Android Users Aren't As Disloyal As Reported

ergo98 writes "As we discussed recently, a CNN article had a statement that '77% of iPhone owners say they'll buy another iPhone, compared to 20% of Android customers who say they'll buy another Android phone.' This was a gross misrepresentation. The CNN story now has up this note: 'Correction: An earlier version of this story incorrectly said that 20% of Android customers say they'll buy another Android phone. The survey actually revealed that 20% of all smartphone customers say they'll buy an Android phone.' The Yankee Group has further sought to clarify the situation by saying that the 20% are people who explicitly said they would buy a 'Google-branded' phone (which excludes the overwhelming majority of popular Android phones) — as Google gets out of the business of selling branded phones. Summarizing their position on Android: 'Yankee Group still believes that Android will become the next breakout mobile phone platform, making it the third most popular platform behind iPhone and RIM's Blackberry in installed base for at least the next five years.'"

Comments

Statistics

[sexconker]

About as accurate as this fist prose.

Re:Statistics

[semiotec]

Not sure about accuracy, but it's certainly useless. The article now says:

The iPhone is also the gift that keeps on giving: 77% of iPhone owners say they'll buy another iPhone, compared to 20% of smartphone customers who say they'll buy an Android phone.

How does one compare these statistics?

Re:Statistics

[shaitand]

Simple, the article is written by an Apple fanboi who is trying to find some way to skew things in Apple's favor.

Apple has 28% of the smartphone market, Android has 9%. 20% of ALL smartphone users say they are going to buy Android for their next phone. In other words, even if 100% of iPhone owners were saying they'd buy another IPhone the numbers indicate Android will soon overtake the IPhone in marketshare.

But they don't, only 77% say they intend to stick with the IPhone, indicating that while android should rise to 29% apple will drop from 28%.

Re:Statistics

[icebike]

How does one compare these statistics?

You see this so much in (what passes for) journalism.

It is so obvious to the reader. But the author, (even with the best of intentions, which in this case I doubt), is so focused on stringing two facts together totally forgets that one fact is Oranges and the other is Codfish.

I can't tell if its a bored reporter assigned to make sense of some dull numbers, or intentional juxtaposition of facts to weight one side of the equation.

Re:Statistics

[PopeRatzo]

It's the statistical equivalent of the question:

"Do you walk to school or bring your lunch"?

Re:Statistics

[medlefsen]

I think your math is a bit off

20% of all smartphone users say they are going to buy Android, including current Android owners. Pretending for a second that people actually do what they say they'll do and that everybody upgrades their phones at the same time, Android would get 20% of the market.

We know that 77% of current iPhone users will buy another one but we don't know about how many the other 72% of smartphone users will buy iPhones. So all we know is that at least 21% (28% * 77%) of current smart phone owners will buy an iPhone, but it's likely to be much higher.

Re:Statistics

[shaitand]

Could have been the same fanboi who modded down this post.

Re:Statistics

[TheLink]

Yeah that's why I'm not too bothered about newspapers going bust. I won't miss most (all?) of those.

I can get crap like that for free. And some bloggers even do "strike-outs" in their corrections so you can see how they screwed up.

Re:Statistics

[similar_name]

The fact that you are modded a troll is enough to convince me of your point. I agree with the other response that your math is not exactly right but you are certainly not a troll. Wow. Why can't Apple fans admit they're fans? I admit I'm a fan of Linux and I know why. Philosophy plus the ability to control the computer I put together from scratch. Unlike Apple fans I don't just fawn over it and say it's the best thing since sliced bread. It's not for everybody. I like Iphones and Macs to the extent that they ask me to crack them.

Re:Statistics

[Anonymous Coward]

By being a mindless lemming who buys whatever is "cool" and believing everything ever told them, like the iPhone is somehow better than any Android phone.*

* Note: I'm not saying either the iPhone or Android are better than the other. Rather, I put forth that it is purely opinion. One may be a better fit to a specific job, but the other is a better fit for another job. I'm simply bitching about the fact that someone believed everything they heard about how one is so much better. In this case, "OMG the iPhone!" seems to be the popular standpoint amongst the mindless lemmings (not that several Android users don't follow in suit).

Re:Statistics

[blai]

Leave it to the journalists.

Re:Statistics

[rtb61]

The maths is all a bit off, unknown survey, with unknown breakdown, using unknown group, says 15 percent of cows jump over the moon (not maths that wrong). Seriously your playing with numbers from a survey with undeclared methods, you have got to be joking.

The reality is the majority of smart phone users will end up going with Android for two main reasons, lots of hardware choice (including a lot of cheaper hardware), service supplier choice and of course 'free' application choice. Google only ever produced it's own branded phone to kick up interest in Android, once that was done and it did work really well, they dropped it.

Even the android demo on PC under windows is popular, hopefully Google will produce a 'one click' download and install so that more people can more readily play with it (rather a smack in M$'s nose if people really like it and continue to use is as a app). The Apple market'droids' are working overtime pretending to be fanbois and it isn't really working and is really starting to become rather distasteful.

Apple has some really creative people, perhaps it is time to shift to a web focus and show M$ how a better company can creative a far more successful version of MSN under another name, hmm, how about, the 'core' ;).

Re:Statistics

[blackest_k]

Actually 20% is the subset of smart phone android users that would buy a Google branded smart phone with android. As most phones running android are not from Google that suggests that if the current minority rises to twenty percent a larger percentage would be running android but not on a Google branded phone.
40+ % android and and 22% iPhone leaving 38% for anything else windows mobile, blackberry ect.

However the survey isn't credible as you can pull the figures anyway you want them.

windows mobile is pants its slow and buggy and Microsofts latest version won't let you install what you want.
thats why I won't go for windows mobile.
iPhone Os-4 at last introduces multitasking but also has its antenna issue. There is also a lack of flash.
iPhone with OS-5 and redesigned hardware might change that. I could possibly go for the touch or an ipad.

Android seems to be the best option
I can choose who i want to use for my carrier.
I also can cut back on the number of plans I am using probably
tethering works i believe
The software isn't as limited as on the iPhone and it multitasks.
Proper usb support. opening up a host of possibilitys
a wide range of hardware giving a range of features.

Android has the edge for me, but for non geeks iPhone seems to be it, (so did razrs a few years ago being trendy doesn't last).

Re:Statistics

[iserlohn]

Actual that 20% is for consumers interested in a Google branded phone only and not for all Android phones in total.

Re:Statistics

[Internal Modem]

Google branded does not mean it's a Google phone. All HTC Android phones are Google branded (not just the N1). Verizon Droids are Google branded.

Re:Statistics

[mdwh2]

Well indeed, the point is that these stats are rather useless, and can be skewed either way.

But a far bigger uncertainty is, how many current non-"smart"-phone users will buy an Iphone, Android - or Symbian or Blackberry come to that, to include the market leaders? The problem is that "smart"-phone is an ill-defined category that just looks at an arbitrary subset of the phone market, virtually all of which these days can run apps and give you Internet, along with touchscreens, but most don't get marketed as a "smart"-phone.

Re:Statistics

[shaitand]

20% of all smartphone users were interested in an android. 32% of those with a google branded phone (and only actual google phones because that is who they called) say they are going to buy another one.

Possibly because the other 68% know there isn't another one to buy.

Re:Statistics

[sexconker]

Actually 20% is the subset of smart phone android users that would buy a Google branded smart phone with android. As most phones running android are not from Google that suggests that if the current minority rises to twenty percent a larger percentage would be running android but not on a Google branded phone.

The problem is, to the plebes, every Android phone is a "Google phone".

Re:Statistics

[VVrath]

All HTC Android phones are Google branded (not just the N1).

My HTC Desire has no Google branding. Some Google apps were pre-installed (Gmail, Maps etc.), but outside of those apps the Google name/logo is nowhere to be seen

Re:Statistics

[Internal Modem]

In the US this seems to be true. The HTC Incredible (US version of the Desire) is Google Branded.

Re:Statistics

[zgornz]

The Incredible is not the US version of the Desire. Desire is more similar to the Nexus One.

Quick survey shows that:
N1, Motorola Droid, Droid Incredible - all have Google on the chassis
Samsung Captivate (AT&T US version of Galaxy S) - Doesn't say Google on the chassis (But does come with Google apps)

Re:Statistics

[PipsqueakOnAP133]

There's just one problem.

The iPod's continued dominance in the field of media players suggests that sometimes "lots of hardware choice (including a lot of cheaper hardware), service supplier choice and of course 'free' application choice" doesn't matter.

The fact isn't that iPhone is going to win or that Android is going to win. The fact is that we don't know until it happens.

Confirmation Bias?

[recoiledsnake]

Someone here got accused of confirmation bias for doubting the study.

by gyrogeerloose (849181)
Alter Relationship
on Saturday July 24, @06:08PM (#33016628)

Who did they ask? People inside of Apple's campus.. You've got to be kidding me.

Got to love it--some research challenges your preconceived notions so, of course, the only thing to do is reconsider said notions, right?

Wrong. Better to disparage the research than admit they might have been incorrect.

Come on, parent is not a troll. (Score:3, Insightful)
by Abcd1234 (188840)
Alter Relationship
on Saturday July 24, @06:17PM (#33016700) Homepage

In fact, he nailed it spot on. The GP doesn't like the conclusions of the study, so he just assumes the study or the researchers are wrong. It's an excellent illustration of confirmation bias (or, in this case, its inverse).

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[OverlordQ]

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

An apple fan . . . admit they're wrong about Apple being the greatest thing since sliced bread? What weird world did you come from.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[pieisgood]

Come on, these are apple fans we're talking about.

*duck*

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

Why does this have to be an 'either/or' question? We all know surveys like this don't really provide an actual usable data.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[MintOreo]

Woo, my confirmation bias tells me your incredulity is confirmation bias.

In my experience people who bemoan others for 'preconceived notions' are most often the ones truly guilty of it. Similarly, to be 'open-minded' has simply come to mean 'alternately' or 'unconventionally' 'minded'. Sad world we live in where cultural-mental 'progress' is merely a shift and all the same problems exist; but I've gotten off topic.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[therealobsideus]

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

An apple fan . . . admit they're wrong about Apple being the greatest thing since sliced bread? What weird world did you come from.

I'm an Apple fan, yet I have no problem admitting when they are wrong and their product shortcomings.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[interkin3tic]

In fact, he nailed it spot on. The GP doesn't like the conclusions of the study, so he just assumes the study or the researchers are wrong. It's an excellent illustration of confirmation bias (or, in this case, its inverse).

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

Or maybe gyrogeerloose's reaction of "This poll result can't be right because I don't believe it" was an illogical one even though it was ultimately correct.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[semiotec]

Maybe it was actually confirmation bias from the said Apple fan, that Android was so disliked and hence he got taken in by the false report?

Nah, no way! Apple fans are the most objective and unprejudiced technology connoisseurs, they would never be "taken in" by any reports or studies unless it has been independently verified by Steve Jobs.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

Just because you were vindicated in hindsight doesn't mean they didn't have a point. Did your doubt of the announced conclusion of the study arise from examining the study itself and its methodology, or at least a track record of bad reporting by the reporter? Or was it based on the (announced) conclusions, and a refusal to believe them?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[hedwards]

Often times if it smells there's something wrong. It doesn't apply to genuine fanbois, but frequently when a study seems incredible it's because the study was done incorrectly. Which is easy to do a minor shift in wording can get an entirely different result. In this case I doubt very much that Android users are that unloyal, it's just kind of hard to know since it's still in development and isn't as well defined as what an iPhone is.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[blair1q]

Well, no, this is how thinking works.

