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Promotion Or Job Change: Which Is the Best Way To Advance In IT?
I've had a couple of management consultants tell me that if you want to move into management, it's better to change jobs or change where you work within your current company than to stay where you are. What if you have to fire one of your old friends? Not cool. Or are you better off starting your management career surrounded by people who know and (hopefully) like you? Read the rest .
Frequently people who are promoted wind up doing both their new job and their old one. There are advantages too, like a lower learning curve, but this would be the big downside for me.
Promotion Or Job Change: Which Is the Best Way To Advance In IT? Posted by Roblimo on Wednesday April 20, @11:10AM Promotion Or Job Change: Which Is the Best Way To Advance In IT? Posted by Roblimo on Wednesday April 20, @11:07AM Does Roblimo have the same memory span as a goldfish?
The best weapon of a dictatorship is secrecy, but the best weapon of a democracy should be the weapon of openness.
I could have sworn I have seen this post before.
If you want to be in management and want to be liked then you are not suitable for the job.
Being a manager means spending more time dealing with politics and paperwork rather than technical issues and I know from experience it's a lot less fun so I don't understand why people crave management so much.
What is your goal? High salary?
Quickest ever dup on slashdot!
I want a list of atrocities done in your name - Recoil
Truly, job change has been the pivotal point in my career. Every time I change company (willingly) I get a promotion and a pay rise, only exception was when I delivered my resignation and my current company made me a generous counter-offer to keep me (I stayed). If I hadn't delivered my resignation I would still be doing the same thing for the same salary, few companies that I know promote inside people, most prefer to pick an outsider... :(
Here's the actual article.
I often see people leaving a company and then returning at a much higher level a few years later, something like "internal promotion" cannot beat the "go away and then come back" strategy.
Migx
No discussion necessary. This is just a poll, right?
Fastest. Dupe. Ever.
Gotta be a Slashdot achievement for that.
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
The questions you ask are about playing games. As an employee you should concentrate on doing the best job possible.
If you think the only way to get into management is by playing stupid games, then you shouldn't get into management. Sometimes its better not to play the game than to try to win.
Ugh, management. Paperwork and stress, and loss of creativity. It sucks when that is the only option for career advancement, when you really want a technical promotion path so you can do more with the skills and knowledge you actually have, rather than suddenly be expected to balance budgets and make reports!
Anyway if you are promoted to management ask for some training courses, and they should clear up professional boundary issues. I guess that if you are open and honest with the people you manage, and try not to become aloof, then things will be alright. If you want to protect your friends, then enact a 'last one in is first to go' policy (however ridiculous that is in reality). Be honest, how many coworkers have you stayed in contact with once they left the company? Is the term 'friends' correct, or are they actually colleagues with whom you might enjoy a beer or two after work sometimes?
Reading the article, this post looks like spam to promote their website if anything.
Beside this discussion comes back every couple of month on Slashdot. How did that get to top again :'(
... but I agree with the "go away" comment, if you've been in your current position for at least two years. Two years is long enough to have been given a development plan and had it successfully execute. Faced with the same problem (stuck at the same org level for ~5 years, and in fact technically pushed down the org chart due to ever-multiplying middle management layers), I changed job functions totally - engineering to marketing - which gave me an instant promotion, and allowed me to earn a second promotion six or seven months later, as a kind of "catchup".
One option might be to start up a new company. A lot of companies go to the wall because the people who run them are not clever enough to understand their products. Look at the companies that survive vs those that don't. It's simple to teach a clever person leadership, but a stupid appointee cannot make working tech – it's only a matter of time ...
The purpose of existence is to make money.
I've had a couple of management consultants tell me that if you want to move into management, it's better to change jobs
By "management consultants" I presume we're talking about recruitment agencies. They have a vested interest in getting people to move jobs and will frequently say anything to make their case. Not only do they earn a huge commission from placing a person with a new company, they then have prior knowledge of a vacancy at the old company and will try to fill that one, too.
It certainly used to be common, that the route to promotion was to change company. However, these days with so few places hiring and the loss of (in the civilised world, at least) job security when taking a position with a new company, the advantages may not be as great as they were - though still better than having to wait for someone in your existing company to die, before you can move one step up the ladder.
