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Michigan Police Could Search Cell Phones During Traffic Stops
SonicSpike writes "The Michigan State Police have a high-tech mobile forensics device that can be used to extract information from cell phones belonging to motorists stopped for minor traffic violations. The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Michigan last Wednesday demanded that state officials stop stonewalling freedom of information requests for information on the program. A US Department of Justice test of the CelleBrite UFED used by Michigan police found the device could grab all of the photos and videos off of an iPhone within one-and-a-half minutes. The device works with 3000 different phone models and can even defeat password protections. 'Complete extraction of existing, hidden, and deleted phone data, including call history, text messages, contacts, images, and geotags,' a CelleBrite brochure explains regarding the device's capabilities." Popular Mechanics has a short conversation with a 4th Amendment lawyer about the practice of slurping cellphone data, too, though it's unclear if the Michigan police are actually using these devices to their full potential.
But, speaking from experience, you can claim illegal search and seizure at preliminary trials, which can result in the charges being dropped.
It's disgusting that it happens, but it does. Just, rest assured, cops rarely get away with it if you have a decent lawyer.
ACLU learned that the police had acquired the cell phone scanning devices and in August 2008 filed an official request for records on the program, including logs of how the devices were used. The state police responded by saying they would provide the information only in return for a payment of $544,680.
emphasis mine. ACLU put in a FOIA, police wanted $544,680 to respond.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? No one, when the pay-to-play is that high...
Once I saw this was wired (obviously), I started to wonder about the practicality of this (ignoring all the rights issues). I mean fairly common phones are one thing. But for those of us who buy the cheaper phones...usually they use fairly obscure power/data jacks (so they can charge us an arm and a leg for power cables when they break or get lost). It'd be quite annoying to carry about a few hundred different cables...
Ginga no Rekshiya Mata Each page.
According to http://support.apple.com/kb/ht2110, you want to own an iPhone 3GS or later.
You can remove all settings and information from your iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch using "Erase All Content and Settings" in Settings > General > Reset.
When you opt to "Erase All Content and Settings," the process can take up to several hours. The time this process takes will vary by device:
Devices that support hardware encryption: Erases user settings and information by removing the encryption key to the data. This process takes just a few minutes.
Devices that overwrite memory: Overwrites user settings and information, writing a series of ones to the data partition. This process can take several hours, depending on the storage capacity of your iPhone or iPod touch. During this time, the device displays the Apple logo and a progress bar.
Nothing for 6-digit uids?
I bet they thought they were citizens of the United States, guess they was wrong, the police are busy schooling them pretty good.
"Sorry officer, I don't have a cellphone"
Do any of the smart phones offer full phone encryption, or would this device bypass that?
...then use the DMCA. Instant justice.
Society use your Sciences
Use of such a device on motorists would be a clear 4th amendment violation. Courts have ruled that police can only search for items that would relate/be evidence to the crime committed There is little chance your phone data is relavent to an illegal lane change.
I am currently rigging a phone that has an unusually high power output on the incorrect USB contacts. I will keep it in my car. Is it my fault their little toy let the smoke out?
Don't get stopped by the police in Michigan. If that's not possible, phone out of view. They may be trying to skirt around the 4th Amendment by slurping the phone data, but they can't search your car (for your phone) with PC or a warrant. And I'm sorry, but "most people have a cellphone so I'm going to find yours" is not PC for a search.
"You're awefully cute, but unfortunately for you, you're made of meat."
Check out the specs on these things:
http://www.cellebrite.com/forensic-products.html
"Complete extraction of existing, hidden, and deleted phone data, including call history, text messages, contacts, images, and geotags" and the list just goes on and on.
So, can anyone buy one of these? If it's legal for police, then...
Can it get past the AES128 full device boot encryption on my Nokia E71? The phone won't boot until you put the password in and both the memory card and internal memory are fully encrypted.
http://discussions.europe.nokia.com/t5/Eseries-and-Communicators/E71-E66-Encryption-specifications/td-p/371392
I'm sure some smart folks will come up with a nice app that provides backup and an easily triggerable secure wipe. Sure, you'll need to do the backups regularly, but if you'd prefer the cops keep their mitts off your stuff, the inconvienence will be more than worth it.
I'm curious, though, what the policy will be if you refuse to provide your cell phone to them. Presumably, they'll need a warrant to take it out of your car if their only motivation is the refusal itself. It doesn't sound like you'll be required to hand over your phone on demand.