Something comes up from the back of your brain to the middle, and the middle says "yeah that's right" or "wait a second, that can't be right" and if it thinks it's right the front of your brain makes it come out your face.

In the hive-mind we do the same thing, only journalists are the back of the brain and the rest of us are the middle and there is no real front. So there's lots of uncoordinated data coming from the back and we're in the middle judging its quality and it pretty much just recirculates, with each of us collecting his own little satchel of things that made sense as they flew past.

And then someone does a survey and cocks up the binning and a lot of the middle doesn't know what is right or wrong any more, but buys an iPhone because that's all the article was purposed to tell them to do, even after the correction was made.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[phantomfive]

The original comment here.....says absolutely nothing other than, "I don't like the results of the study and so I think it's false." If he had given any evidence at all, any at all, for why he believed that way, you might argue that it wasn't confirmation bias. If he had even given commentary, like this guy, he wouldn't have been accused of confirmation bias (and that guy got modded up).

The fact is, if all you have to say is "I don't like the results of this study" then how can you say it's not confirmation bias? He didn't even say which part he didn't like.

But hey, moderation is still open on that story, so if anyone wants to abuse their mod points by modding that guy up, go ahead. Watch out for metamods though, that comment is danger.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

But that wasn't it.

It was more like "this report can't be right because it contradicts all other available data"

Which is anything but illogical.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

I went from an iPhone 3G to a Nexus One, which I returned due to poor reception when holding the device. http://gdgt.com/discuss/nexus-one-has-cell-antennas-on-the-6sn/

I then got a Droid, which was the next best Android phone at the time. When my contract is up, I'll probably switch back to the iPhone unless significant improvements have been made to Android by then. Android has a very Linuxy mindset--it can do just about anything you want, but the user experience is very poor. Compare to the iPhone, which does slightly less in practice (for me at least, the only thing the iPhone doesn't do is tether) but is more or less a joy to use.

18 months is a long time in phones these days, so who knows what the future will bring. But for myself, for now, I wish I had stuck with Apple.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[WrongSizeGlass]

Why does this have to be an 'either/or' question? We all know surveys like this don't really provide an actual usable data.

Actually, 77% of these surveys don't really provide usable data. 20% want to be an Android survey.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[shaitand]

That is a meaningless statement without actually making such an admission.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[shaitand]

I haven't had an IPhone, AT&T offered me one for $15 but I declined. I didn't have a smartphone but I'm not the sort who is usually a light data user and AT&T dropped their unlimited plan. Also they offer no insurance on the IPhone. Also they can't waive upgrade and early termination fees on the IPhone under even extenuating circumstance.

But anyway, I've found the android pretty easy and pleasant to use. To see any Linux you actually have to get a third party utility to open a shell.

The only complaint I have is the App store. There is a big delay after I select something before it downloads and then it usually downloads slowly even when using the phone on wifi.

What is up with that? The typical app is smaller than a multimedia laden webpage, since when does google have no bandwidth?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

But anyway, I've found the android pretty easy and pleasant to use. To see any Linux you actually have to get a third party utility to open a shell.

I was really making a comparison about UI design, not saying that you actually see Linux on Android. The point is that it's cumbersome compared to iOS, not that it looks like Linux.

The only complaint I have is the App store. There is a big delay after I select something before it downloads and then it usually downloads slowly even when using the phone on wifi.

I've seen this a handful of times. I have no idea why it happens, but it's annoying. Luckily, I haven't seen it that often.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[jellomizer]

And Linux/Open Source Zealots are any different. Any Statics against Open Source are obviously false. Any stats for get a bunch of "About Time!" posts. Zealotry/Fan Boyism will lead to endless debates and complaints.

Apple is Evil
Linux is Lame
Windows is washed up.

They all have their weeknesses zealotry on any product really hurts the product you are zealot about. Because you turn a blind eye on many of its faults and failed to see the other sides strengths.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[bm_luethke]

"In my experience people who bemoan others for 'preconceived notions' are most often the ones truly guilty of it."

Better watch out - that one results in a feedback loop.

A statement I always liked is "Just because you are paranoid doesn't meant they aren't out to get you." I do believe there were a great many on that thread that let the "Reality Distortion Field" overcome them - common sense would have (and should have) told one that if the Androids only had 20% return customers then they were going the way of the Kin and probably faster, not have the explosive growth they have had. It doesn't take a marketing genius to figure out that much dislike of the phone would have been all over the place instead of the growth it has had.

It will remain to be seen for a while how the whoe iPhone/Android thing will end up, but saying iPhones have a 77% repurchase rate and Android had 20% was *clearly* stupid.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Zelgadiss]

I feel the same way.

Just got a Samsung Galaxy S ... kind of regretting it already.

This is my first smartphone, however I have used a ipod touch for many years.

A part from hardware problems**, I found things like the settings to be kind of disorganised, there is sometimes a startup lag of sorts when doing things, and the browser's double tap behaviour is fairly annoying - when you zoom in to a piece of text then double tap another, instead of just zooming to the new block of text it zooms out.

And my god, selecting text is an utter PITA - by extension cut-copy-pasting.

Maybe it's my previous ipod experience screwing things up, but I really wish I waited and maybe get the iphone 4 when it comes out where I live.

PS: I too wish for the ideal situation where companies stick to an open standard and compete on quality of implementation. But recently I have come to believe it's nothing more then a pipe dream, like the socialist utopia that is ST:TNG's society, we human beings being what we are.

**The thing came with a broken charger resulting in me having to run back to the store for a swap.
Today I discovered a pixel has died. -_-
It's back to the operator's store today, let hope they will at the very least swap me a new one, would be nice if they let me swap to another phone or give me credit of some kind so I can get an iphone when it comes out this week.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

Sorry to hear about all of your problems. The Galaxy S is a very nice piece of hardware. It's really too bad that Android is so unpolished.

You're right--the settings really exemplify the problems with Android.

Good luck on your swap!

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[jo_ham]

I am an Apple fan, and this is a post I made yesterday:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1731258&cid=33023312

I have made several posts just like it in the past pointing out the downsides in Apple products, as well as the benefits - it's the nature of mass production compared to bespoke construction/design etc.

It seems that the only people who suggest Apple users think their devices are perfect are the anti-Apple crowd who preach it as "fact" without actually knowing much about actual Apple users.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[dgatwood]

I'm going to guess neither. I'd imagine it was more of an application of Sagan's Law: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

A study that says that a popular smartphone OS is so bad that only 20% of its users plan to buy another one is an extraordinary claim. If that were true, there's no way that a second or third manufacturer would start building phones based on the same OS and technology, much less the almost two DOZEN smartphone makers currently building Android-based phones. Even as an iPhone user, I'd have a had time believing that sort of a stat. It's just absurd on the face of it.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

Woo? You mean the carpet pee'er?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[shaitand]

Apple fans are using up all their mod points tonight

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[therealobsideus]

I am an Apple fan, and this is a post I made yesterday: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1731258&cid=33023312

I have made several posts just like it in the past pointing out the downsides in Apple products, as well as the benefits - it's the nature of mass production compared to bespoke construction/design etc.

It seems that the only people who suggest Apple users think their devices are perfect are the anti-Apple crowd who preach it as "fact" without actually knowing much about actual Apple users.

I don't have an iPhone, but I would like to have one. When I'm with friends I constantly borrow theirs to check some things online. I find it more appealing than my previous BlackBerry Bold (I'm not using a Samsung phone running a Symbian OS) and than a lot of the Android phones out there, but I also really like the Galaxy S and Droid X so if I have money in the near future who knows. But my gripes stick to the ipod and the geeky stuff.. the lack of support for Ogg, being able to only use it with iTunes etc.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[shaitand]

"I was really making a comparison about UI design, not saying that you actually see Linux on Android."

That makes even less sense. Linux has the most streamlined desktop GUI these days. MacOS is a close second runner up though.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

Really? Troll? In what universe was that post a troll?

Slashdot's really hit the toilet these days.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[similar_name]

It seems that the only people who suggest Apple users think their devices are perfect are the anti-Apple crowd who preach it as "fact" without actually knowing much about actual Apple users.

Perhaps this has something to do with all of the troll and flamebait mods people get for questioning this 'research'. To be fair, the same happens to people who question open source. It's hard to deny the fawning that many apple users have for their products. I've never had an apple user say they liked the product because of it's technical side. It's design, design, design. Which is well done with Apple. It's a shame most apple users can't tell you they like the UI because they don't know what a UI is.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Abcd1234]

I was the author of that post, and I wasn't taken in by anything. In fact, I voiced absolutely no opinion regarding the veracity of the report. The simple fact is, the original poster flat out denied the contents of that study without *any* evidence whatsoever. They simply didn't like the numbers, so they ignored it.

In this particular case, were they right? Absolutely. But guess what? It's still confirmation bias, and it's an example of poor thinking.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[tourthailand]

good

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[bm_luethke]

Were I too guess I would say the following. Obviously I am not the one modding you as troll nor would I - you just wouldn't have gotten any mod points for these reasons and I will conclude each section with my thoughts. Take them as you wish, I'm certainly one that hasn't avoided those same mods over the years either. I'm bored and a bit inebriated so you get my ramblings :)

Linking the article you did - not only has it bean beaten to death but the majority of those outside of the reality distortion field understand there were to issues: detuning and blocking the signal. The article mixes the two and is a favorite of the Apple fanbois. I would have figured you just didn't care enough to know the difference and are reporting a real signal loss (and not knowing enough to separate the reasons) and some crappy design I happen to disagree with for many cell phone manufacturers. Low user numbers do not mean much - I have one in your range but can no longer access the account (forgot the password and the associated e-mail address no longer exists), do not ask me about "intuitive user interfaces" at all as if I design one it will only make sense to other developers (and for those people I make quite decent ones). However for some a low ID means something and may get a troll whereas a high one may not.

Next is that you have an issue with two distortion fields combining - Linux and Apple. I guess I disagree with Android being like Linux (I find it has about the same feature set that Windows does - but YMMV) and the anti-Apple crowd find the whole "I like it because they tell me what to do" idea to be trollish to begin with. Can't say I disagree with them, but again I find that personal choice and not really being a troll too. I've found a great deal of nostalgia for a phone that works quite well as a phone. You couldn't pry my Droid from my cold dead hands but I do miss the simplicity of just a phone - the good more than outweighs the bad, it is just that I can't see why they can't get the phone part as good as before.

The rest - well that is personal opinion and is probably liked more than not here - few are going to fuss that you wished to stay with Apple.

In the end with a link to a poor article and the jab at Linux I suspect you didn't get the benefit of doubt. What you wrote could be classic "troll" - that is someone who writes something like a well informed question of "C or C++" expecting to get something of a fight. We have lost that definition and instead have "troll" to be something worse. With slashdot's moderation system it doesn't take much to fall under a threshold and not get the modding you deserve. I happened to look over this because one of your ancestor posts was something I was interested in and followed children. I do not have mod points (and since I had previously commented on this I couldn't use them anyway) so nothing I can do about it.