Although why a techie would want to move into management is a question worth asking. Generally management jobs pay better, but they carry greater risk. At least when you're producing stuff, or even just solving problems, you have an inherent value to your employer - they can see and count what you do. As a manager, your value is not directly quantifiable and in most cases imaginary. That makes the position much harder to justify and much easier to cut when times are tough. Management jobs are also harder to get at the interview stage, since there will be many candidates applying: none of which will have any quantifiable skills that would justify their employment. That makes the selection process a lottery (which could work in your favour, if you're not very good).
So, it's a high-risk/medum reward strategy. The "consultants" advising you have nothing to lose and a lot to gain by having you switch jobs. You could, possibly, go back to a technical job if the management career doesn't work out - although you'll probably find that the position you left will be filled by someone earning less than you did, so you'll probably take a drop in pay if you can scramble back in. It's not a career choice I'd make and most management positions are incredibly dull and unrewarding.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
come on
This is a quantum type of problem. The answer to the first story was Promotion, the answer to this one is Job Change
Subterfuge. It works every time. When I started in this industry nearly 33 years ago it was your attitude and your quality of work that determined your path of promotion and success. Nowadays the people I work with are more interested in Social Networking, gossip and "Diversity." It's not just in IT but all industries within white collar environments. The smart players keep their head down, know when to throw in a political jab and to document failures and whine about the mistakes of others. Don't sell it short but schmoozing pays too.
Don't get me wrong, I still consider myself successful, it's just now I work as a consultant and get to watch this go on all the time. It never ceases to amaze me when my clients promote some of the worst folks that I've ever seen and watch the ensuing anger and confusion it causes. You see if you want to get ahead in an organization you need to not create too many waves. That's for entrepreneurs and companies that want to be progressive. By and large, most organizations just want peace and quiet with the associated slow, I mean really slow, progress that it promotes.
If you're aggressive and talented, don't get into a large organization. You'll be frustrated and upset with the politics that go on and constantly in bewilderment at why Joe down the hall who hasn't produced anything in 4 years and who's last major project was a disaster is now a VP.
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
What's the difference between a shopping trolley and a consultant?
You can fit more food and wine into a consultant but at least a shopping trolley has a mind of it's own.
It totally depends on the company you're with. If they are being fair, they'll always being paying you what you're worth and keeping you happy.
If they aren't being fair, the only way to get paid what you're worth is to go ask another company for it. And if you really are worth that, you can probably get that job.
I recently switched companies for that reason. When they told me they were capping everyone's pay at 5% increases, and I knew I was woefully underpaid, I was a little upset. When they did it 2 years in a row, I was upset enough to ask for more. After a little runaround, they finally said 'We'll be fixing everyone's salaries sometimes this year. Can you hold on until then?'
I couldn't. I should never have let them take that money from me for 1 year, let alone 2.
I think it's worth noting that there are non-monetary things that can keep you at a company as well. The people were very nice, and the environment was awesome. The work was fun, interesting, and steady. I knew the whole system inside and out, and I was a trusted person to come to for advice from my peers and bosses both. In short, they did everything right except pay me properly.
tl;dr - Stick with a fair company. Leave and unfair one.
--if you want a job in management, try failing as a programmer or admin
--if you want to avoid firing (or laying off) people, don't go into management
--if you want to avoid winding up with a job jacking off elephants at the zoo, don't look for career advice on slashdot
In almost 20 years as a developer, I've noticed that the best means of obtaining a promotion and pay increase has been to change companies. This also seems constant between small companies and fortune 500 companies...
Logic is the beginning of reason, not the end of it.
Quit.
It's as simple as that.
Quit, after finding another job that is.
Promotion means shit if it doesn't produce more money. And in 20 years in the business my best raises came from the old FU to the previous employer to move on. Even the smallest job switch is still over twice the dollars of any 5 year period of "raises". Even when promotions come, or more likely some "redefined job description" BS that includes all the higher up's work (or more likely, the work of some fool that knows some higher up who's dead weight they finally couldn't tolerate anymore) but no change in status, power, or pay. 30%, 50% jumps in salary just DONT HAPPEN unless you are the CEO or similar. If you are still a tech in any way, there's little extra money room to go for.
So quit. Make sure you are always polishing your resume, and getting skills that can be written down and skip over the company specific complicated crap you can't take with you. (Hint: if you learn their proprietary and crappy system well, guess what you'll be doing for the rest of your stay there? Being invaluable at your job means no promotion. Be good but not in a way that keeps you down.)