If they use it as a matter of course, just turn your phone off (or better, pull the battery) if you get stopped. No power = no transmitting. If it's something more like a K-9 unit where they bring it in as an additional search measure, you're pretty much stuck. They'll just make you power up and turn on your phone. If they're using it passively at intersections, that's an utter outrage.
That's nice and all...
But at what point are all these spineless citizens going to stand up and say 'enough of this shit!'
You know what would be even nicer? To be able to go about my daily life without some jackboot thinking he has any right whatsoever so look at any of my belongings on the spot.
In fact, here is a deal for the 'police'. Immediately allow full and public access to ANY of your dash cams, at any moment, by request. You are supposed to be serving the public, so it would be nice of us to be able to know that you are competently performing your job, and not just taking your word for it. You know, 'trust but verify'. If you aren't doing anything wrong, you should have nothing to worry about. Right? That is what you are relying on in order to justify this intrusion into peoples personal lives, isn't it?
How can this be beneficial in a traffic stop? To see if they were using a cell phone while driving?
If it was handsfree, most places don't have laws against it. So even if they were using it, if it was hands free there is nothing against the law there. Unless the phone some how tell them if an earpiece was in use during a call.
If you have it in your pocket, can they ask you for it? What if it's locked in your trunk where there's no reasonable expectation that you could have held it in your hand to use it?
What lawful purpose does a complete data dump serve in a traffic stop? The only thing a traffic stop should cover is what they can see, hear, smell about your car and in your car when they walk up.
Besides, I would trust the information on your cell phone activity from the phone companies more than I would coming off your individual phone. It'll become common place to wipe the data off the phone in a simple sequence press if this becomes common.
Plus, just load up the phone with non-incriminating data but just make it revolting or insulting to cops to review it. It's not like the guy who pulled you over is going to sit and review all of your 8gb+ of data, or be expected to.
BTW, If this law is true, this law is insane. How can you read about it and not think "Jesus they don't even try to hide the corrupt process anymore."
> The device works with 3000 different phone models and can even defeat password protections
My mobile (a Nokia) runs GPG and the few things I care about the privacy of are encrypted. Do they have some amazing new technology that'll let them defeat AES256 in a few minutes that I should know about? If there's such a known weakness, better to know about it so I don't keep depending on something that's known to be broken.
Looking through the manual, the device can read data through bluetooth, cable, or SIM card. It also requires an app installed for smartphones other than Symbian and Blackberries. Those running CDMA phones with bluetooth off and a password lock activated should be safe(r) from this machine.
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
yes, but do they archive that data? what do they do with that data? would that data be later used against you in a different case?
ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
Americans wouldn't put up with this Soviet crap?
Neither of the articles are clear about this, but from the picture, I assume that the "snooping" device actually has to be physically connected with the phone via USB. I hacked my Nexus One to enable USB host mode, which effectively disables client mode. Any connected device won't be able to mount my SD card or onboard storage.
Is this device even real or could it be a fake like the expensive handheld detector where you inserted a polaroid? How about all the money the feds paid to the guy who claimed Al Queda was broadcasting hidden messages and only his software could decode it? Just saying'.
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
The title of the story says they ARE doing this. The body of the article gives NO evidence that they are doing it, just that they have a box with the capability to read a cell phone in a short period of time.
Yes, so what if the CAN do it? They should be able to do it when it is necessary and legal. If they find a dead body and a cellphone in the pocket, they should be able to get data from it as fast as possible. That means the device should be with the troopers, not locked up in the office where it would take time to get it where it is needed.
Nothing in this article even begins to show that they are doing it to random people on traffic stops. It's just pure hypothesis and nonsense. If the ACLU had evidence it is being used illegally, then they would be suing already. Someone would have been the subject of a search and someone would have reported it to them.
Should this be allowed to stand, traffic stops will become a new tool for police to conduct what would in any other context be considered illegal suspicionless searches. It's bad enough they can do this at the border for reasons unrelated to airline security, but now they want to get away with it anywhere in the country.
When citizens take freedom for granted it becomes way too easy for the government to take those freedoms away. It's also way too easy to forget the sacrifices of generations past and sit idly by as the government flushes people's freedom down the toilet.
"In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
This thing seems to read quite a few different filesystems and has lots of connectivity options. I supposed that could all be hacked up from scratch, and I didn't see any GPL'ed software on their website.
Who has access to one of these things to do a dump?
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
why don't they just make encryption standard on phones?
there is no way that device will beat good encryption, if it would, they would have something like that for computer encryption too.
Pixels please.