Lastly I generally expect that you had an anti-Apple person find your post first, it happens to the more pro-Android posts too. Slashdot's moderation system overall works decent but there are certainly posts that it breaks down at. No system is perfect and you seem to be caught in the bad part of it. Frankly, with your low user ID I would have expected you to know that by now - it doesn't mean much in how well you know some particular pieve of tech but you should have been here long enough to have some idea of the possibility of your modding. People even in the 750k+ id's know this, 5 digit ID's should have seen this possibility coming a mile away. At the lest known enough to not seriously asked this question (if you were also drunk and bored well then that is another story - what else is Slashdot for?).

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[semiotec]

Oh really? I had no idea.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Miseph]

My scientific study has concluded that nobody plans to buy an iPhone ever, and in fact, nobody even owns one.

Do you object on the basis of how I conducted my study? or because you like the iPhone? or simply on the basis that my results are CLEARLY crap?

In a perfect world where nobody ever spewed utter nonsense, it would be reasonable to evaluate every single claim objectively based on the available facts... in the real world, there isn't enough time the day to go without simply dismissing obvious BS out of hand.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

I'm going to guess neither. I'd imagine it was more of an application of Sagan's Law: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

But, if the OP hadn't read the study, for all the OP knew, the extraordinary evidence was there in the study. It means that the "I'll believe it when I see it" attitude, which is not indicative of confirmation bias, becomes "I'll believe it when I see it, but I'll refuse to see it when it's right in front of me", which is more indicative of confirmation bias.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

Do you object on the basis of how I conducted my study? or because you like the iPhone? or simply on the basis that my results are CLEARLY crap?

I object for two reasons. The primary reason is that I can objectively say that your results are crap, since I have witnessed several people with iPhones, something which the OP cannot reasonably claim. I also object because you provided no evidence with your claim, which the OP can only lay claim to if he read the study itself.

You know, had people been more civilised during Galileo's time, his findings on our planet's heliocentrism would have been dismissed out of hand as "obvious BS", and that was a clear case of confirmation bias.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Zebedeu]

The only complaint I have is the App store. There is a big delay after I select something before it downloads and then it usually downloads slowly even when using the phone on wifi.

What is up with that? The typical app is smaller than a multimedia laden webpage, since when does google have no bandwidth?

I can't comment on the lack of bandwidth. It usually downloads quite fast for me on wifi, not so fast on 3G and quite slow on 2G, but I guess that's expected.

But I wanted to comment on the fact that sometimes the download takes a while to start, or doesn't start at all. Apparently, the Android Market is tied to the Google Talk app, and if GT loses it's connection for some reason, you won't be able to install apps from the Market.

The trick is to open GT and login (you may logout immediately afterwards, it's just to start that connection going again).

It's really anoying because I don't use GT and tried to uninstall it once (I have root). You can do it, but the Market will stop working.

Anyway, that may not be your specific problem, but I just wanted to get that information out there.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

You've just never seen it happen, right? :-p

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[the_womble]

Linux has the most streamlined desktop GUI these days

Which Linux desktop does that apply to:
1) Gnome
2) KDE
3) XFCE
4) LXDE
5) Openbox ...... lots of others.

and what does "streamlined" mean anyway?

I use KDE on Openbox (because I like KDE and Kwin memory and CPU usage is very high).

I prefer it to any other desktop environment I have tried (including Mac), but I have not tried Windows more recent than XP, to say nothing of lots of Linux/Unix window managers and desktop environments.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[tehcyder]

I'm an Apple fan, yet I have no problem admitting when they are wrong and their product shortcomings.

It's why fanboy is a useful term, as it distinguishes the utter fanatics from normal users/fans.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

I went from an iPhone 3G to a Milestone (the Nexus One wasn't out yet, and looked like it would be inferior anyway (I didn't know about the locked bootloader at that time)), and depite Motorola's fuckups, I'm reall happy with Android.

I don't think I'll ever buy anything from Motorola again (not until they get their act together, at least), and Android isn't as smooth and stable as it should be (not sure if that's an Android or Motorola issue), but for features, I love Android. Yeah, it still needs a bit of polish before it's completely perfect, and I still need to find a good visual voicemail client that's compatible with the iPhone way, but I don't think my iPhone sync'ed over the air like Android does. Independence from a PC is very nice. So it being able to install better SMS and email clients (I didn't like the iPhone email client). And pretty soon, I intend to have a look at fixing the (minor) OS issues that have been bugging me. Couldn't do that with an iPhone.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

Which Linux distro has that streamlined desktop GUI? I used to have Ubuntu 8.4, and never really liked Gnome (nor KDE, for that matter) much. I love how OS X does it (though some configurability would have been nice).

Linux with a Mac OS UI? I'd definitely go for that.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

I was really making a comparison about UI design, not saying that you actually see Linux on Android. The point is that it's cumbersome compared to iOS, not that it looks like Linux.

I'm not sure what you mean. How is Android cumbersome? For the most part, it's pretty identical to the iPhone UI, and where it differs, it's more powerful and still pretty slick.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

There are some weird troll mods here. This one clearly needs to be about +3 Funny.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

How is this remotely interesting or relevant? We're talking about phones and you make some inane comment about desktops. Who cares?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

And an example would be?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[cjdavis618]

"Who did they ask? People inside of Apple's campus.. You've got to be kidding me." That was my original post on the other topic, and guess what. I still stand by it. I didn't find it surprising that the poll was found inaccurate, I already knew based on my history and the undred or so clients that I support that use AT$T. While the results were regional, they still apply. I would guess in the same way that Yankee applied thier poll to a region. Like I said, I have both an Iphone and Droid X. I like the Droid X BETTER for what it IS. The Iphone is OK, but does have problems since the new update. I think AT$T needs to quit lying about it's coverage map and show 3g vs edge and GPRS. There are alot of places that 3g doesn't work in my state and that is Fact. It didn't take a poll for me to figure that out. Again, the original article was about AT$T, not specifically the Iphone, but the details remain the same.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[cjdavis618]

I did offer evidence, http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1731258&cid=33017256 Poor Thinking huh? I didn't get the memo that said I had to explain myself, or that opinion wasn't allowed without permission.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[hey!]

Wow. You have, like blown my mind, man. I mean, like, now I know what Camus meant when he wrote: "There is but one truly serious philosophical problem, and that is suicide." It's like, *man*. Now putting a bullet in my head would only be a external manifestation of what you've already been doing to it.

This is, like, seriously good stuff.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[cjdavis618]

Um. Yes I did. http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1731258&cid=33017256 [slashdot.org]

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

Someone else already pointed out the settings configuration on Android, which is massive, hard to navigate, and hard to find things in.

Scrolling is, imo, terrible on Android. It feels like I'm working hard to scroll, and there are delays from when I move my finger to when the scrolling starts. This seems like a minor complaint, but this sort of thing (input lag from when you make the input to when you see results) is really a big deal in HCI.

The mail client is simply atrocious. Gmail is fine, but then you're stuck with Gmail services. I run my own mail server, and have no interest in using Gmail for my primary contacts. Incidentally, iOS4 has a much better mail client than iPhone OS 3. Threading is one of the big big things I've wanted in a mobile phone email client. k9mail, probably the best alternate email client on Android, doesn't do threading either, but is far and away better than the stock client. I haven't found an email client for Android which does threading.

Tap to zoom is far better on iOS4.

I really need to start keeping a list of these issues so that I can just link to it every time someone asks. There are a ton of little things that keep popping up and making me want to sell the Droid and cancel my contract, but I just live with it.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Abcd1234]

I did offer evidence

Not in your original post, you didn't.

I didn't get the memo that said I had to explain myself, or that opinion wasn't allowed without permission.

Oh, quit being a defensive little bitch. Your original post was a contentless dismissal of the original study with absolutely no evidence to back your claim. You were rightly attacked for making such a stupid remark, and so were forced to actually provide some evidence. If you can't handle that, honestly, piss off, we have enough contentless posts around here, thanks.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[cjdavis618]

You piss off, if you want details look them up yourself. There are a number of reports on the net about how shitty the ATT service is without having to defend my statement. I posted my opinion whether you like it or not, whether you like it or not. The only whiny little bitch is the one complaining that the post didn't give him any relevant info to dispute so your attack the poster yourself. Classic.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Zelgadiss]

Well, if anyone cares the swap is no go, my operator doesn't think it's their problem any more. :s

My phone is now sitting at the Samsung service centre waiting for a screen swap.
I'm hoping it doesn't make matters worse.

If anyone is still reading...
Say anyone know a good virtual keyboard that has good cursor control?

Swype cursor's control is on a separate screen, major PITA.

PS: I just had an epiphany, why hasn't anyone implemented cursor control via swiping the keyboard?
Or anyone know an Android keyboard that do cursor control the palm way? I heard it's quite good.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

Sorry to hear that!

I agree that cursor control is awful. Graffiti (the old Palm input method) actually did use swipes for cursor control. I don't know of any Android VKs that do, unfortunately. If you ever happen to find one, let me know :)

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[dgatwood]

The thing is, for something so bizarrely unlikely, bare minimum standard for such extraordinary proof would be independent confirmation by a second party. So no single study could provide sufficient proof. We'd need two or three news organizations all having done such studies and all posting them. Sort of that second and third story, the first study should be doubted no matter what it says.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

Someone else already pointed out the settings configuration on Android, which is massive, hard to navigate, and hard to find things in.

There's a lot of stuff in it alright, but I also remember having trouble finding stuff on the iPhone settings.

Scrolling is, imo, terrible on Android. It feels like I'm working hard to scroll, and there are delays from when I move my finger to when the scrolling starts. This seems like a minor complaint, but this sort of thing (input lag from when you make the input to when you see results) is really a big deal in HCI.

I agree. I'm having similar problems with scrolling on my big screen iMac. Really annoying. On Android too, scrolling could have been a bit snappier. Should have been. UI needs to run at the highest priority, and the scheduler needs to keep user interaction in mind.

That reminds me: doesn't the linux kernel always schedule server style: efficiency first instead of responsiveness first? Does anyone know if that's been fixed for Android? It seems like a rather obvious issue.

The mail client is simply atrocious.

It's buggy and unreliable, but other than that, I prefer the mail client over the gmail client. And I prefer both over iPhone's mail client, which I really hated (whereas Mail.app is one of my favourite mail clients).

But the big advantage of Android here is: you can install other mail clients. Not possible on the iPhone.

Incidentally, iOS4 has a much better mail client than iPhone OS 3.

That's good to hear. I had an iPhone 3G, and never liked its mail client.

Tap to zoom is far better on iOS4.

Do people tap to zoom? I always use pinch and zoom. Works fine, though (like scrolling) just a tiny bit too slow.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Anonymous Coward]

Ok, so you're admitting you're an alien, which is cool. But the GP's question was what world are you from. which you still haven't answered ;)

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[Sancho]

That reminds me: doesn't the linux kernel always schedule server style: efficiency first instead of responsiveness first? Does anyone know if that's been fixed for Android? It seems like a rather obvious issue.

The process scheduler is really highly tunable. I don't know how easy it would be to change the tunables under Android. You'd think they'd have done that already.

