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iFixit's Kyle Wiens On the War On DIY Electronics
pigrabbitbear writes with an excerpt from an article at Motherboard: "Anyone planning on buying a new iPad should know what they're getting themselves into by now. In recent years, Apple and other hardware manufacturers have made it liquid-crystal clear that they're not fond of the idea that customers can tear open and fix products without the help of licensed repair specialists. Even if it's as easy as ordering a part online and following a few instructions gleaned from a Google search, hardware companies generally seem to prefer we keep the hood closed. It should not be surprising, then, that the latest version of Apple's much-desired tablet has one 'killer' feature that's finally getting the attention it deserves: A design that stops you from getting inside of it."
everyone knows what apple is all about by now.
To my eyes, the headline reads as if this Kyle Wiens is on war against DIY camp, as opposed to being against this "war" on DIY.
Fuck systemd. Fuck Redhat. Fuck Soylent, too. Wait, scratch the last one.
A design that stops you from getting inside of it
Is this the same new iPad where there was a photo story of some guys who make tools for geeks demonstrating their gear by systematically taking one apart, all on-line within about ten seconds of the product launch?
There even seem to be references to this in TFA...
If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
Even when I was 14 years old, back in the 80's, I knew that Apple's closed system was no good. Yes, at the time, they had better hardware, software, and such, but it wasn't easily upgradeable, not without spending twice more for a part than what you could put in an IBM compatible. And, look what happened, Wintel machines won. More and better innovation came from the hardware manufacturers that had to compete with each other for user's dollars.
Only software suffered because Microsoft had that locked up. Here Apple won the day for a long time because they did have the more creative designers. Now that we have competition in the OS field, we are starting to see better ideas flourish and rise to the top. We are starting to see better designed software interfaces that allow the user to feel at ease with their computing device.
Same rules these days - it's the consumers bucks. If Apple (or anyone) wants to say "you had someone open this who wasn't us - goodbye" that's up to them. And that person can then take it down the road to the guy who's not so fussy.
"The greatest lesson in life is to know that even fools are right sometimes" - Winston Churchill
Don't buy anything with a locked bootloader (that can't be unlocked)
Don't buy anything that requires a non-standard data cable, such as micro USB.
Don't buy anything you can't change your own battery in using much more than a screw driver.
My EVO passes the test, so does my netbook and all the Bluetooth (not Logitech proprietary wireless USB) peripherals.
The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
Thing is, 95% of consumers don't really care about repairing their own electronics, if not more. The remaining handful of people that choose not to buy an iPad because of its inaccessibility re:DIY repairs aren't going to make enough of a difference to make any manufacturer change their ways, even assuming ALL of them refuse to buy iPads.
If you look at it objectively, Apple, or anyone else, is pretty much just giving people what they want. It doesn't seem like this 'killer' feature is designed to keep people from accessing the insides of the iPad; after all, what percentage of iPad 1 owners were tinkering around with the insides of it? An insignificant amount, from the perspective of the company selling millions of the thing.
I've learned that they're worthless, so I don't read AC comments anymore.
Remind me again, what is the "problem"?
Making it easy for things to come apart and be put back together takes space. The bigger the space budget, the more repairable and upgradable things have been. This has always been the case. This is why laptops have been more hassle than desktops, and why the iPad, which is shoved in there VERY tightly, is even worse.
So really, you figure out what's important to you. Is it more important to have a device you can easily repair, or is it more important that it be thin and light? With tablets, few people vote for heavy and repairable since they've been available for years in the Windows Tablet Edition space.
This past weekend between Friday and Sunday, Apple sold 3 million new iPad units (aka the iPad 3). Looks like customers made the decision of buying an integrated system over a DIY system. And honestly, who cares? Apple has gone to great lengths to produce a device that efficiently crams electronics and a battery into something that's 0.37" thick. Why would I want to mess around with that?
Rather then complaining about how difficult it is to strip one down and reassemble it.
Even Apple can't tear down and reassemble an iPad 2 or iPad 3. There is no magical service manual for doing so. If a device is found to be defective, it gets replaced. Internally, they get torn down and a lot of parts are recycled- but this procedure is ONE WAY ONLY. These devices were built with the assumption that they would NEVER be opened up.
The reason for this, contrary to iFixit's belief- is not to screw the user over.
The truth is that the tolerances inside these devices is so astoundingly tight, that there simply isn't room for clamps, latches, and screws (which require threaded posts on the other side- this always takes up more space then the screwhead does). In order to produce a device as sturdy as the iPad 2 and iPad 3, they *had* to use industrial adhesive over a large surface area to literally fuse the thing together. Screws wouldn't cut it. Clamps make for a rickety squeaky device when you torque it between two hands. And the iPad 2/iPad 3 chassis isn't like the iPad 1, which was thick and sturdy enough to survive that sort of mechanical abuse by itself (in other words, the iPad 2 & 3 design depend on everything being fused together- otherwise, the pieces by themselves lack the structural integrity required to withstand daily use).