List of supported phones:
http://www.cellebrite.com/ufed-support-center/ufed-supported-phones.html
Looking at the phone data extraction tutorial, it doesn't seem to be anything fancy or use any secret backdoors or anything to get data. Requires putting the phone in data connection mode. I have my phone default to Charge Only when connected, and they can't make me unlock it for them. And since I'm on Verizon, there's no SIM. If they have access to the a SIM they can easily get whatever is stored on that, which is pretty much nothing on more complex phones. They can also clone the SIM id, which let's them unlock phones which use a SIM lock, which I assume is what they mean by "defeat password protections"
Anyway, this is a grave abuse of power. Unless I see a warrant, I'm not letting them touch my phone. I'm from Michigan and am quite bothered by this. I mean. Seriously. What the frak.
No, those "trouble makers" would be marked and "eliminated" as quickly as possible. Imagine the dispatcher decides to ... "accidentally" forget for a few minutes that you called for help when someone is invading your home, or the patrol car that has been dispatched decided to ... take the "scenic route" to your home while you're being robbed at gun point.
No, I don't have any faith in the legal system, from police up to the supreme court.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc
Officer: "May I search your car?"
You: "No, you may not."
Done.
You should NEVER, EVER, EVER allow an officer of the law, under any circumstances what-so-ever, to search your person, your belongings, or your car. Clearly this includes your mobile phone as well.
Could this not be defeated with encryption? Is there something out there for Android?
Every now and then, I get a fresh reminder of why I really hate police.
---- "Logoff! That cookie shit makes me nervous!" - A. Soprano
why don't they just make encryption standard on phones?
there is no way that device will beat good encryption, if it would, they would have something like that for computer encryption too.
Phones are different in that it's hard to enter complex passwords. A hand-held computer would make quick work of short passwords.
So if a cop takes your phone, what if you have corporate secrets on your phone, wheat if they were to misjack the machine into it and break it? I am wondering if this machine of theirs could void warranties..And wouldn't this be considered breaking encryption, which is same law against people who rip thier dvd's and get in trouble for it.
~~"Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~~Dennis Miller
Lock it in you glove box and tell them to get a warrent. Legal and probably effective.
Good luck with mine. I run my own custom OS, and I bet your little device doesn't work with it. One more reason I decided to start making as many devices i use myself.
let them prove I lied. "I don't recall saying that..."
Fuck the Michigan State Police. Michigan is a hole anyway, no idea why anyone but a redneck or militia member would want to live there.
They used an Apple iPhone as an example. They also say it works on 3000 other phones...
Physical access IS root access. This can be said for ANY system where physical control is compromised; not just fanboy products.
This was a weak attempt at making another apple bashing thread.
http://www.cellebrite.com/ufed-support-center/tutorials.html
Learn to use the UFED and find out if your phone is vulnerable to the various attacks used by this device...
Knowledge is the best defense, let's just hope they leave more doc's laying around related to the tech they use....
Where is MPAA on this? This is a clear violation of copyright on videos held by video creators. And police are doing it without as much as a warrant? I assume MPAA will demand that Michigan police come into compliance and be fined $150K per instance of violation. Michigan police is not immune from FEDERAL copyright statues after all. In fact, if the phones are password protected, the police are also in violation of DMCA.
Any guest worker system is indistinguishable from indentured servitude.
Because lying to the police can get you arrested, the better option is just not answer any questions other then your name, and handing over your drivers license/registration.
Anyone know what it uses for a data store? does it sanitize against SQL injection? any time you read from an unknown device you're taking on some risk. Hell, potentially this guy is a vector to attack the police systems when the data is reviewed...
Cell phones are a great tool for criminals to use in many circumstances. It sort of makes sense that government would need the ability to see what has transpired on a cell phone. This could go all the way upstream to finding terrorists and all the way down stream to people who take secret pics of others nude in a spa or dressing area. Maybe it is time for all of us to be a bit more open to the idea that others have very good reason to review the actions of us all just as we should have the ability to review their actions.
Most people probably feel that a device that would catch their teen drag racing in the family car is a great idea. Less people would be happy about a device that phones a cop if they are driving drunk. I wonder how many people would be in favor of a device that is 100% reliable in discovering adultery in a spouse. Yet people should expect absolutely no right to do wrong no matter what their feelings.
Cops pull over a guy for drunk driving.
They search his phone and find hundreds of pictures young girls both alive and deceased most of them mutilated. Turns out the guy is the biggest serial killer/pedophile history has known.
Guy walks free as the search is ruled illegal as there was no probable cause to believe the phone contained any relevant evidence relating to the drunk driving arrest.
Sloppy lazy police work has real consequences.