That's good to hear. I had an iPhone 3G, and never liked its mail client.

What didn't you like, out of curiosity? I thought it was quite acceptable and not much different from iPhone OS 3's mail client.

Do people tap to zoom? I always use pinch and zoom. Works fine, though (like scrolling) just a tiny bit too slow.

Tap to zoom, when it works, tends to focus quite well on exactly the content you want (on well-formatted sites.)

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[lokiomega]

What about BSD with a MacOS GUI?

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[mcvos]

That's good to hear. I had an iPhone 3G, and never liked its mail client.

What didn't you like, out of curiosity? I thought it was quite acceptable and not much different from iPhone OS 3's mail client.

I remember having to go through lots of menus every time I wanted to check a different mail account. It's possible that Android's standard mail client is no different, but having a separate app for gmail and one for my other email account basically solves the problem.

You'd think there'd be an easier way to do that, but so far, this works well enough for me.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[zuperduperman]

Re: lagginess you might feel somewhat better when you get Froyo / 2.2. For me it fixed many of the occasional lags that were annoying. Prior to 2.2 I used a task killer (a 1x1 widget that you can tap to kill all non-critical background tasks) and if I noticed any lag I hit it and bam, phone is fine again. I think they sorted this out in Froyo because I have barely hit it once in a month now.

Re:Confirmation Bias?

[JAlexoi]

Long live BIOS!

I sense a disturbance in the force

[GrumpySteen]

It's as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced

Re:I sense a disturbance in the force

[interkin3tic]

It's as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced

and replaced by the cries of millions of opposing fanboys.

Re:I sense a disturbance in the force

[Culture20]

It's as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced

Nothing silences a fanboy.

Except Chuck Norris.

Re:I sense a disturbance in the force

[JohnBailey]

It's as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced

Come on.. Like that could ever happen..

Re:I sense a disturbance in the force

[rainmouse]

Fanboys aside, I have an Android and my partner has an iPhone and have had a good chance for a play around with both, they are amazing gadgets but in all honesty both are fairly shit as actual phones.

Re:I sense a disturbance in the force

[mcvos]

I've got a cheap old plastic Nokia for that.

What an Idiotic Blunder

[ceraphis]

Not only did I not trust Yankee Group's numbers before, but now I realize they asked an ignorant question about "google branded" phones? What the hell sense does that have in a comparison between iPhones and Android phones? I'll be sure to consider immediately discarding any statistics released by "Yankee Group" in the future, because they could have just "accidentally" forgot to mention some important detail. Ridiculous.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[DriedClexler]

Some non-nexus phones are google branded. For example, I have a samsung moment, and it says "Google" on the outside in permanent lettering. So some android phones are additionally google branded

Still, it's pretty stupid to equate android with google branding.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[OverlordQ]

I'll be sure to consider immediately discarding any statistics released by "Yankee Group" in the future, because they could have just "accidentally" forgot to mention some important detail. Ridiculous.

It's not their fault CNN Money fails at reading comprehension and cannot gist data correctly.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Em Ellel]

Not only did I not trust Yankee Group's numbers before, but now I realize they asked an ignorant question about "google branded" phones? What the hell sense does that have in a comparison between iPhones and Android phones? I'll be sure to consider immediately discarding any statistics released by "Yankee Group" in the future, because they could have just "accidentally" forgot to mention some important detail. Ridiculous.

At least they are honest. From the Yankee Group's Blog (linked in story above):

So what is the right statistic for Android owners? The honest answer is that we don’t know.

Its not like they are selling statistics.... oh, wait....

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Anonymous Coward]

Idiotic? I would buy a true android phone with up to date specs. No way in hell am I buying an andoid phone with some garbage UI added on by the hardware company, or crapware pre-loaded. The only problem? It does not exist.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Em Ellel]

Some non-nexus phones are google branded. For example, I have a samsung moment, and it says "Google" on the outside in permanent lettering. So some android phones are additionally google branded

Still, it's pretty stupid to equate android with google branding.

If you read the links, "Google Branded" only includes phones manufactured under Google name (i.e. Nexus One) - does not include the "Google Inside" stickers on some Android phones. They only collected data on manufacturer name of the phone, not os - so they have no idea on Android stats as same manufacturers would manufacture non-Android phones.

-Em

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[roc97007]

Re: Google branded; People fully immersed in a traditional closed-architecture business model may have trouble wrapping their brains around Android.

The i-phone is a device created by a manufacturer. It has a gui and an app store and a bazillion apps and these things only run on the device from this manufacturer. Sales of the device are easy to track -- Apple sells a certain number of phones, and that is the sum total of i-phones sold.

Android is not a device. Trivially it's an operating system, but it's also a set of expectations -- app store, gui, and so forth. To compare the two, you have to agree about what you're comparing. If you're comparing Apple's phone with Google's phone, Apple has sold a crapload more phones than Google. Hands down, end of story.

If you're comparing phones running Apple's OS with Google's OS, the numbers change but things get murky. What do you compare the 4G to? Android 2.1? 2.2? If a phone runs the Android OS but has a GUI customized by the vendor, does it count?

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Jimmy King]

I don't think it's really all that different from comparing Windows market share to Mac OS or even just OS X (to keep things slightly simpler and more relevant) market share. Windows is an OS which runs on hardware sold by lots of manufacturers and there are numerous versions of it in use at any point in time. OS X is software developed by Apple to run on hardware sold by Apple. There are still a few versions of it in use at any point in time.

There's really nothing here that should be confusing to anyone who's job it is to provide these sorts of statistics. It sounds more to me like Yankee Group is being shady and wording the statements regarding Android in as confusing and negative a manner as they can. In the previous post about this report someone went into some detail about Yankee Group's history of doing this sort of thing. I'm too lazy to go find it, though.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Anonymous Coward]

For the record, I LOVE my Samsung Moment. The keyboard, the physical "call" and "hang up" buttons, and the ability to root the device :-)

Android has been good to me. I'll be buying a Moment 2. I guess I'm the minority.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[DriedClexler]

I love the Moment too. (In fact, I made the previous post from mine and yes I probably should have bothered to capitalize.) It's heavily under-rated -- it never gets mentioned in lists of the "top" smartphones, but is the most pleasant thing to use (Except maybe how the google homepage crashes the browser), and under $100 with contract after rebate. I don't know how people put up with software keyboards ...

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Anne Thwacks]

What do you expect from a company called "Chicken Noodle News"?

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Shihar]

I don't see how this is hard. Apple owns an OS called iOS. It has different versions. Google has tossed out into the world Android. It also has different versions. Figuring out how many out there are each is just a matter of comparing the numbers. Granted, the numbers are a little tougher to get for Android because you have to do some adding, but it isn't like Apple's announces their numbers; they are generally inferred through one method or another. I'll agree that there is a margin error for Android that is probably a little bigger than for Apple, but it was the same for Windows vs Mac. It is pretty safe to say that at this point, Android is growing very fast and steady, Apple is bursting in waves with their releases and then flattening out, and Black Berry, Palm, and Windows are being eaten alive.

I don't think that there is any serious question in anyone's mind where things are going to be in a couple of years. Black Berry is going to be a smoldering wreckage relegated to a slowly shrinking business client base, Windows 7 Mobile Series (or whatever stupid name they gave it) and Palm will be gimped in the single digits, and Apple and Android will be within 10% of each other with the leader being anyone's guess (fight amongst yourselves fanbois).

If there is anything to throw a wrench into these numbers, it will be tablet uptake. Tablet uptake could screw these numbers all to hell. The phone business is a tough business to get into. The tablet business is much easier. If tablets don't turn out to be a fad like netbooks, I could see the mobile OS wars get crazy. A smart phone is expensive, hard to make, and cost a lot to keep. Tablets on the other hand are a one time cost. Right now Apple is doing pretty dandy being the only real player in town. Hard to say now, but I could envision a price war when Everyone (using Android) shows up to the game. We are a year away from every computer marker and their dog pushing an Android tablet. Prices will drops. The only question is whether or not consumers will bite, or if tablets are going to go the way of netbooks. Frankly, I am a little skeptical on tablets exploding, but if prices drop enough the market uptake might be violent and quick.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Internal Modem]

Google Branded DOES mean it has the word Google on it.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[cjdavis618]

I have some experiance with the Yankee group before and as such, I was labeled a troll because I didn't believe the poll without listing facts. I'm so happy :-)

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Beyond_GoodandEvil]

Idiotic? I would buy a true android phone with up to date specs. No way in hell am I buying an andoid phone with some garbage UI added on by the hardware company, or crapware pre-loaded. The only problem? It does not exist.
Did they stop selling the Nexus One already?Wow, they did. Wait until they discover howto root the EVO.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Em Ellel]

Google Branded DOES mean it has the word Google on it.

Not as far as Yankee Group is concerned. From their response:

So what is the right statistic for Android owners? The honest answer is that we don’t know. You’ll note in the excerpt above, we were careful to say “Google-branded Android phone owners”. That’s because our data keys on the manufacturer of the phone as the way to determine what type of phone a consumer owns.

So its pretty much just Nexus One.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[geminidomino]

Except maybe how the google homepage crashes the browser

I found the easiest way to deal with that little chunk of irony was to stop the load before it crashed, and disable the location lookup. It stopped crashing after that, and I'm perfectly sanguine with the loss of telling google where I am whenever I want to look up a cheat code.

My biggest issue with the Moment is the radio lockup after heavy data/wifi use, but considering I'm coming from a sequence of smartphones that included a Moto Q9C and a Palm Pro(850), if my only problem is needing to reboot it once a week (especially since I can do that without having to take off the damn battery cover like on the aforementioned Palm), I'll take it.

If they don't go the path of the iPhone and (we thought for awhile) the Droid X, and I can root it as easily, then I'll definitely get the Moment 2 (or whatever Samsung Android phone is around next year)

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[roc97007]

> I don't think that there is any serious question in anyone's mind where things are going to be in a couple of years. Black Berry is going to be a smoldering wreckage relegated to a slowly shrinking business client base, Windows 7 Mobile Series (or whatever stupid name they gave it) and Palm will be gimped in the single digits, and Apple and Android will be within 10% of each other with the leader being anyone's guess (fight amongst yourselves fanbois).

I'm currently a Blackberry user, but I'm not a fanatic about it. I have one because it had the best keyboard (subjectively) and it has push email, upon which my job depends, and it's dead nuts reliable. I briefly tried a Windows Mobile phone, sent it back. It's just plain not reliable enough for business use. Sorry, it's just not. The thing would lock up silently and I'd miss email, and worse, calls. You don't do that very often in my business before the boss wonders what he's paying you for.

Similarly, although many at work have those cute iphone gadgets, they don't work as well as a phone, which is kind-of important in business, (and this trend, with the 4G, seems to be getting worse) so they were not in the running.

I checked out a couple Android phones a few months ago, and the keyboards sucked and they didn't have push email. So other than the coolness of having a phone with the little green mascot, there was no reason for me to switch.

So... is there now? I'm not in love with the Blackberry. It does the job. And it's a job I very much need my phone to continue doing.

Does Android have push email?

Does any phone running Android have a decent keyboard for someone who does most of their communication via email from their handheld device? I can just about touch-type on the Tour. I can't get even close on the Droid.