I don't know about other companies, but where I work (major financial services firm) "advancement" only means increased workload and responsibility -- it is not reflected in your paycheck. If you change employers you can expect a pay raise anyway (~15%), and you can argue for a bigger bump still to match your new responsibilities.
Leave on good terms, and you can always hop back to your previous employer in a few years to advance (in responsibility *and* in pay) again.
Be seeing you.
scott
Are you a real tech head or just in it for a high paying career?
A tech focused individual should change jobs. They are almost certainly very poor managers and almost no companies offer promotions unless you go to management. It's a common misconception but their knowledge of technology does not make them a better manager.
A careerist should take promotions to management.
- I've got bad karma because I won't parrot everyone else's opinion
People recruiting for a job almost always think that the unknown person is better than the known, because they don't know the faults of the unknown person. You will always do better by moving due to human nature and bias.
Korma: Good
Gaping Wholes are the Paradigm Shifts that the submitter is wrestling with!
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
I know my manager makes probably 50% more that I do, but she's in meetings over half the time she's here, has boatloads of reports to file, etc. She's also salaried, (I'm hourly), so she often has to put in more than 40 hours. I hate meetings & paperwork, so I often tell her I'm glad I don't have her job, and she says I'm welcome to it any time I'd like.
If you're just looking for extra income, I'd strongly recommend checking into your local community college and seeing if they have any openings for adjuncts in technology courses. I teach a couple of computer courses and its easy money, and its also pretty fun.
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
I'm 33, and I've worked for a single large aerospace company since getting my undergrad degree 11 years ago. I started off as a desktop support guy making $42k, and then was bumped to $43k after a year, then to $45k after another year, then to $46k after another year. In late 2004 I was promoted to junior sysadmin and was bumped to $50k, and through yearly raises got that up to $55k by 2006, when I transferred formally from sysadmin to the enterprise architect side of the house. That got me a bump to $68k, which brought me up to the minimum salary level for that position, and then between 2006 and mid-2010 the pay rose to $74k through those yearly incremental raises.
In 2010 I was a senior architect, making decisions that directly affected the technology direction of a Fortune 50 company with $65B in revenue, making $74k a year. It was nice, of course, and the job was fun, but the compensation just hadn't scaled to the job. There were other benefits--outstanding and near-zero-cost insurance, stock, a functioning pension program, and as near a thing to stability as it's possible to get in an American job--but I wanted more money, so I left. Now I work as a presales engineer (that's "engineer," not real engineer) at one of the same vendors that used to sell to me, making $120k. I would have had to stay at the first job for another 20 years to hit the same level of salary. More, I left on excellent terms, and I wouldn't mind going back there some day.
This experience echoes that of my much-older peers at the aerospace job, where I was one of the only folks in the group less than 50 years old. All of them, without exception, had left at some point for between 1-5 years and then come back, bringing with them a large salary bump. Even in a company that gives you near-guaranteed 2-5% incremental raises, the only way to get a massive salary increase is by leaving.
Where am I? Since when is aspiring to management a slashdot thing?
I thought suits were to be distrusted and ridiculed?
If one is interested in making the change to management, especially in IT, first you have to identify the skills, experience, and qualifications within your company for similar management positions. If you meet these qualifications, by all means apply for positions, both within your company and outside of your company. During your reviews, let your superiors know that you are interested in making the transition to management and ask them what kind of route they took to get that position. Doing that allows you to subtly let them know of your desire to progress and it puts them at ease by having them talk about themselves.
Now, if you want to progress into a position outside of your company, you will need to make sure that you have identified management qualities that other companies look for and tailor your resume to those qualifications. One thing that you could that might help you out would be to simply open your own side business. This shows others that you know how to manage and run your own business (even if the business isn't IT related).
Progressing within a company, regardless of the size, can be a difficult thing. It is frequently said that it's not what you know, it's who you know or who you blow. So make sure that your friends at work are not the kind of people that are anywhere near being any kind of troublemaker or bad influence or on someone's shit list. That will keep from being promoted just as fast as you being a shithead.
"Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet." General James Mattis
The best thing any of you can do is to abandon IT. Outsourcing has destroyed this career path.
It's about being effective. If you can be effective and liked for that effectiveness, that's good. All-in-all, this makes managing people you do not know easier.
Also, even if you don't have to do your old job you can get pigeon holed at your place of employment. You can be the person known only as the "foo expert" and expected to solve their problems in that area. It's better to start fresh.