Wouldn't that alone be a crime?
---- Booth was a patriot ----
The reason is if someone knows how to deal with it, as he clearly does, and has shown a propensity for being someone who will push back, as he clearly has, then you are just inviting trouble doing that. They start pulling him over all the time and doing searches on trumped up pretexts, and they wind up on the wrong side of a federal civil rights lawsuit.
They probably know well enough to leave him alone.
However I'll give a bit of credit in that the police are clearly stonewalling the ACLU and why are they doing that if they've not been doing something they shouldn't with the devices?
The FOIA request is legit, they aren't even contesting that. They are just trying to set a price so high the ACLU will go away, a price much higher than it actually costs to process the request.
If there was nothing going on, if they were using these as they should (as in when there is reason to suspect someone is using their cellphone for illegal things) then I can't see why they wouldn't turn over the records for a reasonable fee. Dealing with FOIA requests is part of the job at a public agency.
That they are stonewalling says to me they've been misbehaving.
I'm wondering if the 'Minor Traffic Violations' in question are in fact stops for using the cell phone while driving, and the data gathered is simply to show that the phone was in use at that time.
That is, before the inevitable scope creep, but my guess that's the reason they aquired these devices.
Given the huge range of phones in existence and that it bypasses passwords, this device must have the active cooperation of your phone. The most likely source of such cooperation is from the cellphone provider. Given the number of secret laws, it's highly likely that there is a secret law requiring backdoor access to all cellphones sold in the USA, for the purpose of retrieving evidence (for terrorist cases, probably). I suggest that someone do a code audit of the android phones to find the backdoor code, and deal with it.
When do we get the open source version that goes thru bluetooth and gets info off everyone walking by? Since that's the logical progression and all...
Since they're enabling facism, that makes them a legetimate target for financiaul destruction under the democratic principles of our republic. Don't waste time going after the ones buying it, go after the ones makeing it. Make it to unprofitable or to riskey to make it, and they'll stop.
Police are human too, and that means they have all the fallacies of human, including vindictiveness.
ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
That has never stopped a cop before, and it certainly isn't going to start now. And yes, they're part of the government, so they don't particularly care what you think of them, or their fiscal policies.
Physical access is root access only if you are allowed enough time and tools. Sony made the PS3 pretty hard to root without the right key; why can't smartphones be 1% as hardened?
Not only is this illegal in other states (e.g. WA) but it's specifically illegal under International Treaties enjoined by the US with the EU and Canada (NAFTA, FTA) which specifically give citizens of those countries the data protection rights they have in their countries.
Information may want to be free, but if the Kinect tries to motion capture me, I've got a second amendment solution for it.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
In his rat-filled dungeon, behind a door with more locks than a major canal network, the Stallman of GNU lay back and grinned in the darkness.
'When the Going gets Weird, the Weird turn Pro.' - Hunter S. Thompson
Pulling the data is one thing, doing something with it is quite another.
Our friends at Berico wrote a nice little CELLEX kit for this.
Very scary business, this is.
Check the "tutorial"...chapter 6.
http://www.cellebrite.com/forensic-products/ufed-standard-kit/ufed-video-tutorial.html
IANAL, but I don't think it will be very long before some court says it's illegal.
Just this year there was a court case re-affirming that I could get pulled over for a traffic ticket, and as long as there isn't anything visibly illegal in the car, I could have a file folder sitting on the seat next to me and the police could not legally so much as touch it, much less search it, unless I consented.
Why should cell phones be any different?
Are we that bad of a society that cops need to have a right not only to search our vehicles for something as simple as a broken license plate light (anyone watch COPS?) but now our own personal devices? It seems anymore the "law" is hunting for violations of one thing or another. Anymore it appears to me that everyone is presumed guilty until proven innocent. Has the axis of our country flipped?
touchscreens however are unique as you can use designs as your password instead of having to enter characters.
yeah, it would be interesting to inject some code into the device to cause it to tell phones to send all data it gathers to some email/website.
I'm sure my employer would have something to say about my password protected Blackberry (with probable HIPAA implications, since I work for a Healthcare company) being searched like this.
Related book on why so many police officers take to planting evidence and forcing inaccurate confessions: ,,,"
"Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me): Why We Justify Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions, and Hurtful Acts"
http://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/0151010986
"Why do people refuse to admit mistakes - so deeply that they transform their own brains? They're not kidding themselves: they really believe what they have to believe to justify their original thought.
There are some pretty scary examples in this book. Psychologists who refuse to admit they'd bought into the false memory theories, causing enormous pain. Politicians. Authors. Doctors. Therapists. Alien abduction victims.
