Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Explains Windows Phone 7 'Phantom Data'
Fuzzy Eric writes "Microsoft has confirmed that some handsets running its Windows Phone 7 software are sending and receiving 'phantom data.' The problem surfaced in early January with some owners of phones running Windows Phone 7, claiming that their phone was sending 'between 30 and 50MB of data' every day; an amount that would eat into a 1GB allowance in 20 days. Microsoft said its investigation found that most problems were caused by a unnamed 'third party' service. It said that the problem seemed to only affect 'a small (low single-digit) percentage of Windows Phone customers.'"
No wonder that this third-party service remains unnamed. After all NSA stands for 'no such agency'.
1. No Answer
or
2. We found the problem. It wasn't our fault, and it doesn't matter because it's not happening to anyone. (lie)
.sigs are for post^Hers.
I have a 500MB plan, and it works for me. I'm cheap. Of course, I don't have a Windows phone.
Goodbye Slashdot. You've changed.
That can't be true. There are more than two reports.
Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
So is there going to be compensation for users scorched by this bug/feature? Class action suit anyone?
If it was the FBI or CIA or NSA I would still mind, but it wouldn't be THAT huge a deal, mainly because:
A. They will track me anyway if they have any reason to.
B. They aint got shit on me.
C. The chances of them actually bugging me are about .001%
I'm more worried about it being someone who is going to try to sell me shit. Because the likelihood of them actually bugging me is almost 100%.
(who we swear is not the FBI)
I suspect that acronym is too long by one letter.
Damn... I would ask you to take a picture and send it to me for proof, but I don't want you to go over your limit.
It doesn't matter. Someone at Microsoft ok'd that third party software without due diligence. It's their baby. Denying it just makes them look unprofessional. But we already knew that.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I'm on a 1Gb/month plan (Nexus One), but between Wi-Fi and not streaming video 24/7 I've only pulled 2.5Gb of Cell data in the last 9 months.
Well, in my country, 1Gb is almost the biggest dataplan any phone company offers, and it costs me 45$ per month . I could have an "unlimited" data plan for 150$ per month, but this price is simply outrageous. And no, I don't live in the tird world, in central Europe actually. Switzerland, where not everyone is a rich banker that promote tax evasion...
So, Microsoft saying "it wasn't us, it was them" counts as an explanation?
I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar.
Can it still be considered 3rd party if the company that generated the "phantom data" was contracted by either the carrier or Microsoft to develop the app to intentionally run up the quota, hopefully going unnoticed and generating overage charges? My ex-bank, 5th3rd has a class-action lawsuit against them for doing something similar.
Loading...
Apparently* it's an external problem and there will be "no need for a system software update.".
Makes you wonder about who can do what with your Windows Phone 7...
*As I noted in my submission. Which was earlier. WTF editors!?
My UID is prime. Hah!
They need a utility built-in to the phone that logs which processes/programs are sending how much data over which connection. None of this "unnamed third-party program" bullshit.
I would be happy to show you, but my account cuts me off automatically when I hit my download li---
Goodbye Slashdot. You've changed.
That would be the majority of users, because they're in wifi range 99% of the time, and actually only need 3G for the random snippits of data at random times.
Are we sure it's not just the phone calling home (Microsoft) to confirm it's a "Genuine Copy"?
So it was a 3rd party application which they do not name. Perhaps they could at least explain what kind of data were being sent... oh wait..
I will put money on it not being anything like that interesting.
It'll probably turn out to be either a crucial app vendor or a launch partner that they don't want to annoy - e.g. if it turned out that one of the HTC apps or the Facebook app was doing it. Until they know for sure, and work out how to fix it they probably want to be a little coy about what's causing it.
Anyway, it's not affecting that many users as far as I can tell. I've got an HTC Mozart for work that's not doing it, after checking my data usage.
Actually, in my experience cell phones are much cheaper in the 3rd world. For 30 bucks in most of Africa you can get a cell phone and more minutes than you could ever use. I'm not sure about smart-phones over there, but the basic cell phone service is astoundingly cheap.