Apple makes money by selling slim, sleek, and sexy hardware. iFixit is blaming them for not producing thick, heavy, and over-engineered equipment instead that is easily serviceable and modular. The only time frame I'm aware of where iFixit's views were societally acceptable was around 1995-1998, where we saw pieces of equipment like the IBM Thinkpad 760XD (still own one of those- it's an awesome laptop). Chunky as hell, weighs as much as a tank (and is otherwise built like one), totally modular, everything is user serviceable. Compare that to a modern day Apple laptop though, and it looks like it was manufactured on a different planet.
TLDR; iFixit is stuck in the past because their business model depends on it. Boo hoo.
-AC (because I work for the aforementioned company as a tech during the day)
Wasn't logged in, unfortunate!
My UID is prime... is yours?
Most compact consumer level electronic not meant to be serviced by the end user, of which only 0.0001% have the actual skill and know-how to fix in the first place!
News at 11.
Aside from a replaceable battery and memory cards, there isn't a thing I would trust users to touch in any tablet made in the last 5 years. Since iPad supports neither of these I guess the entire point is that there is no real point at all. Most end users can't be bothered to put their own memory in a PC let alone do anything that involves a soldering iron. Maybe Apple was wise to keep the consumer away from such dickering.
And no, I don't own an iPad. I would take one for free but I have no intentions of buying one. I just think that the endless tirade about end users not being free to fuck with their gadgets is getting a bit old. You want something to try your hand at building some circuits? Buy an Arduino. You want a compact piece of hardware that can reasonably take the place of 90% of end users needs? Buy a tablet. If you're one of the 1 in 100,000 who ever gets beyond these two concepts? You already know where to go and what to do.
I understand the appeal of fixing your own stuff, being able to take things apart and figure out how they work, and making them work better, but there's some things that are just not suitable for that kind of thing. Like, you don't hear people bitching that the transistors aren't replaceable on their CPU. As other components miniaturize, it's just too difficult to effect field repairs. They become too small and too delicate and tolerances are too tight.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
From the original video it looks like taking apart and repairing the new iPad is pretty much the same as the iPad 2.
But don't let that stop you from writing a scaremongering blog rant that links together FBI practices, human rights abuse, and environmental issues in electronics manufacturing,
I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
I'll never, ever buy an Apple product, if that's the way of things. I am an experienced electronics tech, I've been working on my own vehicles since I was a teenager, and I regularly build or repair things myself. If it's going to cost so damned much as Apple products do and they're going to damn near seal the thing in a block of epoxy to keep me out of it, then screw them and their shit.
Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
...is that Apple just knows its market. The average consumer is perfectly happy to purchase and use devices they cannot service themselves. This is true of their cars, their phones, their televisions, their refrigerators and their washers (just to name a few) - why would they argue over a tablet they cannot service themselves?
Personally, I have no desire to own any Apple product of any kind, precisely because of this kind of crap. However, I frequently recommend their products to my less technologically-inclined friends. Not because there's anything particularly wonderful about the products, but because they are simple to use.
I've had things like RAZR flip phones that were held together with screws and after a while they get really loose feeling. My work laptop, a 3 yr old Dell, creaks like a haunted house when I pick it up with the display open. Not my Apple equipment. My 5 yr old MacBook Pro sems as solid today as it was when I bought it. My iPhone seems to be made from a single slab of glass wrapped with a metal band. My iPad 2 is the same way - solid feeling.
Used to be, back when the phone company was broken up, cheap home phone makers were bolting big slugs of metal in the base of their stuff to make it feel solid. Solid is good - ever slam a car door? Cheap cars have doors that rattle. Good ones don't.
People value stuff that stays solid. As long as I can get my stuff fixed, I don't care if it's me that's doing the fixing or someone else. I used to fix my own cars, now I take them in. I can't fix the ECU and have no desire to buy the equipment necessary to be able to do so.
- real hackers don't have sigs -
Doesn't she know that she's now dependent on Neuropozyne for the rest of her life?
I remember when Linux was good... too...
There will probably be two biggish regrets in my life when I'm 80 years old : All the women I should've tried harder to fuck. Maybe not having kids sooner. And that I spend a decade using Apple laptops. I should've stuck with Linux for laptop machines!
The Christian religion has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world. -- Bertrand Russell
Electronics are like first spouses - it's just easier replace them rather than spending a lot of effort on repairs that are doomed to fail.
Holy Wars aside, teardowns are that much easier and getting parts/docs doesn't require you to be an authorized shop at any stage of the product's support.
Not only are they maintenance friendly from the start, there's documentation(Hardware Maintenance Manual) for replacing every component. On top of that, parts are generally available to all, even if they're in or out of warranty. Thanks to that, there are plenty of modifications that can be done (e.g. cross-model combinations of parts within the T40-43 series and within the T60/T61 series) to avoid design flaws (such as Nvidia's Bumpgate and GPU soldering flaws) or add uncommon/unlisted features (such as better displays).
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
The Kindle Fire is easy to open. The device is easy to slip out of the case by gently prying around the edges. There's no need for Apple to glue the ipad together. They could have done the same thing as the Fire.