How are the Android phones for general reliability? My Windows Mobile phone needed daily resets. Sometimes the *#&$@# audio driver would hang and the "*@#&$# phone wouldn't @#*$&# ring The first time I missed a call from my boss I returned the phone. The Blackberry will always ring, will always connect, and has only dropped maybe two calls in the last six months. How do the Android phones compare?

See, for business, it's really not about having something cute and sexy. It's about being absolutely reliable, and reducing communication lag to as close to zero as is technically possible. The moment Android (or any other platform) can provide this, I'll be happy to consider it.

That said, my 16yo daughter is trading in her BB 8900 for a Galaxy S tomorrow. But she doesn't have the same requirements as I.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Internal Modem]

The Yankee Group shouldn't be taking surveys and publishing results if they don't understand the nomenclature.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Anonymous Coward]

The manufacturer is HTC!

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Em Ellel]

The Yankee Group shouldn't be taking surveys and publishing results if they don't understand the nomenclature.

I think that is by far not the only problem these bozos have.

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Em Ellel]

The manufacturer is HTC!

Not exactly. It is manufactured by HTC for Google. You think Apple manufactures iPhones??

Re:What an Idiotic Blunder

[Shihar]

I think your points are completely valid and that Black Berry is going to hang onto its core business IT department crowd for a while yet. If you need a device that is for both work and play, an Android or an iPhone are clearly the way to go. I use my Android for work and play. It receives calls, gets work (and home) email. I can't speak for other devices, and Android does have a lot of freaking devices with varied levels of quality, but my Evo has crashed exactly once in the month or two I have had it, and that was while using software specifically marked as beta. Your millage my vary.

If you need a phone for Business with a capital B, iPhones and Androids are either unproven or not capable. Android for instance doesn't push yet (I don't think... don't quote me on it). Multi-task lets you get the same functionality, but at a power cost. I think the core IT driven Black Berry crowd is safe for now. IT departments are conservative and error on the side of caution. Only rapidly dropping prices from Android or failing quality from BB are going to push them away.

That said, the business market, while of a healthy size, is small change next to the potential consumer market. Hence, while Black Berry might continue to do fine business, as a smart phone vendor they are going to find their market share shrink to pittance overnight, even if they save their core IT based business customers.

How many Android users know what they're using?

[Kenja]

I know a number of people who have "that cool phone" or "the phone I saw on that tv show". They dont know its Android since thats not really a brand name. This is expounded by how different the UI elements are on different brands Android phones. HTC looks quite different from Motorola (stupid moto-blur) and so on. Some manufacturers are even rebranding Google funconality, see the "Genius Button".

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Darkness404]

Exactly. With the exception of Verizon, the other 3 major carriers have done a pretty poor job of branding their Android phones. AT&T's branding is nearly non-existent (look at the commercials for the Backflip and the HTC Aria could be a Windows Mobile phone from the screenshots they show...)

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Anonymous Coward]

To be clear, not all Motorola devices are moto-blur phones. I have the original Motorola Droid which is a Google Experience phone (meaning it is stock Android, no sneaky changes and carries Google branding on the device along with Motorola and Verizon logos). My wife has an HTC Aria on AT&T which is a Sense UI phone. I have to admit I like some of the features that Sense UI adds like easy sending of contacts via a VCard in an MMS. However, it can sometimes be confusing since "contacts" is renamed to "people" (funny, some of my contacts are businesses and schools not always people) and a "contact" to a "person". However in some places in the UI it still says "contact" which is a bit confusing since you were just editing a "person" and it is now a "contact". Overall the Sense UI seems nice and I wouldn't mind seeing it on my Droid as well. I've never even seen (first hand; I have seen screen shots) Moto-blur though even though I have a Motorola phone.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[16K Ram Pack]

In the UK, the phone shops are now mentioning that phones are Android.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Kenja]

I have a Droid as well, great phone. Thats not the point, the point is that if you get (for example) the backflip by Motorola for AT&T it really doesn't look much like an "Android" phone. It looks like some funky Motorola specific interface. Hell, AT&T even replaced all links to Google search etc with Yahoo. I dont think it says "Google" anywhere in the device.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Kenja]

And in the UK "Android" phone sales are up 300%.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Skuld-Chan]

Well maybe "google phone" is the right phrase - since most of them have the Google logo on them (on the back).

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[h4rr4r]

Contacts turned to people also breaks a lot of third party apps.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[Hadlock]

I doubt many people (i.e. "consumers") make the connection between the whole dark and stormy "Droid Does" marketing campaign and the light and airy green Android robot mascot.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[tepples]

(funny, some of my contacts are businesses and schools not always people)

A corporation is legally a person.

Re:How many Android users know what they're using?

[marcosdumay]

That's not bad brading, that is part of the game. Phone manufacturers want to make their phones unique, and Google designed and licensed (maybe without intention, but did so anyway) Android in a way that they can do it. That is part of what is making it popular.

Wow. Just wow.

[Anonymous Coward]

So it wasn't fabricated stats, it was just a hilariously bad game of telephone. Not sure which is more disturbing...

Either way, what's the outcome for people who saw the original report and didn't instinctively know it was bogus? Most of them will never see even the CNN "correction", much less the truth. Sucks to be them, and I guess if it wasn't this, they'd be believing some other bogus claim; but still, the Android phone manufacturers should sue them -- such sloppiness won't go away unless/until it costs them money.

I can see the typical smartphone user now...

[Anonymous Coward]

Why would I want an Android phone? I'm perfectly happy with my Evo!

Perhaps Yankee aren't all that good at math, but current trending shows the Android marketshare surpassing the iPhone maybe in the next 12-18 months (being conservative). There's a decent chance that they'll start digging into RIM more than iPhone to allow for a RIM > iPhone > Android scenario, but unless BBOS 6.0 is fantastic (and the early browser demo is promising) and they start attracting app developers I can see Android at the #1 spot in five years pretty easily.

Re:I can see the typical smartphone user now...

[h4rr4r]

Even funnier is that all the majors are using or will be using a unix-like OS on their phones. BBOS6 is qnx. MS might own the desktop, but they have a heck of fight in the server space and in the phone/tablet space. Balmer even made a DEC like "were not worried we have the business" statement not to long ago.

Re:I can see the typical smartphone user now...

[Anonymous Coward]

Ummm... no.

iOS is not UNIX-like, BBOS6 is not UNIX-like, Android is not UNIX-like.

All of these use a kernel from a UNIX-like system, and maybe some other low-level stuff, but the entire top half of the platform is custom, serving only to _hide_ whatever remaining UNIX features may exist.

See Master Foo and the Ten Thousand Lines if you don't see why that matters. Back? OK, Maemo is AFAIK the _only_ UNIX-like OS shipping on phones these days. Why? Because it's the only one where I can type that pipeline. (Yes, it comes out of the box with an X terminal.)

If you don't like that angle, here's another: it's also (AFAIK) the only one where you can compile apps on the device -- those familiar with UNIX history will recall it was first shipped outside Bell as an development environment to build a standalone application that would run on bare iron, but wound up being kept as the operating system instead. (I doubt Maemo is fully self-hosting at this point, but it's damned close, especially compared to others.)

Calling the others UNIX-like systems is either a hilarious joke that I was simply too stupid to get (cue the whooshes!), or a gross ignorance of what UNIX is and why it's still relevant 40 years on.

Re:I can see the typical smartphone user now...

[geminidomino]

All of these use a kernel from a UNIX-like system, and maybe some other low-level stuff, but the entire top half of the platform is custom, serving only to _hide_ whatever remaining UNIX features may exist.

Despite what Microsoft, Apple, and/or Canonical may have told you, UI != OS.

And for the record, even before rooting my phone, I could get into a user shell (busybox, I believe) on my Moment.

WTF

[oldhack]

Another post that makes feel dumber after having scanned the headline. Why are they keep posting gossipy bullshit "stories" like this?

Damage is already done

[shaitand]

AT&T and Apple couldn't have bought better advertising.

Even the original statement, 20% of android users are going to get a new phone vs 77% of apple users being happy was biased reporting. If reported in an unbiased manner that would be 80% happy android users vs 77% Apple or 20% unhappy vs 23%, etc. Both would be the positive or the negative.

Note: As a mildly respected member of the Slashdot community I didn't RTFA just TFS so the article may not have been biased at all.

Re:Damage is already done

[semiotec]

So let's play some numbers game.

According to Nielsen, Android market share in 2010 Q1 was 9%.

If 20% of the overall smartphone market wants to buy an Android phone next, then it means that:

20/9 = 222% of Android users will buy another Android phone!

Take that, Apple! Your 77% is nothing!

p.s. no, I don't believe in any way that this is correct way of looking at these numbers.

Re:Damage is already done

[shaitand]

That's 77% of apple users, not 77% of the market. That was 20% of the market buying androids (or 'google brand phone') so these numbers do indicate an increase in android market share.

Re:Damage is already done

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, I'm not sure how you got that out of TFS, but from TFA, it's a lot simpler:

20% of "google-branded phone" users plan to buy an Android phone.
77% of iPhone users plan to buy an iPhone.

IIRC, 34% of "google-branded phone" users plan to buy an iPhone, FWIW.

Note that these stats are pre-iPhone4, but it's not clear (and I didn't do any digging to find out) whether this was before or after the barphone prototype was publicized. The presence of a new generation of iPhone with (this is important) the highest resolution display available could well be responsible for the spike in iPhone interest among all users.

Re:Damage is already done

[Em Ellel]

That's 77% of apple users, not 77% of the market. That was 20% of the market buying androids (or 'google brand phone') so these numbers do indicate an increase in android market share.

Its 20% of ALL users with smartphones (including iPhones) say they would buy an Android phone next. The comparable number for that from same study is 34% of all users with smarphones (including iPhones) would buy iPhone (if you do math, that means 12% of non-Apple smartphone users). From same study 77% of iPhone users would buy another iPhone, while 32% of Google Brand phone users (meaning pretty much G1 or NexusOne only, not Android in general) would buy another Google Branded phone( which is insane, considering Google already exited the market, so their only option would be another NexusOne??)

-Em

Re:Damage is already done

[shaitand]

"Correction: An earlier version of this story incorrectly said that 20% of Android customers say they'll buy another Android phone. The survey actually revealed that 20% of all smartphone customers say they'll buy an Android phone.' The Yankee Group has further sought to clarify the situation by saying that the 20% are people who explicitly said they would buy a 'Google-branded' phone"

Now I have to read TFA. Your reading sounds the same as the uncorrected story... which would support my assertion that the damage is already done. ;)

Re:Damage is already done

[shaitand]

Offtopic?

Re:Damage is already done

[Em Ellel]

Well, I'm not sure how you got that out of TFS, but from TFA, it's a lot simpler:

20% of "google-branded phone" users plan to buy an Android phone.
77% of iPhone users plan to buy an iPhone.

IIRC, 34% of "google-branded phone" users plan to buy an iPhone, FWIW.

Note that these stats are pre-iPhone4, but it's not clear (and I didn't do any digging to find out) whether this was before or after the barphone prototype was publicized. The presence of a new generation of iPhone with (this is important) the highest resolution display available could well be responsible for the spike in iPhone interest among all users.

