was already seated?' he began. He also let the airline know he'd made it to his destination. 'Hey @SouthwestAir! I've landed in Burbank. Don't worry: wall of the plane was opened & I was airlifted out while Richard Simmons supervised.'"
I'll bet Southwest will wish he really was Silent Bob.
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
Even if they can get their butts between the armrests, the rest of them overflows into the next seat.
They should have required him to buy two seats, since he takes up two seats and twice the gas as a normal person.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Hello Mr. Dear Anonymous Coward,
Your words disgust me. Not only because they are not true, but some people just have big bones.
All the best,
Me
If he was really too fat to fly they never should have sold him a ticket.
And they'd better damn well have given him a full refund or a free transfer or it's fraud.
Do you even know who this guy is? He isn't THAT big.
I still think its awesome, but let's keep this next celebrity rivalry off of slashdot. Slashdot didn't cover trump vs o'donnel, and it doesn't cover paris hilton, so while Kevin Smith is a nerd celeb, let's not report on every twitter update in this matter? Mmmkay?
Is it sad that I am more likely to recognize you and your posts by your sig than your name or UID?
........but somehow the only thing I can feel about this is "Yay Southwest!" Hello schadenfreude. I am an asshole.
Qxe4
If he was really too fat to fly they never should have sold him a ticket.
how exactly is the airline supposed to know he is too fat when they sell the ticket? Most airlines sell their tickets online without ever seeing the person.
Qxe4
If he was really too fat to fly they never should have sold him a ticket.
I understand the sentiment, but how would you implement that? Are you going to make people weigh in before they can buy a ticket? Going to rely on self reporting?
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
I've read the tweets all night from @thatkevinsmith - He'll be getting a call at home from our Customer Relations VP tonight.
So why is this posted as a story on /.?
There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
I'm about 135 pounds. Why the fuck do I get charged extra if my bag is 55 pounds, when the fat bastard behind me has 150 pounds on me, and his bag is slightly less? Like somebody mentioned above, yes, I DO think they should weigh people before they get on. The nominal reason for this is fuel charges, right? Can I get a discount because I'm not toting my giant bloated belly around?
</rant>
Do you even know who this guy is? He isn't THAT big.
Are you referring to his weight or his career?
http://www.macworld.com/article/146331/2010/02/kevinsmith.html
If he was really too fat to fly they never should have sold him a ticket.
I understand the sentiment, but how would you implement that? Are you going to make people weigh in before they can buy a ticket? Going to rely on self reporting?
I've always thought that people should be counted in the weight allowance instead of just luggage. A bit porky like me? You get to bring less stuff (or pay more for the same stuff). Properly obese? You get even less. That and people who are for too large to fit in a single seat (with people to their sides being comfortable too) should be made to purchase the double seat they need.
Of course there are logistical complications to this. Firstly there is weight distribution between the passenger cabin and luggage hold which may affect the handling of the craft if most of the passengers are porkies with little luggage. And there is the issue of defining what constitutes too big for one seat. And finally there will be the people who cry like babies and moan that "it isn't my fault" - well it might not be (in which case get a medical cert and we'll consider some extra compassion) but it isn't the airline's fault either and it certainly isn't the fault of the other passengers who get less space between them because of your lardy presence. Another complication is what to do at the other end of the scale - it would be important not to encourage the "a stick of celery and half a tomato is more than enough for lunch" mob so there would need to be lower limit on the luggage gains (perhaps the weight distribution issue would be a legitimate reason for imposing this lower limit).
FYI: I'm a chunk overweight myself and not exactly getting any less so as time passes, and I would have no problem with getting a lower luggage allowance than someone of more healthy proportions. It seems quite fair to me: I want you to transport X kilograms of stuff from here to there which will use up Y amount of fuel, it just so happens that Z% of that mass is me and the heavy boots I prefer to wear. What's that? Xkg is over the total allowance and I'll have to pay a fee for the extra? Fair enough.