Most terrifying: The justice system operates this way. Once someone is accused of a crime - even under the most bizarre circumstances - the police believe he's guilty of something. Even when the DNA shows someone is innocent, or new evidence reveals the true perpetrator, they hesitate to let the accused person go free.
And progressively that can lead police officers down a route of progressive desensitization where they start planting evidence on more and more people until they plant evidence on anyone they have any suspicions about...
A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
...Encounters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqMjMPlXzdA echoes your advice.
A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
be able to pull data from a Blackberry, with the encryption turned on, and set to encrypt device memory, SD card, contacts and media files? And I don't just mean a password - the whole encryption shebang turned on (which it isn't by default, or at least wasn't on mine) I don't know what type of encryption the BB uses, but assuming that its a) something decent and b) no backdoors, wouldn't it severely limit what could be extracted? Maybe SIM card contents, but nothing from the device itself
The information on the phone alone is worth its weight in gold even if the police can't officially 'keep' it.
The information on the phones could be very useful if you *cough cough* happen to pull over someone with a criminal background. Let's say there's some dealer you've been after. You pull him over. Hey, this is a 55 and you were going 56 maybe 65 or I don't really care you're getting pulled over. No charges or pressed but you don't care. You just want the damn phone. Now you have it.
Now a detective or narc would now have a list of that dealer's network. Probably some clients calling him. And a whole miscellany of information that would be invaluable to a detective. Wether or not you believe police don't 'randomly' pull over people, this is all the motivator to do it.
They probably don't care if they can legally keep the information. Or even care to use the information to build up a case. The information on that phone alone can open up a whole dragnet I won't even begin to write about. Keeping a digital copy of the info is probably not legal. But if a detective comes upon the information before they are notified they had to get rid of it and makes "mental notes" its going to be awfully hard to cook up a case proving the officer had or had not seen illegally obtained information.
Obviously the wholesale downloading of phone's drives will cause millions if not billions of dollars of damage to our suffering music industry due to this flagrant violation of copyright. The RIAA will surely solve this issue for us!
42 USC 1983 authorizes suits for deprivation of civil rights. Johnnie Cochran made a fortune doing it. Of course, police have qualified immunity from suit, so you sue the city., i.e., taxpayers, for police misconduct.
But you can't criminally prosecute police for every little misstep. Nobody would want to be a cop.
Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
Do you get imprisoned for making mistakes at work? This would be a great way to ensure you had no cops, or cops that don't do anything for fear of prison! Should the Miranda officers have gone to prison for following the law at the time, only to have new law created out of the ether?
Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
This must be happening with cooperation of the phone manufacturers, if the device is able to work with over 3000 models of phones and defeat password protection. Which phones aren't easily scanable?
Whisper Systems offers a few applications for Android phones to mitigate the risk of this attack. TextSecure hooks and intercepts SMS and MMS messages, storing them locally encrypted (and offering transport-layer protection based on the OTR protocol to another Android handset using TextSecure), Red Phone to make end-to-end encrypted VoIP calls from one Android handset to another running the application, and WhisperCore to perform full system encryption for phones that support that feature.
They're effective enough their author Moxie Marlinspike is harassed and his equipment seized every time he crosses the U.S. border, so I'd expect it's enough to keep "overly motivated" Michigan State Police out of the phone as well.
Stop making up law. Nobody would ever be a cop if they had pay lawsuits. Officers have qualified immunity from lawsuit (plaintiff must show bad faith) and most cities must pay their legal fees/judgments under the municipal codes. I worked for LA's city attorney, in their police lit unit, so I know of what I speak. 42 USC 1983 doesn't ban cities or unions for paying legal bills (it would probably be a 10th Amendment violation of it did).
Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
The fourth amendment does not apply in Michigan as 100% of the state is within the US constitution free zone. http://www.aclu.org/constitution-free-zone-map Thanks, G Dubya!
for a "minor traffic stop"? How is what is on your phone relevant to driving on the road?
It's getting to the point where we will have to give up using any communication technology since the gov. seems to think they have the right to snoop for no good reason at all.
What would happen when you consent to a search of your phone, and this extraction device comes across legally protected sensitive materials? Ignoring the restrictions associated with keeping such data on a humble cell phone, what happens when the device retrieves classified information, attorney-client privileged information or even HIPAA-protected patient records?
I can hear the sound of lawyers' heads exploding around the world.