Guess its not as simple as you thought. Actual stats they are claiming them now are:

  20% of ALL smartphone users would buy Android,
  34% of ALL smartphone users would buy iPhone,

  77% of iPhone users would buy another iPhone , and
  32% of users of phones manufactured by "Google" (NexusOne) users would buy another phone manufactured by "Google" (not same thing as Android or "with Google" labeled phone !!!)

Hope this helps people to understand this mess of misinformation.

-Em

Re:Damage is already done

[Anonymous Coward]

How many android phone users are there when you factor in the Nook and Kindle, which are both technically android phones...

Re:Damage is already done

[semiotec]

let me shamelessly quote myself:

So let's play some numbers game.

Note the use of the word "game", this is to mean that it's not a serious analysis, and more of a tongue-in-cheek reply to the kind of statistics quoted in the article.

p.s. no, I don't believe in any way that this is correct way of looking at these numbers.

This was a further disclaimer to say that, yes, I know it's a silly and incorrect interpretation, please don't take it seriously. That is, it's a joke. Not serious at all.

Re:Damage is already done

[mcvos]

Probably 68% of Nexus One users already knew there's not going to be a Nexus Two.

iPhone will lose

[Jackie_Chan_Fan]

The iPhone will lose if Apple continues to treat customers the way it currently does.

Re:iPhone will lose

[Nerdfest]

I'd like to think that as well, but they do seem to enjoy it.

Good news!

[Andy Smith]

Since putting my 'proper' job on hold I've clocked up around 2 months of 16-hour days working on my first Android game, with roughly a month to go, so it would be great if the whole world would buy Android phones please!

Oh and if everyone could also start pining for a retro-style vertically-scrolling shoot-em-up then that would be great too :-)

Re:Good news!

[beakerMeep]

Bookmarked your blog to give it a test spin when it comes out

Re:Good news!

[se7en11]

Would love to help beta test it if you needed. I'm a developer as well and understand the importance of other people testing it. Just let me know - would love to help.

My wife likes her HTC Magic

[MichaelSmith]

In fact it is the only technological device she doesn't constantly complain about. The way it is going she will get a new phone of the same type when this one comes off contract.

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[IrquiM]

And a friend of mine tells me she "want's that iPhone you have!", which is a HTC Desire.

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[gencha]

I actually like the idea. Maybe we should call all cellphones iPhone.

A: "What iPhone do you have?"
B: "Oh, I have the Apple one."

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[shaitand]

Why not, we call all restaurants Taco Bell... Wait, that hasn't happened yet.

Nothing to see here citizen, move along.

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[Jimmy King]

Nope, they aren't all Taco Bell until sometime around 2032, probably 5-10 years before that, really.

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[Anonymous Coward]

ditto. And she cannot manage to turn on TV... with cable box, HTPC and home theater attached to it, but I digress :)

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[Anonymous Coward]

I can see how your friend got confused. She saw that your phone has the 3G and Wifis.

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[Beyond_GoodandEvil]

A: "What iPhone do you have?" B: "Oh, I have the Apple one."
Does it have the wifis, I would like the one with more GBs

Re:My wife likes her HTC Magic

[geminidomino]

Three Seashells?

Another phone?

[Hatta]

Why would you need two phones?

Re:Another phone?

[unix1]

As a backup?

Re:Another phone?

[symbolset]

Multitasking.

Re:Another phone?

[LynnwoodRooster]

So you can use the second to make calls when your first has antenna problems...

Re:Another phone?

[ScrewMaster]

Why would you need two phones?

Stereo, of course.

Re:Another phone?

[JAlexoi]

That is how you do multitasking on older iPhones... You get two!

It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[MrCrassic]

A lot of people automatically associate Android with Google because the first line of Android-capable phones (G1, Hero, myTouch3G) were marketed that way. In fact, I think the release of the Droid on Verizon officially put a stop to that trend, but I'm not entirely sure about that. Thus, I'd say that surveying how many are likely to get Google-branded phones is a pretty reasonable indicator of how well Android is doing in the marketplace.

Nonetheless, even though Android doesn't seem to be getting a lot of love lately (or at least according to this survey), the thing to keep in mind is that Android's market presence has become notably stronger since the G1 came out. I honestly think that from a phone perspective, the Nexus One had serious potential to realistically compete with the iPhone (3GS) behemoth, considering that it's similar to the iPhone while offering a completely different, and completely usable, experience at a lower price. It's a shame that Google (and T-Mobile!) didn't promote the phone as actively as they could have; it had TONS of potential. Look at how well the Droid's doing on Verizon! (Yes, the Samsung Galaxy S line is much more feature-rich, but it's a toy. The Nexus One was a statement...and a damned good looking one.)

Let's put it this way: at least it's not just Blackberry and Windows Mobile anymore!

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[Belial6]

It is a shame that Google isn't going to put out an Nexus 2. Contrary to what most people think, I believe the Nexus One was a great success. Just look at home much press Android 2.2 is getting. Yet, the Nexus One is still the only phone that has it. How long would it take for other phones to get the new OS if there wasn't an existing phone on the market that was running it? The Nexus One may not have taken over the hardware market, but it was an astounding success in advertising, and a huge factor in pushing carriers to offer phones with newer versions of the OS.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[MrCrassic]

It was a great success. Look at the phones that have been released before (Droid, Aria, Espresso, Behold, etc.) and after (Droid X, Galaxy S, EVO) the Nexus One. I won't say that it was directly responsible for the proliferation of seriously powerful and (reasonably) feature-packed devices, but it did push the platform forward just like the G1 did.

I think Google will make another effort down the line. Android seems to be losing its focus, since it's becoming a lot like Windows Mobile in its execution. The ONLY phone shipping the "Google Experience" (i.e. Android as intended, more or less) was the Nexus One, every other phone out there has some sort of skin FORCEFULLY installed on it (HTC Sense, MOTOBLUR, TouchWiz, etc). To further feed the fire, many of those phones have tons of applications that are completely unnecessary and only seem to help the carrier --- COMPLETELY like the carrier-provided smart (and dumb!) phones that came before the smartphone explosion.

Forget the fact that most of these phones are a bit difficult to root/unlock. When a person buys an iPhone, they get software that, in its stock form, is EXACTLY as Apple intended it. It doesn't have Facebook or anything like that pre-installed; the user get the Apple bits right from the beginning, and everything added after that is entirely up to him or her. Not so when you buy Android...and the sad part is that the stock UI is actually quite good! It's not like Windows Mobile where HTC et. al. HAD to put TouchFLO/Sense on top of it because it was fugly compared to everything else out there.

Look at TouchWiz on the Vibrant, for instance. It tries really, really hard to provide an iPhone-like interface in hopes of being easy to use. The only problem is that it's not. They COULD try and provide something 'different' (which a LOT of people would probably appreciate, if it works) like HTC does with Sense, but that would make way too much sense.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[grayn0de]

The ONLY phone shipping the "Google Experience" (i.e. Android as intended, more or less) was the Nexus One, every other phone out there has some sort of skin FORCEFULLY installed on it (HTC Sense, MOTOBLUR, TouchWiz, etc).

Not true. The Samsung Moment, though laden with Sprint's 'unremovable system apps' (i.e. NASCAR, NFL, SprintTV, etc) and tweaked for CDMA/EVDO, has a plain vanilla Android ROM on it. It offers much the same Google experience as the G1/DevPhone1 did. The only UI difference between the Moment and the Nexus One is that the N1 has the Advanced Laucher and Live Wallpapers (which have been ported to the Moment by the excellent community of Android device hackers, since day one.)

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[Nerdfest]

everything added after that is entirely up to him or her.

... well, unless it's porn, flash, or anything programmable ... currently.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[MrCrassic]

Jailbreaking is the solution. It's absurdly easy, but so many are afraid of it.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[shaitand]

"Thus, I'd say that surveying how many are likely to get Google-branded phones is a pretty reasonable indicator of how well Android is doing in the marketplace. "

Not when your surveyors are only calling people with actual google branded phones from lists provided by the carriers like these guys.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[shaitand]

P.S. The story put the lack of love spin on the numbers. The numbers did not.

Per Neilson Android has 9% market share, IPhone has 28%. This says only 77% of Iphoners are going to keep their phones and 20% of the entire market (including iphoners) are going to buy an Android.

That means if these numbers are correct Android will soon have a greater marketshare than the IPhone.

But that was before the front page CNN article telling everyone the IPhone rocks and Android sux0rs.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[shaitand]

? My HTC Hero came from sprint with OS Version 2.2 preloaded.

I also believe the Evo has 2.2

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[bm_luethke]

"When a person buys an iPhone, they get software that, in its stock form, is EXACTLY as Apple intended it."

That is both one of the features and faults of pretty much all of Apples products. If you think like Apple wants you to then they are the best interface and device on the planet, if you do not then you want to fling them through a wall.

I have always been in the latter group, the interface is one of the least useful ones I have ever used, nothing is where I expect it to be and I can't make it fit my notion of what I want to do. I know of a great deal of iPhone users that only mostly like the interface, as of right now it isn't like Android is much better (as you say many manufacturers force their interface on you too which has the same issues). However there is at least a wider selection and one can usually find an Android phone that fits fairly close to what you like. I do agree about the stock interface - I've yet to see anything that tops a slightly customized Droid or Nexus One (and those apps were free from the market place - I have a Droid).

Android will probably never have that one iPhone killer - it is just not positioned to do so. What it will eventually do is what the PC did to Apple - have so many out there that in total they will dominate. Give it another couple of years and when you really start getting Android based phones that cater to different users and you still have the one option for iPhone and it will "win" (what it does to RIM will depend on how much they can tailor one to the business world and RIM is hard to beat there - they nailed that market as much as Apple nailed the MP3 player market).

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[wfolta]

Android seems to be losing its focus, since it's becoming a lot like Windows Mobile in its execution. The ONLY phone shipping the "Google Experience" (i.e. Android as intended, more or less) was the Nexus One, every other phone out there has some sort of skin FORCEFULLY installed on it (HTC Sense, MOTOBLUR, TouchWiz, etc). To further feed the fire, many of those phones have tons of applications that are completely unnecessary and only seem to help the carrier --- COMPLETELY like the carrier-provided smart (and dumb!) phones that came before the smartphone explosion.

Apple's customer is the consumer, and they will fight the carriers to create the experience they believe the consumer will want. They may not deliver an experience you (or I) want, but they are trying to deliver an experience for an end user.

Google's customers are the carriers. They only want to keep the smartphone market segmented and open to their ad/search control. As long as they can sell your eyes and your personal information, they really don't care what your personal experience is. (Except it can't get SO bad that you can't stand to use any Android phone/carrier at all, robbing them of their real income.)