According to http://www.southwest.com/travel_center/cos_qa.html
It sounds like the determination is made if you can not fit within the confines of a standard seat with the arm rests down on both sides. I wonder if they don't have a test airplane seat you can sit in before hand at the terminal before trying to board or set of measurements you can take at home before buying your ticket/boarding to reduce the potential for embarrassment of being forced off the plane once you try to seat onboard.
From the link above:
"I am a large person and use a seatbelt extension, but I fit in one aircraft seat. Do I have to purchase two seats? Our policy does not focus on weight, and the seatbelt extension is not the determining factor. We use the ability to lower the armrests as the gauge, as the armrests are truly the definitive boundary between each seat."
Another interesting tidibt from the link:
Are all overweight people subject to the policy?
Many Americans are "overweight" or "clinically obese." A number of overweight or obese people occupy only one seat. In fact, many Customers may use a seatbelt extension but occupy only one seat, and these Customers would not be asked to reserve a second seat. If a Customer cannot lower the armrest (and is unable to comfortably travel with it in the down position), he/she is required to pay for the additional seat occupied. Again, we will offer a refund if the flight does not oversell.
.... ... }
int main (void) {
New rule: "If your butt doesn't fit in this box, you will have to go first class or buy two tickets."
Here's what really happened.
The pilot, a registered Republican, woke up from his nap (pilots cat-nap as much as they can because of the new budget-saving schedules), saw the guy, and mistook him for Michael Moore.
If you take up two seats, pay for two seats. And not one here and one 4 aisles back.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Or just charge by weight.
My guess is that weight isn't the issue, it's volume size and overflow into adjacent seats. Could a fat man fly if he didn't have any checked bags? Could a high density, heavily muscled, guy get kicked off because he weighs too much but is compact enough to not overflow the seat? If it is weight dependent, couldn't a fat man pay the extra $10 in fuel?.. or reduce his baggage weight? I think it has to do with seat overflow.. which is related to weight but more about volume.
http://soylentnews.org/~tibman
Well, don't forget the skinny, tall people like me (6'2", 135lbs). I can't get into a seat without my knees getting smashed by the seat ahead. And forget it if the person in front tries to put the seat back. I can only fit (semi-comfortably) in exit-row seats, or other rows where there's extra leg space.
It's one of the reasons why I now refuse to fly.
They do. They're called doors.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Romanes eunt domus!
If you're going to charge the fat folks extra, you gotta give the rest of us the price break on kids' tickets.
Well, what it comes down to is they can only sell whole seats. Your 6 year old might only need half a seat, but that still means he's taking up the whole seat - they can't sell the other half seat to someone else. A fat guy might prefer to buy 1.5 seats, but that isn't an option: he has to buy 2 seats, and that second seat is being taken away from another paying customer.
On the other hand, there's a possible solution: seat the kid who isn't using half of his seat next to the fat guy who needs an extra half seat. But in order to accurately bill everyone for the fractional seats they use, the airline would have to know everyone's measurements ahead of time (not just weight, because bulk is what really matters).
Visual IRC: Fast. Powerful. Free.
You can't have it both ways. If you're going to charge the fat folks extra, you gotta give the rest of us the price break on kids' tickets.
It's simple: Airlines don't sell distance per gas consumed. They sell seats. People are not packages. You can't fly more of them in a plane if they weight less in a linear manner. One seat is the minimum allocation unit you can buy. Whether you use the whole seat just put your purse on it is not their business. You're paying for it if you're going to use it. If you're so fat that you cannot fit into the single smallest allocation unit they provide, you will have to purchase two of them (or upgrade to a higher class with bigger seats).
That pic is from 2007.