I'm encouraged by all the privacy advocates here...but wonder how many people (correctly) denigrating this device, Michigan police, etc. will--in the next breath--trip over themselves to grant the State any other power it wants...say, "Net Neutrality" or pretty much any infringement on property rights.
The less data you have on your phone, the less a cop can get from it.
So use a cheap single-function phone for calls. Get a separate, non-phone device for all the other purposes (like an iPod touch, for example). When the cop asks for your phone, give him your phone, and keep your photos, apps, etc, to yourself.
Obviously the next APP that everyone will need....
What if you are a newspaper writer doing a big story on police corruption, and certain police want to find who is ratting so they can change some minds?
Of course, if they did it through official channels like a warrant, then that might come back to haunt them. But a broken taillight search is innocuous right? Anyone can get stopped for those. And who is to know who got to see the data before it got back to the station.
MPAA is a group of -paying- members.
What happens if you simply refuse to hand over your phone?
- bob99@utsolutions.net - not my real email, seeding a spam honeypot.
Use Apple as an example, expect the example to be used further in discussion. Common sense, Mr. AC, this isn't trolling, despite the morons without a clue modding me as such.
Despite it working for thousands of other devices, Apple touts security as a major part of its platform thing, with tools to help you stop thieves from getting your information.
This little thing makes every bit of that advertising moot, and once the device itself gets out into the wild (and it will,) Apple and other companies trying to play the security bullshit marketing are going to end up eating crow.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Did you even read my post? I said qualified immunity requires the plaintiff show bad faith. It's very rare that a court finds this, and holds an officer liable.
As for the second part, stop impersonating a lawyer. You really don't know what the hell you are talking about. Nothing in that section precludes a state or city from indemnifying a police officer (stop saying "department," cities pay lawsuits, not departments), and California law requires the city defend the police officer, and most local codes require the city to do so as well. And the city even has the discretion to pay punitive damages where bad faith has been found, and this authority has been upheld by the 9th Circuit.
Again, lawyer impersonator, I've worked both sides of the bar in police civil rights cases. Your comments about LA are silly. The LA Muni Code requires the city pay damages of police officers, as do most cities, and this has been tested by federal courts, even in punitive damages (bad faith) cases.
Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
If you refused to let the government regulate corporations, your power bill in a four bedroom house would be $500 a month, your water bill would be $200 a month, your garbage would be $100 a month, and your taxes would go WAAAAAAAAAY up when the contractors who maintain your roads charge the government even more ludicrous sums of money than they already do.
Corporations and government should keep each other in check, not collude against little people like you and me.
If you get pulled over turn your ringer off and toss it under the seat. If the cop asks for it say you lost it recently.
Mod me down with all of your hatred, and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
When you order a phone, you generally have some idea what you're going to wish it had in a year or two. With the Treo 180 it was storage. With the Treo 650 it was wifi. With the N900 it was processing power and RAM. But I got that last one wrong. It was actually full-disk encryption and "play dead" mode.
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
What if I take the MiniSD card out of the phone first?
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
I'm sure your employer would have something to say about your storing HIPAA protected information on your cell phone, yes. And that something might just happen to be Donald Trump's well-known catch phrase, "You're fired!"
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
They used to say "Cops always have the best drugs". Now they say "Cops always have the best porn". I'm sure this won't be used to build up anybody's private collections...
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
The idea they can reasonably "slurp" up 16+gb at a traffic is silly - its going to take you at least 30 minutes to copy my phone!
(2x16gb cards and the usb port isn't very quick)
aside: If they archive it - who pays the music producers for the extra copy? (if its in police possession, but not part of an active investigation, then it would seem someone needs to account for the copyright fees) More - those photographs are my copyright - if they archive but don't arrest, I think I'd be the one going for statutory damages for each photograph copied.
I think the "couple of minutes to copy a phone" stopped back when phones only had 128mb or so.
I can't think of anyone with less than 8gb (thank apple iphones & cheap memory cards for that)
Yeah - hope the copy machine has a whole lot of forensicly secure storage! (see as they will have to image and checksum if they were hoping to ever use the results in court)
Chicken?
Every time someone suggests something radical, out comes cowards, saying: "too dangerous".
You're already in trouble, living in a shithole with asshats dedicated to make everybody's life miserable instead of serving the public.
A. They search you, being in a good mood, sorry for bothering you, and eager to go do something else.
B. They detain you while waiting for a search order to be rubber stamped by an uncaring judge, then search you while pissed off that you dared to challenge their authority.
Your choice.
very good information.i like it
Women Lingerie
If they have root on your phone, what's to stop them from leaving something behind, too?
So where can I find an app for this?