The only thing holding carriers back from totally ruining handsets again is the iPhone and a fanatical Steve Jobs who simply will not allow carriers to mess with things. Other carriers have seen how successful the iPhone is, and so have to at least make as if they care about customers and good design now. If Android trounced the iPhone and Apple went broke next year, we'd soon be back to the worst-of-all-possible-worlds ideas of addware-ladened PCs combined with carrier-controlled designs and restrictions.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[LodCrappo]

The variations in user interface are a growth pain, one that Windows Mobile never became popular enough to outgrow. With the momentum behind Android, it seems possible if not likely that some interface (or a set of elements) will emerge as clearly superior and only phones that implement that interface will sell well. Google has stated that the UI is their main focus in the next version of Android, so it seems they are aware of the issue and doing what they can to improve it. Sure, carriers will always want to mess with things and with so many manufacturers, at least one of them is going to give in to them. Maybe this will be tamed, maybe not. Strangely, Verizon seems to be taking a very hands off approach with their Android phones for now. They used to be known for trying to turn every phone into the same crappy interface, but my new Droid Incredible has very little software that didn't come from HTC and it's completely unobtrusive, as in you have to go looking to find it.

Right now is certainly an interesting time if you are in to trying new things on your phone. There are dozens of home screen interfaces, keyboards/input methods, widgets, etc to play with. Some are innovative, some are duds. With an open system, anyone can try any idea they have, the cream is allowed to rise. It just takes some time and the interest of innovative developers, something Android seems to have in spades. Windows Mobile never attracted this kind of work, and the iPhone platform alienates those who are interested in such things since the interface is locked down. The creative energy behind Android is really fun to watch, I can't wait to see where they are in a year or two.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[stephanruby]

is EXACTLY as Apple intended it. It doesn't have Facebook or anything like that pre-installed; the user get the Apple bits right from the beginning, and everything added after that is entirely up to him or her. Not so when you buy Android...and the sad part is that the stock UI is actually quite good!

You are just misinformed. With Android, you can change the total look and feel of your phone without even rooting it (even coming back to the stock UI if you like). In the Android Market, just search for "home", search for "dialer", or search for "keyboard", and install the ones you prefer -- that's it. Just try doing that with the iPhone!!

Granted, apps like 'Sprint TV' and 'Sprint NASCAR' will still be on your phone, but they won't be visible to you unless you go into the applications tab. And even the applications tab, you don't have to use that if you don't want to, personally I use 'Apps Organizer' as my primary view for locating apps, it's really been a godsend for tagging and organizing all the apps I keep on downloading.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[molnarcs]

... like HTC does with Sense, but that would make way too much sense.

There's a joke in there somewhere :)

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[gordyf]

The Hero and EVO both run 2.1.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[stephanruby]

You're the one who says the Android stock UI can't be gotten back to, and yet, getting it back is as easy as clicking 'install' on a free app from the Marketplace.

And yet to you, hunting down the instructions, rooting your iPhone, foregoing any future OTA updates for your model, now to **you** that's the easier path of the two?? Really???? Are you freaking kidding me?!??? Why would anyone want an iPhone that can't be officially updated anymore?

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[ShakaUVM]

A lot of people automatically associate Android with Google because the first line of Android-capable phones (G1, Hero, myTouch3G) were marketed that way. In fact, I think the release of the Droid on Verizon officially put a stop to that trend, but I'm not entirely sure about that.

Nope, the Droid still has the Google logo branded on it. Along with two Verizon and one Motorola logo.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[MrCrassic]

I guess for the same reasons people get these Android phones that can't officially get updated anymore either...

For what it's worth, jailbreaking an iPhone is as easy as downloading an application and running it. Rooting one's device is far more laborous, or at least I think it would be for a typical user.

You're the one who says the Android stock UI can't be gotten back to, and yet, getting it back is as easy as clicking 'install' on a free app from the Marketplace.

Not so simple. Yes, you can "get it back" by downloading LauncherPro et al, but it's still running underneath regardless. Actually removing it usually requires a custom ROM, which is blocked from official update paths too.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[Internal Modem]

Verizon's Droids are Google Branded.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[stephanruby]

I guess for the same reasons people get these Android phones that can't officially get updated anymore either...

Actually, there are far many more reasons to root an iPhone than to root an Android.

For what it's worth, jailbreaking an iPhone is as easy as downloading an application and running it. Rooting one's device is far more laborous, or at least I think it would be for a typical user.

I assume you meant "isn't"

Not so simple. Yes, you can "get it back" by downloading LauncherPro et al, but it's still running underneath regardless. Actually removing it usually requires a custom ROM, which is blocked from official update paths too.

I haven't tried LauncherPro. From your description it sounds like it overlays a smaller window on top of the UI. I was speaking more of apps like Home++ for instance. Those replace completely the default home UI of your handset manufacturer. And by definition since it's an Activity replacing another Activity, nothing but background services could run underneath the replacement.

Re:It's still looks pretty bad...but it's not.

[MrCrassic]

If Google's customers were inherently the carriers, then why did they release a phone that was so far-removed from carrier lock-in that people still question why it was even supported by them in the first place?

I don't think Google's target customers were the carriers; the AOSP is mostly open-source and can be modified as needed, so it seems more like a byproduct of design and licensing. Perhaps the leaders of this project foresaw carriers designing the experience as they wished, though it makes me wonder whether they preferred that. Considering how the Nexus One was tailored, I would like to think that wasn't the case. (If anything, the ROM used by the Droid is pretty disconnected from Verizon, though they certainly have the manpower to pull old tricks and paint the ROM red like they only know how.)

Strange article

[demonbug]

That's the key finding in a survey released this week by Yankee Group, which reports that 73% of iPhone users are very satisfied with AT&T's service.

The satisfaction rate of AT&T subscribers as a whole is 68%, and only 69% of smartphone users say they are satisfied with their mobile provider, Yankee Group found.

So... a whopping 5% (4% if you confine yourself to smartphones, which they rather broadly defined) more iPhone users are satisfied with AT&T than the aggregate of all subscribers? What was the margin of error on this? Why is it a story that a tiny bit more iPhone users are satisfied with their provider than non-iPhone users?

Re:Strange article

[Snarky McButtface]

The CNN article only told half the story.

Push Poll

[TheMeuge]

This is a marketing strategy known as the Push Poll (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Push_poll).

You ask the questions in such a way as to get the answer you want.

Re:Push Poll

[Sancho]

That's not really how the article describes push polling, which is more of a way of campaigning (or mudslinging) than a method of polling. Push polling is a way to get the people you poll to think something is true. This is more of a manipulation of the poll in order to get the results you want so that the rest of the world thinks that your outcome is true.

Why do these statistics matter?

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Does knowing your particular phone sold more/less/is an iPhone really matter?

Who's keeping score? Why?

All I care about is that there are smart phones on the market that aren't WinMo, BB or Symbian.

Re:Why do these statistics matter?

[Archangel Michael]

Why do these statistics matter?

Statistics matter to the 73.54% of the people who make them up on the spot.

Re:Why do these statistics matter?

[Skuld-Chan]

They would matter to you if you were trying to market a new phone.

Re:Why do these statistics matter?

[Bing Tsher E]

I can assure you that nobody reading this thread, or commenting on it, is trying to market a new phone.

Well... there are probably a few trolls who have wandered over from apple.slashdot.org, but they're not paid a commission for their posts on this domain, so they're generally quiet here.

Android Users Aren't As Disloyal As Reported

[MrKaos]

Maybe they're just a little less *restricted*.

:-)

Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Eponymous Coward]

I really disappointed that Google is going to stop selling handsets. I was waiting for a Nexus Two.

I want a phone that has a pure (plain?) Android experience. I don't want the layers that Motorola and HTC add to differentiate themselves, not to mention all the bloatware. It wouldn't bother me so much if I was able to reformat a phone in the same way I can reformat a Dell or HP machine to clear off all the crap, but as far as I know, I can't.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Drew M.]

Let's see... Google gave all of their employees the G1 for Christmas of 2008, same happened with the Nexus One for Christmas of 2009. Maybe you should check back around Christmas time.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[blair1q]

No dice. This year they're all getting turkeys.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[daemonc]

Personally, I was waiting for the Nexus 6 model... it's seen things you people wouldn't believe.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Kryptonut]

Windows 7 Phone?

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[ColdWetDog]

No dice. This year they're all getting turkeys.

I think he was talking about Google, not Microsoft.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[CryptDemon]

But does it pass the empathy test?

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Anonymous Coward]

It wouldn't bother me so much if I was able to reformat a phone in the same way I can reformat a Dell or HP machine to clear off all the crap, but as far as I know, I can't.

you need to know more.

google android custom rom

not quite as easy but not difficult.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[daemonc]

No, but it wants more (battery) life, f*cker.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[bm_luethke]

There are a number of Android phones that can have custom (or vanilla) roms flashed onto them. It's not really any harder now than reinstalling a stock version of an OS on your pc (instead of the rescue disks crap they give you now). The vast majority of the process is quite automated now.

See http://www.mydroidworld.com/ and their forums for the current state of what phones can bee rooted and what phones can be reflashed and with what. Heck many of the phones can even be overclocked if you so desire :)

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm considering rooting my HTC Incredible to get stock Android instead of HTC sense also. But if I go through the trouble, I may as well enjoy free tethering too.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Eponymous Coward]

I'm afraid that phone makers are going to follow Motorola's lead and start refusing to boot except from a signed image. This could be quite difficult to defeat and as far as I know, hasn't been defeated yet.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes you Nothing is stoping you to have that. I have Desire with unbranded, clean Android.

Re:Sad to see Google bail on the hardware

[RMH101]

I kind of agree with your point but just to go into it in detail...
Some Android devices are trivial to root (forget about SIM unlocking, I'm talking about rooting the OS so you can install anything on it including third party community ROMs). The Nexus One for example just needs a single command to unlock the bootloader, after which it informs you that if you go ahead it'll void your warranty, then it's open. The HTC Desire (which is almost the same phone) has been made deliberately harder to root. You don't get R/W access to /system whilst the phone is booted either.
I've rooted by Desire and I'm running Neophyte 1.3 Android 2.2 (Froyo) ROM on it and it's amazing. Getting 39Mflops out of it on Linpack, compared to under 8 on stock 2.1 ROM.
Basic process was...(for Windows, for other OS you can skip the USB driver step)
Install HTC Sync to get the USB drivers
Install the Android SDK
Using the SDK get the device ID, paste into an online web form to email me a disk image, use a hex editor to copy and paste the contents of that disk image to the first blocks of a spare micro SD card to make a "goldcard"
Boot into recovery with goldcard, use a Modaco script to push a hacked bootloader to phone, reboot
When done, copy Clockwork Recovery flash to the normal SD card, copy downloaded Froyo ROM and radio updates to SD card
Reboot into Clockwork Recovery, apply downloaded ROM and radio and reboot.

Not all that tricky for an enthusiastic geek, but it's not something you'd walk your mum through over the phone, either.

Results are totally worth it though!

Summary of correction misleading

[SuperKendall]

The Yankee Group has further sought to clarify the situation by saying that the 20% are people who explicitly said they would buy a 'Google-branded' phone (which excludes the overwhelming majority of popular Android phones)

No, they did not say that.

In fact what the correction was about was that the people SURVEYED owned "Google-Branded iPhones", the deal was that the HTC and Droid owners may well have a much better satisfaction rate (which I would think to be true given the "Google branded" sampling includes G1 owners).. If there was anything in there specifically asking the people if they would buy Google-branded phones later vs. asking them if they would buy an Android phone - I didn't see it. Also YOU summarized the description as "Google Branded" but the correct phrase (from the article) is "Google Branded Android phone". It seems to be the key word there is in fact Android, I'll bet if you asked the average consumer something like 80% of them would assume the HTC and Droid were "Google Branded Android Phones".