Have you seen him lately?
http://cache-03.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/1/2008/11/Rogen_Kevin_Fat_Guys.flv.jpg
http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
Here's the text:
Not So Silent Bob
Sun, 02/14/2010 - 14:57 — Christi Day
Many of you reached out to us via Twitter last night and today regarding a situation a Customer Twittered about that occurred on a Southwest flight. It is not our customary method of Customer Relations to be so public in how we work through these situations, but with so many people involved in the occurrence, you also should be involved in the solution. First and foremost, to Mr. Smith; we would like to echo our Tweets and again offer our heartfelt apologies to you. We are sincerely sorry for your travel experience on Southwest Airlines.
As soon as we saw the first Tweet from Mr. Smith, we contacted him personally to apologize for his experience and to address his concerns on both Twitter and with a personal phone call. Since the situation has received a lot of public attention, we'd like to take the opportunity to address a few of the specifics here as well.
Mr. Smith originally purchased two Southwest seats on a flight from Oakland to Burbank – as he’s been known to do when traveling on Southwest. He decided to change his plans and board an earlier flight to Burbank, which technically means flying standby. As you may know, airlines are not able to clear standby passengers until all Customers are boarded. When the time came to board Mr. Smith, we had only a single seat available for him to occupy. Our pilots are responsible for the Safety and comfort of all Customers on the aircraft and therefore, made the determination that Mr. Smith needed more than one seat to complete his flight. Our Employees explained why the decision was made, accommodated Mr. Smith on a later flight, and issued him a $100 Southwest travel voucher for his inconvenience.
You've read about these situations before. Southwest instituted our Customer of Size policy more than 25 years ago. The policy requires passengers that can not fit safely and comfortably in one seat to purchase an additional seat while traveling. This policy is not unique to Southwest Airlines and it is not a revenue generator. Most, if not all, carriers have similar policies, but unique to Southwest is the refunding of the second seat purchased (if the flight does not oversell) which is greater than any revenue made (full policy can be found here). The spirit of this policy is based solely on Customer comfort and Safety. As a Company committed to serving our Customers in Safety and comfort, we feel the definitive boundary between seats is the armrest. If a Customer cannot comfortably lower the armrest and infringes on a portion of another seat, a Customer seated adjacent would be very uncomfortable and a timely exit from the aircraft in the event of an emergency might be compromised if we allow a cramped, restricted seating arrangement.
Visual IRC: Fast. Powerful. Free.
some people just have big bones.
And then some people are just fat.
The terms don't exactly look secret. From: http://www.southwest.com/travel_center/cos_qa.html
The armrest is the definitive gauge for a Customer of size. It serves as the boundary between seats and measures 17 inches in width. Customers who are unable to lower both armrests and/or who compromise any portion of adjacent seating should proactively book the number of seats needed prior to travel.
In fact that looks pretty darn simple and straightforward (and fair) - if you fit in the seat (that's the bit between the armrests) then sit in it, otherwise buy more than one seat.
It'll still be a lot cheaper for fat people than tall people who have to pay for business class (ain't no special offers for upgrades if you're too tall to fit your knees behind the cattle class seat, I've tried). Furthermore, fat people can lose weight, tall people are stuck being tall.
Damn straight it's about seat overflow. I flew from LA to Sydney (15 hr flight) next to a rather stout Polish tire salesman. He couldn't even fit into the damn seat! He lifted the arm rest, took over half of my seat, and I would up crunched against a couple next to me.
When I found out, I complained to the QANTAS stewardess, and she said that I could move seats later. Quite hard on a full plane.
you know how uncomfortable it is having a seat rest firmly wedged in your back for 15 hours?
Sorry people of carriage, but if your caboose cannot fit into the seat to the point where you need to lift your armrest, you simply need to buy another god damned seat.
Science advances one funeral at a time- Max Planck
The seat I, not they, paid for.
Yes, it's not right to sneer at people for being fat, whether it's their fault or not. It's perfectly all right to sneer at someone for stealing someone else's seat.
If you need two (or three...) seats buy them. Don't steal from your neighbours.