It needs to protect my phone from being abused by thieves & in this case the police -- and preferably screams in some kind of high piched funny voice "You TICKLE me!" when they connect a cable to it.
We should always say no. And when they say that, "everyone that is innocent doesn't say no". Say NO anyways. They are lying, cus we are innocent till we are proven guilty.Exercising our natural born right that has been reaffirmed in the constitution is not an admission of guilt or wrong doing. Besides who wants to be searched when your late for work. V for Victory
Pitch Forks: check Torches: check Angry People: check - A. LaChasse V for Victory
I would love to be able to copy all of my photos and videos off of my smartphone in only 90 seconds!
The new device may be motivated by wanting to be able to tell if a person was just using the phone. Not sure if using a cell while driving is illegal in Michigan yet, I should know I live in Michigan
Scary, but ineffective. Real criminals will just carry two cellphones, handing the clean one to the filth and staying mum about the one that's not a decoy.
If you have a Nexus phone, WhisperCore is probably worth investigating:
http://www.whispersys.com/whispercore.html
I read the headline as "Michigan Police could SELL cell phones during traffic stops" but then, I'm not quite awake yet.
Just the washing instructions on life's rich tapestry
any DHS law enforcement-- not just customs.
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
the worse the abuse can become, to the point if they want you dead, dead you shall be.
The device will not work with encrypted blackberries and iphones, it only spits out the password on other phones that use a trivial numeric password and not real encryption. If you try to pull any data off the device the device asks you to put in your password (for bb and iphone). Regular phones it will bypass the password. Also, retrieving texts is very poor on cmda based phones unless bb or iphone as there is no standard for storage. however if you have a bb or iphone without a password you are screwed. All GSM phones are basically fair game (unless encrypted).
Source: I have a ufed
Carry two.
No mention of the size of portability or cost of the device. It would help to understand the justification a little better. In any event, encryption is already coming to cellphones. One stores the encryption key in one's head. Can they siphon the keys from my brain?
Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
I wonder if I can sue them for restriction of movement?
But if you don't like it, don't carry a cell phone. I didn't bother to rtfa, but I'm sure there has to be probable cause for them to search your cell. Getting pulled over for doing 5 mph over the limit is not really enough for them to search your vehicle unless when they get closer they suspect something else. I am actually all for this. They should be able to use this. It could prove, the reason they were speeding was they were sending/reading a text and or talking on the phone, any of which at the wrong moment could get someone killed. I don't want my government poking around my life any more than the next citizen no matter how little I have to hide. Like anything in law enforcement it's a tool. And like any tool can be used properly and can be abused. History has shown that the latter will most likely occur more than the former.
I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
There is no Supreme Court Ruling made yet as it regards the phones.
There are two cases one from California that says that during a lawful arrest police can search a phone without a warrant
as it is an "item of the person." (People v Diaz) http://caselaw.findlaw.com/summary/opinion/ca-supreme-court/2011/01/03/253553.html, also in Curtis case they said, it is okay to search through phone. BUT in Ohio, that is right OHIO, they said
that you CANT just search info on the phone without a warrant
http://www.sconet.state.oh.us/PIO/summaries/2009/1215/081781.asp
So the courts are split on this matter. Simply put police officer during a lawful arrest
can search the vehicle without a warrant under the following conditions
1) for his safety and prevent destruction of evidence
2) Because it is reasonable to believe evidence of the crime for which one is arrest could be found there.
And the 2 one is a "catch all phrase."
Anyway -- I am representing the defendant in a mock case and I have to say California court it said it doesnt matter what is the nature of an object they can search it (citing Ross where they said it doesnt matter how big the container was). And still be legal during "incident to the arrest" because of the 2 rules - to do it without a warrant.
IANAL but have a paper due today on this.
Really courts must stop this kind of police state nonsense. "If you have nothing to hide" is the worst "meme" ever -- and without thinking it is so powerful as it appeals to a very basic concept that we are taught-- this is truly a "Manchurian Candidate" brainwashing that starts as kids -- and turned against us as adults.
Western State CoL for the win! :D
This may be a stupid question, but is it likely such a device would such a device work on a phone with no battery?
If the device delivers power, would there be a way to circumvent that?
I doubt the cop is doing it because he particularly wants to or is circumventing policy, likely ordered to do it as part of his job. So don't fire the messenger, fire the guy who wrote the message.
Just fill you phone with images of Goatse.
Have fun washing your eyeballs with bleach and trying to forget you fascist bastards!
When I read about things like this, the picture in my mind is simply jackbooted thugs trampling over the constitution.