We in the "1st" world are being cheated by carriers.
There have been a few times that I have considered switching my iPhone to the 200 MB/month plan, honestly. Since getting my iPhone in Sept 09, I haven't used more than 140 MB in a single month. Mostly because where I live and work and play are all saturated with WiFi, and there isn't 3G where I live, just where I work. But, as I got in on the unlimited data plan before they removed that, I've been hesitant to abandon that gravy boat, in case 3G becomes more readily available, or I find an app I can't live without. (Also, it becomes less important to switch as I get closer and closer to switching to Verizon.)
http://www.telstra.com.au/mobile/plans/nextg-cap-plans.cfm
Note the fun "25c per MB" part when your (or your "smart" phone) is done with the 1 or 2 GB per month.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
So no one here has a Windows phone 7?
Probably pretty easy to monitor what's flowing through your home router if you're on wi-fi.
Is this a problem with all phone's or just if people installed some nefarious app?
1GB is considered a lot by most phone companies on a cellular plan. Most of UK networks are downgrading their "unlimited" to mean "500MB/month" right now - see the recent furore about t-mobile.
Yahoo mail app being reported other places. Figures
I don't understand how that is being decent? An application is causing excess data to be used without the customer's permission and it's good of Microsoft not to name names?
http://transformativeworks.org/
It costs me $30/mo for unlimited data.
Support my political activism on Patreon.
In Great Britain, T-Mobile has only a 500MB data plan for new customers (originally *all* customers, but the backlash was too great). They have an ad campaign now saying "don't view video or download files, save that for your computer at home".
According to ars, Yahoo mail might be the one to blame.
"All very peculiar. The main culprit fingered by the Windows Phone 7 community over this issue (though not named in the statement) is Yahoo! Mail."
I'm glad y'all RTFA and saw where it said
"We are in contact with the third party to assist them in making the necessary fixes," a spokesperson said. The firm also said that it was looking into "potential workarounds" until the issue was solved.
fwiw, there's evidence that one potential culprit was a yahoo mail client
I'm not saying the phantom data isn't bad, I think every kind of phantom is bad, but who on earth gets a smart-phone and signs up for the 1GB a month plan? Do they even have those?
Ok, based on responses to this I guess I'll make a different point: Apparently I'm the only one who uses tethering while traveling.
Right - the risk of getting bugged by FBI is usually lower than the risk of getting your identity stolen and abused.
At least that applies to most of us.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
An "unnamed third party service" is an explanation? As much as "a dog ate my homework".
A and B may be true, but C is quite the opposite. You can be 99,999% sure your mobile Internet traffic also gets routed goes trough one of the NarusInsight boxes. These things are produced for mass-surveillance with a reported capacity of 10Gbit of traffic per unit... Since mobile networks can potentially be a goldmine for 'anti-terrorist' monitoring you can be sure they hooked a fiber from each large network node to a room filled with these babies. The problem is that the chance of C is much higher than most people think, the chances of B and A happening are fairly large once you communicate anything remotely interesting to one of the agencies.
So Microsoft won't tell their users who have problems WHICH software is offending here? Seriously? I'm sure their affected WP7 users just love being denied that information while paying AT&T the bills for their nightly "activities" due to a "third party service". At least they'd be able to turn it off while waiting for a fix if they knew which software caused the problems.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Look, I own a Windows phone (not 7 it's 6.1 then flashed it to 6.5) . I hate Windows for many reasons. I think it's slow (granted, the hardware is not top of the line), it's cumbersome, and there are next to no apps for it.
But the claim that a windows phone has to be rebooted every other day or that one gets BSODs on a windows phone -- that's pure crap. The phone is not rock solid, but it easily runs for months on end with no problem. The few times i've actually had to reboot my windows phone was either because i was flashing an updated ROM or because I was trying to see if the signal issues were caused by the OS (they weren't).
So given that winmo 6.5 is decently stable, why would you FUD about phone 7?