Of course it's about overflow, and those of us who take care not to be grossly fat fucks shouldn't have to be victims of the hambeast in the next seat.
No sympathy here. If you don't fit an airline seat, cargo net your fat disgusting ass to a pallet and go air freight.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
I was flying from Newark to SanFran. And I was in the last row. Ahead of me were three ladies, and these ladies were HUGE! The interesting part was that these three ladies all had to sit in the same row. They complained and said that they would like new seats. The stewardesses in their nicest voice said, "sorry but this flight is full and you will have to sit in your assigned seats."
When the ladies had to sit they moved up all of the armrests and honest to goodness their butts and bodies melted into one another! Needless to say most people around those ladies were relieved that they did not have to endure one those ladies sitting beside them.
I thought it was pretty efficient for Delta to say, "hey you want to be fat, go for it, its a free country. But while we are at it we are going to put you beside each other..."
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
Airlines have overcrammed more seats into each plane than the original designers would have believed possible. When people complain, they respond with "You're freakishly tall," or "You're mbidly obese," when the real answer is "The airlines are so greedy they're cramming so many people into their cargo hold it would make a slave trader of old boggle."
My 5'2", 100lb mother-in-law complains that they've made the seats too small to be comfortable, and she's been flying for 50 years. Do we really think the problem is Kevin Smith is too husky?
How about this for an answer? Let's make airline seats the same size and legroom as movie theater seats and see if the problem goes away.
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
"Customer of Size"? Is that like "People of Color"? Has political correctness come so far that you can't even call someone a fatass any more? I'm with Southwest on this one. Brilliant director or not, if I had to spend an "Evening with Kevin Smith" squished up against him in a coach-class seat, I would not be happy and would be demanding my ticket price back. They tried to accommodate his special request to fly early and couldn't. He should graciously accept their apology (it's more than he would have gotten from me).
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He normally buys double seats due to his width.
This time he was on standby and there was no double seat for him. To prevent the person next to him from suffering the overflow they made him take the next flight and gave him $100 for his trouble.
He knew the rules, this just makes a whining, self-entitled asshole.
No sig today...
What if the fat bastard tries to eat your kid?
Then he would have to pay extra on the food portion of his ticket. And your kid would get a corresponding discount.
If I can be modded down for being a troll, can I be modded up for being an orc, or a balrog?
Let me introduce you to Mr. Procrustes.
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Co-pilot, rev up the left engine, hmmm, for some reason we are tilting..
Have you fscked your local propeller head today?
Confucius say, man who walk through airport turnstile sideways is going to Bangkok.
... and now for something completely different!
You awake to find yourself on a Southwest flight out of Oakland. It is pitch black.
You are likely to the eaten by Kevin Smith.
Numerous airplanes (except the small ones) have varying sized seats (even in coach) - just like many movie theaters.
Huh? What plane and what theater? I've never seen either!
I spent a nice 11 hour flight across the Pacific with a morbidly obese Singaporean guy going home after a comic con (he owned a comic book store). His arm was all the way into the middle of my chest, and his upper fat roll engulfed the arm rest. I couldn't believe that he was allowed on with one seat. I asked a sky waitress if there was anything we could do, but the plane was full and said I'd have to take another flight if I didn't like my seat.
I would have to take another flight because the fatass next to me was taking up half of my seat!
I just pounded Chivas Regal throughout the trip so I wouldn't care so much.
As I did, I started chatting with him. He was a really nice guy, although way too otaku for my tastes. It made it harder for me to wish death upon him, so I've decided to instead wish death upon United Airlines.
This is a serious problem and needs to be addressed as a matter of course. I payed full price for half a seat!
He buys two seats because he hates people and doesn't want to have anyone sit next to him and if you actually read his twitter, you would find out that he can fasten the belt with no extension and sit with the arm rest done.. Ass..