I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
I wouldn't want Joe Sixpack screaming at me for a replacement after dismantling his 500$ + toy on the living-room carpet following a 5 picture teardown and a couple paragraphs on google written by kids who got a similar device on flebay for 40$ and replaced the glass.
mostly the battery or large components like the screen
I smell a shill.
The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
The next step (already in the R&D phase at various places in Silly Valley from what I read a year or so ago) is to print the whole thing on a web press, from the back to the front like a big electronic newspaper. All of the individual components have been successfully done this way - even most of the 'chips'. Once we get to that point, the cost of manufacturing may be so low that it's pointless to fix even if it were possible - it would be one solid unit like pages of newsprint glued together. Just grind it up, separate the materials, reconstitute and reprint a new one.
I wouldn't be surprised if this were already possible for a lower performance device.
It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/
Interesting to mention this while the Mac Mini went the opposite direction. You needed a "special tool" (spatula) for the previous models (and literally "crack" them open - if you heard the sound you know), and since they got all aluminum you don't even need a screwdriver to upgrade memory.
And to all the commenters complaining about how big of a pain it is to upgrade an Apple product: you are comparing desktop PCs to compact machines and laptops. My Macbook pro was easy to take apart, my macbook (older white) was a little harder. I had to change a cooling fan on the latter and unlike my Toshiba, it survived the procedure, and without a scratch... still my media player...
Funny how people complain about "closed systems" too recently. These are the people who do not understand, that you can develop whatever the hell you want for your devices... the distribution is Apple's..... most of my smaller problems can be solved by "web apps" - controlling my appliances, cameras, lights alarms etc .... jqtouch or icefaces take you far-far without writing native code ... unless you need a real app...
Just my 2c. I really have a feeling the people criticizing haven't owned a recent-day mac or iWhatever.
The real reason that consumer electronics are so difficult to repair has nothing to do with corporate conspiracy. Electronic design has shifted over the past generation from using large and discrete components to being almost exclusively dependent on integrated circuits and highly miniaturized surface mount devices. Twenty years ago perhaps, a hobbyist could get out a volmeter and soldering iron to trace a circuit problem to an individual transistor within, say, a pre-amp or filter assembly, and then easily replace the defective part within minutes. Now the entire assembly, formerly involving dozens of components, has been replaced by a single and often very tiny IC chip. In addition, any resistors or capacitors in modern circuits, once large enough for anyone to easily manipulate, have now been reduced to the size of grains of salt and are nearly impossible to extract and replace. In fact, the rule is that it is now much cheaper to simply dispose of defective circuitry than it is to attempt any kind or repair.
Replacing a battery, touch pad, or screen may still be within the realm of possibility, but broken electronics are better just destroyed and replaced with new.
First, this is hardly new, the culture of replacement vs. repair is nothing new. A "licensed technician" is in most cases someone who has access to the service manual and the replacement gear, and this is done so that this whole branch of "services" are outsourced, as they are not a significant income source for the manufacturer.
Second, nothing stops you from doing DIY electronics -- I assemble circuits all the time, some I interface with purchased gear. Frankly, most of the time I use purchased gear for a UI, and have my circuit do whatever job must be done without many frills except the communication unit and some command protocol.
If Apple (and, btw, practically all other mass electronic device manufacturers) must be pressed about something, it is about allowing communication with the device and easily deploying own software.
In this respect, Android does a moderately decent job for USB, Apple and various android devices are roughly equivalent WRT bluetooth, and I suspect, while I haven't bothered to check, that if necessary one can probably learn the Apple connector interface and use that too.
Wasn't the EU working on guidelines and legislation to make sure cars, computers, appliances, etc disassemble easily for the End-of-Life recycling process?
Anybody got links, pls?
This doesn't mean Apple still couldn't make things an expensive and unpleasant chore to repair. But it might make it much more awkward for them. And personally I'd enjoy seeing them catch some flack about this from their pretty large green-leaning user-base.
Mod parent the fuck up. People like sleek, "sexy" designs. This comes at a price. Swapping hard drives on a MacBook Air is going to be far more difficult than on a Mac Pro.
That said, ease of service comes and goes with Apple products. Ever try to get at the hard drive of an iBook? I gave up after about forty screws. Try it on a "classic" MacBook. Three captive screws and a pull tab. Easy as pie. I just replaced the top case on said MacBook when the keyboard died. I'm not happy that the keyboard/trackpad/case are all one piece (plastic welded together), but it was actually a pretty easy repair (and the iFixit guide got a number of key details wrong).
On the plus side I now have fifteen extra upper cases...
The revolution will be mocked
FALSE.... in the Ipad3 exists room more than sufficient to put screws and clamps or latches and make it very serviceable whiteout losing any structural strength or integrity. Some manufactures like Apple don't like that the people repair their equipment, they prefer that wen somethings breaks it's replaced for a new one.
For a car analogy: I used to like working on cars. They were simple. Shoot I could physically climb in next to an engine. There was so much room in there. We used to complain about some compact cars because the spark plugs were virtually inaccessible. Now you look at the engine compartment and the engine is almost one solid chunk. There is little empty space, it is filled with hoses and wires and other devices. Not to mention the electronics and computers involved.
I'm not saying it isn't fun anymore. It just isn't as easy and simple, and requires too many specialized tools.
I've been a happy consumer of HP's elitebook laptops for some time now. They have far better build-quality (Mil-spec) than Macbook Pros, are certified to run linux, can be ordered without Windows, and are extremely easy to open up to swap components out, as well as being far better value.
And now I see that they are bringing out an all-in-one desktop machine specifically designed to be easy to customise, totally tool-free.
Having a preference for the OS is the only objective reason to go Mac. Everything else is hype inflated by their astronomical advertising budget.
I dunno guys, I think this is a tired argument.
Cars aren't easy to repair anymore... radios aren't... tv's aren't....
WTF can 90% of DIY folks even do with an iPad torn down? Replace the battery... maybe solder on a new clock and a switch to overclock something?
So... okay you did that, what now?
You can't really *do* anything cool anymore with such specialized tech.
There's plenty of good kit out there... go play with that.
I think you still point out the other side of the issue. Look how FEW parts are actually in there. If the stuff is well-tested then little can really go wrong. When you plan to make twenty million of something, and make it reliable all those little pieces add up.
The main problem is one or long term resource management. The original iPad already has been kicked from the new iPhoto app... When iPad has the same processor as iphone4 and can easily caputre pictures with something like an eye-fi card in your camera. For all the thousands of watts of energy it takes to make this stuff, two years is a little insulting... So Apple is being generous for original owners and will let them slide for another whole year. So what? use a crippled device? Or throw it away? I understand that 90% of the mass of an iPad is glass, battery, and aluminum... Very recyclable. I also know from working in a steel company that 60% of the cost of making a steel part from recycling to machining is ENERGY COST for furnaces, machines, treatments, machining, and a factory to work in.
Places like iFixit make good money keeping devices functional and out of a landfill for another year or three after Apple would want to sell you a new one. The same goes for Linux... Keeping unsupported things working. That companies are starting to use "copyright" to essentially send stuff to the landfill so you face to buy new is the real problem here. We need some exceptions to copyright tha when a company stops supporting a device with upgrades they have to issue a patch to "unlock" the device so modders and repair shops can legally fix them.
It's actually somewhat ironic, because if the device was that easy to work on, then iFixit wouldn't have a purpose either. So I guess what they're wanting is consumer electronics not specifically designed for an end user to service, but easy enough that an end user does have a chance of repairing them with good enough instructions.
Better known as 318230.
So you want to have screw everywhere? Biased, hatred, non sense post, thanks for wasting more time with Apple hate.
Get my e-mail after a captcha test in: http://tinymailt
"TLDR; iFixit is stuck in the past because their business model depends on it. Boo hoo."
Look at it another way... There is enough DEMAND to hang on to devices that their services are needed. And Apple is essentially trying to REFUSE to support the repair process because of a few bucks. It's that attitude that if WE don't feel like supporting something it's WRONG for ANYBODY ELSE to do it too.... That change in society is the bigger problem.
This has nothing to do with making it harder for DIY, it's just harder period. Compare this to major PC companies who whitelist devices in firmware, or other industries using "security" fasteners requiring patented and regulated tools.
It's a great time to build electronics. Digi-Key and Mouser will sell you a huge range of parts and get them to you overnight. Lots of places will make your PC boards for $50-$75 for a small board. Oscilloscopes are cheaper than they used to be. DVMs are really cheap.There are whole ecosystems like the Arduno, with free, user-friendly tools. Even most of the micro controller vendors now offer free compilers. There are useful web sites, IRC channels, and hacker spaces. You can afford to dedicate a PC or a phone to controlling or displaying out from whatever you're building.
None of that existed 20 years ago. I had to struggle to convince Hamilton-Avnet to let me buy from them, and they required a credit check. Having a PC board made meant drawing it in AutoCAD, having litho films made by one shop, and getting them to another shop to make the board. It wasn't cheap. A C compiler for the 68HC11 microcontroller cost thousands of dollars. Getting an RF link to a mobile device was a huge headache.
So quit whining that you're having trouble opening the box on portable devices built to be extremely thin, and actually learn how to build your own stuff.
http://ifixit.org/1843/new-ipad-teardown/
Vid : http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iPad-3-4G-Teardown/8277/1
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
I got my room mate a Generation 1 Ipod for Christmas what seems like an eternity ago. A considerable time later its screen stopped working. So I gnawed on it a bit until I got it open, and reseated the ribbon cable that went to the LCD. That fixed for quite a while.
I don't mind using an angle grinder, to prove a point. Though in that case I just had to move some stickers around until I found a screw. People might ask you why your ipad has duct tape all around the edges, but by God I'll get that fucker apart.
I'm sure they just don't want you voiding your warranty though, poking your stubby fingers around in there and getting dorito dust all over its vital circuits. Then duct taping it up and trying to pass it off to a genius as "No it's always been like that."
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Really? My friend's Sensation has a broken screen. I looked into fixing it, as I have replaced about a dozen iPhone screens for friends over the past 4 years, checked out the heavily edited for time youtube video, man it looks like a total pain.
Ditto.
And among the reasons I will avoid an iPad for a while:
- Since the screen is nearly edge-to-edge, I will need a tough protector. I would cry at a scratch. Add $40+
- And a decent case, scratches on the back would be tear-worthy. Add $50+, and I like real leather. Mo' $
- At least two other chargers. Nothing lasts long enough, so one for the car and one for wherever. Add $60
Sheesh, I'll need something else, like a BT keyboard. I'm adding $200 in accessories, and i haven't bought an app yet.
I have several BT headsets to choose from, single and stere, so I've already spent that,.
But I so love my Sensation, I'm in no hurry to buy anything Apple.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
How many different ways must you be told that there are a number of devices on the market right now that are as slim or slimmer than the idevices and are able to maintain serviceability. It is not about tight tolerances, it is about money and control.
How many times must I say "fuck Apple" before people fuck Apple?
A rhetorical question, I know... but what does it say about us as a culture of consumers of electronic gadgets when a company that wants access to every facet of our lives, wants total control over things it also wants to sell us, wants us to pay extra just for the privilege of being their customers (their products cost more than those of competing companies that do the same things or more, and that are besides of higher quality and come with fewer restrictions,) so we can sport things with that little "apple" logo on them?
Nothing good. It would seem to say we've got a lot of retards, who have been brainwashed to the point where they will buy almost whatever Apple tells them that they want.
I just can't wait for the iDiscus, a throwable, spinning, aerodynamic toy that flies through the air, costs 70+ dollars for the basic model, and has a silhouette of an apple on it? You know... a Frisbee?
Cars are easier to repair now, as long as you don't get one of the stupid designs where you have to drop the engine out the bottom to do maintenance. Every car since 1996 has an OBD-II interface, so all you have to do is buy a $50-200 scan tool from your auto parts store, plug it in, and it'll tell you all the diagnostic codes your car's computer has flagged. If you can't afford $50-200, then you can't afford a car, nor can you afford the other tools needed to work on it; a full set of wrenches will cost more than that.
Just like smartphones, the repairability of cars varies wildly by manufacturer and model. Some suck, and some are great. As I said before, some shitty vehicles require you to drop the engine to do necessary maintanence, others are designed for easier repairability. I don't know if they've changed in the last decade, but all the Hondas I've worked on have been extremely easy to work on, while many American cars I saw in the late 90s were absolutely horrible, with batteries hidden in wheelwells (so you had to jack up the car and remove the wheel to replace the battery: everyone here in Phoenix has to replace their car battery every 12-18 months, so an operation like this should be quick and simple for an auto-parts store clerk to do in the parking lot), spark plugs that require you to remove access panels in the dashboard to get to, etc.
The truth is that the tolerances inside these devices is so astoundingly tight
That's the truth is it? In spite of all the counterexamples
Have you got your LWN subscription yet?
I maxed out my MacBook's memory and swapped the HDD for an Intel X25M SSD (had to buy a special $2 screwdriver for that) by myself. The MacBook owner's manual explained how to do both these tasks.
Can't think what other hardware changes I'd make ...
Or apple can design it their way and sell 3,000,000 in the first weekend alone.
Everyone writes a bad sentence now and then. When it happens, it's best to say "oops", fix it and try to avoid doing it again. Getting defensive about it is not the way forward.
The site makes good points. Apple goes out of their way to make products unfixable. Before studying computer science, I took electronics engineering (I have paper hanging on my wall for both). A lot of hardware is very difficult to repair. Surface mount chips are there for life (they usually get wave soldered in). Its also true that anything with wires sticking out of it is considered a bomb by police. I did something horrible last summer: I built three highly directional UHF antennas for TV. Worse: they work extremely well! But the truth is, most people see this stuff as magic, except for the police, who treat anything with wires sticking out of it as a bomb.
it's not like they used rivets or welded it shut. i've taken the glass off a mbp unibody and i imagine it's about the same level of care needed. it isn't that difficult with a heat gun and a suction cup. all of about $20 at the local hardware store.
note maybe ifixit should be capitalizing on a market opportunity rather than whinging. i can't imagine it would be too hard to fashion a rug to heat just the edges to the correct temperature and make the whole process so that they don't have to wait til their hangovers are gone, about midweek, to repair these things
how many tools does a car mechanic have? how many of them are custom to some specific make?
Plenty of similar devices that are easily opened up by the end user prove you wrong.
Translation, They love filling lalandfills with toxic electronic waste. Why does Apple hate Mother Earth?
I smell a shill.
Nope. That's your mom's douche.
Your so right. I found it impossible to replace the hard drive on my Macbook Air.
As you say "a generic code reader won't always solve your problem"..