If you want to go down the management track I suggest you learn and develop soft skills, including negotiation skills. A project management and accounting class or two would also help.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Just barely do you job and get certifications only in the path YOU want to go. Then come promotion time you are the least valuable member of the team and hence can be promoted.
Move to a new company is the best way. Just leave on good terms as then you can return after a few years if you really want to.
From my experience I am best at what I do and have be officially recognized for my contributions to projects but that has the detrimental effect of type casting me. Come promotion time I have been told straight up that I am to valuable where I am and the risk is to high to move me and try to replace me. I typical then ask for a simple 25% raise. They follow up by saying it would hurt but they could replace me for finical reasons only and I should be happy that I I have a job and get paid for it. So I look for work out side the company in the direction I want my career to take. It is difficult because my current employer refuses to give me any opportunities in that direction.
If you are a hard worker and feel you really deserve the promotion (I mean really truly believe it and know it) then your only choice is to leave. It is obvious that YOUR career plans and what your employer's career plans differ. I know for myself the only way to get ahead is to leave a company I generally like and some of the best co-workers and friends I have ever had. But it about your life and what is best for you... not what is best for the company.
Sounds like an awful waste... But if you're completely burnt out on the technical side, I guess it's either management or recruiting --assuming you have the soft skills. My advice, in changing job functions or your entire public persona, is that you need to make a clean break. Coworkers at your current job will have difficulty not thinking of you in your old role and it may be difficult and alienating to go from comrade to boss. (I have seen some people pull this off by erecting an emotional wall overnight. We missed the old coworker and they didn't seem happy with the loss of their work friends.) Familiarity has a way of persisting the same behaviors; with new people and a new environment you have no habits or preconceptions to fight.
Ask me about my sig!
When you interview for a manager position at another company, one thing they will want to see is a proven track record of success in a management or supervisory position. You can point to your sysadmin abilities, your programming skills, your winning helpdesk personality, but none of that is relevant for a manager job. So start within your organization, with an eye to the future elsewhere (you know, just like any job).
Start by increasing your successes in your current technical position (engineer, network/sysadmin, helpdesk/customer service, whatever), and learn the necessary interpersonal skills required for management. Go above and beyond. Finish the projects you started. Don't goof off at the water cooler, and never let them catch you on Facebook on company time. Learn the names of the department heads, and find ways to meet them if you're stuck in a closet or server room in the basement. The best managers (and leaders) are people persons. You gotta get out and be one. Also, stop complaining about shit that goes on in your company and start solving problems. Meaning, when marketing asks for something stupid again, then ask to meet with whomever is asking (marketing director or her subordinate who's just trying to get a job done) and find out how to deliver what they're asking or offer an alternative that meets your IT criteria. Think win-win. Seriously.
If your company is so brain dead that no one gets any work done, there's no perceptible bustle of activity when you walk around the offices where the suits work, everyone is grumpy and hates their jobs, and you have no prospects of ever going anywhere at that company, then you need to get out quick. Find another tech job elsewhere so you can get some mental fresh air and learn something other than how to work for a loser company. If you can't get another job right away, then go to Toastmasters.org and find up the nearest Toastmasters club in your zip code. Start attending meetings and join. Toastmasters is the cheapest and most effective hands-on public speaking and leadership course you'll ever find, and it will do wonders for your attitude and confidence.
You will eventually be offered a "line manager" or supervisory position. This will likely be as a team lead, group manager, etc. You will probably NOT have the authority to fire your friends. Large companies have policies and procedures on how to fire people, and smaller companies won't give you that authority until you've proven yourself and climbed the ladder. Learning how to manage your (former) friends will be good experience anyway. If they are good people, or competent professionals, they will know where to draw the line between friendship and professional interaction. If they don't, you will have to learn where that line is and start enforcing it. If any of them are close friends, they'll still hang out with you on the weekends. If your friendship exists only to meet for a beer after work and gripe about marketing, senior management, the job, etc, then you should probably stop hanging out with them anyway. Complaining about work while drunk will affect your attitude and therefore your management career, whether you realize it or not.
Put in at least 6-12 months in your new supervisory position before considering interviewing elsewhere. Have at least a handful of documented successes (projects, initiatives, etc that were completed by the team you led (not by you working alone)) before you go looking for new management work. If you like your company, they should be ready to promote you within a year or two. If after two years they still don't have a ladder for you to climb, it's probably because they like having you in your current position and getting your job done.