For me the biggest issues with windows mobile 6.5 are: slow startup, slow GUI, poor app market. Each of these is a huge minus for winmo compared to the competition. But I would not complain about the phone's stability.
....such as the fact that I don't want a phone that blue screens and/or needs to be rebooted twice a day.....
Sounds like my co-workers Moto Droid 2.
No man is an island, But if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie them together, they make a pretty good raft.
Yep, 9.999999999% with +/- 500% tolerance.
I have a friend who is on the lowest level plan that AT&T offers for the iPhone, and was able to afford one when the plans switched from unlimited only to a tiered system. She really doesn't need unlimited data, since the bulk of her data use is done via wifi with 3G/Edge for those handy times when she needs it. I say "can now afford" not in that "children going hungry" sense, but that her budget was reasonable for a new phone, but with her usage patterns the cost of an unlimited/huge plan would have been a waste.
Not every customer needs an unlimited/giant plan.
I may just be too uncool, but I honestly don't do or say anything that would be worth the time of law enforcement.
I'm not saying its ok to just track everything everyone says, that would be a horrible practice, I'm just saying I'm close to the bottom of the list.
We're just used to that old and lame excuse that 'Everything is more expensive in Switzerland *shrug*'... But frankly, that 1 GB limit is plain stupid. Especially when you consider that these plans aren't even primarily targeted at mobile devices like phones but mobile devices like laptops and netbooks and there, one GB is just a lame joke.
Who does Microsoft care more about? Users or Developers and Partners? Their actions speak louder than words. They are reluctant to tell people the truth so that they can protect themselves or conserve their resources in favor of protecting developers and partners. In the world of Microsoft (and indeed Apple and most other commercial software vendors) the users are to be taken for granted and abuse of users, their information, their computers and their resources are all the norm.
I realize this is more preaching to the choir for most people here and/or this is "stating the obvious" but I think it's sometimes useful to remind people and users of where the priorities and motivations of the vendors they use and rely on are. By knowing their priorities and motivations, you can keep yourself appropriately aware and even guarded. For example, we have a LOT og Google fans here. In the eyes of some, Google does no evil and can do no wrong. They are an advertiser and a marketer and maintain all of the priorities and motivations of advertisers and marketers. It is important to keep Google in perspective. Google is just one example. Microsoft's main strategy is to keep their markets saturated with Microsoft products and services. This is accomplished through strategic partnerships and arrangements with OEMs and resellers among others. This means they place their priorities in favor of those channels; partners, OEMs, developers and all. If Microsoft's primary channel was retail and online sales, their priority would then be focused on the people who buy their products and services directly. But this is, for the most part, not the case.
For this reason ("Who does Microsoft care about?") I generally avoid Microsoft. It is not because they are buggy or insecure or "evil." It is the fact that as a user or customer, they are not interested in my needs or interests. That's a simple fact.
I think he meant "bugging" in the sense of "annoying," not "wiretapping." His point, I think was that he doesn't really care if the FBI is wiretapping him because they almost certainly will never bother him or waste his time, but advertisers almost certainly will.
If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.
I'd reply, but he won't be able to read it until next month.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
I'm not saying the phantom data isn't bad, I think every kind of phantom is bad
The Ghost who Walks would be extremely unhappy to hear you say this.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
Well for 30 bucks in Africa you can feed for one month.
I think he meant "bugging" in the sense of "annoying," not "wiretapping." His point, I think was that he doesn't really care if the FBI is wiretapping him because they almost certainly will never bother him or waste his time, but advertisers almost certainly will.
Ahh, I didn't think that wording out. Thank you.
I should add though that I do indeed care, I'm just not panicking about it. If the FBI follows me for a month it will be a unnecessary invasion of my privacy and I will be upset, but I won't be outright panicking is because at the end of that month the FBI will be bored out of their minds and move on to someone worth following.
When you're with AT&T you have the choice between 300MB and 1GB. A lot of providers won't allow you to eat up more than 2GB before hitting some type of FUP.
Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
Yes you are, as there are far more economically viable data contracts utilising 3G data dongles. If you have your laptop with you anyway, why are you using a phone for data? Don't give me "It's one less thing to carry"; If you are using a device which requires tethering for data, it almost certainly has a USB port.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
Yes you are, as there are far more economically viable data contracts utilising 3G data dongles. If you have your laptop with you anyway, why are you using a phone for data? Don't give me "It's one less thing to carry"; If you are using a device which requires tethering for data, it almost certainly has a USB port.
Because I have a phone that does tethering with unlimited data already, and over the last month I drove all around Montana, Idaho, Wyoming, Utah, Nevada, and Arizona, and out in those big western states there is a lot of land where the only available internet is 3G(which, surprisingly, is almost everywhere out there).
The performance is fine for what I'm doing, I already have the contract, I already have the phone, its easy, and what more reason do you need?
I'm not saying the phantom data isn't bad, I think every kind of phantom is bad
The Ghost who Walks would be extremely unhappy to hear you say this.
I can't believe this is the first post to get my main point.
And the Ghost who walks should go back to where he came from and stop taking our jobs and our women! Damn clear-skins.
2GB is now the standard (and I think LARGEST) plan you can get on AT&T.
1GB seems odd - think AT&T's were 250M and 2GB last I checked.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
I'm not saying the phantom data isn't bad, I think every kind of phantom is bad, but who on earth gets a smart-phone and signs up for the 1GB a month plan? Do they even have those?
Ok, based on responses to this I guess I'll make a different point: Apparently I'm the only one who uses tethering while traveling.
Tethering would make quite a difference, I imagine. As someone who hasn't traveled since I got my smartphone, I have no experience with it.
Mainly, I use my phone with wi-fi whenever possible, and consequently my 100MB data add-on is more than enough for me.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
I agree here. Early versions of WinCE were awful. Same with trying to actually shove Windows into a phone.
But later revisions of Windows Mobile, along with Windows Phone 7, have no real connection to Windows other than riding the marketing coattails of Windows.
I've been using Windows Mobile since WM5 (original AT&T Tilt) and it is actually a great operating system for power users. It was one of the better choices until Android matured (Android 2.x).
My next phone will be Android based, since Microsoft saw fit to utterly cripple WP7. It has a shiny UI but it is missing nearly all of the features, power, and flexibility that made me like WM5/6.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
If they refuse to tell anyone what this "Unnamed 3rd party service" is... then I think it's well within our rights to assume the worst. The FBI/CIA really aren't all that creative.
My suggestion? British Petroleum. They are tracking out movements to determine the best place to have the next oil slick. If no ones around, no one will notice.
any other suggestions? Once we decide on a winner we can go update Wikipedia with our "Facts" and start spreading it around the internet via forums and blog posts. Remember, if it's too ridiculous, no one will believe it... so try and keep your suggestions within reason.
Damn... I would ask you to take a picture and send it to me for proof, but I don't want you to go over your limit.
Too late. Today's the 20th.
!#@%*)anks for hanging up the phone, dear.
Not every customer needs an unlimited/giant plan.
That's very true, but the way the tiers work is really designed to screw the customer anyway. If they didn't want to do that, they'd bill you based on which tier your usage patterns fit into, rather than you adjusting your usage patterns to fit a specific tier.
I'm happily on AT&T's unlimited plan, and it works well for me: I've got some months where I pull 1 gig, and one where I've pulled as high as 6. Granted, it's mostly from video.
The real problem with the cost of a smartphone is that the baseline price for it is the same as for a dumb phone or a feature phone. With smartphones and their "required" data plans being the only offerings available with the features that the customers want these days---I can't tell you the number of people I know who couldn't care less that their Blackberry is uber-secure or receives emails for them; they bought the phone because it's great for texting (*cha-ching* goes the Verizon cash register)---people often find that getting what they want out of their next phone yields a mandatory upgrade in their monthly bill as well.
Boot Windows, Linux, and ESX over the network for free.