Not so long ago, it was easy to understand how a car works, there were no electronics in the way, ordinary vehicles weren't turboed to the gills and everything from the engine to the electrics followed simple physical principles and could be accurately covered in a car repair manual like the ones produced in the UK by Haynes. It was EASY to do basic maintenance, even at the roadside (plugs, contact breaker, rotor arm, fanbelt, fuses, you know?). Now an engine bay is a crammed mass of covered up machinery, special fluids are required for even engine coolant and the bits you are "allowed" to touch are labelled with pictures. Even the oilfilter is often inaccessible and don't even think of trying to change the "fanbelt". And in the modern Haynes manual, half the topics that used to be the meat of the book even 20 years ago are now missing.
Even independent mechanics are being discouraged from looking inside. Manufacturers want the consumer to funnel money into their Franchised outlets for spares and repairs. And god help you when its out of warranty and six years old and you're the third or fourth owner, and can't afford the Franchise because you can't afford to pay their rates (which is why you're buying cars of that age anyway).
Card are WELL down the road (pun intended) to the walled carpark/garden/whatever.
They might throw up various bullshit excuses how this isn't true, e.g. how a hatch ruins the form of a device etc. how they run a repair / replace program but it is true. It is very plain that by sealing the devices that consumers are encouraged to give up and buy a new one even if the old one only needs a replaced part. Given the recent moaning over rare earth metals (which phones and tablets consume plenty) there really is no reason for any country to tolerate this. Zones like the EU should be forcing all devices to be at least battery serviceable.
Aren't we talking about a product that got the benefit of an open architecture in the first place? I'd imagine the product landscape would look a lot different if they didn't have an operating system with an open enough license to base their iProducts on in the first place.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Ditto.
And among the reasons I will avoid an iPad for a while:
- Since the screen is nearly edge-to-edge, I will need a tough protector. I would cry at a scratch. Add $40+
- And a decent case, scratches on the back would be tear-worthy. Add $50+, and I like real leather. Mo' $
- At least two other chargers. Nothing lasts long enough, so one for the car and one for wherever. Add $60
Sheesh, I'll need something else, like a BT keyboard. I'm adding $200 in accessories, and i haven't bought an app yet.
I have several BT headsets to choose from, single and stere, so I've already spent that,.
And this would be different on an Android tablet, how, exactly?
Oh, I know (at least as far as the case goes)! They're already so butt-ugly that you wouldn't mind a scratch on them...
BTW, the carbon-fiber case I got for my iPhone 4s cost me a whopping $13 on Amazon, and protects both the back and front (with a flip-down cover on the front-side). Plus, it only adds about a millimeter to the overall size of the phone. The Addesso case I got for my iPad has a *removeable* Bluetooth keyboard in it, and I think I paid $40 for it. There were cheaper cases with keyboards; but that was the one I wanted.
As for "never enough chargers"; if 10 hours+ of continuous use on your iPad isn't enough, you need to seriously step away from the "devices" and get a life.
Seriously... I love to tinker and I love taking things apart and fix or hack them, I've been doing it since 25 years already. BUT I also like my iPhone and iPad because they're the only things I own where I'm not tempted to tinker around. I like that! The things just work and they do anyting I want. I stopped jailbreaking after I found out, that the only things gained are stupid customization gizmos I don't need. Like already stated: If you don't like the product don't buy it! What do you all hope to gain from your crusade? Couldn't you use all the hate-time to do something productive? Yeah I know, since I own apple products I'm tainted and couldn't possibly be objective... sigh...
Crivens! I kicked meself in me own heid!
Read his last line, then look up the definition of "shill".
Moron.
Stockholm syndrome?
Android users do indeed suffer this in a major way, they are jailed in the confines of the old ways of computing and see nothing but benefit in the bars that they enjoy caressing.
What they cannot see is that more choice for eery user is a curse. Instead Apple keeps things simple for those that need it, but allows expansive access for those that really want it.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Also, my BB and Nokia phones don't become useless after a single short fall.
Neither have any of the iPhone's I have owned, mostly without cases.
Also I've seen iPhones before with cracked screens, and they were still perfectly functional. Much nicer to have a device without buttons that can fail.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
As anyone should know, Apple's products aren't meant to last for the life of the battery. iPad 9 will be out before the battery in your iPad 3 wears out. Be a good consumer and stimulate Apple's economy, just go buy the new model.
I hope people understand that this ifixit thing is not just being "cheap" or even god forbid "environmental".
There is a real joy and pride with keeping something running, much like and old car.
Up until now Apple did have some very good very user friendly hardware.
I built my first iphone 2g from 3 broken ones - Back when most people could not afford one.
I had the personal gratification of not just having an iphone, but ONE I BUILT FROM MY BARE HANDS !
Also i learnt so much, built several other phones and through word of mouth every girl i know takes their broken iphone to me.
Since then my old 2g has been smashed twice and been swimming in a pool (stayed illuminated for 30 seconds in case you ask).
Each time i fixed it and its still with me now and in almost museum grade condition.
I still think of how much money Joe Douchebag would have spent if the same things happened to his phone.
Yeah its a little slow, no retina and only 16gb, Yeah i use my 4gs more,
But one thing these tech companies really need understand is......
THAT IT IS MINE
I FIXED IT
I WILL KEEP FIXING IT
And if they want it back, or want to stop me from using it
THEY CAN TEAR IT FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS !
I am glad the average consumer believes all electronics are impossible to fix. Not only would it reduce the amount of easily repairable second hand gear out there but what are the odds the pile of solder and hot glue on your work bench would even be yours vice wife's, dad's, or friend's?
I am 33. My first computer at 8 was a Sinclair ZX-81. Then an Atari model (800XL, the silvery one, which BTW survived being run over by the back tire of a Pontiac 2000STE) then the better model (130XE, the ventilated off-white plastic one, which came along with pen printers, multiple 5.25 floppy drives, tape drive [I couldn't get Zaxxon in any other format], and 600 'baud' [remember 'baud'] modem), then some kind of 6mhz super-proprietary system where the power came through the monitor into the desk unit and had an OS called Gem or something, then a roaring fast 80286 that was my first real "hot-rod". The last two were used, all of those earlier ones were bought brand-new, and there are of course many days when I'd happily go back to Atari if they made laptops or were still in the business of amazing.
Unlike all the other machines mentioned, the 286 (besides running at my choice of ultra-fast 10mhz or 12mhz, in 1991) was the first machine I had that you could open up and really customize. Granted, you could pick open the Atari and from what I hear you could cram some more RAM into it but it was never necessary because it's not like LOGO is going to give you 8 turtles instead of 4, or Escape from Epsilon is going to turn into Jumpman or Gauntletak is going to go 3D or something. When you're mostly playing shareware it's not a huge deal to operate with 64k, in fact, 64K SHOULD BE ABOUT ALL YOU EVER NEED. WHAT. [Okay, so some programs used the full 128k but to do that those budding 'programmers' needed to utilize the other memory bank, you know! Tricky tricky stuff! Atari BASIC!]
Anyways, so the 286 was like heaven. I outfitted it with a 20 mb expansion-slot hard drive so I could keep running my 2400 Baud BBS (in 1991) which up until then was operating primarily off of a floppy and was serving files and message boards from a 12 mb IDE. I was really upset when I found that the expansion slot drives I had access to didn't like to be in the same computer with one another, and soon after I got Taipei virus which basically ruined a lot of crap including the floppy. I had an ATI all-in-wonder EGA/VGA card. The EGA was, like, above and beyond normal EGA in some way I can't even remember. I remember when I finally afforded a VGA monitor and swept into the world of VGA.
All of this love life was the result of being able to open up and modify my computer. So of course I snickered and guffawed at the Dell, Compaq, Gateway, and other computers of the world that were insisting that their users had to use their hardware. I thought it was especially crude that some of these companies had worked out ways to ensure that you not only used their parts but also made sure you had software on hand to re-acquaint the hardware with the motherboard or else you were screwed. At the time, these companies were selling their computers as the cheapest on the market, so there was this illusion of "you don't want to spend money on a computer you can work with? You're not going to be able to work with your computer." Which I admit lulled all us geeks into complacency.
It was easy to say that it's alright to manufacture and mass market these devices that can't be worked on, because they were going cheap. We noticed that most of the users of these devices weren't very computer-literate so much as they were glad they had their internet poker, their mahjongg, their Sierra and their Myst (though Sierra games were on their way out by the time Compaq started to corner the market).
Eventually, though, these losers won out. People in the Compaq demographic didn't learn-up and throw their useless piles of steaming turd to the corner and go to the OEM store and hand-pick their hot-rods for just $50-100 more. They kept using them, and upgrading, and Compaq became this giant. Dell managed to beat them but they were both playing the same game: proprietary hardware, and I as well as many others never, ever thought that this was going to be the business model that would dominate the PC market and survive through the ages.
So of cour
"Stratigraphically the origin of agriculture and thermonuclear destruction will appear essentially simultaneous" -- Lee
I'm sorry that every girl you know, you met because they want you to repair small proprietary devices for free or in exchange for feeling a boob rest on your shoulder a couple of times.
"Stratigraphically the origin of agriculture and thermonuclear destruction will appear essentially simultaneous" -- Lee
I know of no-one who has a protector for their iPad screen. I'm sure such people exist, but they're pretty few and far between. Most people have cases that double up as screen protectors. Mine cost me 25 quid. It's very nice, too.
Isn't this the same bunch of clowns that declared the End Of the World As We Know It because Apple started using tri-wing screws? (Ones for which they just happened to sell overpriced drivers?) Even though at the time you could buy tri-wing drivers from any number of other tool outfits for a buck or two?
Ah yes, the "anyone who doesn't agree with me is a shill" argument.
On /.? How original!
I also note you didn't actually read his post carefully - I assume you just skimmed the first couple of paragraphs and decided you had enough to base a solid, informed response on.