What does seem pretty significant is this:

In fact, 36 percent of Google-branded Android phone owners say they plan to buy an iPhone

So the real question is, what are the group between the 20% and the 36% planning to buy exactly?

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[Anonymous Coward]

I think you're being optimistic. They typical Android owner only knows that they like their Evo 4G. The high end Android owner recognizes the Nexus One as the only Google Branded Android phone. The mid-range user *may* actually interpret the question as it was intended, but how many of those are there?

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[h4rr4r]

My droid says google on the back, it did run a stock 2.1, and now runs CM6. How much more google branded could it really get?

It is google branded, maybe not google retailed but it does have google on the back.

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[Anonymous Coward]

My Motorola-branded Droid X has a little Google sticker in the back that gets covered by the case. Not sure which Google Droid you've got, all the one's I've seen are HTC or Motorola branded.

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[h4rr4r]

The Motorola droid. It says google right on the back. Bottom left, below camera.

http://a.fsdn.com/gc/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/motorola_droid_back_vertical-580x303.png

You don't put a case on a droid phone, they are made of metal and gorilla glass you heathen.

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[mjwx]

My droid says google on the back, it did run a stock 2.1, and now runs CM6. How much more google branded could it really get?

The Droid is a "Google Experience" phone which means it follows Google guidelines on UI design and a few other things. The Milestone (GSM Droid) is not "Google Experience" as it doesn't have the "with Google" branding but is pretty much the same as the Droid.

Things like the HTC Desire and HTC Hero (they have different names in the states) are not "Google Experience" phones.

Re:Summary of correction misleading

[Internal Modem]

HTC Incredible (Desire) is, however, a Google Branded phone.

So tired of phone drama

[scromp]

Buy whatever phone you like and shut up about it.

Re:So tired of phone drama

[roc97007]

Bravo!

(deep breath) It's JUST a PHONE, people. That felt good.

...unless it's running Winders Mobile. Man, I hated that phone.

Apple press statements lie about competition

[mjwx]

Apple press statements lie about competition.

I'm shocked I tell you, absolutely shocked. Who would have thought.

Re:Meanwhile Off In Reality

[Anonymous Coward]

"The iPhone 4 is a defective piece of junk with a laughably outdated OS."

You can change the wallpaper with iOS 4. Take that Google!

New Math - more will switch AWAY from iPhone....

[Em Ellel]

So let's play some numbers game.

According to Nielsen, Android market share in 2010 Q1 was 9%.

If 20% of the overall smartphone market wants to buy an Android phone next, then it means that:

20/9 = 222% of Android users will buy another Android phone!

Take that, Apple! Your 77% is nothing!

p.s. no, I don't believe in any way that this is correct way of looking at these numbers.

It is at least as "correct" as their way. But if you read carefully, they include the iPhone users in the "smartphone" category. Two can play this game -- we can do some "math" too.

Assuming iPhone in the study is represented roughly same as the market share (28%), this would really skew the numbers in its favor. Lets un-skew. This means that of 34% Smartphone users that would buy iPhone as their next phone, 22% (28%*0.77) are already iPhone users - meaning that only 12% (34%-22%) of the users would switch to iPhone from another Smartphone while 23% (100%-77%) of existing iPhone users that would switch away from iPhone.

So, the real story - almost twice as many people would switch away from iPhone as would switch to it. ;-)

-Em

Turn the numbers upside down...

[linatux]

12% of iPhone owners have been put off smartphones altogether, another 11% want a smartphone but not from Apple. 2% would consider a Windows phone!!
(The Android numbers are so messed up they aren't even worth taking notice of).

Aww, Poor Liddle iFags Feelings Hurt

[Anonymous Coward]

Still crying in each other arms at Starbucks over what a piece of shit the iPhone 4 is?

Re:Aww, Poor Liddle iFags Feelings Hurt

[mcvos]

It's a really nice machine if you put a bit of tape on it.

Re:Meanwhile Off In Reality

[shaitand]

Not a troll, these are relevant facts and on topic with regard to the story.

A lot of heavy handed Apple modding in the comments on this one. Looks like some people weren't happy to lose their rosy picture.

The Yankee Group

[gavron]

The Yankee Group has been a microsoft shil for years!

Do the math.

I'm not sure how much of a "group" they are. After all, they have more directors and officers than "analysts." Still I'm sure the microsoft money is good.. http://www.yankeegroup.com/listAnalysts.do

E

Good grief, of course not.

[Frosty Piss]

Android Users Aren't As Disloyal As Reported

Of course not, it not in their programming (Asimov's Laws, and all). Unless they are Borg...

Too many versions of Android already!

[King_TJ]

Honestly, I think the popularity of these products will increase with time. Right now, it's pretty frustrating, because like a full-blown computer, you have to be concerned with the version a phone is running, and whether or not upgrades are going to be available for it!

EG. Nextel finally has an Android phone out as of yesterday that supports "push to talk" on their IDEN network. This is great news for those of us with companies stuck on Nextel because so many people are using them as walkie-talkies. Previously, you couldn't get anything worth a darn as a "smartphone" that ran on their network. BUT, they only have Android 1.5 support in it and NO word of whether or not 2.1 will ever be offered for it! That's a real bummer, because so many apps in their marketplace require at least v2.1.

For all the complaints about the iPhone, at least if I buy a new one today, I know it runs everything available for one, and I don't have to worry that I'm stuck with the specific version of the OS that came with it. Since Apple was a computer company long before they decided to make a phone, they're FAR above average in grasping the concept that users expect firmware upgrades.

Re:Too many versions of Android already!

[symbolset]

Choice is bad! Stupid Americans and their 37 different choices of bottled water in the 7-11.

Re:Too many versions of Android already!

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmmmm let's say someone has an iPhone 2 and I build an app for iOS4. I doubt that will 'just work', especially with the larger screen resolution. So your argument is flawed, mr fanboi. Oh noes! We have choice! That should be forbidden!

Re:Too many versions of Android already!

[Shihar]

This is really a silly complaint. Multiple versions is not doom. Android actually makes it very easy to develop for the lowest possible version that makes your app work. If an app can be made to work with 1.6, it will work with 1.6. If it needs 2.2, you won't see it. Yes, there will be better phone than yours out there. If this really gives your heart ache, maybe you should get an iPhone.

With an iPhone, you can upgrade on the regular upgrade cycle and never be more than a generation behind when your contract runs out. With Android, you can buy the latest and greatest thing and, seriously, someone is going to have something better within 3 months. If it bothers you that someone out there has something shinier than what you have, don't buy Android. You will live your life in misery. This is what happens when you have half a dozen companies engaging in an economic blood bath to make the best phone. They get better, fast. Much faster than you can upgrade.

Android itself is also in violent expansion. The hardware that 1.6 was made for is night and day different from what they built 2.2 for. Seriously, an Android phone from just a year ago is an order of magnitude worse than what we see today. Again, if rapid improvement far faster than you can upgrade causes your heart ache, stay away from Android. Give it a couple of years and things will level off a little. What makes this phone market unique is that the designers know EXACTLY how to get to the next performance level from the PC experience, it is just a matter of reducing size and power consumption. This means that what it took the PC market a decade or two to achieve, cell phones are going to do in a couple of years. In the phone market we have gone from glorified graphing calculators to computers pushing the power levels of early 2000 in a couple of years. Now that there is an interest in this market, it is going to get better, faster.

Personally, I'll stick to Android. Yes, my fucking Evo that ran off the life force of ground babies is already starting to look dated next to all of those shinny new devices that are coming out that I now drool over. It doesn't change the fact that my phone rocks just as much as it did when I first got it; it just can't rock as hard as what is going to come out in a couple of months. I am pretty sure that when my 18 months are up my Evo is going to look like a relic compared to the latest and greatest Android devices of the day. That won't make my phone any less capable, but it sure as hell will make that day when my contract is up all the more sweeter.

"Fragmentation" isn't a bad thing. It just means that hardware and software are advancing too fucking fast for your sad little 2 year contract to keep up with. Personally, I consider that a good thing. I can live with a little penis envy now if it means an even more bad ass device later.

Re:Too many versions of Android already!

[intheshelter]

Actually, I think his argument is pretty solid. The fact that you found a way to negate his argument 2% of the time does not take away from the fact that he is right 98% of the time. Try and use your brain and find something more useful to say that fanboi comments. They tend to make you look like an anti-fanboi fanboi and that's just plain stupid.

Suddenly

[giorgist]

Suddenly CNN news Google news rank tanked to the level of the primary school blog

That should fix'em :-)

Google ... do some harm, for your fanboys

I got my first android phone last week..

[asm2750]

..and I enjoy my new Evo 4G so much more than my WM6.1 piece of crap.

Now waiting the 2nd retraction...

[mysidia]

"Android users aren't as disloyal as reported"

That's part 1... still waiting on part 2:

• iPhone users aren't as loyal as reported
• iPhone users don't love AT&T as much as reported

I wonder if it was Apple marketing or ATT marketing that was indirectly responsible for the previous disinformation?

Its not like..

[hilather]

Anyone took CNN seriously to begin with. Seriously though, I switched from an iPhone to an android phone and syncing my mobile device/information has never been easier. Android is an amazing OS, and its only going to get better (although I'm not quite sure how).

They give away cars on the Red Square.

[SharpFang]

Traditional news accuracy.

Is it true that they give away cars on the Red Square?
Yes, mostly. Just some small corrections: not on the Red Square but on the Arbat, not cars but bicycles, and not give away but steal.

Not yet robot

[borarslan]

After having both, i would say iPhone is much better. Androind has a way to go http://eksenim.mynet.com/borarslan

Symbian anyone?

[dsvilko]

"making it the third most popular platform behind iPhone and RIM's Blackberry"?
Wasn't Symbian still on top?

iphone is sad but true

[simonshannon10]

iphone all the way baby. as much as i love the prospect of open source software dominating the market, in this instance, as much as i would love to find reason to bring apple down its fairly apparant to anyone one with an once of sense that the iphone is (and will continue to be for a long time) miles ahead of the competition. Not that i don't think things will change in the long term. I remember the days not so long ago when Nokia dominated the mobile market with 3200 and 3300, bet their not smiling so much now

Re:iphone is sad but true

[Internal Modem]

"Miles ahead of the competition" by what metric? Processor speed? Multitasking? Growth? Availability on multiple carriers in the US?

Re:iphone is sad but true

[intheshelter]

Usability by the average consumer.

Loyalty versus simply liking the phone?

[noidentity]

Loyalty would be buying a newer model of the same phone even if it was terrible. Simply liking the phone would be buying the newer model if you liked the current one. Is this really about loyalty, or simply them liking the phone? I mean, almost everything I buy regularly I buy the same brand each time, but it's not because I'm loyal, I just like those products (and don't hesitate to switch brands if they screw a product up).

MOST Android Phones are Google Branded

[Internal Modem]

I have not seen an Android phone sold at Verizon that is not Google branded, this includes the HTC phones.

Guy from CNN Writes about Apple 80%

[LiveCrunch]

David Goldman who wrote that story, if you check his history of articles 80%+ are about iPhone, iPad or any other Apple products (Source: MWD so yeah this story was defiantly written by Apple Fan if you ask me.