Why don't Microsoft tell users what 3rd party app is costing them money ?
Users should have a possibility of deleting or disabling the offending app. As it is now, Microsoft should get the bill for this data forwarded. They know about it and do not act. here in Denmark that is reason for court action, it is actively taking responsibility if you do not act in a timely manner.
Or maybe Microsoft is getting their percentage of the money for data transfer ? So it is money straight in their pocket.
Drop MS, go for the walled garden.
Either way, how come it doesn't ask for permission to transmit (and detail what gets transmitted), like most modern smartphones require? You know, that privacy thing everyone keeps harping on?
That alone would (well, should) make people leery before buying one.
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
Microsoft is just not a tattletale
I like how you said "they ain't got shit on me" rather than "I haven't done anything". ;-)
Cwm, fjord-bank glyphs vext quiz
So, you can have a phone you have to figure out how to hold before you make a call, a phone you have to make all your calls at the start of the month quickly before it drains all your allowance or the other one which does neither. Hmm...
Yeah ok, I think we're on the same page then... :)
I live in Brazil, and we pay here about $20 for unlimited data in a prepaid phone
Oh, well then, two gold stars for them!
http://transformativeworks.org/
I'm on an "unlimited" 500MB deal with Orange. I've yet to reach my limit because there is usually a wifi connection around.
Brain surgery - it's not rocket science!
I live in Germany and pay 10€ a month for unlimited data.
I think every kind of phantom is bad
You're clearly not an audio technician.
Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
It has a shiny UI but it is missing nearly all of the features, power, and flexibility that made me like WM5/6
Which is sad, but most consumer didn't want that in a phone. They wanted an iPhone, so MS attempted to give them what they wanted.
WP7 isn't terrible, still a good OS(love my HTC Surround), it'll be better if it wasn't trying to be like iOS.
If At&T is the primary service then Windows Live is a third party to that service. Since Microsoft did not name themselves as the culprit, they are in fact an Unnamed service. And of course why would Microsoft want to piss off their own their own management, or worse, to let potential buyers know what the real problem is?
Like a good /. reader I did not actually read TFA, but unless they are also disabling this unnamed app and thus keeping it from screwing over more customers, then I don't consider MS' behavior to be decent.
And I'll stop there.
http://transformativeworks.org/
Which telco?
English is not my first language. Corrections and suggestions are welcome.
A. They will track me anyway if they have any reason to.
B. They aint got shit on me.
If they keep tracking you, they will have pretty soon.
Sorry, there just wasn't enough room in the margins.
I'm just saying I'm close to the bottom of the list.
Very subtle.
Thanks for this. It made me smile.
I may just be too uncool, but I honestly don't do or say anything that would be worth the time of law enforcement.
I'm not saying its ok to just track everything everyone says, that would be a horrible practice, I'm just saying I'm close to the bottom of the list.
What you're not thinking about is what about when your favorite hobby x is deemed "double-plus ungood". This is the beginning of the slippery slope that none of us want to be involved in.
A. They already track you
B. They don't need shit on you
C. Because of A. and B. you are right.
And companies will bugger you no matter what. I have yet hear some marketing person say: Let's not contact these people as they are not in our target group. Instead they say: How can we rephrase it so it looks as if we targeting him personally.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
Smart phone owner here. No data plan, voice only. I have wifi at home and work. The GPS maps for the USA, Canada and Mexico are stored on the phone. Who on earth thinks everyone makes the sames decisions and has the same priorities? Who on earth thinks that some people might not want to follow the herd and strike out on their own instead?
And when I did have the data plan, my usage was approximately 150 MBs a month down and 60 MBs a month up.
...an amount that would eat into a 1GB allowance in 20 days
A strange expression - I would have thought even 1 byte would "eat into" any size allowance, technically speaking.
Next ads: "don't make calls, save that for your landline"
I'm going to preface this by saying that I don't really know a single person who has this phone, but phantom 3rd party data seems like is would be software installed by the carrier. MS just doesn't want to throw whoever the carrier is under the bus. When I got my Droid phone, there was a bunch of bloatware installed by Verizon. That's just my guess... it could be the NSA or the FBI or NASA for all I know.