WTF? Are government agencies trying to solve the energy crisis by harnessing the energy of our founding fathers spinning in their graves?
Sounds like the phone is probably provided by the employer, most likely for work emails...
that the mi state police could better spend their time persuading people not to leave the state
So, is anyone aware of any applications that would provide full device encryption for Android phones? Does such an application exist yet?
At what point do we begin to demand liberty or death, on the spot.
Someone needs to mod this post up. It's rare on /. (or anywhere else, for that matter) for someone to admit that they're wrong, especially after so many vitriolic responses.
... or if your carrier gives it to them
From the Cellbrite site
Cellebrite works exclusively with most major carriers worldwide including Verizon Wireless, AT&T, Sprint/Nextel, T-Mobile, Rogers Wireless - Canada, Orange France and Telstra Australia, as well as 140 others. This ensures that future devices are supported prior to retail launch.
So they work with vendors to gain access to intellectual property that is installed
in the phone. Some of which is not the property of the vendors that Cellbrite
states are involved. This seems like a pile of patent, copyright, trade secret and other
secret sauce poo to me. It may be illegal to turn the thing on in the US as it
is today. Because it runs WindowsCE does not give in free access to all
file system technology in the world which makes access to Android phones
interesting and anomalous including the secret sauce in new Windows phones.
To infinity and beyond the fuzzy cloud....
Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
AC is correct that it is a company phone, considering it said this right in the subject. (and quoting Donald Trump in a comment, seriously?)
Cellebrite UFED. This is the device that the Mich State Police are using. With a little reading from the vendors website says that for most phones there needs to be a physical connection to get the information. i-Phones and Androids are the exception. The claim is that there are security doors in Apple's and Google's OS's that allow someone to force a bluetooth connection to a device. It was published on the IT geek sites a few weeks ago that Google can force a restart/reset of your Android phone against your wishes so I would believe that Mich St Police have a hack that can read your Droid like an open book, against your wishes. I would also assume the same for Apple. Thankfully, bluetooth can be easily blocked. Windows Mobile and Crackberrys must be connected with a cable. With Windows you must set up a bluetooth partner to make a connection to the phone. You also have to put in a password to complete the connection. And who would have ever thought a Microsoft OS would be secure?
If you give the officer your phone willingly, they can do with it what they want. If they force a connection with your Droid or i-Phone that is not only illegal but it is unconsitutional. And this device can also read i-Pods, i-Pads, GPS (TomTom) and just about any other computer/tech device that has a USB port, IR, or Bluetooth. Should they have this? Not in their cars. In the crime lab in Lansing - yes as long as the phone is taken with a legally obtained and served warrant.
The Michigan State Police released an official statement about use of cell phone data extraction devices:
Official Statement: Use of Cell Phone Data Extraction Devices
Contact: Tiffany Brown, Public Affairs Section, (517) 241-0970
Agency: State Police
LANSING. Recent news coverage prompted by a press release issued by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) has brought speculation and caused inaccurate information to be reported about data extraction devices (DEDs) owned by the Michigan State Police (MSP).
To be clear, there have not been any allegations of wrongdoing by the MSP in the use of DEDs.
The MSP only uses the DEDs if a search warrant is obtained or if the person possessing the mobile device gives consent. The department*s internal directive is that the DEDs only be used by MSP specialty teams on criminal cases, such as crimes against children.
The DEDs are not being used to extract citizens' personal information during routine traffic stops.
The MSP does not possess DEDs that can extract data without the officer actually possessing the owner's mobile device. The DEDs utilized by the MSP cannot obtain information from mobile devices without the mobile device owner knowing.
Data extraction devices are commercially available and are routinely utilized by mobile communication device vendors nationwide to transmit data from one device to another when customers upgrade their mobile devices.
These DEDs have been adapted for law enforcement use due to the ever-increasing use of mobile communication devices by criminals to further their criminal activity and have become a powerful investigative tool used to obtain critical information from criminals.
Since 2008, the MSP has worked with the ACLU to narrow the focus, and thus reducing the cost, of its initial Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request. To date, the MSP has fulfilled at least one ACLU FOIA request on this issue and has several far-lower cost requests awaiting payment to begin processing. The MSP provides information in accordance with the Freedom of Information Act. As with any request, there may be a processing fee to search for, retrieve, review, examine, and separate exempt material, if any.
The implication by the ACLU that the MSP uses these devices "quietly to bypass Fourth Amendment protections against unreasonable searches" is untrue, and this divisive tactic unjustly harms police and community relations.
They have to have physical access to your phone.
or else!