Yep. I've been known to demand that the person next to me leave the armrest down, and called the flight attendant to enforce it. There is no requirement that passengers be allowed to put armrests up during a flight if the adjacent passenger does not wish to. I find that mentioning "inappropriate physical contact" with a hint of sexual harassment gets the airline's staff's attention.
Actually they sell freight space and the meat they transport is the least profitable as it requires to be heated and fed in a pressurised cabin (it also complains) where as most other freight can happily sit in an unpressurised hold.
The reason airlines in the US started charging for baggage is to dissuade you from bringing more of it (you should have figured this part out already). Now most people assume that this is to cut down on weight, wrong. Airlines can sell the space they freed up to logistics companies who want to move small sized parcels to other parts of the country or world rapidly. This appears cheaper but has a much higher rate of return per KG and is more steady and less problematic then the meat transportation business.
Budget Airlines like Tiger, Air Asia and Ryan Air make all of their money on freight, the passenger service is only expected to break even.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
What's your point? It's OK to be morbidly obese as long as your wife is hot? Does it occur to you that health might be something worth considering hot wife or no?
For many men (both heterosexual and homosexual), particularly those who are single and under the age of 40, a key motivator to get fit is not 'health reasons.' Rather, it's the desire to be more sexually attractive to a mate. In Kevin Smith's case, this motivator isn't present. He's already got an attractive mate. Therefore, in his case a key incentive to lose weight, quit smoking and reduce drug use isn't present. Usually the next driver comes after a health scare (i.e. heart attack or diabetes), and that may not happen for another 10-15 years.
Centurion: What's this, then? "Romanes eunt domus"? People called Romanes, they go, the house?
Brian: It says, "Romans go home. "
Centurion: No it doesn't ! What's the latin for "Roman"? Come on, come on !
Brian: Er, "Romanus" !
Centurion: Vocative plural of "Romanus" is?
Brian: Er, er, "Romani" !
Centurion: [Writes "Romani" over Brian's graffiti] "Eunt"? What is "eunt"? Conjugate the verb, "to go" !
Brian: Er, "Ire". Er, "eo", "is", "it", "imus", "itis", "eunt".
Centurion: So, "eunt" is...?
Brian: Third person plural present indicative, "they go".
Centurion: But, "Romans, go home" is an order. So you must use...?
[He twists Brian's ear]
Brian: Aaagh ! The imperative !
Centurion: Which is...?
Brian: Aaaagh ! Er, er, "i" !
Centurion: How many Romans?
Brian: Aaaaagh ! Plural, plural, er, "ite" !
Centurion: [Writes "ite"] "Domus"? Nominative? "Go home" is motion towards, isn't it?
Brian: Dative !
[the Centurion holds a sword to his throat]
Brian: Aaagh ! Not the dative, not the dative ! Er, er, accusative, "Domum" !
Centurion: But "Domus" takes the locative, which is...?
Brian: Er, "Domum" !
Centurion: [Writes "Domum"] Understand? Now, write it out a hundred times.
Brian: Yes sir. Thank you, sir. Hail Caesar, sir.
Centurion: Hail Caesar ! And if it's not done by sunrise, I'll cut your balls off.
Coming from a guy named couchslug...
You seem to want First Class elbow room at steerage prices. For that you can't blame fat folks, you can blame your cheapness or poorness.
No, we can blame the really fat guy encroaching onto our seat. The seat that we paid for. The seat that would be fine if it weren't for the guy next to us being really overweight. Airline seats are a certain size. In economy they're pretty small because fares are so damn cheap. Why the hell should I have to pay for a first class seat just to get the elbow room I deserve in economy? This isn't about being poor or being cheap, it's about someone being too fucking big to fit in an economy seat. Let the fat guy spend the cash on a bigger seat in first class. How dare you say it's my responsibility to pay extra cash to accomodate the obesity of someone else. If anyone is being too cheap/poor in this situation it's the fat guy who won't spring for the extra seat that he needs, or one larger seat in a higher class.
You can advertise in this sig from as little as £99.99 a month!