> Microsoft said its investigation found that most problems were caused by a unnamed "third party" service ..
In other words, we're making this shit up !!!
Somebody without a stake in the answer needs to do the analysis.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
These are not the data bits you're looking for...
- Dan.
~ People that think they are better than anyone else for any reason are the cause of all the strife in the world.
I have an iPhone on AT&T. Currently I subscribe to the 2GB plan but the reality is that I use just over 200kb a month (just enough I can't get the cheapest plan).
I use the phone all the time for data, so how can I use so little? It's because most of the time I'm at home or work, both places with WiFi. In-between the largest data use is either browsing or network map loading from Waze, a free driving/gps applciation I leave on whenever I drive.
There are LOTS of people that would have plenty of room in a 500k plan.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It would be classic if it was downloading the same unchanged image. I have seen that type of error 100's of times throughout my career. In fact, when something had a memory leak, unnecessary image repainting is one of the first things look for.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
You could do that here to..
Ramen noodles: 15 cents * 3 a day = 45 cents * 30 days = $13.50
You would prob still be eating better.
You are entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts.
I have a smartphone without a data plan-- I just use it as an overpowered PDA.
You don't know that. If they where listening in*, you wouldn't know what they where hunting for.
You might say something perfectly innocent, but in the context of an investigation sound bad. Maybe you give to a charity that has ties to a terrorist organization so everyone who donated is under preliminary investigation.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Facebook was my first thought when reading the article. I made the mistake of installing facebook sync on my blackberry and it was totally crushing the phone. Available memory was at zero, any action resulted in at least 30 seconds of the "hour glass" icon, battery was only lasting about 12 hours, etc. I haven't checked my data usage lately since it is unlimited anyway but it won't surprise me if it is way up. Deleted the app and was still having problems because it wouldn't finish removing itself until I did a full reset by removing the battery.
Given that Windows XP is decently stable, why would you FUD about Vista?
I think the chances of being bugged by our gov are around 100%....with a little help from our mobile providers, ISPs, etc. The risk of those taps ever being examined (by a human - I imagine all are examined by machine) and used are near 0%.
My God can beat up your God. Just kidding...don't take offense. I know there's no God.
A lot of it depends on your carrier. Phone companies are well known for being dicks to their customers.
As an example; my girlfriend (on Verizon) wanted to renew her contract and get a new phone. I don't remember the exact model but she had the 'V2' and wanted to get the 'V3'.
Verizon wouldn't give her the V3, unless she purchased a data plan. The V3 was considered a smart phone (but it was crap by smart-phone standards). Even after several phone calls and eventually, cancelling her service; they still refused to let us upgrade to the V3 without modifying her contract to include a data plan. Even though she didn't want to use data.
I'm a cheap bastard, so I told her to cancel, and I moved her onto my Sprint plan. She would have just gotten the smallest data plan and said, 'Oh well, it's only another $8'
I've seen plenty of this in the past.
Test an app in a nice safe place (in-house, phone simulator, or whatever). Works great. Then it goes to production, and you find out that it does pesky things like take up too much bandwidth.
I've seen projects that worked great in-house, between the developers machines and the in-house testing servers. In production though, where the servers aren't in the next room, and the customer doesn't have a 100Mb/s line on a switched network, things just don't work the same way.
From seeing several botched smartphone implementations lately, it looks like little to no field testing is done any more. I'm surprised that they don't make a few hundred prototypes, and hand them out throughout the company, saying "use this instead of your own cell phone". It seems "field" testing is done in a lab. Then it's up to us consumers to find out that they work great as long as you're within a few feet of the tower, and have unlimited data plans.