If you ever want to advance beyond middle management, you should have a four year college degree. If you don't have one now, that can be a negotiating option when interviewing elsewhere. Some companies have tuition reimbursement or can arrange or it in lieu of top-notch salary.
There's your career path, loosely modeled after my own.
Posting anonymously because it's a potentially embarrassing story. :-)
A few years ago, I thought the same way you did -- I worked at a company where the only route to more money was formal people management. I'd been in a technical job for 5 years, gained responsibility progressively during that time, and wound up being the best technical resource in the department. So, when an opening for manager of the department came up, I volunteered for it and was promoted. I got a 15% raise, an office and all the management trappings. Sounds great, right?
Nope. It was miserable!
The first thing you need to know about management is that you will never do anything technical again. Your job instantly becomes (a) setting goals, (b) babysitting your underperformers, (c) endless meetings with other departments and your management trying to get things done for your people so they can do work so you look good, and of course (d) administrative paperwork (POs, expense reports, reviews, salary and HR stuff.) In addition, the relationship with your team becomes adversarial at the first sign of a disagreement. I lasted about 6 months before I quit.
Fast forward 5 years -- and the same company calls me back to work on a different (and very interesting) project. I went back, with the stipulation that the most I'm ever going to do in the leadership world is a team lead/mentor. They accepted, I got my raise (by quitting and coming back) and am doing the work I enjoy now. The company has a dual-track career ladder (up to a point,) so I can at least get increases for a while.
If you've totally burned out on the tech side. management is a way up, but know what you're getting into!! My advice - save your money and don't live a lifestyle that constantly requires 10% raises.
Particularly in IT, every situation is unique. Changing jobs can enable you to broaden your knowledge and skills, but it can also mean a bunch of lateral moves. Promotion can show a progression in your career, but that can often lead to dead end middle management paper pushing. It really depends on what you're looking to do, and what the climate is like in your current situation. I hate to speak in such useless platitudes, but you really have to look at your own fulfillment, and decide for yourself whether you can find opportunity to achieve it in your current company, or if you should look elsewhere.
I'm only going to work today because I didn't quit yesterday. The only reason I didn't quit yesterday is because I can't find a different job, at least not anywhere I want to live. I'm glad you guys find it so easy to "change jobs" but I'm just not seeing it.
if you've got upward mobility where you are now, stay where you are. If you don't, go elsewhere.
You know the proxy manipulator / OTF page re-writer?
I was thinking yeah, I wonder how I could advance my IT career using proxomitron.
You mean like the IT department?
Software Engineers do not typically use the term IT.
As far as management. Well, I tried it once, but my brain was shrinking. I tried to keep up my skills at the same time, but it did not work. Perhaps it works for some. Perhaps you may not care about loosing technical skills.
Good luck
"What if you have to fire one of your old friends? Not cool."
I hate to be the f***ing asshole here, but if you're concerned about firing your friends, you're probably not fit for management. Business could care less what is "cool" when it comes to those regards.
They don't promote anymore. I kept waiting and it never happened. Managers are happy to just giving more and more work and responsibilities, while only giving you incremental pay increases. If you want to get ahead, change jobs, multiple times. I think it is sad, but it is apparently how things work now. The most successful people seem to now only stay long enough in a position in order to put it on their resume and then move on. The crazy thing is, it usually takes longer than their tenure to actually finish large projects, so they never really finish anything. Perhaps get your underlings to finish a project that your predecessor left, and then claim the credit, and move on. This is how people are rewarded now.
A lot of commentors here have discussed lots of different interesting topics, but I thought I might offer this advice.
All things being equal, you are better of salary-wise to leave than to wait for promotions.
Not only does my experience along with many other people I know confirm this, I know more than one headhunter who also confirm this. I hate to tell you an anecdote about my own personal experience, but it won't hurt: every time I have been laid off (twice now and I'm not even 30) I've received a massive pay raise. I just recently got promoted 2 weeks ago and got a mere 8% pay raise. When I have been laid off I've gotten a 20% and 30% pay raise.
Just because the U.S. is a republic does not mean it is not a democracy. Democracy/republic are not mutually exclusive.
. . . and think about what your opponent (management) will be thinking.
And they will be thinking: "The devil we know, is better than the devil we don't."
That is: the employee they have. You are the devil they DO know. And can take advantage of, who knows the job, and is somewhat entangled, socially, and entrapped, are a better deal for them. However - most employers don't *know* this. Or they do - but they don't show it, in the compensation, advancement, and opportunity department. But this is really one of the huge reasons why employees get "stuck" at one level. Why promote an employee when you'll have to invest in a replacement?
So, go to a new employer -- you become the devil they do not know.
You bring all that the previous employer valued (and failed to reward you for) to the table. The new employer should be rewarding you for bringing that.
All this said - every time I have had an internal promotion, it has been a huge disappointment, mostly.
Every time I have had a "forced" job change, it's been a decline in pay or compensation, one way or another.
When I have changed employers on my own, it's always been somewhat of a risky proposition, (you never know if there are going to be bad factors; unreliable or psycho bosses or coworkers . . . bad business model. . . bad market position. . . etc.) but it's ALWAYS been a huge bump in salary and standard of living for me.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
Especially when the current job does not match your level of capability. I graduated in 2009 (the worst possible time) with a PhD in EE and joined a large software company as an entry level QA. The pay was pretty good for that level but did not at all match my capabilities. I got a pay level promotion that amounts to 6% increase in salary. It was a joke. After the "promotion" I still make less than people who join at same level as my after-promotion level. It will take 7+ years within the company for me to advance to senior level. I left in 2010 to join another internet company as a Sr. dev, making a 50% more salary.
You can convince someone who doesn't already rent your productivity that it's worth 10-20% more. You may be able to convince someone who does already own your time that it's worth 1-2% more, in the current market. And you can grow old and die waiting for the time-serving droid in the boss' seat to grow old and die.
3 broad categories of employer (with the usual pros and cons of stereotyping):
1. The Screw gradually steps up responsibilities and workload without corresponding increase in pay & conditions. Key here is the gradual stepping up which is never individually enough to warrant being called - or pay increased as - a promotion, however each year you can compare to the previous one and realise you're doing a lot more for little extra money. "Turning the screw" tends to be more common with smaller businesses, you'll notice a corporate culture against disclosing pay with colleagues and it's probably a faux pas to raise pay with management, even at appraisals. Here you get promoted by leaving and joining a new company every few years, starting off the new job at about par (similar responsibilities, much better pay) before they start turning the screw.
2. The Slave-Driver ridiculously overworks staff without paid overtime, or even TOIL, incentivised with the promise of fast promotion. Promotions are incremental and usually not much of a pay bump, though they might look bigger when they forget to mention it includes the annual inflation increase. Actual performance doesn't matter so much, just whore yourself and you'll keep being promoted until you are over-promoted to the point that your undeniable incompetence is such a risk to others that they make your life hell until you quit. More common with large companies where HR is the friend that leaves you wondering who needs enemies; beware job adverts highlighting 'career opportunities'. Trying to find a new job elsewhere isn't really a promotion route, it's a horizontal move if looking for a type of work or conditions better suited to your personally (i.e. you're over-promoted or you realise there's more to life than these bastards).
3. Yes, there are actually some employers who increase pay and give promotions as and when deserved... Or would like to, anyway. Such employers are looking long term, understand the value of retaining staff experience and the costs of obtaining and training new. However, it is easy for the employee to mistake this for a screw-turner as naturally everyone over-estimates both their own worth and how green the grass is elsewhere; we have an innate assumption that we're being screwed, usually true but a false belief in this case. The employer is also very likely to be restricted by available opportunities - they know you could do a manager's job, want you to do a managers job but simply have neither an opening nor the money. While you may have to resort to getting a new job to be promoted or else find yourself going nowhere, do understand what a rare gem you have found. Typically a small to medium non-public company.
OK, so there's a 4th:
4. Cushy places where pay is a bit low but you spend half the day on the interwebs and "coffee and cake mornings" are considered important meetings. They might even be called a team-building exercise, which is strange because it's mostly that bitchy gossip that you get from people who are deeply unfulfilled by their 'career', lack any sense of genuine achievement and are so devoid of real stress that they have to go create some. Often easily identified by their gibberish emails using some cartoonish font, because they actually have time for that and don't understand being professional. Most however continue to believe they are underpaid, commonly comparing their salary with advertised (i.e. outlier) salaries no matter how obvious it is that those jobs come with 65 manic hours per week while subject #4 simply has no comprehension of what a hard day's work is for everyone else. As alluded to, this is probably the worst employer of all.