This, this, a thousand times THIS! Nothing highlights the difference between Woz (a true geek and visionary tinkerer) and Jobs (a cold-blooded marketer who couldn't give a shit less about the tech itself) than to contrast the Apple I/II days (when Woz was still doing the heavy-lifting) with today's walled-garden/don't-even-think-about-tinkering-with-this iOS era.
What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
I like Apple computers. There I said it. That doesn't mean that I particularly like the company. I do agree that the unnecessary difficulty in repairing the things - even something as basic as replacing the hard drive - is not right. If I could easily install OS X on a beige box I would do so but I'm probably not nearly technical enough to successfully attempt it. It is not the computers I like so much as the OS. I used Windows up until XP and never enjoyed the experience. I have tried Ubuntu and it just didn't stick for some reason. So I'm sort of stuck with Apple until a real alternative (for me) turns up. I say good luck to the Windows and Linux users if it works for them.
http://www.acetonestudio.com
This works against them eventually. I like my video Ipod but now the battery is beat. My next music player will have an accessible battery or I wont buy it.
I wonder about consumers how can you buy this. It is a computer it has 512 ram that you cant upgrade.
I think Apples operating philosophy is, a sucker born every second.
This has been going on with Apple since the two-foot long Torx screwdriver that was necessary to disassemble the original Mac.
If you complain about WHY you didn't buy, then the seller knows why you didn't buy and can decide NOT TO DO IT ANY MORE.
Shit, you really are an ignorant twat, aren't you.
The larger problem I see is that, if you pay Apple to replace the battery, they won't actually do that. They take your Ipad and exchange it for a refurbished one. So you don't get "your" Ipad back.
I've had enough bad experiences with refurbished products to never go down that route again. So I am left with using a third-party repair shop.
What's the name of the iFixit chick in the video? I'd love to give her a good teardown..
Vernor Vinge talks about this stuff in 2006 in his book Rainbows End. Everything is made from sealed parts no one has access to. In one moment of desperation the protagonist rips apart a car to see what is inside, only to find, more sealed parts.
I've seen the future friends, and its turtles all the way down.
There is an Apple repair place down the street from where I live ADVERTIZING prominently that they repair iPads, iPhones and iPods?
Nothing to see here -- move along now...
No, there is an active war on DIY ANYTHING... and, we citizens are losing.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
The next step (already in the R&D phase at various places in Silly Valley from what I read a year or so ago) is to print the whole thing on a web press, from the back to the front like a big electronic newspaper. All of the individual components have been successfully done this way - even most of the 'chips'.
Er, no. Just no.
Individual components have been "successfully done" only in the loose sense that the manufacturing processes for said components have always involved processes which look a bit like printing. One obvious piece is the good old printed circuit board, where the layers are "printed" on copper-clad FR4 with a photoresist and chemical etch process. Chips involve lithography and etch and plating to build up many layers in processes which are also analogues of printing.
But what you're claiming is something like 3D printing the whole shebang, circuit boards and chips and batteries and display and plastic/metal case, all in a unified process. That is so far from reality as to be laughable. The chips alone make it completely implausible. Many processing steps for chips are along the lines of "heat to hundreds of degrees C in an oxygen rich environment". Or "etch with a powerful acid". Or "remove photoresist with a powerful solvent". Or "bombard with ions". These kinds of processes would wreck everything which is not-a-chip, and produce enough contaminants to ruin the chips (and the machinery for making chips).
There are so many different Android devices and such fragmentation of the Android "OS" that saying Android has surpassed iOS means nothing.
It matters a lot. My fridge, dishwasher, and car can all be repaired by hand. It's nice to be an engineer with knowledge and experience in the trades. Also, my BB and Nokia phones don't become useless after a single short fall.
I'm a retired engineer. I can repair things, but these days I can afford to pay someone to do it for me. I don't cut my grass any more either. I could, but I prefer to pay a couple of guys to do it. BTW - Your fridge, dishwasher, and car are not electronic appliances - Apples and Bananas. And, electronic equipment (appliances, if you will) that can be repaired are also repaired by hand, just like your car. Or maybe you think, for example, that there is such a thing as an iPad (for example) "repair machine".
The truth is that the tolerances inside these devices is so astoundingly tight, that there simply isn't room for clamps, latches, and screws (which require threaded posts on the other side- this always takes up more space then the screwhead does). In order to produce a device as sturdy as the iPad 2 and iPad 3, they *had* to use industrial adhesive over a large surface area to literally fuse the thing together.
-AC (because I work for the aforementioned company as a tech during the day)
My bullshit detector in full effect after your opening statement.
Anyone who has taken apart an iProduct as well as a similar product from another manufacturer would know this too.
I'd argue YOU have vested interests as a tech for the aforementioned company to ensure these devices are as user unserviceable as possible.
Companies aren't as stupid as you think. Sure, they can sell a few cool new toys to the geeks but its only a free way of getting market extablishment AND product research. After you've ironed out the bugs, then you start making it user friendly for non tech savy folks. Yes, I hate apple.