I found my Blackberry (8330) worked great, except at one place I was working. Normally in the city, the phone always just worked, and the battery would last for days. Then I was working in the middle of BFE, where coverage was spotty at best. To talk on the phone, or even get text messages, I had to stand in one part of the parking lot. Since most of the drive, and anywhere in the building didn't have coverage, the battery would die about 6 hours into the day, with no phone calls or texts. I stopped working there, and voila, the battery was back to surviving for days at a time.
For those who don't know, cell phones generally turn up their transmit power, until they can reach a tower. Then they'll bring the transmit power back down to what is necessary. This normally saves your battery life, while ensuring coverage. If there's no coverage to be found, it wastes the battery life with the transmitter at max power until service can be found.
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
I wouldn't be terribly surprised if that was the case.
I know the Facebook app on Blackberry (not Windows Live) keeps the phone very busy. Both my girlfriend and I had Blackberry 8330's. She installed the Facebook app, and found the phone to be unresponsive at times (like about 3 times a week). I installed it on mine, and the same happened. Uninstalling it fixed the problem. Otherwise, we'd find the phones not working, and have to remove the battery to reboot it (the buttons were unresponsive).
Besides being unresponsive, it was horribly slow trying to do anything on the Internet (over the 3G network). Uninstalling the app fixed it. I know they synchronize profile pictures, so I'd suspect repeatedly downloading the profile pictures. If it worked properly, I wouldn't mind. I have no download quota through my provider. It doesn't do me a lot of good for my phone to lock up though.
I wouldn't think that the Win7 phone is much different than the Blackberry app, at least in general behavior.
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
You're supposed to be on medical leave!
microsoft explaining the meaning of explaining something....
But I would not complain about the phone's stability.
I would. It wasn't crashing every other day, but it did happen often enough. I used to joke that Windows is like an old man; once it goes to sleep, you never know if it will wake up. The WinMo phone had just a bit of that. Around once per month, I would look at the display and notice that it locked up about an hour ago.
You can get a blackberry without unlimited texting? That's crazy, I don't even have that option - and at the very least you'd surely get unlimited BBM... And if not, I guess carriers like that might be the reason RIM isn't very focused on the US market these days...
Mine's unlimited and I've gone over 1 gig many times. My co-worker uses his for internet acces for his laptop during his train journey and frequently uses 3+ gig a month. My deal is under £30 (£25 if I recall) a month so it's not even near being one of the more expensive packages.
and at the very least you'd surely get unlimited BBM
But you see, that's not a text message.
God forbid you send someone a blackberry message or an email. It might be free that way!
Boot Windows, Linux, and ESX over the network for free.
I'm on a 50 MB plan with an iPhone. Not in the US though, where they don't care (or are banned by law) from discriminating from the type of device, and instead just charge for usage. But then the data is used just to check email when out and expecting an important one and for maps. Everything else is done over WiFi. I have never hit the 50 MB cap, but that's still far cheaper than doing a no-plan per-kB default.
Learn to love Alaska
I have a 200MB plan and it suffices mostly because wherever I am prone to heavy internet usage I can get wifi.
how come it doesn't ask for permission to transmit (and detail what gets transmitted), like most modern smartphones require?
Maybe I'm not up on my modern smartphones, but that sounds like an annoying option that most people would turn off.
Which modern smartphone does that, just out of curiousity?
-- Bob Smith, Techint Section
Check with Stephen Friedman over at In-Q-Tel, or Steve Carbone over at QintQ, they're probably in on it....
Then there was that Phantom of the Jungle.
And now there's the Phantom of Data.
This is becoming way too complex.
TIM
The last day I used my winmo it crashed 10 times.
6 times while it booted.
It was in prime condition with standard firmware.
HP Ipaq 550.
Well, I don't know if my phone counts as "smart", but it can install apps and I don't have a data plan either. I have Wifi both in my house and university, and I bought an SD card with enough space to store anything I need anywhere else.
Dilbert RSS feed
The more I keep reading about phone plans on /. the more I'm convinced Austria is the only country in the world that has sensible mobile plans.
