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X-Men Origins Pirate Draws a 1-Year Sentence
An anonymous reader writes with this excerpt from geek.com: "In 2009, a copy of X-Men Origins: Wolverine found its way on to Megaupload a month before it was due to appear in movie theaters. The so-called 'workprint' copy was unfinished — so unfinished in fact, anyone viewing this copy saw green screens and wires attached to actors used to help with the more acrobatic movements during action scenes. Hugh Jackman even commented on the leak, describing it as like getting a 'Ferrari without a paint job.' The person who decided to share the movie illegally was tracked down, however. He is a 49-year-old New Yorker by the name of Gilberto Sanchez, and he's just been prosecuted." The New York Times' 2010 interview with Sanchez is a good read, too.
not like he was ripping DVD's to play on his ipod or iphone because the digital copy thing for blu ray is a scam. not like he only watched the stolen copy in his home. he uploaded it so it could be downloaded by others
Sooo, instead of imposing a fine, we'll let the taxpayer foot the bill for a year's incarceration. Brilliant.
The problem with calling it "a Ferrari without a paintjob" is that it's not a Ferrari of a movie. Hell, it's not even an Hyundai Elantra of a movie.
At least watching the workprint made it fun: "Claws Grow".
Hilary Rosen's speech was about her love of money and her desire to roll around naked in a pile of money.
Only after its been rear-ended.
If someone is passing you on the right, you are an asshole for driving in the wrong lane.
Except, of course, those convicted of sodomy charges. There's the Federal no-ass-pounding prison for that.
Jokes aside, it's interesting how among all the different types of intellectual property, only copyright is settled in criminal courts.
If only you had been there, he would be a free man today. In fact, the film probably was better without all that sterile, fake looking animation.
TFA says the jailed guy got the movie on DVD for $5 from some guy in a Chinese restaurant. So the movie was already in commercial, pirate distribution on DVD and the feds did nothing about that. Instead they went after the movie buff who uploaded the DVD for no commercial gain. This sounds more like the usual "war against the internet" than "going after the right person" as the articles propagandistically pretend.
"The person who decided to share the movie illegally was tracked down"
Well, not exactly... the person who first uploaded it was tracked down, not the person who first stole it, copy it, and give it to the Koreans to sell on the street.
Seems the person to first share it is still out there...
it's interesting how among all the different types of intellectual property, only copyright is settled in criminal courts.
There are criminal offenses defined under trademark law, too.
And are policed by the FBI and ICE and Homeland Security ... pretty sweet deal, make the government responsible for policing your profits, and at their expense.
The police (and the government) now officially work for the corporations. It's amazing the laws you can buy.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Here's the obligatory proportions post. How many people have been arrested for the housing market crash thus far? How much monetary damage did those people actually do in comparison to this guy?... yeah.
Don't trust a bull's horn, a doberman's tooth, a runaway horse or me.
I don't think it matters. The movie butchered so many comic book back stories that it was incredibly painful to watch even after "the paint was applied."
I wouldn't call it a Ferrari either. Maybe a Pinto without a paint job.
Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
Come to think of it, I still haven't seen this movie. The first one was good, the second OK, the third... well, you get the picture.
âoeAny society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.
That copy was not ripped from a theatrical release DVD. It was obviously copied directly from a data file in some productions houses' work flow. This guy was just an accessory after the fact. And that "Sanchez explained that he actually bought the movie on DVD for $5 from a Korean man in a Chinese restaurant.". So where does the data originate from?
Who ever released the original data is the person who needs to spend time in jail, not some patsy who bought a cheap DVD from an anonymous pusher in some shady restaurant dealing.
I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
The biggest problem with his analogy is that X-Men Origins: Wolverine was more like a Volkswagen Beetle. The "paint job" they added in post-production was all it had going for it.
Thank you, I did not know that before.
There are actually quite a few exceptions to my claim. France and Austria have criminal penalties for wanton patent infringement for example.
But I think my point still stands: out of all the criminal prosecutions for intellectual property infringements, the vast majority of them are copyright infringements.
Look, I don't really follow the Slashdot party line on this one; I think stealing from artists you respect is stupid, because they won't make you more stuff. And Sanchez was an idiot for uploading this thing from the illegal pirated copy he bought. But his punishment does seem disproportionate, and they still got the wrong guy.
This guy bought stolen goods, and made illegal copies of copyrighted materials. Somebody, somewhere, actually stole the proof from the studio. That is the real crime they should be punishing if they want to stop pre-release pirates. And I won't even bother to point out how effortlessly easy it would be to track copies and identify leaks in this technical audience, because I'm sure you can all come up with half-a-dozen schemes yourselves. If the studios can't be bothered to prevent the leaks or identify and punish the leakers in the first place, why should we care what happens to the leaked materials?
I can just imagine his first conversations with fellow prisoners - so what are you in here for? Convict 1) I killed 3 people. Convict 2) I raped some kids. Sanchez) I uploaded a movie to a filesharing site. He is definitely going to be someone's bitch!
As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a reference to Godwin's Law approaches 1
Please see my response here
Even though lot of exceptions exist, I think my point is still valid. The number of copyright infringement cases in criminal courts dwarfs the number of all other intellectual property violation cases in criminal courts.
It's possibly worth noting that that version was actually more interesting than the final cut.
Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
Also has anyone else ever seen when the police do a "raid" on the bootleg dvd sellers on Canal Street in NYC? I've seen it happen a few times and the police move as slowly as possible, it seems to allow everyone time to pack up all their shit and escape. Sometimes enough time for people to pack up entire carts and run down the street with them. Not exactly a possibility for this dude, clearly. No idea what the sentence time is for someone caught with pirated material in real life is compared to online possession/distribution, or maybe it's the same?
This is a research account for studying online commenting so we can create tools to improve moderation.
Except that Gilberto Sanchez wasn't selling anything.
Not sure how anyone can claim the copy uploaded was "'identical with, or substantially indistinguishable from' the genuine trademark.' Even the braindead Wolverine could see that via his horrid car simile.
So the OP is still correct in pointing out the disconnect.
Which is really where it gets funny.
His source came from some korean guy selling DVDs. If he'd known the guy's name, or had an address to point the FBI to, they probably would have let him off the hook as an informant.
His first mistake (after, of course, uploading the movie) was in not demanding a lawyer present for all interrogations. His second was in not being able to identify by face/name one of the thousand or so Koreans/Chinese who are running around Manhattan selling bootleg crap every day.
And of course, the bigger problem for us is that copyright has ceased to be meaningful. This guy made no profit, but is going to jail for a year. The guy who leaked the source that the korean had? Never been found. The koreans/chinese themselves hawking knockoffs and bootleg DVDs? Fat chance the FBI ever goes after them - they make money, but chances are some precinct head or FBI local branch head is on the take from them.
The movie butchered so many comic book back stories that it was incredibly painful to watch even after "the paint was applied."
Tell me about it. Not only this guy, but every distributor of that crap should be jailed for unleashing such an atrocity. I saw it on TV and still felt like demanding my money back.
And they all moved away from him over on the Group W bench....
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
Except the original VW Beetle had a whole lot going for it even without its paint. Of course, its paint was high quality, too.
robert
A corporation doesn't commit a crime. It has no guilty intent or intent at all. The one who commits a crime is the executive who makes the decision, and they certainly can be sent to prison.
And this is the way it should be. A company can easily behave if those without ethics are removed from the board.
It wasn't always. One of the things the patriot act did was absorb multiple existing agencies into 'homeland security', so that supposedly it would streamline things like information gathering/sharing.
Now, you may look at the ICE wiki page and say 'Bullshit, it was formed March 1st 2003, it was always part of homeland security.'
Look at the homeland security wiki page:
"On March 1, 2003, DHS absorbed the Immigration and Naturalization Service and assumed its duties. In doing so, it divided the enforcement and services functions into two separate and new agencies: Immigration and Customs Enforcement and Citizenship and Immigration Services."
One of the convenient things about absorbing multiple agencies into one large conglomerate is that when someone inside gets caught doing something illegal (warrantless wiretapping, kidnapping and abducting people domestically and internationally, etc), it is easy to pass the buck around into a mire that no one single agency or person can be brought to justice.
506. Criminal offenses6
(a) Criminal Infringement. —
(1) In general. — Any person who willfully infringes a copyright shall be punished as provided under section 2319 of title 18, if the infringement was committed —
(A) for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain;
He didn't earn any money off uploading it
(B) by the reproduction or distribution, including by electronic means, during any 180-day period, of 1 or more copies or phonorecords of 1 or more copyrighted works, which have a total retail value of more than $1,000; or
(C) by the distribution of a work being prepared for commercial distribution, by making it available on a computer network accessible to members of the public, if such person knew or should have known that the work was intended for commercial distribution.
The work was a unfinished work that was never going to see the light of day.
(2) Evidence. — For purposes of this subsection, evidence of reproduction or distribution of a copyrighted work, by itself, shall not be sufficient to establish willful infringement of a copyright.
Did they find anyone that downloaded the movie from the megaupload site? If they didn't have anyone to show that download it then there is no evidence of distribution attributive to him. It might have over some some where else.
(3) Definition. — In this subsection, the term “work being prepared for commercial distribution” means —
(A) a computer program, a musical work, a motion picture or other audiovisual work, or a sound recording, if, at the time of unauthorized distribution —
(i) the copyright owner has a reasonable expectation of commercial distribution; and
(ii) the copies or phonorecords of the work have not been commercially distributed; or
(B) a motion picture, if, at the time of unauthorized distribution, the motion picture —
(i) has been made available for viewing in a motion picture exhibition facility; and
(ii) has not been made available in copies for sale to the general public in the United States in a format intended to permit viewing outside a motion
I think he has a goo case for bad representation and for appeal.
They don't throw all the federal prisoners in together. He's going to go to a minimum security prison, which looks more like a college campus. The other prisoners are going to have been convicted of fraud or money laundering.
The movie was so-so and the effects were HORRIBLE--literally lower than SyFy monster-of-the-week movies. Watching the workprint was the best part. It's interesting to see the behind-the-scenes stuff.
Gene Siskel had a metric for movies: "Is this film more interesting than a documentary of the same actors having lunch?" My variation is, "Is watching this movie more fun than watching the 'making-of' extras on the DVD?"
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Thank it's not a person, and shouldn't have the rights of one.
I know what the law says, and I know that he broke the law. But consider this: there was no provable financial harm to the producers of the film. No one was hurt. No one was deprived of anything. Yet, this guy is deprived of his freedom for one year and earns a permanent criminal record. This was a classic victimless crime and I would argue that that makes it no crime at all.
I agree the movie was bad Sabertooth being Wolverines brother was so stupid. Not to mention my favorite character of all time Gambit got just totally messed up they made him look like a dork and a idiot. Bad movie and they already have plans for a 2nd movie according to hsx.com
http://www.thetechnologygeek.org
I think the difference is that copyright infringement is mostly perpetrated by individuals, patent and trade mark is left to businesses. To intimidate a person, you threaten them with jail. To intimidate a business, you threaten them with a lawsuit.
That would stand to reason since copyright infringement is the most common type of IP crime.
Check out my world simulator thingy.
Recently, a Social Security employee was robbed and shot. The shooter, recently released from prison after 9 months "time-served" of a 10 year sentence for armed robbery.
So armed robbery, and you can be out in less than a year. Upload an unfinished video of a film and it's a year in prison.
The avg person's well being is meaningless to the Law. But the profits of a stealing mega-corporation, now that the Law is concerned with.
There is a point where the Sheriff is corrupt, and his badge is nothing more than a bully pulpit.
>The one who commits a crime is the executive who makes the
> decision, and they certainly can be sent to prison.
I was under the impression that at least part of the basic reason for a corporation was to shield people from liability. To be reasonable, I'm guessing that it was meant as financial, not criminal liability.
But then we get to a thing I call, "blame diffusion," where you spread a bad, even criminal decision around many people. At this point while something truly bad may happen, something that would clearly be criminal had one individual done it, each person in the chain of command has done only something minor or "mildly negligent," and at no single point does it rise to the level of being criminal. IMHO corporate processes can be designed to make things happen this way, and very possibly are, for this exact reason.
> A company can easily behave if those without ethics are
> removed from the board.
That presumes you can find someone else "at that level" who does have some ethics. Given that executives seem to be a rather exclusive club these days, finding a member of that club with good ethics and ready to fill your position may be very difficult indeed.
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
Exactly what 'rights' (that do not extend from the individual rights of the owners) do you think a corporation has?
Don't worry, that was an typo on the editor's part. I clearly remember Hugh Jackman describing it like getting a "Fiero without a paint job."
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
You can get anything you want, at Alice's Restaurant...(exceptin' Alice)...
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Yeah, but neither of those are Ferarris. I probably wouldn't liken the film to a Ferarri either, but I digress...
/* No Comment */
Here you go.
Blank until
It's more like having a Ferrari with every kind of shielding stripped so you actually get to see how the valves work and how the transmission shifts.
Personally, I'd almost say that "working copy" is more interesting than the finished movie. But that's the geek in me, I don't like magicians for the same reason: I wanna know how stuff works!
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
He should be effin' glad the badge isn't seen as the aiming cross. But we're getting there, give it time.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
One of the sweetest things I ever picked up was the titanium bicycle frame that had just a clear coat on it, let you see the metal striations and all the welds in their raw form, with no filler to smooth any of it out, the flexible, rigid strength was visible.
That is certainly the theory, but in practice a diffusion of responsibility results also in a diffusion (and eventually lack) of accountability. It becomes possible for a corporation to do illegal or unethical things without the actual decisionmakers in the corporation necessarily being aware that the company is doing anything illegal or unethical. A corporate culture of criminality or at least reckless disregard for the law can develop, and the government is not going to step in and jail hundreds of thousands of people when this happens. There might be one or two token trials, and maybe somebody will get a year or two in prison and a fine.
Check out my world simulator thingy.
Well, plus the financial damage.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Indeed, if you ever get a chance look up close at a Ferrari F40, it has paint, but just barely enough to make it look Ferrari red from a distance.
The paint is thin and nearly translucent as it is opaque, so it adds the least possible weight. You can see the carbon fiber/nomex/kevlar weave right through it; it's also notoriously easy to scuff, and difficult to polish. The paint job wouldn't be close to acceptable on a factory Kia, but people paid for what is basically a street legal thoroughbred race machine, and shaving a few pounds of paint off makes it go faster, you know.
Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
And so don't the similar harsh penalties for what once used to be organized economic crime strike you as disproportionate at least in some copyright cases where it has been reduced to as little as an inadvertent mouse click?
Cf. http://www.locusmag.com/Features/2008/11/cory-doctorow-why-i-copyfight.html - and that's by a published author who makes a living selling his works.
At least your favorite Marvel character isn't Deadpool. If that were a decent Deadpool adaptation, then his Common Sense would've started tingling and he would've gotten the hell out of that shitty excuse for a movie.
...not that movie. ;-)
See Citizens United v. FEC for the First Amendment right the Supreme court recently ruled that corporations have.
Watching the workprint was the best part. It's interesting to see the behind-the-scenes stuff.
My thoughts when I read this story: "Sounds interesting, where do I get a copy?"
No sig today...
And inside it's all bare metal and visible welding...carpets are heavy!
No sig today...
Hey, that's an insult to Fieros!
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
I stand corrected. My apologies for making a gross overgeneralize without checking the facts first.
People make mistakes, but seriously, after your first made-up claim made it to +5, couldn't you take your winnings and run?
I care about knowing the facts and being right, not some integer counter on /.'s server. If I didn't reply then I wouldn't have been enlightened to the truth, now would I?
Right from the article you linked:
Kennedy wrote: "If the First Amendment has any force, it prohibits Congress from fining or jailing citizens, or associations of citizens, for simply engaging in political speech."
Emphasis mine. 'Corporations' don't have a right of free speech, PEOPLE have a right of free speech, even when those people form an association known as a 'corporation'.
So again I ask, exactly what rights (that do not extend from the individual rights of the owners) do you think a corporation has?
Each one of those supposed 'corporate rights' comes from the fact that a corporation is nothing more than an association of people, and people do not forfeit any of their rights just because they associate. Those same corporate rights apply to unions, the FSF, the EFF, the KKK, and any other group of people you come up with. So again, what special rights does a corporation have that do not extend from the individuals making up the corporation?
His first mistake (after, of course, uploading the movie) was in not demanding a lawyer present for all interrogations
This is a common misunderstanding.
A lawyer is necessary when you've been charged with a crime and you're going in front of a judge.
You don't need one when you're being interrogated (i.e. before you've been charged). All you need to do is BE SILENT. Do not talk to anyone. Don't say anything.
"Did you upload this movie?" silence.
"Is this your computer?" silence
"If you cooperate we'll make it easier on you." silence
If you do have a lawyer during an interrogation, all he will do is tell you to keep silent.
I don't think it matters. The movie butchered so many comic book back stories...
Ha! Good one!
that it was incredibly painful to watch even after "the paint was applied."
I wouldn't call it a Ferrari either. Maybe a Pinto without a paint job.
...wait, were you serious? It seems silly to pretend that the last 15 retcons or complete rewrites were okay, but this one is a step too far! I haven't seen the movie in question and have no reason to believe it's not horrible, but to borrow from James Nicoll, the problem with defending the purity of Marvel back stories is that Marvel back stories about as pure as a cribhouse whore.
Ryan Reynolds did a terrible Deadpool and his Green Lantern was horrible. He stunk in Blade 3 I was glad to see Triple H beat him up. Ryan Reynolds needs to keep away from the comic book movies his adaptation are not up to par.
http://www.thetechnologygeek.org
More like a pinto without the Ferrari badges that a studio exec was planning on gluing on. I think the guy should be considered a consumer watchdog who warned people off of a fraudulent product, not an IP thief.
The reason for a corporation is to shield the shareholders from any more liability than their stake in the corporation. By law, individual shareholders do not have any say in the operation of the corporation (except for voting for the board), and they do not have any information about the operation of the corporation which is not available to the general public.
As for 'blame diffusion', I don't know what you are talking about. Either a crime has been committed or it hasn't. If it has been committed, someone did it. There is no such thing as a bunch of little non-criminal things adding up to a crime, unless there is a conspiracy involved. And if there is a conspiracy, then all parties share culpability.
After what I saw on X-Men 3 I considered myself sufficiently warned and thought people who cared about the comics would be too.
http://dilbert.com/2010-12-13
One of the sweetest things I ever picked up was the titanium bicycle frame that had just a clear coat on it, let you see the metal striations and all the welds in their raw form, with no filler to smooth any of it out, the flexible, rigid strength was visible.
My flexible, rigid strength is clearly visible in it's raw form, too.
Each one of those supposed 'corporate rights' comes from the fact that a corporation is nothing more than an association of people, and people do not forfeit any of their rights just because they associate. Those same corporate rights apply to unions, the FSF, the EFF, the KKK, and any other group of people you come up with. So again, what special rights does a corporation have that do not extend from the individuals making up the corporation?
The right to kill people with no threat of imprisonment or death?
This is the problem with trying to please Comic book people in a major motion picture ADAPTATION. The script writers have to take short cuts to make the movie film length, and that cuts into the many years of development that exists in Comic book universe. It's absurb to think that the writers need to stay so many degrees away from the comics, as it is a completely different medium to tell a similar story. If you want complex back stories, stick to a medium which can build upon the stories. Feature Films are not your bag, but don't try to ruin it for the rest of us.
Uh, yeah. You'll have to show me the law that allows that. In addition, I would like to hear of an actual case, or even a plausible scenario, where a corporation could kill a person in such a manner that the corporation escapes the punishment that would be meted out to an individual that has done the same thing.
You really think that we should add another prisoner to an already over-crowded, over-burdened prison system just for that? Please, this punishment is way out of proportion with the "crime."
Palm trees and 8
So if 'only a few' people have their rights violated that is OK?
If you don't like the way a corporation is representing you via it's political speech (or any other way), divest the shares.
I think the "paint job" bit is a bad analogy, and I think the "Pinto" bit is unfair. If the thing is showing green screens and such, it's really more like a Yugo without the seats and steering wheel. Actually, I think comparing it to a Yugo is probably unfair too, but I can't think of a car worse than that. Maybe a Pontiac Aztek.
Does anyone else see the madness in taking away a real person's liberty and pursuit of happiness in order to sate the artificial rights of an artificial person? I mean, artificial persons don't even risk imprisonment had the committed crimes against him, yet if he commits a crime against an artificial person, he gets removed from life for a period of time.
Everyone involved in distributing X-Men: Origins: Wolverine deserved a year in prison, not just the pirates.
I'm not sure how Green Lantern could have been much better even with a different actor in the lead role.
A movie doesn't have to be "pure" (or true) to the comics, it just has to be good. The X-Men movies directed by Bryan Singer were good. After he left, they took a nosedive.
Beetles were good cars, so that's a dumb analogy. Beetles were simple and reliable, even if their performance sucked. A better comparison is with the Yugo.
Exactly. Even with the Iron Duke engine that tended to catch on fire, Fieros weren't that bad (and actually got pretty good right before they stopped production with the later V6 models). A better comparison is with the Yugo or Lada.
This doesn't count DVD sales & royalties scammed from the cable companies to show it on TV. This also doesn't include merchandising.
Now factor in Hollywood accounting and poormouthing and we now know why the studio loses money on a film that was made for 32 million and brought in half a BILLION
Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
That is bizarre. I am sitting next to a window that overlooks a DeLorean painted red. (The owner is in the process of reverting it)
I had a sucky sig.
Most copyright infringement is not criminal and I'm having a hard time imagining how this was since the "perpetrator" made no money from it.
The Trabant.
Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
I've got a copy, but evidently it wouldn't be a good idea for me to post it. ;-)
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Uh, yeah. You'll have to show me the law that allows that. In addition, I would like to hear of an actual case, or even a plausible scenario, where a corporation could kill a person in such a manner that the corporation escapes the punishment that would be meted out to an individual that has done the same thing.
You don't need a specific law to grant you rights. That's not how rights work.
Plenty of corporations have killed people through greed/negligence/malice - see automobiles, drugs, food, tobacco, etc.
Whereas an individual would be charged with murder/manslaughter, corporations are charged with... nothing. They issue a recall / pay some fines and keep doing it.
Agreed, although I was not fond of the iron duke; with its iron crankcase and aluminium head, it tended to blow head gaskets due to TCE differential. However, the V6 Fiero was fast and reliable and all Fieros were stylish. There was nothing stylish, fast or fun about the film.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
Your basic premise is simply wrong. If corporations (C corps) were nothing more than associations of people, then they would not be subject to separate taxation. Since any corporation can do away with that taxation just by dissolving itself, and the people who formed it can them reconstitute as one or more sole proprietorships, "S-corps', partnerships, variant LLCs (as allowed by some states) and other such pass through entities, and still do business, we either have to believe that all those smart people pay extra taxes as part of their association for absolutely no advantages (maybe they just want to give the government an extra 36% and this is their way of being anonymous charitable donors, right?), or they get advantages for their association (such as higher overall profits than they themselves think they could make as Partnerships, S-Corps, or other pass-throughs). Every for profit C-corp has judged, and continues to judge every quarter, that they DO GET EXTRA RIGHTS from association. You're arguing for William Jefferson Gates, Warren Buffett, and a host of others going back beyond Howard Hughes, Edison, Westinghouse and Ford being the biggest idiots on the planet, constantly conned into giving the rest of us free money and too blind to ever figure it out. Guess what, they weren't and aren't, but I'm not so sure about you.
As a hint of where you have gone off the beam, the standard C-Corp is also often called a limited liability corporation. Why is that do you suppose? It's not like there's anything special about limited liability, is there. Can't anyone, as an individual person, simply declare their liability in the event of an auto accident is limited to the value of their vehicle, and then drive a battered old beater and not have to insure it? No? They cannot? Then you might want to learn just what limited liability means, because you, as a living entity with rights, sure as hell don't enjoy that one.
Who is John Cabal?
Maybe a Pinto without a paint job.
Wrong movie. That would be Fantastic 4 with the human torch.
For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
So you really think he's going to be in prison for one year?
I certainly don't.
What complete bullshit. You're just making stuff up. You can't even come up with a single case where a corporation caused a death that would have resulted in an individual being charged with murder or manslaughter. In fact, you appear to not even know what 'murder' is.
There are thousands and thousands of deaths from auto accidents each year. Almost none of them result in criminal charges. The only way criminal charges are brought (and it is never a murder charge) is if a law has been broken (such as DWI). What laws are being broken by corporations that directly result in deaths?
More like a rusted out pinto. That movie was garbage.
Holy crap. You suggest that I should learn what limited liability means? You apparently haven't got a clue.
Limited liability refers to the liability of the shareholders (individuals) not the corporation itself. Because, by law, shareholders are not involved in the day-to-day operations of the corporation, make no decisions about the corporation, and have no more information about the corporation, their liability is limited to only their financial stake in the company. It has nothing to do with what liability the company itself has. The company can lose all of it's assets and be forced to liquidate for it's actions, just like an individual.
Or perhaps you think that if you happen to own stock in XYZ corp (say in your 401K), and XYZ gets sued for some reason, it is entirely reasonable for you to lose not only that part of your 401K, but also your house, the rest of your 401K, etc.
The rest of your argument makes no sense either? "If companies were nothing more than people they would not be subject to separate taxation"? Says who.
Actually I thought the movie without the paintjob was far superior than the final cut. The movie was so bad that at least getting to see the wire frames on the CGI, some of the green screens and the wires for the stunts made the movie slightly more barable, without that stuff the movie was just plain bad.
What exactly is the charge? I had a quick read through the article and it was not mentioned.
AccountKiller
Not unless you shave your pubes, "Sexconker"...
'Don't worry' said the trees when they saw the axe coming, 'The handle is one of us.'
You are aware that one of the comic book authors also had a lot to do with the script at least in 3. Also from a reading the comics myself, they where anything but consistent. For example in some Saber is little more than a grunting animal, while in others he was quite human in behavior, much like in the movies.
The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
I am seriously outraged. My tax dollars should not be used to help support the copyright industry. It's one thing to sue monetarily, it's another thing to put someone in jail for a year to the cost of the taxpayer for $50,000 a year. Second it's cruel.
It's one thing to give a business a tax break, it's another for government to actually do their job for them and enforce a flawed business model. To become their bill collectors.
Keep this up and people in this country will revolt. Revolt against the government and Hollywood. Suing and putting people in jail that are your potential customers. What has this country come to.
Are you a lawyer? Because that's generally an urban legend. As long as the police are acting lawfully (e.g. no torture), a lawyer can't 'force' the police to do anything. Where it sometimes works is if the lawyer tells you to be silent and you are - The police may eventually release you once they realize they're not getting anything out of you.