I'm paying 0.04 EUR a minute calling anywhere in Austria, 0.04 EUR per SMS and 4 EUR for each started gigabyte each month, with no base fee and an option to pay 8.80 EUR a month for 1000 minutes of talking and 1000 SMS - if I were to turn my phone off for a month I wouldn't be paying anything...
np: Slowdive - Miranda (Pygmalion (Disc 1))
"I'm not anti-anything, I'm anti-everything, it fits better." - Sole
My bet is the "Windows Live" service. Why? The one complaint I saw with anything significant to say was a person complaining that they had everything turned off *except* for their Facebook sync through 'Windows live'. My bet, chances are that the Sync is pulling over all the images and bitmaps along with the web updates, and not pulling over just the delta changes to them. Perhaps its a re-download service, not a true sync.
Nah it's not that, i've got a crapload of stuff syncing via windows live and don't have this issue.
If At&T is the primary service then Windows Live is a third party to that service.
I would say it's something to do with AT&T but likely MS don't want to just blame them and affect their relationship, rather fix the issue quietly and move on. But it would be nice to know what it was.
Given that Windows XP is decently stable, why would you FUD about Vista?
Because the Vista issues are Vista-specific, whereas many people are put off WP7 because of WinMo, but they are completely different operating systems.
WP7 has a completely different target audience. If you're nostalgic about WM, get Android - it's where all the hacking is.
Testing has always been seen as too expensive. Do a quick QA at the end and call it good. Part of the problem is embedded in the word "production". Software is not an industrial process making refrigerators or cars. It is a living breating thing which must adapt to a complex environment. OK, I should stop now before I begin ranting about lack of QA and incorrect software management practices.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
My rooted my touch 4g, running droidwall in white list mode also makes this basically non existent. Anything not approved gets no network access,i can also choose to limit just 3g, just wifi or both.
All of the above was encrypted with a Quad ROT-13 method. Unauthorized decryption is in violation of the DMCA.
She was probably referring to the LG enV2 (VX9100) and LG enV3 (VX9200). I use the enV2 with Verizon, and do not have a data plan, but would be required to get a data plan if I got a subsidized enV3 from Verizon. (I believe they don't offer enV2s anymore.)
For a second there, I thought you were serious. :) Then my sarcasm alert start ringing the "Deep Sarcasm" tone. I'd describe it, but it's in my head. Shhhh, don't mess with my insanities. :)
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
I agree. Personally, while it could just be a "we're too chicken to piss them off" megavendor with a bona fide mistake, the conspiracy theorist in me suggests the possibility that someone at the "third party vendor" multiplied the CPU speed of an always-on WP7 phone by the anticipated number of deployed units and a big, $-shaped lightbulb lit up over their heads. Back in 2000 or so, before "cloud computing" became the buzzword for such things, some p2p clients were being distributed with spyware that would allow your idle CPU cycles, bandwidth and disk space to be rented out to third parties unknown. (The 'b3dprojector' named in the subject was put out by a multimedia company to create an unwitting Bittorrent-like hosting network for swarm downloading.) I bet having something like this slip by all the way to shipping phones would be a huge kick in the nuts to WinFone7 sales if MS let word of it get out...
Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
I'm glad y'all RTFA and saw where it said
"We are in contact with the third party to assist them in making the necessary fixes," a spokesperson said.
The firm also said that it was looking into "potential workarounds" until the issue was solved.
fwiw, there's evidence that one potential culprit was a yahoo mail client
Funniest thing is, even if you pay to Yahoo, you won't get IMAP support including standard IDLE support.
So while you monkey with POP3 and very funny tricks (for 2011) like "leave messages on server", you will also notice the same idiots somehow gives a similar and non standard service FOR FREE to iPhone/iPad owners. What is worse is, it probably uses HTTP protocol which wasn't absolutely designed for such thing.
My bet is, Windows Phone 7 also comes with free IMAP IDLE-like but not IMAP support and somehow, while messing around with re-inventing the wheel, they did something wrong.
It is karma of paying customers who has to monkey with outdated POP3 protocol.
Just asking about MS's statement about small numbers.
Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada